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Stop the CASC madness

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AFAIR, Vex Optimizer will break for sure. I'm uncertain for Widgetizer, but it might be.
Most tools that relied on finding Warcraft 3 MPQ will break, like Magos Model Editor.
Widgetizer most probably won't break, as if I remember it extracts slks to its folder just like slk opt. The real question is, why would you need to use Vex or Slk opt, when W3X2Lni does both jobs better, but well, we are making a list, so might as well include them :)

I guess the list so far is:

1. Magos.
2. MdlVis.
3. Vexorian Map Optimizator.
4. Widgetizer.
5. Wc3SlkOpt (although you could just use 1.26a patch slks for it and still use it).
6. JNPG?
7. Matrix Eater.
8. YDWE (although hardly anyone from any other place, but China uses it).

Was there anything else of relevance that we should mention? I am skipping all MPQ editors themselves, as we shouldn't really count them.
 
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If Matrix Eater breaks, I assume Disarm and Scaler will break as well.

Does CASC also involves the map (.w3x/.w3m) files? If so, might want to think about those Custom Race Installers.
If you use Matrix Eater for custom models that don't use default WC3 data at all, then no, it will work (not sure about Disarm).

Maps are MPQs themselves, so if a tool used MPQ to locate maps (aka MPQ in an MPQ), then yes, they will break. Meaning W3X and W3M are untouched by this change. Also...
If so, might want to think about those Custom Race Installers.
What...?
 
Matrix Eater had some design flaws so that it can go into an infinite crash on startup problem if it loses the MPQs, and then doesn't allow you to change your Matrix Eater WC3 installation settings because you can't open it. This problem may only apply to a particular version, and by the time I release the next version it should be fixed.
 
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Widgetizer most probably won't break, as if I remember it extracts slks to its folder just like slk opt. The real question is, why would you need to use Vex or Slk opt, when W3X2Lni does both jobs better, but well, we are making a list, so might as well include them :)

I guess the list so far is:

1. Magos.
2. MdlVis.
3. Vexorian Map Optimizator.
4. Widgetizer.
5. Wc3SlkOpt (although you could just use 1.26a patch slks for it and still use it).
6. JNPG?
7. Matrix Eater.
8. YDWE (although hardly anyone from any other place, but China uses it).

Was there anything else of relevance that we should mention? I am skipping all MPQ editors themselves, as we shouldn't really count them.

YDWE's last supported version of Warcraft 3 is 1.27a. So 1.30ptr has long been unrelated to YDWE.
 
Frozen fire's add-on race is a SEMPQ and Blizzard dropped support for SEMPQs in Patch 1.28. Its unclear to me if you can still get them to work with different code, and the community has simply failed to provide that code (MPQDraft was not updated for Patch 1.28) or if the upgrade actually made SEMPQ's functionality no longer available. I have never looked into the SEMPQ code to understand it that deeply. But those haven't worked since 1.28. It would be great if we got a new system to allow that same type of functionality (See my other post on this: Patch 1.30 PTR Live ), even if we must accept that all the SEMPQ mods created in the past will never work again. These EXEs with embedded MPQs were all coded to seek out the file named Frozen Throne.exe, or war3.exe, as I understand it, and the game was renamed to Warcraft III.exe. So, these mods probably cannot be saved.

But the idea of loading user files into the game to create a mod, in my opinion, should now be added deliberately to compensate, because this style of modding allowed fans to create cool mods without really presenting any security vulnerabilities that I'm aware of. I mean, those old mods were EXE files, which would be unsafe from the Blizzard Entertainment standpoint, presumably. But a new, intentional system added to the game could ensure that these files were sanctioned bundles with a unique filetype that could not contain arbitrary code.
 
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I see, it makes sense now, but... the usecase is a bit strange, still that's something I've never seen, thank you for pointing it out ;)

Frozen fire's add-on race is a SEMPQ and Blizzard dropped support for SEMPQs in Patch 1.28. Its unclear to me if you can still get them to work with different code, and the community has simply failed to provide that code (MPQDraft was not updated for Patch 1.28) or if the upgrade actually made SEMPQ's functionality no longer available. I have never looked into the SEMPQ code to understand it that deeply. But those haven't worked since 1.28. It would be great if we got a new system to allow that same type of functionality (See my other post on this: Patch 1.30 PTR Live ), even if we must accept that all the SEMPQ mods created in the past will never work again. These EXEs with embedded MPQs were all coded to seek out the file named Frozen Throne.exe, or war3.exe, as I understand it, and the game was renamed to Warcraft III.exe. So, these mods probably cannot be saved.

