I really hate the new Search system

[Maximum_Evil]

I really like the new Site design, but...

In the resource filter of the model section, I cant put in any keywords.

And the search bar in the top corner you search the entire Hive site... The Advanced search doesn't help either, because I check 'Models' and I still get random other stuff (like Forums and comments)?

Am I doing something wrong?

 

[Ralle]

When you go to a repository to search for its resources, you have filter options to the right. Only simple ones, just to do a few quick things.
If you need something more powerful, you can hit "Keyword & Filter Search..." below the "Apply filters" button. This is the same as going to search in the top right but restricted to resources. It's actually really powerful once you get to know it. It has a lot more filtering options than the old system.

 

[Maximum_Evil]

Yes! But why is this so 'hidden', and not like the old site?

EDIT: Also when I use 2 or more keywords, it cannot find anything

 

[Emm-A-]

Hey there I just wanted to add - because it is related -, that in my case, I can do only one search in the ressource section, and then the search bar invisibly jumps back to the main site (as the search results dont seem to display in the searched section itself or so,..), where I have to go manually to the models section again for example. This is very tedious.

 

[Flux]

Hey there I just wanted to add - because it is related -, that in my case, I can do only one search in the ressource section, and then the search bar invisibly jumps back to the main site (as the search results dont seem to display in the searched section itself or so,..), where I have to go manually to the models section again for example. This is very tedious.

Same. I'm hoping the Staff will fix this in the future.

 

[Ralle]

Yes! But why is this so 'hidden', and not like the old site?

EDIT: Also when I use 2 or more keywords, it cannot find anything

1. Because we have added so many more filter options and it would not look nice to have them all in the sidebar. Also, we wanted to integrate natively with XenForo search instead of rolling our own.
2. The new search works a little differently from the old one. When you write two words, they both have to appear in every search results. It allows you to narrow down your search. The old search would find anything that matches just one word. You couldn't narrow the old search like that. However, if you want it to work like the old search, you can make two separate searches.

Hey there I just wanted to add - because it is related -, that in my case, I can do only one search in the ressource section, and then the search bar invisibly jumps back to the main site (as the search results dont seem to display in the searched section itself or so,..), where I have to go manually to the models section again for example. This is very tedious.

Yeah, I kind of don't like that either, but it's part of XenForo's way of working. To modify your search, you have to hit "Search Again" near the top of the search results.

 

[TheLordOfChaos201]

what programming language do you use for searching hive?

if it's java

cause making a search engine for java is super easy

you just don't use contain but instead .equals in relation to every word

 

[Emm-A-]

To modify your search, you have to hit "Search Again" near the top of the search results.

I see ... Well, this actually is an improvement to the other way I had to do it, but I hope you may find a way in the future to work around this.

 

[Maximum_Evil]

I dont think making the search bar so 'complicated' with all the filters is a good thing. I really liked the old & easy one.

 

[Chaosy]

I also think the search is far worse than the old site.
Firstly, what's the benefit of hiding it? The sneaky "Keyword.." takes almost as much space as a 'bubble' where you can search.
I for one tend to search more than I filter so this is just annoying to me.
And to make it even worse.. LET'S PUT AT AT THE BOTTOM

Additionally, the page where the searched models appear is also horrific. I don't like it at all.

 

[Rex.]

I hate the search engine. The old one is the best. I rather go back to Hive 1 because of this. Give it back, this isn't right!

 

[Ralle]

what programming language do you use for searching hive?

if it's java

cause making a search engine for java is super easy

It's MySQL FullText but can be replaced easily.


The reason that there is a separate search page is that it can search across multiple repositories. Every resource section is a separate single repository, but in the future we may have multiple repositories containing the same types of things. That's how it's technically designed anyway right now.

This means that if we remove the search page and only allow searching per repository (aka the repository display page - the one showing bundles) you would only be able to search through its contents.

If we were to have both, well that would just be so much to maintain and I am only a single person.

