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Techtree Contest #13 - Coloured Mana [Optionally Paired]

Discussion in 'Contest Archive' started by Spellbound, Aug 9, 2019.

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  1. MyPad

    MyPad

    Spell Reviewer

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    @Wazzz

    Link to updated entry here:

    EDIT:

    A rundown on the changes:
    - Gold and Lumber costs were altered for most units and buildings.
    - Entropy Bomb's damage type is stated in the tooltip.
    - Purity Field now grants all allies near the caster a base bonus of 1 hit point regeneration, which stacks with the additional bonuses.
    - Reflective Domain now reflects the damage in an AoE.
    - Female Aragorn now has an AoE heal ability (which is immediately available).
    - Entropy Bomb now excludes allies when computing for the total damage, as described in the tooltip. (Previously, it would include allies as well when computing the total damage, but not deal damage to them).
    - A bug with triggered stacking buffs has been resolved (previously, the bug would cause the effects of the buffs to become permanent). Nerfs the effects of Eudonis' Curse, and Aether Realm, to name a few.
    - Glaive Fragments now deals damage based on max health for Heroes (and Hero-units). (Previously, it would be based on Current Health).
    - Added a blink ability for the Scoutron in cases where it gets stuck due to phased movement being deactivated near enemy workers. (Only available near workers as a situational escape ability).
     

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    Last edited: Oct 2, 2019
  2. Wazzz

    Wazzz

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    Nice, I'll update it. It will mean yours is a little overdue, but in the first few days the decline will be pretty negligible. Not to mention, I look forward to giving the updated version a play :)

    Same for @xYours Trulyx's entry, loving the collection of techtrees we're getting so far ^_^
     
  3. islesofurth

    islesofurth

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    @Wazzz

    Here is my updated Entry for the Forces of Gaia

    - Goldmine is now entangled on start
    - Limited custom Heroes to 1 each
    - Added icons for abilities that were missing them
    - Added multiple upgrade requirements to abilities that didn't have them but were meant to
    - Connected units with their upgrades that were not already connected
    - Fixed all Tooltip errors (i think :p)
    - Changed some units Health and Food costs to make them more reliable as they were not performing well enough.
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Leods

    Leods

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    Ohh God, we don't have the Mythic and Spellbound entry yet! Please, hurry up, or the penalization will affect you.
    Well, in fact, one possible technique (in addition to turning cultists into zombies) is to create cultists with the only objective of regenerating the dark mages mana with Cheap sacrifice (by the way, using Shadow skeletons is even more effective. These have more mana and damage, and a little more acceptable amount of life, besides having Shadow bolt too). Also, if you plan to dedicate yourself to the dark mages, I recommend invoking the Shadow Lord, who has an aura of extremely rapid mana regeneration, in a fairly small area.
    A lot of people just forgot that (Blizz used the "undead" name for the Forsakens in Frozen Throne) the Undead techtree is more a Scourge techtree than anything else. The other undead groups uses different techniques in battle (the Forsakens have, per example, the Real Boticary Society. The Ebony sword knights have... Well, death knights. And the CotD, of course, have Orcs, humans, etc.
    I think I forgot change it, at the start, the dusty skeleton will just die at time (i changed it because i think is interesting accumulate them.
     
  5. Spellbound

    Spellbound

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    StarfallEmpire.png
    Features

    - Unique unit-training system
    - custom building models
    - custom unit models
    - 2 heroes
    - custom ground texture for the buildings.


    Screenshots

    Screenshot_180.png Screenshot_809.png Screenshot_808.png Screenshot_89.png Screenshot_83.png Screenshot_72.png


    Units




    Known Issues

    - Hero tech requirement is ignoring gameplay constants, so you will have to use 'synergy' in singleplayer if you wish to use both heroes of the Starfall Empire in the same session. I do not currently know how to fix this.
    - On game start, your star location may clash with that of another player, requiring you to restart the game. I am not sure what's causing this, but it's most likely Custom Race System. Something probably broke when I converted it to wurst. I do not currently know how to fix this either.
    - The Phantasm ability is ignoring tech requirements because Blizzard. /sigh
    - One hero is missing an ultimate :/
    - Evoking the Tutelary will pop up a debug message because that unit has an ability based on Defend, which fires an undefend order the moment the unit is indexed. This then causes an empty instance to be deallocated, which creates a warning.
    - Similarly with the Witness, the same issue causes it to be unable to move :'(
    - Glittering Comets potentially leaking. Unsure.