But the idea of loading user files into the game to create a mod, in my opinion, should now be added deliberately to compensate, because this style of modding allowed fans to create cool mods without really presenting any security vulnerabilities that I'm aware of. I mean, those old mods were EXE files, which would be unsafe from the Blizzard Entertainment standpoint, presumably. But a new, intentional system added to the game could ensure that these files were sanctioned bundles with a unique filetype that could not contain arbitrary code.
Even though I agree with your idea, I myself and a friend of mine used a lot of EXEs/DLLs anything that attaches itself to any process to inject our own data along with it. Sadly I can't really give an alternative that is safe for any mod that uses external files/MPQs to work. But it is hard to imagine the need for them yet again, when we have so much space for map size limit, when we can just have any data we need inside of the map itself, of course the only problem that makes, is that you will have to restart WC3 if you want to play a non-modified map or map that does not use data like you do, etc.

However, the fun thing is, that WC3 has an internal cleaning utility which EXISTS, but is partially broken. On a very alpha of our project (won't speak the name of, so there is no advertisement), we have actually found and fixed it, so after each game you finish your data is cleaned and you don't need to restart WC3 at all, so why is that still not fixed - is something I do not understand.

P.S. Everything I wrote is just a personal opinion, do NOT take it as an opinion you should listen to, if you don't really want to, after all this is a discussion. :)
 

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And how is that connected to a concern? However, yeah, that was added indeed, but it is not a bit connected to what I was saying. Also it is now wise to mix tools that relied on MPQs and that got broken with a the said "plugin" or JassHelper.exe mentioned by you.

Also full quote has a different meaning all-together, but I hope you got the point I was making, there is no real need to discuss it further, as you have your own stand on this topic, so do I. :)
So alright, let's go ahead & break it down. Your original quote (to which I responded):
Unryze said:
I honestly doubt they will, nor that they should. Third-party tools are never a concern to any company and it would be wrong to actually do care about such things. All you can hope is that makers of said third-party tools will adjust to the change and update the tools they once made.

We have never seen blizzard making any other thing, but plugin for 3ds Max, aka Blizzard Art Tools. You could of course try and ask them, but honestly I fail to see how that will change anything. ...

Still, hoping is a good thing and I for one do agree, that it would be good, if Blizzard themselves somehow aid modmakers, but I still can't see that as a possibility, which is kinda sad.
Several times in this quotation (bolded sections) you assert that Blizzard:
- doesn't care about 3rd-party tools
- can't care about 3rd-party tools
- has never 'reached out to modders' with an ancillary tool (except for the Art Tools plugin for 3dsMax)

And my point was, they 100% have, as of this latest Patch. With the help of @MindWorX they have taken the 3rd-party modding tool "JassHelper" and made it a native part of the vanilla Trigger Editor in the World Editor. They have literally done exactly what you asserted multiple times they can't/won't/don't.

I was being coy about it in my original response post, but it seems you've missed my point entirely, so I'm just laying it all out now.

(Yes, I'm aware JassHelper doesn't interact with MPQs which is a big part of this discussion. However, I was merely responding to your comment alone, which didn't mention/refer to MPQ-related tools but simply to Blizzard's connection with 3rd-party tools, which has demonstrably been changed in recent months)


Unryze said:
Back on-topic, I would still like to somehow make a list of tools affected by this change, as this will truly be a good basis on deciding just how much MPQs were needed, so we can look at pros and cons.
I completely agree. No reason why we can't make such a list, and it can only help us get a handle on the situation.

Do MPQ Editors get messed up by this?
 
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So alright, let's go ahead & break it down. Your original quote (to which I responded):

Several times in this quotation (bolded sections) you assert that Blizzard:
- doesn't care about 3rd-party tools
- can't care about 3rd-party tools
- has never 'reached out to modders' with an ancillary tool (except for the Art Tools plugin for 3dsMax)

And my point was, they 100% have, as of this latest Patch. With the help of @MindWorX they have taken the 3rd-party modding tool "JassHelper" and made it a native part of the vanilla Trigger Editor in the World Editor. They have literally done exactly what you asserted multiple times they can't/won't/don't.

I was being coy about it in my original response post, but it seems you've missed my point entirely, so I'm just laying it all out now.

(Yes, I'm aware JassHelper doesn't interact with MPQs which is a big part of this discussion. However, I was merely responding to your comment alone, which didn't mention/refer to MPQ-related tools but simply to Blizzard's connection with 3rd-party tools, which has demonstrably been changed in recent months)

Well, true, I should have worded it better, however. I still stand by my point, that no major company should really be concerned by third-party tools, that they are not sure of or can be harmful. As if user gets harm from them, the one to blame will be the company that agreed to use said third-party tool, etc. That was the whole point, but yeah, let's put it to rest, there is no real reason to have a debate on such thing ;)


I completely agree. No reason why we can't make such a list, and it can only help us get a handle on the situation.

Do MPQ Editors get messed up by this?

