Warcraft 3 Reforged

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Sorry to say that but i am excessively pesimistic towards this.......its really far call from what should be made(take Starcraft 1 Remastered for prime example of how faithful they could get....if they tried...). It's poorly done port of heroes of the storm and world of warcraft assets with few edits, incredibly unfaithful to the artstyle. Excessively revisionist and meant only for world of warcraft fanbase that didnt play the rts games at all. It looks really bad so far especially the culling trailer....it looks like fan fic machnima and menages to be far worse cinematic wise to original cutscene in wc3....which is remarkable.....in worst way possible... I would take the slightly wowified models from Sc2 HD Wc3 asset pack we got years back over this....it wasnt perfect...would still be incredibly unfitting to all assets we made over the years but would be for sure much closer AND WOULD use original animations.....when this lazily put together mess uses animations from wherever it got copied and ported from either wow or hots(even if its reanimated its clealry not trying too hard to resemble originals...), same with many sounds. How did it go from quite well done remasters like WoW HD models in WoD and Starcraft 1 to this disrespectful revisionist remake?

On top of that it will part the community, make artstyle in games with custom assets incredibly inconsistent and painful to look at, will make Reforged the stardard kids and newcomers will default to neglecting original game, and will be just heptic mess that will hurt the game over all. It should be handled in far better way.....with respect and faithfulness Starcraft 1 received...... Is Warcraft 3 not worthy of such treatment? What are reasons to make this so lazily, to such degree that it doesnt even bother to attempt at being a remaster? Good remaster is at faithful as it is physicly possible, with all sounds, animations(with minor upgrades which we seen on Sc2 HD wc3 pack despite its minor wowification in few models, and textures that would break all custom assets made by us using ingame textures), UI and music. Instead we get everything disrespectfully changed and Excuse given is "You dont like it then dont play it" or "You still have the old game" from most people who dont even understand this community too well.

I feel incredibly dissapointed and betrayed, it should be given far more respect and stick to original artstyle with improvements drawn from textures, icon artworks and concept arftworks....instead we got revisionist mash up of existing Heroes of the Storm and World of Warcraft assets with few edits and reskins using source animations which are incredibly clinky and unfitting and are incredibly far call from originals..... I dont care that some people who dont understand my points will attack me, but i wont stand for this and will still carry on with my plans of remastering wc3 in coming years on my own i just got myself freed of previous time constraints that stopped my progress for months.....and i am greeted by this.....and many wow fans and clueless people who dont think about it in proper mindset taking everything into account praise it to no end......which is a really bad sign.....
 
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It looks really bad so far especially the culling trailer....it looks like fan fic machnima and menages to be far worse cinematic wise to original cutscene in wc3....which is remarkable.....in worst way possible...
Blizzard probably has their B or C team working on this remaster, while for Starcraft they had the real deal. That or they just probably don't care at all since they know for sure that people will buy their games regardless of quality (Battle for Azeroth for example) due to them being such a big name in the gaming industry. I'm positive they could've done a way better cutscene even under time constraints if they cared at all.
 

deepstrasz

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with respect and faithfulness Starcraft 1 received
Except for many portraits and not only.
and many wow fans and clueless people who dont think about it in proper mindset taking everything into account praise it to no end......which is a really bad sign.....
It's the sign they need. Hopefully, the modding part would be what will actually matter in the end.
 
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It's poorly done port of heroes of the storm and world of warcraft assets with few edits, incredibly unfaithful to the artstyle
I respectfully disagree. While the in-game cutscene they showed ("The Culling" between Arthas and Uther) looked a little bit like WoW's shorts, the actual gameplay they showed off looks incredibly respectful of the original art style.

it looks like fan fic machnima and menages to be far worse cinematic wise to original cutscene in wc3

Ah yes, look at this amazing writing. Such a detailed cinematic!

On top of that it will part the community, make artstyle in games with custom assets incredibly inconsistent and painful to look at,

Considering you can still use the original art assets with a simple button to switch between them, I don't think it's going to part the community too badly. I bet you could even enforce new vs old graphics as a map option.

I think you are blowing this WAY out of proportion.
 
