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Reforged Warcraft III Reforged - Community Feedback

Discussion in 'Patch & Reforged Discussion' started by Archian, Nov 4, 2018.

  1. stan0033

    stan0033

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    That sound dumb and unnecessary.
     
  2. foje tit

    foje tit

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    I will love it

    I thought so
     
  3. Destroyer117

    Destroyer117

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    Yes Blizzard, all this ^^
     
  4. Chaosium

    Chaosium

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    I'd love a way to have more than 6 inventory slots. Obviously not baseline because that would impact multiplayer balance too much I guess, but some way to modify it via triggers would be super cool and save a lot of painful inventory system coding. Judging by the videos, I guess 3 more slots could fit without taking too much screen space.

    Also, I hope they'll fix the bug that cuts buff descriptions when you add a comma in the text.
     
  5. LiSen冯

    LiSen冯

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    One important project is HD character/Text

    I hope to add them.

    1. I hope to add HD Character/Text;
    2. TextTag can use HD Text and Art(pic or model),like ''Crit'' ''Gold'' for Heroes.
    3. The characteristics of HP/MP Bar,like Heroes.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2018
  6. deepstrasz

    deepstrasz

    Map Reviewer

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    It is not dumb. The way you replied is.

    It is indeed unnecessary as it will cause confusion for players plus it would look weird if a hurt unit will walk as fast as it usually does or even faster when under a buff.
     
  7. stan0033

    stan0033

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    • Add text editor in text fields for coloring, new line in object Editor.
    • more tiles in the terrain palette
    • lighting palette
    • lightning palette
    • able to create floating terrain, multiple terrain levels and delete terrain
    • able to increase/decrease water level with triggers!
    • detect type of damage taken - physical, spell.
    • spell schools! holy/chaos/shadow/frost/fire/arcane/nature for every spell in the object editor and triggers to check the damage type.
    • incldue systems - multi-page shop system, easy recipe system, fade system, panel system,item stack system acceleratio nsystem,
    • sliding for units instead of moving them to an incremented osition every 0.01s.
    • detect mouse position(conditions) with triggers and movement(events)
    • garbage collection
    • moveable multiboard
    • able to disable/enable cheat codes in single player with a single trigger
    • improved line of sight and optional line of sight system.
    • attachment system - let object attach to attachment points of units and move with them.
    • no need for dummies to cast abilities - just cast them with a trigger.
    • ability - wander, with controls disabled. (Fear)
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2018
  8. fenix140

    fenix140

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    This could be useful, in game editor.

    - Management and creation of new terrains, cliffs, elevations of the terrain or elimination of this, etc., in-game as in SC2.
    - New race manageable in the game interface, or an option to add races edited by the user on a map. To be selectable by a player in the game interface.
    - Spectator mode of "in-game" games for users who are not part of it, and can enter a live game and watch its outcome.
    - New forms of building creation to be created in a specific area or land, for example the Pylon area of SC that allows the construction of a building.
    - Management of multiplayer campaigns.
    - Handling models by detonators, related to X, Y, Z: Enlarge, flatten, or stretch. All this in-game. (An option they could take into account)
    - Being able to have several inventories at the same time in the game interface.
    - Have several tabs for the creation of buildings as SC, this would also include the book of spells, which have the defect of coupling in only one, and the learning of abilities of the hero, in the same way to have several of these. (These options could simply be implemented in the game's manageable interface).

    Greetings...
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2018
  9. Sieben

    Sieben

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    You think so? When I mentioned MoP, it was about the trailer only (and some people already complained about that new artistic choice back then). I don't know much about the rest of MoP, since I've never played it, but I think Reforged models are not so different from the human and the orc in MoP trailer: bulky look, very big chest, huge hands, tiny heads. And not just the orc: the human too has an enormous chest, trunk-sized arms, big hands and a rather small head (though not as exaggerated as the orc, but still). Just like Arthas and grunts in Reforged.
    MoP:
    MoPhuman.png MoPorc.png
    Reforged:
    ReforgedArthas.png ReforgedGrunt.png
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2018
  10. LiSen冯

    LiSen冯

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    make more some pretty Effect that without in old WC3.
     
