New Content Discussion [SPOILER]

[LISBOAH]

The next chapter is in full production.

Hidden

Spoiler

Awww, Aridon being a good boss...
Considering that he had killed one of his siblings and tried to kill the other two, that says a lot

Hidden

Spoiler

Well, nice knowing you Destroyer. You will die fighting till the last breath, while Rangul and Rath, who claimed to do so, will run away. That is what they get for ignoring Vanessa's warnings and questioning her loyalty.

 

[Mvicio]

So at least 3 Nexus and 5 attacking heroes. Perhaps Margazar and Fleshtearer are on the defense.

Awww, Aridon being a good boss...
Considering that he had killed one of his siblings and tried to kill the other two, that says a lot

"I hate my family but LOVE my workers" type of Guy

Well, nice knowing you Destroyer. You will die fighting till the last breath, while Rangul and Rath, who claimed to do so, will run away. That is what they get for ignoring Vanessa's warnings and questioning her loyalty.

It is a pity but the orc's side needs some loses too. Everyone is alive at the moment.
Aridon despises orcs so its most likely he wont be undead.

 

[DD Mikasa]

Well it looks like the last chapter, for which I didn't even get the notification created quite a ruckus, now I wont repeat what the boys already said BUT to me It looked like a bootleg version of the previous chapter. It wasn't that hard, surprisingly the allied AI was competent, they went and saved my base twice.

It wasn't BAD per say, It's just...After the awesome face lift that Pride of the Empire got...This one was a let down.

 

[LISBOAH]

"I hate my family but LOVE my workers" type of Guy

This comes to mind

Hidden

Aridon despises orcs so its most likely he wont be undead.

Who knows? He might like the Destroyer for at the very least knowing that the orcs' plans had very low chances of success.

 

[Mvicio]

Who knows? He might like the Destroyer for at the very least knowing that the orcs' plans had very low chances of success.

Why would he bother? I mean, he didn´t spared the cave orcs, an enormous amount of orcs that WORKSHIPS him. He could use them as cannon fodder, use them to breed more and more orcs (and undead), use them to torture in the ardoz nexus... yet he killed them all. He won´t bother taking the Destroyer under his wing.

 

[Enki555]

Why would he bother? I mean, he didn´t spared the cave orcs, an enormous amount of orcs that WORKSHIPS him. He could use them as cannon fodder, use them to breed more and more orcs (and undead), use them to torture in the ardoz nexus... yet he killed them all. He won´t bother taking the Destroyer under his wing.

Maybe reason why Destroyer is not a hero yet could be he is proper as "reborn" undead hero just as Inara was "reborn" after gladiatorial match; she was just regular orc woman before that.

 

[DD Mikasa]

Destroyer is making it out, I am calling it, HIS PLOT LINE WITH Okri is just to dam juicy not to be explored!


Ehm also I noticed that some of you guys were kind of let down by the lack of "new" units for Genethas, but I think even lore wise him having special units wouldn't make sense. Genethas despite being a veteran of the void war does not hold any special rank within the empire (like the commanders of the special regiments or Gardon). So him possessing the generic empire units tech tree lore wise is absolutely okay to me. After all Blen states (during the first even human mission) that each lord will bring his own personal army, so unless Genethas held special rank within the empire besides the fact that he was nobility he should only have access to the standard empire army roster.

Now he cannot employ the black and white knights that Demon slaves have access too, cuz you know...His allies would turn on him on the spot SO him rocking the generic empire unit roster isn't that bad. I just think the reason why most of us felt a tad bit disappointed by this chapter is due to the previous one being so much more better on everything!

 

[Jayborino]

Looking at how the True Story has changed, the more I am comfortable with a 'smaller' scale Betrayal map. Yes, I think more needs to be happening on it to better utilize the space BUT there's no reason it needs to be big chaos per say. These are reserve troops and Gardon should be expected to handily win considering two entire factions, the Dwarves and Grey Guard, show up to help him. I don't know if it's a dialogue/writing issue, or maybe it's the original FHB setting expectations erroneously, but I don't think the scale of the map necessarily should be much bigger. If anything, ensure the AI waves actually go where they are intended to go, add some errant dialogue/comments from the characters, maybe toss Merlon's boats back in, etc - there have been great suggestions by others earlier in the thread.

But the reality is that Genethas really doesn't have much screentime, particularly when comparing back to FHB because he's not there in Bull and Wolf anymore, nor is there a branching mission to help him as opposed to Gardon. If we think about the True Story from the perspective of someone ONLY playing True Story, then Genethas is a relatively unknown and random distraction, but a distraction nonetheless that affects the actual huge battle happening in Pride of the Empire. He is not deserving of a huge battle at this point anymore honestly. Maybe cinematic dialogue needs to be adjusted or something in previous maps, I dunno, but if it's a FHB holdover issue, then there's not much to be done about it besides raising awareness.

Now, even though I think narratively my reasoning makes some sort of sense, that doesn't mean the map is hunky-dory because again, I think there are space issues and AI waves problems (I did dive in and actually test the map WITHOUT CHEATS).