Also, the XenForo search system allows for replacing the backend. We can replace MySQL FullText search with ElasticSearch with a simple plugin, so I would rather not hardcode my repository display page against their MySQL backend as I may some day decide to use their ElasticSearch instead.

This is why I decided to stick with a few simple filters for the repository display page and integrate the XenForo way with their search system.

Additionally, the page where the searched models appear is also horrific. I don't like it at all.

If you think the way the search results are presented can be improved, I am open to suggestions. This page should however be able to display multiple types of contents, so a table design is no option.

I hate the search engine. The old one is the best. I rather go back to Hive 1 because of this. Give it back, this isn't right!

This is not helpful. We cannot go back to the old site and I cannot work with "I hate X". It only makes me sad

 

[Kyrbi0]

I have been waiting, for years, for a proper "AND" search functionality.

I don't know about the utility of the rest of it, but that alone has made things better.

 

[Rex.]

Well I can't help it really. The reason why hive stands out from the rest of the other war3 websites is due to hives massive content such as maps models and etc. Now the problem is the new search engine, I myself as a map maker really need to search the right content from the whole massive storage and it is going to take me hours!

C'mon, Ralle. I really hope this issue will be solved.


Besides, think of all the effort that members put into each of hives resources. Do it for the us the peons, okay?

 

[IcemanBo]

Hey Rex, did you read Ralle's posts about the search system?
If you can name the problem or what should be improved there is a good chance Ralle can understand and work on it.
Appropriate working based on unspecified statements is impossible.

 

[Ralle]

I more or less addressed all of the feedback by @MasterBlaster. He is my lawyer regarding the search system. Get in here and prove this guy wrong or find out what he wants

 

[MasterBlaster]

I had some computer issues recently, so sorry I wasn't around to help out

Guys, the only piece of advice I can give you here is - try going into more details as to what you don't like or think is broken.
Sure, it takes more time to write everything down, but it really helps Ralle understand where the issue is

If you still have any issues, try to provide an example of a search that you think doesn't work correctly (i.e. what results you got vs what you expected to get).

If you don't like a certain element of the new search feature, try to provide a rational (i.e. not "I just liked it more" or "I was used to how things were") reason "why" you feel the old one was better.

---

As for my experience, the search feature just works - it just takes a little bit of getting used to.

 

[Chaosy]

the search feature just works

Firstly - no.
Here is a system: GUI-Friendly Damage Detection v1.2.1

I search for "Weep", the only result from the user "weep" is the one the furthermost down.
Yes, I could search for author but this is only to prove a point.

I search for dds which is short for Damage Detection System.
The system does not appear at all. However two of MY systems that use his systems appear. Because fuck logic.
GUI Absrorb System 1.0
Do note that the name of the map is exactly the same as the one by Weep as I made the system in the map downloaded.

I search for damage detection, once again MY systems appear on the first page, while the one I am looking for is on the second page, despite my system having a 100x less downloads. And yet again, contains his system and gets placed before the original.
And the first result:
Cosmos' Wrath v1.0 - GUI (5 downloads, not rated, one comment )
WHAT?!??!?!?!?

That has -nothing- to do with what I searched for.


So yeah it's "working indeed"
*sarcasm*

The key is probably the "search for titles option"
But that should be fucking obvious. Of course searching for the title should come before the tags. I don't see the "search for title" option on google or youtube, do I?

And don't get me started on the retarded fact of having to scroll down a whole lot and then click on a link in order to search.
I did post this:

Firstly, what's the benefit of hiding it? The sneaky "Keyword.." takes almost as much space as a 'bubble' where you can search.
I for one tend to search more than I filter so this is just annoying to me.
And to make it even worse.. LET'S PUT AT AT THE BOTTOM

Additionally, the page where the searched models appear is also horrific. I don't like it at all.

But that's just the tip of the iceberg.

 

[Ralle]

I search for "Weep", the only result from the user "weep" is the one the furthermost down.

Weep is a word and not just a username. It makes sense that results unrelated to the user show up. You can put his name in the "author" field and it will show only his submissions.

