Why are WoW models not allowed?

[brad.dude03]

BS... in 2002 WC# was hardly done, let alone TFT. That's total lies. WoW wasn't even imagined until at least after TFT was done.

Future expansions... who the feck cares? One word buddy, we all know it anyway: Northrend.

Bah.

 

[Zieg]

wow was in its conceptual stage before warcraft 3 was finished. not much was done with it at the time but the basic idea was there. after frozen throne was done work on wow was in full swing. you have to realize that blizzard isnt just a group of people working on 1 game at a time. there full of dozens of groups working on differant games at one time. so dont cry bullshit unless you really know for sure.

heres some basic facts that everyone knows.

frozen throne was released Jul 1, 2003
wow was released Nov 23, 2004

so your telling me wow was thought up just after frozen throne was released, all models done and made, all skills thought up and balanced, all in little over 1 year. hate to tell you but wow has been in development since at least 2001 when the idea was first thought up. as i said in 2002 we got our first look at it. so smartass what do you think now.

 

[brad.dude03]

Yawn, it still doesn't add up at all for me. They may have had the CONCEPT perhaps of making an MMO, but none of the details could be done, because until TFT was done they probably had no idea where things were actually going with the story, ETC. I have a very hard time believing that WoW has been in development as long or longer then WC3.

 

[Zieg]

blizzard has numerous games in development that hasnt even seen the light of day yet. you can not even begin to make a mmo as big as wow in 2 years let alone 1. hell blizzard is going to show the world this month there new game thats being released. and you say that they made an entire game from the moment burning crusade got released till now. no sir you have to add a few years to each game thats released. and warcraft 3 has been in development since the late 90s. each game no matter who does it takes 3-5 years to complete. we are the ones who only see the game in its later phase when its officially going to be "released". if an idea blizzard has goes to the trash, nobody knew about the game in the first place so it didnt really exist.

 

[Kimbo]

I don't think you realize this.. but your discussion isn't relevant, even if it includes the word "WoW" in it.

 

[Zieg]

thats what i was trying to tell that other mod but he never listens lol. this thread is not meant for this kind of discussion but he felt because it was dealing with wow that it HAD to be put in this thread.

 

[brad.dude03]

It doesn't matter whether it's relevent or not, I've been through this a thousand times with you people. When a thread reaches the point where all discussion about then original topic has been rsolved and is finished, conversation will immediately and subconsciously switch to a NEW topic that is vaguely related to the last. This is what happened here, and I don't think it's against the rules, because until some other noob comes along and starts the discussion again, there is nothing to worry about.

Learn 2 Deal.

 

[Mecheon]

TFT uses WoW models. Its a fact of life

WoW was in production while TFT was being made. Though WoW was an absolute pre-beta, but you can tell due to filenames, and the presence of the Dragonspawn creeps. Blizzard are lazy. You don't have to be

 

[GST_Nemisis]

you know they have more than one development team right? there is a team working on SC2 and a team on TBC and a team probably making a new WoW expantion and there probably a team making a new Diablo or Wc4 or something. they all work with each other but the development process is independant of the other teams. so chances are WoW had been in development when wc3 was and was probably 50% done when TFT was released.

 

[Paapuli]

No way...

I think the use of WoW models should be allowed, it's after all us who has been given the advantage to make and use custom player-made models.

And i don't actually think that there were any restrictions to the use of custom made models in the contract when i purhaced Wc3.

In my opinion, this is just yet another way to make something that is wanted to be seized, just more interesting.

 

[brad.dude03]

Uh, no, it isn't.

1) No they shouldn't
2) Yes, to MAKE not to rip out of another game and use ILLEGALLY for your map.
3) Yes there are. Check the EULA and then if that comes up short, check the law. Your using the intellectual property of one game in another, and that's illegal. It doesn't matter that both games are made by Blizzard.

Alright, who's next >.>

 

[Pyritie]

pwnt.

 

[GST_Nemisis]

would you allowed to edit a wow model so that it is based on it but not the same, such as a reskin of a wow model?

 

[Pyritie]

It can't just be a reskin. It has to look very different. Olof made two models based off of a WoW model: The crystal one and the helldragon one.

Crystal
- removed wings
- fixed tail
- added icicles down its back
- doubled the layers as to have that "crystal" effect

Helldragon
- Skin is 100% freehand
- added lots of particle emitters

Unless you can make it look completely different, there are always going to be people who don't like it.

 

[brad.dude03]

A reskin, no, unless it's for a heavily edited WoW model.

As far as I know (and in my opinion) the only models that are related to WoW that we accept should be those that are BASED OFF OF but are done completely freehand. That way, even though you're making it in the likeness of the WoW model, it is your property and you made it yourself.

This way, unlike the WoW rips, the model is designed for Wacraft 3, and you're not doing anything illegal.