EDIT: And also, if Destroyer dies in this final Undead mission I will quit Arkain, DON'T TEST ME SHAR

 

[Karmondia]

The only problem is, if Genethas is just a minor distraction, then the entire chapter loses it's narrative tension. That map needs to be a bit more engaging, and again, I'm not say it has to be a big battle. I'm only saying it has to be fun and interesting. Right now, the map is just a standard kill everything, destroy the castle mission, without anything to shake it up. This, despite it's smaller scale, is still a civil war between the emperor's bastard brother and a prestigious general. It needs some confusion, because it is a confusing situation, according to the narrative. Some soldiers have no idea who the traitor is, they could have inner doubts. And when they see, that we are actually fighting the demons, some could join our side. Lerrig and his forces could arrive a few minutes after the start of the mission, to make the player feel, that he literally ran away from the front lines, just to fight for Genethas. Merlon is a person who loves ships, so an ai vs ai naval battle might not be a bad idea either, but he needs something. Okay, I get it, Genethas can't have unique units, but his faction is called "Veterans of the Void War", they could be a little different. Also Gardon having the same "Honor Guards" as Genethas... you can't explain that. The Ironfist should be a bit more prominent presence on the map, because we have seen how large the Ironfist is in previous missions. It's out of character for him to not bring a terrifying force, to crush the traitor. And again I do NOT mean, "MOAR LARGG EPIKK BATTEL" but small things, like seeing some of his lieutenants, or a better defended base, or just lines from Gardon, when he's commanding his troops. There could be more outlying bases, that aren't necessarly "full" bases, but little outposts, that you can attack. The entire middle part of the map is empty, except for Progaderas. There could be sick forest creatures in the swamp, but that would make the ai's clumsy pathing even more difficult. In the end, I would even be happy with just the characters speaking more during the mission, and maybe an added gimmick to shake the usual "kill and destroy" missions up. That could be anything, from naval battles, to deserting soldiers... anything, but it needs SOMETHING. Also, Gardon's base could look more menacing. Maybe there could be other things, I don't know... maybe another hero for the enemy could balance out the scales, if Shar is conerned about the Ironfist stomping the Veterans. As I said, I'm not saying it has to be a copy of "Pride of the Empire", but it needs some love, because to me, Betrayal felt really lacking. It's not a "bad" map, most maps on this site don't even come close to its quality, but you can really see, that Shar made this map, when he was relatively inexperienced. It need a facelift, as others have said. I know I wrote a lot about it, but from a narrative point, this is an important map, it deserves to be as good as Pride of The Empire.

 

[Karmondia]

I must say, I really, really like the new chapter, Shar! Betrayal is also very fun now! There isn't much else to say, it is a very good map now, MILES better than the old version!

Update: The Story is SO GOOD now! It is an improvement in every way! You really outdid yourself, Master of Arkain!

 

[Championfighter25]

I played the new version of betrayal.
Overall, it was a good improvement over the previous version.

- The new story bit about Blen and Zoia was pretty cool and helped make Greymoore into more of a gray (I know) character.
Also helped explain Zoia's far more ruthless attitude in "The Wolf" short story.

• Seeing Gardon use underhanded tactics in a good way was also pretty cool.
• I noticed the Souleater Legion had the team colour of the Dreamhunter Legion.

The gameplay part had a few problems.

• Overall, the southern part of the map can be easily broken through.
• The northern part of the map due to Lerrig's war aura and sometimes Sage Truthbearer with devotion aura being a part of the attack waves can be quite ridiculous. Because of those 2 auras the Knight's of Kome's base was pretty easily overwhelmed after their first attack wave was defeated and made me restart. (I didn't use I seedeadpeople or any other cheats)

I'll share my thoughts on Bloodbath later.

 

[LISBOAH]

My review

Act Four Chapter Four
-When Gardon didn't answer Merlon's question, he already knew the answer
-I love that Lisara come outs when Gardon was willing to resort to trickery in order to emerge as the victor. That is such a demon thing to do! XD
-Gardon is right. Genethas was clearly stalling them simply to give the demons more time.
-Intro cinematic: "...who wants to my death." --> "...who wants my death."
-So Zoia has sent a detachment of her own forces simply to watch over the civil war?
-Zarin: I will not help you attack the Wolf Regiment. Also Zarin: One of the Heroes that can be used to attack the Wolf Regiment.
-Not to sound picky, but the Souleater Legion should have Green as their team color.
-The Branchlegionary has the Q hotkey
-The Thornkin has the W hotkey
-The Gloomleaf has the Q hotkey
-The Warhounds for some reason have the buff effect appear on top of their heads
-The Knights of Kome sure enjoy launching attacks on Genethas, but they suck on defending their base. They don't even rebuild it even after I repelled Genethas' attack!
-I attacked Genethas first to confirm that we had to destroy the Wolf Regiment. We are indeed forced to destroy their base in order to win the mission.
-This is quite an improvement, Shar. Well done!

Act Four Chapter Five
-Intro cinematic: "...think, they stand a chance." --> "think they stand a chance."
-Poor Sapphira, her time serving under Queen Renova has made her paranoid. Damn, the Elven Queen must be even worse than I thought if apparently someone speaking out of turn is enough for her to punish his or her superior. Luckily for her, though, her new master and "family" are above that. She can now slowly recover from that trauma
-I chose the Zirr Nexus for the spellcasters
-Kazardius, faithful general of Zyainor in life, faithful servant of Aridon in death, and his Q ability is Hurl Boulder. For real?
-I chose to destroy the Skullblade base, but I had to resort to Frost Wyrms in order to bypass three orc bases.
-If you ask me, the orcs' point of view in the last cinematic seems weird since this is the ending cinematic for a mission where we play as the undead
-That is what you, Rangul, get for ignoring Vanessa's warnings! And he had the nerve to act surprised when the demons inevitably attack!
-I love that Sasrogarn was quite quick in giving an excuse as to why he was in the base rather than on the frontlines.
-It would be cool if we had a bonus chapter right after this one where we play as the Destroyer and kill as many demons as possible. If you had played "In Utter Darkness" mission in Starcraft 2 Wings of Liberty, you know what I am talking out.
-RIP Destroyer. You fought well. If there is an orc version of Vallhala, you have more than earned it!

