Modeling Contest #29 - Squad

[Grey Knight]

I'm really excited from who will gonna win this contest
I hope maybe someday, I can Enter this contest
but first I'm going to study THW modeling tutorial but not only modeling

 

[-Grendel]

how is it hard to understand that squad = goblin sappers, mortar team. i mean like, why do people have to think so complex that the meaning of squad in this concept is as simple as 2 - 3 small units in a group, doesn't have to be neccesarily "small units" but you get the idea

 

[Pvt.Toma]

A challenger appears.

Well, maybe.
Even if I can get a wip, finishing it would be a different story but I currently do have an idea. It's gonna be another funny guy(well, guys) that hopefully works.

 

[MiniMage]

Alright. It was the best idea I had. Then I wont participate. Good luck to the others.

 

[Pvt.Toma]

Alright. It was the best idea I had. Then I wont participate. Good luck to the others.

Aw mate
Looking at your past models, I'm sure you can conjure up another idea that would fit the theme, and still be epic, if you give it a shot.

And maybe even for your idea, just throwing out random ideas, though it won't be what you had in mind, what if your sidecar was able to transform into something that would be standalone? The other guy is just lazy so he uses sidecar mode more often than not, but changes when he needs to, that might turn into a squad then.

When I think squad, what I think of it is that they're kinda like friends on equal ground. Yeah, friends, cooperating in doing what they do, sometimes disagreeing due to difference in opinions(this is being on equal grounds I guess), not sidekicks or servants or anything. That's just my opinion.

Yeah, there's still a lot of freedom here mate
You can do it

 

[Kyrbi0]

Alright. It was the best idea I had. Then I wont participate. Good luck to the others.

Aw mate
...

Yeah, there's still a lot of freedom here mate
You can do it

A motorcycle/sidecar is a great idea, man; just separate them & have them as, like, two separate dudes (say, a couple of zany Goblins on death trikes, or a big auto-matic cannon with a crazed Goblin engineer zipping around it), wheeling around each other & stuff, and you're golden.

Doing what you had planned, plus a separation, is pretty much the whole bag.

 

[Himperion]

Well, about the Goblin Chopper, why not make the driver help during attack animation, by throwing a grenade, or pointing the attack with a telescope. Similar during walk you could have the goblin in the sidecar putting his body on the side to help the chopper to move faster.

 

[Misha]

they're still driving in the thing..

.. do you guys really intend to throw this contest into a bin by like.. not thinking?

 

[HappyCockroach]

Alright. It was the best idea I had. Then I wont participate. Good luck to the others.

Alright. Only participate if you're willing to.

they're still driving in the thing..

.. do you guys really intend to throw this contest into a bin by like.. not thinking?

Well, again.. me, Pvt.Toma and apparently PROXY are still on the run, and we have a month or so until the deadline. Maybe you can consider participating, if you have the time and will?

 

[Misha]

eh.. the thing i have on my mind would be a tri-wisp, and i have an idea how they could cooperate, but i couldn't really do the animations myself.. i guess that's the will part i'm lacking

 

[Ardenian]

Alright, I think I found something that works for me.
May I introduce you to the Crystal Buddies ( work name, obviously).

New WIP

I love Blood Ravens Runestone attachments and played around with the main texture lately,
coming up with this.

I know it is a bit simple, but I have some decent ideas for the different animations,
like Defend or Morph.

EDIT:
Short texture update

Hidden

 

[Misha]

ah, that is fancy are they gonna be melee or spell-based?

 

[Kyrbi0]

Alright, I think I found something that works for me.
May I introduce you to the Crystal Buddies ( work name, obviously).

New WIP

I love Blood Ravens Runestone attachments and played around with the main texture lately,
coming up with this.

I know it is a bit simple, but I have some decent ideas for the different animations,
like Defend or Morph.

EDIT:
Short texture update

Hidden

Very cool, man. I didn't even think of that. : )

 

[Hantoo]

Don't really have time to actually do the model, And I don't really think I will able to ever finish (Or Even Start it)

But even if I might cannot make it before deadline, Still going to make it XD, Will see if I have a chance to finish it XD

Scrapped the old idea XD, cause I came up some other Ideas, If I can Find time to go to my next step, Would be Improve the sketch so that I don't have to think about lots o problem when I Making the model (If I ever start before deadline anyway)


