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Next Melee Mapping contest Pre-disscusion

Discussion in 'Contest Submission' started by Mr.Henci, Feb 17, 2019.

?

What maps would you like to create for the next contest?

  1. 1v1

    55.6%
  2. 2v2

    72.2%
  3. 3v3

    22.2%
  4. 4v4

    5.6%
  5. 4 Players FFA

    33.3%
  6. 6 Players FFA

    5.6%
  7. 8 Players FFA

    5.6%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Mr.Henci

    Mr.Henci

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    Hello there!

    With Melee Mapping contest #3 soon comming to an end, we should start disscusion about the next one. Share with us your opinions, I and many more are looking forward to hearing what you have to say. The poll should represent the general theme, thus what types of map we want to create in the next contest. You have up to 3 votes, so we can get as close as possible to the most suited category agreed by most of us.

    Another main questions wich we must agree on:
    - Do we want to have it Reforget friendly or not? (e.g. Allow custom doodads or not etc.)
    - If no imports, can we change the actual doodads, make small changes to wheater and so on.
    - If we want to allow imports, to what extend they can be implemented?
    - If you have suggestions for judges, I will be more then happy to hear them.
    - Do you think we can soon -ish (March) or should we wait for a few more weeks?

    That would be all for now, but I hope we can get the conversation going.
     
  2. XanderD

    XanderD

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    I'm in favor of doing so. It'll come soon enough.

    Weather effects are fine with me.

    Are there any information about what kind of imports would not look odd with Reforged?
    But if we agree to allow imports they should not be game breaking or confusing like destructibles looking like something that's normally invulnerable or terrain textures where you can't tell whether you can build on them or not.

    How about you?
    Also I'd like to suggest the winners of the previous contests, including the current third one (whoever that will be).

    Soonish - unless my expectation for the end of the judges' work is off again. They as well as you are still busy with the current contest and you are a mapmaker yourself. I wouldn't want to give you a handicap because you're still occupied.
     
  3. JaleVeliki

    JaleVeliki

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    This is mandatory imo, Reforged-ready maps, ain't this why we're doing this couple recent contests for - to have a nice pack of R-ready maps? Do we want to have it Reforget friendly or not? (e.g. Allow custom doodads or not)

    If Blizzard would be so kind to change boundaries of what is considered Melee:Yes/No in Reforged, than yes. I would really enjoy if melee maps allowed to modify doodad size from 20% to 300%+, or change doodad color, rotation, pitch and all those things that shouldn't break the melee:YES status. If no imports, can we change the actual doodads, make small changes to wheater and so on.

    Imports if not specifically done blizzlike, usually look out of style/tone with the rest of models. This contest is a melee contest: balance, innovation and theme. If we want to allow imports, to what extend they can be implemented?

    No suggestions for a qualified wc3 judge, but would be nice for judges to communicate more and be more active during the contest. - If you have suggestions for judges, I will be more then happy to hear them.

    ASAP? Who has time to join - will join :D Maybe include more submissions per creator? Do you think we can soon -ish (March) or should we wait for a few more weeks?
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2019
  4. Khaldaiel

    Khaldaiel

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    Yeah, I'm globally against the utilisation of imports, but I don't see why changing the doodads visuals through the editor is problematic (it will still be a melee map even if the editor cannot recognize it)...
    About time, I think that finishing before the release of Reforged could be a good point so a contest in march-april is a plus !
     
  5. Mr.Henci

    Mr.Henci

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    Seems like many of you hyped for the next contest, which is great. The main idea behind these contests is indeed to get some of those maps to official ladder, but we can have some other patterns (2 contest Reforged ready, 1 for custom doodads or something) since some people would like to produce some new tileset/not so mainstream map designs and so on. I just want to make sure majority of you are for Reforged ready maps.

    @Khaldaiel while we all know that, Blizz won't accept any map with changed object data. (Check Swamped Temple, which originaly had some, but Blizz scraped them all, notifying the community it is the last time they will do that.) Thus until the Blizz will change their melee ladder policy regarding this, if we want to stay Reforged ready we must comply with that. (I have some custom object data in some of my maps, but I know they won't be accepted into the ladder. If I would want them to be there, I would have to rework them.)

    @XanderD while I and previous participants could judge, most of them would like to participate in the contest, so I don't know about that. Also, speaking for myself, I'm not that confident in my melee knowledge to become a judge, maybe in the future when I'm more confident, but have in mind that the judge should have a lot of mapping as well as gameplay knowledge, but most importantly, loads of free time, which is rather limited for some.
     
  6. XanderD

    XanderD

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    My intention was not to force anyone to do this job nor to make this a punishment for people who win a contest so they'd be unable to do it twice in a row or whatever. It was just a suggestion. But besides mapmakers we could also ask professional players (or former ones) or shoutcasters or people who are a bit like both. So to name just a few that come to my mind: Foggy, Grubby, Neo and Remo from Back2Warcraft, ToD - perhaps even the finalists of the recent 2v2 Ugri Challenge Happy, Cash, Thorzain and StarShaped or other top participants from this tournament. But I have no idea whether any of these would want to or got the time to do this. I think it would also be nice to have a combination like one mapmaker, one top player and one caster so we'd get three completely different points of view. But these are all just ideas.
     
