• 🏆 Texturing Contest #33 is OPEN! Contestants must re-texture a SD unit model found in-game (Warcraft 3 Classic), recreating the unit into a peaceful NPC version. 🔗Click here to enter!
  • 🏆 Hive's 6th HD Modeling Contest: Mechanical is now open! Design and model a mechanical creature, mechanized animal, a futuristic robotic being, or anything else your imagination can tinker with! 📅 Submissions close on June 30, 2024. Don't miss this opportunity to let your creativity shine! Enter now and show us your mechanical masterpiece! 🔗 Click here to enter!

Hero Contest #8 - Joint: Artist & Coder

Status
Not open for further replies.

Kyrbi0

Arena Moderator
Level 45
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
9,521
the%20hive%20workshop.png


hero.png
contest.png
number.png
8.png



Hero Contest #8

Artists & Coders Unite!
TAVERN Series

You may remember THW's successful series of Hero Contests... This time around though, we're kicking it up a notch and trying to involve multiple aspects of the site in one tremendous contest of skill. Both artists and coders will unite together to enter into this contest: the artist will choose and create aspects of the hero's graphics while the coder will provide the hero with spells. With good teamwork, the end result will be worthy of taking a spot in the Neutral Taverns!


You may choose to create a hero for any non-primary Faction (i.e. not Alliance, Horde, Scourge, or Sentinels). You are to create the ninth hero for the Tavern, including skills fitting of that hero and the Neutral Heroes in general. You will need to consider how that hero balances with the other heroes in the Tavern and how it impacts the metagame of melee as a whole. It might sound scary, but with solid teamwork and design you can pull through with a winner!



contest%20rules%20and%20conditions.png


Contest Rules:
  • Everybody is allowed and encouraged to enter, as long as they follow the rules.
  • Two people per team, one artist, one coder.
  • No entrant can be a member of multiple teams.
  • One entry per team.
  • No submission may violate the Hive Workshop Rules and Spells Rules.
  • If you are both a skilled artist and coder in one, you cannot perform both tasks and be your own team. Choose to team up with another individual who needs a partner and do that part of the tasks.
  • All entries must be designed specifically for this contest, there will be no previously-made work allowed. Exception: The Hero you make for the Techtree Contest #11 can be used for this Contest (and vice versa)
  • Any submission must follow a Work In Progress (WiP) image, before it is published and labelled as the final piece.
_______________________________________________

Hero Requirements:
  • Your hero must be a hero for the Neutral Tavern.
  • The hero must have only 4 spells, no innate abilities (aside from Shadowmeld for a Night Elf).
    • Your hero must have one "Ultimate" and three "Level-able Skills".
    • Your hero must be designed with a max level of 10 in mind.
    • At least two of the hero's skills must be trigger enhanced, but you may trigger more than two of them.
    • You are not allowed to make purely cinematic spells. This means you cannot pause the hero, use cinematic mode for any spell, or anything of the sort.
    • You are not allowed to use the spellbook ability as any of your spells. Heroes have 3 normal abilities and 1 ultimate no matter what, no bypassing it.

  • The hero must have a distinct Theme. This Theme is an important part of hero design, your artwork and spells must fit into its Theme. There is no defined Theme for the contest, but your team must create your own Theme.
  • The hero must have a distinct Role. This Role is an important part of hero design, your abilities and playstyle must fit into its Role. There is no defined Role for the contest, but your team must create your own Role.
  • The hero should be balanced qualitatively and quantitatively as if it were a tavern hero in standard WC3 melee games.
_______________________________________________

Specific Group Requirements:

Artist Rules:
  • The artistic team member must choose to do at least one of the following:
    • Create a custom texture(s) for a model. (Unit models with >1 texture may have all non-effect textures changed)
    • Create a custom hero model with either in-game or custom animations.
    • Create custom special effect models for any number of the hero's spells and/or the hero's attack.
    • Create custom icons for the hero's spells.
    • Perform any one of the above another time for a hero's summon.
    • Perform any one of the above another time for a hero's alternate form.
  • Any combination of up to 3 of the above is permissible, any more than 3 used in a single entry will result in disqualification.
  • You are allowed to make a custom unit icon for your hero.
  • You are allowed to import an attachable hero glow effect model for your hero.
  • If you pick to texture or model a hero that is already present in the melee game, you may reimport the model with different texture paths to prevent model and texture collisions.
  • If you make a texture, it has to be at least 90% freehand.
  • You must post at least one WIP shot of your artistic contribution to the contest before deadline.
  • All artistic work used in this competition must be made exclusively for this competition, no previous work will be accepted. Exception: The Hero you make for the Techtree Contest #11 can be used for this Contest (and vice versa)
_______________________________________________

Programming Rules:
  • You can use any type of coding method you'd like (JASS / GUI / vJass) in designing your spells. (Specify in the entry topic)
  • All spells for the hero must be designed specifically for this contest, there will be no previously-made spells allowed.
  • You may use any script or system from a Wc3 Modding-Site's database for your map. This means if you want to use a system you, yourself, have made, it will have to be approved and in the database before the contest's beginning.
  • You are allowed to import and use a dummy unit model with a single bone and the 'origin' attachment. This can be useful for some projectile spells and therefore it is allowed. (Pitch dummies with 180 degree vertical rotation are allowed as well)
_______________________________________________

Submission Rules:
  • All submitted entries must use (4)TurtleRock.w3x as the test map. (Modified as necessary, but not with any drastic changes)
  • Submitted maps may be no larger than 1400kb.
  • The map you submit your hero in should be set up as a melee map so the hero can be tested in a standard melee game; that means no cinematics or other extraneous additions, aside from:
    • Your custom Hero, it's custom spells (and any triggering/OE-work necessary to accomplish them), etc (your submission, essentially).
    • Triggers which should be provided to allow a single player to test the hero individually with ease and without having to build an altar and gain experience.
    • An in-game map name in the format:
      [HC8] <MyHeroName>.w3x
      Example: [HC8] Paladin.w3x
  • All submitted entries must have a filename in the format:
  • [HC8] <MyHeroName>.w3x
    Example: [HC8] Paladin.w3x
  • When the hero is complete, either upload it to a Pastebin or a post in the primary Contest thread, and send the Host a private message with a link to the Pastebin/post. The Private Message should have "[HC8]" in the title so the Host can locate it easily.
_______________________________________________



prizes.png



1st

50 reputation points & Your Entry on the award icon.

2nd

35 reputation points & an award.

3rd

25 reputation points & an award.

Finished Entry

5 rep


judges.png

If you would like to judge the contest simply make a post in this thread stating so.
You need to be a user who is knowledgeable in the process of
designing, creating & implementing custom content; and who is known to judge objectively.
  • DESIGN Judge(s)
  • ARTIST Judge(s)
  • CODING Judge(s)

  • Each Judge shall receive 5 Reputation Points

  • 75 % of the winner shall be determined by the contest's appointed judge(s).
  • 25 % of the winner shall be determined by the results of a public poll.


contest%20judging%20and%20voting.png



Judging Criteria:
  • If more than 3 teams enter, the contest will enter into a public poll where users can distribute two points among the contestants.
  • The teams with the highest points after the public voting stage (Up to 5 teams, depending on how many entries) will move on to be judged based on code, art, and overall hero design by a team of up to "3" judges.

  • In the poll, users will have to rank the heroes from best to worst, ignoring any of the entries that they want to.
  • Clear instructions on how to vote will be posted the day the poll opens.
  • The votes will then be processed using the (Modified) Borda Count Method.
  • The teams with the highest ranks (Up to 5 teams, depending on how many entries) will move on to be judged based on code, art, and overall hero design by a team of up to "3" judges.