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Chaosy

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Getting upgrades and complaining
pp,550x550.u2.jpg


I suggest the reforge edition is 600x800 max res and units can only move in 8 directions like diablo 1.
And lastly, no sounds are allowed to maintain our stoneage pre-evolution feel where we had not developed the ability to hear yet.

edit: sign my petition to add "omegalul" as a standard emoji to the hive.
 
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For guys that said new graphics are not cool etc or saying asking money for only dynamic shadows is bad here is my answer: I worked atleast 5 years to make that HD mod and I'lld even give 100 dolars if they were gonna do it and now they have done it, so if you guys don't like it just play classic you have, I will play with my new graphics and also use models I made that I still like better.
 
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deepstrasz

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This isn’t curing. This is adding while trying to cure what is not broken.
It's called treatment.
I suggest the reforge edition is 600x800 max res and units can only move in 8 directions like diablo 1.
And lastly, no sounds are allowed to maintain our stoneage pre-evolution feel where we had not developed the ability to hear yet.

edit: sign my petition to add "omegalul" as a standard emoji to the hive.
I'm sorry. A remaster is not supposed to be a reboot.
For guys that said new graphics are not cool etc or saying asking money for only dynamic shadows is bad here is my answer: I worked atleast 5 years to make that HD mod and I'lld even give 100 dolars if they were gonna do it and now they have done it, so if you guys don't like it just play classic you have, I will play with my new graphics and also use models I made that I still like better.
Let's understand this. You're still going to use your models even though your happy they did what they did?
Also, your work is pretty much in vain now.
 
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It's called treatment.

I'm sorry. A remaster is not supposed to be a reboot.

Let's understand this. You're still going to use your models even though your happy they did what they did?
Also, your work is pretty much in vain now.
No, no I did not try to say it I mean I don't care about my mod they can take all my money I'll use their models and if I don't like a model I'll use my versions on top of it
 
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I respectfully disagree. While the in-game cutscene they showed ("The Culling" between Arthas and Uther) looked a little bit like WoW's shorts, the actual gameplay they showed off looks incredibly respectful of the original art style.
I even more respectfully and excessively firmly disagree. Its not Wc3 artstyle, it's based of one of unused artworks that went to use in Hots, model isnt copied from there per se(except for jaina who is DIRECTLY copied from hots and restextured, maybe with her face edited a tiny bit...). Wc3 Artstyle is mroe cartoony ingame and more realistic in cinematics, WoW isnt on either it kind of sits in the middle and towards to "fantasy oversized and overly fancy syndrome". Replacing the sounds shouldnt even happen. REMASTER is a faithful recreation and upgrade of original game's appreance with all audio and animations intact, it could be improved(good examples are hadn and face animations on WC3HD models in Starcraft 2 which are MUCH more faithful that this mess they shown because it TRIES to look like wc3 and mostly suceeds even if i still have some issues with it, but its MUCH better than what they just shown)

Ah yes, look at this amazing writing. Such a detailed cinematic!
you completely missed my point. It was about the atmosphere of the scene, way it was acted out even with wc3's limitations, Culling trailer looks really bad in comparison to that..... which as i said is remarkably bad feat. Again artstyle is incredibly unfaithful. Its derived from WoW and Hots models swith some being straight ported from Hots like human knights, footmen, blademaster to some extend with edits buildings and so on(Alterac map from hots).


Considering you can still use the original art assets with a simple button to switch between them, I don't think it's going to part the community too badly. I bet you could even enforce new vs old graphics as a map option.

I think you are blowing this WAY out of proportion.
It doesnt change a think about making all assets accumulated over the years aside from few(which will still not fit with ones they used even with more detailed custom made ones) will be obsolete and unfitting in al custom maps using them. New doodads are welcome but they still should be adapted for wc3 artstyle instead of being literally WoW's artstyle with textures and look. Changing the cinematics instead of trying to recover originals and updating them to rerender at higher resolution was also not ideal.....there was no need to repalce the audio in it.

Another thing is.....how will it work with original game if assets of 'Reforged' are used, that may or may not be unique like Terenas statue i seen in culling. Does it replace some wc3 doodad or it will be there is it's wow-style appearence?
 