    Note

    - You need Warcraft 3 patch 1.31 or higher to play this map.
    - Do not save this in the editor or you will clear ALL triggers from the map.
    - Accidentally uploaded the wrong version. Please re-download map.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Oct 5, 2019
  6. stein123

    stein123

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    Holy Crap!!!!
     
  7. Kyrbi0

    Kyrbi0

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    Ridiculous
     
  8. Wazzz

    Wazzz

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    @islesofurth @Spellbound @Mythic

    Nice, post edited with the updated entries :D

    There were a couple others who were working on their entries a while ago, but it has been so long since we've heard from them. I suppose if they show up, they show up.

    Also, if I get anything wrong, please let me know and I'll see if I can't fix it up ^_^

    I'll also add in some additional reviews for the more recent updated versions of things, as well as the new entries. The reviews don't really mean anything, I just like showing the entries some love <3

    Spellbound & Mythic - Starfall Empire

    Right from the get go, this feels like a Spellbound entry. When coupled with Mythic's aesthetics, it truly paints a picture of a vintage Spellbound techtree, which, of course, went along with the Blue theme. Again, classic Spellbound.

    The Starfall Empire is a techtree that draws heavy inspiration from the Protoss playstyle of Starcraft 2 specifically, in that it borrows from the concepts of warping units in as well as the way the Colossus attacks. It even uses a shielding system, which I am pleased to see does not use the Mana Shield ability as I have seen many predecessors that have attempted something like this do before, but in fact implements it entirely passively. Perhaps more obscurely, I feel a bit of a Magic: The Gathering - Battlegrounds vibe with the way the more mystical variant of Giant Turtles are used both as Food Production, and as a potential form of defense. Other aspects feel reminiscent of the Blue's aesthetic in Battlegrounds, and perhaps some inspiration was drawn from the title, presenting an overall pretty aesthetic.

    The playstyle of the techtree is unique to the ingame factions in that rather than leveling up your Town Hall to tech up, you simply build the next structure, somewhat similar to how the Zerg play where the base structure produces all the units, while the unit structures provide the upgrades and unlock the next tier of units. This provides a much cheaper, and much faster way to tech up, as you can skip the expense and time investment of going to tier two or three, and jump straight into unlocking the units, all while expanding your Evokation field and the rate in which you collect the charges that allow you to produce your units.

    This does, unfortunately, provide a very fast means of going straight into the third tier, allowing you to fast track your way right into Channellers. This is actually optimal, as I was able to defeat an Insane AI with absolute ease using these. It also makes for easy creeping when you are able to use flying Colossi before the first Night Time even hits. Their primary weakness is that they can't attack air units, but that tends to not be much of an issue as you upgrade the Channelers to do additional damage against buildings and destroy waves of Food Production structures while picking apart entire armies.

    Unfortunately, none of your structures actually qualify as a Town Hall, either, making Town Portal ineffective for this faction. The potential oversight of Tavern Heroes, however, was well taken care of as they require the appropriate Tiered facilities - something that can be overlooked, and I am very glad to see it wasn't.

    The towers available to the faction are additionally interesting, as they are geared more towards levitation and can be picked up by the Giant Turtles, which are colloquially referred to as Stormbinders. Upon moving near them, the Tower can be picked up by the Turtles, turning them into Stormbearers. Pretty cool stuff. This gives them a Tempest ability which produces a debug message, and after a while begins Thunderclapping the ground with bolts of lightning.