 

[Jayred0320]

I haven't quite finished the chapter yet, since it is indeed quite tricky, but I figured I should share my insight in regards of what I found so far.

Betrayal is definitely more awesome, Zoia and Blen's issue towards each other was given more context, but like what Harmos said. I get the feeling that what Blen said wasn't entirely true yet. And the part where Genethas wasn't the one who made the first move was really surprising for me, but we are talking about Gardon here, and it isn't an entire surprise for him to choose that route. Regardless tho. I believe that Genethas would have attacked anyway.
But I do have one thing to address in terms of gameplay:
-The North sector which is held by the knights of Kome. Gets swarmed fast by Lerrig's forces. I expected much more towards the Knights of Kome tho. I don't know if it is really to be meant that way, or Lerrig's forces were just too powerful compared to the Knight's of kome in a way?

 

[LISBOAH]

But I do have one thing to address in terms of gameplay:
-The North sector which is held by the knights of Kome. Gets swarmed fast by Lerrig's forces. I expected much more towards the Knights of Kome tho. I don't know if it is really to be meant that way, or Lerrig's forces were just too powerful compared to the Knight's kome in a way?

I had the same issue.
In terms of lore, you could say that they are still recovering after the orcs attacked and razed their base.
But still, the Knights are constantly sending units to the front even though their base was being overwhelmed by that time.

 

[Enki555]

So, here is the review for Bloodbath:
-Quite an awesome fight, much better than the previous. Even more challenging. In hard, if you don't have a right momentum the wipe is very likely. It reminds me of Squid Game's tug-of-war... albeit much massive and magnified. Demons are all numerous and full of "men"; yet luring them towards undead base and raising skeleton legion (in case playing as Zirr) can turn the tide better.
-Margazar and Fleshtearer as defense heroes are nice addition. Yet why Kazardius has Hurl Boulder? It can be something like Cursed Strike of Gardon. Five heroes have excellent synergy with Edoarus as single-heal, melee-support, golem-disable; Krom as hero-killer; Rahandir as nuker, disabler, mana support and, most importantly, death decay (can destroy demon hordes in no time and those accursed demon gates); Kazardius as defense-buff, spectral soldiers with bash and for healing of Edoarus, and magnificent Korzar!; and Saphira as anti-spellcaster-and-hero, dark minions, and charm. Red alert when Morganur revives! He is truly one of the strongest demons and should be added to Character Sheet! He can even lead small bands of infernals into the destruction of undead! It just snowballs horridly.
-Kazardius should have artifact; smth like Spectral Helmet of Zyainor or Ca'rach's Glaive etc. It's also time to introduce 2nd artifact of our important undead heroes. Me in particular itches to use Rahandir's Book of Undying and hopefully his third will be available in SB. Krom, Saphira, and Kazardius should have 2nd artifact too and Edoarus's third can be introduced in SB. It is probable that items of yore scrapped undying craft remain canon. I assume Meya's 2nd was Shield of Horrors (upgraded from Shield of Darkness)? Galareth should've artifact too (maybe ogre-related memoir). Mordin's could be gift of Zarin.
-Oh, it seems like we will have pitlord frankeinsteins in the very near future...
-Maybe, just this time, we should have luxury of playing exclusive techtree of our chosen nexus. Playing as Splecir, I expected of using Heralds and Lifescorchers yet only had Scourges and Spirit Legionnares disappointed me a little... I wonder if it's worth it in the SB.
-No matter which nexus you are playing, Frost Wyrms (Twindragons in case of Ardoz) must have to comprise the bulk of army. (Quick edit: Playing as Zirr nexus, with legions of firebearers and lorekeepers, and band of ras should be enough to overwhelm even two legions alone without frost wyrms.)
-Btw, where are succubi? They should be summoned from Demon Gates.
-I thought destroying wyvern base would give Frostbringers as extra units...
-What about choosing Zirr and Ejara would allow Tremalon and Harantel-kazor to participate respectively? That would be a nice addition for nexus otherwise so hard-pitted and disadvantageous against demons.
-There should be demon slaves imo. It's Blooddrinker's last fight and it would only make sense for them to bring all the forces they have.
-Saphira's paranoia is... insightful. Perhaps elven queens all shared the trait of their dark elven ancestors and creator: deceptiveness.
-Oh, I just hope Ishzog's prophecy regarding Destroyer will be true. He might survive this fight and appear in SB. He and Okri have scores to settle, that must not be forgotten.
-The orc invasion wouldn't have failed had they listened to Vanessa. The butterfly effect of ignoring just one suggestion resulting in wipe is amazing.
-So, Ornasion was aware Kersidar would betray him? And his interaction with Krom... Well, he is even more courteous than previously depicted... or maybe undeath shall mar him really brutish.
-With Aridon's command, it seems like we will encounter fallen generals of Imperials in the future... sounds thrilling!
-Overall, the best version of previous. Keep it up! Can't wait for the start of SB.