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I wouldn't say it in such a harsh way, but I think pretty much the same, to be honest. I don't feel the new graphics are faithful to the origin design. They have amplified the cartoonish design, which was already cartoonish enough...
And it's obvious Blizzard tried to match WoW as much as possible. This is a disappointment, because there are many things I dislike about post-vanilla WoW. For example, the excessive size of spaulders or weapons which is really absurd, like in WoW. Just look at Arthas' head in Reforged, it is ridiculously small compared to the rest of his body, his armour and his oversized weapon. It's just my personal taste here though, but I'm sure I'm not the only one. They changed the whole Stratholme map just to match WoW design: was it necessary? I mean, does WoW derive from Warcraft III, or is it the other way around? Are they going to change all Warcraft III campaigns to make sure it is as close as possible as WoW, even if it degrades the original game experience? (and I think WoW design and scenario were already messed up since a long time ago, but that's another topic)
I concur with Deepstrasz here, is it a reboot or a remaster?

As for the general style, there are pros and cons, in my opinion. Right now, I'm almost happy with most units (except what I said about size issues). I really don't like buildings. They are too stylized, too cartoonish. Overall environment is not too bad, however I find it too smooth. On the whole, you can see there was a clear choice in visual style, similar to games like Heroes of the Storm, or also a bit like Overwatch or even Fortnite, games with that kind of style. Maybe to follow the current trend in games graphics, I don't know, but I'm so not fond of it.

Also, why putting one orc and two jungle trolls in the surroundings of Stratholme? Jungle trolls in Lordaeron? I don't mean to be an ass, but do they know there own game? I hope they just dropped them there just for Blizzcon, to show off some of the new assets.

And, again, I'm disappointed that even the best custom models won't be able to fit in this remaster.

These are just my humble thoughts. I'll try to be more specific and constructive in the future, especially when more footage will be available. Perhaps new threads should be opened shortly, so we can discuss about suggestions and deliver some feedback?
 
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I hope for a unit database in game like in starcraft 2. So you could for example choose footmen from Stormwind, Lordaeron Stromgarde, Dalaran etc. For orc the clans and so on.
YES!!! THIS I'D LOVE!! :D Also for UI to have it stylized in such a way. :) So sometimes u can play Humans but not always have Lordaeron crest in your UI. :)
 
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I wouldn't say it in such a harsh way, but I think pretty much the same, to be honest. I don't feel the new graphics are faithful to the origin design. They have amplified the cartoonish design, which was already cartoonish enough...
And it's obvious Blizzard tried to match WoW as much as possible. This is a disappointment, because there are many things I dislike about post-vanilla WoW. For example, the excessive size of spaulders or weapons which is really absurd, like in WoW. Just look at Arthas' head in Reforged, it is ridiculously small compared to the rest of his body, his armour and his oversized weapon. It's just my personal taste here though, but I'm sure I'm not the only one. They changed the whole Stratholme map just to match WoW design: was it necessary? I mean, does WoW derive from Warcraft III, or is it the other way around? Are they going to change all Warcraft III campaigns to make sure it is as close as possible as WoW, even if it degrades the original game experience? (and I think WoW design and scenario were already messed up since a long time ago, but that's another topic)
I concur with Deepstrasz here, is it a reboot or a remaster?

As for the general style, there are pros and cons, in my opinion. Right now, I'm almost happy with most units (except what I said about size issues). I really don't like buildings. They are too stylized, too cartoonish. Overall environment is not too bad, however I find it too smooth. On the whole, you can see there was a clear choice in visual style, similar to games like Heroes of the Storm, or also a bit like Overwatch or even Fortnite, games with that kind of style. Maybe to follow the current trend in games graphics, I don't know, but I'm so not fond of it.

Also, why putting one orc and two jungle trolls in the surroundings of Stratholme? Jungle trolls in Lordaeron? I don't mean to be an ass, but do they know there own game? I hope they just dropped them there just for Blizzcon, to show off some of the new assets.

And, again, I'm disappointed that even the best custom models won't be able to fit in this remaster.

These are just my humble thoughts. I'll try to be more specific and constructive in the future, especially when more footage will be available. Perhaps new threads should be opened shortly, so we can discuss about suggestions and deliver some feedback?
Good to see that i am no alone :v
Yes buildings are really ugly cuz of this excessive stylized appearence and WoW traits like over sized armours and too much of unnessesary decorations or spikes on the armour is really bad. I dislike changes or animations and cinematic style. It could be still similar to originals like Sc2 does it ingame and with few better animated cutscenes that reflect original style more. It is weirdly done now.