  7. sentrywiz

    sentrywiz

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    What is reforged-ready maps? Is it only custom doodads?
    Can we also change models of units then?
    Or add some minor trigger enhancements?

    Probably not on the latter this is melee contest..
     
  8. JaleVeliki

    JaleVeliki

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    Reforged-ready is a melee map with no imports, triggers or any changes which would make it melee map:no.
    Would be nice that it's balanced and beautiful, and that it's easy/clear for newbs that come with Reforged.
     
  9. Mr.Henci

    Mr.Henci

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    @sentrywiz pretty much what @JaleVeliki said. The map status in editor must be melee, which right now means: No custom data, No triggers, No imports, No campaign units etc. Everything that changes the status Is this a melee map to No would be banned. Since we don't know much about Reforged yet, assumtion is that maps which use Blizz assets and use no custom data, can be easilly transfered into W3:Reforged and played by everybody with a beatiful new graphics.
     
  10. Arrr

    Arrr

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    I think we could go full reforged friendly.
    Some hive maps have been recently used in tounaments and inhouse games, and they are required to be melee: yes types of maps, and having maps fresh out of contest ready to be played would be a plus imo.

    About judges I have no idea. It is such a time consuming thing, I doubt anyone busy streaming and such would even consider it.

    Was wondering also, is there any way to have people vote without having to log in?

    And what about collaborations? A good terrainer could partner up with a more game knowledgable person and viceversa.

    Maybe I'm thinking too far on these, the community is too small for that I fear.

    About the time.. considering these seem to last around 2 monts+, mid march? with it ending around mid may, we could have a longer contest june-august, and then mid september-mid november in time with reforged? I'm just speculating.
     
  11. W3Sour

    W3Sour

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    "And what about collaborations? A good terrainer could partner up with a more game knowledgable person and viceversa."

    Me like this idea a lot
     
  12. Mr.Henci

    Mr.Henci

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    @Arrr ,@W3Sour collaborations seems like a nice idea, though many would still work alone, having this option sure gives participants more freedom. Good point, let see what others think about it.
     
  13. Ragnaros17

    Ragnaros17

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    1) yes
    2) no change doodads.
    3) no imports all to reach blizzard Ladder, use the imports in mini maps contest.
    4) I have none.
    5) march is great! canĀ“t wait to map something. 1st of march would be great!!

    6) since the tide is going to 2v2, I say 2v2.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2019
  14. sentrywiz

    sentrywiz

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    Can 2v2 be interpreted as a 4 player FFA, if I started attacking my ally and my dark
    companion player attacks his ally. Then we;re all attacking each other and its a mess.
    A bloodbath. *hint

    I agree on any date, as long as the rules are defined. Custom or no custom, works fine with me.
     
  15. XanderD

    XanderD

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    Someone please remind me never to play or test a map with sentrywiz.
    ;)
    But of course you could make a 2v2 map in a way that it is also suitable for 4 player FFA.
     
  16. sentrywiz

    sentrywiz

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    Lmao! Especially not the "2v2" map I would be making.
     
  17. Ragnaros17

    Ragnaros17

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    I am eager to start!! hope this starts the 1st of march!!

    it may be problematic, 2 users may end discussing the map in neverending ways.
    Collaboration is great for big proyects like AOS, Altered melee and RPG, where you can actually add things, more heroes, more items, more units, more buildings with funtions,

    but for melee, is like the whole map is an individual idea,
    (it may end in things like, I dont want partner with that guy... is not that good at this...or is not having time or not responding my pms, he has low activity...).

    Coperative contest tend to have time of 2 and 3 months, while us like 1 month.

    also we are not that much people with will to participate in competitive melee contest, 19 maps in the 2nd 15 maps in the 3rd, it will reduce the entries at half.

    But, I would consider 2-users team as optional for those who want to team, if there are users that really gets along and have time to discuss, send map here, send map there, beta test. (I prefer solo-mapping).
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2019
  18. W3Sour

    W3Sour

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    Yeah I mean just as an option. I have worked with Keito/Filmting in the past on maps such as Synergy which is now in the 2v2 mappool on ladder.
    And I have also collaborated with Knecht here and there.
    Collaborations shouldn't be forced, but they can create great results. I have a pretty good grasp on balance and can create concepts, but I have no World Editor experience or terrain ability, but I still like the idea of making a map. If you prefer solo mapping you can do solo, but to me this is a good idea.
     
  19. deepstrasz

    deepstrasz

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    Not the same persons are they?
     
  20. W3Sour

    W3Sour

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    Yeah they are. Sister She / Filmting / Keito