    But in most likelyhood you probably won't use too much of those, or any of the other units, as Channelers are the way to go. Unless you come up against some fast Gargoyles or Hippogryphs, you're likely to be fine, and if anything does cause them damage it goes straight to their mana instead, which regenerates rather nicely. In some cases it does seem like the mana shielding could be easily exploitable by units like the Spellbreaker, or a Demon Hunter with his Mana Burn, but none of that really matters if you don't have a base.

    Some other things I noticed was that the Backpack upgrade seems strangely more expensive, suspiciously sporting the same icon and cost as the Thaumapagy upgrade found in the Aether Vault. Additionally, the Aether Vault requires only the Mystic Loom, allowing you to skip tier 1 units altogether, and realistically, this seems to be the best course of action. While the tier 1 units are by no means bad, they're no Channelers.

    A part of me can't help but wonder what the philosophy behind the entry is, either. While they feel similar to the Magic: The Gathering - Battlegrounds Blue faction stylistically in addition to Magic Protoss, I do wonder what the philosophy behind the faction is, as well as how that would translate into their playstyle.

    Overall, this techtree lives and breathes everything that is Spellbound, and the artistic style is classic Mythic, which appears to be a very fitting union. There are definite faults with this, possibly due to time constraints and being overly ambitious in some areas, but with the minimum requirements met it seems suitably established. Perhaps we will see an updated version over the horizon?



    xYoursTrulyx - Xetkin Clan Revisited

    A few minor updates have been made to this techtree, rounding it out a little more and making things a little neater. While a lot of the initial gripes about the early game mechanics still persist, having revisited them I have found they have a substantially useful exploit to take advantage of.

    When it comes to the strategy aspect, I recommend starting your early game with trying to establish your miners and getting an architect ASAP. Go for the Architect Tent, get two miner's guilds, and two lumber mills. Once you have an Architect out, for some reason this doesn't cost food, so you can afford to use another slot for an extra miner.

    Using the Architect, lay down the foundations for structures, but use the Laymen to finish them off. To do this, pull the Architect off and just set the Layman to work. When it comes to unit production facilities, you will need to manually click repair and target the structure in question, otherwise the Layman will get confused and want to get some early training. This will help you establish yourself in the early game economy wise, although you will always be a few steps behind because of it.

    This is where it picks up. Personally, I recommend getting two Hunter's Halls. You don't really want to bother with Scrappers, they're decent but the Archers are where it's at. For your hero, go the Pyromancer. The damage spell is fantastic and when you start leveling up his passive, he almost never runs out of mana to keep casting it. It makes for an effective early game hero killer.

    When you have a few archers out, start creeping with your Pyromancer and Archer party. Once you free up a Gold Mine, expand to it - you'll want to be producing laymen at twice the rate anyway, so you can pump out more archers, and having the extra gold income will be invaluable for the upcoming push. Creep a little more to get your Pyromancer to a decent level, and then hunt down the enemy base.

    This is where it gets obscene. You should be at tier 2 now, and have all the upgrades available for the archers, improving their attack range, attack rate and movement speed, and giving them an ability to expend 8 mana on a shot to deal an extra 50 damage. Once you have the enemy in your sights, activate Passion For War on all your Archers. It doesn't matter how far away they are, as long as you see an enemy they will pursue them. While you don't get to control the units individually anymore, you do get an immense attack rate boost, and if any of them die it's easy enough to replace them. Using the Refinery you can also upgrade their damage and armor values, which makes for an insane midgame push.

    So far this strategy seems to be the optimal way to play the faction, as you end up with an insane attack rate on your archers and they automatically attack move for you. As you pump out more Archers, just keep exploiting Passion For War on them and they'll take care of everything else for you. Then you can focus on just keeping your Pyromancer alive so he can tank up those juicy levels, and kill off any enemy heroes or units that look menacing enough.

