Warcraft III Reforged 1.32.10 PTR Patch Notes

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I dont understand how some people can blame the community for the state of reforged.
Was it the community that advertised and hyped features that had been dropped more than a year ago on the W3 product page? ..
Was it the community that caused the game to go from desyncing some custom games to even desyncing melee games to the extend of changing entire tournaments outomes?
Was it the community that permanently removed features like custom campaigns?
Was it the community that regressed performance of a 20 year old game to the point it could not maintain 60fps anymore on modern hardware?

Was it the community that sold their soul to the chinese government and directly repressed players?
Was it the community that said "if you touch this game with a long stick we will claim all your work as our own" and gave the middle finger to everybody that has worked to provide the content that has kept this game alive for the past ~20 years??

The only one who fucked over Blizzard's reputation is blizzard themselves. The only ones who are soley responsible for the state of Warcraft 3 reforged are blizzard. Blizzards actions have always been driving this downwards spiral, they opeted to take all of the communities plentiful good will and turn it all into cold hard cash then and there.

Why isn't warctaft 3 reforged in a better state? Because that would have cost money, and they opted to just have the profits right away and not give a shit about the mess they made.
 
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Stop me if I'm wrong but the reforged team before they got booted had a roadmap and updates to fix all this correct? I mean they knew they messed up and that marketing probably over promised and was working to fix everything. So why did the community bring forth a smear campaign and demand refunds like it wasn't acknowledged already that stuff was broken and a plan to fix them was in place.

The outrage was so bad that the old team got fired, right? So now this completely new team that knows nothing about WC3 code, nothing about the updated code and no idea how or why the old team broke portions of it now has to learn it all and fix it? Please we'd have been better off with the last team; by now they would have been able to fix their shit instead of getting a whole new team. So yes, I do blame the communities pointless outrage.

If they released it and said, "Yep all fine we aren't fixing shit." then sure, outrage. Smear. Get them to listen.
But if they already said they are working on it then why did everyone still lose their minds?
 
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If you are modding, there are plenty of reasons to be excited. The UI natives are awesome and so is Lua (and TypeScript by proxy).
Oh yes, indeed! I've seen some of the newer things in the modding scene for Reforged and can say, I'm very impressed. It can be modded into a whole new different game even like those passion projects I've seen that really edited out the whole system and feel of the game, far from the original look (changes on movement system, rehaul of game UI, etc.).

As for me, not sure if I'd return to the modding scene. Seeing I have lots of dropped projects too and I didn't know that much back in the days other than terrain art and I was kinda overly passionate despite that. And now is always a busy day in college so there's that, too. I'll probably check out the new maps and all though once I get myself into Reforged again. Can't wait to try them out!
 
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I had assumed that support for WarCraft III was well and truly over, so I'm pleasantly surprised to see it get a new patch, however small it might be and even though I have no interest in the multiplayer game. (Indeed, fixing the issues I personally have with its balance would take more than a patch of this type.) I am a bit concerned by custom campaigns not being mentioned at all alongside ranked play, leaderboards, and player profiles.

So, based on the above, somebody was probably trying to turn the .w3n format into a general "mod" format for me and probably screwed it all up so that "restoring the feature" of custom campaigns is probably not nearly as easy as you think.

We might as well cut the (now non-existent) team some slack, assuming custom campaigns are never coming back (if for nothing else because of the above chat log) and stop complaining, and just take each moment as a glorious opportunity to continue our lives. If they add a custom campaign feature, that's like when somebody gives you a gift. Because it would be unexpected.

Interesting suggestion, but I don't find it very plausible. If someone had "screwed it all up" – either screwing up the game's ability to handle the format or screwing up the format itself – they could just roll back. These are professional programmers after all; they will use version control.
 
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Stop me if I'm wrong but the reforged team before they got booted had a roadmap and updates to fix all this correct? I mean they knew they messed up and that marketing probably over promised and was working to fix everything. So why did the community bring forth a smear campaign and demand refunds like it wasn't acknowledged already that stuff was broken and a plan to fix them was in place.

