Draenor

[AIagremm]

Thats because he kinda allowed them. The people of Stormwind - they are fools. I remember how when I played WoW, I accidentaly, without even knowing about it, found warlock hideout in a tavern with a creepy name. I would lead the whole's city's defences and armies in this tavern and Stockade, destroying them! But Stormwind sucks since the end of the Second War.

 

[Fussiler1]

Why would he allow warlocks?

 

[AIagremm]

WoW stuff. He would never allow warlocks, but the "Orcs need a Warlock class in WoW" so we have it. Another stupid stuff they made Thrall do to keep the game balance is to accept Forsaken and Blood Elves in the Horde.

 

[Fussiler1]

That isn't stupid, actually. It's quite smart.
Thrall would've needed allies in the Eastern Kingdoms to have influence there and prevent the Alliance of growing too strong.

 

[AIagremm]

He would never allow warlocks in the Horde, after he saw what happened to Grom in the day of his death.
And first of all blood elves and Forsakne would never join the Horde... well at leats blood elves. BE and F are their own legacy - I call them Avengers. perhaps the naga are with them.

 

[Misha]

good point

 

[AIagremm]

Races of the avengers:

• Blood Elves who hate Alliance for their "betrayal"
• Forsaken who hate everything
• Naga who hate night elves and stuff

Their allies are:

• Illidari - broken, fel orcs, satyrs, demons(De facto Outland Avengers, sponsors and supporters of Azerothian Avengers)
• Defias Brotherhood(Possibly, but not really allied. Just share some stuff like information)

Satyrs, dark iron dwarves and black dragons may also be allies of Avengers, or share the same ideology. Syndicate may also be spies of Avengers.

 

[Misha]

we need just one more race so we can put entirely new WoW faction >D

 

[AIagremm]

Satyrs? Fel orcs? Mermaids?

 

[AIagremm]

Guys, check this out. I hope you will like it.

 

[VeljkoM]

Whoa whole discussion without me T.T

 

[StormWarriors2]

Fail?

 

[AIagremm]

I guess so.

 

[AIagremm]

Do you think, that if the titans will somehow find out what happened to Draenor, will they rebuild it? And if yes, do you think they will use the radical method.

 

[VeljkoM]

Why should they even care?

 

[AIagremm]

Because they bring order to the world, and wouldnt like that one of the worlds they worked on is ripped apart.

 

[VeljkoM]

But that is wrong world. And if they cared they would save Azeroth before it meets same fate as Dreanor.

 

[AIagremm]

They found out when Loken was killed in Ulduar, so they sent an observer to check the planet, for Old God infestation. He came and found out that there is a serious Old God problem(which is intriguing). A bunch of n00bs killed him, and he understood that rebuilding the planet(destroying and building it from metal, stone and air)is bad, since there are so many great races. He helped the races to send a positive code to the Pantheon. So Azeroth is in its own hands right now.

 

[VeljkoM]

But that's WoW... and that guy talked more like Protoss or terran probe than a mystic being.

 

[AIagremm]

He was made of pure energy. I kinda liked him ^^

 

[VeljkoM]

The raid destroyer that loots players and eats their tears. I like him too but he isn't real. Players were just manipulated by old gods.

 

[AIagremm]

Seriously. How could they even think about trying to kill a creation of titans, sent by them?
Anyone would try to interrogate.

 

[VeljkoM]

It is like killing a coast guard that is trying to save you from drowning. I say old gods manipulated players and they thought that they killed Titan creation so they would loose hope.

Also he doesn't look like he is from Warcraft at all. He probably was sent by Xel'naga to go to Starcraft and he got lost.

 

[Fussiler1]

I just realized something strange.
The Dragonmaw Clan. But how could it be named like that, if there weren't any Dragons in Draenor before Deathwing? Or had it another name back then?

 

[AIagremm]

Oh, thats one of the greatest mysteries. It is said that they were named so before Dark Portal, but there were no dragons in Draenor.
It is said that dragon meant serpent in language of orcs, but it doesnt fit a bit, so its a retcon that's never been retconned for some strange reason.

 

[VeljkoM]

Deathwing appeared in post second war so he wasn't first dragon seen by orcs. Dragonmaw clan was created somewhere in second war I think (well it would make more sense). They were to small to be very old clan. Or maybe originally dragon were on dreanor?

 

[AIagremm]

No they werent. There were only basiliscs, salamanders and lizards and possibly chimaeras. I too think that Dragonmaw should have been said to be created in the Second or even after the First War. But strangely it is said that its a clan from Draenor, that came to Azeroth later.

 

[VeljkoM]

It looks that paradox was created by novel "rise of the Horde" since there dragonmaw clan existed before Second war. Not to mention that in warcraft 2 manual that clan existed before warlocks.

 

[AIagremm]

I guess so.

 

[VeljkoM]

Gameplay before lore is number 2 rule of Blizzard.

 

[AIagremm]

The mystery of the name from WoWWiki:

It is unknown exactly what prompted the orcs to name their clan "Dragonmaw". It is apparent from Rise of the Horde that their name had been such for many years — long before the orcs encountered anything resembling dragons, the dragons being native to Azeroth. It is possible the Dragonmaw changed their name after they took command of the Red Dragonflight, or after Deathwing flew into the Dark Portal and secreted a clutch of eggs in Outland which, subsequently, hatched. However, this would nullify Rise of the Horde, in which the name of the clan is Dragonmaw — years before the idea of the Dark Portal was even devised. This may mean that there are or were dragons native to Draenor, or at the very least they existed in the form of mythological creatures in orcish culture — which would indicate that the Titans came to Draenor as well, which in turn indicates that the "reborn" Azeroth, freed from the Old Gods, predates Draenor.