  • All points earned in each section of judging will be scaled to 1000 points and then weighted equally in the final tallying of points.
  • Judges will grade the final (up to) 5 heroes points, and must use the provided Criteria without modification:

Design Criteria
Theme/FormHow well the skills, aesthetics & design fit together in a thematic manner such that they feel like they belong on the given hero (i.e. frost mage with frost spells, warrior with martial abilities, etc). A cohesive Theme complemented by well-fitting & polished aesthetics will be graded well; poorly-considered or lacking Thematic elements will result in a poor score.15

Role/Function
How well the skills of the hero work together to achieve the tactical synergy & gameplay style the hero has (i.e. ranged assault, tank, support caster, etc). Comprehensive, well-though-out Roles which complement a cohesive playstyle will be graded well; ill-considered, insufficient or over-compensating Roles will lose points.15

Balance/Integration
Includes how well the hero's Theme, & Role fit into the melee environment in terms of balance, theme, style, complicatedness, and so forth. Overpowered or Underpowered Heroes will result in a poor score; properly balanced elements will mean a good score.10

Creativity/Originality
How original the design of the hero is in terms of creative ideas, clever implementations, or new concepts. Innovation and creativity will be rewarded; re-use of existing spells and such, or extensive un-originality will result in a poor score.10


Total points:
50

_______________________________________________

Coding Criteria
All Criteria must be interpreted as being 'in regards to the language it is written in'; e.g. GUI code should not be compared to similar (v)Jass code in terms of it's Efficiency, Cleanness, Reusability or Robustness, or vice versa

Interface with Computer
How well the coding works & communicates with the system (i.e. Warcraft 3); is it Leak-Free? Is it Efficient & Robust? Etc.15

Interface with User
How well the coding works & communicates with the user; is it Clean & Easy to Read? Is it Reusable, and does it provide for User Modification? Etc.15

Total points:
30

_______________________________________________

Artist Criteria
Submitted art should be graded based primarily on the criteria listed in the corresponding resource submission rules for that entry type (i.e. model, texture, animation, etc), in conjunction with:


Concept & Style
How well is the Hero's Concept reflected in the art? Did the artist's Style aid or detract from it?10

Implementation & Execution
How well were the art decisions implemented? Do they come across correctly/appropriately in the final product?10

Relevance
How well does the final product fit within the standard Warcraft 3 game?10

Total points:
30



contest%20dates%20and%20deadline.png



:BEGINS:

:ENDS:

Monday

Monday

July 11th

August 29th

2016

2016

11:59:59 GMT

You have 7 weeks, 49 days, or 1176
hours to complete your submission.

 

Attachments

  • (4)TurtleRock.w3x
    142.9 KB · Views: 378
Last edited:

Kyrbi0

Arena Moderator
Level 45
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
9,521
It's going to be quite a hunt to have both a modeler and a coder work for this. I mean, the number of contestants would not be so many since a coder can only team up with one model creator.
If you say so. In the past (& on other sites) it's been a tremendous success, and we already have two full teams rarin' to go. Just post on the Matchmaking thread & then start spreadin' the word; there are loads of talented coders/artists on this site!
 
Kyrbi0,

Can I have some minor clarification?

You can use any type of coding method you'd like (JASS / GUI / vJass) in designing your spells. (Specify in the entry topic)

Clearly, "any type of coding" includes https://github.com/peq/WurstScript , is that correct?

You may use any script or system from a Wc3 Modding-Site's database for your map. This means if you want to use a system you, yourself, have made, it will have to be approved and in the database before the contest's beginning.

Wurst has a standard library - https://github.com/peq/WurstScript/tree/master/Wurstpack/wurstscript/lib - which contains a number of systems. None of this content is in the HIVE modding database.

Is it allowed to use the wurst stl?

Furthermore,

I am a contributor to the wurst stl. Is it allowed to publish new content to the stl and use it in the submission?

Potential examples include:

* sequence operations
* base64
* DamageType
 

Kyrbi0

Arena Moderator
Level 45
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
9,521
Kyrbi0,

Can I have some minor clarification?



Clearly, "any type of coding" includes https://github.com/peq/WurstScript , is that correct?
I don't see why not. I can add that to the first post if you'd like, but I said "any" so yeah.

Cokemonkey11 said:
Wurst has a standard library - https://github.com/peq/WurstScript/tree/master/Wurstpack/wurstscript/lib - which contains a number of systems. None of this content is in the HIVE modding database.

Is it allowed to use the wurst stl?
Well, I didn't say "the Hive", I said "any Wc3 Modding website". The definition of that could arguably be stretched thin... I was intending Wc3C.net & THW, but ah dannae. Is none of that (libraries/documentation/stuff/etc) on the Hive?