Also style is very weird mix of excessively cartoonish and "wow realistic" and it adds to excessive inconsistency.
I want to show with my planned remasters of models to show how it should be done. It will take time to do.

I really dislike the UI and graphics for loadings. It shoudnt be changed(could be redrawn for 16:9)

Animations should be exacly like in original with minor improvements(hand motions) like Sc2 Wc3HD models do, and for models to be as close to originals as possible.
 
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'WoW' style looking doodads\buildings are epic, I hope they'll use old design abit more though for ghoul etc, also Necromancer is pretty epic my only wish is them going the WoW route and not going that Hots shitty style.

So yes old 'concept' 'design' must be kept for all models (add that damn tail to dreadlord even though he looks epic) but the style must be like this WoW-realistic
 
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I will drop whatever I said befo
'WoW' style looking doodads\buildings are epic, I hope they'll use old design abit more though for ghoul etc, also Necromancer is pretty epic my only wish is them going the WoW route and not going that Hots shitty style.
hate to break it to you. They already did go the shitty style.

Also for the rest of you. Arguing is pointless, but many will ask for it. Accidentally or on purpose.

You will have to learn to face the divide soon between Warcraft communities. Only when the game truly comes out will you learn about disappointment and what really is fine to remain and what isn’t fine to remain. Many of you will like this game because of the endless mods you can do that is no where similar to the game, but let’s face it... you people have been doing that with terrain and many other crap for years as well. So the Hive Workshop will face a divide and all moderators should smart up and learn to take critic voices and opinions into consideration. Massive forum changes will have to be ready before 2019. We should be ready.

It is clear to our eyes that the years of good work and commute that has kept this community thriving will all be flushed out. Changes will be made. New models will be at the horizon and new ones will be here. The many old ones we made will be useless to the new engine and those who know real Warcraft 3 will always use the old ones and ya engine. and God bless those who see that Warcraft 3 should be a game built with passion and love for what the game it originally was. Not some cheap graphical sell out it will become.

I, for one, will not give in to easy graphical changes of a game that I don’t even recognize anymore. I will leave my opinion to that and hope the Hive members organize before the coming release of this new release and list down all the main issues. But I am afraid they aren’t capable of doing that and hoped on the hive hype train. Chu-chu!

Farewell and good luck. “Takes up pick axe and Walks peasants style” More work?
 

Dr Super Good

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what's sure was that the demo Grubby played was unoptimized.
It likely was optimized, but not gone through an optimization pass with the code. That said, such passes give some performance increases, not enough that a high end lap top running an ancient game on an undemanding map will suddenly perform very well. If you have an already working, >10 year old game that was designed to run on a 300MHz processor with trash pipelining and it suddenly performs like trash on a high end Intel processor form post 2016 then you have done something horribly wrong.

Yes the graphics are more complex. No it should not impact frame rate much on any reasonable GPU. VPU load should be reduced due to more modern D3D11 or D3D12 level APIs. WC3 barely loaded GPUs anyway so a little bit more is still trivial. Unless they are saying that they are relying on driver profiles to be written from AMD and NVidia...

Also "cutting edge" graphics?! It got raytracing or something? Or again, did they write the page 2 years ago before cutting edge and the system requirements changed...
 
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You will have to learn to face the divide soon between Warcraft communities. Only when the game truly comes out will you learn about disappointment and what really is fine to remain and what isn’t fine to remain.
I'm just going to point out that this exact quote was said of Brood War Remastered when it was first announced.
 
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I will drop whatever I said befo
hate to break it to you. They already did go the shitty style.

Also for the rest of you. Arguing is pointless, but many will ask for it. Accidentally or on purpose.

You will have to learn to face the divide soon between Warcraft communities. Only when the game truly comes out will you learn about disappointment and what really is fine to remain and what isn’t fine to remain. Many of you will like this game because of the endless mods you can do that is no where similar to the game, but let’s face it... you people have been doing that with terrain and many other crap for years as well. So the Hive Workshop will face a divide and all moderators should smart up and learn to take critic voices and opinions into consideration. Massive forum changes will have to be ready before 2019. We should be ready.

