Achieving a better spell section:

[HINDYhat]

That's definitely not the major reason as to why the spell section is inflating...

 

[Aspard]

It would be acceptable if this punch of spells is at least well-codded and origingal, wouldn't it?

But it (punch) won't be so nice since we have about 5-6 buggy and useless spells, which have been done in 15 minutes of WE work, by those people. Since they don't pay attention to the submission rules, so let the modd punish them and clean up the section!

 

[Deuterium]

Thank you PP for checking.

Although I didn't want any promotion for members who could be mods, but you're the boss around here, so meh..

PP, now I don't exactly have any one in mind, I mean one of the best hive coders beside DD is usually very inactive so wouldn't suit being a mod (I'm talking about Deaod). Actually most of the best hive coders are usually inactive.

But have you considered -JonNny? He is fairly active, he has good coding knowledge, his English seems fine and he's mature.

If I get anyone else in mind, I'll be sure to mention him

----

Septimus, your idea is sort of logical... but here's a better idea. A simple "check" questions when uploading the spell like:
1. Is your spell/system leakless?
2. Is your spell/system MUI?
3. Does your spell/system use waits?

And yet I still don't find that idea that impressive, but take it as a improved version of your own idea.

And Septimus, banning is sort of harsh

----

Hope hvo gets better soon. Never knew that happened to him.

----

@ Thanathos:
Kingz has been inactive (although he checks the hive from time to time) for sometime, so I doubt he'd be an option. Also, I doubt he could moderate (v)Jass spells as the last time he was active, he had just learnt vJass.

Dark_Dragon would have been a very good choice if his english was better.
He is understandable usually, but sometimes it is hard to understand what he means.

----

@ Aspard:
No it's not a poll... we don't vote here, we just advice someone

----

Thanks all!

 

[En_Fuego]

Septimus, your idea is sort of logical... but here's a better idea. A simple "check" questions when uploading the spell like:
1. Is your spell/system leakless?
2. Is your spell/system MUI?
3. Does your spell/system use waits?

And yet I still don't find that idea that impressive, but take it as a improved version of your own idea.

This is not an improvement.

1) People don't always know what leaks are.
2) People lie.
3) Waits aren't dis-allowed as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Deuterium]

meh well then a whole better system should be thought out imo, rather than having quizzes

 

[Rmx]

There is no point in this big argue about Kingz and DD, we must figure out a solution.

We should have active mods in the spell section or else it will be flooded by pending spells !

 

[Lambdadelta]

Get Jesus4Lyf over here and ask him to review ^^

Although that is highly unlikely.

Ok, that is off topic.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I agree with not enough active moderators but the sub-section is redundent.

[Rules
You must accept the site rules in order to upload.
I have read, understood and agree to abide by The Hive Workshop rules.
Yes
No

I see this in place, yet people go uploading their shameless crap saying it's their first spell uploaded or something.

Use
The spells section should not be used to get feedback or help on your coding--please use the Triggers and Scripts forum for that. It should also not be used to send spells to friends and then delete them--please use the Pastebin for that.

 

[Rmx]

I think we should not instantly upload our spells in the spell section as pending, we should make it only for approved spells and all of the rest should go to somewhere else, were they wait till they get reviewed.

That's what i think

 

[HINDYhat]

... what the heck is the difference, other than screwing up the consistency of the resource system?

 

[Rmx]

what the heck is the difference, other than screwing up the consistency of the resource system?

I think they made it before, all approved spells were only showen, this is what should have been done ages ago.

When they made it like this, i instantly fixed one of my sepllpack to get it approved thus making it show in the spell section and not in pending zone.

 

[Deuterium]

That's a bad idea. Let's say it's vacation, and all mods are off skiing somewhere, your spell won't exist for a few weeks until they get back

 

[En_Fuego]

That's a bad idea. Let's say it's vacation, and all mods are off skiing somewhere, your spell won't exist for a few weeks until they get back

Because it totally exists while buried under a mound of shit?

 

[Deuterium]

If you wana re-phrase what I said in your own way, yes

 

[Aspard]

The problem is in lack of moderation, not in bunch of noobs uploading shitty stuff. The ladders will always exist and find a way to violate any submission rules, which will ever be set. ;( If the moderators are more active - the community is cleaner.

 

[Linaze]

The problem with both the Spell and Map section is the amount of shit that's uploaded.
Just think of it, how fun is it to review a pile of garbage?

 

[baassee]

Just think of it, how fun is it to review a pile of garbage?

better clean it than leave it!

boo yah, one nights sleep and I miss all this, what a mess

Yes I agree that the spell section is a pretty mess and I can see what spells I should review and not review cause some are just as you guys said, piece of shit. No offense but naming spells with something "special" doesnt make it special. I've seen alot of the spell section, reviewed alot. Told alot about the misstakes they make and very often how to fix 'em. And it's a piss poor job to do it. But someone have to do it?