The Idea, Baseball Ogre, Im considering If I want to give him a Baseball Helmet, (Or At least the Goblin)
There will be either 1-2 goblin with 1 ogre, Depends on what I can do in the more detailed sketch in future, One Will be Throwing ball toward the ogre and the ogre "Launch" the ball, Im thinking the goblin not only throw it, But Enhance the Projectile (Or Ball) with magic, so there might have third goblin to do the enhancing, might as well the Ogre is carrying something maybe a pot or a sack of Stones/Ball.
This guy is more like a Artillery Unit, plus, Can Attack in Melee with "One Shot One Kill" Kind of damage but is like is unlikely to hit. And Launching Magical Enhance Ball as Projectile, As well as Deflecting Enemy's Projectile.
And I purposely make the Ogre Blind, So there might have one Goblin for guiding the angle of the ogre, Or the ogre just do the launching part, while the projectile navigate itself with magic

I think this won't be that useful for most maps, But could create a custom map with this or as a special hero XD

While the other smaller one, Is another Idea, Which The Ogre is Holding a "Rocket Launcher"
A goblin Reloading, A goblin "Look and Guide" the goblin with fishing hook to adjust the angle of the cannon, While everyone is mounted on Ogre, So not sure if this fits the theme, I will do further Exploration to see what I can do when I do a more detailed sketch...


Well.. :V btw Misha, Animate a couple of wisp sounds fun, How bout you make it (Not for contest) and I help you animate that like... Maybe next year XD

 

[Ardenian]

Very cool, man. I didn't even think of that. : )

Thank you

I thought about it once more and I am going to extend my concept.
I think about adding roots around these crystals, making them some kind of Nature Guardians or something.
I can interact with these roots then and greatly improve my animation concepts.
Nothing in stone yet, but I think about adding adding a morph ability
transforming the unit into a turret using the roots
and a morph alternate transforming the unit into an Ancient-like thingy.

I have some problems adding TC though. I tried a bit around with material layers,
but I couldn't find a satisfying solution, since the teal of the crystal interacts too much
with the TC, altering it and making the unit look strange sometimes.
Suggestions are welcome!
My own idea up to now was adding some TC flowers.

 

[HappyCockroach]

But even if I might cannot make it before deadline, Still going to make it XD, Will see if I have a chance to finish it XD

Sound nice! I prefer the rocket launcher ogre idea

And for everyone having trouble with animations, you can always transfer animations from multiple units, and with a bit of tinkering make them coincide, or use the mortar team, or goblin sappers as a base.

 

[Hantoo]

And for everyone having trouble with animations, you can always transfer animations from multiple units, and with a bit of tinkering make them coincide, or use the mortar team, or goblin sappers as a base.

Well.. Just something I suggest Matrix Eater for anyone want to use Anim Transfer, It can make a model having multiple unit animation. Super Powerful,

But other than that, For people that can't animate theres a big limitation though, For a squad to be good, It needs to Interact nicely, So.... limitation are big for those who depends on goblin sapper, mortar team, and anim transfer, But well, It's still possible, But I think Squad is indeed more demanding in term of animation

 

[The_Silent]

I've found, after doing some testing, that animation in war3 model editor actually isn't that bad. Sure, it take ages, but it can be done.

 

[Deleted member 238226]

i think you've got better on drawing hayate. nice concept :3

 

[Kyrbi0]

Hayate, I like it a lot. I prefer the "rocket launcher" version as well, but baseball would be funny. : )

I've found, after doing some testing, that animation in war3 model editor actually isn't that bad. Sure, it take ages, but it can be done.

Magos? You can animate in Magos??

 

[Ardenian]

I've found, after doing some testing, that animation in war3 model editor actually isn't that bad. Sure, it take ages, but it can be done.

It is much cleaner though and you can orientate yourself better, can't you.


Started with the roots for the main crystal.
They are so odd to wrap, I might only attach them to the main crystal.

 

[HappyCockroach]

It is much cleaner though and you can orientate yourself better, can't you.


Started with the roots for the main crystal.
They are so odd to wrap, I might only attach them to the main crystal.

Maybe try to add features to make those crystals look a bit more like characters.. a sprite imprisioned inside, as the wisp portrait, or soemthing. If not, at the animations you might be able to give them more life.

 

[Ardenian]

Maybe try to add features to make those crystals look a bit more like characters.. a sprite imprisioned inside, as the wisp portrait, or soemthing. If not, at the animations you might be able to give them more life.

Hm, an interesting suggestion.
What filter mode would I use for making textures transparent ? I tried different filter modes and I recall there was one setting where
the stuff inside the crystal ( I played a bit around) was visible, but foolish me,
I forgot what setting it was..
Also, changing the Alpha value to something else than 1 seems to not change anything in Magos,
is there a reason why or did I miss something ?
I thought setting Alpha to 0.5 would make my tetxures 50% transparent.