Yes, ANY MPQ editor can't open CASC, as it is a structure of multiple files, that give you access to it and not a MPQ, that just holds files in itself. An easier way to understand is to download Ladik CASC editor, once you open your WC3 directory with it, you will see all locales inside of it and one, singular war3.mpq and war3xlocal.mpq.

I've written some of the tools known to be, which I used to use or still use, but if there is anything else, it would be nice if someone could write them here, so I can add them to the list ;)[/QUOTE]
 
Abit late to the topic but, I stated all the stuff in patch discussion, Casc is still bad for modding and modeling for example yes you can still use war3mod.mpq FOLDER after allowing local files but it is not a nice compressed archive anymore it is just a folder that contains all your work and named war3mod.mpq, it is really an early christmass for stealers.
 
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Abit late to the topic but, I stated all the stuff in patch discussion, Casc is still bad for modding and modeling for example yes you can still use war3mod.mpq FOLDER after allowing local files but it is not a nice compressed archive anymore it is just a folder that contains all your work and named war3mod.mpq, it is really an early christmass for stealers.

May you elaborate what ppl could steal what they couldn't before (We were already be able to just extract anything out of the mpq's anyway, so whats the difference?). Also, as far as i know, the work of noone was really saved into the games mpq, except you created your own. And then still, reading mpq's was already possible anyway. So i don't really see an argument there.
 
May you elaborate what ppl could steal what they couldn't before (We were already be able to just extract anything out of the mpq's anyway, so whats the difference?). Also, as far as i know, the work of noone was really saved into the games mpq, except you created your own. And then still, reading mpq's was already possible anyway. So i don't really see an argument there.
It is alot easier you can just open the folder , you could protect mpqs by deleting listfiles(easiet way) for example , but it is not the point I'm talking about , casc is breaking everything plus this is an issue too. And yes it won't effect me except protectionwise,( I have atleast 6 copies of older patches and they are connected to my tools already ) but thing is they are breaking stuff that worked good for 16 years and now they wont be adapted easily , thing about casc is you can export files but can't import them ( for now ) so it is also bad for a modder, but what could be done was leaving mpqs ingame like a 'legacy' folder and still letting people use war3mod.mpq to modify stuff legally , or make an explanation like saying you can use this data.002 file as your war3mod.mpq.
 
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Honestly, that isn't really an argument. People that would even think about stealing assets from projects like WAA would do it with the right knowledge and put them on the WOW-Rip sites. I highly doubt that a making it to a small degree harder wouldn't even change a thing. If Wc3 can read it, people can do that with the already existing tools, too. Heck, people deprotect maps just for some noobs to make a cheatversion of. I don't want to offend anybody, but making a standalone MPQ which is read by the standard wc3 launcher and then thinking you could protect your assets is something i would call downright impossible.

Now, i am for the implementation of a legancy folder and already said that in this thread, so i think when we talk about the tools we somewhat share an opinion. Although i think that something is good only because it works for 16 years. And also i think that people will in fact adopt faster than you think. It depends only if they want to.
 
Honestly, that isn't really an argument. People that would even think about stealing assets from projects like WAA would do it with the right knowledge and put them on the WOW-Rip sites. I highly doubt that a making it to a small degree harder wouldn't even change a thing. If Wc3 can read it, people can do that with the already existing tools, too. Heck, people deprotect maps just for some noobs to make a cheatversion of. I don't want to offend anybody, but making a standalone MPQ which is read by the standard wc3 launcher and then thinking you could protect your assets is something i would call downright impossible.

Now, i am for the implementation of a legancy folder and already said that in this thread, so i think when we talk about the tools we somewhat share an opinion. Although i think that something is good only because it works for 16 years. And also i think that people will in fact adopt faster than you think. It depends only if they want to.
I'm a part of the WAA mod , so let me know if someone stoles our models , also I'm global moderator of warcraft underground so they dont stand a chance there
 
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I know, thats why i am especially pointing that out. Its not like i didn't knowed which mod you were concerned upon, and i really respect what you and the rest of the team do there. I just wanted to point out that if someone us really behind on stealing assets, you will probably have a hard time controlling that. And my point was more that sich dedicated people wouldn't be stopped by an mpq file that is being obsfucated. But i can keep my ears sharpened if i stumble upon stolen assets.
 
I could side with Lord_Earthfire about protection. I have seen a tool that loads a map or MPQ with no listfile, parses the unit data, and creates a world editor style unit selector. It asks you to choose a folder, then when you click a unit's icon, it traverses the unit data, finding all icons, disabled icons, scorescreen icons, caster upgrade icons, models, textures, portrait models, textures of portrait models, projectile art models, etc and places them in the target folder, making a one-click stop for getting assets from something like Nirvana, from the MPQ version of my own Heavens Fall mod, or from any map in existence. It's not that this *can* exist, but in fact that it *does* exist. Now, if this post needs to be removed for site rules, that's okay, but it seems relevant to the discussion.