 

[VeljkoM]

It should not be taken as representing official lore.

You forgot this

 

[AIagremm]

Exactly. And personally I dont agree.
But, the only reason why the name is confusing is in one point of a novel, and we all know how "lore-accurate" most novels are.

 

[VeljkoM]

Hey that my line! Also it isn't considered lore since it is fan based.

And second reason is Warcraft 2 manual. It clearly states that Dragonmaw is older then warlocks which means Blizzard intended that Dragons were from Dreanor before they changed their mind latter.

 

[AIagremm]

Draenor was clearly visited by the titans. Colossus' prove that.

 

[VeljkoM]

Wait you mean gods (younger then old) or titans created by gods?

 

[AIagremm]

No, I mean mountain giants of Draenor.
It seems that they were on Draenor since there is normal life there, and colossuses.
However in Draenor they used normal life matrix. Azeroth was an experimental territory, with new ways of creating life(earthen), research facilities and extremely dangerous prisoners. However it seems that Draenor didnt avoid Old God infestation after all. From the looks of it, there is at least one Old God, who seems to be not as powerfull as Azerothian ones, but still powerfull. He also seems to be chained somewhere in the deeps... and still his prison is only a little shattered. But if he did influence... wait! What if Draenor giants(f.e. ogres)originate from assimilated Colossuses(Draenor mountain giants)? They look pretty similar in shape.

 

[VeljkoM]

Giants that were used to make first orc undead buildings? Well many giants of dreanor are dead today. Only ogres still have "civilization" if you can call it that.

But Old god in Dreanor? That is just...just...

 

[AIagremm]

Crazy? Not really. Old Gods came from somewhere... and it is strange that titans didnt know about them, nor where they are from. Perhaps there is a world in which the Old Gods power is at full potential, where they summon their forces: faceless ones, protoplasms. The world must be completely corrupted. Like a virus-infested cell. Perhaps there is even some sort of source of corruption, like Well of eternity, only corrupted.
Perhaps even the Army of Light that is being created by the Naaru, will try to hold off the Force of Corruption.

Also there are no titan facilities or guardians in Draenor because it didnt have a source of concentarted magic.

 

[VeljkoM]

Old gods come from Zerus
Aren't old gods native to Azeroth but new gods kicked them out. There is no reason why Dreanor would have Old God but then they are just might crazy enough to go there. Maybe one came through one of million of portals.

And Protoplasmic creeps are from non lore campaign. Shouldn't they use elementals or something like that. I personally think that Dwarven campaign is better but wow....

 

[AIagremm]

So you understood that all of that stuff I said is from Dwarf Campaign? ^^
You are right, and I really like it. It almost seems like some lore they created was stolen by Blizzard. N'Gah the dreaded citadel of the Old Gods is awesome, but there are no Old Gods there.

No Old Gods arent native to Azeorth. After the titans seeded life in Azeroth, necrophotic creatures(Old Gods)infected the planet. However their power was so great that some of titan projects had to be restarted after defeat of the Old Gods. Plus they put a lot of guardians in Azeroth.

I only wonder, where'd they come from?

 

[VeljkoM]

Zerus as I said.

But In wiki it says that Old gods ruled Azeroth and then guardians saw the planet. It was clearly stated that Old gods were there before Titans and rest.

 

[AIagremm]

It was retconned, however I seriously dont think that such powerfull creatures could be native to Azeroth even in the previous lore.

BTW, whats Zerus?

 

[VeljkoM]

Old gods were there as "gods" not simple beings. Well in wiki lore is that old gods were there then titans.

And is that hard to guess what Zerus is? It is zerg birth planet.

 

[AIagremm]

Yeah, I thought it has something to do with zergs, however I wasnt sure.
And Old Gods are way too powerful, even for Overmind, especially since his powers are specialized for some special things by Xel'Naga. Like controlling zergs.
Also, its interesting what happened to those Xel'Naga who he assimilated?

 

[VeljkoM]

Nah they operate very similar. Old gods only lack the mutation virus but they do same thing. They mind control races and powerful beings. Owermind is more powerful since he can teleport. And about xel'naga it seems he absorbed part of their their knowledge and learned about protoss.

 

[AIagremm]

I know about that, but what happend to them? I guess they couldnt be assimilated, so soon they desinigrated.
Also, Old Gods can teleport, Azeorthian ones cant. C'thun because he is really weakened, and others because they are imprisoned. I wonder what will happen when all of them get free. Also, C'thun was killed. Since he was thought to be killed, it seems that his death wont destroy Azeorth. But if the others will die...

Old Gods use artifacts in which they send their power and their minds and powers to change or to be correct assimialte somebody.

And what do you mean they dont have a virus thingy? What about the Curse of the Flesh?

 

[VeljkoM]

Curse of the flesh doesn't have anything to do with mutation virus (it also doesn't make sense). Mutation virus is what gives zergs ability to evolve and infest.

Do you wander how Arthas was able to do what titas couldn't?

Oh and xel'naga bodies were probably no use to the zerg. They eradicate what they see as weak.

 

[AIagremm]

Xel'Naga? Weak? Perhaps...

Curse of the Flesh really doesnt give ability to evolve and infest...
Or does it? Faceless ones(succesfully assimilated)are made out of tecntacles, so they can easily evolve into more powerfull forms. Plus the Curse sometimes acts as a virus - it can spread from one to another.

 

[VeljkoM]

Well physically. Or maybe they were sick or something.

Faceless are ancient and nowhere was mentioned that they are assimilated creatures. And curse turned metal to flesh which makes no sense. There were flesh creatures before that curse I mean just look at all other worlds.