(did you mean "still" at the end there? I'm not familiar with what "stl" means in the context of coding)

Cokemonkey11 said:
Furthermore,

I am a contributor to the wurst stl. Is it allowed to publish new content to the stl and use it in the submission?

Potential examples include:

* sequence operations
* base64
* DamageType
I would really prefer to have a real coder come & tell me if that matters, but I'm erring on the side of 'not'. Even if you are a contributor, it strikes me that the rule exists to keep people from using their fancy proprietary systems in their submission.
 
Is none of that (libraries/documentation/stuff/etc) on the Hive?

No because it is wurst.

STL means basically standard library. Instead of importing scripts like a UnitIndexer or a DamageDetector you can just write import UnitIndexer at the start of the package.

Other languages do the same thing. For example, all versions of c++ can do #include <algorithm> - this is just code that is standard across platforms.

Even if you are a contributor, it strikes me that the rule exists to keep people from using their fancy proprietary systems in their submission.

This is a bit of a tangent, but I don't think this is correct.

I think that rule has always existed with the intention to clarify to the user that "yes public code is allowed". (Equally, it disqualifies you from going and ripping code from dota)
 

Kyrbi0

Arena Moderator
Level 45
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
9,521
I hate my life. I hate when this awesome things comes at the wrong time.
Aw man, why's that? (weren't you the one who started the suggestion?) Sorry to hear about it. My life is pretty insane right now as well, but perhaps if you're lucky you'll be able to scrape some time together; 7 weeks is a long time (& extensions aren't out of the question).

Well, always great to see contests like these running.

Guess it's skill polishing time again, been a long while.
Definitely, man. Start looking for a team-mate & get cracking!

Can you quickly give me a "yes everything's fine"?

Freddyk and I are now a team.
Um, I mean, sure. As far as I know, Wurstscript is just another language, another tool, so it should be fine. I'm not sure I agree with your reasoning for that particular rule ("current database of scripts") & why you should be allowed to breach it (granted, I'm not sure what *is* the reason for it period), but just, whatever. I don't know enough to argue one way or another.
 
Um, I mean, sure. As far as I know, Wurstscript is just another language, another tool, so it should be fine. I'm not sure I agree with your reasoning for that particular rule ("current database of scripts") & why you should be allowed to breach it (granted, I'm not sure what *is* the reason for it period), but just, whatever. I don't know enough to argue one way or another.

Thanks. I don't mean to pester you, I just want to get started sooner than later and it seems pointless to write something I'll have to throw away in the end.
 
Aw man, why's that? (weren't you the one who started the suggestion?) Sorry to hear about it. My life is pretty insane right now as well, but perhaps if you're lucky you'll be able to scrape some time together; 7 weeks is a long time (& extensions aren't out of the question).
Currently working on my college thesis, in which we are required to propose 3 of them. I spend my everyday life to it pretty much :(
 
This seems like the kind of contest I missed in THW. I just hope we have many teams joining :)

I'm up for it! (no team yet, though...)

The teams with the highest points after the public voting stage (Up to 5 teams, depending on how many entries) will move on to be judged based on code, art, and overall hero design by a team of up to "3" judges.
I'll have to say I find this unecessary. The labor of putting up an entry is much bigger than judging them - it's of no harm judging all the entries, even because judging goes in the direction of correcting poll bias. So, I'd suggest not basing judging conditions on the biased poll itself.
 
Last edited:

Kyrbi0

Arena Moderator
Level 45
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
9,521
This seems like the kind of contest I missed in THW. I just hope we have many teams joining :)

I'm up for it! (no team yet, though...)
Awexome! I felt much the same way. I hope we have a load of entries (as much to stroke my ego as to prove that this is a viable model :p).

