Curse of the Forsaken v3.0.1

This bundle is marked as approved. It works and satisfies the submission rules.
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1) This campaign was made on Warcraft III patch 1.30.2. Make sure your Warcraft III is
patched as well. The campaign WILL NOT WORK properly without the most recent patch.
2) Download the campaign and place into your My Documents/Warcraft 3/Campaigns folder.
3) Play the campaign!

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Models Credits
Skins Credits
Icons Credits
Miscellanous Credits
Campaign menu by Sellenisko
Undead buildings with human birth animation by Mister_Hadrauf
Vrykul models by Sellenisko
Forsaken buildings and worker by Ujimasa Hoso
Wretched units by Ujimasa Hoso
Blood elf Buildings by SinisterX
Alexstrazsa by 67chrome, Sellenisko
Arthas by Kwaliti
Lich King by Kwaliti
Inferno Knight by Tarrasque
Baron Dark/Iceclaw by Fan & xXm0RpH3usXx
Val'kyr models by Sellenisko
Campaign menu by Sellenisko
Dullahan Omega by -Grendel
Fir by Fingolfin
Hero Drider by Garfield
OrbOfFire by UgoUgo
Garrosh by takakenji
HeroGlow by assasin_lord
The Grim Reaper by The Grim Reaper
Banisher by -Grendel
Demoness by Gottfrei
Castle Tower by Tranquil
Hero Dark Kael by Sephiroth_VII
Nathrezim Sage by Vermillion Edict
Mortis by Gottfrei
ObsidianRuneblade by Blood Raven & Revilo
Queensland Shield by I3lackDeath
UndeadBloodElf by ironmaiden
Blizzard Eruption by JetFangInferno
Frost Nova by Daelin
Frozen Shell by Daelin
Imp5 by Ramza
HarvestLife by Power
InquisitorMalendis by Sellenisko
UndeadMissleGreen by Power
PeeKay's PunishMissle Model by PeeKay
Sir Valiant by CloudWolf
SnowPine by Gottfrei
Projectiles by sPy
SwordOfKingVarianWrynn by paladinjst
WaterElemental by alfredx_sotn
Shadow Bolt by Champara Bros
SoulArmor by JesusHipster
Mist Aura by Pyritie
SC2ForceField_ByEpsilon by epsilon
AbyssShade by EvilCryptLord
Ancient Ziggurat and Derivates by Ujimasa Hojo
AnimateDeadTarget by JetFangInferno
Arcane Nova by dhguardianes
Arrow of Pestilence by 00110000
Battle for Azeroth Sylvanas by kangyun
Beastmaster by frostwolf
Beastmaster and Derivates by Ujimasa Hojo
Blizzard Missile by s4nji
Blizzard Target by Freezer
Blood Mage and Derivates by Ujimasa Hojo
Green Slime by Hayate
Blood Elf Champion by General Frank
Blood Elf Wizard by General Frank
Bottle of Poison Missile by JesusHipster
GrudgeAura by JetFangInferno
Chaos Bestiary by MasterHaosis
CloudOfFog by JetFangInferno
Cold Buff by dhguardianes
Corpse Blood Missile by Frotty
Darkness by Pyritie
Demolisher Fire Missile by JetFangInferno
Demonic Crystal Generator by MasterHaosis
Draenei Huntress by Sellenisko
Dragonmaw Rider by Sellenisko
Dreadlord Jaina by Stefan.K
Fatal Wound by cotd333
Fel Fire models by Lothar1994
Fel Fire Ball by Zephyrius2412
Fel Incinerate by Zephyrius2412
Frost Missile by bisnar13
Frost Nova by Daelin, Frost Name
Frosty Shield by marcus158
Gan'arg Engineer by Mephestrial
GarithosPaladin by Stefan.K
Garrosh by Tauer
Grey Smoke by Ergius
Ancient Explosion by WILLTHEALMIGHTY
OrcSpearThrower by Radagast
Heart by republicola
Holy Fire Slam by ratamahatta
HumanLargeDeathExplode by destroza
IceBolt by Weep
IceSlam by valkemiere
Inquisitor by FerSZ
Jailer by FerSZ
Legion Teleporter by Mephestrial
Lich and Derivates by Ujimasa Hojo
Lor'themar by kangyun
Lady Liadrin by kangyun
Blood Elemental Missile by Devine
Orb of Blood by General Frank
Orb of Darkness by General Frank
Orb of Ice by General Frank
Orb of Corruption by UgoUgo
Orc Witch Doctor by -Grendel
Orcish Wall by takakenji
Purple Arrow by DCrimson
Pursuer by Vortigon
Saidan Dathrohan by kangyun
Scourge Banner by Cuore
Shadow Assault by UgoUgo
Shrapnel Shards Explosion by WILL THE ALMIGHTY
Skyfire Gunship by HerrDave
Snipe Target by Tranquil
Spirit Bolt by WhiteDeath
Spirit Arrow by epsilon
Temple of the Damned and Derivates by Ujimasa Hojo
Tyrande Whisperwind by kangyun
Ultimate Explosion - Air Based Explosion by WILL THE ALMIGHTY
Undead Apothecary by AnemicRoyalty
VenomousGale by JesusHipster
Vereesa Windrunner by kangyun
Warp Dark by Thrikodius
Wings of Nightmare by Usedwell
TheHolyBomb by JetFangInferno
Ziggurat and Derivates by Ujimasa Hojo
ProteaSapiens by Daenar7
Betrayed by Daenar7
Sorceress by chr2
BloodElfSentry by 67Chrome
BloodElfAssassin by 67chrome
BloodElfSpellThief by shockwave
BloodElfRanger by 67 Chrome
Gilneas Buildings by CloudWolf
DarkChampion by 67chrome
DarkElfArcher by Juice_F
DarkSylvanas by 67chrome
DarkwingBat by 67chrome
Daemoness Mage by b17rider
Dalaran buildings sin'dorei textures by Spinel
HumanMage by 67chrome
Jaina by 67chrome
Scarlet Crusader by CloudWolf
GilneasFarm.BLP by Raelith
Turalyon by CloudWolf
ReturnedArcher by 67chrome
ReturnedCaptain by 67chrome
ReturnedMage by 67chrome
Rilrae Thraele by shiiK
ScarletCrusader by 67chrome
ScarletKnight by Heinvers
ScarletOracle by Heinvers
Icons from World of Warcraft
Icons from Heroes of the Storm
BTNAcid2 by bigapple90
BTNAdept by PeeKay
BTNUnguentv2 by 4eNNightmare
BTNRubyAmulet by PeeKay
BTNSkullSpirits by -BerZeKeR-
BTNSapphireAmulet by PeeKay
BTNGarroshHellscream by FrIkY
BTNBlackWidow by Dan van Ohllus
BTNDarkElfWitch by chr2
BTNOrbPain by Big Dub
BTNFerealInstinct by PeeKay
BTNAlexstraszaIcon by 67chrome
BTNANTIDOTEVIAL by blahson256
BTNArcaneBlast by Darkfang
BTNBatby67chrome by 67chrome
BTNCRBlood by CRAZYRUSSIAN
BTNCRHeartstrike by CRAZYRUSSIAN
BTNCRDRAGONBLOODBADBLOOD by CRAZYRUSSIAN
BTNCRHolylight by CRAZYRUSSIAN
BTNCRFlamez by CRAZYRUSSIAN
BTNCrRICHARD by CRAZYRUSSIAN
BTNCWScarletCrusader by CloudWolf
BTNCWValiant by CloudWolf
BTNDarkChampion by 67chrome
BTNDarkSylvanas by 67chrome
BTNDeathguard by 67chrome
BTNDraeneiHuntress by Sin'dorei300
BTNDKPotM2 by zadelim
BTNHeroDullahanOmega by -Grendel
BTNGoreShield by PeeKay
BTNLevelQQDSJaina by 67chrome
BTNLichKing by kwaliti
BTNLifeIntoMana by PeeKay
BTNMiasma by San
BTNNoxiousFumes by Lelling
BTNOrbOfChill by JollyD
BTNPCosmicBolt by Svenski
BTNPoison by PeeKay
BTNPoisonBlast by Elainiel
BTNPoisonBow by Army-of-Pandas
BTNPoisonElemental by Marcos DAB
BTNPoisonNails by Elainiel
BTNRilraeThraele by shiiK
BTNScarletCrusader by 67chrome
BTNSoulRune by PeeKay
BTNSpikedRing by -Berz-
BTNSylvanas by 67chrome
BTNWeaver by PeeKay
BTNWeb2Spiderless by Golden-Drake
BTNWorgenHero by NFWar
BTNANANatureReviveExplosion by Anachron
BTNCRAnimate by CRAZYRUSSIAN
BTNcrSANDR by CRAZYRUSSIAN
BTNCWTuralyon by CloudWolf
BTNDeadCoil by Mr.Goblin
BTNDeathCoil by -BerZeKeR-
BTNDeathPulse by -BerZeKeR-
BTNFireSwordRed by 67chrome
BTNLifeEssenceDAB by Marcos DAB
BTNReanimate66 by Marcos DAB
BTNSoulBurn by Infinitynexus
BTNTorch by FhelZone
BTNFireTornado by Army-of-Pandas
BTNPyroblast by aki15
BTNRiseUndead by zbc
BTNSearingArrow by Darkfang
Blood Elven Upgrades by Zephyrius2412
Cinematics:
Curse of the Forsaken: Combination of Warcraft 3 cinematics, WoW cinematics (Wrathgate, Battle for
Azeroth CGI, Stormheim Cinematic, Lament of the Highborne) and Warcraft 3 ingame cutscenes from the
campaign
Wrath of the Lich King: WoW WotLK CGI
Invasion of Northrend: Combination of WoW cinematics (5.1 Alliance and Horde Landfall, Broken Shore
Cinematic, Lament of the Highborne)
The Wrathgate: The Wrathgate cinematic

Music:
WoW: Anduin
WoW: Arthas, My Son
WoW: Azjol-Nerub
WoW: Broken Shore
WoW: Dalaran
WoW: Darnassus
WoW: Demon Invasion
WoW: Ebon Hold
WoW: Evil Forest music
WoW: Fate of the Horde
WoW: Icecrown
WoW: Icecrown Citadel
WoW: Invincible
WoW: Lament of the Highborne
WoW: Orgrimmar
WoW: The Wrathgate
WoW: Tirisfal Glades
WoW: Silverpine Forest (Cataclysm)
WoW: Undercity
WoW: Xaxas
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: Abattoir
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: Ancient Ruins of Dholmour
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: Battlegrounds of Eternity
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: Blood for Blood
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: Crusader
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: Full Circle
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: Paths of the Drowned
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: Runes
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: Sartor, Grodoloth, Kordoroth
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: The Guise of Man
Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls: Urzael
Dragon Age Inquisition: Adamant Fortress
Dragon Age Inquisition: Calling the Inquisition
Dragon Age Inquisition: Dark Solas
Dragon Age Inquisition: Death on the Bridge
Dragon Age Inquisition: Lost Elf
Dragon Age Inquisition: Siege of Adamant
Dragon Age Inquisition: The Fall
Dragon Age Inquisition: The Inquisition Marches
Dragon Age Inquisition: The Well of Sorrows
Two Steps From Hell: Black Blade
Two Steps From Hell: Dark Ages
Two Steps From Hell: Master of Shadows
Two Steps From Hell: Power of Darkness
Adrian von Ziegler: Angel of Death
Mass Effect 3: An End Once and For All
Resident Evil Remake: Macabre Hallway
Within Temptation: The Silent Force Intro

Sound effects from Heroes of the Storm, World of Warcraft
Voice lines from Heroes of the Storm, World of Warcraft
Tracer voice line from Overwatch

Some lines written by ericwu102

Changelog
- Released.

- Fixed the gold mine bug in chapter one.
- The fountain of health in chapter two is no longer flying.
- Changed the side quest name in chapter two to ''The Cleansing''.
- Renamed mur'guls to murlocs in chapter two.
- Ghosts of Dark Rangers no longer cost food.
- Orc Warlocks have unarmored armor now.
- Darkclaw is dead in chapter four, he won't stay alive.
- Selection on units is removed in all cinematics.

- Side quest in Chapter Three is available almost immediately.
- Difficulty of Chapter Seven has been reduced. The gold mines also have more gold.
- Alexstrasza's line won't trigger before the quest.
- Sindragosa drops a different item.
- Marrowgar will no longer spam his line after his death.

- If you skip the intro cinematic in Chapter Four, Darkclaw's items won't teleport to Sylvanas.
- Phaelynne doesn't teleport with Varimathras in chapter four.
- If a hero dies during the Frostmourne part of the Lich King fight, they won't stay transparent later.

- Overall difficulty of some maps reduced a little.
- The ''bug'' in chapter eleven where all units freeze is no longer present.
- It is now more clear where to go in chapter nine as the blood elven base is visible from the start.
- Some other minor bugs fixed.

- Some small changes happened in Chapter One and Two.
- Most of the quests now get pinged on the minimap so that it's more clear where to go.

- Vereesa now has her voice from WoW: Mists of Pandaria
- The Lich King fight intro cinematic has been changed a little,
now both Sylvanas and Jaina have their lines voiced from WoW.

- Revamp of the Forsaken race and tecthree.
- New building - Royal Laboratory - 10 new upgrades within it.
- Apothecary has a new spell, replaced Alchemic Decay.
- New maps added - Chapter Eight, Part One, all new interludes.
- Chapter Five and Six changed places.
- Chapter Six and Nine revamped.
- All other chapters improved and tweaked.
- All AIs improved.
- Lots of new cinematics that replace the old ones.
- Improved, expanded storyline - most of dialogues changed and improved.
- Some heroes' story has been expanded. There are also new heroes present in the story.
- Most heroes have new spells.
- All hero spells now hotkeyed to QWER.
- New characters added.
- New ''exotic'' items added.
- Cliff slopes fixed in all maps.
- Skip level cheat now works in all maps.
- LOTS of other minor stuff that are not noted here.

- Garrosh collision size reduced to same like all heroes.
- Choosing Lor'themar no longer grants 12 extra food in Chapter Eleven. (The Forsaken farms get killed
if you choose him, making you lose 12 food while his building still gives 12)
- Garrosh is no longer called Jaina in Chapter Eight.
- There should now be enough space at the gold mine in Chapter Seven to expand.
- Dalaran units should now stay neutral in Chapter Four.
- Cinematics in Chapter Five and Nine should no longer run at the same time.
- Chapter Five should now be a little easier.
- Gargoyles should no longer be able to leave the playable area in Chapter Six.
- Shaman can now use Bloodlust again in Chapter Eleven.
- Varimathras now drops his item in Chapter Eleven upon death.
- You can't build any orc buildings anymore in Chapter Three.
- There is now more gold in the gold mine in Chapter Six.

- A cinematic in Chapter One now skips properly.
- Malefaction fixed, it no longer works on heroes and Phaelynne won't bug herself.
- Two Raymonds bug fixed in Epilogue.

- Chapter Ten ending cinematic can now be properly skipped
and you can now choose heroes properly if you skip it.
- Vereesa will no longer say her line in Chapter Nine before
she actually appears.
- Finale has been renamed to Edge of Night from Edge of the Night.

- Removed mention of Shadow of Blood in the Epilogue.
- Couple of dialogues rewritten, most notably in Chapter Two.

- Some dialogues in most of the chapters have been updated.
- Sylvanas' voice has been changed to her WoW/Heroes of the Storm voice.
- Cold damage area in Chapter Ten removed,
- Undead in Chapter Five now has less upgrades.
- Few other minor fixes/changes.

- The campaign now contains four optional CGI cinematics. You can choose in the first map to instead view ingame versions of them.
- The campaign now has three difficulties: easy, normal and hard.
- New chapter: Chapter Four – Devil’s Deal.
- Four completely revamped chapters, while all others have received updates of varying sizes.
- Two new interludes.
- Massively updated storyline and almost all dialogues rewritten.
- New background music, taken from World of Warcraft.
- Lots of new soundtracks throughout the campaign in cinematics and boss fights.
- New major characters: Bolvar Fordragon, Grand Apothecary Putress.
- Several characters have reduced roles in the storyline, while few have increased roles.
- Apothecary Phaelynne’s role in the story has been taken over by Grand Apothecary Putress.

Major Chapter Changes

- All chapters have received storyline and dialogue updates. Most of the dialogues have been completely rewritten, all cinematics have been improved in some way.
- Revamped maps have the same or similar storyline as their old versions, but have completely new terrain, cinematics and gameplay.
- Chapter Two: Aiding the Cursed has been removed.
- Lots of other minor updates; only bigger updates are listed here.

NEW: Cinematic: Curse of the Forsaken

Introductory cinematic for the campaign, detailing the Forsaken’s past and their current goal. You will also choose whether you want CGI or ingame cinematics in this map as well as the campaign difficulty (easy, normal or hard).

Chapter One: A Necessary Intervention

- Renamed from Unnecessary Intervention to A Necessary Intervention.
- New intro cinematic.
- Second cinematic (in the Scarlet Crusade base) removed.

Chapter Two: Icy Menace

- All non-orc units have been replaced with orc units.
- Terrain changes, more pathways to the final orc base.

NEW: Interlude: Purpose

While Varimathras advanced through the Alterac Mountains, Sylvanas and her forces travel through the Silverpine Forest.

Chapter Three: Disdain

- Renamed from Forsaken Incursion to Disdain
- New intro cinematic, other cinematics vastly changed.
- Two new side quests.
- Apothecaries can now be trained from the beginning of the map.
- Significant terrain changes to the map.

NEW: Chapter Four: Devil’s Deal

Lead the assault on the Scarlet Monastery, the final battle with the Scarlet Crusade, while commanding a new Forsaken ally, the vampire bats.

Cinematic: Wrath of the Lich King

- Renamed from The Awakening to Wrath of the Lich King.
- World of Warcraft: Wrath of the Lich King opening cinematic available instead of the ingame cinematic.

Interlude: A Royal Coup

- Renamed from The Demon Within to A Royal Coup.
- First part of the cinematic altered.

REVAMPED: Chapter Five: A Rallying Point

Chapter Six: Battle for the Undercity

- Intro part altered, a demon inside the first base must now be killed in order to gain control of it.
- Three enemy Forsaken bases replaced with demon bases.

Interlude: Memories

- New intro part.
- References to Malygos removed.

NEW: Cinematic: Invasion of Northrend

After gathering their forces, the Horde and the Alliance set sail for Northrend.

Chapter Seven: Into the Frozen Heart of Northrend

- Map expanded, whole new part added to the left side of the map.
- The blood elves and Lor’themar are now playable in this map, separately from the Forsaken. The blood elves must destroy Scourge Spires in order to allow the Forsaken forces to advance further.
- The enemy AI will now attack by loading their units into zeppelins and landing outside the Forsaken base, instead of teleporting.
- Enemy vrykul AI added.
- Darkfallen units added to the Undead Scourge AIs.
- New cinematics.
- Second cinematic removed.

NEW: Interlude: Crossroads

While the Forsaken battle against the Scourge at the east of Northrend, the Horde and the Alliance find themselves before an unavoidable hurdle, the nerubian kingdom of Azjol-Nerub.

REVAMPED: Chapter Eight: Azjol-Nerub

Chapter Nine: Hearts in Ice

- Renamed from Echoes of the Past to Hearts in Ice.
- Lor’themar is no longer playable in this map.
- Blue dragons and references to Malygos removed.
- New intro cinematic and an Alexstrasza cinematic added.

Bonus Interlude: Journey to the Sunwell

- Jaina and Lor’themar no longer appear in the cinematic. Aethas now appears in the cinematic.
- Lady Liadrin has a new model.
- More dialogue added.

Chapter Ten: Hour of the Forsaken

- Altered terrain at the part where the Alliance and the Horde fight against the undead.
- The Alliance and Horde bases can no longer be destroyed. Likewise, the undead base they are fighting against cannot be destroyed.
- First part of the intro cinematic changed.
- New side quest.

NEW: Cinematic: The Wrathgate

Bolvar Fordragon and a Horde general finally lead a successful assault against the undead forces at Angrathar the Wrathgate.

REVAMPED: Chapter Eleven: Trial of Monsters

Interlude: Deliverance

- Renamed from Lost to Deliverance.
- Sound from the World of Warcraft Patch 3.3.0: Fall of the Lich King Trailer added.

