Warcraft 3 Reforged

[YourArthas]

I know they said that, but they also said that beta will at the begining 2019. They'll probabaly just keep quiet about that part, it wouldn't be the first time a game is late(nor the last). Besides realeasing a game with 0 promotion, however unimportant it may be, is imo just rediculous.

It won't happen due to both laws, avoiding facing lawsuits and when Blizzard gives a date they don't fail at it, you can say game will be completely broken sure it has a 90% chance if you ask me, but it will arrive in 2019 for sure

 

[Verb8im]

I know they said that, but they also said that beta will at the begining 2019. They'll probabaly just keep quiet about that part, it wouldn't be the first time a game is late(nor the last). Besides realeasing a game with 0 promotion, however unimportant it may be, is imo just rediculous.

I mean, literally nobody knew Apex Legends existed until it released

 

[deepstrasz]

Didn't they usually release one game per year or so in Novemenber?

 

[MasterBlaster]

They are 100% going to release by the end of the year.

The way I remember, Blizzard usually releases their games or content updates towards the end of the estimated time window anyway, so as I've said before - there's no reason to panic just yet. In my opinion, they're just waiting for Blizzcon to announce the release date to potentially profit from a little bit of extra hype.

As for how stable the game is at launch... I don't think it will be that bad - the core of the game should work absolutely fine and if there are any glitches, they will probably be pretty minor and will get patched out rather quickly.

If anything, there might be some more serious problems with the editor, because if they do indeed run out of time, the editor is not really something that's absolutely necessary for most people to enjoy the game (as long as the basic functionality is there and some of the more popular maps are able to be ported or recreated, the regular player won't really notice the issues with some editor functions), so that's a fairly obvious corner that they can cut.

 

[SLICED]

Well the way thing look now....
It's not a secret that the situation in Blizzard is not good. The company needs all the cash it can get. Having only one succesful game(Overwatch) is not enough to keep a large company as Blizzard running. So they have to release as much cash grabs as they can. That's why we got WoW Classic and why we're getting Warcraft 3 Reforged. So there definitely will be Reforged.
What is obvious is that Reforged is not Blizzards priority(it's Overwatch). Warcraft related stuff aren't even second most successful Blizzard's game(it's Diablo). It's also obviouse that Reforged is a game with limited budget, that reuses HotS engine, almost all units we've seen thus far look and animate almost exactely like they do in HotS. So I personally expect it to be late and initially with a lot of bugs(last few years Blizzard developed a tendency towards buggy games). Though it "worries" me that there's still no beta. Some people say that it's a good thing and they will release it full, but I'm not convinced/sceptical, it's just not how Blizzard does things.

Idk if Overwatch is that successful anymore.. didn't WoW Classic take over the no.#1 spot in their most played/popular games list in this period ? I mean, Asmongold has been having like 35k viewers in the past days by playing Classic, and those are pretty big numbers regarding WoW on Twitch.

Leaks are not official, thus not relevant to as being non-silence.

Beta is when mostly everyone can play it.

Yeah, true about the Beta part.

However, why would the unofficial leaks not be relevant to as being non-silence ? Indeed, they're unofficial, but they are still something and they reflect the fact that something is happening, be it the design of unit/hero artworks or regional esports tournaments. I don't consider these as silence.

I think that expecting Blizzard to release Reforged "AT" Blizzcon is quite silly.

1. I don't recall Blizzard ever launching a game, a patch, or a PTR/beta during Blizzcon. Maybe there was something, but overall it's not a thing that they "do".

2. It's a bad idea to release a game AT a convention, because:

a) A lot of the developers are away from work, because they attend the convention - and when you launch a new game, there's always a risk of things going sideways, so you need these people in the office to potentially develop and release fixes in a timely manner.

b) It would be a massive middle-finger to their most loyal customers (i.e. people who actually go to Blizzcon) to release a game during the convention and tell them: "oh, we've just released a game and everyone at home can already play it, but you - our "best" customers - will have to wait until you get back home, because... fuck you.

c) It's not really smart from a PR perspective to release something during the convention, because either this thing is going to be overshadowed by other announcements or it will take attention away from whatever it is they are showing at the convention.

So, nope - Blizzcon release is NOT going to happen. My personal guess is that there will be no "beta". Instead they will show a new demo at Blizzcon and announce the release date for late November/early December.

P.S. What I've said is also true for a beta. If there is one, it will either start before (doubt it) or shortly after Blizzcon. Not during it.

