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Beyond the Throne: Tides of Darkness

Kam

Kam

Kam

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I have a surprise for you made possible by Remixer:
 

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Kam

Kam

Kam

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There will be an update before the 5th. Two of the maps will have new terrain in addition to the continued balance work.

A special thanks to infrenus for help in modeling.

Edit: Exams and such. I'll work on getting the update out before Friday. All that's left is completing the new terrain.
 

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SeedinAethyr

SeedinAethyr

SeedinAethyr

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I just recently became obsessed with altered melee maps and as of now, Beyond The Throne is my favorite altered melee.
I got into Beyond The Throne when my friend persuaded me to play a "really cool altered melee with three races". I played my first game of BtT as the Seed (duh) and was amazed by the uniqueness of the race. However, I was destroyed pretty easily since I made lots of Beasts and my friend's hero killed them all and got very strong. I played a few more games with him, but I didn't understand the race and got destroyed every time. (I did not want to play the Orcs or Humans, mostly because the Seed was so epic to play as.) I got frustrated after I failed to beat my friend (and the AI). So I gave up trying to win, and stopped playing Beyond The Throne for awhile (maybe a year or so). Then my friend told me to play Beyond The Throne again and I decided to try it (again). This time, the map was Paradise Shoals and I was human. The game (not the map) wasn't that good, because my friend apparently was having horrible lag problems and had to leave (or maybe that was an excuse to leave after I killed his army?) However, I was really impressed (again) by the uniqueness of all the Human's abilities and structures and stuff. So I decided to try it again in singleplayer (where my opponents would not leave) and fell in love with the map.
It's amazingly polished and I love all the custom models. The spells are really unique, especially the hero spells. I really like how you implemented navy and the terrain is really well made. It looks nice and it works well in combat. The Lost is a really awesome and unique race, but they seem to get too much gold lategame if they get more than two mines (which is pretty easy to do since corrupting a gold mine isn't that expensive and food is not required to harvest gold, because the Lost don't need workers to harvest.) Are they supposed to create masses of Shamblers augmented by a few other units? Also, Terminus Cruxs aren't repairable by Fulgors or Shadows, a Monolith is required to heal them. Is this intentional? I also noticed that Essence has a [Level 1] attached to it, does it have different levels? The Lost's workers also seem very vulnerable to air attacks, and if the Lost loses a lot of its workers, it becomes very weak. I think the Void Aid should be unsummonable or self-destructable, since it loses its use after the items are bought. I don't see too much of a use for the Adjutant, mostly because it doesn't have any way to directly deal damage to enemies. The Humans and Orcs are really well made and I don't think I can say anything bad about them. They seem quite balanced but are pretty different from one another, which is a cool thing. Lastly, I think that the Relic is a really cool neutral building.
The dedication you put into this is really astounding, and I'm commend you for making these maps.
(Also, I know that you removed the Seed, but I liked playing around with them in singleplayer and am curious to know whether you have any more maps than the one I played with my friend. It was a 9 player circular map.)
 