The outrage was so bad that the old team got fired, right? So now this completely new team that knows nothing about WC3 code, nothing about the updated code and no idea how or why the old team broke portions of it now has to learn it all and fix it? Please we'd have been better off with the last team; by now they would have been able to fix their shit instead of getting a whole new team. So yes, I do blame the communities pointless outrage.

If they released it and said, "Yep all fine we aren't fixing shit." then sure, outrage. Smear. Get them to listen.
But if they already said they are working on it then why did everyone still lose their minds?

I think you're misremembering. Looking back through past posts on the official forums, initially they released it and said nothing – features were removed and there was no explanation of why, or even acknowledgement that it had happened. The first acknowledgement of any missing features came a week after release, by which time the review bombing had already happened. But then they only mentioned leaderboards and clans, and the post also said "we’re sorry to those of you who didn’t have the experience you wanted", which some people interpreted as blaming the fans for having the wrong expectations. As far as I can tell, the first time they acknowledged all of the missing features was 1st March, by which time the damage was well and truly done.
 
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This kind of seems like an update they absolutely needed to do rather than one done to help improve the game. It seems like some game-breaking bugs/glitches needed to be fixed ASAP and they couldn't put off releasing this. Honestly, though? I prefer them doing stuff like this once in a blue moon as opposed to releasing monthly patches full of absolutely nothing significant as if to further mock their already wounded playerbase. The new team is already doing moderately better than the old one.

I'm not sure if I buy the whole "COVID is the reason we haven't added ladders/clans/custom campaigns" excuse. It seems more like Blizzard isn't letting the team put much time or manpower into it as War3 isn't a moneymaker right now. Even still, I can hardly blame them for not wanting to admit that.

Overall, its much better to have a patch filled with significant/necessary changes after a few months rather than having a completely useless one every single month. Congrats, Blizzard. You're back up to 0 again!
 

Rui

Rui

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@Retera your posts are interesting to read, but sometimes you make a mountain out of a molehill. I don't buy the "who's to blame" business, even though Warcraft III is the game of my childhood. Figures I'd have plenty of motivation to vent, but I have a tendency for stoicism these days.

Even so, a community modding, playing, and keeping the game alive was Reforged's sole reason for being. Given that circumstance, Blizzard saw an opportunity to milk some money out of it. They rushed an unstable remaster, probably the first in history that actually removes features from the original game (being custom campaigns under the limelight), with a controversial art revamp, and charged 40$ for it. When they had promised fully remastered campaigns, and what would seem like the world and beyond, for those who have been working with an aging product.

Next thing you know, the community lashes out? Sounds like basic human psychology to me. You can blame it (and I know you like to 😁) on people following their basic instincts. Which is worse? Anger over a broken promise and a given word, or greed?
 
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I'm glad Blizzard is still working on Warcraft III Reforged. I thought they have totally abandoned it.

I'm one of the few people who appreciate both melee and World Editor updates. I watch melee games in YouTube and enjoy seeing the reaction of the melee players. The World Editor updates in 1.31 were already overwhelming and it's potential is just underappreciated.

I understand why people are still upset, as the mistakes (reworked main menu with missing features like custom campaign, performance issues, lack of quality check to the 3D models) felt like a really bad customer service if it is left hanging in future updates. I believe the developers are very aware of it and they are doing their best to fix these issues.

Please take your time and enjoy the development of this awesome game.
 
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@verstefyren Indeed it is - same amount of time it would take you to change it in the World Editor. Testing the changes might take more time if there was any testing. Basically this is not an update. Not sure what one could call this.
A hotfix. It was created to fix some game-breaking glitches and exploits, and tinkered some minor stuff. It was necessary. Unlike the year's worth of meaningless crap the old team used to release monthly.

It's extremely hard for me to talk about this remaster without venting my heartbroken anger and masking it as smarmy roasts so I'm just gonna stop here.
 

Retera

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It's extremely hard for me to talk about this remaster without venting my heartbroken anger

Today I am making profiles. Those will be the categories under which I can store campaign data, and also custom campaign data :)

I do not know what possesses you to say and believe this thing that you do, but do you honestly leave it to someone else to decide how you feel? Of all things to be heartbroken about -- Reforged? Really?