You are mostly correct but I believe that when people say it's gonna release at BlizzCon, they might have meant that Blizz employees are gonna say that they will launch it at a specific date in time after BlizzCon, prior to the end of the year, possibly a Beta first and then the full game.. but idk, I kinda doubt they will ever release a Beta anymore.

 

[MasterBlaster]

You are mostly correct but I believe that when people say it's gonna release at BlizzCon, they might have meant that Blizz employees are gonna say that they will launch it at a specific date in time after BlizzCon, prior to the end of the year

Nope, I wasn't talking about a release date announcement (which I believe will happen at Blizzcon), but actual surprise release.

 

[deepstrasz]

Idk if Overwatch is that successful anymore.. didn't WoW Classic take over the no.#1 spot in their most played/popular games list in this period ? I mean, Asmongold has been having like 35k viewers in the past days by playing Classic, and those are pretty big numbers regarding WoW on Twitch.

Might just be a temporary hype.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Might just be a temporary hype.

Well, we're getting close to 1 month since Classic launched - it will be interesting to see if it maintains it's strong position after the first subscription period runs out. I somewhat expect that it will die down a little, but still be a fairly popular game, at least for as long as Blizzard keeps unlocking new content.

 

[deepstrasz]

unlocking new content.

What's new about a reboot? Actually not even a remake but a rerun.

 

[SLICED]

Might just be a temporary hype.

Oh yes, definetely. But right now, I think Classic is taking the leads in views compared to Overwatch.

 

[MasterBlaster]

According to Wowhead, the most recent patch for the Battle.net client has added a BETA option for Warcraft 3 Reforged. The beta itself is obviously not available yet, but the inclusion of references to it in the launcher strongly points towards it going live soon (i.e. most likely around Blizzcon).

@Ralle @StoPCampinGn00b @Archian - tagging you guys in case you'd want to write a news piece about this or even just to let you know that things are happening

Source: Warcraft III Reforged Beta Option Added to Launcher - Beta Near BlizzCon?

 

[YourArthas]

According to Wowhead, the most recent patch for the Battle.net client has added a BETA option for Warcraft 3 Reforged. The beta itself is obviously not available yet, but the inclusion of references to it in the launcher strongly points towards it going live soon (i.e. most likely around Blizzcon).

@Ralle @StoPCampinGn00b @Archian - tagging you guys in case you'd want to write a news piece about this or even just to let you know that things are happening

Source: Warcraft III Reforged Beta Option Added to Launcher - Beta Near BlizzCon?

It is added to bnet database as an entry, but there is no build yet but the preperations has been all made now and a build can be released in any time now basically, there is a high chance of it being announced with Blizzcon schedule that will probably be announced next week as a virtual ticket goodie. Or it can just happen near Blizzcon(before,on,or just after it) as a somewhat preorderer exclusive thing.

 

[MasterBlaster]

It is added to bnet database as an entry, but there is no build yet but the preperations has been all made now and a build can be released in any time now basically, there is a high chance of it being announced with Blizzcon schedule that will probably be announced next week as a virtual ticket goodie. Or it can just happen near Blizzcon(before,on,or just after it) as a somewhat preorderer exclusive thing.

My guess is that it will be similar to the Classic demo from last year's Blizzcon, i.e. if you buy a Virtual Ticket (or are present at the convention), you will have access to the Beta, while the actual (i.e. with more invites) Beta - if they aren't just branding the demo as a Beta - will happen shortly after Blizzcon.

Regardless, what this tells us is that it's getting really, really close, because they wouldn't be updating the launcher in preparation for the Beta if it wasn't near.

 

[YourArthas]

My guess is that it will be similar to the Classic demo from last year's Blizzcon, i.e. if you buy a Virtual Ticket (or are present at the convention), you will have access to the Beta, while the actual (i.e. with more invites) Beta - if they aren't just branding the demo as a Beta - will happen shortly after Blizzcon.

Regardless, what this tells us is that it's getting really, really close, because they wouldn't be updating the launcher in preparation for the Beta if it wasn't near.

Yeah, since they do those kind of updates just about a week before the release of the thing. We can know more about it when they announce the schedule next week and hopefully have it as a virtual ticket goodie atleast.

 

[sonphamthe11H]

:sexy:

 

[deepstrasz]

@sonphamthe11H
Reforged - Warcraft III Reforged - What we know... so far.
New Reforged Screenshots!
Reforged - Reforged beta incoming?