Example of MPQ as an openable file:
 
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I think YourArthas knows that the mods mpq is openable in magos xD
There was another ''format of mpq'' as .mix files were able to be loaded into the game as a mpq for modding so were .asi files... And they were really hard to crack open... Deprotecter for maps didn't work on them, while the deprotecter did work on mods like nirvana...
And that file extension is also not usable anymore (i think that change was before 1.3 ptr)
But, as u said, i have seen even ''that level of protection'' and file extension being ''hacked'' but not many people know how to do it. So, as you said people should ''come to terms'' with models not being totaly exclusive and protected from stealing.
 
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I'm a part of the WAA mod , so let me know if someone stoles our models , also I'm global moderator of warcraft underground so they dont stand a chance there
Sorry, but no. Just no... I myself worked on protection on both patches mix/asi and even maps that made MPQ Editor run for its life, so what you are saying is just biased as you have never really encountered anyone with enough skill to pretty much trash anything you throw at him. I am willing to show you that everything you have won't last even for 5 minutes and I will have at the very least 95% of your models extracted and restored. This is not boasting, but a "challenge" if you want to call it that way.

I think YourArthas knows that the mods mpq is openable in magos xD
There was another ''format of mpq'' as .mix files were able to be loaded into the game as a mpq for modding so were .asi files... And they were really hard to crack open... Deprotecter for maps didn't work on them, while the deprotecter did work on mods like nirvana...
And that file extension is also not usable anymore (i think that change was before 1.3 ptr)
But, as u said, i have seen even ''that level of protection'' and file extension being ''hacked'' but not many people know how to do it. So, as you said people should ''come to terms'' with models not being totaly exclusive and protected from stealing.
mix and asi, and even though they are a bit pesky they are no different from a regular MPQ in the the end. And no, mix can't be as protected as map, they are more vulnerable, due to their hex structure or structure itself being based on a dll that has an MPQ header built in. A map can be gnawed to a point where only pure Storm.dll will be able to load it, a mix patch can't be "malformed" as hard as a map.

This message is a bit hostile, because it is really frustrating to see people spout things they really don't know anything about. In reality every single possible iteration of normal HEX malformation has been used, you can ask Ladik the same question he will confirm it, thus only measure is drastic, which makes the map unusable by normal user and only being possible to be loaded via host-bot with HEAVILY modified StormLib, default one WILL NOT work, that is the gist of it.

Of course you can use JAPI or how was it called, to make the map "create fake files" for normal storm.dll/sfmpq/StormLib, but it is still a matter of time until you can just find a pattern of those fake files and just ignore them. There are many, MANY protections overall and I am pretty sure most of them were never seen here, as they come from Korea/China mostly. The only thing that EU/US/RU community ever made in terms of protection were: Spazzler, Vexorian( it was considered a protection at some point too) and well... Widgetizer (slk data). On the Asian side they had: Moonlight, Somj with variatons such as KangTooLee, Somj2, then SS protect 1 and SS protect 2 and JAPI as mentioned and other protections that I am too lazy to name.
 
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I thought this thread was supposed to be about why the MPQ format was a good idea
Well, the original thread was more of “CASC is killing modding”, however to get back on topic, MPQs are only good for simplicity, nothing more. If we had tools that wouldn’t care about MPQ or CASC this thread would have never existed, or maybe it would, but due to inability of using external “patches” to store their files.

To be fair I think it would be correct to close this thread, as not only there were multiple times of off-topic chatter (me included), but the thread starter itself seems to have abandoned it altogether.

Retera, could you perhaps name some of the benefits of MPQs, aside from simplicity and its use case for tools? Because I am way too biased on this topic it seems, having a more unbiased opinion would be very appreciated and you will certainly be able to do so :)
 
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@Unryze i think i never said that .asi is the ultimate protected thing. I've seen people cracking .asi files, it's just that as you said ''it is more pesky''. AKA more difficult for a person that does not know anything about (all that you just said xD) to open .asi files. And .mix files were openable with ladik's mpq edit just by allowing the program to open ''all file types''

So, i agree with everything you said, and imo i never had an opinion that was different than your's. Everything that you said makes sense, even tho i have no real knowledge about programing.

As for why i'd like to use asi or .mix files: a lot of people just open our mods mpq and take whatever model is in there, edit and upload to different sites, make mods based on ours and pretend they made everything... it sucks seeing a model you spent days working on perfecting the texture, animations and mesh just to see it uploaded somewhere by a person claiming they did it... And for ''normal people'' (nothing against you but most people wouldn't know how to open that asi file) it would be harder to steal the models...