Gandalf once said, "There are other forces at work in this world besides the will of evil."
 
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Some people defending Blizzard forgot what Blizzard did. What they did is a crime in some countries and they still did it. They promised tons of stuff which they did not deliver at launch which qualifies as false marketing which is a crime. What is worse, since people got disappointed, they asked for refunds and complained, some got banned, some refunds got denied. And after several days of raging worldwide, on youtube and social networks, and awesome 0.5 rating :cgrin: , after people finally stood up against greedy corporation, they finally gave people the option to refund! I heard that inspections in some countries ,,started to work", which also helped people to get refund...
I always found it amusing defend try for Blizzard by their fans ,,they could not do it quickly, they will deliver in patches"... but they can rapidly accept money! I never saw that they had a problem with taking money, they were quick about that. Only when they had to deliver something, or to communicate with people. Oh communication! I had proofs, and I reported that back then everywhere... Few days before official release, their ,,community manager" moderator had only 4 posts! We asked him if he is alive. I still can't believe how they allowed it! Just few days before release, their man whose is charge for communicating with people was actually absent all time! Nobody was in forums to talk to us.
And I am proud I was with other people back then to show them a lesson which they will never forget. Wc3 had around 9 ratings, Reforged got 0.4 Hahaha!
 

Retera

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I always found it amusing defend try for Blizzard by their fans
No, no, you're not getting it. There is no Blizzard. The thing that you think is being defended does not exist. There is just a WoW dealership (WoW is a series of WC3 maps with engine-level support for more players at a time.) And we know from 15+ years of not updating Warcraft 3 that they do not update things that are not financially viable to update.

I do not think that the WoW dealership made any mistakes. I think that they are still making very good money. If anything, if I had any investments in my former WoW dealership (I don't) then I would be worried about them given that they are still releasing updates to Reforged. I think that would not be a good use of my investment, since I am not able to foresee or imagine any large number of people purchasing Reforged, since most of the development work done on it (which was a lot of dev time!) was released to the public for free.

This is pretty blatant victim-blaming. We are not to blame for Blizzard's mistakes.
Alright. I kid, I kid. Reforged was more than I ever expected from my WoW dealership. While I accrued 130 days straight of total log-in time on World of Warcraft, it quickly became evident to me that the WoW dealership's focus is on financial gain and not on how I feel. The first place I ever heard the expression "community" applied to Warcraft III was from the Reforged dev team members when they needed a way to have an excuse for their actions.

It is quite clear that nobody else shares my vision of spending $2000 on Warcraft III to try to offset the WoW dealership's statistical analyses. Also, that was evident to me from the start. I have a private phone video of myself that I recorded in 2017 after I heard a rumor from a believable source that there was eventually going to be a Warcraft III remaster. In the video, I clearly state that I am confused about it since it would not make money. I pointed out that they could make a poop expansion that only adds poop units to the game and I would still buy it, but selling the product in this manner is not going to reach enough people to be profitable. It was a matter of "target audience" I said in this little time machine to myself. I said something to the affect that I "only played Warcraft III because of certain other people who were playing it, and those people have moved on and are not going to play a Warcraft III remaster. So instead it has to target people similar to those -- and other social groups."

There was never any evidence (to me at least) of the Reforged team spending any legitimate time caring about that problem. Like me modding the game, they simply did what was fun, and they even stooped to care about my (ill-advised) feedback. But I, too, was just having fun. It just goes to show that the main attraction of this game is being non-technically-skilled and still being able to get things done in the World Editor, and so if you hire people who enjoy that... they are probably not going to be very technically skilled (otherwise they would have moved on to some other better activity with their life :p)!

With that said, Reforged is the reason we're all here, so, like it or not, I think that's kind of amazing.
 
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All items’ re-sell percentage increased from 50% to 75% of the item’s original cost.
  • Developers’ notes: These are probably the biggest changes in this patch. We’re making some changes to all the Aura items to reduce their effectiveness. We believe that these aura items do have a place in the game but should not have parity in power to the actual hero ability. Also, due to the nature of some items being more impactful than others, we’re increasing the sell rate of items to help mitigate some potential “bad item luck” that players may experience, which can ultimately determine the outcome of some games.