 

[Karmondia]

Overall, the southern part of the map can be easily broken through.

-The Knights of Kome sure enjoy launching attacks on Genethas, but they suck on defending their base. They don't even rebuild it even after I repelled Genethas' attack!

-The North sector which is held by the knights of Kome. Gets swarmed fast by Lerrig's forces.

I have to agree. The Knights of Kome get overwhelmed almost instantly, as soon as the battle begins. It's a little problematic. What do you think, could they be buffed a bit, just to give them a fair chance? (Or at least make Lerrig advance a little slower, to give the player a chance to react.)

 

[Championfighter25]

Played Bloodbath

• Chose the Splecir Nexus. The Spirit Legionnaires were pretty useful here.
• Krom's cache didn't transfer.
• Kazardius should have some kind of artefact item.
• Kazardius' hurl boulder should be replaced with something else because it doesn't seem very fitting.
• The undead AI mostly ignored attacking the demon gates and shrines even when there were no enemies nearby and instead went straight for Ornasion. (didn't use any cheats)
• Decided not to destroy the wyvern breeding grounds or kill Progaderas. The enemies you need to circumvent was a turn-off. The orc could use some additional forces for the future and Progaders getting slain 2 times already was too much anyway.
• The other orc clans should say something when attacked by the undead.
• I think that the undead had a legitimate chance of permanently killing Kersidar here. Had they launched a full-on assault they could've managed to defeat him before their additional reinforcement arrived.
• Good old Sas. Lands pretty much devoid of human life at this point can't possibly have humans attacking you through them silly.
• The most likely possibility for the Destroyer is dying at the hands of the demons. I wouldn't be completely surprised if Okri somehow snuck through and backstabbed him in a scenario where he escapes.

It was overall a pretty good chapter. For those wanting to save some time, killing Aridon and instantly winning is still an option.

 

[Jayred0320]

I have to agree. The Knights of Kome get overwhelmed almost instantly, as soon as the battle begins. It's a little problematic. What do you think, could they be buffed a bit, just to give them a fair chance? (Or at least make Lerrig advance a little slower, to give the player a chance to react.)

Either give the Knights of Kome a buff and improve their pre-placed defenses, or decrease Lerrig's op attacks.

 

[Shar Dundred]

The reason why the Knights in the north struggle is because the Veterans of the Voidwar, especially
their initial starting wave of Honor Guards and the paladin, sneak by their first wave.
I am making additional terrain changes to make them less sneaky.

-Kazardius, faithful general of Zyainor in life, faithful servant of Aridon in death, and his Q ability is Hurl Boulder. For real?

Kazardius' hurl boulder should be replaced with something else because it doesn't seem very fitting.

I will never understand what your problem with Hurl Boulder is.
Yes it doesn't "sound" impressive but the ability deals decent damage and, more importantly,
serves as a good stun.
I suppose I have to give more enemies channel abilities to make you appreciate it more.
Unless ofc you would prefer Shockwave because whosyourdaddy makes it incredibly more useful.

On a serious note:
Kazardius was originally designed as a support hero, with Barrier, his summon & War Aura.
Hurl Boulder was added to give him the potential to disable powerful enemies while the other skills buffed
his allies and himself.
Now that War Aura has been replaced with another summon, he is more of a summoner who buffs his summons
and units with Barrier. Hurl Boulder still serves the same purpose however.
His stun combined with Krom's Death Grip can be utilized quite efficiently.

-I thought destroying wyvern base would give Frostbringers as extra units...

There is a way to get Frostbringers, the optional quest is not required for that.
It is intentionally a bit deceptive, but I am sure you can figure it out.

-What about choosing Zirr and Ejara would allow Tremalon and Harantel-kazor to participate respectively? That would be a nice addition for nexus otherwise so hard-pitted and disadvantageous against demons.

I had considered such things but you already have enough heroes as it is.
Also heroes like Haran aren't supposed to be of a high level yet, making them not very useful here anyway.

Krom's cache didn't transfer.

There was a bug in the initial version of Act Four, Chapter One which saved Krom in the wrong cache.
It has been fixed quite a while ago but if you never played the updated version, that bug unfortunately
means that Krom didn't get saved.
Replaying Possession should fix the issue however.

Progaders getting slain 2 times already was too much anyway.

Is there such a thing as Progaderas dying too often?

I think that the undead had a legitimate chance of permanently killing Kersidar here. Had they launched a full-on assault they could've managed to defeat him before their additional reinforcement arrived.

Despite Kersidar being the leader of the Souleater Legion and someone who has been orchestrating
many things in the background, he was still "just" one demon in Aridon's eyes. A powerful one, no doubt,
but killing Aridon didn't think that killing Kersidar would halt the invasion - it wouldn't have at this point.
Others such as Hesrathion would have taken Kersidar's place.
That is not to say that Kersidar's death wouldn't have been a good thing for the Undead of course.
Aridon considered the effort of such an endavour not worth it.
As I said, at this particular moment in time at least.

Good old Sas. Lands pretty much devoid of human life at this point can't possibly have humans attacking you through them silly.

Smart sassy Sas.