But that should be fucking obvious. Of course searching for the title should come before the tags. I don't see the "search for title" option on google or youtube, do I?

The tags are once again check boxes you can tick which filter out the results. If you search for words, it will match them against the description and title equally. If you tick "Titles only" it will ignore the description.
Also, you will not find these things on Google and YouTube because you know what? YouTube is Google and Google has spent billions making a great search system.

despite my system having a 100x less downloads

It only sorts by downloads if you set it to sort by downloads.

The system does not appear at all. However two of MY systems that use his systems appear. Because fuck logic.

Can you link this system that it's not finding?

And don't get me started on the retarded fact of having to scroll down a whole lot and then click on a link in order to search.

This is just a link for convenience, you can access the search page many ways. I just try to help people finding it without having to ask.

I need to look more into why it does not find the "dds" result (which I need a link for btw), but aside from that many of your arguments could be made for the old search too. There is not much difference. The old search would always search through both title and description and not even allow you to only search the title.

 

[MasterBlaster]

@Chaosy:

I've said it was working based on my experience, it's impossible for one person to come up with all possible searches and thus find everything that doesn't work - and that's why it's good that you've posted these examples. No need to be sarcastic here, mate

Here is a system: GUI-Friendly Damage Detection v1.2.1
I search for "Weep", the only result from the user "weep" is the one the furthermost down.

Well, it appears there is indeed a bug here. The search engine should check the entire description for the input word and since the author's name is in the description of that particular resource, it should be displayed on the results page.

I search for dds which is short for Damage Detection System.
The system does not appear at all.

Would the old search engine find it? If you're talking about the resource mentioned above, DDS is not in the title or in keywords or in the description, so what you're basically asking is for the search engine to be capable of looking for abbreviations?

However two of MY systems that use his systems appear. Because fuck logic.

Nope, I think there's some logic in this.

The example you posted contains "dds" in the description box on the resource page, whereas as far as I can see the original resource does not (both in the description and the old keywords that are included there + the title). Knowing that the search engine checks titles and descriptions (which - let me stress that out - contains old keywords), it's completely reasonable that it found your resource which contains the imput word and didn't show resources that don't.

I search for damage detection, once again MY systems appear on the first page, while the one I am looking for is on the second page, despite my system having a 100x less downloads. And yet again, contains his system and gets placed before the original.

Well, that's funny, because when I've literally copy-pasted damage detection from the damage detection resource (look above) and tried to search for it - I got nothing.

Also, asking for a way to better sort the results by their relevance is a completely valid suggestion (for example display the resources with input phrase found in the title first). That I can agree with.

 

[fladdermasken]

I feel like maybe people overvalue the old search engine? Trust me, that was genuinely more shitty than this one.

Not that it's bad to get feedback and improve on it, but it's made into a much bigger deal than it needs to be.

It will never be better than Google either way, so if you're really picky, it's honestly better to go that way instead.

 

[Chaosy]

Weep is a word and not just a username. It makes sense that results unrelated to the user show up. You can put his name in the "author" field and it will show only his submissions.

I am aware.
But this is not logical regardless.
If I search for Pewpiepie on youtube, perdiwpie's videos will appear, even if the title does not contain pewdiepie. (though it will probably be a mix)
It's silly that it would be required to write it in a special search box. It's a good option though.

The tags are once again check boxes you can tick which filter out the results. If you search for words, it will match them against the description and title equally. If you tick "Titles only" it will ignore the description.
Also, you will not find these things on Google and YouTube because you know what? YouTube is Google and Google has spent billions making a great search system.

This is no budget issue. The feature is right there, you just decided to disable it by default.

It only sorts by downloads if you set it to sort by downloads.

Once again, this should be obvious. The chances of me searching for a "not so famous system" is obviously lower than a popular one.

Can you link this system that it's not finding?

I did at the very top.

Would the old search engine find it? If you're talking about the resource mentioned above, DDS is not in the title or in keywords or in the description, so what you're basically asking is for the search engine to be capable of looking for abbreviations?