  11. Bribe

    Bribe

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    As someone who's put thousands of hours into building systems which try to fill gaps left by the developers, I couldn't agree more. I would love if they integrated some or all of those events and variables. Or at least opened up more API so we can catch even MORE events which currently even systems struggle with.

    Right now, for example, I'm mostly finished with an extremely major overhaul of Spell System. I intended to integrate an advanced cooldown system into it so units can have charged abilities, but there is no way to "fake" cooldown regeneration in the system. If Blizzard added charges to abilities similar to items have, it wouldn't be an issue.
     
  12. stan0033

    stan0033

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    Yes, including healing detection and absorb detection!
     
  13. starter_e

    starter_e

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    Yes taste is relative. Good quality game design turning it into art transcends taste and relativity. It requires skill and most of all a dedicated cohesive team like that which created titles like Starcraft and Warcraft 3. Which is no longer the case. Different people, different company, different game. Just the new Arthas voice-over shows you that.

    Blizzard cannot please everyone all of the time. Therefore they should focus first and foremost on enabling us to (self-)please ourselves and everyone else(slight fap fap fap sound in the distance) which is the best way to please everyone most of the time. This means that in terms of novelty and selling-points they should focus on showcasing the removed(from the engine) limitations, rather than changing the work of art itself. Of course some visual update is called-for to pitch before investors, but it needs to be only a respectful update, not an overhaul.

    In other words get in the head of Metzen and everyone else back in those years(Blizzard must have memos etc or at least means of getting those contacting past employees most of whom are probably thankfully alive etc.), think of what they wanted and how they were prevented from achieving it due to time, technical etc. limitations of the day, and unleash it.

    The trick (Mr. Potter,...(Prometheus reference)) is to pay respect to the ingenious way in which the creators not only managed to get their ideas accross despite the limitations but also used these limitations to their advantage, which is what we mortals now call the charm of the game. As you preserve those, you preserve the soul of the game while allowing it to grow. Thus you fulfil the dreams of your predecessors who inspired you to join the company, become a developer etc.

    "If I have seen further it is by standing on the sholders of Mountain Giants." Respecting these words doesn`t mean that you don`t change a thing and sell the game for 30 bucks. It means that by honouring what was done before you, you actually do more and do it more efficiently because you don`t waste your time rediscovering the wheel, as in revoicing Arthas as a muscular BMW sporting 20-smth-year-old. What RTS gamer can associate with that? Like, com`on Justin Gross nailed it. Give it to the man. He stuck with us not just because he happened to be there at the time, but because he nailed him - Arthas, poised between the rashness and insecurity of youth.

    If Blizzard doesn`t seem inclined to do the above, then we make sure they follow up on the minimum plan which is just enabling us to do the above (and even more).(I should stop lest I continue ranting and drooling over the succubus voice-over and the crypt fiend "chicks into bondage"...)
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2018
  14. Meai

    Meai

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    Ok I'm just going to summarize my belief on all of this: I simply do not believe that Blizzard will pull this off in a single year when their first playable alpha was so far removed from the perfection of classic wc3. Their lead designer saying that the pandaren cinematic symbolizes warcraft to HIM when clearly it was nothing like the other warcraft titles, not even WoW... I mean what are we left to think. They are experimenting with our perfect game in ways that will probably lead to a less than perfect game. We all know it, we can feel it. It will be less perfect than the classic.
    Even teamcolors which are massively important for the feel of warcraft 3 were completely wrong / insufficient.
     
  15. SpasMaster

    SpasMaster

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    Ok, so I've been thinking for awhile what exactly to put into this review of mine & the feedback that I want to provide. Let me start by saying that the sole concept of a remastering of Warcraft 3 was something that I have always dreamed about and up until a couple of years back seemed like it wasn't ever going to happen. Yet this year's Blizzcon MVP was indeed Warcraft 3: Reforged.