For those wanting to save some time, killing Aridon and instantly winning is still an option.

If you want a strong demon wave at the beginning of the next undead chapter, sure, go ahead.

 

[Boredino]

Played both missions. Here are my thoughts.

Act Four Chapter Four

• This one was a doozy. Had to start from the beginning something like 10 times because the allies kept being overwhelmed. Especially the Knights of Kome. They needed help ASAP since they were overwhelmed by the first wave. I had to snipe Lerrig the moment I saw him, because, with his war aura, he made his army unstoppable. I hate him now. Also, Sagebearer was a pain in the ass with his divine protection.
• Darkfang was an absolute monster, sometimes eliminating my weaker heroes with a few hits. I lost three times because he attacked the fortifications I built for the knights of kome and steamrolled them down by himself. I almost hated blen not killing him lol
• is there a story about blen and that crazy wolf-lady? I think i missed it
• All in all, a crazy mission and a crazy good one at that. Any second counted and you had to move fast. Well done

Act Four Chapter Five

• Whoa, so many heroes.
• I'll admit, i don't like the undead (too much casual cruelty ). But there's something endearing at how they are united, in contrast to the other factions. Aridon is dad.
• This mission was a nice change of pace after the relentless previous two. It was much easier (at least in normal). I appreciate that. Three relentless missions in a row are too much for me. With a bunch of Lorekeepers, i spawned enough skeletons to destroy another two legions.
• Sas knows what's up.
• I hope the Destroyer gets a rock on the head and dies, the brute.
• The orcs really need to work on their scouting. You know you have to fire the scout chief when 9999999 demons sneak out on you.
• Ornasion was a chunky boi with that hp pool.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Lil fyi I just forgot with my last post, in the next update I might give Aedale the Mass Teleportation
aiblity (not as ult) to allow better movement on the map.

is there a story about blen and that crazy wolf-lady? I think i missed it

As in a short story? Nope.
There's some stuff in the cinematic changes of that chapter however.

 

[Enki555]

*Maybe Kazardius's Boulder could be replaced with Shadowbolt. That would be nice edit. He is obviously not the Horde brute.
*Since Undead and Humans command 5 heroes... what about adding Inara as 5th hero for Orcs in Pride of the Empire! She and Zoia could make nasty threats along with Vanessa.

 

[Shar Dundred]

what about adding Inara as 5th hero for Orcs in Pride of the Empire

There's a reason for her not being playable yet.

 

[LISBOAH]

-There should be demon slaves imo. It's Blooddrinker's last fight and it would only make sense for them to bring all the forces they have.

Maybe Ornassion wanted for the demons to have all the fun.

-Saphira's paranoia is... insightful. Perhaps elven queens all shared the trait of their dark elven ancestors and creator: deceptiveness.

That or Queen Renova is just a b#

-The orc invasion wouldn't have failed had they listened to Vanessa. The butterfly effect of ignoring just one suggestion resulting in wipe is amazing.

And in the meantime the Redfists are about to turn their islands from islands of earth to islands of fire. If not for Vanessa and Amari, the orcs would have been forced to start living as nomads, always on the run from the Imperials and Demons, and having no place to run off to.

-So, Ornasion was aware Kersidar would betray him? And his interaction with Krom... Well, he is even more courteous than previously depicted... or maybe undeath shall mar him really brutish.

He probably respects Krom for both his age, personality and skills.

Is there such a thing as Progaderas dying too often?

It would be funny if Progaderas was to get more pissed and powerful every time we kill him. If we kill him three times, he would be nigh unbeatable in the 4th map XD

• The orcs really need to work on their scouting. You know you have to fire the scout chief when 9999999 demons sneak out on you.

By that logic, more than half of their top leaders has to be fired because their stubborness, thirst for revenge, bloodlust, lack of foresight, hyppocrisy, etc has led them to the brink of extinction.

Shar, I sure hope Vanessa has the opportunity to chew on all of them once they manage to escape. They accused her of cowardice and treachery, and yet she was one of the main reasons why they survived, while they were too drunk on their victory to notice what was happening around them. And they will not even have anything to counter her arguments because she is 100% right.

They were so focused on killing every Imperial that they didn't even focus on what was happening on the rear.

 

[Boredino]

Hey, eons pass, kingdoms fall, gods die, but throwing boulders is always effective

 

[Karmondia]

Lil fyi I just forgot with my last post, in the next update I might give Aedale the Mass Teleportation
aiblity (not as ult) to allow better movement on the map.

I really like this idea. Keep up the good work, Shar!

 

[Mvicio]

Lets talk about the new chapters then.

Chapter four:
-So Gardon didn´t wanted to give Aedale a chance but had enough with the traitor Genethas. I suppose using their power in the battle and then killing her is the most effective way. Ends justify the means.
-We shouldn´t have Zarin against the wolf regiment.
-So as pretty much everyone guessed Blen was married to Zoia´s sister (if they were divorced many other would have said that, specially the wolves)
-I lost my Knights of Kome base during my first 2 tries while dealing with the demons, after babysitting there a long time then we were good to go.
-Now it makes more sense, since the demons were "out" of the fight no Genethas soldier saw them and couldn´t deflect.
-Having access to the ironbarks is a nice touch but i didn´t use them.
-A taunt between a random imperial mage and Harmos? Unexpected.
-Letting darkfang alive means that we will fight him during the orcs escape 100%. Great.
-Every issue i had in the previous betrayal has been solved. Nice one Shar!