I am not entirely sure to honest.
I do remember that I had zero issues finding it though. Probably just searched for "damage detection system". It was not on the second page, that much is certain. Probably among the first 5 results.

The example you posted contains "dds" in the description box on the resource page, whereas as far as I can see the original resource does not (both in the description and the old keywords that are included there + the title). Knowing that the search engine checks titles and descriptions (which - let me stress that out - contains old keywords), it's completely reasonable that it found your resource which contains the imput word and didn't show resources that don't.

My system is named "Absorb system" and is an edited version of Weep's DDS. I literary downloaded his map and added my triggers, so the map settings are identical. Yet my map is displayed before the original despite having less mentions of a damage detection system.

Once again I emphasize that the number of downloads/rating? should be filtered by default. AND that the title should hold more value than the tags.

 

[Rex.]

AND that the title should hold more value than the tags.

This guy is right about it.

 

[MasterBlaster]

Okay, Chaosy - from what I understand, your primary concern is not that the search engine doesn't find something in general, but how the results are sorted on the results page by default (i.e. the order the search results are displayed in)? Did I understand you correctly?

 

[Chaosy]

It's a mix of both, but yes having certain settings by default would be a huge step in the right direction.

 

[Ralle]

I search for dds which is short for Damage Detection System.
The system does not appear at all.

Would the old search engine find it? If you're talking about the resource mentioned above, DDS is not in the title or in keywords or in the description, so what you're basically asking is for the search engine to be capable of looking for abbreviations?

Exactly. Never been like that. I suggest @Weep put in the word DDS in the title or description.

Sorting by results in title first might be possible. It's a good idea.

If I search for Pewpiepie on youtube, perdiwpie's videos will appear, even if the title does not contain pewdiepie. (though it will probably be a mix)

Putting the author's name in the search data is probably also a good idea.

This is no budget issue. The feature is right there, you just decided to disable it by default.

I don't get what you're saying, you can select the tags right here (see attached image).

Yet my map is displayed before the original despite having less mentions of a damage detection system.

Number of mentions? So I just have to add the words "damage detection system" 100 times to my description to show up at the top?

 

[MasterBlaster]

I can second this, sorting the results in a way that the resources with querry matching the title, starting with most popular first (perhaps) would be a nice improvement

 

[Kyrbi0]

I Really Hate This Thread's Title; can't we shoot for something a little more constructive?

 

[GhostWolf]

Just reverse engineer how Google search works, and problem solved!

 

[Ralle]

The search is currently re-indexing. After that, there shouldn't be any not permitted words. Also, search will order by relevance.

 

[ssbbssc2]

please add an old search system
this new is totally waste
i cant even find dummy.mdx

 

[DracoL1ch]

clicking on the picture of the model/resource at "search" should target you at the resource private page instead of opening image.

 

[ssbbssc2]

still the old search system was much better
емасе =\

 

[Sulfar]

Since most of my searches are keyword related rather than using simple filters the new system slows me down when i have to look for resources.

 

[Ralle]

still the old search system was much better
емасе =\

Technically no, user experience wise, maybe. Please add more details. Your posts thus far in this thread have been a waste of space.

Since most of my searches are keyword related rather than using simple filters the new system slows me down when i have to look for resources.

I understand. Do you however find what you look for?

 

[Sulfar]

I understand. Do you however find what you look for?

Yeah, there's no problem with that

 

[Ralle]

Yeah, there's no problem with that

That used to be a problem, you see. I have ideas for adding the search field back but I need to do some thinking. So far the search field is integrated into a special XenForo system. I would need to integrate properly with that to do this. I know it's important to many people .

 

[JesusHipster]

I can't find shit with the new search engine. Am I the only one with this problem?'

I ordered Prince Phoenix model author to find the original author of the cape model to credit him properly and ask for credits. I guessed he has problems with this, so i've decided to give it a shot myself.

So yeah, i didn't find crap with keywords like "cloak", "hood" and "cape". On old Hive it would have been enough 'coz i frankly remember searching for that cloak model myself and successfully finding it.