 

[MasterBlaster]

Art:

Warcraft III Reforged Art Assets - Loading Screens, Portraits, Campaign Screens

More screenshots:

Warcraft III Reforged Beta Client Screenshots

And how to unlock portraits:

How to Unlock Player Portraits in Warcraft III Reforged

---

These two are my favourites, great art

Spoiler

Spoiler

 

[deepstrasz]

Dark/undead Jaina skin/model (portrait)? Also the BfA Jaina version.
But yeah, you can even see female versions like the DH. I totally hate Illidan's eyes being shown though. Kills the special thing about the character, being blind.
There's also a satyr or Emerald Nightmare version for the KoG.
I guess Furion and Tyrande now have green hair.
Looks like there are two Arthas human icons, either different skin/model or one of them is the version after the character takes Frostmourne.
Not sure if orcs have their noses too small though or not.

Lol, it's not easy it's story mode. Talk about politically correct but then does that make you abnormal not playing the normal difficulty?

These two are my favourites, great art

Ha-ha they dressed the archer up.

Ah OK, the last link confirms the icons, so indeed Emerald Nightmare KoG (Cenarius), Frostmourne wielding Arthas, and the Dark Jaina was actually a female Death Knight.

The Spirit Walker looks too brutish for a spell caster.
The Wind Rider is a bit too different from the original but you get used to it wearing a skull instead of a stuffed head.
Grom's icon isn't that representative except for the eyes.
Peons look as if they were possessed and it's not the chaos version.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Yeah, the NE Archer was more sexy in the original and she's obviously been covered up to make the game more "politically correct"... but the armor is actually nice and come to think of it, it kinda does make sense that she isn't going into battle half-naked. So yeah, I'm a bit torn on this.

I like some icons/portraits more and some less, but still - I think that overall they've done a pretty good job and if this was Warcraft 4, I don't think many people would be complaining. Still, it's rather obvious that "Reforged" is closer to "Reimagined" than "Recreated" Personally I don't really mind it, but I can understand people who feel like it's too big of a departure from the original.

---

Some more cool stuff:

1. Blizzard & Flamestrike animations/spell effects:

Stevan Mitrovic on Twitter

Stevan Mitrovic on Twitter

2. Male Paladin in-game:

3. Orc Peon:

---

My comment:

1. Spell effects look absolutely amazing, but I'm really not sold on the casting animations by both heroes.

2. I really dislike the hair on the male paladin... it's too stylized after the modern US military.

3. Most of you are probably going to hate it, but I absolutely LOVE the Peon, because in the lore Peons were supposed to be these dumb and weak "failed" Orcs and at least to me, this new model sells that fantasy better than the old one (at least to me).

---

P.s. the guy who datamined these was asked to post more in-game screenshots/animations and said that he'll do it tomorrow once he gets home, so... I'd suggest bookmarking/following him on Twitter if you want to get the news right away. If you don't mind waiting, I'll post whatever I find here.

 

[deepstrasz]

it kinda does make sense that she isn't going into battle half-naked.

That's beside the fact that they changed the culture with this.

1. Spell animations look absolutely amazing, but I'm really not sold on the casting animations by both heroes.

Yeah, it's too WoW/HotStorm like.

2. I really dislike the hair on the male paladin... it's too stylized after the modern US military.

True.

3. Most of you are probably going to hate it, but I absolutely LOVE the Peon, because in the lore Peons were supposed to be these dumb and weak "failed" Orcs and at least to me, this new model sells that fantasy better than the old one (at least to me).

The peon has scoliosis now.

 

[MasterBlaster]

That's beside the fact that they changed the culture with this

In a way - yeah. I preferred the old one, but I can live with the new one too.

The peon has scoliosis now.

As I've said, lore-wise peons are "failed" Orcs who are good for nothing else than simple labor, so making them look deformed fits perfectly.

 

[deepstrasz]

Many, many icons here by the way:
New Reforged Screenshots!
post New Reforged Screenshots!

 

[MasterBlaster]

Is it just me or did they make a lot of demonic creatures look a bit more humane? I mean things like Dreadlords, Satyrs, Succubus...

On the other hand, all the skeleton icons are super awesome!

P.S. @deepstrasz talking about covering up and Succubus (and derivative) - wanna bet how much they cover them up?

 

[WGPavell]

Anybody knows how to enable buttons in the menu of new beta?