    I happen to have a Discord community where people play my map - Sunken City. And after Blizzard started releasing patches, many people in there have asked me if I personally think a Remaster of some sort might come. Not only did I think that it ain't happening, but frankly - I was against it. The reason involves my greatest concern with Warcraft: Reforged and will be the core of the feedback I am about to provide:

    The Custom Resources
    I have always said that I prefer to have tens of thousands low-res custom resources to use for my projects as opposed to high quality ones, but only the default units. Sure, a melee player would probably not care at all about custom assets, but for us, modders, this is basically what allowed us to create resources that gave Warcraft 3 life for so many years.

    By having fans continuously create custom assets, those who consume them felt like there is constantly something new coming their way. There is this feeling when you go into a custom map and you stumble upon something you've never seen before. In a game that is over a decade old. As long as such thing exits, Warcraft can never get old, since it always received new things.

    So many maps are designed and built upon the foundation of custom assets. Many popular maps like Gaias Retaliation by @Zwiebelchen or Iceborn by @APproject utilize hundreds if not thousands of custom resources, not all of which (if any) will translate to Warcraft: Reforged. This is a concerning thought, since in a single day plenty of custom maps will inevitably have a chunk of them that remains in the past and another that transitions into the present high quality resources.

    Model makers will need some time to learn to use the new tools Blizzard will be providing, but not all of them will be capable to use them. Regardless of what anyone thinks about the models and textures showcased during Blizzcon, these are of very high quality. I personally have hard time imagining the non-professional Warcraft 3 modders transitioning smoothly, even with the tools. I can see some more experienced users like @Tauer having the necessary skill to create models that will be able to stand next to the original models provided by Reforged. However, for many others that may not be the case. I have recently had a conversation with another very talented model maker from Hive, namely @PROXY because I wanted his opinion, as someone who's been creating models for warcraft for a long time and who recently collaborated with me on my project. He happens to have the same exact concern. I hope that over the coming months we get some insight in how exactly those new tools you'll be providing will work so that we can get a better idea regarding how we can adapt.

    Personally, I am willing to move forward, because while this is a great concern (for me at least), this is the future of the game and is something that if done correctly will keep the game alive for years to come.

    I do, however have a couple of suggestions that can help modders transition more smoothly:
    • As previously mentioned, give us information regarding how and what we will be able to use for future modding, whether it will be texturing, 3D model making, etc.
    • Blizzard has confirmed that skins will be made for certain models. This gave me an idea: Let's assume that after Reforged comes out, none of the previously created assets will be usable and the modders who are willing (and capable) of providing new ones will need some time to learn how to use the new tools. In that case, if Blizzard is willing to create 'alternative' skins for units, this will give map makers like me something to work with, in the absence of the previous massive amount of resources. Let me give some examples:
      • The functionality to use alternative skins for units is already available ingame. As you can see in the images below, you can select different skins for the Priest. In this case a RoC version and a TFT one. Now imagine if we could do things like the ones I will list down in the next points.
        Priest1.png

        Priest2.png
      • Footman skins (recolors): Kul'Tiras Footman, Dalaran Footman, Gilnean Footman, Stormwind Footman, etc.
      • Alternative models to existing units, established in WoW lore that you seem to be adopting: Tauren Druid, Blood Elf Demon Hunter, Blood Elf Paladin, Undead Mage, etc.
    • Continue to provide the short explanations to new trigger functions. This is something very important not only for newcomers, but also for veteran modders who are given new functions to work with in the future.
      Triggers.png

    My Suggestions & Wishes
    Here I will make a list that I will update as I come up with more things over time, containing everything I would like to see.
    • I've seen that Blizzard will give us the possibility to modify the UI. I would love to see that taken to the next level:
      • Let us generate UI windows on the screen at desired locations.
      • Let us customize these windows, but do provide us with default assets & art for them, until modders have came up with alternatives.
      • Let us add intractable buttons into them, leading into things like: Dialogue Windows, Talent Tree Windows, Stat Windows, Additional Command Card Windows, etc.
    • Give us the ability to mess with health/mana bars - change their colors in various ways.
    • Allow zooming into the minimap ingame.