 

[Shar Dundred]

I can't find shit with the new search engine. Am I the only one with this problem?'

Nope.

 

[Kyrbi0]

"site:hiveworkshop.com model cloak"?

The new Search is "AND" rather than "OR", which means you should be able to narrow it down or be general, whichever. "cloak cape hood" will find less things than any one of them alone (basically it has to find something with "cloak" AND "cape" AND "hood", likely 0).

However, I too have some issues, even knowing this, so I'm not sure if I'm missing something.

 

[JesusHipster]

The new Search is "AND" rather than "OR", which means you should be able to narrow it down or be general, whichever. "cloak cape hood" will find less things than any one of them alone (basically it has to find something with "cloak" AND "cape" AND "hood", likely 0).

I've used them separately. So yeah, it's messsy right now..

P.S: Help me find the model

 

[Ralle]

I can't find shit with the new search engine. Am I the only one with this problem?'

I ordered Prince Phoenix model author to find the original author of the cape model to credit him properly and ask for credits. I guessed he has problems with this, so i've decided to give it a shot myself.

So yeah, i didn't find crap with keywords like "cloak", "hood" and "cape". On old Hive it would have been enough 'coz i frankly remember searching for that cloak model myself and successfully finding it.

If you search for "cape, cloak, robe" it will require that any result contains ALL the entered words. You get more results by making a search for each word separately.

It works perfectly for me. I am not aware of any mess so far.

I searched for "cape" and found 4 that looks like the one you want. Linked in your request.

 

[JesusHipster]

If you search for "cape, cloak, robe" it will require that any result contains ALL the entered words. You get more results by making a search for each word separately.

It works perfectly for me. I am not aware of any mess so far.

I searched for "cape" and found 4 that looks like the one you want. Linked in your request.

I've used them separately. So yeah, it's messsy right now..

I am not that unfamiliar with search engines work to search for "cape, cloak and hood" instead of trying those words separately. That's why I put each of them into separate commas. Wonder if the problem is with my English or just that everyone is more likely to believe that I've searched for all 3 words at once instead of the fact that the search engine is broken.

Ralle, thank you for your help, but 2 of those cloaks look nothing like the one I'm looking for. As for the others - I just can't access them - I get an error message.

And I'm still 100% positive that search for one of those words used to return the needed cape model. I might load waybackmachine and try searching the same words in older version of the site later, but take a look into this asap, pretty sure there is some problem as of right now.


Edit: well, that sounded way too harsh of me. Sorry. Though the fact that search returns less items then it did before bothers me.

 

[ssbbssc2]

Technically no, user experience wise, maybe. Please add more details. Your posts thus far in this thread have been a waste of space.


I understand. Do you however find what you look for?

okay, i mat same problems as JesusHipster
i got too many unneeded shit in my search

 

[Ralle]

Still not helpful. Besides, @JesusHipster found what he was looking for. Turned out it was deleted.

 

[Kyrbi0]

Search worked pretty well for me just recently; turns out a grand total of 3 other people have written the words "custom troll race"/"jungle troll race", other than me.

 

[Chaosy]

Nope still broken.

I searched for "Timed" (tried with checking the title box as well)
the first results:

Aaaand, further down the page, Timed Effect and Timed Ability (which I was looking for)
I give the search engine ONE keyword, and it somehow sorts Time before Timed, despite me searching for Timed. This is just bonkers.

 

[Ralle]

How is that broken? This is not using the Chaosy sort algorithm.

 

[Kyrbi0]

Actually, I'm confused too by that. Searching for "Time" should give those kind of results ("Time" entries on top as most relevant, but "Timed" also as 'time' is a part of 'timed'), but searching for "Timed" shouldn't show a single "Time" entry, since it's looking for that extra 'd'.

I would think.

 

[Ralle]

I think it sanitizes all words to a common form before actually doing the search. This is what also helps when you search for singular/plural forms of words. It finds them all.