REVAMPED: Chapter Twelve: Fall of the Lich King

Finale: In Damnation

- Renamed from Edge of Night to In Damnation.
- Split into this new finale and the new epilogue. The old epilogue has been removed. The new finale only contains the beginning part with Sylvanas.
- The part with Jaina, Vereesa and Varian has been removed.

Epilogue: Edge of Night

- The third part of the old finale.
- New ending part added.


Techtree Changes

- Structures that previously used the undead birth animation now use a more human looking one: Graveyard, Temple of the Damned, Slaughterhouse, Boneyard and Tomb of Relics.
- Creature Attack Upgrade and Unholy Attack Upgrade have been consolidated into a single upgrade.
- Royal Laboratory no longer requires Dark Castle to be built. Instead, some upgrades now have certain building requirements.

NEW UNIT: Vampire Bat

- Replaces the Gargoyle unit.
- Can use Blood Plague: Infects a target ground enemy unit's blood which deals 5 damage per second for 15 seconds. If the infected unit dies while under the effect of Blood Plague and if there are any enemies nearby, the Vampire Bat will cause its corpse to explode, causing additional 50 damage to nearby enemy units.
- Can use Vampiric Bite: Converts 50% of attack damage done back to life.
- Can use the upgrade Blood Circulation: Increases Vampire Bats' health by 150 and allows them to use the Blood Plague ability, which deals damage over time to enemy units and causes their corpses to explode.

Worker

- Has a new voice.
- Multiple Workers can now construct a single building at the same time (like human Peasants).

Ghoul

- Shadow Claw has a new sound effect. It also no longer makes Ghouls have a visual effect when researched.

Dark Ranger

- Poison Arrow has a new special effect.

Dreadguard

- Has a new voice.
- Attack has been lowered.
- Dreadguards now begin with Drain Life, but must research Spell Runes to use Spell Immunity.
- Dark Arts has been removed.
- New ability: Siphon Life: replaces Drain Life and causes Dreadguards to heal for 50% of attack damage done.

Apothecary

- Now plays a voice line when trained.
- Noxious Cloud has been removed.
- New ability: Cleansing Toxin: Consumes all magical buffs from units in an area. Each unit that is cleansed costs 15 mana.
- Healing Flasks no longer heals enemy units as well.

Banshee

- Vengeance has a new sound effect.

Meat Wagon

- Exhume Corpses has been removed.
- New ability: Defile: creates an area of Blight around the Meat Wagon.

Abomination

- Disease Cloud has been removed.
- New ability: Gorge: Consumes an enemy land unit, slowly digesting it and dealing 5 damage per second to it.

Val’kyr Battlemaiden

- Has a new voice.
- Named changed from Val’kyr to Val’kyr Battlemaiden.
- Increased health and attack.
- Increased gold and lumber cost.
- Raise Dead, Animate Dead and Spirit Sacrifice have been removed.
- New ability: Revive: Brings back to life the corpse of a nearby friendly unit.
- New ability: Unholy Protection: Increases all nearby friendly units' armor by 10 for 10 seconds and restores 150 hit points.
- New ability: Icy Grip: Decreases nearby enemy units' movement and attack speed.
- New upgrade: Runic Attunement: Increases Val'kyr Battlemaidens' mana regeneration rate and allows them to use the Icy Grip ability.


Hero Changes

Sylvanas

- Silence, Black Arrow and Call of the Queen have new icons.
- Banshee’s (Call of the Queen) abilities renamed to Terrify and Scream of Terror. Both abilities have new icons and sound effects.
- One of the Call of the Queen Banshees should now automatically cast Scream of Terror when used.
- Has a new model from Chapter Five onward.

Phaelynne (Putress)

- Replaced by Putress: new model, new voice, new stats.
- Virulence and Malefaction have been removed.
- New ability: Summon Volatile Ooze [E]: Summons a volatile ooze that explodes upon reaching an enemy, dealing area damage to enemy units in the area.
- New ability: Blinding Cloud [R]: Poisons enemy units with a plague, causing their movement and attack speed to be heavily reduced, and causing them to miss their attacks for 15 seconds.

Jaina

- Has a new voice.
- Has a new skin and a new attack projectile.
- Telekinesis, Brilliance Aura and Pyroblast have been removed.
- New (old) ability: Blizzard [Q]: Calls down waves of freezing ice shards that damage units in a target area. Fires less waves than default, but deals more damage and has a higher area of effect at higher levels. Has a new icon.
- Updated ability: Summon Water Elemental [W]: has a new icon. Can use Frost Attack at level 2, and Frost Attack and Frost Armor at level 3.
- New ability: Frostbolt [E]: Fires a frostbolt at an enemy target unit, slowing its attack rate and movement speed.
- New ability: Ring of Frost [R]: After a 1 second delay, creates a Ring of Frost in an area that deals 250 damage to ground units and stuns them for 10 seconds.

Varian

- Bloodbath [R] has been removed.
- Updated ability: Enraged Regeneration [Q]: has a new sound effect.
- New ability: Taunt [R]: The closest 10 enemies are forced to attack this unit.

Vereesa

- Has a new model.
- Has a new voice.
- New hero classification: Marksman.
- Updated stats: now attacks slower than most ranged heroes, but deals more damage and has a higher range.
- Summon Hawk, Cold Arrows, Trueshot Aura and Vengeance have been removed.
- New ability: Aimed Shot [Q]: A powerful aimed shot that deals damage to an enemy unit.
- New ability: Vulnerability [W]: Reduces a target enemy unit's armor and gives vision of that unit.
- New ability: Piercing Shot [E]: Fires a shot that damages all enemies in a line.
- New ability: Sniper Aim [R]: Increases the Marksman's attack rate by 125% for 30 seconds, but heavily decreases her movement speed.

Thrall

- Updated ability: Totem Mastery [W]: Earthbind Totem now also reduces enemy attack speed.
- Windwalk Totem now increases mana regeneration rate of nearby friendly units. Both totems have reduced mana cost.
- New ability: War Banner [R]: Summons an immobile banner that increases nearby friendly units' attack rate and movement speed by 25% for 60 seconds. Has a new sound effect.

Lor’themar

- Has a new model and a new icon.
- Dashing Winds has been removed.
- Updated ability: Flames of Retribution [Q]: no longer does friendly fire.
- Updated ability: Blood Cry [W] now affects a larger area.
- New ability: Living Bomb [E]: adds extra damage on each attack and causes units that die while under the effect to explode, dealing damage to nearby enemy units.

OVERALL CHANGES

- All maps now have new loading screen art.
- CGI cinematics have been removed, they are replaced by their ingame counterparts. (CGI cinematics didn't seem to work for a lot of people before, and patch 1.30 broke them completely for me. Ingame cinematics, however, work for everyone. I will re-add CGI cinematics in the future if I figure out a way to make them work.)
- Most maps have received balance updates to normal and hard difficulty. Normal should overall be easier while hard should be harder. (Normal and hard were very close in difficulty in v3.0. Normal should no longer feel like you're playing on hard, but some maps will remain challenging as they were intended to be. Hard should now feel much harder than normal.)
- Friendly AI Heroes will no longer drop items.
- Aimed Shot, Arcane Barrage, Blood Plague, Blood Plague Corpse Explosion, Consecration, Divine Storm, Divine Purpose, Enraged Regeneration, Frostbolt, Piercing Shot, Revive, Ring of Frost, Sniper Aim, Taunt, Unholy Protection and War Banner sound effects can no longer be heard globally. (Varian's mapwide AAAAAaaaaaGgggHHHHHH is gone, rejoice!)
- Lots of minor changes, such as fixing typos, changing tooltips, bug fixes, etc.

UNIT AND HERO CHANGES

- Dark Ranger - Black Arrows and Poison Arrows now also increase Dark Rangers' attack range by 75. Dark Rangers can now have a maximum of 650 Attack Range. (From 500) (Dark Rangers become too frail in later chapters, this change gives them some additional survivability.)
- Dreadguard – Now has 500 Hit Points (From 600). Siphon Life now converts 35% of damage done back to life. (from 50%) (Dreadguards are too durable with all their upgrades, these changes will make them less so.)
- Banshee – Using Possession on worker units now once again allows you to construct their buildings.
- Meat Wagon - Forsaken Plague no longer deals friendly fire. Also changes Meat Wagons' missile to a cloudy green projectile. (Forsaken Plague is a fun ability, but was not worth using due to its friendly fire.)
- Abomination Outbreak now allows Abominations to afflict a target enemy unit with a deadly plague that festers inside the target, dealing 5 damage per second for 30 seconds. If the afflicted unit dies while under the effect of Outbreak, four Maggots will spawn from its corpse. Also stores maggots inside the Abomination's body that crawl out to fight after its death. Now unlocks in Chapter Ten.
- Royal Laboratory – New upgrade available: Fortified Defenses (50 gold/250 lumber, requires Dark Castle), which upgrades Guard Towers, Coil Towers and Virulent Towers so that they have fortified armor. Unlocked in Chapter Ten.
- Vampire Bats, Black Spiders and Maggots are now classified as undead. (This change is so these units can also be healed by Putress' Elixir of Death.)
- Vrykul units and buildings have new icons.
- Unholy Aura now once again affects mechanical units.
- Gan'arg Engineer's selection circle should no longer fly above his head.
- Dreadlord Jaina has a new model.

CHAPTER ONE – A Necessary Intervention

- The Scarlet Crusade Keep from the first base now drops a Tiny Shadowhall.
- Main Scarlet Crusade AI will now attack when trees fall down.

CHAPTER THREE - Disdain

- An additional gold mine has been added to the south of Sylvanas' base.

CHAPTER FIVE – A Rallying Point

- Garrosh and his forces now use the maroon team color.
- An additional shallow water way across the river in Orgrimmar has been added to reduce units from getting stuck on the bridge.

CHAPTER SEVEN – Into the Frozen Heart of Northrend

- Blood Elves now have a gold mine and a shipyard.
- Blood Elf units now require upgrades to unlock all of their abilities.
- Tiny Shadowhall, Tiny Crypt and Tiny Graveyard are now dropped by the buildings in the first Scourge base.
- Enemy AI should no longer bug and stop attacking.
- Orange AI can now also attack Blood Elves.
- Purple AI can now attack you if you expand to the Orange AI's goldmine. Purple AI will also attack Blood Elves if all Forsaken bases are destroyed.

CHAPTER EIGHT – Azjol-Nerub

- Azjol-Nerub terrain updated, certain paths have been closed off and the way up to Anub'arak is now linear. There are some new encounters and traps and Anub'arak can no longer be reached earlier than intended. Fire traps before Anub'arak are no longer deadly.
- Side Quest revamped. You now have to find three parts of a key to open the way gate. The way gate has also been moved to a new location.
- Signet of the Traitor King is now acquired from the side quest.
- Nerubian burrow attacks in Azjol-Nerub now happen a little less often.
- Ice Rocks now have less health.

CHAPTER TEN – Hour of the Forsaken

- Not doing the side quest should no longer bug the Blood Elf AI, they will destroy the gate leading there themselves.

CHAPTER ELEVEN – Trial of Monsters

- Lich King respawn timer has been increased and is shorter depending on difficulty.

CHAPTER TWELVE – Fall of the Lich King

- All Obelisks should now get disabled properly.
- Twin Val'kyr no longer fly around, instead the additional val'kyr units simply spawn, so the fight no longer bugs.
- Sindragosa boss fight should no longer bug.
- Alexstrasza can now die during the Sindragosa and Lich King boss fights.
- Alexstrasza now resurrects all Heroes before the Lich King boss fight.

Known Issues
- If Quel'Delar is moved to a different spot in the inventory, its abilities
disappear. Drop it and pick it up again to fix the issue.
- Targeting circles fly above the ground in Chapter Six.
- A few sound effects can be heard mapwide.
- Sound effects that are ripped directly from WoW videos sometimes
may not be completely synced with the cinematic.
- Bolvar's Wave of Light special effect is invisible in Chapter Eight.

Extra Downloads
Curse of the Forsaken v1.0 - The very first version of the campaign, released in January 2013.
Curse of the Forsaken v2.0 - The second version of the campaign, released in August 2014
Voice Sets - Voice sets used in the campaign, you're free to use them in your own projects.

Translations
Chinese - v3.0.1, hosted on pan.baidu.com (提取码: bb2w), by nuck001.
Russian - v3.0, hosted on xgm.guru, by kirlandiya.

My Other Campaign

Please post any bugs, suggestions and tips!
Contents

Curse of the Forsaken v3.0.1 (Campaign)

Reviews
» Vengeancekael:[c] 「Profile :: Message :: Hive Staff」 » Date:[c] 「20/Mar/2013 16:02:25」 » Reasons: » Comment: [Moderated version: 1.01] Not Rated » Rules: [c] 「Map Submission」 [TR]» Contact: [c] 「Staff Contact」 ! 'Reasons' are automated !
Level 8
Joined
Apr 14, 2011
Messages
456
Considering your opinions on Anub'Arak, perhaps he can reappear making a reference that he in WoW, died first in Azjol'Nerub but reappeared in Trial of the Crusader (man, they really made Anub'Arak shit on WoW :( ) so perhaps he can make his second time as a boss again in Chapter Twelve but maybe this time more powerful or I don't know.
 
Level 22
Joined
Nov 5, 2010
Messages
1,322
aight, finished this campaign for like the 999999999th time. Yes, its THAT fun.
anyways, now i've decided to give it a full review.

i know that you said you were done with this one and that it is complete, but im posting this just in case you change your mind later on.



Tech Tree:

overall the techtree is very unique and interesting. Its not one of the best because IT IS THE BEST. However, i do have some critical points to consider.

1- Ghouls: They need to go. Like seriously, they look too scourgy and imo does not really fit into the forsaken at all. I would replace them with something else like deathstalkers (the forsaken rouges) or any other light melee infantry that would fit with the forsaken. Also they are pretty much worthless beyond chapter 1 tbh they die with 2 hits and are not worth investing money into them or they upgrades and they donot combo very well with other units from the tech tree. The normal workers would harvest lumber as they already can.

2- Dark Ranger: There guys are AMAZING. There are slight changes that i would like to have for them though.

A) Why do they have 2 arrow types? i know that its for the sake of diversity but it really overlaps the other imo. Also black arrows overlap with sylvanas's black arrows which would result in a weaker dark minion because the dark rangers overwrites sylvanas's stronger variation sometimes. so i would probably limit them to 1 arrow type.

B) even after their range was buffed, they are still kinda unrewarding to be used in later chapters simply because they die way too fast. My suggestion is to either give them the normal 700 range, or buff their hp and make them a little bit more expensive.

C) the ghost that spawns upon the dark ranger is a neat idea, though it seems a little bit pointless as they are imo pretty worthless. I would probably give them a weak spell to spam at first, and then when out of mana they would start attacking as they do right now. Also they should be considered as a summoned creature with a limited life time because as of right now u can spam a million ghost army as they cost 0 food (though who would do that). This could also be an upgradable research instead of having it right off the bat. Could be names something like "Will of The Forsaken" since she literally came back from death to fight again.


3 - Dreadguards: these guys are perfect as they are tbh, they used to be broken but after the nerf they are perfect. The only thing that i would change from they is to remove the "Drain life" ability alonside their mana bar. Because they do not need to be able to attack air units and imo they should not be healing without the lifesteal upgrade.

4- Apethecaries: aight, prepare for a huge review about these guys.

A) First of all, none of their abilities could be auto casted. Which means each and everyone of them requires micro management in order to be functional.

B) Shadow bolt imo does not fit the apothecary unit. It feels like a demonic ability rather than chemical or undeath-ly. Personally not a big fan of it. I would replace it with an autocast ability that funstions similar to the naga siren's "Parasite" spell but would remove the spawning creature. This way you have an autocast damage spell that combos with the plague or any ability that requires the target to die like outbreak and black arrow.

C) Cleanse Toxins is nice and all but Anti Magic Shell is really better than it in almost every department. Even though it does have its unique uses, its still way too similar to AMS imo. I would replace it with another spell. What would be it you ask? well i have a couple of ideas;

1- "Hazy Potion": Something similar to the "Banish" spell from the blood mage. This would combo well with banshee's Vengeance ability as well as the auto cast damage spell i suggested earlier. Also it would not overlap any other ability in the tech tree that i can remember. Can be used offensively and defensively supporting the apothecary as a "Primary Spellcaster".

2- "Enraging Acid": summons a ward-like thing on the ground that has a low level endurance aura of some sorts. Having it as an "Aura" allows it to affect your units even when they are under the effects of anti magic shell. Would not overlap any other forsaken ability.

D) Healing Flasks is amazing. It also can be better. The mana cost and the aoe is underwhelming considering the amount it heals. I would probably decrease the mana cost to 90 or 100.

5- Banshees: My favorite unit. There are 3 things that are bugging me atm. First, why does the vengence upgrade replace curse? it limits the banshee's options while ethereal. I mean its an "Upgrade" so we spent gold, lumber, and time on it so it shouldn't replace anything. Banshees should just acquire this ability upon research while keeping curse. Second, why are banshees unaffected by regenerative flesh? i mean i understand why if they are in ethereal form but when they are corporeal i do not see a reason as to why they do not benefit from it. Third, why do they only have 500 attack range? every spellcaster in the game has 600 so why is the banshee the only spellcaster that has its range nerfed?

6- Abominations: these guys are perfect as it is. Though why are they classified as a different unit than the scourge's abomination? it interferes with me when i try to possess enemy abominations and find out that they do not have my upgrades. they are also in a different selection group when i group them with my own abominations :/

7- Vampire Bats: Tbh i hardly used these guys so do not take my points seriously. I find them not very useful because iirc their main job is countering enemy flyers. Which they are not very good at imo. What are they gonna do when 3+ Frostwyrms and some Valkyrs swarm my base in "Trial of Monsters". Frostwyrms does not take extra damage from normal attacks, and while valkyrs do take extra damage, they have a huge chunk of hp for these guys to do anything worth their time and resources.

8- Meat Wagons: They just need a model change. Thats it. I suggest using the "Forsaken Catapult" from hiveworkshop.

9 - Valkyr: Overall pretty good and combos with a lot of different strategies that you can use with this amazing tech tree. I would buff her mana to 400 though instead of 350 and increase the duration of unholy protection to 15 seconds instead of 10 as it costs 200 mana. Because the way they are, you are better reviving your fallen for 75 mana rather than spending 200 mana protecting them. 200 mana are worth 5 revives, which combos with dark rangers ghosts :). Speaking of revive, it's targeting system is bugging me alot. Why does it prefer to revive fallen black spiders than abominations for example? it also prefers to revive the dead maggots from the outbreak ability from the abominations and turn them into a permanent unit. the targeting system needs to change. Or simply make it that black spiders/maggots does not drop corpses upon death.



Now we move on to heroes:

1- Sylvanas Windrunner: She is pretty amazing. Here are my thoughts on her:

A) Silence: Perfect, nothing to change. The spell combos well and does not get overlapped with other abilities in the tech tree.

B) Black Arrow: It overlaps with Dark rangers. One of them need to have their ability changed or reworked. Not sure what to do here, but i would probably change sylvanas's black arrow into "Wailing Arrow" like the one she has in heroes of the storm where it is an active ability that travels a set distance and explodes for an aoe damage. Would replace its silencing effect with something else though.

C) Drain Life: Meh, i didnt like this ability of hers tbh even though it is original. It really does not fit for a ranged character that hardly needs healing and it looks very demonic rather than undead. I would probably replace it with something else. Maybe a passive ability that summons ghosts/wraiths each time its condition is fulfilled?

D) Call of The Queen: The idea is spectacular. Here is my review concerning this ability; First, i think it should be an item ability for "Sylvanas's Locket" because she summons her banshees when she sees this item in WoW. So as a baseline ultimate spell, i would probably giver her the original "Charm" spell as i think its her signature move. Would probably change the charm icon to "Icon of Torment" though which is the forsaken sigil.

E) Banshee Queen: Perfect as it is. This ability is COOL AF btw, was hyped af when i got it unlocked. Good job on it.

2- Putress: Perfect as he is. Though im struggling to figure out how/why am i supposed to use ooze when i could just elixir of death for a lower mana cost? i dont like that ooze is uncontrollable but thats just me.

3 - Varimathras: Honestly i really like that u didnt change anything with him. though it is sad that we never have a chance to unlock his ultimate as he betrays us before we have a chance to do so.