It could be a good idea, thank you.
I am not sure whether the animations are going to give it some character.
It feels to me the Crystal Guardians are rather static, emotionless,
there are like components forming elements.
What do you think about it ?

 

[HappyCockroach]

Hm, an interesting suggestion.
What filter mode would I use for making textures transparent ? I tried different filter modes and I recall there was one setting where
the stuff inside the crystal ( I played a bit around) was visible, but foolish me,
I forgot what setting it was..
Also, changing the Alpha value to something else than 1 seems to not change anything in Magos,
is there a reason why or did I miss something ?
I thought setting Alpha to 0.5 would make my tetxures 50% transparent.

If your materials are set to "Transparent" in Magos, which is the 2-Color-Alpha, or to "None", in Magos, which is Opaque, they won't allow half-transparency. They're meant to be a yes-or-no visibility. Full Color Alpha, or Additive, Modulate and such, allow more tones of transparency than 0 or 1.

You might achieve a good result playing around with Full Alpha or Additive. Additive tends to give that eerie feel you might be going for. Add multiple objects, layers, you can test many alternatives.

And I give you those advices to avoid making it look like a building, or an unanimated thing. But do what you think is best, really.

 

[Ardenian]

Thanks, I try them out!

Well, I think it should give some character if I move them a bit around, maybe rotating and such,
as if they are living individuals.

 

[The_Silent]

Early mesh wip

Shield Guy

 

[Kyrbi0]

Early mesh wip

Shield Guy

Fix dat 'ttachment, yo. I wanna drool, dawg. : )

 

[Pvt.Toma]

WIP for now.
Next update would be the full model if possible i guess.

 

[HappyCockroach]

A WIP I bring thee:



mesh of the first guy taking shape..

Early mesh wip

The attachment is broken. :'(

WIP for now.
Next update would be the full model if possible i guess.

That looks like a hand, or a gauntlet. A squad of ghostly limbs? Would be nice

 

[Kyrbi0]

A WIP I bring thee:

View attachment 154210

mesh of the first guy taking shape..

~~~

That looks like a hand, or a gauntlet. A squad of ghostly limbs? Would be nice

I like the WIP, and I like the idea. Carry on. : )

 

[HappyCockroach]

Added this section to the first post:

Since many people said that thinking about a squad concept is a remarkably hard task, I've put up this section of references to help giving some inspiration.
Of course, no one is encouraged to copy them or any other idea directly, it's just to trigger your creativity, in case you're willing to do something but lack an idea.

Squad Examples

The Classic WC3 Squads, the Mortar Team and the Goblin Sappers

Outside of WC3, I took those MTG card illustrations which represent very plausible squads. There are many others in MTG universe

Faeries many times come in squads:

Or goblins:

Guards who cross halberds:

Or macabre creatures:

In Warhammer 40k, the Skaven feature many interesting squad examples

At this ratmen squad, one of the members carry the heavy cannon while the other does the cannonball maneuver.

While the musketeer benefits from the defense and the stability to shoot, the other rat also prevents melee attacks to reach the duo.

There are a few squads in THW's model section which can help with ideas

HerrDave's Gunner Teams:



Even if kinda simple and devoid of greater character interaction, Kofi_Banan did a few squads long ago, too.

 

[Exarch]

Hey guys! I messed up last time in contest#28 because of not being able to export the model correctly from 3ds max 2014. I really want to join this one and this time with no failing. But first, i need somebody to teach me this process (how to export correctly from max 2014). I really need this, anyone here can guide me?
I know you would recommend using wc3's own software for modelling but it would take too much time to learn and blocking me from using lot of techniques that i know for what i want to create for the contest.

 

[Ardenian]

Coldblows, I hope none recommends you to use Mdlvis or Magos for the basic modelling.
Ain't nobody has time for that.
Dunno if you saw Neodex, it is for 3ds max, iirc.
Else you could also use Blender to export to ms3d and import that to Magos.

 

[Exarch]

Ardeniadion, thank you for responding. I have tryed Neodex last time but didn't work for me. I mean i might be use wrong rigging (cause there are few different techniques) or it might be neodex doesn't have an update for max 2014? If someone would use max2014 and tell me his/her way to export, it would be awesome and shorter than ever isn't it?

 

[Ardenian]

ah, that is fancy are they gonna be melee or spell-based?

Oh, Misha, did this question aim for my post ?
If so, excuse, I somehow managed to totally miss it.

I am going to focus on this contest next days, so a new WIP should be up soon.


Coldblows, try contacting the creator of the tool or post there: http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/...odex-2-7-wc3-modeling-kit-3dsmax-gmax-115767/
If you don't want to get Blender, heavy tool, you might want to consider using Biturn for converting.
It can also convert from mdx to other file types.

@HappyCockroach
Custom texture or in-game textures ?

 

[Exarch]

I remember BlinkBoy asking me if i tryed his samples to make sure i'm doing it correct. I'll do that and then try to contact him, thank you so much.

 

[HappyCockroach]

@Ardenian: I'll use in-game textures.

I remember BlinkBoy asking me if i tryed his samples to make sure i'm doing it correct. I'll do that and then try to contact him, thank you so much.

Coldblows, NeoDex, as far as I know, is a great tool. I believe I tested it a few times, but never did complex models in it. There's a whole documentation at the thread Ardenian pointed you to. As it says, it works with 3dsmax 2014. I'd recommend you read the whole thread before starting doing material which might be not supported. I think the crucial aspect in exporting successfully is the animation. About that, rig your model with Skin Modifier and normal bones, and try to use TCB or linear animations to avoid unsupported systems.

And really curious to see what you'll come up with

 

[Exarch]

@Ardenian: I'll use in-game textures.

Coldblows, NeoDex, as far as I know, is a great tool. I believe I tested it a few times, but never did complex models in it. There's a whole documentation at the thread Ardenian pointed you to. As it says, it works with 3dsmax 2014. I'd recommend you read the whole thread before starting doing material which might be not supported. I think the crucial aspect in exporting successfully is the animation. About that, rig your model with Skin Modifier and normal bones, and try to use TCB or linear animations to avoid unsupported systems.

And really curious to see what you'll come up with

HappyCockroach, thank you for these informations and warnings. I'm also curious to try what you guys recommend

 

[Exarch]

Long live thw!!!

@HappyCockroach, you were right i was using CAT and Biped for rigging, now i've tested it with normal bones and it worked. After my test model started working on the world editor i realised 1 more trouble (there was only the first animation appears) because i was adding Note Tracks for each animation and it was becoming 5-6 Notes in different lines, what i learned is when i had a closer look at the BlinkBoy's samples.. i saw he was adding all Animation Names in one Note, i applied the same and bam! did work. Now i'm about to figure out how teamglow is working, i can create a plane linked to my model and then give it a transparent texture with glowing on the middle and then? How the color gonna change when the model is playing in other teams? I think there's a totally different thing is going on at this stage.. is there a guide topic about that where you can direct me?

Edit: Oh! BlinkBoy has a quick explanation on his topic, imma give it a quick try xd sorry for being trouble arround here

 

[Exarch]

Design is complete. Time to move on.. Finally i got everything i need to know to complete the task xd

 

[HappyCockroach]

Design is complete. Time to move on.. Finally i got everything i need to know to complete the task xd

Wow! Looks great. Willing to see the WIP's.

 

[MogulKahn]

What happened with Titans or whatever was last contest?

 

[-Grendel]

Wizards was the last contest

 

[Exarch]

Base meshes nearly completed, first and last wip from today xd

 

[Stefan.K]

Base meshes nearly completed, first and last wip from today xd

That's nice wip. They seem HQ/ though. How much polies untill now?

 

[Exarch]

That's nice wip. They seem HQ/ though. How much polies untill now?

There are currently 888
Right now in 2016 i thought that would be okay if i go out over 2000.

 

[HappyCockroach]

There are currently 888
Right now in 2016 i thought that would be okay if i go out over 2000.

888 is pretty alright for the elements and level of detail you have. If you have doubt, try to reference on the most detailed wc3 models, or the regular ones, see their joints and such. But going above 2000 shouldn't be a problem, as long as it isn't an 'error' of many invisible polies inside your mesh or something like that. Most contest entries we've seen are around 1200 and 3000 polies. The thing is being reasonable at their usage, rather than the count itself.

 

[Pvt.Toma]

I have 4.4k polies(not tris) and it's barely completed, that alright?

 

[HappyCockroach]

I have 4.4k polies(not tris) and it's barely completed, that alright?

I'm not the one to tell if it's alright or not, rather the judges.

I think that, although it might sound much, it always depends on your model. Although I do have the impression you probably can cut some if you have that much. (even in triangles that would sound a high quantity)

 

[The_Silent]

I don't have the original wip file anymore. You'll have to wait for the next wip to see my progress. Sorry guys.