 

[Jaakko]

EDIT: I dont get paid for a hobby of mine.

Well very few people would be paid for a hobby. Usually it is so that a person rather pays than gets money with a hobby... ^^
Hobbies are not for money, they are for fun and to fulfill ourselves.

So now maps that use wow models are not allowed? Now THAT is borderline retarded. Blizzard doesnt even look at these sites anymore, let alone threaten lawsuits against sites that host extracted models or maps that have them imported.

T H E Y

D O

N O T

C A R E

The whole "illegel illegal" whine is not only irrelevant but old and repatative as well.
-VGsatomi

Agreed. But on the other hand I don't either care will this site host WoW models or not.

 

[brad.dude03]

If VG thinks that it's legal, then that's great. This isn't WC3sear.ch, though, and it seems that some people haven't accepted that yet. We have our own policies and rules, and regardless of what was allowed then, this is how things are now.

If you find a need to constantly question our rules and policies, then I recommend finding another WC3 site to browse.

We still don't allow WoW models, no matter how much complaining you people do.

Mind you, we do accept: Models that are BASED off of a WoW model. For example, if you had an image of a Blood Elf Mage character, and you used that image to help you make your model 100% from scratch, then it's fine.

We just don't want people to take the models directly out of the game and try and put them into WC3 maps. It doesn't require any talent, there are a myriad of problems with it, and it is on very fine legal ground (I think it's a grey area as of now, since you are literally stealing someone else's copyrighted work, and using it for your own purposes, without the expressed permission of the owner). I'm no expert in law, but it sounds quite illegal to me.

A grey area in our policy (to my knowledge, anyway) is optimized WoW models. These are models taken from the game, but they are changed, and corrected in order to work with WC3. Animations are deleted, polycount is reduced, etc, in order to use the model (or a number of them in most cases) in a normal, multiplayer Battle.Net game. Our stance is undetermined as far as I know, so I think it would be wise to figure this out as well.

 

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

Even if it is illegal, not even the guys who made the models care.

But rejecting maps with WoW models is going a little far.
If you cut off access to the ressources, new maps will eventually have less WoW models in them.
Besides, it should be something frowned upon (as in, its ugly, doesn't fit in the game, too many polies, etc...) but not rejected.

 

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

It can't just be a reskin. It has to look very different. Olof made two models based off of a WoW model: The crystal one and the helldragon one.

Crystal
- removed wings
- fixed tail
- added icicles down its back
- doubled the layers as to have that "crystal" effect

Helldragon
- Skin is 100% freehand
- added lots of particle emitters

Unless you can make it look completely different, there are always going to be people who don't like it.

Sorry for double post, but yes it can be a reskin. A COMPLETE reskin. Well, I hope. To me that is enough of a change. But then again, some other MDL editing is always helpful.

 

[Chaos Overlord]

A grey area in our policy (to my knowledge, anyway) is optimized WoW models. These are models taken from the game, but they are changed, and corrected in order to work with WC3. Animations are deleted, polycount is reduced, etc, in order to use the model (or a number of them in most cases) in a normal, multiplayer Battle.Net game. Our stance is undetermined as far as I know, so I think it would be wise to figure this out as well.

Why would people even put WoW models into their maps anyways? They would completely fill the map size ont ehir own and then what? You got one cool looking thing and then you don't even have room to make all the features for your map. brad.dude pointed out the only way that they are even worth using but that probably takes a while and is really unnesacary (I slaughtered that word). There are lots of models that would be fine in maps instead of WoW models.

 

[Pyritie]

Sorry for double post, but yes it can be a reskin. A COMPLETE reskin. Well, I hope. To me that is enough of a change. But then again, some other MDL editing is always helpful.

True, things like removing unneeded animations, adding attachment points and event sounds, etc.

 

[Captain Griffen]

Is using or allowing WoW models good practise?

No.

No one has given any logical arguments as to why it is.

 

[Horn]

The fact that Blizzard have spotlighted maps with wow models...

 

[Pyritie]

Like which ones?

 

[brad.dude03]

Not Blizzard, but Battle.Net. Battle.Net is independant from Blizzard in a sense, and I don't think their spotlighting really amounts to anything. The one map that they did splotlight, Molten Core,w as an absolute piece of shit.

The rogue was rigged as hell, took all of the aggro, and most of the game was in French.

Spotlight? I think not.

 

[Pyritie]

Ouch.

 

[Horn]

Molten Core,w as an absolute piece of shit.
The rogue was rigged as hell, took all of the aggro, and most of the game was in French.

Like that really has any place in the discussion.

It's a map Blizzard spotlighted and it has wow rips in it.

 

[brad.dude03]

Well, unlike the rest of these knobs, I try to bring some facts to the table. It wouldn't be right for me to just call it a piece of shit, I felt I had to explain *why* it was a piece of shit even though Battle.Net spotlighted it.