Now to the Best Part, the chapters:


Chapter 1 "A Necessary Intervention": This chapter is a great introduction to the campaign and sets everything out perfectly for the new player. Here are my thoughts; At the start, the player should not have a base and they need to build up their own when they destroy the scarlet base. It feels weird a little bit to start with a crypt and a shadowhall only for the gold mine to explode. imo it would be a better introduction to have the new player start from 0.
There is an exploit here where you could destroy the souther scarlet base that spams casters (the one that is very close to the first objective) before you assault the gold mine base. Im guessing that we are not meant to do that but its an exploit that removes an attacking base early on with minimal effort. Needs to change imo.


Chapter 2 "Icy Menace": Pretty good, though i do not understand the optional quest. Like why is it there? i get that there is a gold mine but there are expansion slots all over the campaign why does this one has an optional quest for it. especially that the starting resources are not scarce and there is a gold mine right next to our base which also happens to be unprotected. I would probably change the optional quest into something else. By the way i like that you changed phaelynn into putress, i always disliked gender bent characters. I also like that you removed the worgen chapter in silverpine forest since it made little sense back then. Good job.


Chapter 3 "Disdain": I would have loved to see more interaction between the forsaken and the crusade with characters like "Brigitte Abbendis" as part of me wanted the story arc against the crusade to be slightly longer before the balnazzar reveal. I like the double base approach as it indeed adds to the challenge. The optional quest of possessing murlocs is a great homage to "The Dark Lady" chapter of blizzard's TFT campaign, i like that. I also like the optional quest with the kirin tor though i think the reward is a little bit weird. Instead of giving u a bunch of consumables, how about Rhonin gives you 1 powerful item? i would say the locket but there is already an interlude for it so it would not do. The build up and the climax when sylvanas unleashes her banshee form had me screaming and hyped up to slaughter anyone in my way. IT IS AMAAAAAAZING YOU DESERVE AN AWARD FOR THAT. All in all it is one of my favorite chapters.

Chapter 4 "Devil's Deal": My favorite chapter to replay. Though it does have many flaws imo so here comes; First, the attacks are way too frequent, aren't we supposed to be the ones atacking the monastery? if so the attacks should be much less frequent and their defense should be significantly stronger. The vampire bat side quest is op. Do you know what i did on my hard playthrough? i just chilled in my base with heavy defenses, took all the meat from the scarlet attackers and delivered them to the bats after the demons turned on the humans so they the bat's nests wont be raided with a full attack. The vampire bats did all the rest for me. Which brings me to the next point, why does the demons and humans turn on each other? it made the map progressively easier rather than becoming harder with it. imo it should be an optional quest where we make Balnazzar lose his telepathic power rather him just snapping at the humans while he is at war for no reason. There is a bug when balnazzar reanimated by dark rangers and i kill them they still drop a ghost for him even though they were "Reanimated" never mind me if this was intentional. Also i have found the hidden pendant of mana up the hill :).

Chapter 5 "A Rallying Point": I am unable to complete this chapter on hard mode without cheats. Even though i got the reinforcements as early as possible and took every powerup for Sylvanas in the previous chapters im still unable to win this one on hard. I think the first few waves should be nerfed a bit to give time for the player to finish the optional quest without letting orgrimmar be completely swarmed. I have noticed that there are alot of creeps and places to explore in this map which i liked, but when are we supposed to do that? is there a specific time where we can go on exploring without letting orgrimmar be overwhelmed?

Chapter 6 "Battle for the Undercity": This chapter is amazing. It puts you through stress and makes you super focused and calculative. There are some stuff that i would like to alter; The first objective of the chapter where to free the forsaken bases can be done right from the start. After killing the first general and claiming the first base, i could simply take all the starting units and assault the next one with call of the queen. Then proceed and claim the third one with banshee queen. If this is what is intended then fine but if not they i think u should know about it. Overall the chapter is well thought and the pacing is perfect.

Chapter 7 "Into the Frozen Heart of Northrend": Amazingly thought out and perfectly executed. I love how it mirrors Arthas's landing back in the frozen throne campaign. I like that we can also control the blood elves here as it adds to the variety of units that we could make. The terrain could use a bit more work though. I also fail to see a reward for completing the optional quest where we kill all the valkyrs on the map.

Chapter 8 "Azjol-Nerub": This map sent shivers down my spine for how creepy it was. I like the atmosphere and the feeling of uncertainty. Personally im not a big fan of these kind of maps because i prefer a base-building map. Also it had nothing to do with the forsaken so i probably wont be replaying this chapter as much as the other.

Chapter 9 "Hearts in Ice": I like like that the lore goes in-depth with this chapter. But otherwise same thoughts as chappter 8.

Chapter 10 "Hour of the Forsaken": Amazingly executed. One of my favorites. Here are my concerns; The 3 valkyrs at the start are taking a huge proportion of the base, they need to be flying or moved somewhere else. Is the orb of frost the only reason to kill the valkyr that is loyal to the lich king? because if so then i do not think that it is a worthy reward for such a quest tbh. Otherwise i enjoyed this chapter and replayed it for a bazillion of times.

Chapter 11 "Trial of Monsters": This chapter goes even with Devil's Deal as my favorite. Though it has ALOT of problems imo. So here they are; First, there is no reason to take the obelisks. The ideal play is to destroy all the scourge bases and once they are all cleared out go ahead and take the obelisks. Arthas is easy to deal with when you've got your army and heroes. The problem is that the only defeat condition is when your base is destroyed. In blizzard's finale, you had to go for the obelisks otherwise illidan would take them and you would lose, that was the motivation. But here there isn't any motivation, so there has to be a motivation for us to take the obelisks like if Arthas seals all 4 of them then we lose. The next point is that the frost wyrm base needs to be tones down. Its making WAAY too many froswt wyrms imo when considering the balance of the other attacking forces. A change that i would like to make is to have an "Inaccessible" scourge base where we cannot destroy it that Arthas gets revived from. Arthas also needs to have a complete AI so that he attacks with an army, not by himself. Also imo he should not attack our bases, he should simply go for the obelisks every 5-10 minutes until he takes them all and we lose.

Chapter 12 "Fall of the Lich King": This chapter is perfect as it is. A fitting intro and a climactic end. The boss fights are all well planned and the hype is real. Amazing job on this one too.


There is a consistent problem in all of the base-building chapters where lumber is waaaay too scarce for no reason. An easy way to fix this without having to redo the terrain is to simply increase the HP of all tree types by a little bit.


All in all, this is the best campaign i have ever played that tops rise of the blood elves (which is also amazing) and tops even blizzard's own campaign imo. Well done and excellent work :)

Now that is a HUGE review! My thoughts:

Ghouls: I like ghouls! I also like the idea of Deathstalkers (I actually realised at some point recently I completely forgot Deathstalkers exist), but I honestly kind of like ghouls better. There isn't really much to it, I just wanted to keep some familiar Scourge units.
Dark Rangers: I like them having two types of arrows. Usually I'd put most dark rangers on poison arrow and two or three on black arrow because Sylvanas can't debuff all units by herself. As for the ghost that spawns, I like the idea of making it somehow more useful. I'll think about that.
Apothecaries: I appreciate your thoughts, but I don't think I'll be changing these. I think replacing any of their abilities would be a loss for the playable race as a whole since no other unit can stun, cleanse or heal for most of the campaign.
Banshees: I guess Vengeance could exist alongside Curse, but I also like how it functions now. Also honestly I didn't realise their attack range was lower. Maybe I changed this at some point and forgot about it? And they're not affected by Regenerative Flesh because they don't have any flesh. Banshees are ghosts and the ethereal ability in this sense does feel redundant, but it's a gameplay thing to allow them to possess other units more easily.
Abominations: I remember running into some kind an issue when the Scourge abomination and Forsaken abomination were a single unit, but I can't say what it was right now.
Vampire Bats: I think they are very good at countering flyers. A group of six bats in Chapter Eleven can make the map much easier at times, but they are pretty squishy and can die without support.
Meat Wagons: I didn't really like any other custom models.
Val'kyr: Huh, didn't realise they like to resurrect maggots and spiders before other units. It may be because the other corpses already got used up by necromancers or something else, but I am not sure. I'll check it out.
Sylvanas: I don't really want to change any of her abilities.

Chapter One: I don't think it feels weird, Sylvanas says immediately as the map starts that you are running low on resources. Also, destroying that base is not an exploit. The way it works since v3.0 is that once you destroy one of any of the enemy bases, the AI triggers.
Chapter Two: Yes, I agree the optional quest is kinda lame, it's just there to encourage the player to attack the ogres to get the +6 strenght item.
Chapter Three: Hmmm, I like the idea of adding a more lore-appropriate Scarlet Crusade hero!
Chapter Four: The attacks are supposed to be harder than usual in this map because the map is supposed to feel impossible. The way you played it is the "right" way to play. The enemy AIs turns against other because Balnazzar is a haughty demon (and it creates a pretty fun scenario!).
Chapter Five: Been a while since I played it on hard so I can't say what the right tactic is. I put all the creeps around the map if you want to try and get them. It'd be an empty map in places otherwise.
Chapter Six: It's intended that you can go and get three bases immediately. Makes the map faster and more interesting in my opinion.
Chapter Seven: Like in Chapter Two, the intention of the side quest is simply to encourage the player to go kill stuff to get items and powerups.
Chapter Ten: I think Orb of Frost is pretty good reward from a side quest. Completing the side quest also stops the val'kyr attacks.
Chapter Eleven: You are actually correct. I completely forgot another way to fail the final TFT map was letting Illidan capture all the obelisks. I like the idea of Arthas having an inaccessible base somewhere, but honestly, this map was a pain to create and I doubt I'll be changing anything about it at this point. Might check out the frost wyrms if they are too powerful.

Thank you for the huge review and all your thoughts! I'm glad you like it!

I've deleted all my save games, progress and downloaded the campaign again. Have been replaying it again, this time without opening the campaign in WE, and am now on chapter 11. Bugs I found:
  1. The murloc quest is still broken. It works if you play the map from the start, but when you save/load (which you have to more often than not cause the map is quite challenging), it doesn't work. You only get the big murloc and nothing else happens.
  2. Some chapters/interludes (though mostly chapters) do not appear on the campaign loading screen.
  3. When I liberated the Brill in chapter 6 I got the abomination quest. I couldn't do it straight away cause a bunch of demons/forsaken were constantly attacking. I took the southern base(with the castle), lost the Brill, destroyed the upper demon base, than took the other forsaken base and destroyed the demon base next to it. Then I searched for the abomination, but it was nowhere to be found. I used "iseedeadpeople" and the abomination was nowhere. I did do save/load at some point.
  4. Quel'Dalar quest works fine now. Massage do not open the campaign with the WE.
Things I noticed that are not exactly bugs, but rather oversights:
  • I think that Sylvanas(post chapter 5) and Vereesa(not sure about Lor'themar and Liandrin) use outdated models. Their mouths have been improved on the newer versions. The guy who made those two also has a Rhonin model that would fit the campaign perfectly. He has also a bunch of Jaina models as well.
  • In the interludes where high elf Sylvanas battles Arthas dragonhawks/dragonhawk knighs have blood elven skins instead of RoC highelven.
  • In chapter 9 in Jaina and Vereesa group there are two blood elven sorceresses, not high elven. Imo that doesn't make sense, cause both Jaina and Vereesa are team Alliance and Vereesa is the leader of the high elves.
  • In the "Invasion of Northrend" interlude we see the orc armada with the bunch of wyverns and bets. The alliance one has the gunship, bunch of gyrocopters, but no gryphons and hippogryps/hippogryph risers. The forsaken and blood elven doesn't have a single air unit, no vampire bats no dragonhawks.
  • In chapter 7 the vrykuls are led by a san'leyn blood prince. That dosen't make sense science you already have two vrykul heroes.
  • There is a vrykul archer skin that would imo fit a vrykul ranged unit much better than the spearman,
  • It is really confusing that we have two identical val'kyr with two different skin, it's imo completely unnecessary and makes control harder. Perhaps blue ones can be scourge, red forsaken and gold vrykul, or something.
  • Imo forsaken meat wagons could use a different models since they are about spreading blight and plague not carrying and digging corpses. Apothecary could use an autocast spell.
  • The heroes that appear, as uncontrollable, in chapters 10, 11 and 12 could reach level 10 in chapters where we control them so they can use their full powers in those challenging chapters.
  • Imo Anub'arak definitely deserves a boss fight in the last chapter, the crypt fiends really give us headache in the last couple of chapters. Maybe after activating the obelisks and before Kel'thuzard.
  • In chapter 11 the Horde has much more units and looks much cooler than the Alliance. Maybe Alliance could have rifflemen in chapters 10 and 11. I would also love to see more of the Silver Covenant(cause of Vereesa), perhaps replace the night elf archer with the high elf one, or add a new high elf unit to the alliance I don't know.
Everything else in the campaign is perfect. I hope the comment is somewhat helpful if you ever update the campaign again.
edit: I was playing the newest version of the campaign on the latest patch.

Thanks for reporting all this! I'll check it out! And I'm glad you liked the campaign!

Hello! This is my first feedback and I'm still at chapter 3 but the Murloc quest thingy does not update when I possessed Mrgglrr II and as far as story goes though it's not a big deal. (seems to work fine when I restarted warcraft)

If is just for me then all is good but I just want to let you know about it.

Some of the lines are cringy. (Not that it's so bad that I wanna roll in the ground but more like I want to scratch my back kind)

Great improvement though compared to the early versions!
Going to update this again after I finished it!

Thanks for the dedication and hard work mate~
Hello~

It's on patch 1.31 and only had a problem on the first playthrough.

I just finished the campaign and it's really fun to the point that I want to continue playing but the cliff is so heart wrenching that I jumped while screaming "I want more!!!" down to my demise hoping to find Sylvanas with open arms but only her cold eyes looking at me indifferently was waiting before I waked up feeling even more distraught than when I finished it...

Anyway, here's a few of what I found: (not too important but still food for thoughts~)

View attachment 328035

Chapter 3 is missing but can be played if you play the interlude before it.

In chapter 7 if you possessed the val'kyr that are on the ground, you won't be able to finish the side-quest for it and if you possess the Vrykul Race you won't need to worry about not having enough food since most of them don't even need food aside from the wolf. (It's my style of playing which doesn't really guarantee efficiency at all only maximum fun, for me atleast, as the quest do tell you to slay 'em)

In chapter 9 you can kill the Lich King so he didn't appear in the cinematics after

That's all I guess and had fun which the best part!

Thanks and sorry for the shallow feedback from me.

Glad you liked it! Thanks for repoerting the bugs! What lines did you find cringy?

Considering your opinions on Anub'Arak, perhaps he can reappear making a reference that he in WoW, died first in Azjol'Nerub but reappeared in Trial of the Crusader (man, they really made Anub'Arak shit on WoW :( ) so perhaps he can make his second time as a boss again in Chapter Twelve but maybe this time more powerful or I don't know.

I'll be 100% honest, I forgot about Anub'arak after Chapter Eight. I would like to include him in the final chapter (Lana'thel did reappear so it shouldn't be an issue including him), but I don't think I'll be adding it at this point.

Thanks everyone for all your posts! Enjoyed reading all your thoughts!
 
Level 12
Joined
Feb 3, 2019
Messages
771
Now that is a HUGE review! My thoughts:

Ghouls: I like ghouls! I also like the idea of Deathstalkers (I actually realised at some point recently I completely forgot Deathstalkers exist), but I honestly kind of like ghouls better. There isn't really much to it, I just wanted to keep some familiar Scourge units.
Dark Rangers: I like them having two types of arrows. Usually I'd put most dark rangers on poison arrow and two or three on black arrow because Sylvanas can't debuff all units by herself. As for the ghost that spawns, I like the idea of making it somehow more useful. I'll think about that.
Apothecaries: I appreciate your thoughts, but I don't think I'll be changing these. I think replacing any of their abilities would be a loss for the playable race as a whole since no other unit can stun, cleanse or heal for most of the campaign.
Banshees: I guess Vengeance could exist alongside Curse, but I also like how it functions now. Also honestly I didn't realise their attack range was lower. Maybe I changed this at some point and forgot about it? And they're not affected by Regenerative Flesh because they don't have any flesh. Banshees are ghosts and the ethereal ability in this sense does feel redundant, but it's a gameplay thing to allow them to possess other units more easily.
Abominations: I remember running into some kind an issue when the Scourge abomination and Forsaken abomination were a single unit, but I can't say what it was right now.
Vampire Bats: I think they are very good at countering flyers. A group of six bats in Chapter Eleven can make the map much easier at times, but they are pretty squishy and can die without support.
Meat Wagons: I didn't really like any other custom models.
Val'kyr: Huh, didn't realise they like to resurrect maggots and spiders before other units. It may be because the other corpses already got used up by necromancers or something else, but I am not sure. I'll check it out.
Sylvanas: I don't really want to change any of her abilities.

Chapter One: I don't think it feels weird, Sylvanas says immediately as the map starts that you are running low on resources. Also, destroying that base is not an exploit. The way it works since v3.0 is that once you destroy one of any of the enemy bases, the AI triggers.
Chapter Two: Yes, I agree the optional quest is kinda lame, it's just there to encourage the player to attack the ogres to get the +6 strenght item.
Chapter Three: Hmmm, I like the idea of adding a more lore-appropriate Scarlet Crusade hero!
Chapter Four: The attacks are supposed to be harder than usual in this map because the map is supposed to feel impossible. The way you played it is the "right" way to play. The enemy AIs turns against other because Balnazzar is a haughty demon (and it creates a pretty fun scenario!).
Chapter Five: Been a while since I played it on hard so I can't say what the right tactic is. I put all the creeps around the map if you want to try and get them. It'd be an empty map in places otherwise.
Chapter Six: It's intended that you can go and get three bases immediately. Makes the map faster and more interesting in my opinion.
Chapter Seven: Like in Chapter Two, the intention of the side quest is simply to encourage the player to go kill stuff to get items and powerups.
Chapter Ten: I think Orb of Frost is pretty good reward from a side quest. Completing the side quest also stops the val'kyr attacks.
Chapter Eleven: You are actually correct. I completely forgot another way to fail the final TFT map was letting Illidan capture all the obelisks. I like the idea of Arthas having an inaccessible base somewhere, but honestly, this map was a pain to create and I doubt I'll be changing anything about it at this point. Might check out the frost wyrms if they are too powerful.

Thank you for the huge review and all your thoughts! I'm glad you like it!



Thanks for reporting all this! I'll check it out! And I'm glad you liked the campaign!




Glad you liked it! Thanks for repoerting the bugs! What lines did you find cringy?



I'll be 100% honest, I forgot about Anub'arak after Chapter Eight. I would like to include him in the final chapter (Lana'thel did reappear so it shouldn't be an issue including him), but I don't think I'll be adding it at this point.

Thanks everyone for all your posts! Enjoyed reading all your thoughts!
Finally managed to finish this masterpiece campaign yesterday on 1.31.1.something, newest patch, newest version on normal difficulty. Let me just say that I had a blast. Just want to leave this final comment to summarize all the stuff I said, and tell my opinion on chapters and bugs, and other stuff. Just imos. Was hoping I would post this before you read the comments, but I was unable to.
First of all I encountered four bugs, probably due to the latest warcraft 3 patches:
  1. The murloc quest is broken. It works if you play the map from the start, but when you save/load (which you have to more often than not cause the map is quite challenging), it doesn't work. You only get the big murloc and nothing else happens.
  2. Some chapters/interludes (though mostly chapters) do not appear on the campaign loading screen.
  3. When I liberated the Brill in chapter 6 I got the abomination quest. I couldn't do it straight away cause a bunch of demons/forsaken were constantly attacking. I took the southern base(with the castle), lost the Brill, destroyed the upper demon base, than took the other forsaken base and destroyed the demon base next to it. Then I searched for the abomination, but it was nowhere to be found. I used "iseedeadpeople" and the abomination was nowhere. I did do save/load at some point.
  4. After using save/load in chapters 6 and 11 the buildings get strangely oriented.
Now my opinion about techtree, interludes and chapters:

TECHTREE:

First of all the techtree is really unique and amazing. There are only a few mostly cosmetic issues:
-Build buttons are in a little strange order. It would be cool if you changed farm and tower build buttons positions, so the farm would be next to the altar, as is with the humans. Maybe then change towers and graveyard, so the towers get in top right corner as is with the orcs and night elves.
-If I noticed correctly you are using these Ujimasa Hojo's Resources Discussion building models for the forsaken. But why are you still using scourge slaughter house when there is a forsaken one in this pack? Also might be cool if you changed Temple of the Damned with the Plagueatorium,Barracks (Human) and Derivatives, and Tomb of relics with this Building (Sunken Ruins) and Derivatives , both have human birth animations, but that's just my point of view. The only building model that imo doesn't look logical is the val'kyr building. It doesn't really make sense that the val'kyrs are traind from the bones of a dead dragon. These two maps, Forsaken and Forsaken V1.11, have a perfect Val'kyr building model, with human birth animation and an icon, but I was unable to find it on the hive.

