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Techtree Contest #12 - Evolution

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Spellbound said:
You were literally told the map was changed from TurtleRock.w3x to Moonglade.w3x. It's also been changed in the OP.
If you meant whether the map was changed from Moonglad.w3x to something else, then no, it's still Moonglade.w3x.
Click to expand...

Thank god. Was confused like a chicken.
Anywho, now's the perfect time to avoid double post. 2nd WIP:

Wellings1.png


TL;DR:
-green things transform into those floating spires. floating spires transforms into buildings and so on.
-green things are cheap (10 bucks) and can be bought from that pillar thing (town hall).
-wells produce blue sphere things that can be released for 60 bitcoins. blue sphere things morph into units.

Need an approval whether or not my concept fit this contest's theme

EDIT: Also, why is my race still unnamed? I already named them the Wellings :confused:
 
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Hmm... While I won't be participating in the contest (I'm mostly an ideas person for this level of stuff, owing to my lack of understanding of the finer points of triggers and model importing), I have some ideas for where to start with the style of techtree. I'll list elements rather than techtree styles, though, as there's actually a decent deal of things to work with, thanks to the surprising variety of unit production methods in WC3.

Ancient t3: Essentially, instead of the conventional t3 style, which would be complicated to arrange for a morphing chain, the t3 units are the structures made directly combat-viable. Effectively, your Mountain Giant stand-in is actually your Ancient of Lore itself, reliant on an upgrade locked behind t3 to become combat-viable directly. This means that, late-game, large parts of the infrastructure are mobile and capable of fighting off attacks, or being used as a "last push" to secure the win, possibly from a disadvantaged position.

Zombie Upgrade: You know the campaign ability of Mal'ganis to turn peasants into zombies? That's actually an ability still in the editor (Dark Conversion, listed under Neutral Hostile Hero abilities), one able to turn a category of units into a specific other unit. Quickly looking into the editor, it specifies a race to convert rather than tags. This means that, if you want to lock it to only the base unit, you have to make it so that the only unit of the race that is a permitted target is the base unit. If you want any unit of the race to be a target, though, you need no special targeting restrictions or enablers.

Mount-Production: The Hyppogryph Rider's production method can be an important element in a single starting point techtree, allowing you to instantly (after a potential cooldown) make one particular unit that can optionally turn back into the original unit (Dismount is optional to include on the new unit), or you could choose to have it able to separate into entirely different units from the two that merged to make it, with a cooldown before it can be done if desired. Mount/Pick Up Archer, itself, needs to be on both units to function.

Morph Shift: Metamorphosis is present as an ability that changes to a separately-coded unit. This means that it interacts with other methods by changing the base unit, and it also means the alternate form can exist through multiple production methods. However, the unit specified as "alternate form", if it has the ability, uses the time limit before it changes to the "normal form". And not having the ability on the alternate form causes a death to register, but the unit weirdly doesn't actually die. The animation plays, but the unit just gets up when you command it. An unfavorable bug, though.

Pheonix "Birth": Similarly to Morph Shift, there's some bugginess to the Pheonix's on-death morph and the alternate form unit is always on the time limit when it has the ability. I've made a thread on this ability's potential uses, and some productive examples of what occurs with various layouts. I even got it properly working with Heroes! And the previous screwup offers alternating forms for regular units. This can be used to make a unit that will automatically become another unit after some time, with a reversion to the initial form after death. Usable for something like Lava Spawn merging into a Pheonix Egg that then has to wait to "hatch", then goes on as a normal egg-on-death pheonix.

Hero Sub-Techtrees: As we have received permission to be able to use the standard Hero production method, we could roll it into access points for transformation mechanics, such as having a Dark Conversion ability that changes what comes out with the ability level, replacing conventional upgrade processes or naturally phasing out overlapping roles without the odd behavior seen in the Berzerker upgrade for Troll Headhunters. Any ability-based production can be used here, even the Destroyer Form as a permanent Hero change Ultimate.

