Techtree Contest #10 - Mythology

[Edge45]

I think Chaosy's right, besides, we've different ways of making techtree. So there's no guarantee for same units

 

[BlackRangerXIII]

Allright

 

[The_Silent]

Doing a aztec themed techtree. Since the lizardmen models made by Doom Wolf and Gluma by far fits the bill the most, I've chosen it to be Aztec Lizardmen. Called the race Xipe after Xipe-totec (aztec god).

The race will have a couple of unique mechanics, such as blood sacrifice and war prisoners. (Related)

Here is my first screenshot. It is of the units, since I want to make most of the structures myself, and they aren't done yet.

Unit Screenshot

Illidan's Cage is a placeholder for a siege unit I'm going to make myself as well made to capture enemies.

 

[Spellbound]

Right, to anyone curious about how to make a custom Haunted Gold Mine for your race work with Custom Race System, here's how you do it:

library FaefolkSetup initializer Init requires CustomRaceSystem
    
    //This function saves the X/Y coordinates of the Gold Mine and the amount of gold it has, then removes it and places your custom Haunted Gold Mine in its place.
    private function EnchantGoldMine takes player play, group workers, unit goldmine, unit townhall, unit randhero returns nothing
        local integer mineGold = GetResourceAmount(goldmine)
        local real mineX = GetUnitX(goldmine)
        local real mineY = GetUnitY(goldmine)
        local unit newMine = null
        
        call RemoveUnit(goldmine)
        set newMine = CreateUnit(play, 'ffgm', mineX, mineY, 270.00) //replace 'ffgm' with the unit ID of your custom gold mine. Press Ctrl + D in the Object Editor to toggle raw data view.
        call SetResourceAmount(newMine, mineGold)

        set newMine = null
    endfunction
    
    private function Init takes nothing returns nothing
        local CustomRace c = CustomRace.create("Faefolk",RACE_HUMAN,1.0)
        call c.setTownHall('ffr1')                  // Faerie Ring
      /*call c.addWorkerType('ff??',c.NEAR_MINE,1)  // Worker 1
        call c.addWorkerType('ff??',c.NEAR_HALL,2)  // Worker 2
        call c.addHeroType('Ff??')                  // HERO: 
        call c.addHeroType('Ff??')                  // HERO: 
        call c.addHeroType('Ff??')                  // HERO: 
        call c.addHeroType('Ff??')*/                // HERO: 
        call c.setCallback(CustomRaceCall.EnchantGoldMine) // <----- This line calls the function above: EnchantGoldMine. You may rename the function, but change it here too.
        call c.setAIScript("undead.ai")
    endfunction
    
endlibrary

 

[Kyrbi0]

Haha,you wrote so much text.A bit lazy to read 'em all.Hopefully Ranger will respond to your post there.

You must be new here; that's what I do. : )

I hope(d) so too.

Aren't these...elementals?ARGH!! Iamsoconfused

That does get me thinking - isn't this sort of a variation on Elements? Like, your Element is 'golems'....

Not saying your approach is not good, though. I'd like to hear your PoV on this.

Lol, I can see why you'd say that. Seemingly! Seemingly! To the untrained eye, there are definitely some strong similarities, aesthetically to Warcraft 3 Earth Elementals. But worry not; these are legitimately-inspired-by Golems of the Jewish mythological variety, my good sirs. : )

The nice thing about this Contest's Theme is the relative open-ended-ness in the design. While we are constrained to pick mythology-stuff, entrants may choose to create a faction AoM-style (i.e. normal historical race with mythological elements), an entire myth-creature race (i.e. "faerie race" or "cthulhu race" as we've seen), or, in what might be considered a daring/stupid stroke of brilliance/idiocy, a race made entirely from one particular myth unit. In my case, I'm pursuing the latter. : )

Thanks for the help but
avoid posting a Wall of words and try bring the matters to Visitor messages to me, please?

You're welcome.

I will post as many words as it takes to get my point across. I am, for better & for worse, rather verbose.

I can move this to VM's, but honestly, talking about the Contest in the Contest Thread... Seemed pretty much like the right place.

Not gonna touch on anything else that was said except for this:

I definitely have to agree with Kyrbi0 here. Marketplaces and Taverns should not be modified in any way. The point of the contest is to add a new race to the mix, not make space to fit one. The new race has to adapt to the existing framework, not the other way around.

Yes, thanks for the reasoning.

KK,third wip.All is almost complete except a bunch of units,structures,spells and upgrades.The only thing that is holding me down is time and missing resources.Kinda hard to type without mouse using Paint.
I love it when the console fits.