When I read about this, I'm curious if it affects custom games. I tested this in the PTR.

This change is only applied when the Game Data Set is set into "Melee (Latest Patch)" in 1.32.10. Re-sell percentage of items in custom games (Game Data Set that is set into "Default (based on melee map melee status)") are unaffected. (still 50%)

I learned just now that you can customize the re-sell percentage in the Gameplay Constants. This option is available even in the earlier versions of Warcraft III.

I bought this up since in my 18 years of custom map experience, I didn't knew you can customize the re-sell percentage of the items. I never saw any custom map that modifies it.
 
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I do not think that the WoW dealership made any mistakes.
So, this all law-breaking, and everything what happened is no a mistake..... Then it is worse, it is being done on purpose. Then they should be punished even more, they got what they deserve. Their reputation got damaged because of that.
It is quite clear that nobody else shares my vision of spending $2000 on Warcraft III to try to offset the WoW dealership's statistical analyses. Also, that was evident to me from the start.
HAHAHAHA! to spend 2000$ on Blizzard! On Reforged! :cgrin:
Did you saw what actually happened year ago? People not that did not want to support them, actually vast majority refunded their money back, thus giving name Warcraft: Refunded
I saw what you (or someone else, I apologize in advance) wrote before, that we should support their employees. Why should we care about them? Do they care about other professions worldwide (let say as an example, doctors and other medical workers worldwide who die from this virus to save people's lives)? I did not see that Blizzard employees tried to protect any other profession in the world, and now people should stand for them in turn.
That was for first, and for second, considering a fact that they worked for Blizzard leads to fact that they are skilled and professionals at what they do, which leads to another fact that they can more easily find another similar job. They are professionals and can work for someone else.
And third, they knew exactly for what type of company they worked, for which devil they signed contract. They knew that they will soon or less be thrown away by the company like we throw garbage in the trash (I heard recently that Blizzard fired some employees). EA Games also did this many times over. Once their C&C series turned out to be bad, they always fire up their employees. It happened that they closed the whole sub-company whose worked on certain game firing everyone inside. And yet, people come back to work for them. Why? Simple because they do not care about each other. They do not ,,support" each other. (for example, when mass employees protested against google, that was certain sign that something happened. If Blizzard employees started rapidly to complain, protest, to stand for each other, to downrate company etc etc... I mean any way of fight they can imagine... many fans would join them, and overall they would reduce drastically company's reputation and this is what any company considers as a great hit to them, when their precious reputation got damaged, then they will start negotiating, and usually undo their moves). But no, they have that silent mentality, nobody is fighting bullies today...
And fourth, even if they are fooled like the rest of us, that is good for them. That means that they should not do for such company whose fools their customers and employees, and they should find someone who respect them more and their work and energy they put into that company.
Or we can do your method.... We can all spend 2000$ to support people whose gonne get fired.... And what worse, you do not pay to them, you pay to the corporation. And that corporation decided WHAT AND WHEN AND HOW MUCH will their employee get. You cannot spend your 2000$ and note specifically that ,,this money goes to employees". Now, if some are fired anyway, if rumors are correct, then you can find them and donate them money, that is the best way to support employee, but not via the corporation.
Retera, that is not just reply to you, but for anyone who wanted to ,,support" their employees. I am always in side of employees, and against companies, but I hate when you need to support or fight for someone who just shuts up all the time and remains silent while such companies grow bigger and bigger. For that very reason, as there is nobody to stop them and their illegal activities until it is too late.
In the video, I clearly state that I am confused about it since it would not make money.
Hmmm..... then why would a corporation which just thinks about money would invest their holy money into a project which will not make them money in turn? I think that they overestimated themselves and their ,,power". They wanted easy money. You know, modern times ,,reality programs, show, internet, stupidity, modern generations..." they bring circus in town, promoting everything what they can, hoping that modern sleepy audience will just swallow it, and once it is done, take their money, release crappy project and move to another.... BUT! This time around was a different story. They did not count on massive outrage. AND 0.4 RATING HAHAHA!
With that said, Reforged is the reason we're all here, so, like it or not, I think that's kind of amazing.
But this is completely wrong. In my case at least. I did not play Reforged since the official release. I am here for good old (and new) people. People called me to come back many times over, and I simply cannot ignore it. It is stronger than me, those people here, this place.... Not some reforged.
 