    Considering this strategy is effectively an automatic attack move, I have to say this is actually god damn perfect for the Red theme. Once you get around the fiddly early game mechanics, it's a pretty chill "all in" strategy that you can use when playing them, and you get a hero that burns everything. What's not to love?
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
  9. Spellbound

    Spellbound

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    That was a quick review! Thanks for taking the time.

    That... was unintended xD The Mystic Loom initially required an Aegisary to be built but I worried about causing too much of a dependency chain. Turns out, without an upgrading town hall, you kinda need said chain to nerf the rush to tier 3. I've also since made Aether Vaults and Lyceums as expensive and time-consuming as upgrading town halls. Should help with slowing things down a little bit.

    I do wonder if that's the cause of some of the issues I've been having. I never intended for the Fountainhead to not be a town hall. That was an oversight. 'twill be rectified.

    Whoops. Will remove debug msg.

    Backpack upgrade was an afterthought and copied and modified from another existing upgrade and in my haste I forgot to change icons and stuff like that.

    It's about perfection and quality over quantity. Notice that the only 'human' (or elven, rather) units at play are tier 3 units and heroes. Everything else are constructs or animals. The Starfall Empire is all about the excellence of the individual, and being elves, they have a long, long, long time to get there. There's also elements of misdirection or subversion in there, like the Tesseract's Inverse Lattice and Phantasm (an illusion that will hurt you if you attack it). Mana shields can also be considered Blue, as you hit something and expect it to bleed, but you strike a barrier instead. The Witness is also a superlative scout, which gives you much needed insight into enemy movements so you can outmaneuver them.

    Mebbe

    Thanks for that rather thorough review :)
     
  10. Wazzz

    Wazzz

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    @Spellbound hmm, if the lack of a Town Hall status was what caused some of the problems in the first place, perhaps it was as simple as all that after all? Well here's hoping, that would be awesome if it really did chalk down to something so deceptively minor

    Oh dang, I also forgot to mention that the Observer-y unit didn't move in either form.
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
  11. Spellbound

    Spellbound

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    Review time!

    Dark Elves

    The first thing that stood out to me was how the workers justs didn't do much. I sorta see where you were going with this, but the implementation could have been better, imo. In general I feel like worker should constantly being doing something, and the summoner chicks should have been given some role, like mining gold the way Acolytes do it. Building construction could have been done by summoning an Elemental that will then sacrifice itself to create the building. Obviously there's a lot of coding involved there but I think that's something worth trying.

    For the Banner System, I feel like then again the implementation could have been better. It's not bad, by any stretch of the imagination, but it can be somewhat confusing the first few times you're playing this faction. When I got to the point where I could train Black Amazons, they were basically the only units I bothered with. I didn't get the sense that they were overpowered, but it was simple to remember what I was getting. I would add, though, that something like the Banner System would work wonders had there been some sort of squad system to go along with it. Then again, those tend to be rather clunky so it's can be something hard to accomplish in the wc3 engine.


    Cult of the Damned

    The idea of the Plague Cauldron sacrificing units into better things is super neat. While my first instinct was to ask why not just use a morph, I do feel like this method is potentially more fun, especially if you take that concept and combine it with custom UI to make a global ability. Maybe it even comes in AoE and Single-Target versions, allowing you to convert swathes of units at a time. I did spend a fair amount of time testing the Cauldron's sacrifice on a number of units to see what they become. Really neat feature.

    On the downside, workers with timed life? Can;t say I'm fond of that. I was constantly running out of gold because my workers were dying (though I did have a bunch of skeletons hanging around). It's an interesting way to turn the harshness of slavery into a game mechanic but something more like a health degen and potential ways to curb that (at the cost of effciency) would have been preferrable. What's more, this creates the opportunity for a taskmaster kind of a unit that would specialise in base-management a bit like the Zerg Queen from StarCraft II.

    Also one of your ranged heroes has an no-target aoe spell. Better to give that to the melee heroes imo. Also, Pact of the Damned costs more mana that the caster's maximum.


    Forces of Gaia

    First of all, Racoons as worker? Brilliant.