Really lookin' snazzy. I'm glad to have some competition. Visual aesthetic coherence is a big deal to me, so it's good to see that working out for you.

Haha,thanks for those kind words.Hopefully I can finish this before the deadline.Otherwise it will be a complete foolish waste of time

Nonsense! It can be put to use in some other modding project you have, and if nothing else, it's valuable experience. : )

Doing a aztec themed techtree. Since the lizardmen models made by Doom Wolf and Gluma by far fits the bill the most, I've chosen it to be Aztec Lizardmen. Called the race Xipe after Xipe-totec (aztec god).

The race will have a couple of unique mechanics, such as blood sacrifice and war prisoners. (Related)

Here is my first screenshot. It is of the units, since I want to make most of the structures myself, and they aren't done yet.

Unit Screenshot

Illidan's Cage is a placeholder for a siege unit I'm going to make myself as well made to capture enemies.

Very exciting; love Gluma's models, love Aztec-style mythology & all that entails. I'm particularly interested in how your "war prisoner/cage" idea will manifest; I've had a similar, trigger-lite version of that knocking about in my head, and I'm actually doing something similar for my Golem race (surprisingly, it's a part of the mythos, in a way).

 

[Spellbound]

Tech demo! I most made a video because I wanted to try using Fraps, so here, have video:
PS: Big thanks to Anitarf for the formulae for the upward curve.

 

[Kam]

Tech demo! I most made a video because I wanted to try using Fraps, so here, have video:
PS: Big thanks to Anitarf for the formulae for the upward curve.

That's exceedingly well done.

I would suggest though having the electric ball coincide with the training bar if possible so that a unit 75% complete would have the electric ball be 75% of the way to the hall.

 

[Spellbound]

Thanks I thought about making the training match the progress tbh, but the reason why this doesn't happen is to make it so that you don't have to build multiple unit-production buildings. One of these can sustain an entire army. It also allows me to do things like speeding up production time, etc. I'll need to balance the cost of the units to make for that large advantage though.

The downside is that your units are vulnerable during 'production'. The wisps can be canceled via an ability they have, which refunds 75% of the cost.

 

[Kyrbi0]

Tech demo! I most made a video because I wanted to try using Fraps, so here, have video:
PS: Big thanks to Anitarf for the formulae for the upward curve.

Welp, I've lost.

That is exceedingly sick. Sometimes in my righteous fervor for OE-work-arounds and trigger-less/lite design, I forget just how cool a little bit of programming can make an entry. : )

 

[Sunreaver]

I lost too haha

 

[Spellbound]

I do hope y'all not planning on quitting on me. I want this contest to have more submissions than last time. Besides, it's not set in stone, I might not have the time to finish. Or maybe someone with a more interesting submission comes along. Or my stuff is really not that great when you compare it to the full thing. Who knows?

 

[Kingz]

Nice unit training system spell bound.

However it seems to have demoralized everyone else XD

 

[Kam]

Nice unit training system spell bound.

However it seems to have demoralized everyone else XD

That is nonsense if people are going to quit after seeing his system.

It is extremely nice, but it is not a race. I've been working on my own races long enough to know that aspects like his training system are but a fine veneer. Aesthetics factor in significantly. I can't stand it when buildings don't make sense or units are missing portraits or team color. I also recognize that the more important component to a race is the tech tree. I want to see a complete tree more than anything else. I'm expecting at least seven combat units with full upgrade tracks, custom abilities, fun gameplay, and thought out enough to where it makes sense for them to be a race and not a collection of vaguely similar units. One hero will suffice as I know how much time they take to develop.

My point is that Spellbound has a nice start.

 

[Kyrbi0]

That is nonsense if people are going to quit after seeing his system.

It is extremely nice, but it is not a race. I've been working on my own races long enough to know that aspects like his training system are but a fine veneer.

Lol, I was being facetious, man. If I fail/stop, it will be due to time & not Spellbound's perceived awexomeness. : )

Aesthetics factor in significantly. I can't stand it when buildings don't make sense or units are missing portraits or team color. I also recognize that the more important component to a race is the tech tree. I want to see a complete tree more than anything else. I'm expecting at least seven combat units with full upgrade tracks, custom abilities, fun gameplay, and thought out enough to where it makes sense for them to be a race and not a collection of vaguely similar units.