Chapter Five:
-So Aridon perhaps is mad to Rahandir because of Saphira´s comment. That would make sense since Aridon thinks he knows the best for everyone everytime.
-Everyone is here undead version!. Seeing every heroe together was a nice touch.
-Having boulder on Kazardius... makes sense. I mean before dying he was defending a city, of course he would use every stone to defend their borders. Therefore the boulder.
-I picked Splicer, i thought about using their full tech tree but ended with mostly spirit leggionaries. Good enough. Although i think having Ejara or Rohir for the auras would be better.
-So defeating the orcs gives you anything apart from the claws of attack? Did i missed something?
-After the hardest pride of the empire and the medium betrayal comes the easy bloodbath.
-Its an improvement from the older version in every way.
-So the idea of moving to the next kingdom wasn´t even from Rangul but Gorthog. Also Vanessa had the same idea and was the smartest choice.
-Sas running away is like 95% of his character, the other 5% is lightining shield.
-The Destroyer won´t die. But i dont know what will happen, the demons can´t take the orcs as slaves (because can´t be controlled), Okri wouldn´t let the demons kill his prey. I thought that maybe Amari and his clan would rescue them but that would mean that the destroyer will become a prisoner too. Lets see how this unfolds.
-Also Rangul didn´t cared at all about the destroyer buying him time, despite being the only reason they could escape.

-So Zoia has sent a detachment of her own forces simply to watch over the civil war?

To make sure that no one kills Blen instead of her.

-With Aridon's command, it seems like we will encounter fallen generals of Imperials in the future... sounds thrilling!

Didn´t thought of that, maybe Van Durce will reunite with undead Prideblade.

The most likely possibility for the Destroyer is dying at the hands of the demons. I wouldn't be completely surprised if Okri somehow snuck through and backstabbed him in a scenario where he escapes.

Maybe Amari wont let Okri kill him... yet. They need all the strenght they can get to assault Salria, and the destroyer is really strong.

There is a way to get Frostbringers, the optional quest is not required for that.
It is intentionally a bit deceptive, but I am sure you can figure it out.

I suppose you have to pick the Ejara nexus to get them and only in that case.

There's a reason for her not being playable yet.

Yes, at this moment the orcs don´t allow the woman to fight. We´ll have to wait until Amari arrives.

 

[LISBOAH]

-We shouldn´t have Zarin against the wolf regiment.

Exactly!

Chapter Five:
-So Aridon perhaps is mad to Rahandir because of Saphira´s comment. That would make sense since Aridon thinks he knows the best for everyone everytime.

I don't think he would be that petty. My guess is that Krom was the best choice to lead an army aimed at killing a powerful dreadlord.

-After the hardest pride of the empire and the medium betrayal comes the easy bloodbath.

Well, in the "Pride of the Empire" we are commanding an army of brainless morons.
In "Betrayal" we are commanding an army against demon slaves, gullible idiots and a bunch of werewolves that are just there because some woman has a gruge against her former brother-in-law.
In "Bloodbath", we have the entirety of the Nexus, all united under the will of Aridon with no grudges or ulterior motives to tear them apart.

-So the idea of moving to the next kingdom wasn´t even from Rangul but Gorthog. Also Vanessa had the same idea and was the smartest choice.

If Gorthog ends up dying sooner than Rangul I will be pissed.

-Sas running away is like 95% of his character, the other 5% is lightining shield.

You forgot the percentage of him taking the credit for Grofzag's deeds.

 

[Shar Dundred]

-Zarin: I will not help you attack the Wolf Regiment. Also Zarin: One of the Heroes that can be used to attack the Wolf Regiment.

-We shouldn´t have Zarin against the wolf regiment.

I mean, I could give him to the AI but why would I want to take him away from you?
Lorewise he doesn't attack the Wolves. Gameplaywise I think Zarin is too important to not be a useable hero.
I think you will forgive me for not taking him away from you there.

-So as pretty much everyone guessed Blen was married to Zoia´s sister (if they were divorced many other would have said that, specially the wolves)

I remember when people thought Blen & Zoia were married in the past.
I'll leave her snarky comments regarding these claims to your imagination - you can guess how many of her
comments would have insulted Blen in some way.

-Having access to the ironbarks is a nice touch but i didn´t use them.

Don't get used to them being trainable.

-Sas running away is like 95% of his character, the other 5% is lightining shield.

That made me smile.

I suppose you have to pick the Ejara nexus to get them and only in that case.

Nope.
It's hidden and available to you no matter what - you have to find out how first though.

You forgot the percentage of him taking the credit for Grofzag's deeds.

In the True Story that hasn't happened yet. Merlon is thankful for that btw.

 

[Mvicio]

I don't think he would be that petty. My guess is that Krom was the best choice to lead an army aimed at killing a powerful dreadlord.

Perhaps.

Well, in the "Pride of the Empire" we are commanding an army of brainless morons.
In "Betrayal" we are commanding an army against demon slaves, gullible idiots and a bunch of werewolves that are just there because some woman has a gruge against her former brother-in-law.
In "Bloodbath", we have the entirety of the Nexus, all united under the will of Aridon with no grudges or ulterior motives to tear them apart.