I'd like if people were ''as good as on hive'' with writing credits on models and asking for permission of using stuff xD

--edit--
yeah this has gone really off topic, sorry for that xD And sorry if I'm a bit hard to understand english is not my native language
 
Well, the original thread was more of “CASC is killing modding”, however to get back on topic, MPQs are only good for simplicity, nothing more. If we had tools that wouldn’t care about MPQ or CASC this thread would have never existed, or maybe it would, but due to inability of using external “patches” to store their files.

To be fair I think it would be correct to close this thread, as not only there were multiple times of off-topic chatter (me included), but the thread starter itself seems to have abandoned it altogether.

Retera, could you perhaps name some of the benefits of MPQs, aside from simplicity and its use case for tools? Because I am way too biased on this topic it seems, having a more unbiased opinion would be very appreciated and you will certainly be able to do so :)
Well, casc files cant be modded by us atleast for now and even if we learn how to put files or replace files into casc storages it will break online features and will be illegal that is really a big problem, war3mod.mpq file was an awsome tool and never effected online features.
 
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@Unryze i think i never said that .asi is the ultimate protected thing. I've seen people cracking .asi files, it's just that as you said ''it is more pesky''. AKA more difficult for a person that does not know anything about (all that you just said xD) to open .asi files. And .mix files were openable with ladik's mpq edit just by allowing the program to open ''all file types''

So, i agree with everything you said, and imo i never had an opinion that was different than your's. Everything that you said makes sense, even tho i have no real knowledge about programing.

As for why i'd like to use asi or .mix files: a lot of people just open our mods mpq and take whatever model is in there, edit and upload to different sites, make mods based on ours and pretend they made everything... it sucks seeing a model you spent days working on perfecting the texture, animations and mesh just to see it uploaded somewhere by a person claiming they did it... And for ''normal people'' (nothing against you but most people wouldn't know how to open that asi file) it would be harder to steal the models...

I'd like if people were ''as good as on hive'' with writing credits on models and asking for permission of using stuff xD

--edit--
yeah this has gone really off topic, sorry for that xD And sorry if I'm a bit hard to understand english is not my native language
The message was mostly directed towards @YourArthas, my bad that I did not form it better, sorry if I somehow offended you :p

As for the credits... I am very reluctant on this topic, as forcing people to credit is wrong, but also not crediting those who did the work is wrong. But there are cases when no one really knows who to credit, and I've seen cases when people's resources were declined because of it.

Now back on topic, because I've yet again derailed... still, it would be very nice to see at least someone from Blizzard side to comment on the topic. Possibly they could remove the fog of bias that each of us have and pass us the real reason for the said change and what it brings to the table.
Well, casc files cant be modded by us atleast for now and even if we learn how to put files or replace files into casc storages it will break online features and will be illegal that is really a big problem, war3mod.mpq file was an awsome tool and never effected online features.
Agreed, but you have close to 500mb map size limit, you can use map itself as mod, so I fail to see the actual need for a separate MPQ, could you perhaps elaborate on this? I am interested in your opinion.

Unless you want the mod to change default units etc for other maps as well, then yeah, all the mods will get removed, but for such things you could use local files, just have a good file structure like this:

Screenshot_1.png

Yes, it is not as good as "just download file and put it into WC3", but it should check-out as well, as all it takes is just to enable local files. :)
 
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The message was mostly directed towards @YourArthas, my bad that I did not form it better, sorry if I somehow offended you :p

As for the credits... I am very reluctant on this topic, as forcing people to credit is wrong, but also no crediting those who did the work is wrong. But there are cases when no one really knows who to credit, and I've seen cases when people's resources were declined because of it.

Now back on topic, because I've yet again derailed... still, it would be very nice to see at least someone from Blizzard side to comment on the topic. Possibly they could remove the fog of bias that each of us have and pass us the real reason for the said change and what it brings to the table.

Agreed, but you have close to 500mb map size limit, you can use map itself as mod, so I fail to see the actual need for a separate MPQ, could you perhaps elaborate on this? I am interested in your opinion.
The thing is we make a total conversion mod ( and I know alot of people likes that idea, and mods like that pop up alot recently ) and the idea behind is not making a map but making mpq(s) (or any format of data that game can read) so the game will be changed you can play campaign or melee or custom maps online or offline but with changed models and with that war3mod.mpq file blizz was not against it and you wont be banned, if we go to map route we have to make each and every custom map melee map or campaign to reach that 'warcraft hd' goal which is not possible, and let's forget our mod and maybe someone makes a 'naga faction mod' for example with a data game can read it will again work with every map (kinda), but online feature would not work after that but that is offtopic
 
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The message was mostly directed towards @YourArthas, my bad that I did not form it better, sorry if I somehow offended you :p

No offense taken :D

About the mod we are talking, yes it is meant as whole wc3 unit replacement... so map based mod won't work...