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To be honest Master Haosis does have a few very good points here as long as we don't see any positives development from Blizzard than we should be highly doubtful about anything they post.

This is sad and it really breaks my heart to see a such beloved game loved by millions of fans fall so low it reminds of what my grandma said to me once the higher you to climb with your fantasies the faster reality will drag down to the ground.

Oh my how the mighty have fallen.
 
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Retera

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it really breaks my heart
It just seems to me that the problem with Reforged upsetting people is when they take it as someone's attempt at replacing their Warcraft III experiences. If Reforged were a mod published by the Warcraft III community, it would be highly regarded as one of the best mods created by the Warcraft III community in all of history.
 
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It just seems to me that the problem with Reforged upsetting people is when they take it as someone's attempt at replacing their Warcraft III experiences. If Reforged were a mod published by the Warcraft III community, it would be highly regarded as one of the best mods created by the Warcraft III community in all of history.
Totally.
 
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It just seems to me that the problem with Reforged upsetting people is when they take it as someone's attempt at replacing their Warcraft III experiences. If Reforged were a mod published by the Warcraft III community, it would be highly regarded as one of the best mods created by the Warcraft III community in all of history.
Well, yeah. The fact that it has completely erased and replaced the previous versions with no way to roll back is definitely the biggest drawback.
 
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It just seems to me that the problem with Reforged upsetting people is when they take it as someone's attempt at replacing their Warcraft III experiences. If Reforged were a mod published by the Warcraft III community, it would be highly regarded as one of the best mods created by the Warcraft III community in all of history.
Yeah if they made it mod it would rank as one of the bests but when they made it game they screwed up bigtime
 
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It just seems to me that the problem with Reforged upsetting people is when they take it as someone's attempt at replacing their Warcraft III experiences. If Reforged were a mod published by the Warcraft III community, it would be highly regarded as one of the best mods created by the Warcraft III community in all of history.
Agree. They made it harder to allow other experiences and more or less shoved it down peoples throats as their only alternative.
It turns out, people don't like stuff shoved down their throats. Who would've guessed?
 
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It just seems to me that the problem with Reforged upsetting people is when they take it as someone's attempt at replacing their Warcraft III experiences. If Reforged were a mod published by the Warcraft III community, it would be highly regarded as one of the best mods created by the Warcraft III community in all of history.
That argument is wrong, it's not a mod and those 2xGB aren't optional

I know it's not related directly to this balance changes update, but I think many users don't grasp the whole of what blizzard has done, even before reforged was released the game was in a bad state
There is more to it than reforged is a bad release, an inferior product compared to the legacy, like the patches from 1.30 onward destroying the game: legacy custom maps not working, no more dedicated server hosting, no more opengl, the audio issues... (but the natives!)
Then there is the actual reforged release which is a waste of resources shoved at everybody throat, replacing the legacy client with reforged, also replacing the bnet multiplayer with an inferior one
Then there is the hive users "working closely with blizzard" barely communicating or warning the community about what was happening or going to happen (in retrospect it's easy to infer why)
Then there is "classic team" caring more about blizzard or themselves, and going ahead with the game "destruction", ironically they got "destroyed", I don't get how anyone can refer to them with any kind of appreciation, when in practical terms they are the ones responsible for forcefully REPLACING the game with an inferior version without recourse, they knew this would happen

I don't think warcraft 3 is completely dead (I keep playing it, on patch 1.28.5), but it's already fragmented between the single player community which is probably using the last version because "mah natives" and the multiplayer community which requires bots to be tolerable
 
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I stopped playing back then when I got annoyed by audio bugs where I would for example hear random sounds like Infernals or elementals dying and Undead building construction SUPER LOUD IN ANY PART OF THE MAP! This was introduced in one of the patches like 9 months before Reforged actually came in January 2020. -_- In addition to people desyncing in customs maps... Then never again was I motivated to play Wc3 again to check if this stuff was fixed BUT I always kept a close eye on the community both on forums and on Discord and never have I read anything from active players that would give me hope and motivation to start playing again. I mostly played custom maps like Lordaeron The Aftermath/Foremath, (any Marshmallo map tbh lol :D), Survival Chaos etc...
 