Carrion Summoning: The Crypt Lord's Carrion Beetle ability makes permanent units that have a limit to how many can exist from one caster at a time. This is important, because it offers a nonstandard production method with it's own limit of numbers, independent of the food supply. This means that you have units that are directly tied to the numbers of another unit, allowing you to limit how many are present at once without interacting with the food supply. This can be used with other methods that cause retention of low-tier unit production to be problematic, offering cheap frontliners potentially vital to the techtree's function late-game from supply being choked out by situational units.
 
Since no one posted an update since Tuesday, I'll just mingle up something to keep the thread running. I've done 2 heroes and their abilities is all done. Presenting you, the Madlord and the Aquachanter.


Madlord___Aquachanter.png


Madlord's Abilities:

Deranged Fling:
Flings an enemy unit behind the Madlord, dealing damage. If the target is in Tidal Prison, the root will burst, dealing bonus damage.

guy got flips.png



Tidal Prison:
Roots an enemy for a duration and spawns 3 tentacles around it that rapidly attacks it. Tentacles lasts the same duration.

anime girls' dreams.png



Crazed Presence:
Decreases nearby enemy units' base armor.

why the fuckk would you need an image for this.


Insanity:
Gains 35% atk speed and 50% move speed. Madlord's attacks will always critically strike its targets during the duration (15 seconds)


why....


Aquachanter's abilities:

Hidration Splash:
Deals damage to the target enemy and slows it and nearby enemies.

think Lich's Frost Nova.


Shimmering Bubble:
Hurls a giant bubble to an area, dealing damage and stunning for a period.

im just blowing bubbles.png



Faithful Sacrifice:
Kills a unit for mana, scaling with the target's health. Also grants bonus movement speed for a while

not ez being green.png



Supreme Currents:
chain lightning ayy lmao

a glorified chain lightning that is.



EDIT: hide the big posts in /hidden bb codes coz its too damn bigg
 
Well, I've been lurking around this thread for a while, but I wanted to make sure that the concept I had in mind would actually work before I joined. Now that I've done that... count me in! I'm good with going solo, but I would love help from a modeler if any are available.

My idea is to make a Nerubian variant race (Tenatively nicknamed "Shadefrost Nerubians") using a bunch of imported resources, such as the building pack made by MatiS. By making strategic use of egg-laying lesser units and evolving into stronger ones, I think I can make this race work without traditionally training or constructing anything. Hopefully the meta-point for the concept will make up for the fact that this will be my very first time using triggers in JASS.

Also, here's a very early WIP shot with 2 buildings, three units, and their eggs/cocoons.
ShadefrostNerubians1.png
 
xYours Trulyx said:

View attachment 297996


You know you can just ask for the triggers,right?
Click to expand...
lol, love the memez.

No I wasn't planning on stealing the code or anything, per se; just the idea. I have been tossing design ideas for a Tidal Lord hero of my own for literally years, and I've had a hard time deciding. But one thing I think would be cool is water tentacles; just wasn't sure what to do with them. Your idea (Of entrapment) sounds pretty legit. : )

Don't worry, I'd credit you.

//EDIT//

There we go:

upload_2018-5-14_15-36-38.png
 
xYours Trulyx said:
You're making a water race too? Cool, I can't wait to see what you have on your behalf. Also, do you make that "history sheet" on everything you do? That seems rather cumbersome. I just got most of my spell ideas from LoL (Some are still OG tho).

I would kiiindly show an update to my race, but heck, I'm way too lazy atm.
Click to expand...
What? No. I'm not doing a Water Race as well. That's just plans for a tavern hero.