Since they are updating to casc, and sc2 is casc, maybe it is possibile to have a system like starcraft 2 somewhere in the future... to have official plugin format that can be used to make mods that can be used as ''master files'' for other maps...
Or even something like skyrims plugin system where we are alowed to load multiple ''mods''
 
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The thing is we make a total conversion mod ( and I know alot of people likes that idea, and mods like that pop up alot recently ) and the idea behind is not making a map but making mpq(s) (or any format of data that game can read) so the game will be changed you can play campaign or melee or custom maps online or offline but with changed models and with that war3mod.mpq file blizz was not against it and you wont be banned, if we go to map route we have to make each and every custom map melee map or campaign to reach that 'warcraft hd' goal which is not possible, and let's forget our mod and maybe someone makes a 'naga faction mod' for example with a data game can read it will again work with every map (kinda), but online feature would not work after that but that is offtopic
In this case yes, you are correct, using local files then will be a enormous hassle, well technically you could make a separate casc for mods, and use some restriction if it is being used. Anyways, now I do understand you clearly, and so far there might no be much helping it, unless as mentioned Blizzard will makes us able to add things without editing original CASC (as that most probably will be bannable/forcing an update that will fix it).
No offense taken :D

About the mod we are talking, yes it is meant as whole wc3 unit replacement... so map based mod won't work...

Since they are updating to casc, and sc2 is casc, maybe it is possibile to have a system like starcraft 2 somewhere in the future... to have official plugin format that can be used to make mods that can be used as ''master files'' for other maps...
Or even something like skyrims plugin system where we are alowed to load multiple ''mods''
Hopefully, it would be a very good addition, however unless someone from Blizzard speaks up, we will only have speculations on our hands ;c
About the local file thing yeah it will be the way we go, I still want to find a way to protect it only abit so like Orapa said not everyone can right click and open it without a little little bit of knowladge like we had about .asi etc...
Nah, in this case it will be impossible to manage the files, as you will have to follow WC3 file path and that can't be sorted as you wish, which makes my point invalid... which is sad.
 
I keep seeing people be misinformed about War3Mod.mpq. When 1.28 and 1.29 load that file, it is because of a terrible accident. I spoke with a man from Blizzard who shall not be named who did not not realize he knew more than me. Before he realized it was time to shut his mouth, he said, "that file has never been released to the public."

So, never say Blizzard supported custom mods intentionally. In this case it was part of an accident. Blizzard might only support Blizzard themself modding. We do not know for sure.

Edit: I have no intention of offending our Blizzard overlords with this post by admitting that they're having fun modding. But this is important because we want to be modding too.
 
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Interesting point. If you modify the contents of the CASC files, do they reset back to what they were when you launch Warcraft III? I recall attempting to do this years ago with some other Blizzard game that switched to CASC for educational purposes and my amusement, and it immediately purged my modifications from the CASC files and reset them to their original state after the game was running, as far as I could tell at the time.
 
Interesting point. If you modify the contents of the CASC files, do they reset back to what they were when you launch Warcraft III? I recall attempting to do this years ago with some other Blizzard game that switched to CASC for educational purposes and my amusement, and it immediately purged my modifications from the CASC files and reset them to their original state after the game was running, as far as I could tell at the time.
Exactly, when you click battle.net they are gone for sure
 
Level 20
Joined
Apr 12, 2018
Messages
494
Interesting point. If you modify the contents of the CASC files,
Even when they strictly used MPQs this is not something anyone should be doing and was the entire point of the MPQ archive's hierarchy system.

As for why i'd like to use asi or .mix files: a lot of people just open our mods mpq and take whatever model is in there, edit and upload to different sites, make mods based on ours and pretend they made everything... it sucks seeing a model you spent days working on perfecting the texture, animations and mesh just to see it uploaded somewhere by a person claiming they did it... And for ''normal people'' (nothing against you but most people wouldn't know how to open that asi file) it would be harder to steal the models...
Frankly every time I see people post stuff like this I take it as a challenge, especially if said model is a rip or contains ripped components.

Having said that I would be absolutely flattered if people stole my SC2 rips (of the ones I actually did myself that is, I don't have time to convert everything). It doesn't seem particularly popular for some reason.
 
Level 1
Joined
Nov 29, 2017
Messages
6
However, it is not a good thing, that now it will take time to regain what was lost, meaning newcomers will indeed suffer, but let's face the truth, just how many newcomers are there? Probably not much,
There's one right here. I spent all day looking through tutorials and downloading programs trying to figure out why I wasn't able to find mpq files and/or edit anything.
I remember doing this a decade ago and couldn't figure out why nothing was working now.