About the units:
-Ghoul is really useful and needs to stay. They harvest and move a lot faster than the workers and it's much better to have 4-5 ghouls on lumber than 10+ workers. Lorewise forsaken do have ghouls in WoW. Plus they are undead and a race without ghouls is imo not really undead.
-Archers(and spiders) are perfect as they are. The only thing is that the ghost could use food. If I remember correctly archers use 2 food, then the ghosts could use 1 food.
-Dreadgurads are perfect, nothing else to say.
-Apothecaries use very diverse abilities. I agree that all three abilities should stay, but they would be more useful if one of them was an autocast. Perhaps cleansing toxins could be an autocast like the dryad's cancellation or the stun ability could be an autocast somehow. I also think that the healing could be nerfed a little, healing some more hitpoints.
-Banshees are perfect as they are. The coolest thing about them is that you preserve mana with vengeance instead of spending it on curse. And then turning them ethereal and stealing enemy's knights, sorceresses, priests, mammoths, abominations, crypt fiends, necromancers etc...
-Meat wagons are good. It's just that they are not meat wagons anymore. Their role now is to spread plague and blight not dig and carry corpses, so them throwing corpses doesn't make a lot of sense. They could use a different name and a different model. Maybe Forsaken Catapult, or the maps I mentiond earlier also have a few forsaken siege unit models that might work.
-Abominations are perfect as they are. Especially love their new abilities devour and maggots.
-Vampire Bats are perfect, nothing else to say.
-Val'kyrs are the only units in the techtree with problems:
-Revive doesn't work very well. In chapter 11 after Arthas attacked he killd 3-4 Dreadguards, an Abomination, a couple of archers and a few Apothecaries. After all that a val'kyr revived a maggot. I was like c'mon, really. I think that revive targets should be prioritized. Dreadguards, Abominations, Archers and Apothecaries being of first priority. Ghouls and Workers second, Spiders third and Maggots last.
-Having two identical Val'kyr units with different skins is imo confusing, unnecessary and makes gameplay harder. I agree that both skins are awesome and should be in the campaign. Here is my suggestion how. Three factions in the campaign use the val'kyr: scourge, forsaken and vrykul. You can make them have different val'kyr, with same stats and abilities, but with different skins and visual effects:
-Scourge can have pale val'kyr, with their abilities having icy visuals like now.
-Forsaken can have dark val'kyr with their abilities having dark/void visuals.
-Vrykul can have golden val'kyr, Golden Val'Kyr or Golden Valkyr, with their abilities having light effects, revive looking like resurrection and Unholy Protection like Liadrin's mass heal.

INTERLUDES:
Interludes are amazing. I'm especially in love with "Wrath of the Lich King", "Wrathgate", "Deliverence", Prologue and Epilogue. Again saw some minor cosmetic issues:
-In "In Damnation" Sylvanas is behind a cliff, most likely caused by the newest patches.
-In the Prologue and "Memories", when high elf Sylvanas is battling the scourge, her army has dragonhawk knights and dragonhawk riders that use blood elven skins instead of RoC high elven skins.
-In "Wrathgate" I didn't see a single dwarf unit, you could add a couple of rifflemen or mortar teams.
-The only interlude that imo has problems is "The Invasion of Northrend".
-All armadas are almost invisible cause of the storm, could be just a little more visible.
-The Alliance armada has a huge Skybreaker with a lot of gyrocopters(imo the weakest, most ridiculous and useless unit of all), but no gryphons and no hippogryphs/hippogryph riders.
-The Horde armada on the other hand has all flying units, but no Orgrim's Hammer. It too should have a role in the campaign.
-The Forsaken and Blood Elven armada has no air units at all. It has no Vampire Bats and no Dragonhawk Riders.
edit: Forgot to say, but would be godtier awesome if you added WotLK trailer sounds, music and King Terenas monologue, in the interlude "Wrath of the Lich King".

CHAPTERS:
-Chapter 1: Perfect start as it is. Just Saidan might not be necessary in a small scarlet outpost, but that doesn't really matter.
-Chapter 2: Also a perfect second chapter. Love the fact that there is a basebuilding mission where Sylvanas is not playable. The only thing that you could change is to make the ogres and the grey orcs attack your base in turns, instead of just the grey orcs attacking. That would give more variety and more motivation to do the optional quest.
-Chapter 3 is also good. Saidan Dathrohan needs to appear in this chapter cause Balnazzar revelation is one of the highlights of the campaign. If you are going to add Brigitte Abbendis then it could only be in the southern scarlet base that attacks Varimathras and Putress. There could also be an optional quest to destroy that base. Murloc quest is a cool reference to TFT campaign. Rhonin could use a new model(Rhonin).
-Chapter 4 is one of my three favorite chapters. Enjoyed every minute of it. Perfect as it is. Might also be cool if you added either Renault Mograine or Sally Whitemane. Simple reason is that when the demons and the crusade start fighting you have to attack Balnazzar right away or he will destroy the crusade and attack you and destroy you. Do not make the scarlet hero attack your base cause it would be too much(maybe only on hard). Maybe make the scarlet hero attack your base only after Balnazzar is destroyed.
-Chapter 5 is imo the weakest chapter of the campaign. First of all Sylvanas uses an outdated model. To be honest I couldn't complete this chapter on normal so had to change it to easy. There are too many frost wyrms, the lich spawns too often and your heroes and friendly AIs are too weak. You could make the fountain of health in the center of Orgrimmar replenish mana as well(the fountain of mana near the portals is completely too far and thus useless), crypt fiends and beatles that spawn not to use burrow(so annoying), reduce the number of frost wyrms, make enemy heroes spawn a little less. Maybe make the Lich and Deathknight(and maybe even add a Crypt Lord in the third base) attack in turns. And make Jaina and Thrall able to reach level 8(Sylvanas is already powerful at level 7, but not rally these two).
-Chapter 6 is perfect as it is and very interesting, nothing else to say. Thrall could be able to reach level 9 in this chapter, but nothing else.
-Chapter 7 is one of the three of my favorite chapters, it is very long, but I enjoyed every moment of it. Especially loved controlling Blood Elves and Forsaken simultaneously, my favorite part is when you charge the last base with both armies. You should imo enable Lor'themar to reach level 10. Also enable the blood elves to build cannon and arcane towers, and give them an additional building that would research lumbermill and blacksmith upgrades, cause Farstraider Lauge is overstuffed with training units and workers, plus all the upgrades. And having improved masonry and all three towers would make Blood Elves lives a lot easier in chapters 10 and 11. The vrykul are led by a blood prince. That imo doesn't make sense. I know that he appears with them in wow, but he is a messenger for the Lich King. He doesn't lead them in battle, Ingvar the Plunderer (a vrykul) does. Replace the blood prince with Angerboda, or Ymiron, or a new hero Ingvar. The vrykul spear thrower doesn't really look that it's made for throwing spears, this one could be a lot better ranged unit(https://www.hiveworkshop.com/threads/vrykul- huntress.313243/#resource-82829), you can give the spear carrier the role of a wolf and repurpose the wolf as a siege unit. Also noticed that in chapters 7 and 10 the vrykuls do not do any upgrades, why not?
-Chapter 8 I personally am not a fan of tourch chapters, but nevertheless it's really good. You could make heroes able to find a gem of true sight at the first part of the map. And make heroes able to reach level 10. Varian could use a different model(King Varian Wrynn).
-Chapter 9 you start with two blood elven sorceresses. That imo makes no sense, cause both Jaina and Vereesa are team alliance and Vereesa doesn't like the blood elves. Give them high elven skin. Vereesa uses an outdated model, I think. Also the Skybreaker appears at the start of the mission and is sooo annoying. He doesn't need to appear before the end. Krasus could use a new model(Krasus orHigh Elf & Creeps Pack(Eldin)). The san'layn prince that appears with the vrykul could instead appear here in front of the fountain where you temper Quel'Delar. Make Jaina and Vereesa able to reach level 10.
-Chapter 10 is one of my three favorite chapters, enjoyed every moment with it. The stuff about the Vrykul and Blood Elves I said already. Love that you fight Kel'thuzad and Sapphiron. The reward for killing Sapphiron is great, but the reward for killing Svalna could be better, some val'kyr related object. Val'kyr attacking your base aren't really a problem if you have two vampire bats at your and blood elven bases. Here I'll talk about the Alliance and Horde AI's. The Horde imo looks a lot cooler than the Alliance. The horde has all orc units plus the warlock, plus the blood elves in chapter 11. The Alliance feels like it's missing it's two important parts. There is not enough dwarves, no comment on the gyrocopter, the mortar teams aren't that visible, that leaves only gryphins. Readding rifflemen would solve this. It also seems there is no silver covenant, besides Vereesa herself and some priests. Maybe change night elven archer with a high elven one, or include them both, but give the high elf different abilities(cold arrow or arcane arrow), and/or give the Alliance a new high elven unit. Give the Horde Orgrim's Hammer. Also make red dragonflight able to have red whelps/drakes/dragons beside the custom units.
-Chapter 11, man that was hard. First thing I noticed is that Alexstrasza is smaller than Sindragosa, while storywise she should be larger. Would be cooler, more fun if Skybreaker and Orgrim's Hammer destroyed each other, instead of Sindragosa destroying the Skybreaker. I love the idea of having Arthas, an ultra powered hero who can destroy your entire army and annihilate your allies on his own. Arthas should have chaos attack instead of hero. But racing with him for the obelisks would be imo a suicide and a mission imposible. Again there are just a little too many frost wyrms. Imo Anub'arak could be more fitting to this mission than Kel'thuzad since he and Arthas were in the obelisk mission in TFT campaign. The Alliance here uses Ancient Protectors, the weakest tower of all, why? The humans have the best towers.
-Chapter 12 is also awesome. Love all the boss fights. But again Anub'arak deserves a boss fight. King Terenas could use a new model(King). It would also be cool if we were able to train red dragonflight units. Both custom and not custom. And make workers disappear once they've build the structures, they just take space.

At the end if you're reading this I need to thank you and congratulate you on this awesome campaign. Wish you all the best.
 
Last edited:
Level 5
Joined
Jul 23, 2013
Messages
95
Now that is a HUGE review! My thoughts:

Ghouls: I like ghouls! I also like the idea of Deathstalkers (I actually realised at some point recently I completely forgot Deathstalkers exist), but I honestly kind of like ghouls better. There isn't really much to it, I just wanted to keep some familiar Scourge units.
Dark Rangers: I like them having two types of arrows. Usually I'd put most dark rangers on poison arrow and two or three on black arrow because Sylvanas can't debuff all units by herself. As for the ghost that spawns, I like the idea of making it somehow more useful. I'll think about that.
Apothecaries: I appreciate your thoughts, but I don't think I'll be changing these. I think replacing any of their abilities would be a loss for the playable race as a whole since no other unit can stun, cleanse or heal for most of the campaign.
Banshees: I guess Vengeance could exist alongside Curse, but I also like how it functions now. Also honestly I didn't realise their attack range was lower. Maybe I changed this at some point and forgot about it? And they're not affected by Regenerative Flesh because they don't have any flesh. Banshees are ghosts and the ethereal ability in this sense does feel redundant, but it's a gameplay thing to allow them to possess other units more easily.
Abominations: I remember running into some kind an issue when the Scourge abomination and Forsaken abomination were a single unit, but I can't say what it was right now.
Vampire Bats: I think they are very good at countering flyers. A group of six bats in Chapter Eleven can make the map much easier at times, but they are pretty squishy and can die without support.
Meat Wagons: I didn't really like any other custom models.
Val'kyr: Huh, didn't realise they like to resurrect maggots and spiders before other units. It may be because the other corpses already got used up by necromancers or something else, but I am not sure. I'll check it out.
Sylvanas: I don't really want to change any of her abilities.

Chapter One: I don't think it feels weird, Sylvanas says immediately as the map starts that you are running low on resources. Also, destroying that base is not an exploit. The way it works since v3.0 is that once you destroy one of any of the enemy bases, the AI triggers.
Chapter Two: Yes, I agree the optional quest is kinda lame, it's just there to encourage the player to attack the ogres to get the +6 strenght item.
Chapter Three: Hmmm, I like the idea of adding a more lore-appropriate Scarlet Crusade hero!
Chapter Four: The attacks are supposed to be harder than usual in this map because the map is supposed to feel impossible. The way you played it is the "right" way to play. The enemy AIs turns against other because Balnazzar is a haughty demon (and it creates a pretty fun scenario!).
Chapter Five: Been a while since I played it on hard so I can't say what the right tactic is. I put all the creeps around the map if you want to try and get them. It'd be an empty map in places otherwise.
Chapter Six: It's intended that you can go and get three bases immediately. Makes the map faster and more interesting in my opinion.
Chapter Seven: Like in Chapter Two, the intention of the side quest is simply to encourage the player to go kill stuff to get items and powerups.
Chapter Ten: I think Orb of Frost is pretty good reward from a side quest. Completing the side quest also stops the val'kyr attacks.
Chapter Eleven: You are actually correct. I completely forgot another way to fail the final TFT map was letting Illidan capture all the obelisks. I like the idea of Arthas having an inaccessible base somewhere, but honestly, this map was a pain to create and I doubt I'll be changing anything about it at this point. Might check out the frost wyrms if they are too powerful.

Thank you for the huge review and all your thoughts! I'm glad you like it!



Thanks for reporting all this! I'll check it out! And I'm glad you liked the campaign!




Glad you liked it! Thanks for repoerting the bugs! What lines did you find cringy?



I'll be 100% honest, I forgot about Anub'arak after Chapter Eight. I would like to include him in the final chapter (Lana'thel did reappear so it shouldn't be an issue including him), but I don't think I'll be adding it at this point.

Thanks everyone for all your posts! Enjoyed reading all your thoughts!

i forgot to mention that vampire bats also lack regenerative flesh even though they are 100% corporeal

Edit: Also did you hear Patty Mattson's (the voice actress of sylvanas) new version of lament of the highborne? she has it uploaded on youtube. Could be neat if u could implement it somehow in trial of monsters when sylvanas is fighting arthas over the obelisks.
 
Last edited:
Level 1
Joined
Feb 26, 2015
Messages
2
Ok, I managed to finish the "new" 3.0 version in three days. Played on Hard difficulty for the first time.
Since English is not my first language, I'll try to be quick with my opinion about this campaign.

Techtree.
- Techtree is truly amazing, I feel like this version of Forsaken should be added to the other melee custom maps.

Units
- Units are well made too, but some units, like ghouls, really become useless after, like, second chapter. Also, their upgrade in the Laboratory is the worst one imo. Archers are great, but they are not needed even against super tough air units like Val'kyrs or Wyrms. Again, they become almost useless after 5th or 6th chapter, but that's totally fine, I can see the reason of that. But the most useless one is the blood bat, or whatever it is. I literally used it for one reason - scout the map for secrets (found a Tracer one!).
- There are also op units, like banshee with astral form. Idk if this is a bug or not, but you can enter astral form and give youself an anti-magic shield, which will make her invulnerable. AI will try to desperately kill her, stacking his armies around her and never attack you base (you just need to renew the shield after 90 seconds).
Multiple dark knights can one-shot any living being with their life drain ability spam, which single-handedly makes their upgrade a little bit worthless.
I feel like Apothecaries are a bit broken too, but that's just my vision of it. 5-6 of them can easily heal up your entire army, or stun lock any hero with shadow bolts.

Buildings
- Buildings are fine in terms of balance, although there are a few exceptions, like, electric towers spam can destroy a whole undead legion (and this is what I was doing 90% of the time), making the poison towers entirely useless.

Heroes
- All of them are really well done. Putress is one of the best heroes I've ever seen, although his Q feels really op. The only bad spells I can remember are Sylvanas' Life Drain, Jaina's Blizzard and Lor'Themar's auto-cast thing (destroys your manapool in a second).

Difficulty and balance.
- Again, it is fine most of the time. I struggled hard in chapter 2, 6, and 11 due to unstoppable enemy attacks, but I managed to build like a thousand electric towers, play some Tower Defense stuff and took my time to stabilize. So I played turtle-tactic the whole time and managed to beat all chapters in 2-3 tries. The cool thing is, there is more than one way to complete almost every chapter. For example, in chapter 6 you can play like me, capture only one base, sacrifice your main one, and play super defensively, or you can play agressively, capture all bases at once and quickly overwhelm your opponent. In chapter 10 for some reason I thought that the right way of completing 10-minutes quest is to use Val'kyrs, fly over all obstacles and just break Vereesa's cage. I thought it would be possible to defeat an entirely undead base with Kel'Thuzad and Sapphyron defending it in 10 minutes.

Bosses, additional quests, story, and other small things I urgently need to whine about.
All of it is outstanding, but I need to say about some subjective things.
- I was a little but dissapointed with Varimathras boss fight as it was very easy, but again, that's very subjective.
- About quests. In the second chapter there's a strange one: "Destroy ogres and take their gold mine", but there are already two or three gold mines around your base, lol. If it was like "Destroy ogres, if you do so, it will protect us from their attacks", that would be totally fine.
- Story. In the end of chapter 6, why would Varian get angry at Thrall? In the original WoW storyline there's a reason to - Battle for the Undercity took place AFTER Battle of the Wrathgate, and Varian thought that Bolvar's death was the entire Horde's fault. But in this campaign, Battle for the Undercity takes place before Wrathgate, and seems like there's no reason for Varian to be angry at Thrall. Correct me if I'm wrong.
- Secrets. I found almost everything (I guess). Tracer, Pandaren, manalocket and other small ones. There are too few of them!
- CGI cinematics weren't working for some reasons.
- When music switches, the game freezes for 3 seconds.
- In chapter 10, you can mind control Vrykul's worker before completing first main quest and start producing Val'kyrs. Idk if that was intended. Also, I think there are tons of mind control interactions, but I never tried to make them happen.

And one question. Have you tried to complete the hard Lich King fight with 6 heroes only?
As it turns out, it can be done, but you have to fight in the corner of the arena, or near the Frozen Throne, to skip most of the summons and Sindragosa phase. It was super hard and close kill, in the end three of my heroes died to summons and I was yelling at my screen things like "cmon finish him almost 10% cmon CMON YES I DID IT". Truly well done.

Overall this is one of the best custom campaigns I've ever played. I give it 4.999 / 5.000, because of secrets, dammit!
 
Last edited:
Level 22
Joined
Nov 5, 2010
Messages
1,322
Finally managed to finish this masterpiece campaign yesterday on 1.31.1.something, newest patch, newest version on normal difficulty. Let me just say that I had a blast. Just want to leave this final comment to summarize all the stuff I said, and tell my opinion on chapters and bugs, and other stuff. Just imos. Was hoping I would post this before you read the comments, but I was unable to.
First of all I encountered four bugs, probably due to the latest warcraft 3 patches:
  1. The murloc quest is broken. It works if you play the map from the start, but when you save/load (which you have to more often than not cause the map is quite challenging), it doesn't work. You only get the big murloc and nothing else happens.
  2. Some chapters/interludes (though mostly chapters) do not appear on the campaign loading screen.
  3. When I liberated the Brill in chapter 6 I got the abomination quest. I couldn't do it straight away cause a bunch of demons/forsaken were constantly attacking. I took the southern base(with the castle), lost the Brill, destroyed the upper demon base, than took the other forsaken base and destroyed the demon base next to it. Then I searched for the abomination, but it was nowhere to be found. I used "iseedeadpeople" and the abomination was nowhere. I did do save/load at some point.
  4. After using save/load in chapters 6 and 11 the buildings get strangely oriented.
Now my opinion about techtree, interludes and chapters:

TECHTREE:

First of all the techtree is really unique and amazing. There are only a few mostly cosmetic issues:
-Build buttons are in a little strange order. It would be cool if you changed farm and tower build buttons positions, so the farm would be next to the altar, as is with the humans. Maybe then change towers and graveyard, so the towers get in top right corner as is with the orcs and night elves.
-If I noticed correctly you are using these Ujimasa Hojo's Resources Discussion building models for the forsaken. But why are you still using scourge slaughter house when there is a forsaken one in this pack? Also might be cool if you changed Temple of the Damned with the Plagueatorium,Barracks (Human) and Derivatives, and Tomb of relics with this Building (Sunken Ruins) and Derivatives , both have human birth animations, but that's just my point of view. The only building model that imo doesn't look logical is the val'kyr building. It doesn't really make sense that the val'kyrs are traind from the bones of a dead dragon. These two maps, Forsaken and Forsaken V1.11, have a perfect Val'kyr building model, with human birth animation and an icon, but I was unable to find it on the hive.