Abovegame said:
@Kyrbi0 Will you be participating or just lurking around :D ?
Click to expand...
Hopefully the former. ; )... :<
 
Is too late to participate in this or could I still sign up? lol i know that my account is new (i had an older account too much time ago but forgot the user and password) but don't underestimate me :c, i know enough to participate if i are allowed. In any case there are enough time for me to complete all before the end of the contest
 
Riki Martin said:
Ok, then I'll make a ghostly race that I'll name Nightmare Wraiths
Click to expand...
So you'll probably have Destroyer Form and Mount as core functional elements. Maybe shenanigans with Possession-based abilities and triggers.

I post again because I forgot a few transformation mechanics, and more summoning mechanics are also usable.

Druid Swap: The Druid of the Claw and Druid of the Talon are both units that permanently change forms through an ability, one that, like some other units, uses the alternate form model tag and transformation animation. Unlike many other methods, the amount of buggyness is nearly nonexistent, as it's purely "turn into X". This is because Blizzard has alternate forms always be classified as separate units, instead of a shift to the base unit, meaning a lot of things they do with models aren't required for functionality in any meaningful way.

Inferno Artillery: The Inferno spell is the only AoE that summons automatically, making it useful for units like Starcraft 2: LotV's Ravagers that perform artillery functions by casting an ability. This is particularly useful when the summoned unit capitalizes on the stun in some way, either via AoE damage of it's own or an ability to extend the crowd control effect, possibly by making units to bodyblock.

Arrow Reanimation: Black Arrow, essentially, makes it so that kills will always create a particular unit, provided the unit dies within a specified time limit. This means that one can make kills add units of a variety otherwise unavailable. The time limit means that kills by unconnected units, such as Creep fatalities, don't generate the unit, and also ensures that attribution properly occurs. For area of effect attacks applying such an effect, a basic trigger can replicate the effect with basically anything.

Doom Creation: The Doom ability is interesting. It's the only ability that has a permanent duration dealing damage. This means that it can be used to mark a unit for inevitable death. Usually, it gets used to create a major unit that'll wreck enemies further, rather than being primarily a dedicated source of damage or making a swarm of units. Guaranteeing the death of a unit is worth quite a bit, which is why such effects are usually restricted to Hero ultimates.

Factory Stream: The Pocket Factory's ability to produce units is tied to the ability that spawns it. This is, itself, fairly useful, as it lets you have an ability to summon a unit with an extra trick it would not have by default (potentially useful for saving on data and models). However, an unused ability exists to do this as a passive, so you could apply it to units and structures to produce a technically-not-trained unit at a constant rate, on a timed life. Such as a unit used as a resource for abilities, or the "foundation" unit a lot of others interact with for additional forms.

Engineering Loadouts: Activateable Engineering Upgrade abilities can allow one to alter a unit quite considerably by swapping abilities without technically being a different unit, preserving a few behaviors, such as Mount/Pick Up Archer qualifiers, at the cost of needing to navigate some spectacularly weird things. Generally, switching from a summoner to a damage dealer is doable with fairly little difficulties, as a number of mechanisms for damage dealing also have summon versions. And in the worst case, all target-point abilities are equally able to be cast through Rain of Fire.

Stone Regeneration: Funnily enough, the Stone Form of Gargoyles actually specifically mentions the additional 8 HP/sec granted as part of the ability, rather than the unit. This means that a unit gotten from the Stone Form ability can have additional health regeneration over other access methods. Much like the Druid forms, there's no bugginess to be had from not having the ability on the alternate form, nor does lacking the ability on the normal form cause particularly nasty issues.

SEF Fragmentation: Storm, Earth and Fire is actually a unique ability. Not only is it the only morph ability that morphs into multiple other units, but it's through a list, so you can just add a unit to the list multiple times to get it more than once, unlike a massive number of other abilities that are restricted to just one or two unit types. This is primarily useful for large chains of merges, upgrades, morphs and revivals to break back down temporarily, though the ability to make units for those could prove useful.