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Then there is the hive users "working closely with blizzard" barely communicating or warning the community about what was happening or going to happen (in retrospect it's easy to infer why)

If there was anything remotely official about this, then those hive users would have signed non-disclosure agreements, which – knowing Blizzard – would have been as restrictive as possible. That said, whenever I see someone claiming to have been working closely with Blizzard (or sometimes even claiming to have been employed by Blizzard), I take it with a large pinch of salt. This is the internet, after all...

I agree with your post though, and I find all the raving about natives rather wearing...
 
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I stopped playing back then when I got annoyed by audio bugs where I would for example hear random sounds like Infernals or elementals dying and Undead building construction SUPER LOUD IN ANY PART OF THE MAP! This was introduced in one of the patches like 9 months before Reforged actually came in January 2020. -_- In addition to people desyncing in customs maps... Then never again was I motivated to play Wc3 again to check if this stuff was fixed BUT I always kept a close eye on the community both on forums and on Discord and never have I read anything from active players that would give me hope and motivation to start playing again. I mostly played custom maps like Lordaeron The Aftermath/Foremath, (any Marshmallo map tbh lol :D), Survival Chaos etc...
Making a post from a practical standpoint. Things have improved since, and the game seems in its most stable state since 1.26. The loss of features should not affect most devs/players of custom maps, unless we're talking about custom campaigns. Based on your message, this is not all that important to you.

I'm actually not too unhappy about the game state right now. Playerbase remains stable for many years, and it's a good environment to play custom games. It seems many players also opening up to newer and more different maps, because some older staples got broken. This is something I personally enjoy, but maybe not for the one who came for his dose of nostalgia.

The main downer is that the game performance has gone down, which makes playing on an old pc hard. And there are some annoying bugs that require being worked around as a mapmaker.
 

Kam

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I encourage you all to keep an open mind as patching continues. There will be many issues in the future but hopefully this patch is a good sign about resourcing on the project. Don't expect them to have a mastery of this now ~21 year old code base. Even with William, you all, and myself providing input we still made mistakes and discovered new issues.
 
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I encourage you all to keep an open mind as patching continues. There will be many issues in the future but hopefully this patch is a good sign about resourcing on the project. Don't expect them to have a mastery of this now ~21 year old code base. Even with William, you all, and myself providing input we still made mistakes and discovered new issues.
Do you know what's the final goal in terms of the game state with the patches?
 

pyf

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[...] Don't expect them to have a mastery of this now ~21 year old code base. [...]
... with some ~5 year old brand new code sometimes leading to unexpected side effects.

By now, I would expect the entire source code to be fully and extensively documented, so that any team of programmers can take over this software development project.
 
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... with some ~5 year old brand new code sometimes leading to unexpected side effects.

By now, I would expect the entire source code to be fully and extensively documented, so that any team of programmers can take over this software development project.
Given how the original code might not be fully documented prior and even with all the new patches since 2016, I'm uncertain it's fully documented to be honest.
 
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... with some ~5 year old brand new code sometimes leading to unexpected side effects.

By now, I would expect the entire source code to be fully and extensively documented, so that any team of programmers can take over this software development project.

Devs under pressure rarely have time to document things, so I wouldn't hold my breath. Whether its documented or not is mostly a question of priorities set by management - and documentation is typically pretty far down the list of priorities.
 
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Well, dismissing the old team wasn't the smartest idea. Now, new developers will have to maintain code they have never seen and as far as I my understanding is that there will be some external team for all the classic games. As long as there are no custom campaigns and the main menu lags as hell, the game is not complete etc.

I don't understand how this company cannot invest some money in their classic games to fix its reputation.

Just make the code base Open Source like they did it for for Jedi Knight, so we can maintain a community build. I think we would patch all important things in a few months. This is just fucking stupid right now. You could also add some ingame content which can be bought to make some money from some addicted players, so we modders will get patches since you will earn money again.