Ehh... hope I don't disappoint you too much, but I'm not going to be able to make a full-size (12 units/4 heroes/10+ bldgs/3 tiers/etc) faction. I'll be lucky to squeeze a hero, two tiers and a little over a half-dozen units. (heck, does any race have 7 "combat" units (not workers/casters/siege)? (HU: ft, rf, kn, gy, sb, gr... OR: gr, th, rd, wr, kb, tr... UD: gh, cf, gg, ab, os, ds, fw... NE: ar, ht, mg, hp, hr, ch... TR: ht, rv, ds, vb, mr, rw, tt) Ok, so one/two of them do, I guess).

One hero will suffice as I know how much time they take to develop.

Hm. Well if we were going purist Wc3 standards, I'd have to stand by a full 4; however, after our previous lengthy discussions on the matter I think it's more than appropriate to modify our expectations down to 3 (otherwise, playing 'normal games' means we all have to test each entry twice to see all the heroes); heroes can be a lot of work. If we weren't/aren't doing full-techtrees, then I can see anything from 3 down to 1. I'd still like to see, say, 2 (says the pot, calling black the kettle), but that's me. This Contest contained no such stipulations.

Nitpick/Confusion

The sequence here from your above statement:

...aspects like his training system are but a fine veneer. Aesthetics factor in significantly...

I would argue that his "training system" is pretty much entirely an aesthetic/Thematic aspect (AFAIK it doesn't do much in-game aside from make shiny SFX & the cool light-thing & the path-walking), so saying, essentially that such things are "only of surface-level importance" and then immediately saying "EXCEPT THEY FACTOR SIGNIFICANTLY" seemed like a bit of semantic whiplash to me... Did I misread you?

 

[Spellbound]

Kam is right, in that you should not give up just because someone else makes something that looks better than what you have/will make. This is just one part of the techtree and the winner will be decided on the whole of what was submitted, not just one part.

That being said, my system is not purely an aesthetic choice - there are some rather significant gameplay impacts it can have. For one, I can 'chronoboost' unit production that way, since the speed at which the wisp moves towards the Faerie Ring is controlled via triggers (based on their training time), which means I can increase/decrease production speed by whatever amount I want. What's more, this way I don't need to have multiple unit-production structures to make a lot of units, and unit production can be stopped by destroying a wisp. This opens up new ways of dealing with the Feykin (you can effectively stop their production with less firepower), but you also have to be weary of their economic advantage since they have no need for multiple buildings of the same type.

 

[Kyrbi0]

That being said, my system is not purely an aesthetic choice - there are some rather significant gameplay impacts it can have. ...

Ah, I suspected as much. Cool; I stand corrected.

 

[Chaosy]

Report Spellbound for scaring peepz away?

 

[BlackRangerXIII]

Report Spellbound for scaring peepz away?

No need for that
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Allright everyone
News from me:

I'm planing on not participating on this contest, not because of spellbound, but because this is the first techtree contest after Pharaoh_ quit the site and I'm worried on how it will go.
So my plan is to not only quit but work on the backstage and answering any questions you guys might have.

If you guys have an objection you can say it

 

[Kyrbi0]

No need for that
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Allright everyone
News from me:

I'm planing on not participating on this contest, not because of spellbound, but because this is the first contest after Pharaoh_ quit the site and I'm worried on how it will go.
So my plan is to not only quit but work on the backstage and answering any questions you guys might have.

If you guys have an objection you can say it

Aw, sorry to hear that.

(Do you mean the first techtree Contest since Pharaoh left? Because there have definitely been other Contests since then...)

 

[BlackRangerXIII]

Aw, sorry to hear that.

(Do you mean the first techtree Contest since Pharaoh left? Because there have definitely been other Contests since then...)

Yep
The first Techtree contest post Pharaoh_

 

[Kam]

Yep
The first Techtree contest post Pharaoh_

Are we to mark the ages based on prominent leaders like the peasants of old?

Keep up the work guys and post WIP's.

 

[Chaosy]

Hm, looking at the examples of the fictional work..

Does that mean I could in theory just many any race from the Warcraft universe?
After all there are Warcraft books.

For example, I could do a troll race because they worship the loa and thus have a religion.
Same goes for night elf and elune, draenei and the naaru.

 

[Kyrbi0]

Are we to mark the ages based on prominent leaders like the peasants of old?

Of course not, Grand Master Kam. May thou prosper long.

Hm, looking at the examples of the fictional work..

Does that mean I could in theory just many any race from the Warcraft universe?
After all there are Warcraft books.

For example, I could do a troll race because they worship the loa and thus have a religion.
Same goes for night elf and elune, draenei and the naaru.