 

[Venombite]

Is it just me or did they make a lot of demonic creatures look a bit more humane? I mean things like Dreadlords, Satyrs, Succubus...

On the other hand, all the skeleton icons are super awesome!

P.S. @deepstrasz talking about covering up and Succubus (and derivative) - wanna bet how much they cover them up?

Technically, Satyrs are not Demons. They are corrupted night elves, so it makes totaal sense that they look like night elves. We're also getting female satyrs, which we don't have even in WoW or any other Blizzard game, save Hearthstone, which is really nice.
Eredar are also not Demons, technically.
Dreadlords and succubus have been definitely "WoWised". But it also fits they're models, cause they are basically Mel'Ganis from heroes of the Storm.
Archer was dressed most likely cause she is based on Sylvanas from HotS, so she has simmilar leggings and shoulders.

 

[EredarArbeiterYU]

Yeah, the NE Archer was more sexy in the original and she's obviously been covered up to make the game more "politically correct"... but the armor is actually nice and come to think of it, it kinda does make sense that she isn't going into battle half-naked. So yeah, I'm a bit torn on this.

In this case, "politically correct" is just a more mature look. Don't need them looking like they are coming back from the beach lol. For the current archer model in Wc3, I never thought she looked sexy lol, not while being so low-polly.

2. I really dislike the hair on the male paladin... it's too stylized after the modern US military.

- Exactly!! wtf is up with the hair... does it need to be geometrically straight? xD

 

[Verb8im]

Warcraft III Reforged Human Unit Models

 

[Rui]

Awesome. Not sure I like the flying machine so much. It's so big for a unit that is typically massed.

 

[Venombite]

Most of the units are fine, the heroes not that good, I do love the Paladin though:
Wait so high elven and blood elven priest, sorceress and dragonhawk rider will have the sameskin?
Is the Archmage a dwarf? His icon looks a lot like a dwarf.
Mountain King looks nothing like he does in Classis.
Blood Mage looks too much like a San'layn.
OK, don't get me wrong it's not a bad thing, he is the best looking of all Heroes, I don't mean to sound insoulting to anyone or anything, but is the Paladin black?

 

[MasterBlaster]

And the Orcs:

Warcraft III Reforged Orc Unit and Hero Models

 

[deepstrasz]

Is it just me or did they make a lot of demonic creatures look a bit more humane? I mean things like Dreadlords, Satyrs, Succubus...

Yeah.

P.S. @deepstrasz talking about covering up and Succubus (and derivative) - wanna bet how much they cover them up?

And the harpies too, especially them :\

Eredar are also not Demons, technically.

In the RoC manual they are, technically and theoretically.

In this case, "politically correct" is just a more mature look. Don't need them looking like they are coming back from the beach lol.

It's not about a need. It's about how their culture was portrayed and it is being changed.
It's like changing all paladins to bald to look more like medieval Catholic monks (just saying).

---

Huge shoulder pads are still a thing.
They have this obsession with armour on animals (poor gryphon; how it's it gonna fly with that much weight on it?).
That's more like a Flying Steam Tank/Engine. Too sci-fi-steampunk.
Steroid militia/peasants.
The rest are generally fine.

Blademasters got armour. That kind of kills samurai and ninja culture.
Far Seer wolf armour is totally ugly. It makes it look like a warlock's wolf. Again, their disturbing obsession with armour on animals. Funny hypocrisy, since China eats dogs and stuff.
Spirit Walkers look too bestial.
OK, the icon for the Wind Rider is not fitting. The orc model resembles more the one from the original game than the one in the Reforged icon.
Generally fine.

 

[MasterBlaster]

As for my feelings - I like most of them, even though the departure from the original style is quite significant and...

- Blood Mage looks a bit wimpy - I know he's a mage and a Blood Elf, so he can't really be all that bulky, but in the original game he seemed "bigger", maybe because of the cape being wider.

- Achmage - the horse is cool, but I'm really not sold on the mage... I mean, for an Archmage his robes are very plain and his shoulders look rather low quality.

- Paladin - military haircut... ugh.

- Flying Machine - upon closer inspection, I agree with @deepstrasz that it's a bit too steampunk-y.

The rest of the human units are fine with me. I really like the Dwarves - Mountain King is the best looking hero for me (I agree it's very different from the original - I just like the new look more) and I absolutely love the Rifleman, the Mortar Team and the Gryphon Rider.