 

General Frank

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I don't understand how this company cannot invest some money in their classic games to fix its reputation.
Because you do not want to hove less money. Right? Right?! RIGHT?!?

But in all seriousness, for Activision wc3 is not important and they could not careless for the year-long shitstorm.
If they would be clever they can invest some money and actually deliver what they promised.
 
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Son now? after that revolutionary patch. How long should we wait before infantry get 1 more damage, and ghoul 3 more Move speed lol

No seriously.
Did Blizzard knows about what we are waiting for? In how many times will we have an other CORRECTIVE patch? Can we know their roadmap? How many people are constanly in the Warcraft 3 team? Can we help to priorize features?

I really like that game, and it would be nice to have more informations.
 
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Level 11
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Mar 18, 2014
Messages
579
So, this all law-breaking, and everything what happened is no a mistake..... Then it is worse, it is being done on purpose. Then they should be punished even more, they got what they deserve. Their reputation got damaged because of that.

HAHAHAHA! to spend 2000$ on Blizzard! On Reforged! :cgrin:
Did you saw what actually happened year ago? People not that did not want to support them, actually vast majority refunded their money back, thus giving name Warcraft: Refunded
I saw what you (or someone else, I apologize in advance) wrote before, that we should support their employees. Why should we care about them? Do they care about other professions worldwide (let say as an example, doctors and other medical workers worldwide who die from this virus to save people's lives)? I did not see that Blizzard employees tried to protect any other profession in the world, and now people should stand for them in turn.
That was for first, and for second, considering a fact that they worked for Blizzard leads to fact that they are skilled and professionals at what they do, which leads to another fact that they can more easily find another similar job. They are professionals and can work for someone else.
And third, they knew exactly for what type of company they worked, for which devil they signed contract. They knew that they will soon or less be thrown away by the company like we throw garbage in the trash (I heard recently that Blizzard fired some employees). EA Games also did this many times over. Once their C&C series turned out to be bad, they always fire up their employees. It happened that they closed the whole sub-company whose worked on certain game firing everyone inside. And yet, people come back to work for them. Why? Simple because they do not care about each other. They do not ,,support" each other. (for example, when mass employees protested against google, that was certain sign that something happened. If Blizzard employees started rapidly to complain, protest, to stand for each other, to downrate company etc etc... I mean any way of fight they can imagine... many fans would join them, and overall they would reduce drastically company's reputation and this is what any company considers as a great hit to them, when their precious reputation got damaged, then they will start negotiating, and usually undo their moves). But no, they have that silent mentality, nobody is fighting bullies today...
And fourth, even if they are fooled like the rest of us, that is good for them. That means that they should not do for such company whose fools their customers and employees, and they should find someone who respect them more and their work and energy they put into that company.
Or we can do your method.... We can all spend 2000$ to support people whose gonne get fired.... And what worse, you do not pay to them, you pay to the corporation. And that corporation decided WHAT AND WHEN AND HOW MUCH will their employee get. You cannot spend your 2000$ and note specifically that ,,this money goes to employees". Now, if some are fired anyway, if rumors are correct, then you can find them and donate them money, that is the best way to support employee, but not via the corporation.
Retera, that is not just reply to you, but for anyone who wanted to ,,support" their employees. I am always in side of employees, and against companies, but I hate when you need to support or fight for someone who just shuts up all the time and remains silent while such companies grow bigger and bigger. For that very reason, as there is nobody to stop them and their illegal activities until it is too late.

Hmmm..... then why would a corporation which just thinks about money would invest their holy money into a project which will not make them money in turn? I think that they overestimated themselves and their ,,power". They wanted easy money. You know, modern times ,,reality programs, show, internet, stupidity, modern generations..." they bring circus in town, promoting everything what they can, hoping that modern sleepy audience will just swallow it, and once it is done, take their money, release crappy project and move to another.... BUT! This time around was a different story. They did not count on massive outrage. AND 0.4 RATING HAHAHA!

But this is completely wrong. In my case at least. I did not play Reforged since the official release. I am here for good old (and new) people. People called me to come back many times over, and I simply cannot ignore it. It is stronger than me, those people here, this place.... Not some reforged.