Y'know, I suppose it's entirely feasible... Though honestly, that would be hewing to the 'letter of the law' while spitting at the 'spirit of the law'... (much like my entry )

 

[Spellbound]

Lol Kam setting the record straight!
We do need more WIPs. Maybe a hero showcase, anyone?

 

[Yours Truly]

I think they'll change the deadline to a longer duration if not at least 3 participants are entering.

 

[BlackRangerXIII]

I think they'll change the deadline to a longer duration if not at least 3 participants are entering.

there will be no deadline extensions

 

[Sunreaver]

Screenies

 

[Spellbound]

Now that's a cool skillset! Very curious to see the end result.

 

[Chaosy]

Well I will just go ahead and make a troll race and see if I can finish it.

I hope that someone can inform me as early as possible if it's stretching the rules too far.

 

[Sunreaver]

Now that's a cool skillset! Very curious to see the end result.

The hero is already done

 

[Spellbound]

Well I will just go ahead and make a troll race and see if I can finish it.

I hope that someone can inform me as early as possible if it's stretching the rules too far.

Well you don't have to do wc3 trolls. I mean, trolls have their own real-world mythos they come from, so you can just use that instead and... add your own 'twist' on them.

 

[Chaosy]

Well, I like the Warcraft edition

 

[Spellbound]

Well I'm skeptical as to how valid it is, but I guess we'll have to wait and see what you actually make and what Kam and BlackRangerXIII say.

 

[Chaosy]

Their fault for adding fictional work

 

[Spellbound]

Their fault for adding fictional work

Lol, true that ;D
Still, I imagine the unspoken understanding is that it's all mytholgy goes, except Warcraft's xD

EDIT:

Resource Collection!
(there is sound but it's extremely low. WE (or maybe it's JNGP) for some reason practically kills my sound when it's open)

 

[Kyrbi0]

Lol, true that ;D
Still, I imagine the unspoken understanding is that it's all mytholgy goes, except Warcraft's xD

EDIT:

Resource Collection!
(there is sound but it's extremely low. WE (or maybe it's JNGP) for some reason practically kills my sound when it's open)

Wow. I lose again. Great to see the Creep Rebellion's lumber-harvesting method seeing the light of day.

Well I will just go ahead and make a troll race and see if I can finish it.

Lol... While I'm not sure how wise that is for this Contest, I'm really interested to see someone else's take on Trolls. xD

(Hey, did you see my reply to your post on the "Hero Retrofit" topic?)

 

[Chaosy]

@Spellbound

Seems OP as f*** at the moment but the visals are on spot.

@Kyrbi0
Well, the issue is that finding models for a mythology is quite hard since this site mainly got models from the warcraft universe.

And yes I did.

 

[Spellbound]

Great to see the Creep Rebellion's lumber-harvesting method seeing the light of day.

It's funny, yknow, I had completely forgotten that Creep Rebellion used to harvest lumber that way. It's only around a couple of years ago that I was brainstorming lumber harvesting methods, and thought up the treant thing. Only after coding it did I remember I saw that in Creep Rebellion

@Spellbound
Seems OP as f*** at the moment but the visals are on spot.

Oh I sped up the lumber harvesting for demoing. In the balanced version it should take around 50 seconds or so to harvest 1 tree. By my calculations this might even be too fast, since a Wisp can harvest 5 lumber every 8 seconds, 50 lumber should take 80 seconds. That does sound excessively long though, dunno. At that time scale, I'll need to have a visual indicator.

@Kyrbi0
Well, the issue is that finding models for a mythology is quite hard since this site mainly got models from the warcraft universe.

Honestly based on the rarity of available models, this should be allowed. I guess you'll be trolling the contest then

 

[N41]

I know am a lot slow. Don't know if I would ever make it .
Though am not quitting yet..
-----

Resource Collection!
(there is sound but it's extremely low. WE (or maybe it's JNGP) for some reason practically kills my sound when it's open)

Won't be making something like that any sooner (will need year or two or more ).
Great work SpellBound..
-----

N41,try making the buildings invisible and visible again after construction

Thanks for suggestion, but I would rather prefer little modeling or wrapping over triggers or codes .. Thanks anyways.
-----

Updates:
-Not using desert blight effect anymore
-Replaced Crypt Lord with Blood Beetle, preventing two similar looking heroes with different skillset.
-Made two building for the contest.
-Edited two doodads to work like building.

Screenshot

-----

Thanks to The_Silent's suggestion and little searching and modelling work, I am completed with buildings. Now hunting for units...

