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Zephyr Contest #14, Theme poll

Theme for Zephyr #14

  • Unit manipulation

    Votes: 2 9.1%
  • Tribute

    Votes: 5 22.7%
  • Unique Summoning

    Votes: 16 72.7%
  • Skillshot

    Votes: 6 27.3%
  • Line of Sight

    Votes: 4 18.2%
  • Diversity

    Votes: 7 31.8%
  • Explosion

    Votes: 1 4.5%
  • Immobilize

    Votes: 1 4.5%
  • Reanimation

    Votes: 4 18.2%
  • Undead

    Votes: 3 13.6%
  • Object Editor Spells

    Votes: 9 40.9%

  • Total voters
    22
  • Poll closed .
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Zephyr #14, Theme poll
These are the suggested themes for the contest.
Please, vote for the theme/s you are interest in.


Theme
Description

Unit manipulationTake over controll of units ( throw, draw, confuse, ... etc)
TributeCreate a spell that has direct impact on caster and the target.
For instance some sort of drawback to a units vitality. An example would
be Double-Edge from DotA / DotA2.
Unique SummoningCreate a spell that summons one or many units in a unique way.
Eventually consider implementing a specific unit/s behaviour after summoning.
A good example is Tinker's Pocket Factory.
SkillshotCreate a spell that requires accurate timing and tact to succeed.
Examples of this kind are Pudge's Meat Hook and Invoker's Sun Strike.
Line of SightCreate a spell that affects unit in a line. An example would be Impale.
DiversityCreate a spell which concept is seperated in at least 2 phases.
This theme would give participants a lot of creative freedom.
ExplosionCreate a spell that is based on explosions, grenade-throwing spells.
Also consider a good mix out of special effect/s and usefulness.
ImmobilizeCreate a spell that stop movement in a unique way.
ReanimationMake a spell which has an involvement with bringing alive the dead.
It has similarity to the Corpse Theme but this one is more focused on Summoning the dead.
UndeadMake a spell which has an involvement with the dead.
Something like giving bonus stats when you're around the dead or anything else that you have in mind.
Object Editor SpellsWrap your spell around default Warcraft III abilities from the object editor
or alternatively remake and enhance an Object Editor Spell from the ground.
You should stick relative close to the core conception of that spell.


Theme Discussion
 
Level 11
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I voted for Unique Summoning, Skillshot and Object Editor Spells.

For some reason I would really enjoy recreating an existing spell and make it much more flexible with code. It was my absolute first priority, but seeing how there were multiple choices, voted for these two as well.

EDIT: This seems like a battle between diversity and Unique Summoning :p.

unique summoning pls
 
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Ardenian

A

Ardenian

Seems Unique Summoning is winning.
A challenging theme, isn't it.
 
When I learned jass I kinda feel like that's unfair, jass may be better but it's also more difficult.

Using GUI or JASS or vJASS doesn't affect the score(or well... they do, but a little)

I once joined Zephyr, submitted a GUI spell and won second place (behind Tank)

the last Zephyr I also joined, I also submitted in GUI and placed on second again(but that was because we are only 3 competitors)
 

Chaosy

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Using GUI or JASS or vJASS doesn't affect the score(or well... they do, but a little)
Which is wrong. If I convert a decent GUI spell to JASS (without changing anything) it will get a horrible score 3/10 at best (if the rater is REALLY kind). But if I don't convert it it might get a 5-6/10

I want to create my spells and systems in zinc these days but I know I will get a lower score by doing so. Compared to me creating the same thing in GUI.
This can be shown by me submitting quite a few of them in the spell section, not a single one is anywhere close to approval. (though they are MUI/MPI and fully working and likely more efficient than any GUI spell/system)
 
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Using GUI is okay and using JASS is okay.

If one uses GUI, it will be harder to write complex stuff and using all the given JASS capabilities.
If you directly use JASS, it will be easier to write appropriated code.

How ever, no matter in which layout you code, it will be judged how you could do it, and how you actually did.
If you did it in the GUI-best-possible way, it is perfect. If you convert it to JASS, and it becomes a bad way, compared to your possibilies, it will become worse.

The layout, in which how ever you write, can limit the one or other idea in final execution, and so might also affect the concept/mechanics of an submission. In theory. :)
 
I see Custom Script as JASS, and would judge it like one.
Bribe probably did keep it "GUI" to provide a GUI-user friendly layout. Sometimes they might be even scared of only reading commenty/examples in JASS style.^^

Readability is for example also something that affects the coding score.
I find it that it easily gets unreadable if you write with custom scripts very much. (so you see it could affect some criteria of coding) But in this example by Bribe, he handled it pretty well and kept it clean.

My personal tip:
You basicly can try to take advantage of Custom Scripts, of course, but my suggestion is to keep the purpose clean, and not to create inconsistent code, which suffers much from uniformity and readability.
 
That would be a pretty dull contest, since originality would have a lower factor and it would be vJASS spells with tons of lib requirements that would dominate the contest.

Zephyr has always been about coding. Creativity and visuals come behind it. Also, from what I can remember, using multiple libraries will hurt your score since your "spell" would end up showcasing the systems you used, and not your actual code.

Anyway, I don't understand the debate here. GUI has more breathing room in terms of how many mistakes you can make, but GUI becomes extremely disgusting to look at (and that means something coming from someone who prefers to use GUI over JASS) when you start to add complex mechanics, resulting in convoluted code (which will affect your score). The Zephyr judges are also most likely JASS/vJASS proficient, meaning that they will most likely hate looking at GUI code. There is no advantage over the other.
 

Chaosy

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If I make spell in GUI and save it.
Then I make a copy of that GUI trigger so I got 2x of them.

I then convert one of the two GUI ones to jass and remove some BJ functions, clean up the code a little etc, etc.

Which one will get the highest rating? the GUI one.
Which is the best coded? the JASS one.

Not fair. I understand that favoring JASS will reduce the number of contestants by a whole lot though.
 
If I convert a GUI spell to jass it will get the shittiest rating ever, because the rules are more harsh.
Well I guess it kind of goes in hand that a GUI spell should be judged as a GUI spell, and a JASS spell should be judged as a JASS spell. I personally think one should be docked a few points for not utilizing the tools (maximum potential) you have. One also has to remember that readability is an important aspect of coding. I personally think readability is more important than efficiency, and JASS has the clear upperhand here.
 

Chaosy

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To be honest it should be GUI spells vs GUI spells and jass vs jass.

This may sound sexist but male and female football players do not play against each other because it ruins the competitive aspect when one has the upper hand.

You don't make them play and remove two male players to make it fair, or make the females start with 2 goals. Or allow the females to play with their hands in addition to their feet.
 
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