Kam

Kam

Kam

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SeedinAethyr said:
I just recently became obsessed with altered melee maps and as of now, Beyond The Throne is my favorite altered melee.
I got into Beyond The Throne when my friend persuaded me to play a "really cool altered melee with three races". I played my first game of BtT as the Seed (duh) and was amazed by the uniqueness of the race. However, I was destroyed pretty easily since I made lots of Beasts and my friend's hero killed them all and got very strong. I played a few more games with him, but I didn't understand the race and got destroyed every time. (I did not want to play the Orcs or Humans, mostly because the Seed was so epic to play as.) I got frustrated after I failed to beat my friend (and the AI). So I gave up trying to win, and stopped playing Beyond The Throne for awhile (maybe a year or so). Then my friend told me to play Beyond The Throne again and I decided to try it (again). This time, the map was Paradise Shoals and I was human. The game (not the map) wasn't that good, because my friend apparently was having horrible lag problems and had to leave (or maybe that was an excuse to leave after I killed his army?) However, I was really impressed (again) by the uniqueness of all the Human's abilities and structures and stuff. So I decided to try it again in singleplayer (where my opponents would not leave) and fell in love with the map.
It's amazingly polished and I love all the custom models. The spells are really unique, especially the hero spells. I really like how you implemented navy and the terrain is really well made. It looks nice and it works well in combat. The Lost is a really awesome and unique race, but they seem to get too much gold lategame if they get more than two mines (which is pretty easy to do since corrupting a gold mine isn't that expensive and food is not required to harvest gold, because the Lost don't need workers to harvest.) Are they supposed to create masses of Shamblers augmented by a few other units? Also, Terminus Cruxs aren't repairable by Fulgors or Shadows, a Monolith is required to heal them. Is this intentional? I also noticed that Essence has a [Level 1] attached to it, does it have different levels? The Lost's workers also seem very vulnerable to air attacks, and if the Lost loses a lot of its workers, it becomes very weak. I think the Void Aid should be unsummonable or self-destructable, since it loses its use after the items are bought. I don't see too much of a use for the Adjutant, mostly because it doesn't have any way to directly deal damage to enemies. The Humans and Orcs are really well made and I don't think I can say anything bad about them. They seem quite balanced but are pretty different from one another, which is a cool thing. Lastly, I think that the Relic is a really cool neutral building.
The dedication you put into this is really astounding, and I'm commend you for making these maps.
(Also, I know that you removed the Seed, but I liked playing around with them in singleplayer and am curious to know whether you have any more maps than the one I played with my friend. It was a 9 player circular map.)
Click to expand...

It is satisfying to read that someone likes my project this much. I will endeavor to keep you interested.

I liked the Seed. In the end though I felt they did not fit in the Warcraft universe as their own race. Some of their features made it into the Lost, most notably the "portal" hero ultimate. In the update I'm working on for the end of this week there is a new Lost hero that sort of embodies the Seed.

I work hard to insure that custom resources are used in logical places. Polish is important to me.
-I looked at the Terminus Crux and had not noticed that issue. I will fix it.
-Shamblers are the heart of your army, but they are certainly not an end all unit. Think of them as a strong support base for other units.
-The Monolith is being merged with another structure.
-Essence used to be based on a more complex leveling system that was based on the number of a certain building you had. This proved tedious for players.
-Items sold by the Void Aide refresh after a time.
-The Adjutant is a support hero. It's ultimate is probably the best in the game. In the next update it will have a basic attack.
-The resource intake is carefully balanced for the Lost. Many of the upgrades are expensive. Part of the logic behind the gold rate is that you may not be the most effective at monitoring units health. It's easy to forget that units are losing health off blight. Your opponent may also learn to force you to engage in combat off blight. I am always balancing though.

I do not have any more maps with the Seed, however I did release the race open source so you could add them to any map you wanted:

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/idea-factory-462/seed-race-159369/

The upcoming patch is significant for the Lost particularly. I will be done with university for a time after this week. I would be happy to play a game with you.
 

Kam

Kam

Kam

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Thanks to SeedinAethyr I have made a small update that corrects a few oversights.

One bug I was not able to determine the cause of has to do with the Soul Imitation racial ability Humans have. Please post any details about this bug if you encounter it.

I'm looking at some changes to the Bulwark in the next update. I'd like to replace Pressure Mine with something more useful. The Ogre Magnate model will likely see a change as well.
 
Last edited:

Kam

Kam

Kam

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JCarrill0 said:
Kam, lets talk Campaign!
Click to expand...

What did you have in mind?

The story I developed for the Lost is fairly forward. It would not be difficult to adapt to a campaign. However time is the issue for me. I would be able to complete a small campaign, but nothing as lengthy as the vanilla campaigns.

The Lost:

As the Undead Scourge was cleansed and the lands of Azeroth recovered from the devastation lain upon them cooperation began to waiver among the two dominant races. In the outlying territories where resources were thin, and the peace was not so easily enforced, conflict soon broke out. As the fighting escalated a new and frightening enemy crawled from the ruins of the past to settle the future.

---

Following the battle at the World Tree and defeat of the Scourge much of the conquered Undead lands were reclaimed for the living. There were numerous abandoned facilities in remote locations that were never found by Alliance forces. With most of the living focusing on hunting remnants of the Scourge or rebuilding there was little interest in searching the wilds for empty structures. Upon Illidan's death and the seemingly benign reign of Arthas in the far North a tenuous peace began between the Orc and Human forces.