HappyCockroach said:
I'll have to say I find this unecessary. The labor of putting up an entry is much bigger than judging them - it's of no harm judging all the entries, even because judging goes in the direction of correcting poll bias. So, I'd suggest not basing judging conditions on the biased poll itself.
I agree with HappyCockroach, all entries should be judged
Those are great opinions to express... I would encourage you to do so in the days/weeks/months that the "Poll", "Idea" or "Proposition" threads are active, though. Just keep "Contest Submissions" in your "Watched Forums" list. It is a tad frustrating, to spend weeks waiting for insight/conversation/discussion on a given Contest's Theme, Criteria, Rules, Guidelines, and other stuff, hearing nothing, only to then hear complaints once it's already started. :<

That being said, I understand the frustration; an entry can take a while & you want it Judged, don't want to trust the nasty polls, etc. However, I think it's erroneous on a number of levels; for one, "it's of no harm judging all the entries" (huh?). The Judges of many, many previous Contests would probably disagree with you (I know you have been a Judge of several previous Modeling Contests; I won't go so far as to say that (judging) Modeling is easier than (judging) Hero-making, but if you are basing your statement off of your experience, fine. Just consider that you must be amazing; most Judges have issues getting things out on time with 5-10 or even 15 or more entries). It's not easy (especially in Contests with lots of aspects, like Hero ones (coding, design, aesthetics, etc) to Judge, and can take a long time. We are still waiting for the results of the Zephyr Contest, and that's only one of many that has taken weeks/months past the end-date.

Secondly, do not think that the Poll will be the same old lame 'single-vote, no-accountability, popularity contests' of old; as you have probably noticed my doings around here, that's one of the things I am most again. For one, we voted on Modified Borda Count (a nice, preferential voting system that lets you rate entries against one another, ranking them rather then just "voting"), and for two, I've always striven for accountability; the Poll for this Contest, like all the others I've Hosted, will include elements of responsibility (i.e. "your vote will be disqualified if you do not explain sufficiently!"). So there will not be too much of a 'Poll bias' to counteract.

It's definitely different, and change can be difficult. But using a (preferential, accountable) Poll to narrow things down to a Top 5 eases work for the Judges immensely, which shortens the time it takes immensely, which results in faster Results and happier Contestants all-around. It's done wonders in the past & I think it's something to try here.

Is it allowed to use Icons from the Hive ressources for some spells? Or do we have to create everything?
Everything needed for the Hero (aside from the Map, which is provided) should be created by the Team; coding by the Coder, art by the Artist, and design by both. I believe there's a little bit of leeway (for example, the Coder can make some art), but there should not be a total overlap/one-man-band issues.

Remember that there is a limited number of "Art" things that a Team can choose to do. Icons is one of them.
 

Kyrbi0

Arena Moderator
Level 45
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
9,521
I'm glad to see all the discussion going on. Really looking forward to seeing some WIPs & some Hero concept discussion, too! We're keeping ours under wraps for now, but I can say we're still waffling between one of two choices... As a hint, we're either going Paternity or Maternity. Mwaha!

Cant wait for dem Entries >.<
Neither can I... Though you'll notice we already have 2 WIPs!

That means the team can't use custom icons from the resource section. They should make their own, or use those provided by WC3's MPQ. Correct?
Presactly. Excisely. ... Totally. : )

Everything about the model that would fall under the realm of "art" (i.e. icons, models, SFX, textures, etc) should be made by the Team (specifically the Artist, except for extenuating circumstances) for the Contest entry they are making (i.e. not for anyone else, and not started before the Contest, etc). Either that (custom), or "already existing in-game" as per the usual (and of course, including geomerges, color swaps, minor texture edits; things that use the pre-existing Warcraft resources in minorly-edited ways).

This isn't a "who can find the best stuff" Contest, nor a "who is lucky enough to pick a Hero with loads of pre-existing resources in the resource section" Contest.

So what if the artist is ownly capable of doing 3d models but no texture work? Will he get less points for using standard icons?
No sir. Each individual & each team will only be scored on what they can do, not on what they can't do.

As long as you (following the Criteria) only make up to 3 custom "art things", it doesn't matter what those "art things" are; you are equally well off. Speaking specifically of the Art, you'll notice that the Criteria are general enough to apply to anything chosen by the Artist (i.e. icon, model, texture, etc).

In the 2nd Wc3C Hero Contest, there was an entry that only had 2D texture-work done to it (a skin, specifically). And it won. It's not all about the models; grab a SFX-er or a talented Icon artist and have at it!!

