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Taking the Galaxy Editor very seriously

Discussion in 'StarCraft I & II' started by OverSky, Mar 18, 2010.

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  1. OverSky

    OverSky

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    Hey everyone,

    First I just want to introduce myself, this post might be long so my apologies in advance.

    My name is Toby, I'm currently #1 in my platinum division for SC2 as well as the #1 Zerg in North America.
    For about a year I've been making WC3 and now SC2 videos and uploading them on youtube..
    If you want to check out some of my games here's a link to my youtube channel: http://www.youtube.com/perfectionistemblem
    There are games vs David Kim and Matt Cooper from Blizzard and also SC1 semi-pro's.

    Anyways, I spent a lot of time preparing for SC2 before beta was out and was planning on playing it competitively but I haven't been enjoying the game enough to continue playing it for 14~ hours/day and go pro etc..
    Since I went to Blizzcon it has been in the back of my mind that it would be a lot of fun to take the Galaxy Editor extremely seriously and so currently I'm studying hard everyday to become as familiar as possible with the World Editor, while trying to focus on the skills that I think will best transfer over to Galaxy.

    I'm planning on treating Galaxy as my job with at least 50 hour work weeks etc (which would be a decrease from how much I've been playing SC2 since it was out) :wink:

    I'm basically trying to meet other people who have similar ambitions with the program as well as the means to carry out their ambitions. Once Galaxy is out I'll be following every tutorial that's released, making tutorials of my own and spending all day learning every aspect of the program.

    Until it's out, if anyone thinks they can help me out in any way to learn important and 'Galaxy-relevant' skills within the WC3 Editor I would be be extremely grateful.

    One last thing: I have a spare SC2 beta key to give away to someone I think would put it to good use.
    I want to be clear, this is not a contest. It's just a way for me to give back to whomever I think is as committed as myself to learning the new program as thoroughly as possible and applying that knowledge to making great maps.

    *Please don't message me if you are not the kind of person who enjoys helping and learning with other people (with or without getting something in return).*

    I might post this thread in a couple other forums but it won't be more than 2 or 3.
    If you are interested either post in this thread and/or send me a PM with your MSN(I don't have AIM).
     
  2. Hero_Lief

    Hero_Lief

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    Well, we don't exactly know much about the Galaxy editor, except that it uses a single large Data Editor for most of it's functions, which Wc3 doesn't have. Therefor, there's not much to know, but certainly get familiar with basic GUI functions in the Trigger Editor and get used to terraining and making units in the Object Editor.
     
  3. overload119

    overload119

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    Dude I think it's awesome you posted here. You got MSN/GMail/Ventrilo? I'll teach you what you need to know, I've been dib-dabbing with SC2 and I'm an experienced WC3 map editor.

    When SC2 comes out maybe we can make a map together.

    Don't learn GUI. Trust me. I'll teach you the basic of the Galaxy language, and even the more complicated stuff. None of the good maps will be made in GUI for SC2.

    I also have SC2. Overload119.tge

    I've been watching your videos too! I'm a Zerg player myself.
     
  4. The World Is Flat

    The World Is Flat

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    well Galaxy is designed so that there is no need for coding, and that every function is available in the triggers and data editor. or so i hear. theres not much you can learn from the WE other than the basic layout and operation of the triggering and object editors. and terraining ofc. but the SC2 editor is vastly superior is every respect. i have msn if you want to talk.
     
  5. overload119

    overload119

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    Yes but GUI coding is a lot slower. Clicking buttons is never as fast as typing, and being able to copy and paste. WorldEdit was designed the same way btw, with every function available, via Custom script. But it's still not what the higher-end mappers use.

    Anyone who wants to take the SC2 editor seriously isn't going to be using GUI...
     
  6. The World Is Flat

    The World Is Flat

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    well it is an alternative to learning c. and WC was not designed that way. in SC2 if i want to do the ghost map. i can edit ui and everything triggers perspective, special abilites without jass like coding. i can make ay spell i want without having to custom code it. and its efficient. or so i hear.
     
  7. Tleno

    Tleno

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    Agree, the best part its as simple as WC3 WE, but with much more capabilites!
     
  8. Fulla

    Fulla

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    Nice to see such enthuisasm :) I sent you a pm.
     
  9. BlinkforFear

    BlinkforFear

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    Dang #1 zerg player in North America thats crazy. I would extremely happy to be like 500th in North America. Anyways... I would suggest not spending too much time with GUI, because if your going to be spending 50 hours a week on learning about the editor, I'm assuming you want to be a good map maker. Hence you will probably not use anything close to GUI in SC2 because of its limitations.
     
  10. Infinitynexus

    Infinitynexus

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    Pretty sure it's just a spam message, the guy just wants attention to his youtube channel.
     
  11. Fussiler1

    Fussiler1

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    Or he just tries to learn how the Editor works.
     
  12. redmarine

    redmarine

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    Not sure if you're going to find a partner who is as dedicated and as serious as you are(might be a couple). We're treating this game as a hobby and like a fun activity.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2010
  13. The World Is Flat

    The World Is Flat

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    I have to agree with redmarine. you could make SOME money from the marketplace, but it would have to be an incredible map. this is more of a hobby, and because its fun, we have the desire to make good mods etc.