About the units:
-Ghoul is really useful and needs to stay. They harvest and move a lot faster than the workers and it's much better to have 4-5 ghouls on lumber than 10+ workers. Lorewise forsaken do have ghouls in WoW. Plus they are undead and a race without ghouls is imo not really undead.
-Archers(and spiders) are perfect as they are. The only thing is that the ghost could use food. If I remember correctly archers use 2 food, then the ghosts could use 1 food.
-Dreadgurads are perfect, nothing else to say.
-Apothecaries use very diverse abilities. I agree that all three abilities should stay, but they would be more useful if one of them was an autocast. Perhaps cleansing toxins could be an autocast like the dryad's cancellation or the stun ability could be an autocast somehow. I also think that the healing could be nerfed a little, healing some more hitpoints.
-Banshees are perfect as they are. The coolest thing about them is that you preserve mana with vengeance instead of spending it on curse. And then turning them ethereal and stealing enemy's knights, sorceresses, priests, mammoths, abominations, crypt fiends, necromancers etc...
-Meat wagons are good. It's just that they are not meat wagons anymore. Their role now is to spread plague and blight not dig and carry corpses, so them throwing corpses doesn't make a lot of sense. They could use a different name and a different model. Maybe Forsaken Catapult, or the maps I mentiond earlier also have a few forsaken siege unit models that might work.
-Abominations are perfect as they are. Especially love their new abilities devour and maggots.
-Vampire Bats are perfect, nothing else to say.
-Val'kyrs are the only units in the techtree with problems:
-Revive doesn't work very well. In chapter 11 after Arthas attacked he killd 3-4 Dreadguards, an Abomination, a couple of archers and a few Apothecaries. After all that a val'kyr revived a maggot. I was like c'mon, really. I think that revive targets should be prioritized. Dreadguards, Abominations, Archers and Apothecaries being of first priority. Ghouls and Workers second, Spiders third and Maggots last.
-Having two identical Val'kyr units with different skins is imo confusing, unnecessary and makes gameplay harder. I agree that both skins are awesome and should be in the campaign. Here is my suggestion how. Three factions in the campaign use the val'kyr: scourge, forsaken and vrykul. You can make them have different val'kyr, with same stats and abilities, but with different skins and visual effects:
-Scourge can have pale val'kyr, with their abilities having icy visuals like now.
-Forsaken can have dark val'kyr with their abilities having dark/void visuals.
-Vrykul can have golden val'kyr, Golden Val'Kyr or Golden Valkyr, with their abilities having light effects, revive looking like resurrection and Unholy Protection like Liadrin's mass heal.

INTERLUDES:
Interludes are amazing. I'm especially in love with "Wrath of the Lich King", "Wrathgate", "Deliverence", Prologue and Epilogue. Again saw some minor cosmetic issues:
-In "In Damnation" Sylvanas is behind a cliff, most likely caused by the newest patches.
-In the Prologue and "Memories", when high elf Sylvanas is battling the scourge, her army has dragonhawk knights and dragonhawk riders that use blood elven skins instead of RoC high elven skins.
-In "Wrathgate" I didn't see a single dwarf unit, you could add a couple of rifflemen or mortar teams.
-The only interlude that imo has problems is "The Invasion of Northrend".
-All armadas are almost invisible cause of the storm, could be just a little more visible.
-The Alliance armada has a huge Skybreaker with a lot of gyrocopters(imo the weakest, most ridiculous and useless unit of all), but no gryphons and no hippogryphs/hippogryph riders.
-The Horde armada on the other hand has all flying units, but no Orgrim's Hammer. It too should have a role in the campaign.
-The Forsaken and Blood Elven armada has no air units at all. It has no Vampire Bats and no Dragonhawk Riders.
edit: Forgot to say, but would be godtier awesome if you added WotLK trailer sounds, music and King Terenas monologue, in the interlude "Wrath of the Lich King".

CHAPTERS:
-Chapter 1: Perfect start as it is. Just Saidan might not be necessary in a small scarlet outpost, but that doesn't really matter.
-Chapter 2: Also a perfect second chapter. Love the fact that there is a basebuilding mission where Sylvanas is not playable. The only thing that you could change is to make the ogres and the grey orcs attack your base in turns, instead of just the grey orcs attacking. That would give more variety and more motivation to do the optional quest.
-Chapter 3 is also good. Saidan Dathrohan needs to appear in this chapter cause Balnazzar revelation is one of the highlights of the campaign. If you are going to add Brigitte Abbendis then it could only be in the southern scarlet base that attacks Varimathras and Putress. There could also be an optional quest to destroy that base. Murloc quest is a cool reference to TFT campaign. Rhonin could use a new model(Rhonin).
-Chapter 4 is one of my three favorite chapters. Enjoyed every minute of it. Perfect as it is. Might also be cool if you added either Renault Mograine or Sally Whitemane. Simple reason is that when the demons and the crusade start fighting you have to attack Balnazzar right away or he will destroy the crusade and attack you and destroy you. Do not make the scarlet hero attack your base cause it would be too much(maybe only on hard). Maybe make the scarlet hero attack your base only after Balnazzar is destroyed.
-Chapter 5 is imo the weakest chapter of the campaign. First of all Sylvanas uses an outdated model. To be honest I couldn't complete this chapter on normal so had to change it to easy. There are too many frost wyrms, the lich spawns too often and your heroes and friendly AIs are too weak. You could make the fountain of health in the center of Orgrimmar replenish mana as well(the fountain of mana near the portals is completely too far and thus useless), crypt fiends and beatles that spawn not to use burrow(so annoying), reduce the number of frost wyrms, make enemy heroes spawn a little less. Maybe make the Lich and Deathknight(and maybe even add a Crypt Lord in the third base) attack in turns. And make Jaina and Thrall able to reach level 8(Sylvanas is already powerful at level 7, but not rally these two).
-Chapter 6 is perfect as it is and very interesting, nothing else to say. Thrall could be able to reach level 9 in this chapter, but nothing else.
-Chapter 7 is one of the three of my favorite chapters, it is very long, but I enjoyed every moment of it. Especially loved controlling Blood Elves and Forsaken simultaneously, my favorite part is when you charge the last base with both armies. You should imo enable Lor'themar to reach level 10. Also enable the blood elves to build cannon and arcane towers, and give them an additional building that would research lumbermill and blacksmith upgrades, cause Farstraider Lauge is overstuffed with training units and workers, plus all the upgrades. And having improved masonry and all three towers would make Blood Elves lives a lot easier in chapters 10 and 11. The vrykul are led by a blood prince. That imo doesn't make sense. I know that he appears with them in wow, but he is a messenger for the Lich King. He doesn't lead them in battle, Ingvar the Plunderer (a vrykul) does. Replace the blood prince with Angerboda, or Ymiron, or a new hero Ingvar. The vrykul spear thrower doesn't really look that it's made for throwing spears, this one could be a lot better ranged unit(https://www.hiveworkshop.com/threads/vrykul- huntress.313243/#resource-82829), you can give the spear carrier the role of a wolf and repurpose the wolf as a siege unit. Also noticed that in chapters 7 and 10 the vrykuls do not do any upgrades, why not?
-Chapter 8 I personally am not a fan of tourch chapters, but nevertheless it's really good. You could make heroes able to find a gem of true sight at the first part of the map. And make heroes able to reach level 10. Varian could use a different model(King Varian Wrynn).
-Chapter 9 you start with two blood elven sorceresses. That imo makes no sense, cause both Jaina and Vereesa are team alliance and Vereesa doesn't like the blood elves. Give them high elven skin. Vereesa uses an outdated model, I think. Also the Skybreaker appears at the start of the mission and is sooo annoying. He doesn't need to appear before the end. Krasus could use a new model(Krasus orHigh Elf & Creeps Pack(Eldin)). The san'layn prince that appears with the vrykul could instead appear here in front of the fountain where you temper Quel'Delar. Make Jaina and Vereesa able to reach level 10.
-Chapter 10 is one of my three favorite chapters, enjoyed every moment with it. The stuff about the Vrykul and Blood Elves I said already. Love that you fight Kel'thuzad and Sapphiron. The reward for killing Sapphiron is great, but the reward for killing Svalna could be better, some val'kyr related object. Val'kyr attacking your base aren't really a problem if you have two vampire bats at your and blood elven bases. Here I'll talk about the Alliance and Horde AI's. The Horde imo looks a lot cooler than the Alliance. The horde has all orc units plus the warlock, plus the blood elves in chapter 11. The Alliance feels like it's missing it's two important parts. There is not enough dwarves, no comment on the gyrocopter, the mortar teams aren't that visible, that leaves only gryphins. Readding rifflemen would solve this. It also seems there is no silver covenant, besides Vereesa herself and some priests. Maybe change night elven archer with a high elven one, or include them both, but give the high elf different abilities(cold arrow or arcane arrow), and/or give the Alliance a new high elven unit. Give the Horde Orgrim's Hammer. Also make red dragonflight able to have red whelps/drakes/dragons beside the custom units.
-Chapter 11, man that was hard. First thing I noticed is that Alexstrasza is smaller than Sindragosa, while storywise she should be larger. Would be cooler, more fun if Skybreaker and Orgrim's Hammer destroyed each other, instead of Sindragosa destroying the Skybreaker. I love the idea of having Arthas, an ultra powered hero who can destroy your entire army and annihilate your allies on his own. Arthas should have chaos attack instead of hero. But racing with him for the obelisks would be imo a suicide and a mission imposible. Again there are just a little too many frost wyrms. Imo Anub'arak could be more fitting to this mission than Kel'thuzad since he and Arthas were in the obelisk mission in TFT campaign. The Alliance here uses Ancient Protectors, the weakest tower of all, why? The humans have the best towers.
-Chapter 12 is also awesome. Love all the boss fights. But again Anub'arak deserves a boss fight. King Terenas could use a new model(King). It would also be cool if we were able to train red dragonflight units. Both custom and not custom. And make workers disappear once they've build the structures, they just take space.

At the end if you're reading this I need to thank you and congratulate you on this awesome campaign. Wish you all the best.

Glad you liked it, thanks for reporting the bugs!

And thank you for all your thoughts, my opinions on some:
- I left some Scourge buildings in the techtree mostly because I wanted to leave some familiar things in there, plus I kind of like the Scourge Temple and Slaughterhouse better.
- I don't think the val'kyr colors are confusing, but I agree it's problematic because they're different units. I am not sure how I can resolve that other than just allowing one option. And I didn't know there was a golden val'kyr! Though the golden val'kyr are good val'kyr aligned with the Valarjar from WoW, so those wouldn't unfortunately fit here.
- Invasion of Northrend interlude: honestly, I didn't put much thought into this interlude, I just wanted to show all the armies arriving to Northrend.
- Someone already suggested adding more Scarlet Crusade heroes, I love that idea!
- I disagree that Chapter Five is the weakest chapter, it's one of my favorites. It could use a bit of tweaking though. I'll check it out!
- Love that val'kyr archer model! Looks like it didn't exist when I released the campaign, I think I'll end up using it.
- I actually wanted to give the horde Orgrim's Hammer, but I don't think there is a horde gunship model.


Thanks for your help
tomoraider

No probs!

i forgot to mention that vampire bats also lack regenerative flesh even though they are 100% corporeal

Edit: Also did you hear Patty Mattson's (the voice actress of sylvanas) new version of lament of the highborne? she has it uploaded on youtube. Could be neat if u could implement it somehow in trial of monsters when sylvanas is fighting arthas over the obelisks.

The reason why I didn't give the bats regenerative flesh is because they are not undead. Originally in v3.0 they weren't even classified as undead, but some people pointed out that that means you can't heal them with Putress so I gave them the undead classification in v3.0.1, but it's only for gameplay purposes. Otherwise they heal passively outside of blight like any other unit.

And yeah, I saw that! It's awesome that she made it, but I prefer the original. I find it much more haunting whereas Patty Mattson's version if more of a battle theme.

Ok, I managed to finish the "new" 3.0 version in three days. Played on Hard difficulty for the first time.
Since English is not my first language, I'll try to be quick with my opinion about this campaign.

Techtree.
- Techtree is truly amazing, I feel like this version of Forsaken should be added to the other melee custom maps.

Units
- Units are well made too, but some units, like ghouls, really become useless after, like, second chapter. Also, their upgrade in the Laboratory is the worst one imo. Archers are great, but they are not needed even against super tough air units like Val'kyrs or Wyrms. Again, they become almost useless after 5th or 6th chapter, but that's totally fine, I can see the reason of that. But the most useless one is the blood bat, or whatever it is. I literally used it for one reason - scout the map for secrets (found a Tracer one!).
- There are also op units, like banshee with astral form. Idk if this is a bug or not, but you can enter astral form and give youself an anti-magic shield, which will make her invulnerable. AI will try to desperately kill her, stacking his armies around her and never attack you base (you just need to renew the shield after 90 seconds).
Multiple dark knights can one-shot any living being with their life drain ability spam, which single-handedly makes their upgrade a little bit worthless.
I feel like Apothecaries are a bit broken too, but that's just my vision of it. 5-6 of them can easily heal up your entire army, or stun lock any hero with shadow bolts.

Buildings
- Buildings are fine in terms of balance, although there are a few exceptions, like, electric towers spam can destroy a whole undead legion (and this is what I was doing 90% of the time), making the poison towers entirely useless.

Heroes
- All of them are really well done. Putress is one of the best heroes I've ever seen, although his Q feels really op. The only bad spells I can remember are Sylvanas' Life Drain, Jaina's Blizzard and Lor'Themar's auto-cast thing (destroys your manapool in a second).

Difficulty and balance.
- Again, it is fine most of the time. I struggled hard in chapter 2, 6, and 11 due to unstoppable enemy attacks, but I managed to build like a thousand electric towers, play some Tower Defense stuff and took my time to stabilize. So I played turtle-tactic the whole time and managed to beat all chapters in 2-3 tries. The cool thing is, there is more than one way to complete almost every chapter. For example, in chapter 6 you can play like me, capture only one base, sacrifice your main one, and play super defensively, or you can play agressively, capture all bases at once and quickly overwhelm your opponent. In chapter 10 for some reason I thought that the right way of completing 10-minutes quest is to use Val'kyrs, fly over all obstacles and just break Vereesa's cage. I thought it would be possible to defeat an entirely undead base with Kel'Thuzad and Sapphyron defending it in 10 minutes.

Bosses, additional quests, story, and other small things I urgently need to whine about.
All of it is outstanding, but I need to say about some subjective things.
- I was a little but dissapointed with Varimathras boss fight as it was very easy, but again, that's very subjective.
- About quests. In the second chapter there's a strange one: "Destroy ogres and take their gold mine", but there are already two or three gold mines around your base, lol. If it was like "Destroy ogres, if you do so, it will protect us from their attacks", that would be totally fine.
- Story. In the end of chapter 6, why would Varian get angry at Thrall? In the original WoW storyline there's a reason to - Battle for the Undercity took place AFTER Battle of the Wrathgate, and Varian thought that Bolvar's death was the entire Horde's fault. But in this campaign, Battle for the Undercity takes place before Wrathgate, and seems like there's no reason for Varian to be angry at Thrall. Correct me if I'm wrong.
- Secrets. I found almost everything (I guess). Tracer, Pandaren, manalocket and other small ones. There are too few of them!
- CGI cinematics weren't working for some reasons.
- When music switches, the game freezes for 3 seconds.
- In chapter 10, you can mind control Vrykul's worker before completing first main quest and start producing Val'kyrs. Idk if that was intended. Also, I think there are tons of mind control interactions, but I never tried to make them happen.

And one question. Have you tried to complete the hard Lich King fight with 6 heroes only?
As it turns out, it can be done, but you have to fight in the corner of the arena, or near the Frozen Throne, to skip most of the summons and Sindragosa phase. It was super hard and close kill, in the end three of my heroes died to summons and I was yelling at my screen things like "cmon finish him almost 10% cmon CMON YES I DID IT". Truly well done.

Overall this is one of the best custom campaigns I've ever played. I give it 4.999 / 5.000, because of secrets, dammit!

Glad you liked it!

- I think the vampire bats can be pretty useful if you make 5-6 of them. Blood Plague is pretty good and they can easily deal with any flying units.
- Honestly, it never occured to me that you can make banshees invulnerable by doing that. But it's not a bug, I actually like it that you can do that.
- I actually think Varimathras' fight is too easy as well. The problem with this map is that you can easily lose all your units if you're not careful. That's why I didn't make him a bit challenge, because if you engage with just Sylvanas and Thrall and like five units, you can very easily lose.
- Yeah, multiple people have already mentioned the chapter two quest! It is pretty silly. I'll need to figure out some kind of a new side quest for that map.
- So my intention for Chapter Six was that the Alliance entered the Undercity and saw Sylvanas' experiments, and that is why Varian gets pissed (as I needed a new reason for him to get angry since it happens before the Wrathgate). But since this is not shown on the screen or mentioned until after the encounter, I agree it comes across as weird.
- Did you find Dreadlord Jaina?
- CGI cinematics were removed in v3.0.1 as I couldn't get them to work anymore.
- Yeah, I know about the music freezing the game, this has been happening since one of the newer WC3 patches. I don't know how to fix it.
- It's fine that you can mind control. Originally I made it so you couldn't build other races' stuff, but ultimately I ended bringing it back because it doesn't really affect anythng, it's fun to use the AI's units.
- Yeah, I tested the entire campaign on hard. It's all doable, just requires some more micro than usual.
 
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- I actually wanted to give the horde Orgrim's Hammer, but I don't think there is a horde gunship model.

- I don't think the val'kyr colors are confusing, but I agree it's problematic because they're different units. I am not sure how I can resolve that other than just allowing one option. And I didn't know there was a golden val'kyr! Though the golden val'kyr are good val'kyr aligned with the Valarjar from WoW, so those wouldn't unfortunately fit here.
-You can always ask someone, make thread or something. If some member would ask nobody would care. But if you or a few other great campaign makers would ask, I think people would make it with haste. At least someone could reskin the alliance one(I personally have no clue of model making or skinning or else I would do it myself).
It would also fit the story well. If the two gunships would destroy each other, then Sylvanas would thought to herself something like "My allies are idiots. If we think to kill Arthas, than the forsaken have to do most(all) of the battle. In the end it's all up to me."
-I think the golden val'kyr didn't exist before Legion. So they weren't around in WotLK. But imo it would make sense that the vrykul would have Valajar Val'kyr. Ymiron ends up becoming a Valajar in Legion.
edit: The golden val'kyr and the Valajar are not necessarily good. They are working for Odyn, and his interests do not always oppose those of the Lich King. Some of their interests are actually common. I personally think that Odyn and the Valajar are bad guys in the long run.

Edit: Forgot to mention it earlier, but would make sense if Dreadlord Jaina had different abilities that do the same thing:
-Rain of Fire instead of Blizzard
-Summon Voidwalker or Succubus instead of Water Elemental
-Chaos bolt instead of Frostbolt
-Have a Summon Infernal meteor that falls from the sky that deals damage and stuns all objects(without summoning the infernal) instead of Ring of Frost
 
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In the end of chapter 6, why would Varian get angry at Thrall? In the original WoW storyline there's a reason... But in this campaign...seems like there's no reason for Varian to be angry at Thrall.
There're actually two reasons.One was mentioned by tomoraider while the other was hidden in the past,which could probably only be understood by hard-core history fans.:D

In the early days of WoW(1.0-2.0),Varian was not in the game.There were some vague quests indicating players that the king of Stormwind was kidnapped by someone,leaving the throne empty for a long time.Varian finally brought himself back in WoW 3.0,what he had experienced was hardly explained in WoW though.As a matter of fact,Blizzard has put Varian's story into a comic series,which could tell you why Varian hated Thrall at that moment.
 