- Blademaster - I think that shoulder pad is a bit excessive considering the Blademaster was supposed to be this fast, agile, stealthy warrior and those don't usually carry too much armor.

- Farseer - I'm not a huge fan of his cape. If you zoom in, it looks okay, but from the distance it made me feel like his head was bugged.

Suprisingly, I really like the rest. My favourite hero is the Tauren Chieftan and as for units, I think the Demolisher looks absolutely amazing. The Tauren, Shaman and Witch Doctor are also really great.

 

[deepstrasz]

- Blood Mage looks a bit wimpy - I know he's a mage and a Blood Elf, so he can't really be all that bulky, but in the original game he seemed "bigger", maybe because of the cape being wider.

I'm OK with that. In the original most models were bulky because of their disproportions regarding the low poly blocks. Mages aren't supposed to be on steroids.

- Achmage - the horse is cool, but I'm really not sold on the mage... I mean, for an Archmage his robes are very plain and his shoulders look rather low quality.

Doing like Venombite here, maybe the melee version is more of an ascetic type and Antonidas looks regal?

- Paladin - military haircut... it's probably my least favourite Human hero.

Yeah, they should have made him bald instead to be more in theme with Catholicism (monasticism, Light and all; crusader order etc.).

 

[MasterBlaster]

I'm OK with that. In the original most models were bulky because of their disproportions regarding the low poly blocks. Mages aren't supposed to be on steroids.

Perhaps, I just wish they made the cape wider so that it would fall from his shoulders a bit...

Doing like Venombite here, maybe the melee version is more of an ascetic type and Antonidas looks regal?

To me it looks a bit bland and boring

Yeah, they should have made him bald instead to be more in theme with Catholicism (monasticism, Light and all; crusader order etc.).

I'd be fine with a simple short hair solution.

---

But overall - there are a couple models that I'm not a huge fan of (mostly heroes), but overall it isn't that bad and I can totally see myself getting used to this new look.

 

[deepstrasz]

To me it looks a bit bland and boring

Remember, "skins" sell.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Remember, "skins" sell.

Yeah, but you know what - I'd really, really want Blizzard to eventually release some new content and if selling skins makes it worthwhile to do so, I'd be fine with it.

By the way, looking at Wowhead site and Twitter comments, the vast majority is very positive, even going as far as saying that Reforged models look better than World of Warcraft or asking for some of these armor sets to be ported into WoW. This makes me think my theory about us being more critical than the general audience was correct and most "regular" people who pick up Reforged will walk away satisfied with the new look

 

[Venombite]

In the RoC manual they are, technically and theoretically.

They were in RoC and thus the manual. RoC and thus the manual have been retconned ten times by now, lol, and only the newest version of the story is in Reforged. TFT already retconns RoC with Illidan's story for example.

 

[deepstrasz]

TFT already retconns RoC with Illidan's story for example.

How so? It's a continuation. Yes, indeed Maiev wasn't there when Tyrande got him out and neither right afterwards but they were still under pressure because of the legion invading.
Anyways, it's a small retcon. It didn't change that much like the Draenei story.

 

[Shar Dundred]

So this is what Reforged units are going to look like?
Bah.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Divine Shield effect:
Stevan Mitrovic on Twitter

 

[Venombite]

How so? It's a continuation. Yes, indeed Maiev wasn't there when Tyrande got him out and neither right afterwards but they were still under pressure because of the legion invading.
Anyways, it's a small retcon. It didn't change that much like the Draenei story.

Exactely what I meant to say. It retconns a story a bit. Then each WoW expansion a bit by bit and now we have a 100% different story for the third time, lol.
At the end of Illidan's chapter in RoC Illidan becomes a deformed Demon, a monstrosoty of immense power, who is banished by Malfurion. Then suddenly at the beguining of TFT he is normal again (with some horns and wings) and is again on par with Malfurion and Tyrande. Still in the Night Elven lands, and serving Kil'Jaeden. Of course he dies in the end, but he doesn't actually and is alive in TBC, when he dies. Wait he was actually imprisoned by Maiev and is in a 10 000 years old jail, located on the islands that Maiev didn't hear about in TFT. Then Legion retconns the whole TFT story and you get the point....
Also in TFT there was an elven prince who never fought Arthas when he slaughtered the elves, Sylvanas is an undead general and not a banshee low soldier and etc...
edit: In RoC one of Jaina's quotes is "I pray my father is safe.", then in TFT, ohh wait he is actually the admiral of the largest fleet in the world. Oh wait he is a de facto king of one of the human kingdoms and Jaina is a de facto princess and her mother, alive and well, a powerful sorceress in WC3 manual is a ruling queen, and doesn't have a clue about magic etc...