We also command Vanessa during the pride of the empire, you know she has 9 brain cells out of 10. The other one is shared between Hortnog, Grofzag, Zairmak and Gorthog.

If Gorthog ends up dying sooner than Rangul I will be pissed.

I think Gorthog won´t reach Salria, he won´t allow the alliance between races instead of slaving them.

You forgot the percentage of him taking the credit for Grofzag's deeds.

You are right. 90% running away
5% Lightining shield and 5% taking over Grofzag´s deeds, and the hammer of Kome.

 

[Mvicio]

Nope.
It's hidden and available to you no matter what - you have to find out how first thought.

That´s the thing, i played a second round cleaning the map before defeating Ornassion and didn´t found it.

In the True Story that hasn't happened yet.

You sure? You can´t make us believe that ANYONE would believe that Sasrogarn was the leader during the siege of Kome, it was Zairmak and Grofzag.

 

[Shar Dundred]

That´s the thing, i played a second round cleaning the map before defeating Ornassion and didn´t found it.

It is very well hidden.
You can move around and attack what you want, that doesn't unlock it.
It is more... underhanded.

You sure? You can´t make us believe that ANYONE would believe that Sasrogarn was the leader during the siege of Kome, it was Zairmak and Grofzag.

I was refering to deeds such as killing the best admiral of the series in cold blood.
That however... Yeah, fair point.

 

[LISBOAH]

I mean, I could give him to the AI but why would I want to take him away from you?
Lorewise he doesn't attack the Wolves. Gameplaywise I think Zarin is too important to not be a useable hero.
I think you will forgive me for not taking him away from you there.

What if we are forced to first deal with the Wolf Regiment? And once that is over, Zarin becomes playable?

 

[Shar Dundred]

Nah. I want you to be able to choose what you do first (if only so that you will try to avoid
fighting the beloved Wolf Regiment by killing Genethas first and then realizing that YOU HAVE
NO CHOICE IN THE MATTER AHAHAHAHAHA!)
ahem
I think it works better this way.

 

[Karmondia]

Nope.
It's hidden and available to you no matter what - you have to find out how first though.

It is very well hidden.
You can move around and attack what you want, that doesn't unlock it.
It is more... underhanded.

Okay, so list of things that haven't worked so far:

• Constructing a base on the ashes of the Skullblade base.
• Charming the units in the base.
• The mysterious corpses around the base aren't raiseable.
• Neither are the pile of corpses on the edge of the map, next to the undead base.
• That weird purple magic effect on those rocks is nothing.
• Collecting wyvern corpses with meat wagons.
• Using Kazardius' ultimate on specific places.
• Only killing the units around the Skullblade Stronghold.
• The Wind Master is not charmable/posessable.

Shar said moving around and killing things does not unlock them. And you should be able to do it with any of the available nexuses... Hmmm... What could it be?

 

[tottipeter]

It is very well hidden.
You can move around and attack what you want, that doesn't unlock it.
It is more... underhanded.

I think that will be found in one of undead maps

 

[Mvicio]

Shar said moving around and killing things does not unlock them. And you should be able to do it with any of the available nexuses... Hmmm... What could it be?

Killing the bigger Skullblade base doesn´t unlock it either. I tried a couple of yours too but none of them works.

 

[LISBOAH]

Killing the bigger Skullblade base doesn´t unlock it either. I tried a couple of yours too but none of them works.

Rahandir: How can we unlock it?
Krom: Maybe, but just maybe, we might have to kill everyone.
Sapphira: And you are sure that will unlock it?
Krom: ... Unlock what?

Just kidding, of course. It doesn't have to be that extreme... right?

 

[Championfighter25]

Rahandir: How can we unlock it?
Krom: Maybe, but just maybe, we might have to kill everyone.
Sapphira: And you are sure that will unlock it?
Krom: ... Unlock what?

Just kidding, of course. It doesn't have to be that extreme... right?

I can see the Scarec Nexus either giggling or doing an incredibly evil laugh while hearing that.

 

[Mvicio]

Just kidding, of course. It doesn't have to be that extreme... right?

Well i did and it didn´t worked so no. Also, there is no need for that unit but who knows when we´ll get to play with the ejara nexus (the second undead book mostly uses ornasion anyway).

 

[Hardric62]

That´s the thing, i played a second round cleaning the map before defeating Ornassion and didn´t found it.

I have found the answer:

Spoiler: Don't read this if you want to discover the solution by yourself, people

Just charm a Peon with Saphira. I wanted to get a look at Orcish clans we didn't get to use yet, and this was the result. The only building they can build is a Bestiary that will be spitting out Frostbringers, and only Frostbringers.

 

[Karmondia]

Excuse me. I'm still recovering from the shock... THAT IS ALL I HAD TO DO?! You can't imagine the things i have done, YOU CAN'T! I've looked at the triggers, I've checked EVERYTHING, except that... I feel dumb now... I've literally spent 30 minutes checking all the different triggers, I think I know exactly how this map works now Before I opened the map in the editor, I've spent fifteen minutes looking at those glowing rocks, at the edge of the map, built a base on the ruins of the Skullblade stronghold. I've built boneyard IN EVERY MILDLY SUSPICIOUS AREA, I've tried raising EVERY bone doodad on the map. All for it to be that simple...