You are really the heart and soul but most importantly the BRAIN of this website.
 
Level 23
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Sep 18, 2007
Messages
1,487
To be honest Master Haosis does have a few very good points here
Thank you istvan! :razz:
You are really the heart and soul but most importantly the BRAIN of this website.
You see @Ralle !!! After all those years!

Thank you YourArthas! I am glad that you like me :cgrin:
Unfortunately, Blizzard did not believe in me and what I wrote..... Otherwise, you would get more stable game, promised hours of new cinematics, frequent communication with them ..... And all would be better... Last year should not happen (AND 0.4 RATING haha). But no, they had to do it in harder way...
 

pyf

pyf

Level 29
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Mar 21, 2016
Messages
2,862
Given how the original code might not be fully documented prior and even with all the new patches since 2016, I'm uncertain it's fully documented to be honest.
Devs under pressure rarely have time to document things, so I wouldn't hold my breath. Whether its documented or not is mostly a question of priorities set by management - and documentation is typically pretty far down the list of priorities.
There has been a five year hiatus between v1.26a and 1.27a (from March 2011 until March 2016). And the serious fiddling with the internals of the game by the new team imho only began with the first batch of cleanups that started with 1.28.0, from April 2017 onwards.

So, six years were not enough to document/plan out something properly, in a relaxed way?

[...] Just make the code base Open Source like they did it for for Jedi Knight, so we can maintain a community build. [...]
@Barade: Whaaat? Link please. tia.

Afaik, LucasArts has lost the source code of Jedi Knight. You were very probably talking about Jedi Outcast?...
 
Level 12
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Messages
494
So, six years were not enough to document/plan out something properly, in a relaxed way?
I don't think there was anyone working on WC3 during 2011-2016.

What we're left with is the 2016-2020 period, during which, we've seen WC3 break over and over again. I'm pessimistic that documentation was a priority.
 
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pyf

pyf

Level 29
Joined
Mar 21, 2016
Messages
2,862
I don't think there was anyone working on WC3 during 2011-2016.
iirc the focus of the new Classic Team was on StarCraft and on Diablo II, at first.


For the sake of nostalgia, here is a link about the time when Blizzard had started hiring for their newly created Classic Games division:

2015. Tempus fugit...


You were very probably talking about Jedi Outcast?...

(Almost) quoting Wikipedia about Jedi Outcast, while also talking to myself in the process:
:wink:

"[...] Following Disney's decision to close LucasArts on April 3, 2013, the developers at Raven Software released the source code for the game on SourceForge under GNU GPLv2 licensing. A few days after release, the source code disappeared from SourceForge without explanation. SourceForge later explained to media outlet Kotaku that Raven Software had requested its removal. Kotaku speculated this was due to the presence of licensed code, such as for the Bink Video format from Rad Game Tools, that was not intended to be made public.

However, prior to the removal a fork called "OpenJK" was created on GitHub with the problematic code parts already excised. The goal of the OpenJK community project is to "maintain and improve Jedi Academy + Jedi Outcast released by Raven Software." [...]"

As of this writing, the source code has still not been re-posted where it had originally been released:

For the record, OpenJK is still not supporting the demo version of JO afaik
 
Level 9
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Oct 28, 2012
Messages
205
I encourage you all to keep an open mind as patching continues. There will be many issues in the future but hopefully this patch is a good sign about resourcing on the project. Don't expect them to have a mastery of this now ~21 year old code base. Even with William, you all, and myself providing input we still made mistakes and discovered new issues.
@Kam The trust has to be earned. Right now the Blizzard does not deserve our optimism or enthusiasm. Of course, it doesn't mean we should dwell in negativity and despair, but to me, those patch notes - over and over - prove, that the team either does not understand what the community desires, does not wishes to hear it, or simply can't deliver for various (quite possibly understandable) reasons.

Rebalancing stuff is mostly simply changing numbers. It is the features and code fixes that matter. Take a look at the patch history of Reforged. Can you tell me with a clear conscience that it suggests we should expect more?

I believe they can still make this right. But so far we got very little evidence that this hope isn't just a naive dream.

TL: DR; I will believe it when I see it ^^
 
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