 

[deepstrasz]

At the end of Illidan's chapter in RoC Illidan becomes a deformed Demon, a monstrosoty of immense power, who is banished by Malfurion.

Well, yeah, it's debatable since melee has timed Metamorphosis so possibly, that form was temporary and Furion has seen Illidan before the character turned back. Also, it was something new for Illidan and the character might not have known it would revert? Apologetics here.

and is again on par with Malfurion and Tyrande. Still in the Night Elven lands, and serving Kil'Jaeden.

Well, no. That was weird seeing Illidan without demonic taint in the scene talking to Kil'jaeden. Illidan was not without risk going through nelven lands. Besides, the protagonist decided to go rogue once more and this time the character had the naga (a retcon, lol or at least a barging in of lore).

Of course he dies in the end

Or does he? I guess it can be more of a cliff-hanger since if you look closely, it was the right chest getting hit by Frostmourne. But yeah, probably they intended for the character do die there since they loved Arthas more and had to continue somehow more interesting than demonic invasion reiteration.
About WoW, lore, I try to stay off it as much as I need, which is pretty much 90 if not 99%.

Also in TFT there was an elven prince who never fought Arthas when he slaughtered the elves

There was that Archmage. In Reforged it might be that prince? It's an error on their side that they didn't make elven techtrees like they did in StarCraft II with most factions. Or, maybe they wanted to show that some Kirin Tor survivors came to defend Quel'thalas? I've no idea.

 

[Venombite]

There was that Archmage. In Reforged it might be that prince?

In Reforged it's Anastarian Sunstrider, Kael's father and king of Quel'thalas. The prince that didn't fight Arthas, I meant Kael.

 

[deepstrasz]

In Reforged it's Anastarian Sunstrider, Kael's father and king of Quel'thalas. The prince that didn't fight Arthas, I meant Kael.

Ah, yes sorry. Not even in Dalaran. What was he doing, went on a yacht trip?
Problem is, too many characters would have made it a headache. I agree they could have done much better. They basically locked themselves up with not leaving something out of the Quel'thalas experience but Sylvanas' transformation. They decided to make the elves have a role and left out the humans to Garithos and not to the Scarlet Crusade or whatnot.
I guess, we'll just have to imagine Kael fought in the war and escaped death or not if we play Reforged?

 

[deepstrasz]

Not sure how legit this is but here goes:
Dragon models and Russian Hackers

Spoiler: dragons

 

[Tuwnew]

Ah, yes sorry. Not even in Dalaran. What was he doing, went on a yacht trip?
Problem is, too many characters would have made it a headache. I agree they could have done much better. They basically locked themselves up with not leaving something out of the Quel'thalas experience but Sylvanas' transformation. They decided to make the elves have a role and left out the humans to Garithos and not to the Scarlet Crusade or whatnot.
I guess, we'll just have to imagine Kael fought in the war and escaped death or not if we play Reforged?

I am not sure if I understood correctly, but :
Kael'Thas went to Quel'Thalas after its destruction. He was at Dalaran when Sylvanas died.
And when he was there, Arthas was at Dalaran.
Make sense they don't fought each others.

Btw, they've made an High Elf Archmage' icon and Anasterian' icon. They will certainly be boss at Silvermoon.

 

[deepstrasz]

I am not sure if I understood correctly, but :
Kael'Thas went to Quel'Thalas after its destruction. He was at Dalaran when Sylvanas died.
And when he was there, Arthas was at Dalaran.
Make sense they don't fought each others.

lol, the undead went through the underground or did Kael teleport each time?

 

[Verb8im]

Not sure how legit this is but here goes:
Dragon models and Russian Hackers

Spoiler: dragons

Doubt those are legit, since it looks like those are in a model editor, whereas all the rest are in-game

 

[Venombite]

Not sure how legit this is but here goes:
Dragon models and Russian Hackers

Spoiler: dragons

Yep, it's legit. They would fit the icons and the red dragon we saw months ago. And as I was "afraid" they look an aweful lot like Brightwing from Heroes of the Storm.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Unlikely to be legit, but considering the rather... let's say "disturbing look" of other models,
it is actually possible.