I used it to point out that Battle.Net spotlights random garbage, so it doesn't really matter in this discussion.

 

[Horn]

Battle.net is run by Blizzard employees.

Battle.net is the platform for all legal Blizzard games to be played in multiplayer.

Battle.net spotlights maps with Wow rips.

The only knob here is you if you're going to ignore such facts.

So, clearly, Blizzard have no problem with Wow models in their maps. The only problem they'd have is distributing their resources outside their games. But then this site already does that with every resource available here.

 

[brad.dude03]

What you just said was all fine and great.

But the fact remains.

the Hive Workshop will not tolerate anything at all to do with WoW models.

You lose.

 

[Horn]

What do I lose exactly? I won a 'logical argument', you utterly failed at yours and you succumbed to insults first.

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

A policy succeeds all logical argument. Rules are steel, philosophers aren't. It's just that simple. If this thread was discussing what the rules were, I would have sided with Brad. However, this is not the case, in that this thread is asking why, in fact, are WoW models not allowed. Therefore, we are not asking about what are the rules, but why the rules are this way. I reluctantly have to agree with Whitehorn. He hasn't lost anything.

 

[HappyTauren]

Its immoral. End of story.

 

[Killer_Girl1]

I don't see why we can't put wow models on because i know that wc3 campaign's supports the use of wow model's give credit and most likely you can put them on or develop a system to make it easier to get people to submit the model without taking full credit.

 

[Kimbo]

wc3c does NOT support them...and its been like that for at least a year now.

 

[Deleted member 126647]

I don't see why we can't put wow models on because i know that wc3 campaign's supports the use of wow model's

Learn to read up on your material before you use false claims to justify something. If you believe this to be true, why not take a trip over there and request some WoW models? See the warm welcome.

 

[brad.dude03]

Precisely.

NO ONE (Except maybe the noob communities) supports the use of WoW models, so stop freaking asking.

No matter how much you whine, it's not going to change. We're NEVER going to allow WoW models, unless some hellbent loser manages to change international copyright law, in which case we might review the scenario again.

 

[Killer_Girl1]

I never said i wanted wow model's to be in here.

 

[brad.dude03]

Indirectly you did. You said you couldn't see why we couldn't have WoW models, so yes, in fact, you did say that you wanted WoW models on this site.

Make up your freaking mind.

 

[HappyTauren]

You wouldnt be able to upload wow model. Why? It was NOT made by you.

 

[Killer_Girl1]

Don't want to upload wow models anyway i like the regular models and the models made by the great people on here.

 

[Pyritie]

Did you even read the thread title?

 

[pandamanana]

Okay people... you can stop dumping on the n00bs...

but seriously if we are allowed to use WoW Icons in our warcraft maps why can't we use WoW models? Personally I don't care but Wc3Campaigns.net rejected my FAVORITE map of all time AotZ, untill Chriz here and some other peeps fixed up a new Scamp model. (which is AWESOME btw)

 

[Magoo 111]

I saw this topic and just felt I wanted to post me two cents.

If I offend ANYONE in any way, I am deeply sorry, as I do not wish to start an arguement here.



Anyways, I agree full-heartedly that WoW models, seperate from a map, should be prohibited from being posted. They are NOT your property, they belong to Blizzard. Sure, I hate Blizz now for ruining Warcraft lore, but I respect their property.

On the other hand, I believe it silly to not allow a map or campaign(my appologies for bad spelling) to be uploaded JUST because of using WoW models.

Prohibiting the up-loading of those resources themselves is one thing, but to prohibit the final product is a bit rude.


My two cents, where both sides can find a man who agrees.

 

[Wolverabid]

Guys we have been over this a million times: please, please, please read the entire thread and understand its contents before posting. Thanks.

No WoW MODELS (or models extracted from other games) will be approved in our resource section. Maps are an entirely separate issue and are evaluated differently. It's up to the map moderator's discretion as to whether or not to approve them: submit maps that include WoW models at your own risk- there are no guarantees.

 

[HappyTauren]

it has become really hard to read whole thread wolve, i think last couple pages are enough.

 

[Magoo 111]

Indeed..which I did read.

It was just my two cents, and, like I said, I didn't want to provoke anything from it.

 

[Kitabatake]

WoW icons?

but seriously if we are allowed to use WoW Icons in our warcraft maps why can't we use WoW models?

Hmm yea, if WoW models are prohibited, why aren't WoW icons prohibited as well? They're also made by blizzard.

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but I don't have time to start searching 14 pages...

 

[Pyritie]

Blizzard put up most of their WoW icons on the bnet site, free for download. Ralle then went and put them all on the hive too. WoW's models were never released by blizzard, and so using them is immoral.

 

[Fulla]

Blizzard released the icons as open source, but the models werent.

Ppl take the Models out of the WoW mpq and convert them thereselves.
Many ppl here consider that stealing.