Next Melee Mapping Contest: Pre-Contest discussion

[mafe]

@mafe sorry that it tooked me so long, I had some university terms so there wasn't any time during weekend. I will start working on the thread, but here are few questions/suggestion:

No need to apologize. You are doing this in your free time, and so am I Sometimes reallife gets in the way, as happens to me too.

-4v4 maps that serve only for 4v4 or should these maps also serve as FFA and/or perhaps 6v6 maps?

Normally, a good FFA map will also be a good teamplay map (as FFA maps should give equal chances to all players), but not the other way around. So anyone more interested in making an FFA map can still submit and have good chances to do well. As with the 1v1 contest, I suggest you can have any number of players, but the map will be judged on how it does for 4v4. I would say so because unless blizzard introduce a 6v6 ladder, I think a main selling point of this contest will the chance that blizzard might pick a map for bnet ladder.

-no imports, got it, but what about custom data? I mean, red LorSumm trees or oversized rocks? Will it be allowed or we should stick to W3 presets.

I would leave this for the users to decide. Maybe you can add a note of caution to the thread that while not being disalllowed, we dont know yet how blizzard feels about custom data, so it might hinder the chances of blizzard picking a map. On the other hand, my hope that blizzard would adopt a map are still very much speculation.

-I don't think we need limit for participants, if we are lucky, we will sit around 20 ppl. 4v4 is a bigger project than 1v1.

I said so mostly with the judges point of view in mind: It might be not ideal if they volunteer, thinking there will be about 10-15 maps, but suddenly they have to look at 40 maps. This could have a negative impact on the quality of reviews.

-do we have somebody, who is familiar with 4v4's since I would say playstyle is quitte different from 1v1, thus judges must apply diferent rules.

Depend on who the judges will be after all. If we dont find some, I would volunteer myself (having played many 4v4s myself, thought probably not on very high skill level), though I would prefer to make a mypa myself and give backseat feedback to others Anyway, balance in 4v4 is much more flexible, so I would put a higher aspect on gameplay, for examples what different playstyles are possible on the map, and what strategies are possible or not. Whereas generally for a 1v1 the race matchup is huge factor which means that each matchup needs to be playable on a 1v1 map and therefore imposes all sorts of limitations ona map, this doesnt really apply to 4v4.

 

[Mr.Henci]

Normally, a good FFA map will also be a good teamplay map (as FFA maps should give equal chances to all players), but not the other way around. So anyone more interested in making an FFA map can still submit and have good chances to do well. As with the 1v1 contest, I suggest you can have any number of players, but the map will be judged on how it does for 4v4. I would say so because unless blizzard introduce a 6v6 ladder, I think a main selling point of this contest will the chance that blizzard might pick a map for bnet ladder.

I meant 3v3, but I get your point.

One more question came to my mind, still only one entry per user?

 

[deepstrasz]

One more question came to my mind, still only one entry per user?

You're saying somebody has time to make more than one map? I doubt that.

 

[mafe]

You're saying somebody has time to make more than one map? I doubt that.

Yes, me too. Also I would rather have one polished map as a submission than two which are not quite finished. Therefore I'm in favor of limiting submissions to one per user.

 

[JSRGN]

I'm in one of the top 4s clans on US.East, and have connections with the other top clans/streamers in that gametype. I'm sure we can work out some inhouse matches on WIP maps.

 

[JaleVeliki]

Inhouse matches on WIPs sound awesome.

 

[Mr.Henci]

MELEE MAPPING CONTEST #3

Create a 4v4 melee map that excels in balance, terrain, dynamic, and creativity, while beeing suitable for the Warcraft III Reforged.

• No submission may violate any of the site rules.
• If a submission does not follow the map submission rules the creator will be disqualified.
• All submissions must follow the current theme. If any submission does not fit, a moderator will tell you as soon as possible as to avoid confusion.
  • You must submit your entry before the deadline. To submit your final entry, you must upload the entry's contents as a bundle in the Maps Section, and link to that bundle in this thread confirming the submission.
  • Several screenshots of terrain and gameplay.
  • The file in the appropriate format.
• You must show at least one unfinished preview of your submission, before the deadline, as proof that it’s yours.
  
• Your submission may not be started/made before the official launch of the contest.
• Judges may not participate.
• Your final submission must be bug free.
• Teamwork is not allowed.
  • Finding testers to help you with your submission is not considered teamwork.
• No custom imports are allowed.
• Triggers are not allowed.
• Only one entry per contestant.
• For melee maps, any gameplay altering data may not be changed.

Breaking any of these rules may lead to punishment in the judgement score, up to disqualification from the contest, depending on the weight of the issue. In case of doubts towards a certain rule you are very encouraged to discuss it in the contest thread so others and judges may help with sorting it out.

1st place: 30 reputation points
2nd place: 20 reputation points
3rd place: 10 reputation points
Judges: 5 rep
The three winning entries will receive an award icon, representing the winning entry.

• ----------
• ----------

Balance	Is the map balanced for both teams? Are the positions and distance between points of interest fair? Does the map allow the 4 races to be balanced? Consider balance when implementing the pathing, resources, creep camps, and item drops.	50/100
Terrain	Is the map visually pleasing in mediums of terrain, doodad placement, and overall theme? Is the map repetitive? Is the aesthetic well designed but not overly obstructive?	35/100
Creativity & Uniqueness	Does the map bring something new or creative to the table?	15/100
Bugs	Scores may be brought down if there are bug-like issues such as faulty pathing, unusable resources, etc	-

• 80% of the winner shall be determined by the contest's appointed judge(s).
• 20% of the winner shall be determined by the results of a public poll.

• The contest shall begin on XXX and conclude on XXX, 23:59 GMT

Assigned Moderator: ----------
__________________________________________________________________

Here it is. Please, anyone who spotted something wrong/finds something which could be added, tell me what you have in mind. I will work on some picture next week.

 

[mafe]

@Mr.Henci looks good overall. A few suggestions for change:
-I would replaceve the "Is the map balanced for all 8 players?"-part with "Is the map balanced for both teams"? The reason here is that a 4v4 does not have to put every single player in an equal position. In fact, most 4v4 maps dont. Usually there are always players on each team who are closer to the enemy team, or have other neutral buildings nearby. This is fine as long as you there is a player on the enemy team in the same position. But it does not mean that the starting position of every single player is equal to every single player. So to avoid any confusion, I would change this.
-As it has been a source of confusion in the lasdt contests, I think it would be better to state right from the start that participants are not allowed to vote for themselves in the poll.
-Also I think ti shoudl be mentioned that you have to register as a participant in the contest thread and that there will be a list of registered participants and, if necessary, a waiting list.

 

[JaleVeliki]

@Mr.Henci
-I would replaceve the "Is the map balanced for all 8 players?"-part with "Is the map balanced for both teams"? The reason here is that a 4v4 does not have to put every single player in an equal position. This is fine as long as you there is a player on the enemy team in the same position.

^ this.

 

[Mr.Henci]

Melee Mapping contest #3

Operation contest #3 is GO!