Hvo has taken the step to do it. Now during his injuries (usch usch usch very painful one) he can basiclly do nothing. Now DSG and Hanky jumped in reviewed a few and like PP said, better than nothing.

But also as PP told us, bring a list of qualified ppl. I don't see a problem with that so let's us make a list !

~baassee

 

[Rmx]

I agree with Baassee we should bring a list of qualified people to review spell

 

[Yixx]

When picking a mod, you have to take in account that we dont want any one-day-flys that review a bunch of spells and then leave it like that. We need people that are active, good moderators, of course have coding knowledge, but (in my opinion) above all have motivation to moderate and keep that motivation. Though you cannot predict how motivated a person will be after a while, you can try to see how he (or maybe she!) has been motivated in the past and how this motivation has changed.

 

[Deuterium]

Well then make a list and I'll be posting it in the thread description

 

[Yixx]

I do not think i am the one to decide wether a person is good enough to be listed for Mod, but i do recommend you guys to look in the JASS section a little more, because the Spell section isnt the only section with coders, and in general i think JASS section has better coders than Spell section.

Actually, i am sure about that last statement. Making spells is childish once you start the real work, real vJass.

 

[-Berz-]

DD can type English perfectly, but just if he wants

 

[HINDYhat]

Making spells is childish once you start the real work, real vJass.

lolwat

 

[Deuterium]

I second Hindy

 

[Aspard]

Actually, i am sure about that last statement. Making spells is childish once you start the real work, real vJass.

There is no any actual difference between GUI, Jass, vJass or other scripting ways. Everything could be done in all of them in semi-same quality (I know GUI will never reach the perfect level of the Jass, but even here we can avoid all actual problems if we have hard-working hands and clever mind) and if you want to say, that GUI is a piece of sh*t, then think about it this way: Why does Blizzard made it as the base format for their game? Do you think all the codders who were making the game are just childish funs of WarCraft series? ;D

And btw, there are only libraries and scripts in the Jass section, not spells or systems

 

[Viikuna]

Spells are not just code, they are actually much more than that.
You just use code for spells, just like you use models and textures and all cool shit.

Many people seem to be forgetting this. You cant do everything with code only and so making some spells requires more skills than just coding skills.

 

[Yixx]

Spells are all the same base. Either an instant spell, or something with a periodic timer. Then it is just some maths or whatever. Opposite to that, real systems are more than an event and a timer. Im not saying all systems are advanced codes of thousands of lines, but there has been put in a little more thought than a spell.

Don't think i dont want a cleaner Spell Section, im just saying you guys should look in JASS section also for candidates, as you are all just summing up big spell-makers, while there are really more people that know how to code than just spell-makers.

 

[PurplePoot]

The_Reborn_Devil will be helping with spell reviewing as a spell moderator.

 

[Deuterium]

Nice to know that

 

[Viikuna]

Differencies between systems and spells?



Well, a good system does something efficiently and is easy to use.

Good spell does something really cool that looks good and everything.

Systems are more about coding, spells are more about the idea behind spell and the art and other stuff.

Systems are here to do all that actual work, like modifying stats ( UnitProperties ) or moving units ( Knockback system ).

Spell are just supposed to use systems to do all this in some innovative and cool way.

Systems are here just to do their part in spell making progress, which contains loads of other stuff too.

 

[PurplePoot]

That's an interesting description, although making a spell does not necessitate using systems.

 

[Viikuna]

I cant really think a spell that can be made without any systems at all.

Well, of course you can hardcode anything inside your spell code, but that kinda sucks. Almost every spell does something that should be done with systems.

Stuff like damaging unit ( DamageSystem for custom damage types and resistances ) or slowing unit ( UnitPropeties for changing units movespeed and some Buff system which handles temporary effects like temporary movespeed changes ) for example.

 

[Anachron]

I vote for removing mods who can't spend 10 minutes a day per HWS, because they don't have a reason to be mod then.

Additionally, new mods have to be placed instead.

It doesn't matter whether there are new more minimods or more active ones, but the action has to be taken.

 

[Foopad]

However, what's the matter in approving spells, if we can search for both approved and pending spells, huh? The reason of "approving" itself for me seems as to sort off all this harsh with leaking, unefficient, boring and non-creative spells and systems. But if you look here NOW - what will you find? About 4/5 of pending uploads are kinda like this. Yes, we help people to make their spells better with our reviews, but sometimes we just face ignorance or belief in being an outstanding codder with even Wait actions in five line scripts.

I for one recently submitted a spell to the spell section - it was poorly written and did not follow the standards. It is no longer on the spell section, evidently it should have gone to the trigger and script section - because I needed help. The problem was finding the help I needed.