 

[Hardric62]

Also, speaking of the Undead map, it was a bit... Intense, but it is a funny thing to go through with your hero squad. Went with Ejara for it, figure I'll see what Nexi to try in the future (bit sad these Contraptions thingies from Aridoz aren't available to the player though).

If you want to go for the optionals, I'd say you need to break 3 Demon Gates, then eliminate Demons to get the allied armies on the offensive. Once this is done, they seem to get in a slow upward spiral that leaves you just enough time to break through an Orc base with ground forces and the heroes, destroy the Skullblade base, and of course pay Progaderas a visit before Ornassion gets overwhelmed.

 

[LISBOAH]

Spoiler: Don't read this if you want to discover the solution by yourself, people

Just charm a Peon with Saphira. I wanted to get a look at Orcish clans we didn't get to use yet, and this was the result. The only building they can build is a Bestiary that will be spitting out Frostbringers, and only Frostbringers.

So basically we have to do it Rohir Nexus style.

Excuse me. I'm still recovering from the shock... THAT IS ALL I HAD TO DO?! You can't imagine the things i have done, YOU CAN'T! I've looked at the triggers, I've checked EVERYTHING, except that... I feel dumb now... I've literally spent 30 minutes checking all the different triggers, I think I know exactly how this map works now Before I opened the map in the editor, I've spent fifteen minutes looking at those glowing rocks, at the edge of the map, built a base on the ruins of the Skullblade stronghold. I've built boneyard IN EVERY MILDLY SUSPICIOUS AREA, I've tried raising EVERY bone doodad on the map. All for it to be that simple...

Same feelings.

I just noticed something.
So orcs are immune to demonic control, as being this the reason why there aren't orc demon slaves, correct? But they aren't immune to both Sapphira's Charm and the Basnhee's Possession.
Undead Magic >>> Demon Magic.
By the way, I am well aware that the Demonlords we face in Arkain have the same ability. This is just a joke.

 

[Mvicio]

Excuse me. I'm still recovering from the shock... THAT IS ALL I HAD TO DO?! You can't imagine the things i have done, YOU CAN'T! I've looked at the triggers, I've checked EVERYTHING, except that... I feel dumb now...

We are stupid indeed. We are smart enough to mind control the wyverns. To build a base in the ashes of the skullblade... But not to CHARM a peon.

But they aren't immune to both Sapphira's Charm and the Basnhee's Possession.
Undead Magic >>> Demon Magic.
By the way, I am well aware that the Demonlords we face in Arkain have the same ability. This is just a joke.

So elves Magic = Demonlord Magic. I knew those green lovers cant be trusted.
Either that or the demonlords are as charming as a elf, either Alive or dead. That felt awkward.

 

[LISBOAH]

We are stupid indeed. We are smart enough to mind control the wyverns. To build a base in the ashes of the skullblade... But not to CHARM a peon.

Yeah, it was that simple., apparently.

So elves Magic = Demonlord Magic. I knew those green lovers cant be trusted.
Either that or the demonlords are as charming as a elf, either Alive or dead. That felt awkward.

Well, Renova might be charming in terms of appearence, but that is it. In the meantime, some demons seem to have a more approachable personality.

Say what you want about Ornassion, but I would rather have him as an ally than Renova. The guy actually hates scheming and treachery. And while he might ruthless and bloodthirsty, he is open about it, and doesn't hide under a façade.

 

[Enki555]

For Bloodbath, minor suggestions:
-Margazar not healed by Death Coil? It should be available.
-What about founding altar for Fleshtearer and Margazar to revive so that they could undyingly defend the base unless...
-Allowing Queen of Suffering to be trained by demons should make the mission even more challenging...

 

[FOEHN]

Current Betrayal suggestion
-Kome issue has been already spoken by many people so I will be shush about it
-Actually, in case if you have difficulty in making Kome defend themselves better, you could make dialog of someone(Merlon?) mocking Komes suck with defending(referring siege of Kome directly maybe?) while they are good at attacking(and Salana insists on Merlon to be shush about it in front of them)
-No dialog after killing the wolves?
-No dialog on Genethas' side when they see Aedale?
-I still support the idea that Lerrig's forces should arrive later in the battle, maybe after first Kome wave, taking over upper side of the Genethas base. This could become another reason Kome defenses start to crumble(and give more reason for Gardon and Merlon hating Lerrig). If this can't be the case, I think it would be better to show Genethas side during intro including Lerrig's arrival, like Salana one.
-I also still support forest creatures dominating the map at first, making battlefield MORE chaotic
-I kinda think navy can have some role like, supporting upper side siege. Connected with Merlon mocking Kome defense capability Gardon could order Merlon to send his fleet to support Kome. I'm not sure but ships can attack upper side of Lerrig's base maybe?
-Maybe I missed it but still Theoden, Salana, Gardon and Merlon still has no dialogs during battle
-Gardon nor Genethas/Lerrig doesn't make any 'encouragements' to their soldiers? I remember atleast Gardon made something like that in original
-Progaderas still didn't drop Orb of Fire
-Dwarven hero who leads Dwarves instead of Zarin would be good
-Personal preference but I hope we can see three lieutenants accompanied Salana back than, they supporting Salana could be cool, and ofc she commenting about it too
-Oh and, Souleater legion's red

 

[Shar Dundred]

The long awaited End of Act Four will be released today!

 

[Karmondia]

WOW, this new chapter was AWESOME! It was a fitting end to the first book era!