It is clear to our eyes that the years of good work and commute that has kept this community thriving will all be flushed out. Changes will be made. New models will be at the horizon and new ones will be here. The many old ones we made will be useless to the new engine and those who know real Warcraft 3 will always use the old ones and ya engine. and God bless those who see that Warcraft 3 should be a game built with passion and love for what the game it originally was. Not some cheap graphical sell out it will become.

I, for one, will not give in to easy graphical changes of a game that I don’t even recognize anymore. I will leave my opinion to that and hope the Hive members organize before the coming release of this new release and list down all the main issues. But I am afraid they aren’t capable of doing that and hoped on the hive hype train. Chu-chu!

Farewell and good luck. “Takes up pick axe and Walks peasants style” More work?

Side note; I'm so happy that old models will be like 'trash' , as a HD modder(which is a retired job by that announcement) every map with imports were a pain to look at to me, they were clashing with hd models and ruining the whole reason for that 'hd' mod
 

deepstrasz

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I'm just going to point out that this exact quote was said of Brood War Remastered when it was first announced.
And I've still hadn't bought it even today. Too many uncalled for changes to portraits and art. I would have been very happy with a resolution boost. The StarEdit has it. The game could have had it too. Many have done it with third party tools before.
 

deepstrasz

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you literally can still play it with the original graphics in widescreen mode at higher resolutions without buying the remaster
How? I get black borders and it's not widescreen. I'm talking about the current game patch version.
Side note; I'm so happy that old models will be like 'trash' , as a HD modder(which is a retired job by that announcement) every map with imports were a pain to look at to me, they were clashing with hd models and ruining the whole reason for that 'hd' mod
You are not the Warcraft III community. You're just one piece.
 
Ok ill be honest : when i saw news i couldnt believe cause there was no logic to tell me they will do it - deep paranoia i just thought its a joke or hacked page.

My first reaction was similar to crying of happines , then when i watch video i was kinda : WTF is this , i expected way more.

Some assets look terrible, enviroment is not kinda in same tone,colors dont blend much and some assets got different art style in environment.

About models : Some are huge dissapointment about art style, and some use very bad animations.

I wonder did you followed head concept of human worker ?? ! I couldnt see its portait yet , but i saw icon of human similar to old wc3,he should like that. Cause human worker is epic,unique.

Also zombie face i could see, unit is very nicely done. Do you know wc3 Portrait of Zombie is kinda UNIQUE! Combination of hairless undead and frankenshtien - i cant get close describe sorry . Its just unique art style

What Blizzard must understand is that there is 1 hard-line that warcraft 3 makes epic and unique (and i was afraid they will care of it) is combination of : 1.Portrait (which is kinda constantly with you when you control the unit) 2. Unique animations for some models 3. Sounds of characters talking

This trinity gave a soul of old wc3 , actually it gives PERSONALITY to units. And in some custom games they are EPIC and you kinda cant forget them(while tho in melee they are just creeps to kill) .Either you find wow generic, or hots not enough style like wc3, or sc2-wc3 assets not enough quality : You must agree old wc3 had a SOUL = eh but it wasnt HD enough?

After all that anger i said to my self : Relax , the most important thing is it HAPPEND! It has to be started, our hearts need remaster badly .I am afriad this is way to pushed cause of actual need , and some good will of blizz people for fans screaming for remaster. And it is obviously top blizz guys dont give a fuck.

YOU KNOW WHAT ? THERES NO TURN BACK NOW . I dont care about skins much , but it gives me a reasonable logic premise that : The game will not die, and we will be able to buy skins so top-lords can earn money = which means game will get new patches,upgrades etc!

I think they must do it cause = we cant afford they abandon us again for 10 years without any patch!

Blizzard must help to those guys of wc3 reforged, cause now theres no turning back and its a huge huge potential.

So everyne who is not satisfyed with everything : Relax , say tnx to anyone who pushed this to happen (classic team guys or someone else???), dont judge this hard, support it, cause its not over. Got new engine thnx god the most important thing ever. Relax please...

Relax cause no metter how some thing dont look as we expected : Somone pushed this to blizz elite money-blood-sckers and bring it to people so selfish elite cant say NO to us anymore.