I no longer have any old files or versions of the game thanks to a hurricane last year. ...so I'm basically screwed. but hey, ...my suffering's not important right?
 
There is a solution @PrismCat for the most basic use cases.
If you want to use Magos War3ModelEditor or MdlVis as a way to view models on your computer, you could download something like the "build3" link that I suggested in a post on this thread:
Mdlvis

The link to this is here:
https://www.hiveworkshop.com/attachments/build3-zip.259156/

Basically in an older version of the game, I repackaged and compressed all of the games assets and textures into a 100ish MB MPQ that's an easy download. It has compression artifacts, so you would not want to make a new model from it. Also, the game was updated so that it can no longer read those compressed BLPs. But this MPQ allows you to view custom models and stuff that use in-game textures. If you know how to add your CD key to this old version, I think it might be a runnable copy of the game from 1.27 that is only 120 MB or whatever, but it doesn't come with a CD key.
 
Level 16
Joined
Apr 14, 2016
Messages
382
There's one right here. I spent all day looking through tutorials and downloading programs trying to figure out why I wasn't able to find mpq files and/or edit anything.
I remember doing this a decade ago and couldn't figure out why nothing was working now.

I no longer have any old files or versions of the game thanks to a hurricane last year. ...so I'm basically screwed. but hey, ...my suffering's not important right?
In case you were talking about things Retera mentioned, then you should have seen, that you can extract CASC into one Singular MPQ and name it into war3.mpq and MDLVis will pick it up no problem. Or, just download what Retera has provided.

And if you want a 1.26a build, I have my own repacks for it, light = 400MB version and full 800MB version, I am not sure if I can openly give a link here, but I can give a link to you in PM.
 
Level 14
Joined
Nov 13, 2017
Messages
733
I don't fully understand.
I patched to 1.30 recently and nothing seems to be problematic. I can normally view models, can even break into mpqs and modify .slks, but yet some custom maps don't work and terribly, I can't see 24 players stuffs related to that.
 

pyf

pyf

Level 32
Joined
Mar 21, 2016
Messages
2,985
With CASC the patches would likely be <<20MB.
CASC likely simplifies the deployment procedure for updates. It is also actively maintained unlike MPQ. For that reason alone moving Warcraft III to it is a good idea as it means we will more likely see regular patches, possibly even hot fixes, and Warcraft III might take advantage of any future updates to the CASC system.
TFT patches for all supported locales, ranging from v1.20d up to and including v1.24e with release notes, date and file size (and hopefully working download links):

Patch 1.20d - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Castellano.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:17 795K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Cesky.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:17 799K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Chinese_Simp.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:17 786K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Chinese_Trad.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:17 789K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Deutsch.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:16 798K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_English.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:16 666K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Francais.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:16 793K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Italiano.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:16 797K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Japanese.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:16 814K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Korean.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:16 790K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Polski.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:16 793K
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War3TFT_120c_to_120d_Russian.exe 19-Apr-2006 12:17 808K


Patch 1.20e - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_120d_120e_Castellano.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:36 697K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_Cesky.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:36 702K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_Chinese_Simp.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:36 688K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_Chinese_Trad.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:36 691K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_Deutsch.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:37 701K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_English.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:37 692K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_Francais.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:37 696K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_Italiano.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:37 700K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_Japanese.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:37 717K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_Korean.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:37 692K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_Polski.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:37 696K
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War3TFT_120d_120e_Russian.exe 22-Jun-2006 19:37 710K


Patch 1.21 - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_120e_121a_Castellano.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:44 2.7M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_Cesky.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:45 2.7M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_Chinese_Simp.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:45 2.7M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_Chinese_Trad.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:45 2.7M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_Deutsch.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:45 2.7M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_English.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:46 2.5M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_Francais.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:43 2.7M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_Italiano.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:43 2.7M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_Japanese.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:43 2.7M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_Korean.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:44 2.7M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_Polski.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:44 2.7M
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War3TFT_120e_121a_Russian.exe 22-Jan-2007 20:44 2.7M


Patch 1.21b - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_121a_121b_Castellano.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:26 936K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_Cesky.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:26 940K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_Chinese_Simp.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:27 926K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_Chinese_Trad.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:27 928K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_Deutsch.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:26 941K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_English.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:26 791K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_Francais.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:26 935K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_Italiano.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:26 938K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_Japanese.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:26 950K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_Korean.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:26 931K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_Polski.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:26 935K
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War3TFT_121a_121b_Russian.exe 06-Feb-2008 18:26 949K


Patch 1.22 - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_121b_122a_Castellano.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:48 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Cesky.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:48 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Chinese_Simp.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:49 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Chinese_Trad.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:49 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Deutsch.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:49 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_English.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:49 7.5M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Francais.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:49 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Italiano.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:49 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Japanese.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:47 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Korean.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:48 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Polski.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:48 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Russian.exe 03-Jul-2008 20:48 7.7M
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War3TFT_121b_122a_Taiwanese.exe 27-Aug-2008 16:40 7.7M