    Blinkforfear: Apparently the GUI of SC2 isn't held back like it was in WC3. Apparenty SC2 GUI is Limitless (only held back by coding language) therefore, no reason not to go with GUI
     
  14. vjeux

    vjeux

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    How can you tell? The editor is not even out ...
     
  15. MGCǂSpectre

    MGCǂSpectre

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    I intend to have SC2 as a competitive game in tournaments, and then if I have the time, to do maps, like I was doing with war3. So, I do not belong to the ppl who should get a key in return to being great mapmakers, just saying.
     
  16. The World Is Flat

    The World Is Flat

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    Because of all i have heard and seen about it.
     
  17. Jaeron2

    Jaeron2

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    You’ll need a few tools to effectively code with JASS.

    Make sure you have Jass NewGen Pack: http://www.wc3c.net/showthread.php?t=90999

    It adds many useful features to the weak JASS language. Of its many features, two are particular useful: the ability to declare global anywhere and an anti-crash at compile time.

    Without NewGen, global variables had to be manually created using the variable editor. This was extremely frustrating and impractical because of the variable editor’s clumsiness; it would add “udg_” (user define global) prefix that it add to a variable name. Also, it doesn’t expose all variables types; specifically, (although not really variable because you can’t create an arrays with it) the callback.

    The World Editor, as a stand alone, would crash if you generate specific kinds of bad codes; instead of properly issuing an error and disabling the erroneous script. Such codes are infinite loops, bad trigger registry (?), bad variable placement (?), etc...



    As for actually coding with JASS, it’s recommended you code with another text editor - not with the World Editor’s text editor - because of the editor’s unreliability (crashes), clumsiness, and impracticality. Notepad++ (with vJASS Syntax Highlighter; a plug-in) or JassCraft are a good alternative; anything that highlights Warcraft III’s APIs. I strongly recommend notepad++ as it’s not just for JASS but a barrage of other programming languages.

    Notepad++: http://sourceforge.net/projects/notepad-plus/files/
    vJASS Syntax Highlighter: http://www.wc3c.net/showthread.php?t=94292
    Software that can unzip a .7z file: http://www.wc3c.net/faq.php?faq=faqmisc#faq_7zrar

    JassCraft: http://www.wc3c.net/showthread.php?t=80105



    I would not recommend use the World Editor’s GUI or at least skim it through because the GUI cannot use local variable, it’s slow for system creations, and it’s clumsy and impractical for large script and/or systems. Technically, you can use the “script” interface. However, that requires some knowledge about JASS’s variable syntax. Be sure to skim around wc3c.net for JASS tutorials; Vexorian's tutorial are quite good.



    ---
    By the way, since you have access to Starcraft 2 beta and the capabilities to make and post video on Youtube, can you make videos on the Galaxy Editor’s features? This is assuming Blizzard decides to release the editor in beta. Thanks in advance if you do!

    Source: http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/community/blizzcast/archive/episode13.html at [21:25]
    Only reason I’m buying Starcraft II is for the editor :) but I’m quite sure the lack of critical features (GUI API, pointers, reference, bitwise operators, custom type definitions, dynamic memory, overloading functions, etc…) will disappoint me :( and I’ll end up not developing games for Starcraft II.



    ---
    You should couple your learning with some crash-course with the C programming language; Blizzard said the Galaxy language is similar to it.

    Aside from anything else I’ve mention, don’t have crazy ambitions for the modding with Starcraft 2 early on because of Blizzard tendency to hard-code, not provide useful documentations, and lack GUI APIs support. A lot of the complex techniques to implement features you wanted (dodging spells, more icon slots, more item slots, change a unit z position, hiding/removing the rally point icon, GUI support, etc.) came from exploiting bugs, triggering to create a pseudo-effect, or sneaky tricks. But, many of these methods came into existence many years after Frozen Throne release.

    So keep in mind that if you can’t implement or have a hard time with a feature in your map, it could be that no one has yet found a sneaky/clever way around it because the lack of certain critical APIs or direct manipulation of certain data.

    Nothing serious or personal, just a fair warning when modding with some of Blizzard tools. I learned that the hard way, I wanted to create an epic random terrain generation engine, but there wasn’t any cliff and ramp API :(. I’ve tried to bypass the limitation by using very high hill and setting the ground to unwalkable to simulate cliffs, but it was too buggy, clumsy, impractical, and ugly.
     
  18. sixbrownsnakes2

    sixbrownsnakes2

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    This is the most retarded thing ever written.
     
  19. Fussiler1

    Fussiler1

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    I think he was trying to say he found GUI very inefficient, in a bit a wrong way.
     
  20. sixbrownsnakes2

    sixbrownsnakes2

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    "None of the good maps will be made in GUI for SC2"

    What the hell else did he mean? There's no hidden meaning to that statement, it's just wrong and retarded. Coding genius =/= good map.
     
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