Yes maybe B or C team is doing it . I wish team A is doing - whatever i will never forget the courage of people who brought this = even tho i dont know their names :D

For 2-3 years from this moment we will face with something like Dota 2 did with its Dota 2 Rebirth thing .

And in glory of that i suggest that warcraft 3 reinforged can have a game name Warcraft 3 Rebirth :) lol
 
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How? I get black borders and it's not widescreen. I'm talking about the current game patch version.

You are not the Warcraft III community. You're just one piece.
Yeah i dont really like what he said there......
Also......they really should just embrace wc3 artstyle......its what made it look still nice despite blocky models. thanks to nicely tuned cartony artstyle that made it age finely alongside with good animations that are well timed and defined, which makes me dislike this reanimations or just replacements with hots animations....
 

Dr Super Good

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I will point out that because WC3 had no colour management, if they actually gave it colour management, as I suggested in the past, it would look washed out until they adjust the light intensity and such to be appropriate. My suggestion was made that it be applied to all versions of Warcraft III, and not just a remaster, because it will alter fundamental parts of the game graphics that will always be in common.
 
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Yeah i dont really like what he said there......
Also......they really should just embrace wc3 artstyle......its what made it look still nice despite blocky models. thanks to nicely tuned cartony artstyle that made it age finely alongside with good animations that are well timed and defined, which makes me dislike this reanimations or just replacements with hots animations....
And how he totally dodged the answer to my question afterwards.

All I'm saying is I'm happy that was what needed so Blizzard has done the right thing, if people thinks it is bad they can make a better remaster themselves, We (Armies of Azeroth) tried it and it looks like we failed to deliever it in time and yes I do think some models we made are cooler but there is no denyinh Blizzard did ALL while we were just crawling
 

deepstrasz

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All I'm saying is I'm happy that was what needed so Blizzard has done the right thing, if people thinks it is bad they can make a better remaster themselves, We (Armies of Azeroth) tried it and it looks like we failed to deliever it in time and yes I do think some models we made are cooler but there is no denyinh Blizzard did ALL while we were just crawling
I was referring to this question, not yours:
Warcraft 3 Reforged
 
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The only thing I'm missing right now is the old a lot dirtier look but oh boy, it seems they are doing a lot of things right!
:infl_thumbs_up::infl_thumbs_up::infl_thumbs_up:
 
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I have been a Warcraft 3 player for 10 years now and I don't know if I should be excited or annoyed >_>
although 30 euro is a good price I don't want to have to buy the game AGAIN!
they could at least make it that if you have your ROC & TFT keys to get the game for free... OR at least get a discount lol...

also I should hurry and finish my map before the new WC3 is out >_>
 
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I have been a Warcraft 3 player for 10 years now and ... I don't want to have to buy the game AGAIN!

I've never understood this argument... It's one thing if it was a game littered with microtransactions and DLC and you're paying to get it on a new platform with slightly better graphics a couple years later (Skyrim), but... Come on. It's been 16 years, dude. How many hours have you spent in this game? Do you think you got your money's worth? Because if not, I feel really sorry for you.
 
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Good to see that i am no alone :v
Yes buildings are really ugly cuz of this excessive stylized appearence and WoW traits like over sized armours and too much of unnessesary decorations or spikes on the armour is really bad. I dislike changes or animations and cinematic style. It could be still similar to originals like Sc2 does it ingame and with few better animated cutscenes that reflect original style more. It is weirdly done now.

Also style is very weird mix of excessively cartoonish and "wow realistic" and it adds to excessive inconsistency.
I want to show with my planned remasters of models to show how it should be done. It will take time to do.

I really dislike the UI and graphics for loadings. It shoudnt be changed(could be redrawn for 16:9)

Animations should be exacly like in original with minor improvements(hand motions) like Sc2 Wc3HD models do, and for models to be as close to originals as possible.
i support your opinion about blizzard trying to make people waste money in something which will be a dissapointment, as it does with its new patchs it created. the graphics and mechanics seems to be really poor and i wouldn't expect a better development in the new world editor. blizzard even confirmed when this new version of warcraft will be available!!

it is so similar when blizzard released "wc3 - armies of azeroth", but even this mod has better graphics than this new wc3 version.

8.jpg

maxresdefault.jpg
 
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