(granted, I know personally I think models > textures/icons/everything, but we are going to strive to find an Artistic Judge who is reasonably impartial and capable of Judging them all (equally))

Can you please clarify what constitutes a WIP in this contest?

Am I required to post code?
Thanks for catching that; first post has been updated.

Simply an image. Of what, you decide (as long as it's, y'know, an image of something you are working on for the Contest (say, the code of a spell or the Object Editor data of a hero or the custom art of the entry, etc)). Specifically, though, if you read the Criteria, the Artist in the team must provide an artistic WIP... This, of course, fulfills the alternate requirement as well (though more never hurts).
 

Kyrbi0

Arena Moderator
Level 45
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
9,521
(Responded to from Team Matchmaking thread)

Is the artist allowed to edit blizzard icons or do icons need to be purely hand-drawn?
"Custom Icons" (whether fully custom or edited from Blizzard stuff) is one of the 3 allowed categories of Art, so it is indeed allowed overall.

We actually need a minor edit to get a matching icon for one ability. That won't be our main piece of art, this icon doesn't even have to get judged.
That's fine, but it does count as one of your 3 (and probably will be Judged).

Silver is our secret recipe. ;)
Anyway, here's a wip for our entry. Need to finish some little things and then rig it and give it animations.
Awexome! Looks different enough from Medivh to be interesting, methinks; I'm curious what you guys have cooking.
 
Level 22
Joined
Aug 27, 2013
Messages
3,973
I believe there's a little bit of leeway (for example, the Coder can make some art), but there should not be a total overlap/one-man-band issues.
So for example, the artist (in this case the modeler) isn't very good with icons (making or editing the existing one) but the coder somehow is. Is the coder allowed to take care of the icons?
 

Kyrbi0

Arena Moderator
Level 45
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
9,521
And here is the first WIP from team this is not a team

t4YMBJ0.png


https://i.imgur.com/t4YMBJ0.png
Noice. Lookin' like some kind of sea monster, perhaps a mind-controlling octopus or summat? Very cool. : )

So for example, the artist (in this case the modeler) isn't very good with icons (making or editing the existing one) but the coder somehow is. Is the coder allowed to take care of the icons?
Unfortunately no. Except for extenuating circumstances (where an artist mysteriously disappears, or his work is lost entirely to hard drive failure or whatever) the work is split such that the Artist should not do the coding & the Coder should not do the art-ing.

If the Artist doesn't have a certain specialty, then don't do it. It's not required to do it all; just (at least) one (and up to 3).
 

Kyrbi0

Arena Moderator
Level 45
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
9,521
What do you take us for? Savages?
No sir, I take you for a fool. Often conflated, I assure you.

wtf are you talking about
ikr

Its called a joke. Its supposed to be funny.

But then again, that might be a bit too complex for you.
Lawl. You're talking to Cokemonkey; just because he idolizes brevity & elegance doesn't mean complexity is out of his wheelhouse.

AAAAAaaaand now, let me take this back to the direction we all should prefer... WIPtime!
 

Attachments

  • HC8 - WIP.PNG
    HC8 - WIP.PNG
    77.4 KB · Views: 193

Kyrbi0

Arena Moderator
Level 45
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
9,521
That is a lot of custom abilities you've got there, I assume all of them are to be used? (Aside from "Mother's love" since I assume that's your spell contest entry)
Not necessarily; that's part of the mystery : P. And don't worry, I have/am completely remaking that ability from scratch (not like I "made" it the first time *cough* incomplete garbage *cough*...)

This is clearly a Family Guy Hero. Nice.
OUR SECRET IS OUT!!
 
That would ruin the surprise you bum :)

Edit:

Okay, here's my WIP:

Demo1.jpg


this is obviously a joke and credits to tank commander for making this joke possible
All that razzle-dazzle to do a single-target damage? Fireworks contest isn't here xD

Jokes apart, at least I hope it isn't xD

Well as long as we're doing Code WIP's here's my first one (with teaser names for the other abilities) The first ability is fully coded (sans documentation)
Is it A.R's Duelist? :p
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top