Parasite Poison: The duration limit is, itself, fairly important to re-defining the dynamic. Doom's permanent duration allows one to guarantee the loss of something, eventually (bar debuff removal), while Parasite acts as a conventional DoT that also makes a minion if the enemy dies during it's duration. This means that much weaker units can have Parasite-based abilities, while Doom has to be on higher-tier units as a general rule.

Spawn Splitting: The passives to generate units on death can be used to accomplish many things, and in this case, what's important is that the death makes a different unit, which can cover the weaknesses of the unit that just died. For example, a unit akin to a Mountain Giant, big single-target beatstick, could make units that offer area of effect damage that can kill off the sort of meatwalls that typically cause issues for single-target beatsticks.

---

A further note on transformation abilities: They do, in fact, have the ability to make any of them act like Destroyer Form (matter of fact, Destroyer Form has all the same fields as Gargoyle Form), as the payment option is a morphing flag, as is whether or not it's permanent. I'm not particularly in the mood to mess around with the "needs payment" at the moment, but it may be usable to have an "immortality protocol" that causes you to lose resources when the unit triggers the revival. A useful balancing factor, in some cases.

Edit (Forgot Lava Spawn):

Lava Cloning: The Summon Lava Spawn is the last one of these, I promise. It's the one creation ability I missed (that I know of and isn't redundant), and it's a pretty crazy one, because it defines how many attacks before a split and a duration the split takes. And a generation limit. At any rate, it allows one to make a summoning spell that has the summoned unit get the ability to clone itself by attacking. Also, it uses the Alternate Form animation set, so that's a modelling concern (Druid of the Talon turns into a bird for the delay, for example)
 
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Welp, I am officially In.
Haven't decided on the race name yet, but there are crabs and makrura (aka lobstrokks).
Made basic preparations such as extra models, icons and basic race mechanics.
(who am i kidding, ive got like 2MB filled up with icons already)

Also, I have a question: does it violate the rules if player starts with two diffirent types of workers ('builder' and recource collector) even though collector is an upgrade of the 'builder'?
If yes, I am fine with slightly changing it.
upload_2018-5-21_21-5-7.png
 
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Saelendious said:
Welp, I am officially In.
Haven't decided on the race name yet, but there are crabs and makrura (aka lobstrokks).
Made basic preparations such as extra models, icons and basic race mechanics.
(who am i kidding, ive got like 2MB filled up with icons already)

Also, I have a question: does it violate the rules if player starts with two diffirent types of workers ('builder' and recource collector) even though collector is an upgrade of the 'builder'?
If yes, I am fine with slightly changing it.
View attachment 298496
Click to expand...
AFAIK, that's no problem. The Contest doesn't stipulate how you start the game (i.e. with how many of what type of thing (as long as it's balanced, of course)); simply that No More Than One Unit (& Hero?) May Be "Trained" in the Classic Sense. An upgraded version of the worker that spawns alongside it at the beginning seems perfectly reasonable to me.
 
Tuwnew said:
WHAT IS THIS MONSTER ON THE BOTTOM RIGHT CORNER?
Click to expand...
Thats the starting 'building'. Not giving anything away yet tho, maybe later.

Kyrbi0 said:
simply that No More Than One Unit (& Hero?) May Be "Trained" in the Classic Sense
Click to expand...
Dont have any trained units at all, but did not implement any hero training system, because its slightly hard to figure with my current race setup.

Maybe I will post some more screens later since I think sending custom icons I made isnt much of a WIP lel
 
Well, I think my concept fit the rules so I'll explain it:

-Workers (black ghost on the left) can summon those purple towers, the towers are upgraded to the rest of buildings except food-production buildings.

-Food production is increased by the blue ghosts, who are an upgrade of Workers.

-Workers can merge to create the purple floating thing on the right from where are created the rest of units.

Wraiths1.PNG
 
Riki Martin said:
from where are created the rest of units.
Click to expand...
How so? Is it summoning via spells in a "frontloaded training" mechanic, transforming the workers into more advanced units via Dark Conversion based spells, "eating" workers for charges to make the higher up units... How's it doing it, if it isn't using standard training? Remember, only one unit may use standard training.
 