 

[GhostThruster]

Resource Collection!
(there is sound but it's extremely low. WE (or maybe it's JNGP) for some reason practically kills my sound when it's open)

looks great, but balance will be a major issue if you don't find a way to expose their economy to harassment. especially considering how much easier it is to macro when you basically gotta build 2 structures instead of 12 or so workers.

eh well one of my problems ever since gameplay was /20 is that the judging criteria encourages systems like this and discourages thought about the impact on how the race plays in wc3 melee. that's a rant for another time and place tho.

 

[Yours Truly]

Lol, true that ;D
Still, I imagine the unspoken understanding is that it's all mytholgy goes, except Warcraft's xD

EDIT:

Resource Collection!
(there is sound but it's extremely low. WE (or maybe it's JNGP) for some reason practically kills my sound when it's open)

Haha,nice!I think I just lost 50% of my contest spirit
Anyways,don't you think that wood dance is a bit too fast?It's easy to get lumber with that kind of production speed.

 

[Spellbound]

looks great, but balance will be a major issue if you don't find a way to expose their economy to harassment. especially considering how much easier it is to macro when you basically gotta build 2 structures instead of 12 or so workers.

eh well one of my problems ever since gameplay was /20 is that the judging criteria encourages systems like this and discourages thought about the impact on how the race plays in wc3 melee. that's a rant for another time and place tho.

I've always loathed managing workers, so the less I have to deal with, the better. I do understand where you're coming from, but from my PoV, either I find a way to balance this, or I just ignore that altogether and bank mostly on creativity.

Besides, i can't increase the number of production buildings since each mushroom is a unit. The fps would tank something fierce if I encouraged more buildings.

Haha,nice!I think I just lost 50% of my contest spirit
Anyways,don't you think that wood dance is a bit too fast?It's easy to get lumber with that kind of production speed.

I forgot to mention in the video description that this is demo speed. The actual wood harvesting is x10 slower. Should probably be slower still.

 

[Kingz]

Couldn't you use destructables instead of units?
Unit's are quite taxing in terms of resources if i remember right, destructables should use less of them?

Not sure tho, just a suggestion.

 

[Spellbound]

I needed team colour :\

 

[Kingz]

You could always run 12 different models/destructables with different texture colors then?

No need to act upon this suggestion, I do not even know how big of a performance boost it would be, just assumed it would be significant because wc3 maps tend to have a lot more destructable (read: trees) than units on a map at any given time.

Just remember that pausing units provides a significant boost to performance, so once their spawn animation is done, pause those mushrooms if you decide to keep using units

 

[Yours Truly]

@Kingz:Aren't you participating?Your idea about the previous contest submission was great.So why not join this contest?For old time's sake?

 

[Edge45]

My my, such amazing systems Spellbound made...

Oh well, this contest serve as great practice for JASS anyway, might as well learn,

 

[Spellbound]

You could always run 12 different models/destructables with different texture colors then?

No need to act upon this suggestion, I do not even know how big of a performance boost it would be, just assumed it would be significant because wc3 maps tend to have a lot more destructable (read: trees) than units on a map at any given time.

Just remember that pausing units provides a significant boost to performance, so once their spawn animation is done, pause those mushrooms if you decide to keep using units

They're already paused actually, since all they have to do is just... stay there lol. And I unpause them before triggering their death if they building they're connected to dies to prevent any weirdness.

Still, there are a awful lot of trees... if I ever do run into a fps problem with units, i'll switch to destructibles, though there will still be the problem of people who switch team color the map UI. Hopefully it won't come to this

@Kingz:Aren't you participating?Your idea about the previous contest submission was great.So why not join this contest?For old time's sake?

Yeah, you should join the party

My my, such amazing systems Spellbound made...

Oh well, this contest serve as great practice for JASS anyway, might as well learn,

Yeah, it's good JASS practice for me, and now that I've made all these systems, I'm not really sure what to do next lol.

 

[Yours Truly]

and now that I've made all these systems, I'm not really sure what to do next lol.

You could focus on your units.And I see you already done 2 champions.

I can't be sure what to do with my fourth hero.Leo's suggestion was great but I need a name of a member from the Great Old Ones that has the same traits as Leo's.And btw,here's my fourth WIP.not really much of a WIP but this'll show you what I've done so far.

 

[Thorlolking]

Im new to the hive so just asking when i want to download and try these race maps, the editor says that some command must end with some other thing (the custom spells of the game) , and i cant load the map in the game engine help?

TKs