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StarCraft II Editor too hard for you?

Discussion in 'StarCraft I & II' started by Statharas, Aug 2, 2010.

  1. beantony

    beantony

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    WC3 WE is more user friendly, easy to use, easy to learn, but WC3 graphic is somehow outdated, though it is still fun to play WC3.

    SC2 GE is much more complicated, especially when it comes to Data Editor. When I tried to duplicate a unit, it's not as simple as WE. I've spent about one or two hours in this last two days just trying to figure out how to do it.

    Maybe we just need more to put more time on the GE, trying to familiarize ourselves with it, and then move on from WE to GE.
     
  2. Epix_Loot

    Epix_Loot

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    I'm not familiar with the galaxy editor yet, but I can see that this thing's capabilities will dwarf those of the world editor.
    I haven't really found the patience to actually take my time learning my way around with it, but I'm sure I'll fall in love with it afterwards.
    When I read people's complaints about it being too hard, I usually let out a huge sigh.
    They should just learn how to use the thing now that it's become more advanced.
    The only downside I can think of is that less people with an awesome idea will be able to show it.
     
  3. MySpaceBarBroke

    MySpaceBarBroke

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    Against my better judgment, I'm going to reply to your post. I know I will not change your mind. I know I will not help you understand a single thing. But god damn it, I tried, and if this won't help you, nothing will.
    So are you some kind of AI or just incapable of sympathizing with everyone who HASN'T used the WC3's World Editor before?
    This is why it's hard to take you seriously, DSG.
    Yes, but this isn't a programming language, now is it? This is a map editor. This is a program specifically designed to let Starcraft 2 Players edit and make maps. This isn't a program designed to let software designers make maps or even experienced game modders. At the forefront, this is for Starcraft 2 Players.

    And, assuming that it isn't, it should be. What Blizzard's editors did best was invite and introduce game modding. Its complexity has only gotten better, but to the extent at which they sacrifice comprehensible interface is to the extent at which they are alienating their fanbase.
    [​IMG]
    So, if I'm getting this correct, you want to discourage all new, amateur game modders from ever touching the editor, regardless of potential, because you don't ever want to see shitty maps?
     
  4. Karawasa

    Karawasa

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    Just want to say that the new editor is fucking great!
     
  5. StormWarriors2

    StormWarriors2

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    ugh. I just read all the comments -.-. Wow people never agree with each other. The editor is harder to use than before. I don't like what they did with terraining making it 2x harder than before. And also giving the player the most difficult system. The data units are weird and i can't fix certain values without having to spend 2 @#$!ing hours on the map editior trying to figure it out. I know that some good map editors can't find any way to build a new map. But I have to disagree there is 1 game on battlenet that is completely epic.
    Cortrex Roleplay Xil and swamp. That is one of the best maps on battlenet. XD

    But i was a great modder and tester back when i didn't have hiveworkshop. (After i quit playing for a while i lost my skills D:)
    The thing is that it is too difficult to use. And simple way to fix this is by making it more user friendly. Hell i would enjoy them giving me a copy and paste key. But nooo they had to make that difficult. instead of me working on a map for 30 minutes it takes me 2 hours. As units can't be built that i had made to be built. -.- Thank blizzard, you f---ed up again. sad face :(
     
  6. Giantr

    Giantr

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    I like the GE, but there are some things that are just BULL.

    I hate the water squares.
    I dislike the Data Editor
    I hate (If that is not yet fixed) that you can't simply put Galaxy code into the Trigger editor.
    I hate the restictions on map size (10 mb is too low for some maps), but that is not the editor's fault now is it.

    Other than that it's solid.
     
  7. mrzwach

    mrzwach

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    The real problem with the Galaxy editor is that it expects its users to be highly competent in the modding field already (ie have used other editors). Once you have learned the editor, it is quite simple to do almost anything, but to someone who is just starting to look at it, it is hellishly complex and confusing.

    Better UI and such would be nice. Unfortunately, it won't happen (as blizz has stated), which is what I think the point of the original post was.

    oh, also, you can code custom script directly in the editor. Could you please at least try to do something before you complain about not being able to?
     
  8. tagg1080

    tagg1080

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    Or the fact that blizzard has barely updated the way they present the information to be edited since the first editor.

    A long list of fields that are semi organized, some with obscure names, and no help info anywhere.

    Maybe they could actually give us a nicely packaged editor for once?

    Now, th elitist pieces of crap are all like, "omg noobs, stfu, it is easy once you know what you are doing!", and you know what? at this point in "blizzard map editor" versions, this thing should be fucking b-e-a-utiful.

    But it is STILL an ugly piece of crap.
     
  9. PurplePoot

    PurplePoot

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    That's the same as the WE, really, mrz.
     