Banelingline said:
How so? Is it summoning via spells in a "frontloaded training" mechanic, transforming the workers into more advanced units via Dark Conversion based spells, "eating" workers for charges to make the higher up units... How's it doing it, if it isn't using standard training? Remember, only one unit may use standard training.
Click to expand...

He has a point. Unless you make some sort of cargo hold system to evolve units, I don't think that fits the theme.

BTW, Clairvoyant has been changed to Tide Priest and I released the final hero, Ocean Vanguard.


New Heroes Preview.png


Vanguard's Abilities:

Whirpool Strike:
Unleashess a whirlpool in front of the Vanguard that deals damage to enemies caught in the path.

imma firin ma lazor.png



Riptide:
Gathers the water into an explosion at the target area, damaging and knocking up enemies in the area for a few seconds.

that one grunt that's chilling.png



Luminescence Mace:
Basic attacks mark enemies with Luminescence for a few seconds. Marked enemies takes bonus damage from all sources.

NO PREVIEW FOR THIS BECAUSE OF ULTIMATE UNNECESSITY

Waterway Reversion:
Switch places between an enemy hero. The Vanguard then taunts nearby enemies and gains 25 bonus armor for 8 seconds. The target enemy hero gets marked with Luminescence for 5 seconds instead.

THIS SPELL IS TOO FAST TO SCREENIE SO DEAL WITH IT


Tide Priest's abilities:

Mind Flare:
Deals damage to an enemy unit and stuns them for a duration. Targets below 30% health receive double damage.

THIS SPELL IS TOO SIMPLE TO SCREENIE SO USE YOUR IMAGINATION

Salvation:
Channels life force onto the target unit, healing it for an amount while draining 15 mana every second. This ability can continue being channelled until the target has fully healed or the Tide Priest's mana has perished. Moving,attacking or casting other spells will cancel the channel.

this one took longer coz of bugs.png



Celerity Aura:
Increases nearby allied units' movement speed.

NO

Divine Journey:
Sends a target friendly unit to the abyss to receive a blessing from the Riverqueen. After 15 seconds, they return fully healed with a permanent varied gift. Units that have already been casted cannot be sent into the abyss again. Gifts are bonus atk damage, atk rate, movespeed, health and armor.

praise the sun!!.png


[/hidden]
 
Banelingline said:
How so? Is it summoning via spells in a "frontloaded training" mechanic, transforming the workers into more advanced units via Dark Conversion based spells, "eating" workers for charges to make the higher up units... How's it doing it, if it isn't using standard training? Remember, only one unit may use standard training.
Click to expand...
The workers merge and create the purple floating thing and then it "evolves" in the rest of the units (obviously you lose the purple thing at the end of the "evolution"). This will count as standard training?
 
EternalOne said:
Well, progress has been made. The Shadefrost Nerubians now have fully functional bases, and all the standard units/buildings can be made in one way or another. I still have a ways to go, but here's a nice WIP shot of the Shadefrost army returning to base after going creep hunting:
View attachment 298819
Click to expand...

Cool. I wonder how you do the evolution triggers because I'm loosing my mind over this (still done tho).
 
So, since I'm getting close to the end of the "mechanics development," as it were, I have a question about the rules. Mods or Judges, give me a ruling here:

Is it okay to have people outside of your team do balance testing for your custom race?

As much as I enjoy the design process, I must admit: I'm quite bad at melee games. As such, I might not have the best sense of when my custom race is balanced. If I have to test this stuff out by myself, then I will, but it would be easier if I could make a beta of the race and have some people that do melee better than me try it out and send me feedback.

I don't need the answer right away or anything, but I couldn't find a clarification of this in the rules, so I hope one of you will publish an answer here for all of the teams' references.
 
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