    Blizzcon-specific Feedback
    I've seen people already talk about this in great detail, but I'll quickly throw my own impressions here:
    • Buildings look great.
    • Some units look very similar to their 'classic' counterpart like: Rifleman, Shaman, Witch Doctor, Blademaster.
    • Others not so much: Grunt, Footman, Knight, Paladin, Arthas.
    • Ghouls seem very off to me. Previously they seemed like they were barely held together by flesh and bones, and in Reforged they look way bulkier and less skinny.
    • I've noticed that with many of the units, Blizzard has decided to modify the animations. While that can be nice, I'd like to see a more smooth and fluid alternative to existing animations, rather than having new ones. The explanation is simple: aside from their looks, Warcraft units have very distinct animations. Even if I see a pitch black silhouette of a Grunt, I'll know it's a Grunt by the way he moves. I would suggest improving the animation, while sticking to it, if that makes sense. Think of what WoW has done for the Character Models after the visual update, animation-wise.

    That's all I have for now. I will update this post over time, if I come up with more suggestions/feedback. I do want to state in conclusion that I am very excited about the future of Warcraft and its community and I am hopeful that Blizzard will take it in the right direction.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2018
  16. martix

    martix

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    There's like a couple very specific things I'd like added to the engine:
    1. The ability to mess with ability cooldowns.
    2. More than 6 item slots. Also UI customization for it.
     
  17. Triceron

    Triceron

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    I beg to differ.

    Art does not transcend tastes and relativity. Art is the purist form of subjectivity. A good quality game is not going to be held on the same pedestal by all even if is universally pegged as good.

    For us enthusiasts, there are more things that we consider 'sacred' and feel should not be touched. That's okay. But that's not a fault or failing of the developers if things change. Heroes of the Storm is not a lesser game because they used a different voice actor for Anub'arak instead of the original Warcraft 3 actor. You can definitely have an opinion on whether you like the change or not, but that one act doesn't have a lasting impact on the game beyond a personal preference. It doesn't change the core aspect which you've touched upon - the game design.

    Aside from the campaign and retooling hit boxes, the actual gameplay of Warcraft 3 is untouched. The aesthetics may not be up to everyone's standards right now, but keeping in mind that this is a new take on the style, it's remained fairly consistent to itself. We should be regarding this game as a new and different soul. The comparisons to the original can not be escaped since this is ultimately a remake, but that doesn't mean that we should place all stakes of success and failure on it for straying too far from the original or 'not adhering to the original vision'. It is not Warcraft 3. It is Reforged. It has its own vision, it is its own soul.
     
  18. MatiS

    MatiS

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    1) give us an option to change world editor's langue to english without changing our game's language version. When I want to copy triggers because I need help with something I have to translate them all manually which is really tedious.
    2) Don't change the translation from what we had in original WC3. I can't say anything about other translations, but the polish one (old one) is considered iconic, it's widely believed to be one of the best translations ever made. Problem is, most new Blizzard games and books use the hearthstone translation. And at least polish version is really cringy and widely hated. I've heard rumours that there plans to use the hearthstone translation in WC3 reforged. I advise against that, the old translation was one of the things that made WC3 so awesome. And HS translation is really bad (like really, really bad) and would reduce the charm of the game.
    3) damage detection system is desperately needed
    4) Allow us to order units to use abilities in triggers via variables so we can give them multiple skills based on the same one. It would really help. And give us more customizable proxy abilities like channel
     
  19. Dat-C3

    Dat-C3

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    Funny thing is they already have some form of this with the flare and sentinel abilities which you could already use however it'd be nice if we weren't limited to just two abilities, think someone was working on a system to change that already though from what I saw it didn't go public. Basic stuff like this would definately add a lot, hopefully Blizzard takes this into consideration.
     
  20. stan0033

    stan0033

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    • Let us change the unit's movement type with trigger. (instead of addign abilities)