  10. mrzwach

    mrzwach

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    Not particularly. I was able to jump into the world editor and make custom maps almost instantly, when I was like 9 years old. Granted, they were pretty damn shitty maps, but at the very least I was able to easily understand how to use it.
     
  11. Statharas

    Statharas

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    Sure, i started off by exploring the World Editor. But the problem here is that some people even asked how to open the editor... We're not talking how really hard it is, we're talking how people find it that hard.

    In fact, i'd say it's not hard at all. People make it look hard to learn. And that's why they should stick with WE.


    And to crush your last statement, my friend started learning how to do everything in GE. And hell, he's doing a good job for a guy that never used a Blizzard Editor before.
     
  12. PurplePoot

    PurplePoot

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    Define "easily understand how to use it." Back in the day I managed to get the pocket factory ability on a building making a certain type of unit and it was a breakthrough for me. I've helped many a person learn to work out how damage works or how to do many seemingly-obvious object data changes.

    I think people remember learning the editor to be easier than it was.
     
  13. StormWarriors2

    StormWarriors2

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    People have different skill settings some people just make games for their own enjoyment.
     
  14. MySpaceBarBroke

    MySpaceBarBroke

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    Haha, crush. Arguments aren't Pokemon, buddy.

    I don't know if your friend already has experience with computers (or the programming thereof), or if he's taken an extensive dive into tutorials with your vehement encouragement, but he if he can take on Galaxy Editor with relative ease, I can assure you, he is not representative of any kind of reasonable expectation from the average Starcraft player.
    WE was hard in its more complex stages. That's to be expected. Galaxy Editor should be the same way, if not even more so. But god damn it, it shouldn't take a tutorial to understand how to create a custom unit. This is entry-grade, elementary level design, and they're needlessly complicating it. I intuitively knew how to create a unit, set its model, attack range, projectile, and abilities rather easily in World Editor. It's just not there in Galaxy.

    This is a site full of experienced modders and experienced IT users. It's natural to have a higher expectation of technical competency here. And granted, I'm not exactly an experienced techie. But it's plain to see that for the average user, Galaxy Editor is a fucking labrynth.
     
  15. Just_Spectating

    Just_Spectating

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    i've learned how to create a unit after like an hour or so of poking through the editor (in the beta),

    so i agree with MSBB

    it doesn't help much more than WE to make it so complicated to create a FUNCTIONAL unit without any FRUSTRATION and BUGS..

    but in my perspective.

    learning is learning.

    if you know how to learn, then everything takes the same amount of difficulty.
    then comes years of practice, and it becomes easy
     
  16. tagg1080

    tagg1080

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    Ok, to sort this out.


    The problem is not in the fact that now a unit takes 50 steps to create.

    The problem is that each of those steps are confusing in themselves.


    There are a LOT of fields to mess with, and not all of them are clear on what they do, how they do it, etc...

    It also doesn't help that the way said fields are organized and presented to the user are a very jumbled and only semi-sorted mess.


    I am not bitching about having more steps, I am bitching because this is blizzards at least 4th map editor, and it has the same format as the first.

    Update it.
     
  17. kewlthis

    kewlthis

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    I got my hands on the editor today. It sure seems a bit different :p

    The unit creating indeed seems like a mess, but the triggers didnt seem all that bad for the first glance.

    Well I quess ill have to play around with it a bit more before final judgement
     
  18. Bloody_Turds

    Bloody_Turds

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    i would have to agree that object data is the biggest leap, although there are more fields, with more stuff to do, its not so simple to do the easy stuff anymore, atleast untill uve devoted hours and hours into it, which is fine and all for kids with plenty of time, but im kinda working (and goin to school), and dont have the hours i had when i was a kid..

    The trigger editor seemed only slightly more complicated, at entry level, with alot more functionality, and the terrain editor's great, with the exception of the cliff hight limits (i think theres only 4 cliffhights you can do), it woulda been nice if you could 'raise ground' directly above a cliff, and it would make sure to only get the terrain on the top side, making a seemingly taller cliff, with the same climbing rules as 1 cliff tall), plus nearly limitless variations on cliff hight

    also all the cliff models should be doodads, for custom cliff creation, to bypass any terrain 'limits' (im sure there available in the mpq once someone finds em)
     
  19. kewlthis

    kewlthis

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    I dont know if im just plain stupid or what, but the editor is really owning me...

    iv spend 2-3h on the editor and so far iv managed to create a unit and add ability to it...too bad the ability doesnt work!!!

    and iv done these with tutorials....so hard.....maybe i can get a hero made in next month at this rate...
     
  20. Statharas

    Statharas

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    You are all wrong. The problem is that people panic when they fail. They never try to find what happened. They run off and make a thread for almost nothing.