    The idea of Growth of Green is quite nicely implemented with the Sasquatch and the green drakes. The use of Gnolls on trees as turret is a nice idea but the implementation could be a lot better (eg using the Orc Burrow technique or some sort of right-click detection). Some things like the Pool having a healing role but also having upgrades means it can't heal while upgrading. Rock Golem with chaos damage means I don't need to make anything else, also Dropbears have a *lot* of mana so they can heal infinitely. Remains quite a fun race to play.


    Orderions

    This faction has hands down the *BEST* unit in all of RTS history: Female Aragorn. She can't attack, but will return damage if stuck, and she's also a healer. She can also taunt male units. Specifically male. I did not test this against Night Elves, but I choose to believe the tooltip and trust that MyPad actually went through the trouble of listing all female units and checking if the unit being taunted is not on there.

    On a more serious note, the method of lumber harvest is neat, reminds me the race I made for the first Advanced Techtree Contest that was rife with bugs and was nigh-unplayable, but the lumber was harvested by loading workers into a cube. Although, it didn't appear that the more workers inside of a food-production building increased its gathering power.

    Visually the faction is a bit all over the place. 'Twas fun, but feels unfinished, what with the lack of heroes and all.


    Xetkin Clan

    It's an odd feeling to see Battle Realms inside of Warcraft 3 but it's been done quite well. The unique training system feels original and intuitive but the worker system does need improving. It would have been preferrable for the Layman to be able to construct food production, and for said food production to produce more Laymen since your only source of Laymen is the town hall. When you're teching up, you can't produce any Laymen for at least two-and-then-some minutes. Artisans also just hang around doing nothing. Being able to train them into warriors like the Laymen would allow players to recycle idle Artisans into a more active role.

    Aesthetically, this faction is cohesive and quite nice. It has to be said, however, that the units tend to all look alike. That's not really a criticism on your work, but it's worth pointing out, imo.

    When it comes to combat, I entered a melee with the Serpent Incarnate and all my unit suddenly caught fire and started doing w/e they wanted. I understand this is a Red faction, but... but... my units. /single tear. They did wipe the floor with an Orc army, but they remained uncontrollable even after the fight. GG, best army, strongk af but one-time use only. The Serpent remained uncontrollable even after combat died. I assume that's not by design.

    Quite a fun faction, however. Plenty of neat upgrades to buff those units. Also the Scavenger deals 56 - 276 damage at level 3 damage upgrade. Might wanna nerf that.

    PS: if you want to cancel an order immediate after it's given, run a zero-second timer and then order the unit in question to stop. It will look seamless.


    Bandit Outlaws

    Soundtrack is Necropolis theme from Heroes of Might and Magic IV! That game might not be the best HoMM title out there, but imo is has some of the best soundtracks.

    This is a very cleverly developed faction, in general. Everything from their altar-type structure being a tavern to the town-hall having the same recruitment functionality as a mecenary camp make it feel extremely well thought-out. Thematically, it's very coherent and it's well at home with its Black philosophy; bandits are mostly selfish bastards, and this is a whole faction of them.

    The Skaven units are really fun to use and work really well with the whole army. If you have a few Sharpshooter Teams and Gunner, they will *violate* bases. The amount of siege damage on display is impressive, to say the least.

    The Void Walker seems to be the only unit with a healing ability, and the shop doesn't appear to have any way to heal units. Loading a unit inside of a tent will heal them, but the cargo system being somewhat clunky makes this hard to control at times, requiring constant mirco to heal multiple units. For a Black faction it makes sense to not have a lot of healing but I still would have preferred a more efficient way to heal my units after a confrontation. Simply allowing more than 1 unit per tent might have made this better. It's quite a minor point, however. Overall this faction is really good.
     
  12. xYours Trulyx

    xYours Trulyx

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    Really appreciate that you reviewed my entry. I really, really need to update my race, but I still don't have answers as to weather or nor the penalty rate is applied to this deadline extension. I wish I could review the marvelous entries we have so far, but the patch I'm running on seems to have a bug where the AI can't properly find an attack route, thus freezing the game every few seconds. Heck, I can't even test out my own entry.