I agree with Aspard - it's crucial that those with knowledge help those without. The thing I've noticed is the Spell section recently have been overrulled by spells lately. I joined somewhat 2008, back then one spell by month would be what I could find. Thehiveworkshop has grown to big. Direct people to the right forum - It took me time to find and use the "Forums" button .

A interresting idea to try!
Make a Mod of the month thingy, users can vote about who has been the best mod this month. Hopefully it would motivate some unmotivated mod's

 

[Pyritie]

A interresting idea to try!
Make a Mod of the month thingy, users can vote about who has been the best mod this month. Hopefully it would motivate some unmotivated mod's

Ehh... I don't really see the point of that besides another thing to increase epeens. :/

 

[Coolty44]

Well the spells section has kinda gone to waste anyway, and it'll take a long time to regroup it as a section, instead of a type of pastebin. I recently saw a spell that got rejected for using locations and needing structs... I'm not even sure if I want to really submit a spell anymore since it seems some are getting weemed out for even the smallest rules, some that don't even exist enitrly.

It needs to get picked up before we hit 15 pages, else I think it'll never regroup.

 

[Deuterium]

Well as you guys can all see... the modding scene totally changed the last two days...
The_Reborn_Devil who has been recently recruited is doing a good job, Hanky is also trying to squeeze a few reviews through his busy day, and it seems like hvo is back and reviewing spells.

So as you can see, the numbers are back dropping and section is getting cleaned.

Now it's all about giving the mods the time to clean up the section.

 

[Rmx]

All hail to SEED lol

 

[Shdow89]

I agree with Deuterium 100 %. When I started making spells about 2 years ago (yes, they were GUI), mods then would review a spell in a matter of 10 to 20 days. And that was OK. Now, I'm seeing spells that are months and months old, makes you really wonder what's going on.

And, yes, I agree with people that say that section needs more mods. Why? Because it's only logical, if one or two mods are unavailable there's always someone else to back them up. And I gotta admit that The_Reborn_Devil, started off very serious and his doing a good job so far.

Excellent post Deu, and I hope for a better future of spell section .

 

[PurplePoot]

I agree with Deuterium 100 %. When I started making spells about 2 years ago (yes, they were GUI), mods then would review a spell in a matter of 10 to 20 days. And that was OK. Now, I'm seeing spells that are months and months old, makes you really wonder what's going on.

Less submissions is why. That and wyrm, myself, DSG, and whoever else were spell moderators had no life.

 

[Dentothor]

i think this should happen for the icon section as well...

 

[Azeroc]

In this whole thread I support idea about "Mod's workpower", as said, spells could just take, minimum, few mins to some half hour.

 

[TriggerHappy]

A lot of spells can't simply be approved on the spot. You need to give some suggestions and wait until the spell submitter takes in those suggestions. Just because a mod does 5 reviews a day doesn't mean the spells will be approved that day. So you may see the pending spell count rise. Part of it has to do with inactive members taking days or weeks to reply to the thread. And even then they don't fix everything.

So you see, it takes effort on both spell submitters and moderators to clear out the pending spell section. Though I must admit i do see a lot of spells or systems that have had no reviews at all. But I have been doing reviews like crazy so hopefully we will see the pending spells decrease over time.

 

[Pyritie]

You need to give some suggestions and wait until the spell submitter takes in those suggestions.

Protip: Use the "Rejected (until updated)" status for reviewed spells that need work but shouldn't be rejected or approved. Leaving them in Pending lets other users still see and search for them so there's less motivation to fix them. Plus if they never bother to update them then you won't have to worry about anything

 

[-Berz-]

I still think that submitting a spell trigger is a must. And it should be one of the main rules.

As I said before, I'm pretty sure that everyone looks at the spell code first. And this would save a lot of time, because you don't need to download, and open it manually(maybe you're on a PC that doesn't have WC3 installed) So you can still "moderate" it in some way. you know what i mean?

 

[Azeroc]

Py told me that Spell Moderators can see spell triggers automatically in posted spell thread.

 

[-Berz-]

Py told me that Spell Moderators can see spell triggers automatically in posted spell thread.

I didn't know that, but as I asked some people they said it's true

 

[Shdow89]

Py told me that Spell Moderators can see spell triggers automatically in posted spell thread.

I don't see a reason why other users, wouldn't have this advantage . Most of users post the code in spell description, anyway.

 

[Azeroc]

Most of users post the code in spell description, anyway.

Well, I guess they don't know about that "Automatic Code/Trigger seeing for moderators".

 

[Deuterium]

Well I think that's how it's being now... haven't been around much, but now there are The_Reborn_Devil and TriggerHappy187 who are 2 new active mods =)

 

[Saia_Djinn]

i can also help on this reviewing spells and purge the section