Patch 1.23 - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_122a_123a_Castellano.exe 19-Mar-2009 21:44 1.8M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_Cesky.exe 19-Mar-2009 21:39 1.8M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_Chinese_Simp.exe 19-Mar-2009 22:39 1.8M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_Chinese_Trad.exe 19-Mar-2009 22:40 1.8M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_Deutsch.exe 19-Mar-2009 21:41 1.8M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_English.exe 19-Mar-2009 21:42 1.7M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_Francais.exe 19-Mar-2009 21:45 1.8M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_Italiano.exe 19-Mar-2009 21:47 1.8M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_Japanese.exe 19-Mar-2009 21:48 1.8M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_Korean.exe 19-Mar-2009 22:35 1.8M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_Polski.exe 19-Mar-2009 22:36 1.8M
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War3TFT_122a_123a_Russian.exe 19-Mar-2009 22:38 1.8M
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War3Patches_TFT_122a_123a_zhTW.exe 19-Mar-2009 22:40 1.8M


Patch 1.24 - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_123a_124a_Castellano.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:17 1.4M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_Cesky.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:12 1.4M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_Chinese_Simp.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:27 1.4M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_Chinese_Trad.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:29 1.4M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_Deutsch.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:14 1.4M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_English.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:15 1.2M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_Francais.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:18 1.4M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_Italiano.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:20 1.4M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_Japanese.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:21 1.4M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_Korean.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:23 1.4M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_Polski.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:24 1.4M
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War3TFT_123a_124a_Russian.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:26 1.4M
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War3Patches_TFT_123a_124a_zhTW.exe 04-Aug-2009 20:29 1.4M

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Patch 1.24b - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_124a_124b_Castellano.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:42 923K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_Cesky.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:43 928K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_Chinese_Simp.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:44 914K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_Chinese_Trad.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:44 916K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_Deutsch.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:45 930K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_English.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:45 772K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_Francais.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:46 923K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_Italiano.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:47 926K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_Japanese.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:48 943K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_Korean.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:48 921K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_Polski.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:49 922K
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War3TFT_124a_124b_Russian.exe 25-Aug-2009 19:50 937K


Patch 1.24c - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_124b_124c_Castellano.exe 06-Dec-2009 00:42 889K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_Cesky.exe 06-Dec-2009 00:42 895K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_Chinese_Simp.exe 06-Dec-2009 00:42 880K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_Chinese_Trad.exe 06-Dec-2009 00:42 882K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_Deutsch.exe 06-Dec-2009 00:42 894K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_English.exe 06-Dec-2009 00:42 737K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_Francais.exe 05-Dec-2009 20:37 888K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_Italiano.exe 05-Dec-2009 20:39 892K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_Japanese.exe 05-Dec-2009 20:40 908K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_Korean.exe 05-Dec-2009 20:41 885K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_Polski.exe 05-Dec-2009 20:42 889K
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War3TFT_124b_124c_Russian.exe 05-Dec-2009 20:43 903K


Patch 1.24d - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_124c_124d_Castellano.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:54 807K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_Cesky.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:54 812K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_Chinese_Simp.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:54 798K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_Chinese_Trad.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:54 799K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_Deutsch.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:55 812K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_English.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:55 655K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_Francais.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:55 807K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_Italiano.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:55 810K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_Japanese.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:55 826K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_Korean.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:55 803K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_Polski.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:55 806K
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War3TFT_124c_124d_Russian.exe 21-Jan-2010 11:55 821K


Patch 1.24e - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki

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War3TFT_124d_124e_Castellano.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:50 837K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_Cesky.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:49 842K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_Chinese_Simp.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:50 828K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_Chinese_Trad.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:50 830K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_Deutsch.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:49 842K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_English.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:49 826K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_Francais.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:50 836K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_Italiano.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:50 840K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_Japanese.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:50 857K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_Korean.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:50 833K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_Polski.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:50 837K
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War3TFT_124d_124e_Russian.exe 12-Mar-2010 20:50 852K


Patch 1.25b - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki
Patch 1.26 - Liquipedia Warcraft Wiki


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Please find out by yourself. I am tired.

:xxd:
 
Last edited:
Level 2
Joined
Aug 25, 2018
Messages
4
Agreed. Me and a few others are making a map with 4.5 custom races(Working REALLY hard to make them balanced), and all but for my single one DEPENDS on custom content, and this update 100% BROKE us.
 
Level 2
Joined
Aug 25, 2018
Messages
4
It doesn't work for us, for some reason. We don't know why. Did they fix it since the 1.30 update?
 
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