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Glad you liked it, thanks for reporting the bugs!
Glad you liked it!

- I think the vampire bats can be pretty useful if you make 5-6 of them. Blood Plague is pretty good and they can easily deal with any flying units.
- Honestly, it never occured to me that you can make banshees invulnerable by doing that. But it's not a bug, I actually like it that you can do that.
- I actually think Varimathras' fight is too easy as well. The problem with this map is that you can easily lose all your units if you're not careful. That's why I didn't make him a bit challenge, because if you engage with just Sylvanas and Thrall and like five units, you can very easily lose.
- Yeah, multiple people have already mentioned the chapter two quest! It is pretty silly. I'll need to figure out some kind of a new side quest for that map.
- So my intention for Chapter Six was that the Alliance entered the Undercity and saw Sylvanas' experiments, and that is why Varian gets pissed (as I needed a new reason for him to get angry since it happens before the Wrathgate). But since this is not shown on the screen or mentioned until after the encounter, I agree it comes across as weird.
- Did you find Dreadlord Jaina?
- CGI cinematics were removed in v3.0.1 as I couldn't get them to work anymore.
- Yeah, I know about the music freezing the game, this has been happening since one of the newer WC3 patches. I don't know how to fix it.
- It's fine that you can mind control. Originally I made it so you couldn't build other races' stuff, but ultimately I ended bringing it back because it doesn't really affect anythng, it's fun to use the AI's units.
- Yeah, I tested the entire campaign on hard. It's all doable, just requires some more micro than usual.

- Still, vamps are pretty "meh" against serious air units, like Val'kyrs or Wyrms. I'd rather spam multiple knights' life drain to kill them.
Maybe they need another skill, for example, "Whenever this kills an air dude, spawn a little bat", you know, like Abomination's worms. In that case you could swarm down your enemies and make air combat much greater.
- Banshees invulnerability is an amazing feature, you can use her as a spy, but the problem is, your enemy will try to kill her and won't attack your base anymore until she's dead. Here is the example:
Nu9FE09keJM.jpg
AI attacked my base only when I forgot about that banshee and necromancers killed her with magic attacks. Idk if anyone else noticed that, but I consider it as a cheating :pcon:
- Got it.
- I think you just need to change the quest reward to "Ogres will stop attacking you", or "Cool item that gives you strength", or both at the same time. But of course it's up to you.
- Thanks for the explanation :d
- No, I haven't! Is it hard to find her? I'll try to search the whole chapters again, maybe even with cheats.
- Got it.
- Damn, the music changes a lot in the final chapter. It's not a big problem thou.
- That's really fun to mind control the other races' builders. I'll definitely try to destroy the giant undead base with Val'kyrs in chapter 10 :D
- Got it.

Thanks for the reply, cheers!

There're actually two reasons.One was mentioned by tomoraider while the other was hidden in the past,which could probably only be understood by hard-core history fans.:D

In the early days of WoW(1.0-2.0),Varian was not in the game.There were some vague quests indicating players that the king of Stormwind was kidnapped by someone,leaving the throne empty for a long time.Varian finally brought himself back in WoW 3.0,what he had experienced was hardly explained in WoW though.As a matter of fact,Blizzard has put Varian's story into a comic series,which could tell you why Varian hated Thrall at that moment.

Wow, thanks a lot, I haven't read this one.
 
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And one question. Have you tried to complete the hard Lich King fight with 6 heroes only?
As it turns out, it can be done, but you have to fight in the corner of the arena, or near the Frozen Throne, to skip most of the summons and Sindragosa phase. It was super hard and close kill, in the end three of my heroes died to summons and I was yelling at my screen things like "cmon finish him almost 10% cmon CMON YES I DID IT". Truly well done.

I tried too, every boss can be done with the heroes, though Lana'thel with her mind control is pretty annoying.

- CGI cinematics were removed in v3.0.1 as I couldn't get them to work anymore.
I think I saw in one of the recent patches that this can be redone again, but I'm not sure.
 
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Edit: Forgot to mention it earlier, but would make sense if Dreadlord Jaina had different abilities that do the same thing:
-Rain of Fire instead of Blizzard
-Summon Voidwalker or Succubus instead of Water Elemental
-Chaos bolt instead of Frostbolt
-Have a Summon Infernal meteor that falls from the sky that deals damage and stuns all objects(without summoning the infernal) instead of Ring of Frost

I thought about that, but I didn't give her anything else because I didn't want the dreadlord skin to affect gameplay so you have to use it because dreadlord Jaina is more powerful. I could, however, just reskin all of the abilities. I'll consider that!

There're actually two reasons.One was mentioned by tomoraider while the other was hidden in the past,which could probably only be understood by hard-core history fans.:D

In the early days of WoW(1.0-2.0),Varian was not in the game.There were some vague quests indicating players that the king of Stormwind was kidnapped by someone,leaving the throne empty for a long time.Varian finally brought himself back in WoW 3.0,what he had experienced was hardly explained in WoW though.As a matter of fact,Blizzard has put Varian's story into a comic series,which could tell you why Varian hated Thrall at that moment.

Oh you're absolutely right, I forgot about that!

- No, I haven't! Is it hard to find her? I'll try to search the whole chapters again, maybe even with cheats.

Check out Chapter Nine!

I think I saw in one of the recent patches that this can be redone again, but I'm not sure.

Huh, I'll check it out.
 
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Last thing:
It would be cool if Krasus would take over Alexstrasza's role after chapter 9 (he should get her stats and abilities and role and stuff) for a number of reasons:
-Krasus is Sindragosa's "equivalent", a consort, not Alexstrasza. Alexstrasza is supposed to be much more powerful than Sindragosa. (I know Sindragosa was a prime consort and Krasus wasn't, but he's the only red consort alive, plus dying has surely weakend Sindragosa)
-Helping and allying with mortals is far more fitting for Krasus's character than Alexstrasza's.
-Alexstrasza is supposed to be much more powerful, she's supposed to be able to take entire armies on her own.
-Alexstrasza in WoW has Malygos, her own "equivalent" to deal with.
I know it's not just changing the model and the name and that it's too much work and Krasus doesn't have HotS lines, so I didn't want to post this. But I guess the urge to post stuff is stronger than me.
 
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74
- Still, vamps are pretty "meh" against serious air units, like Val'kyrs or Wyrms. I'd rather spam multiple knights' life drain to kill them.
Maybe they need another skill, for example, "Whenever this kills an air dude, spawn a little bat", you know, like Abomination's worms. In that case you could swarm down your enemies and make air combat much greater.
- Banshees invulnerability is an amazing feature, you can use her as a spy, but the problem is, your enemy will try to kill her and won't attack your base anymore until she's dead. Here is the example:
Nu9FE09keJM.jpg
AI attacked my base only when I forgot about that banshee and necromancers killed her with magic attacks. Idk if anyone else noticed that, but I consider it as a cheating :pcon:
- Got it.
- I think you just need to change the quest reward to "Ogres will stop attacking you", or "Cool item that gives you strength", or both at the same time. But of course it's up to you.
- Thanks for the explanation :d
- No, I haven't! Is it hard to find her? I'll try to search the whole chapters again, maybe even with cheats.
- Got it.
- Damn, the music changes a lot in the final chapter. It's not a big problem thou.
- That's really fun to mind control the other races' builders. I'll definitely try to destroy the giant undead base with Val'kyrs in chapter 10 :D
- Got it.

Thanks for the reply, cheers!



Wow, thanks a lot, I haven't read this one.

Vampire Bats are actually the best anti-air units in the whole campaign. They can easily kill the strong enemy air units like Val'kyrs and Frost Wyrms, plus it's not expensive to make like 8-10 of them. Their abilities are also really good and enough for what they need. I would actually say they are a bit OP.
 
Level 22
Joined
Nov 5, 2010
Messages
1,322
Last thing:
It would be cool if Krasus would take over Alexstrasza's role after chapter 9 (he should get her stats and abilities and role and stuff) for a number of reasons:
-Krasus is Sindragosa's "equivalent", a consort, not Alexstrasza. Alexstrasza is supposed to be much more powerful than Sindragosa. (I know Sindragosa was a prime consort and Krasus wasn't, but he's the only red consort alive, plus dying has surely weakend Sindragosa)
-Helping and allying with mortals is far more fitting for Krasus's character than Alexstrasza's.
-Alexstrasza is supposed to be much more powerful, she's supposed to be able to take entire armies on her own.
-Alexstrasza in WoW has Malygos, her own "equivalent" to deal with.
I know it's not just changing the model and the name and that it's too much work and Krasus doesn't have HotS lines, so I didn't want to post this. But I guess the urge to post stuff is stronger than me.

I think including Alexstrasza is just cooler, mostly cause she is a more prominent character and has HotS voice lines.
 
Level 7
Joined
Jul 31, 2019
Messages
82
This campaign absolutely deserves 5/5! Everything is beautifully executed. I honestly think your work must deserve more recognition for such hard work. So far, this version is a real hit compared to previous ones. However, I really hope you will update Curse of the Forsaken to make it even better in the future. There are some suggestions (mostly general):
  • As for Forsaken techtree, it should be included in the altered melee map. However, you can consider the following changes: Lorewise, there is a rogue group for Forsaken. A new unit called "Shadowstalker" can be added. They can be used to spy enemy bases or silently killing single units. It would be better if you replace the skin of Meat Wagon with Forsaken Blight thrower. They emanate some sort of Scourge vibe from Forsaken. But that's fine. Dark rangers are awesome! Only thing I found fixable is Black Arrow upgrade. I think it should be replaced by something better because it overlaps with Sylvanas's own Black Arrows. Ghouls and Abominations are fine though I think their skins should be changed to fit more into Forsaken army. Apothecaries, Banshees and Vampire bats are well-made. There is nothing to complain about them. How about making workers cost no food? I just finished Second Human Book of Arkain and saw worker units costed no food to smoothly build the sizable army. Dreadguards are wonderful but after Dark Arts upgrade their mana pool becomes useless. So, I think this upgrade should at least give them an auto-cast ability that would drain mana. Or mana pool of dreadguards can be erased altogether. Valkyrs are the best! However, their model stacks with Scourge and Vrykul valkyrs. How about giving each faction's valkyr a different model? I think this would be more fitting. "Fortified defenses" upgrade doesn't give coil and virulent towers a fortified armor. It makes them susceptible to the frost wyrm attacks. Also in chapter 11, "Forsaken Plague" upgrade was missing from Forsaken laboratory. I don't know if it was intentional or not. That's all for Forsaken. :grin:
  • I also really loved the Scourge techtree. I noticed, however, that Obsidian Destroyers were removed from Scourge. Frostbrood Vanquishers should be given a unique model, skin and icon. They don't look much different than Frost wyrms. Darkfallen units are cool but how about adding a new unit for them? Maybe "Darkfallen Blood Knight"? Also when I possessed Acolyte and started producing more Scourge units, I observed that Darkfallen icons are actually Blood elven ones. (Freezing breath upgrade was missing from Scourge's Boneyard when I used a possessed Acolyte to train a frost wyrms.) They can be changed into a more deathly state. As for Nerubians, they only have crypt fiends. How about adding "Nerubian Viziers" and "Nerubian Flyers"? They would at least give more flavor to Scourge army. They could be named as "Crypt Seers" and "Crypt Sentinels", respectively (My thoughts haha). "Crypt seers" can function as healing and curse inflicting units for Scourge. "Crypt Sentinels" could become Scourge loyal Nerubians' equivalent of Vampire bats. If you ever decide of adding them, they can be added in chapter 8 where Bolvar and Varian are trapped in Azjol-Nerub. Scourge banshees should also look different than Forsaken ones. I saw no prominent presence of Death knights in CotF. How about making a custom unit called "death knight' that serves as Lich King's personal guards? Overall, that's my opinion on Scourge.
  • Now heroes and characters: There is nothing significant to change about Sylvanas. All of her skills are nicely done. Life Drain spell's icon, however, could be changed into a more shadowy themed one. Putress is also good though his melee range kinda makes him squishy. Thrall's model can be changed to suit WoW. Jaina's blizzard spell can be changed into a fiery or arcane type since she is an archmage. Also, her Ring of Frost's friendly fire is annoying as it damages her allied units. Varian and Vereesa are fine. Kel'Thuzad's model should be changed as he is "Arch-Lich of the Scourge", not a generic one. Anub'arak should return in chapter 12 as one of the boss fights. His demise in chapter 9 felt too early. Or he can return in chapter 11 as one of the commanders of Arthas's base. We haven't seen Varimathras's ultimate since he betrayed early. It would be nice if there was a secret mission about enslaving Undercity by Burning Legion which would involve Varimathras aiming to fight Forsaken resistance. Lor'themar's spells cost much mana. How about giving him a sin'dorei artifact to compensate for this problem? (Maybe every hero should have permanent items which would give special abilities and boost.) Sindragosa should have a better model as she is "Queen of Frostbrood". Alexstrasza's dragon form looks too simple. She is a Dragon aspect, after all. It will be cool if you intend to introduce Scarlet Crusade heroes (e.g. Sally Whitemane).
  • Now chapters: The first three chapters were fine (excluding some bugs mentioned by some players). Chapter 4 was daunting at first but after persisting long enough, the mission turned out to be surprisingly easy. The player must quickly deliver meats (it's better to locate Putress near to the bat nest while Sylvanas collect the meat. The process is fast.) Chapter 5 was also daunting. I think time duration should be increased as the heroes need to kill creeps and obtain some nice items (Medallion of Courage from Bronze Dragon as an example). Chapter 6 was extremely difficult that I restarted the mission many times after being overwhelmed by constant attacks. Luckily, hastily killing the next general after the first one made the mission much easier (Quick strike is the key). Chapter 7 was good (Tracer secret helped a lot :)) but killing all valkyrs on the map should give some reward. Chapter 8 is doable even in hard difficulty (though you have to lose most of your units in the last quest). I really liked chapter 9 due to its uncertainty and creepy atmosphere (except for nerubians which mostly comprised of crypt fiends and living nerubians, making the mission kinda boring to kill same units again and again). I think, however, more secrets should be added to make this chapter exciting. Chapter 10 was really cool but side quest involving about slaying Svala Sorrowgrave just gave an orb of frost. I think it should be potent artifact instead. The aerial path to Vereesa should be blocked as this made the mission too easy to complete. Constant attacks from Kel'thuzad and Vrykul were annoying though (Only by destroying the first vrykul base at the first minute, the mission gets smoother). Btw showing the battle at Wrathgate was such a magnificent idea! I really enjoyed seeing the titanic fight between Scourge vs alliance, horde and red dragons! Chapter 11... Perhaps the most challenging map I ever played. In hard difficulty, I passed this mission only by entering a money cheat (greedisgood 30000. My preference xD) as I had to direct both alliance and horde armies. I even sent Sylvanas and Vereesa to distract Arthas while armies were absent (My main forces stayed at our own base to defend it and harass the northeastern base after destroying the nearest Scourge fortification.) Alliance and Horde AI's should receive some modification in order to make their respective bases survivable. (Bonus idea: How about adding a Red Dragon Roost in Alliance base? Due to Alexstrasza's abduction by Arthas, her dragonflight should be panicked and desperately try to release her from Lich king's grasp.) There are five enemy bases... all of them are Scourge... which made enemies not quite diverse. How about replacing the one base with Vrykul? They are still the servants of Lich king. This is the map I liked the most:infl_thumbs_up: (worth playing a hundred times). Chapter 12 was insanely perfect! Nothing to complain about. Also have the coolest boss battle. I also agree with the notion of including Anub'arak boss fight in this chapter.
Overall, I wish you the best, tomoraider! You did an amazing job and made my days exciting by your campaigns. I look forward to playing the next updated version of both CotF and RotB.:ogre_haosis:
 
Last edited:
Level 22
Joined
Nov 5, 2010
Messages
1,322
This campaign absolutely deserves 5/5! Everything is beautifully executed. I honestly think your work must deserve more recognition for such a hard work. So far, this version is real hit compared to previous ones. However, I really hope you will update Curse of the Forsaken to make it even better in the future. There are some suggestions (mostly general):
  • As for Forsaken techtree, it should be included in altered melee map. However, you can consider following changes: Lorewise, there is a rogue group for Forsaken. A new unit called "Shadowstalker" can be added. They can be used to spy enemy bases or silently killing single units. It would be better if you replace the skin of Meat Wagon with Forsaken Blight thrower. They emanate some sort of Scourge vibe from Forsaken. But that's fine. Dark rangers are awesome! Only thing I found fixable is Black Arrow upgrade. I think it should be replaced by something better because it overlaps with Sylvanas's own Black Arrows. Ghouls and Abominations are fine though I think their skins should be changed to fit more into Forsaken army. Apothecaries, Banshees and Vampire bats are well-made. There is nothing to complain about them. How about making workers cost no food? I just finished Second Human Book of Arkain and saw worker units costed no food to smoothly build the sizable army. Dreadguards are wonderful but after Dark Arts upgrade their mana pool becomes useless. So, I think this upgrade should at least give them a autocast ability that would drain mana. Or mana pool of dreadguards can be erased altogether. Valkyrs are the best! However, their model stacks with Scourge and Vrykul valkyrs. How about giving each faction's valkyr a different model? I think this would be more fitting. "Fortified defenses" upgrade doesn't give coil and virulent towers a fortified armor. It makes them susceptible against the frost wyrm attacks. Also in chapter 11, "Forsaken Plague" upgrade was missing from Forsaken laboratory. I don't know if it was intentional or not. That's all for Forsaken. :grin:
  • I also really loved Scourge techtree. I noticed, however, that Obsidian Destroyers were removed from Scourge. Frostbrood Vanquishers should be given a unique model, skin and icon. They don't look much different than Frost wyrms. Darkfallen units are cool but how about adding a new unit for them? Maybe Darkfallen Blood Knight? Also when I possessed Acolyte and started producing more Scourge units, I observed that Darkfallen icons are actually Blood elven ones. (Freezing breath ability was missing from Scourge's Boneyard when I used a possessed Acolyte to train a frost wyrms.) They can be changed into more deathly state. As for Nerubians, they only have crypt fiends. How about adding "Nerubian Viziers" and "Nerubian Flyers"? They would at least give more flavor to Scourge army. They could be named as "Crypt Seers" and "Crypt Sentinels", respectively (My thoughts haha). "Crypt seers" can function as healing and curse inflicting units for Scourge. "Crypt Sentinels" could become Scourge loyal Nerubians' equivalent of Vampire bats. If you ever decide of adding them, they can be added in chapter 8 where Bolvar and Varian are trapped in Azjol-Nerub. Scourge banshees should also look different than Forsaken ones. I saw no prominent presence of Death knights in CotF. How about making a custom unit called "death knight' that serves as Lich King's personal guards? Overall, that's my opinion on Scourge.
  • Now heroes and characters: There is nothing significant to change about Sylvanas. All of her skills are nicely done. Life Drain spell's icon, however, could be changed into more shadowy themed one. Putress is also good though his melee range kinda makes him squishy. Thrall's model can be changed to suit WoW. Jaina's blizzard spell can be changed into fiery or arcane type, since she is an archmage. Also her Ring of Frost's friendly fire is annoying as it damages her allied units. Varian and Vereesa are fine. Kel'Thuzad's model should be changed as he is "Arch-Lich of the Scourge", not a generic one. Anub'arak should return in chapter 12 as one of the boss fights. His demise in chapter 9 felt too early. Or he can return in chapter 11 as one of the commanders of Arthas's base. We haven't seen Varimathras's ultimate since he betrayed early. It would be nice if there was a secret mission about enslaving Undercity by Burning Legion which would involve Varimathras aiming to fight Forsaken resistance. Lor'themar's spells cost much mana. How about giving him a sindorei artifact to compensate this problem? (Maybe every heroes should have permanent items which would give special abilities and boost.) Sindragosa should have better model as she is "Queen of Frostbrood". Alexstrasza's dragon form looks too simple. She is a Dragon aspect, afterall. It will be cool if you intend to introduce Scarlet Crusade heroes (e.g. Sally Whitemane).
  • Now chapters: First three chapters were fine (excluding some bugs mentioned by some players). Chapter 4 was daunting at first but after persisting long enough, the mission turned out to be surprisingly easy. The player must quickly deliver meats (it's better to locate Putress near to the bat nest while Sylvanas collect a meat. The process is fast.) Chapter 5 was also daunting. I think time duration should be increased as the heroes need to kill creeps and obtain some nice items (Medallion of Courage from Bronze Dragon as an example). Chapter 6 was extremely difficult that I restarted the mission many times after being overwhelmed from constant attacks. Luckily, hastily killing the next general after the first one made the mission much easier (Quick strike is the key). Chapter 7 was good (Tracer secret helped a lot :)) but killing all valkyrs in the map should give some reward. Chapter 8 is doable even in hard difficulty (though you have to lose most of your units in last quest). I really liked chapter 9 due to its uncertainty and creepy atmosphere (except for nerubians which mostly comprised of crypt fiends and living nerubians, making the mission kinda boring to kill same units again and again). I think, however, more secrets should be added to make this chapter exciting. Chapter 10 was really cool but side quest involving about slaying Svala Sorrowgrave just gave a orb of frost. I think it should be potent artifact instead. The aerial path to Vereesa should be blocked as this made the mission too easy to complete. Constant attacks from Kel'thuzad and Vrykul were annoying though (Only by destroying the first vrykul base at first minute, the mission gets smoother). Btw showing the battle at Wrathgate was such a magnificent idea! I really enjoyed seeing the titanic fight between Scourge vs alliance, horde and red dragons! Chapter 11... Perhaps the most challenging map I ever played. In hard difficulty, I passed this mission only by entering a money cheat (greedisgood 30000. My preference xD) as I had to direct both alliance and horde armies. I even sent Sylvanas and Vereesa to distract Arthas while armies were absent (My main forces stayed at our own base to defend it and harass the northeastern base after destroying the nearest Scourge fortification.) Alliance and Horde AI's should receive some modification in order to make their respective bases survivable. (Bonus idea: How about adding a Red Dragon Roost in Alliance base? Due to Alexstrasza's kidnapping by arthas, her flight should be panicked and openly assist Alliance forces.) There are five enemy bases... all of them are Scourge... which made enemies not quite diverse. How about replacing the one base with Vrykul? They are still servants of Lich king. This is the map I liked the most:infl_thumbs_up: (worth playing hundred times). Chapter 12 was insanely perfect! Nothing to complain about. Also have the coolest boss battle. I also agree with the notion of including Anub'arak boss fight in this chapter.
Overall, I wish you the best, tomoraider! You did amazing job and made my days exciting by your campaigns. I look forward to playing next updated version of both CotF and RotB.:ogre_haosis:

Glad you liked it! Thank you for all your suggestions!
 