Years of strained cooperation passed.

On the outer fringes much of the old tensions remained active in spilled blood. Territory was constantly being fought over. All were oblivious to what was coming.

---

At the behest of the Burning Legion Undead researchers began looking for sources of energy to sustain the Scourge. In the darkest hours before the final battle there was success, although those responsible knew nothing of their accomplishments as the facility was consumed in an instant. Out of desperation the consequences of their dark magics had been ignored. A slight dimensional tear had been opened - to where was not known. As the years passed the rift slowly expanded consuming its tomb of debris until the ground was void of substance. Sinister magics began to flow into Azeroth as the swirling nethers of the Second War had, darker than even Archimonde could have summoned.
 

JCarrill0

JCarrill0

JCarrill0

Level 16
Joined
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Messages
1,207
Kam said:
What did you have in mind?

The story I developed for the Lost is fairly forward. It would not be difficult to adapt to a campaign. However time is the issue for me. I would be able to complete a small campaign, but nothing as lengthy as the vanilla campaigns.

The Lost:

As the Undead Scourge was cleansed and the lands of Azeroth recovered from the devastation lain upon them cooperation began to waiver among the two dominant races. In the outlying territories where resources were thin, and the peace was not so easily enforced, conflict soon broke out. As the fighting escalated a new and frightening enemy crawled from the ruins of the past to settle the future.

---

Following the battle at the World Tree and defeat of the Scourge much of the conquered Undead lands were reclaimed for the living. There were numerous abandoned facilities in remote locations that were never found by Alliance forces. With most of the living focusing on hunting remnants of the Scourge or rebuilding there was little interest in searching the wilds for empty structures. Upon Illidan's death and the seemingly benign reign of Arthas in the far North a tenuous peace began between the Orc and Human forces.

Years of strained cooperation passed.

On the outer fringes much of the old tensions remained active in spilled blood. Territory was constantly being fought over. All were oblivious to what was coming.

---

At the behest of the Burning Legion Undead researchers began looking for sources of energy to sustain the Scourge. In the darkest hours before the final battle there was success, although those responsible knew nothing of their accomplishments as the facility was consumed in an instant. Out of desperation the consequences of their dark magics had been ignored. A slight dimensional tear had been opened - to where was not known. As the years passed the rift slowly expanded consuming its tomb of debris until the ground was void of substance. Sinister magics began to flow into Azeroth as the swirling nethers of the Second War had, darker than even Archimonde could have summoned.
Click to expand...

Very nice, Well if time is against ya, why not make a demo campaign of the LOST. 4 maps is normally what they do, and I would absolutely LOVE to see your maps campaign style!
 

Retera

Retera

Retera

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Are there any BtT games going to be played this weekend at the funmap evening thing? Last time they had one of those funmap evenings I mostly missed it, but since it's the occasion I'd be happy to try to find some time to test this thing out multiplayer with some of you guys and see how the balance is doing.
 

JCarrill0

JCarrill0

JCarrill0

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TaShadan said:
Those guys hardly play altered melee. If someone wants to play 1on1 just msg me.
Click to expand...

I'm a newb to BtT, but I love to play altered melee Maps, and BtT is one of my favs (Along with your wc2.5 ofc), I just never have people on Bnet to play.
SUGGESTIONS:
  1. If this is a melee map, maybe have a Melee Loading screen instead of custom.
  2. Put what version this is in the Description or Map Name
  3. Instead of having a second Worker, perhaps use an "advanced build" option. There is several ways to do it.
 
Last edited:

Kam

Kam

Kam

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I chose the custom screen because none of the included screens make sense and I don't want to import one.

The version is actually there in map selection but the formatting made it not show, it will be fixed.

The issues with the advanced build options are: 1) You end up getting weird bugs where it switches between the two dummy abilities, and 2) AI has no idea what to do with it.
 

JCarrill0

JCarrill0

JCarrill0

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Joined
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Messages
1,207
Kam said:
I chose the custom screen because none of the included screens make sense and I don't want to import one.
Click to expand...
I say that because the loading screen is empty anyways, so why not just disable it and have it show who's loading and who is done loading and waiting for others in the load? When you have a custom loading screen you cant see who's loading but yourself. It's nice to see when you have multiple player loading. Just a suggestion.
 
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