    The Serpent Incarnate is meant to do that. When he fights, you fight. No questions.
    I agree that my worker system is kinda shite right now.
     
  13. Wazzz

    Wazzz

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    I had a feeling you'd pick up on the soundtrack used :D
    At first I was pondering using the Chaos theme since it has Bandits available to that faction in the game, but listening through the soundtrack I just felt the Necropolis fit better. Definitely one of the more underrated entries in the HoMM series, but I've always had a soft spot for it.

    Healing was absolutely a tough one for the faction. On the one hand, I found myself having a huuuuge aversion to doing traditional healing for the Black theme, but god damn it there needs to be some means of maintaining your troops! So, there's a few things here and there, the Tent Cargo Mechanics are a tad on the tedious side as I did actually find I had to queue up entering the unit within, and because it precluded the flying units from having access to it I provided them with the Shadow Form as a means of regeneration. The Void Walker ability is sort of a double-edged sword, phase a unit out and let them regenerate, but overall it's definitely a more offensive faction :p
    Very glad you liked it :D

    @xYours Trulyx, the penalty rate still applies now but it's up to you whether you want to take the penalty or not. As it stands, the race is still pretty playable, and I updated one of my posts up above to show a strategy for playing around with it ^_^
     
  14. xYours Trulyx

    xYours Trulyx

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    It's around 7.5% penalty right now, right?
    This is a big gamble. I need a few minutes to decide.
     
  15. Wazzz

    Wazzz

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    Well, we'd be on the third day still, based on GMT, so it should be 6% now. But the fourth day will be 10%.
    I don't know if that helps or not, but it is 1.5% less than you were initially thinking, so maybe that will be the deciding factor :D
     
  16. islesofurth

    islesofurth

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    :D

    Thank you :)
    I had a lot of difficulty balancing those 2 units

    Originally I had tried to make the Gnoll jump onto a tree. But having a lot of difficulty making it & needing a tower building anyway...Next time maybe.

    Oh, i never considered this.
    If it was only the healing upgrade it would be a good thing, but since its the main upgrade building its a very bad thing

    Really?
    But it can only attack buildings and air, also it have slow movement& really bad turning. Not to mention it gets even slower when it splits.

    Hehe, ya that i missed that one :p
    they are only meant to have as much as a preist or a sorc.

    Glad you enjoyed it :D
     
  17. Wazzz

    Wazzz

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    I actually thought the Golem were going to be super good and then I realized no, they can only hit buildings... and air, but no ground other than buildings...
    Which was a little baffling, the tooltip probably should mention that one :p

    Oh well, it's still a fun techtree to play and I have a real soft spot for it
     
  18. Spellbound

    Spellbound

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    Oh.. I genuinely thought they were attacking units. Might have been confused in the melee..w was attacking a base ^^;
     
  19. Leods

    Leods

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    Dec 16, 2018
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    hahaha, so I spent writing that manual, for you to continue experimenting? Although I admit it's fun. Even I, knowing what could happen, I spent about five minutes just watching my units die. I save your work. Those are the only combinations. Any other will just kill the unit. I was thinking of creating some secret combinations, but I had no more human units that could be involved.
    That's a good idea.
    Maybe at some other time, after the tournament, I steal you this idea.
    It's based in the argument of shooting star, of the priestess of the moon. A little secret? This ability is, also, based in that ultimate. I just maded little changes.
    Hmmm, it does? After the contest is over, if I do that review, I will decrease the damage and life of the caster at the expense of more mana. For now, you can simply update it, until you have the necessary statistics. Thanks for the review!
    So, the poll will start soon, i suppose.
     
  20. Riki Martin

    Riki Martin

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    I was planning to make some improvements to my faction, mainly banner armies and evokers, but I couldn't do it.

    I have had some obligations during these last days and I even had to upload my entry before the time I had planned. I plan to make the improvements later and upload it to the map section.
     
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