Level 7
Joined
Mar 4, 2014
Messages
116
A small review.
~~
~~Negatives/Bugs~~
_I played all the missions on hard difficulty, so take my critique based on that_

~Overall~

- It seems like before every cutscene starts there is a small lag/pause of 1-2 seconds(usually showing the current base with the time stopped), this might be just because of my laptop tho.(it doesn't happen for prologue/interludes most of the time).

- Sylvanas has a really slow attack speed and yes i know it's supposed to be similar to her melle counterpart but... Even when i played with her leveling up plus taking tons of agi/knowledge tomes,she still has slow attack speed(the visual might say "fast" but it doesn't feel like fast to me), she is either capped(on attack speed) or thats just how her attacks are, either way its pretty annoying in my opinion(especially since she is an agi hero).

-I kinda got annoyed by this because of 2 reasons:
1. She is our main protagonist so she should be strong(yes i know she has very strong ultimates, but thats it, her normal spells without the ultimate are still average).
2. Now imagine having slow attacks + having curse as well, trying to last hit to get skeletons was a nightmare because before she could get an attack other heroes/units would have attacked before her and steal the kill.
-This fact might be related to her slow attack speed, when she levels up she only gets 1 point in agility.

- Sylvanas's model has the hitbox too big, causing many missclicks on her and not on other heroes or enemies making the gameplay worse.
For exemple, i can select her by clicking near her:
box.png box 2.png

- Sylvanas's extra ultimate "Banshee Queen" has some of what i think might be bugs, but not sure:
-Soul Harvest: The tooltip in this case is lying, Sylvanas is not actually instantly stealing the hp, it actually has a 1 sec delay before the hp is beeing stolen, only the damage dealt is instant, this can cause some issues(took me a while to see that it doesn't work properly), after using the spell and moving Sylvanas the hp steal fails, the same happens when she gets stunned while using the spell (the spell seems to have a channeling effect similar to flame strike so it can be canceled).

~Mission 4~

- Balnazzar should have an orb of shadow(purple) not an orb of slow(yellow) that color doesn't fit him.

~Mission 5~

- This was one of the hardest missions(took me a few restarts to be able to do it, just barely tho, having only a few orc buildings left), i got a few problems with this mission:

-The optional quest with the other 2 allies Warsong clan and Frostwolf clan, their A.I. is very bad and i think i know why, is because of the way gates (basically A.I. gets very confused when there are way gates involved), They didn't do much to be honest, almost no help at all, and even when they somehow managed to get true those way gates well.. they will just get destroyed by the undead anyway,(pretty hilarious).

-I actually did this mission without completing the optional quest at first because i didn't really undestand what to do with the way gates, (since i already scouted the way gates near Ogrimmar at first i was really confused how to activate them, in my infinit wisdom i didn't think of just right clicking my heroes to those allies, and to be fair i didn't think that was even possible since there seemed to be no dirrect roads to their location and i thought that the way gates were the only option).

-So my suggestion would be:
1. Try to have the road to Garosh semi revealed on the mini map already (this will show the player that there is a dirrect way to those allies, without using the gateways) and somehow manage to work out how to make the A.I use the waygates properly without them getting confused and not helping.

or

2. Another option would be to just ditch the way gates all together, that way the A.I will not be that confused anymore and will actually do something, A way to do this would be to make both Warsong and Frostwolf clans teleport through a portal and make a base near Ogrimmar like those elves/forsaken did at the beginning of the game.The optional quest will remain the same, with making the player go and reach them by killing the guardians(but this time there would be portals having to be cleared rather than way gates).

- Even tho i liked having to control Thrall and Jaina in this mission along with Sylvanas and nothing else, i really hated their spells (they just felt so weak to me compared to Sylvanas), again we are talking about The Warchief of the Horde here and his spells/powers were really lacklustre, same for Jaina(i don't know why Jaina doesn't have brilliance aura anymore, that just made her pretty useless in my eyes, her ultimate is ok but anything else is too weak) and Garosh as well.
I suggest either giving them a second ultimate similar to Sylvanas's Banshee Queen, or buffing their other spells, same for Garosh(saw him literally getting cursed by a banshee and thats it, he dealt 0 dmg after that, and died killed by 3 ghouls(pretty funny and sad at the same time).
My heroes were always out of mana and yes i know there was a mana fountin nearby but i didn't really have time to go anywhere near that spot while beeing attacked nonstop by the undead armies.

~Mission 9~

- So, what's up with that scroll of truth, it seems like it only works on Jaina, is there some kind of purpose to it or is just for cosmetics, either way i was really confused by it, i liked the Dreadlord voice lines tho(female version dreadlord sounded pretty badass).

- When we have to run from the Lich King part, i stood to fight him and actually managed to kill him(used all my pots and lost all my units, but still), i don't think this should be a thing, so my suggestion would be to either give Lich King like 5k more hp or make it in such a way that when he gets low hp he will cast a spell that heals him to full health.
The cutscenes looked funny as well, The Lich King was talking but there was nobody there :D
lol.png

~Mission 12~

- Very nice and cute how we kept "getting help" from our allies by constructing buildings for each race, But there was a problem, what to do with them when i have almost no gold, i barelly had gold to revive 1 hero and make 4 units, it just felt weird having all those new buildings and not having gold to use them.

- In this mission i found 2 items of the same name called "Essence of Death", i have no idea what they do.

~~Positives~~

- I really liked the new units overall, my favorite must be the vindicator Draenei with those epic voice lines and her russian accent :xxd:

- The new enemy units looked amazing, all those new races like the Vrykul (reminded me of vikings) , the demons and those darkfallen highelves.

- Loved the beautiful mix of alliance units/buildings allways beeing together in every missions when everyone had bases (trully a e s t h e t i c) Seeing all those different mix of units fighting along side eachother was pretty epic!

- All the boss fights were challenging enough and cool (i guess with the exception of Varimathras, i think he should be able to summons some infernals as well just because he went down too easily).

Overall I Loved this! Once i started playing i couldn't stop untill i finished it!
-The Story was really engaging and beautiful!
-The dialogues between the characters felt real and awesome.
-The Gameplay was always fantastic in every mission!
My favorite mission was Number 11, I really liked seeing the similarities between the objectives of this mission with the old classic campaign mission at the end of the Frozen Throne, pretty nostalgic.
Even tho in the past Arthas managed to take all 4 obelisks from Illidan, the second time it seems like he failed and that costed him his reign! :D
~~
 
Last edited:
Level 12
Joined
Feb 3, 2019
Messages
771
If I might add, having a san'layn like Scourge subrace with nerubians would be really awesome. Though I don't know in what map you could squeeze it in besides chapter 11.
And I didn't notice there were no destroyers. They should be present.
 
Level 1
Joined
Aug 5, 2019
Messages
5
I just finish this here in Brazil, were the custom campaign community is not popular and I must say that this is a masterpiece. Thank you for the hours of pleasure playing this. Amazing work.
 
Level 22
Joined
Nov 5, 2010
Messages
1,322
A small review.
~~
~~Negatives/Bugs~~
_I played all the missions on hard difficulty, so take my critique based on that_

~Overall~

- It seems like before every cutscene starts there is a small lag/pause of 1-2 seconds(usually showing the current base with the time stopped), this might be just because of my laptop tho.(it doesn't happen for prologue/interludes most of the time).

- Sylvanas has a really slow attack speed and yes i know it's supposed to be similar to her melle counterpart but... Even when i played with her leveling up plus taking tons of agi/knowledge tomes,she still has slow attack speed(the visual might say "fast" but it doesn't feel like fast to me), she is either capped(on attack speed) or thats just how her attacks are, either way its pretty annoying in my opinion(especially since she is an agi hero).

-I kinda got annoyed by this because of 2 reasons:
1. She is our main protagonist so she should be strong(yes i know she has very strong ultimates, but thats it, her normal spells without the ultimate are still average).
2. Now imagine having slow attacks + having curse as well, trying to last hit to get skeletons was a nightmare because before she could get an attack other heroes/units would have attacked before her and steal the kill.
-This fact might be related to her slow attack speed, when she levels up she only gets 1 point in agility.

- Sylvanas's model has the hitbox too big, causing many missclicks on her and not on other heroes or enemies making the gameplay worse.
For exemple, i can select her by clicking near her:
- Sylvanas's extra ultimate "Banshee Queen" has some of what i think might be bugs, but not sure:
-Soul Harvest: The tooltip in this case is lying, Sylvanas is not actually instantly stealing the hp, it actually has a 1 sec delay before the hp is beeing stolen, only the damage dealt is instant, this can cause some issues(took me a while to see that it doesn't work properly), after using the spell and moving Sylvanas the hp steal fails, the same happens when she gets stunned while using the spell (the spell seems to have a channeling effect similar to flame strike so it can be canceled).

~Mission 4~

- Balnazzar should have an orb of shadow(purple) not an orb of slow(yellow) that color doesn't fit him.

~Mission 5~

- This was one of the hardest missions(took me a few restarts to be able to do it, just barely tho, having only a few orc buildings left), i got a few problems with this mission:

-The optional quest with the other 2 allies Warsong clan and Frostwolf clan, their A.I. is very bad and i think i know why, is because of the way gates (basically A.I. gets very confused when there are way gates involved), They didn't do much to be honest, almost no help at all, and even when they somehow managed to get true those way gates well.. they will just get destroyed by the undead anyway,(pretty hilarious).

-I actually did this mission without completing the optional quest at first because i didn't really undestand what to do with the way gates, (since i already scouted the way gates near Ogrimmar at first i was really confused how to activate them, in my infinit wisdom i didn't think of just right clicking my heroes to those allies, and to be fair i didn't think that was even possible since there seemed to be no dirrect roads to their location and i thought that the way gates were the only option).

-So my suggestion would be:
1. Try to have the road to Garosh semi revealed on the mini map already (this will show the player that there is a dirrect way to those allies, without using the gateways) and somehow manage to work out how to make the A.I use the waygates properly without them getting confused and not helping.

or

2. Another option would be to just ditch the way gates all together, that way the A.I will not be that confused anymore and will actually do something, A way to do this would be to make both Warsong and Frostwolf clans teleport through a portal and make a base near Ogrimmar like those elves/forsaken did at the beginning of the game.The optional quest will remain the same, with making the player go and reach them by killing the guardians(but this time there would be portals having to be cleared rather than way gates).

- Even tho i liked having to control Thrall and Jaina in this mission along with Sylvanas and nothing else, i really hated their spells (they just felt so weak to me compared to Sylvanas), again we are talking about The Warchief of the Horde here and his spells/powers were really lacklustre, same for Jaina(i don't know why Jaina doesn't have brilliance aura anymore, that just made her pretty useless in my eyes, her ultimate is ok but anything else is too weak) and Garosh as well.
I suggest either giving them a second ultimate similar to Sylvanas's Banshee Queen, or buffing their other spells, same for Garosh(saw him literally getting cursed by a banshee and thats it, he dealt 0 dmg after that, and died killed by 3 ghouls(pretty funny and sad at the same time).
My heroes were always out of mana and yes i know there was a mana fountin nearby but i didn't really have time to go anywhere near that spot while beeing attacked nonstop by the undead armies.

~Mission 9~

- So, what's up with that scroll of truth, it seems like it only works on Jaina, is there some kind of purpose to it or is just for cosmetics, either way i was really confused by it, i liked the Dreadlord voice lines tho(female version dreadlord sounded pretty badass).

- When we have to run from the Lich King part, i stood to fight him and actually managed to kill him(used all my pots and lost all my units, but still), i don't think this should be a thing, so my suggestion would be to either give Lich King like 5k more hp or make it in such a way that when he gets low hp he will cast a spell that heals him to full health.
The cutscenes looked funny as well, The Lich King was talking but there was nobody there :D

~Mission 12~

- Very nice and cute how we kept "getting help" from our allies by constructing buildings for each race, But there was a problem, what to do with them when i have almost no gold, i barelly had gold to revive 1 hero and make 4 units, it just felt weird having all those new buildings and not having gold to use them.

- In this mission i found 2 items of the same name called "Essence of Death", i have no idea what they do.

~~Positives~~

- I really liked the new units overall, my favorite must be the vindicator Draenei with those epic voice lines and her russian accent :xxd:

- The new enemy units looked amazing, all those new races like the Vrykul (reminded me of vikings) , the demons and those darkfallen highelves.

- Loved the beautiful mix of alliance units/buildings allways beeing together in every missions when everyone had bases (trully a e s t h e t i c) Seeing all those different mix of units fighting along side eachother was pretty epic!

- All the boss fights were challenging enough and cool (i guess with the exception of Varimathras, i think he should be able to summons some infernals as well just because he went down too easily).

Overall I Loved this! Once i started playing i couldn't stop untill i finished it!
-The Story was really engaging and beautiful!
-The dialogues between the characters felt real and awesome.
-The Gameplay was always fantastic in every mission!
My favorite mission was Number 11, I really liked seeing the similarities between the objectives of this mission with the old classic campaign mission at the end of the Frozen Throne, pretty nostalgic.
Even tho in the past Arthas managed to take all 4 obelisks from Illidan, the second time it seems like he failed and that costed him his reign! :D
~~

Glad you liked the campaign! Thank you for mentioning all the issues you encountered!

If I might add, having a san'layn like Scourge subrace with nerubians would be really awesome. Though I don't know in what map you could squeeze it in besides chapter 11.
And I didn't notice there were no destroyers. They should be present.

I think they're fine as they are. They are already present pretty heavily in the Northrend maps, four out of six maps have the san'layn. And honestly, I think I just forgot about destroyers.

I just finish this here in Brazil, were the custom campaign community is not popular and I must say that this is a masterpiece. Thank you for the hours of pleasure playing this. Amazing work.

Thank you, glad you liked it!
 
Level 12
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Messages
771
If I might add, having a san'layn like Scourge subrace with nerubians would be really awesome. Though I don't know in what map you could squeeze it in besides chapter 11.
And I didn't notice there were no destroyers. They should be present.
I think they're fine as they are. They are already present pretty heavily in the Northrend maps, four out of six maps have the san'layn. And honestly, I think I just forgot about destroyers.
Bad choice of words, I apologize. The san'layn are indeed present more than enought. What I meant is the san'layn are a scourge race with scourge buildings and some scourge units and custom san'layn units. I meant it would be really awesome to have a nerubian race that way, scourge buildings, some scourge units and nerubian (custom) units. Nerubian race having no san'layn units of course.

edit: Quick question just out of curiosity, every hero that has HotS voice uses it, except Thrall and Varian. Why don't they use it? (Again urge to post stronger than me, sorry)
 
Last edited:
Level 3
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Aug 3, 2019
Messages
38
Hey Tomoraider, I haven't played much of your campaign yet, except for the first 2 missions. I'm definitely about to play more, but I gotta ask you a question: Have you considered making your game co-op playable as well? U know, like releasing another version of it. I know it's time consuming, but I'm just asking. Don't wanna speak for everyone, but I think most of us would appreciate playing this masterpiece with another person!


Might update my message later, as well as add a review.
Thanks for your reply,
Matt.
UPDATE: Alright, I have finished your entire campaign. (no spoilers, don't worry)
And I must say, I'm stunned! Everything was done well. I enjoyed playing as more factions, so it doesn't get repetitive. Also, most of the missions felt unique to me, especially the final one!
The custom units were also done well, except for the poison and dark arrows of rangers and towers.. it could be kept, but I think poison arrows need some buff for damage or something, so they are worth researching and using.
Also, in the epilogue, there was a scene where I could only see a weird purple triangle, possibly some part of the forsaken flag.
The difficulty was alright as well(finished on normal, because custom campaigns usually have impossibly hard difficulties). I will give your Rise of The Blood Elves a try as well, because I enjoyed playing this one!
Thanks again,
Matt.
 
Last edited:
Level 1
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Oct 14, 2018
Messages
2
My download speed is so slow, its usually 500kbps when downloading any map in hive, but in this specific map it goes down to 15kbps. It takes me about 4 hours then I get frustrated and start again
 
Level 10
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Messages
139
One of the best campaigns I've played. Is Blizz-like and feels like a great continuation to the the Legacy of the Damned campaign. I like how you essentially remade WotLK into a campaign. I am really glad you made the story follow the canon WoW events instead of making that apothecary girl Lich Kings as I have seen in old playthroughs. I've just started replaying is, since last time I played I quit half-way through because a new patch came and messed up my saves. That being said I have 2 very small suggestions:
1. Turn on Dark Minion buff on Life Drain, it's a new balance change, but for custom maps and campaigns it needs to be manually turned on. (I made sure to enable it before starting the campaign, for anyone wanting to play the campaign I recommend you enable it)
2. Since Meat Wagons don't transport corpses and you are playing as the Forsaken, I think you should rename them Blight Spreaders, get them a new model and icon and change their missile to Chimaera green breath, but keep the same stats. (just like you did with Gargoyles and Vampire Bats, it gives more flavor to the race)
 
Level 1
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Aug 29, 2019
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4
Well as one of players who loves wc3 lore and gameplay, have to say that this thing is awesome. Every level looks and plays very well and lore made totaly fine 10\10
 
Level 1
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1
hi, i recently downloaded the campaign and i started to play but the conversations in-game do not appear to me just the animation of the characters talking without any text.

PD: Sorry for my bad english i'm just learning to talk it ;)
 
Level 8
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Messages
456
hi, i recently downloaded the campaign and i started to play but the conversations in-game do not appear to me just the animation of the characters talking without any text.

PD: Sorry for my bad english i'm just learning to talk it ;)
You need to activate the Subtitles in Options ;D
 
Level 23
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Feb 18, 2014
Messages
3,423
Alright, I replayed this campaign once again on Patch 1.30.4, going on Hard this time, here's my review :
Chapter One :

- Units can destroy the stone fences, dunno if that was intentional.
- The main scarlet base AI doesn't seem to work properly, they rebuild some of their lost units and then they stop at some point.
- You may want to find a better model/skin for the Sorceress cause the Blood Elf skin doesn't suit for it.

Chapter Two :

- Level 8 Red Dragon with bloodlust? That must be a joke!
- I feel like the Dark Rangers don't deal much damage to air units and they are easly killed by them, if only one of the forsaken units had Ensare or Web, maybe you want to consider giving the Dark Ranger's Spider the Web ability, just a suggestion.
- The AI is quite harsh in this mission, they don't give you enough time to catch up your breath.
- IMO, the light blue AI should start when you attack them first or when you rescue Putress.
- I kinda agree with what the others said, there is already enough gold in this mission thus the optional quest seem pointless, perhaps you may want to replace it with something like : Kill Mug'Thol or some sort like that.

Chapter Three :

- Putress shouldn't be an intelligence base since he's a melee hero imo.
- I think Vengeance should be seperated from Curse, like give it to another unit or replace it with Etheral Form since this latter isn't much useful imo.
- Varimthras's base should normally also be attacked by the main Scarlet Crusade Base cause as of now they are only attacking Sylvanas, which makes it a 2v1 and 1v1.
- After the betrayal, The enemy AI build extra structures which already exist, like 1 extra townhall, 1 extra keep and an extra castle, I know this is a commun bug with AI not regonizing the Forsaken Tech-Tree, this can be fixed by adding this condition to the Townhall in the AI :
((Total number of Shadowhall units) Equal to 0 and ((Total number of Haunted Keep units) Equal to (Total number of Shadowhall units) and (Total number of Dark Castle units) Equal to (Total number of Haunted Keep units))
With this condition, the AI won't build a second tier units.
- The optional quest of this mission feels kinda a plagiarism to the third mission of the FT undead campaign. I mean it's not bad to take ideas/inspirations from the original blizzard campaigns but it should not be too similar.

Chapter Four :

- The game crash when I load my saved game file.
- I don't understand the point of destroying the Scarlet Crusade base if this latter will eventually be destroyed by the demons, also there was no explanation why those two, all of a sudden, turned against each others?
- Well, it was a pretty fun and easy mission I'd say even on Hard difficulty, it's just those Scarlet Crusade waves at the beginning which are kinda annoying but then it all become much easier after they turn against the demons, the vampire bats also make good support units in distracting the enemy.

Chapter Five :

- There was a strange sound that plays during the intro cinematic, I think it was the undead obesidian statue's replanish ability if I'm not mistaken.
- I think you should have kept Jaina's Brilliance Aura, it seems more useful than the one you replaced it. Same can be said for the her Mass Teleport Ability, I mean, the spell that freezes enemies is also good, but teleport seem more useful in this type of maps, especially if you want to teleport your heroes back to base in case of enemy attack while exploring the region.
- It also was an easy mission than I expected, all heroes are just doing fine like nothing to worry about, there wasn't a big challenge I would say.
- Drek'Thar's AI seem confused, they just keep going back and to forth to their base doing nothing.

Chapter Six :

- Well, nothing much to say about this level, it was pretty fun and entertaining, there were just a few freezes that happen during the battle for the Undercity which I think are caused by the music when it restart.
- I think the battle in the undercity could use more work like there are a lot of empty space in it which cannot be explored.

Chapter Seven :

- There is techanically a bug that occur with the tiny Forsaken buildings, if you order Lor'themar to use them they will be controlled by to the Blood Elves instead of the Forsaken.
- I think you should seperate the Scourge and the Undead Blood elves with two different bases.
- It would have been better if the Blood Elves had their complete Techtree in this mission instead of merging everything inside one building.
- Is it just me or are the enemy Heroes respawning too fast?
- Enemy having zeppelins vs Player having ships seems unfair to me.
- Well, this was a challenging map comparing to the other maps I played previously.

Chapter Eight :

- At some point of the game, Varian strangely became mute.
- Bol'var could use a better soundset
- Varian's ultimate isn't that great imo, maybe find him a better ultimate?
- Lags/freezes that occur from time to time.
- Normally, there should be a switch to turn off the Fire traps, or did I miss something?
- No reward for killing Anub'arak?

Chapter Nine :

- Why do the Sorceresses have Arcane Affinity? I mean they are not Blood Elves, are they?

Chapter Ten :

- You do realise that Veressa's cage can be destroyed with air units without having to pass through Kel'Thuzard's base, right? Maybe add block pathers for air units so the player will be forced to battle the Scourge base first before getting to Veressa?

Chapter Elven :

- I'm not really sure how the Enemy AI works in this map, I mean they just attack randomly, there is like 5 enemy bases in this mission and they all seem to attack the same opponent at the same time, specifically Sylvanas' base, which makes it very hard to deal with them, normally the 2 scourge bases in the east should go after Sylvanas' base, and the middle scourge base should go after the Horde base, while the 2 scourge bases in the west should go after the Alliance base.
- I don't see why would you make the Lich King so powerful in this chapter, I know he's supposed to be a powerful tyrant and all that by this isn't like a boss fight mission.
- Lich King spawning out of nowhere, maybe give him a small base somewhere where it cannot be reached by the Player and add a portal there so that he could teleport himself to the battlefield?
- I don't understand why would we need to re-activate the obelisks when we already did that in the final mission of the Frozen Throne?

Chapter Twleve :

- Jaina's W doesn't work.
- Lor'themar had the Essence of Death in his inventory at the beginning, was that intentional?
- The three Essences and the two titanium keys should be saved inside a variable rather than the inventory.
- In the quest it says disable the three obelisks while in reality only two were disabled.
- Some bosses are just ridiculously and unnecessary OP.
- Why do the Tormented Souls have mana if they don't have spells?


Overrall, it's always been fun replaying this campaign again, I'll be replaying RotbE next and give another review for it when completed. Keep up the good work and have a nice day :)
 
Level 6
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May 8, 2014
Messages
168
- The game crash when I load my saved game file.

- There was a strange sound that plays during the intro cinematic

- Lor'themar had the Essence of Death in his inventory at the beginning
As far as I know,some bugs including what you've listed above were caused by new patches (1.30.4, 1.31.0 and 1.31.1).Tomoraider updated CotF v3.0.1 with patch 1.30.2,which in my opinion was the last NORMAL patch updated by Blizzard...
 
Level 22
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Nov 5, 2010
Messages
1,322
edit: Quick question just out of curiosity, every hero that has HotS voice uses it, except Thrall and Varian. Why don't they use it? (Again urge to post stronger than me, sorry)

I didn't feel that they needed new voice sets, Sylvanas and Jaina have the HotS one because I wanted them to have the same voice actress.

Hey Tomoraider, I haven't played much of your campaign yet, except for the first 2 missions. I'm definitely about to play more, but I gotta ask you a question: Have you considered making your game co-op playable as well? U know, like releasing another version of it. I know it's time consuming, but I'm just asking. Don't wanna speak for everyone, but I think most of us would appreciate playing this masterpiece with another person!


Might update my message later, as well as add a review.
Thanks for your reply,
Matt.
UPDATE: Alright, I have finished your entire campaign. (no spoilers, don't worry)
And I must say, I'm stunned! Everything was done well. I enjoyed playing as more factions, so it doesn't get repetitive. Also, most of the missions felt unique to me, especially the final one!
The custom units were also done well, except for the poison and dark arrows of rangers and towers.. it could be kept, but I think poison arrows need some buff for damage or something, so they are worth researching and using.
Also, in the epilogue, there was a scene where I could only see a weird purple triangle, possibly some part of the forsaken flag.
The difficulty was alright as well(finished on normal, because custom campaigns usually have impossibly hard difficulties). I will give your Rise of The Blood Elves a try as well, because I enjoyed playing this one!
Thanks again,
Matt.

Oof, making co-op would be pretty tough. I can't say I would be really interested in working on that.

And glad you liked the campaign!

One of the best campaigns I've played. Is Blizz-like and feels like a great continuation to the the Legacy of the Damned campaign. I like how you essentially remade WotLK into a campaign. I am really glad you made the story follow the canon WoW events instead of making that apothecary girl Lich Kings as I have seen in old playthroughs. I've just started replaying is, since last time I played I quit half-way through because a new patch came and messed up my saves. That being said I have 2 very small suggestions:
1. Turn on Dark Minion buff on Life Drain, it's a new balance change, but for custom maps and campaigns it needs to be manually turned on. (I made sure to enable it before starting the campaign, for anyone wanting to play the campaign I recommend you enable it)
2. Since Meat Wagons don't transport corpses and you are playing as the Forsaken, I think you should rename them Blight Spreaders, get them a new model and icon and change their missile to Chimaera green breath, but keep the same stats. (just like you did with Gargoyles and Vampire Bats, it gives more flavor to the race)

Glad you liked it!
1. Oh I didn't even realise that got changed. Thanks for bringing it to my attention!
2. Honestly, I left them the same because I couldn't find any other catapult model that I really liked.

Well as one of players who loves wc3 lore and gameplay, have to say that this thing is awesome. Every level looks and plays very well and lore made totaly fine 10\10

Glad you liked it!

Alright, I replayed this campaign once again on Patch 1.30.4, going on Hard this time, here's my review :
Chapter One :

- Units can destroy the stone fences, dunno if that was intentional.
- The main scarlet base AI doesn't seem to work properly, they rebuild some of their lost units and then they stop at some point.
- You may want to find a better model/skin for the Sorceress cause the Blood Elf skin doesn't suit for it.

Chapter Two :

- Level 8 Red Dragon with bloodlust? That must be a joke!
- I feel like the Dark Rangers don't deal much damage to air units and they are easly killed by them, if only one of the forsaken units had Ensare or Web, maybe you want to consider giving the Dark Ranger's Spider the Web ability, just a suggestion.
- The AI is quite harsh in this mission, they don't give you enough time to catch up your breath.
- IMO, the light blue AI should start when you attack them first or when you rescue Putress.
- I kinda agree with what the others said, there is already enough gold in this mission thus the optional quest seem pointless, perhaps you may want to replace it with something like : Kill Mug'Thol or some sort like that.

Chapter Three :

- Putress shouldn't be an intelligence base since he's a melee hero imo.
- I think Vengeance should be seperated from Curse, like give it to another unit or replace it with Etheral Form since this latter isn't much useful imo.
- Varimthras's base should normally also be attacked by the main Scarlet Crusade Base cause as of now they are only attacking Sylvanas, which makes it a 2v1 and 1v1.
- After the betrayal, The enemy AI build extra structures which already exist, like 1 extra townhall, 1 extra keep and an extra castle, I know this is a commun bug with AI not regonizing the Forsaken Tech-Tree, this can be fixed by adding this condition to the Townhall in the AI :
((Total number of Shadowhall units) Equal to 0 and ((Total number of Haunted Keep units) Equal to (Total number of Shadowhall units) and (Total number of Dark Castle units) Equal to (Total number of Haunted Keep units))
With this condition, the AI won't build a second tier units.
- The optional quest of this mission feels kinda a plagiarism to the third mission of the FT undead campaign. I mean it's not bad to take ideas/inspirations from the original blizzard campaigns but it should not be too similar.

Chapter Four :

- The game crash when I load my saved game file.
- I don't understand the point of destroying the Scarlet Crusade base if this latter will eventually be destroyed by the demons, also there was no explanation why those two, all of a sudden, turned against each others?
- Well, it was a pretty fun and easy mission I'd say even on Hard difficulty, it's just those Scarlet Crusade waves at the beginning which are kinda annoying but then it all become much easier after they turn against the demons, the vampire bats also make good support units in distracting the enemy.

Chapter Five :

- There was a strange sound that plays during the intro cinematic, I think it was the undead obesidian statue's replanish ability if I'm not mistaken.
- I think you should have kept Jaina's Brilliance Aura, it seems more useful than the one you replaced it. Same can be said for the her Mass Teleport Ability, I mean, the spell that freezes enemies is also good, but teleport seem more useful in this type of maps, especially if you want to teleport your heroes back to base in case of enemy attack while exploring the region.
- It also was an easy mission than I expected, all heroes are just doing fine like nothing to worry about, there wasn't a big challenge I would say.
- Drek'Thar's AI seem confused, they just keep going back and to forth to their base doing nothing.

Chapter Six :

- Well, nothing much to say about this level, it was pretty fun and entertaining, there were just a few freezes that happen during the battle for the Undercity which I think are caused by the music when it restart.
- I think the battle in the undercity could use more work like there are a lot of empty space in it which cannot be explored.

Chapter Seven :

- There is techanically a bug that occur with the tiny Forsaken buildings, if you order Lor'themar to use them they will be controlled by to the Blood Elves instead of the Forsaken.
- I think you should seperate the Scourge and the Undead Blood elves with two different bases.
- It would have been better if the Blood Elves had their complete Techtree in this mission instead of merging everything inside one building.
- Is it just me or are the enemy Heroes respawning too fast?
- Enemy having zeppelins vs Player having ships seems unfair to me.
- Well, this was a challenging map comparing to the other maps I played previously.

Chapter Eight :

- At some point of the game, Varian strangely became mute.
- Bol'var could use a better soundset
- Varian's ultimate isn't that great imo, maybe find him a better ultimate?
- Lags/freezes that occur from time to time.
- Normally, there should be a switch to turn off the Fire traps, or did I miss something?
- No reward for killing Anub'arak?

Chapter Nine :

- Why do the Sorceresses have Arcane Affinity? I mean they are not Blood Elves, are they?

Chapter Ten :

- You do realise that Veressa's cage can be destroyed with air units without having to pass through Kel'Thuzard's base, right? Maybe add block pathers for air units so the player will be forced to battle the Scourge base first before getting to Veressa?

Chapter Elven :

- I'm not really sure how the Enemy AI works in this map, I mean they just attack randomly, there is like 5 enemy bases in this mission and they all seem to attack the same opponent at the same time, specifically Sylvanas' base, which makes it very hard to deal with them, normally the 2 scourge bases in the east should go after Sylvanas' base, and the middle scourge base should go after the Horde base, while the 2 scourge bases in the west should go after the Alliance base.
- I don't see why would you make the Lich King so powerful in this chapter, I know he's supposed to be a powerful tyrant and all that by this isn't like a boss fight mission.
- Lich King spawning out of nowhere, maybe give him a small base somewhere where it cannot be reached by the Player and add a portal there so that he could teleport himself to the battlefield?
- I don't understand why would we need to re-activate the obelisks when we already did that in the final mission of the Frozen Throne?

Chapter Twleve :

- Jaina's W doesn't work.
- Lor'themar had the Essence of Death in his inventory at the beginning, was that intentional?
- The three Essences and the two titanium keys should be saved inside a variable rather than the inventory.
- In the quest it says disable the three obelisks while in reality only two were disabled.
- Some bosses are just ridiculously and unnecessary OP.
- Why do the Tormented Souls have mana if they don't have spells?


Overrall, it's always been fun replaying this campaign again, I'll be replaying RotbE next and give another review for it when completed. Keep up the good work and have a nice day :)

Thanks for mentioning all the issues you encountered, honestly this is the first time I'm hearing about many of them. Perhaps some of the recent pathes broke some stuff, as @nuck001 said? As for some of the other stuff you mentioned:
  • Chapter One: the sorceress is using one of the skins here from Hive that changes her ears into a crown, if I'm not wrong, I don't think it looks like a blood elf. And I made it so everyone can destroy the walls, just to simplify things.
  • Chapter Two: yeah, the side quest sucks here. The AI is probably a bit overtuned as well, even for hard difficulty.
  • Chapter Three: thanks for mentioning that trigger for the town halls, that honestly didn't even occur to me. Also, I wouldn't call it plagiarism, it's not that I couldn't come up with anything on my own, I deliberately wanted to make some things similar to the TFT campaign as a fun way to allude to it.
  • Chapter Four: the point of this map was to start in a position where it feels impossible, but the tides turn as more and more vampires bats attack, and I made the demons attack the humans cause it's honestly really fun. It would otherwise be just another "destroy the enemy base map", this way at least it has a twist.
  • Chapter Five: interesting that you didn't find it challenging, I always found this mission pretty tough on hard!
  • Chapter Seven: I wouldn't really call Lor'themar being able to construct Forsaken buildings a bug. It's similar to how you can possess workers with Banshess, it's a fun little feature that I didn't want to remove cause it doesn't really affect anything.
  • Chapter Eight: originally Anub'arak would drop the item you get from the side quest, but some people didn't manage to pick it up in time so it was gone forever, so I decided to move it to the side quest.
  • Chapter Nine: they are blood elves. You use Kirin Tor unit in this map, that's why they are all casters, and blood elves are a part of Kirin Tor.
  • Chapter Ten: I thought I fixed that, that's weird.
  • Chapter Eleven: I think the AI is somewhat random in this map so they aren't always attacking the same bases. As for the Lich King, I wanted to make it like Kerrigan in the final Starcraft 2: Wings of Liberty mission. Whenever she spawned, you'd have to focus on stopping her cause she'd wreck your defenses.
  • Chapter Twelve: nope, no idea how Lor'themar got that. Which bosses did you find too hard?
 
Level 23
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Feb 18, 2014
Messages
3,423
Chapter Twelve: nope, no idea how Lor'themar got that. Which bosses did you find too hard?
I don't remember their names exactly, but I do recall how they look like, like those two Val'kyrs that keeps healing each others constantly or those three Blood Mages that keeps reviving themselves, also I forgot to mention 2 more things about this level: Units seem useless to me because if you compare them to enemy units, you'll see that those latters deal 2 or 3 times more damage than normal. I soloed this whole mission using only my heroes while trying my best to keep them alive as long as possible. Not only that, but there is also another problem that bothers me the most about this chapter: why is there not enough gold ? You can barely find gold coins, there isn't enough gold to train units nor ressurect your heroes.
 
Level 12
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Messages
771
Level 12
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Feb 3, 2019
Messages
771
No because Terenas is a weak old man, not a buff warrior/paladin old man
Well he was a weak old man when he died(he was 70+), but he's a ghost so he can look like he did during his prime. He looks quite buff in WoW and he uses a sword(the model is obviousely based on Terenas from WoW in Icecrown Citadel). Besides a king should be a warrior not a priest.
 
Level 22
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Sep 17, 2010
Messages
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Well he was a weak old man when he died(he was 70+), but he's a ghost so he can look like he did during his prime. He looks quite buff in WoW and he uses a sword(the model is obviousely based on Terenas from WoW in Icecrown Citadel). Besides a king should be a warrior not a priest.
Terenas wasn't a warrior even in his youth, maybe you could read about him a little?
 
Level 12
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Messages
771
Terenas wasn't a warrior even in his youth, maybe you could read about him a little?
Really? Where does it say? I know from wowpedia that he wasn't a GOOD warrior, but he was still a warrior(haven't read the chronicles that deep, but I know that he defended the Capital against the Horde). And also a king who is not a warrior in a fantasy realm that's based on medival Europe doesn't make any sense. All other human/dwarven/elven kings and princes(except Keal) are warriors or paladins. And in Icecrown Citadel he fights Arthas with a sword so he does know how to use it, obviousely.
 
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Really? Where does it say? I know from wowpedia that he wasn't a GOOD warrior, but he was still a warrior(haven't read the chronicles that deep, but I know that he defended the Capital against the Horde). And also a king who is not a warrior in a fantasy realm that's based on medival Europe doesn't make any sense. All other human/dwarven/elven kings and princes(except Keal) are warriors or paladins.
Well, Lord Perenolde wasn't a warrior either, if i recall only only Thoras was a warrior king, following the tradition of the old kings of Arathor, Genn spent more time leading through politics than on the battlefield either, same with king Llane :peasant-thinking:
 
Level 12
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771
Well, Lord Perenolde wasn't a warrior either, if i recall only only Thoras was a warrior king, following the tradition of the old kings of Arathor, Genn spent more time leading through politics than on the battlefield either, same with king Llane :peasant-thinking:
Llane Wrynn was a best friend of Anduin Lothar and Medivh, they grew up together. Llane would frequently spar with Lothar, the greatest warrior in human history, and the score was even. He was obviously a legendary warrior on par with Lothar, he died from backstabbing by Garona. It is said that Varian took his warrior skills from his father. Genn is clearly stated as a warrior in WoW and uses warrior abilities, his son Liam as well. He doesn't like to get his hands dirty when there are other ways, but he's a really good warrior. Both Pernold and his son were warriors actually, they were cowards, didn't go to battle ever and stayed away as much as they could. But they were warriors skilled with swords. Kael wasn't a warrior cause he was a powerful mage, but all other rulers of Quel'Thalas were.
edit Daelin and both his sons are clearly warriors. And all the Trollbanes. As well as Bronzebeard, Wildhammer and Dark Iron kings.
 
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