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DotA is dying.

Thoughts on this?


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Lol, dota is not dying. 6.56 came out with new heroes and items. I played today Warcraft, battle net is full of dota. There is more dota becouse warcraft is dying only people that love dota still play it on battle net the rest has gave up on Warcraft. Face it, Warcraft is going KABOOM! lol. No, really *DEAD*

True that.I think this thread should be closed now.
 
Level 15
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Lol wtf you just epic failed.

Ok guys, this thread is just full of fucking fail and you all know it. Most of you don't even discuss about he damn subject anymore so please GTFO!
And the truth is that DotA is dying every god damn second and will be dead when SC2 comes. Resurrection is possible in SC2, but most likely won't happen.

How the fuck will SC2 kill DotA? Most of the people who play DotA play "DotA" not "WC3". They generalize it as only DotA. They don't give a shit about WC3 or SC2, because they know that DotA will always be played on WC3. Always.
 
Level 10
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Actually, the only people that quit after that update were newbs who play Easy Mode.

That means that DotA isn't dying at all, and is actually getting better by cleansing newbies.

In fact, that update was directed at balancing professional play... the current creators of DotA don't enjoy the fact that random newbs play DotA.
 
Level 36
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Well nobody cares about the pros who play it in private games, because those don't flood up the public game list.

If we're left with only pros, however, the same thing will happen to DotA as it did to RPing. The pros stop allowing new players to play in their games and only let the MOST elite in their teams. Then, those pros start being less and less active as they move onto other things in life. And since the new players all hate DotA because of the pros, and the pros aren't there anymore, neither is DotA.
 
Level 6
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DotA just released their new version, 6.55, which obviously is not going over well with its players.

Read more here: DotA Allstars Discussion -> General Discussion

Anyway, the amount of games hosted on bnet has at least been halved, if not quartered.

What are your thoughts on this?
Actually, the only people that quit after that update were newbs who play Easy Mode.

DotA isn't dying. Nearly every DotA update, there's always people that complain. It's no different this time(well, there's slightly more complainers but still doesn't anything).

Also I don't think much people quit at all. It was just the "short-term" shock from the sudden new change in the map(which a lot of people aren't used to), after the shock, they all return to DotA.

The reason why I say that is because, well, a lot of people on the forums complain to everything, especially if the changes are big.

They just need a few days to adjust to the new changes before "stopping complaining".

Another reason why I say not many people quit is because DotA still takes up 70% of the custom games(during peak hours), just like always, so it still seems the same.

Also, of the DotA games that are hosted, nearly ALL of them are "still" -em(there's only like 2-3 non-em games out of the 10-15 that are hosted at a time).

DotA isnt a bad map, the creator sucks hardcore I have to admit.
Icefrog? Why?(I haven't been keeping up with what Icefrog is doing, honest question).

The map is a good map, though the community is bad(In the sense that there are a lot of elitist, trash talkers, clanners[who are elitist], etc).

In all fairness though, this affects nearly every popular online game, so it doesn't apply to just DotA, it applies to nearly all popular games in general.

Though I think it affects DotA more than any other custom WC3 map in my experience.

Yeah i play mostly against the bots and my friends, It's really a fun map that way.But playing it on Bnet is a whole different situation.

Agreed. There's rarely a game with "even teams"(there's almost always someone that leaves, feeds, or something else). Not to mention the trash talkers and allies who blame you for all their own faults(like dying).
 
Level 25
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Well the new 6.56 is released and AI+ version and i think there is truth in what Newuser said but i don't think we will see the end of dota soon, and people who flame dota either get owned on Bnet or don't try it thinking dota is crap.
Maybe Dota is flooding the Bnet but i think that is cause people want to play it so we can't really do anything until Diablo3 & Starcraft2 come out...
 
Level 2
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ive played DoTa plenty times, IUT JUST A REGULAR HERO Deffense like game
lol. Anyway heres my take on things:
This version is my first time playing DotA since version 3.14...
idk what the older versions were like, but i like This version. I think its okay. I have noticed that the number of games hosted IS dropping. I am also wondering if wc3 will die altogether after the release of starcraft2. The one thing i know is tht wc3 uses hero and starcraft does not. i like the heros btr. i do believe this will be a deciding factor in wc3 vs starcraft2. tho as soon as starcraft2 is released the number of ppl who ply wc3 will lessen significantly, and in turn dotA will also "die"
 
Level 1
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DotA may just be a standard hero offense map in gameplay, but not in the way the developers made its items and heroes.
IMO DotA is very creative; the heroes' skills are good and thus it incites more variations in the gameplay, with unique combinations between heroes and items.
I've also played DotA so often and I rarely get bored.
 
Level 2
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DotA is not dying, we thought it was 2 years ago & the only thing that died was custom map variety. Currently according to mapgnome.org dota is hosted about 28x more often than the second place map.
 
Level 6
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Basically, all the DotA-players are saying the non-DotA players suck, and the non-DotA players say the DotA map sucks.

There's a big difference in those two, more importantly that the latter isn't attacking a person/several persons, except Icefrog which has been justified.

Myself I don't enjoy playing DotA, I don't like AoS games at all, really.
I'd be happy to see less DotA in the game lists when I'm on BNet, I don't mind if there's a few of them, but now there's too many.

Some have argued that DotA takes skill, sure, I can agree that you need to play it a few times before you're good, but it does in no way require more skill then a different type of map, take the WoW Arena for example, it also requires a lot of knowledge, timing, tricks and mindgames to be good.

Personally I don't see why DotA is such a major map, except for the fact that it's being updated frequently, there's nothing special about it, and I think another map like EotA could have made it just as far, with some luck.

As for it dying, no, I don't think it is, or will in the near future.
 
Level 13
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I think the BIG problem of dota is that it is really hard to learn...

When you join a dota game online and you are a newby then EVERYBODY will tell you how bad you are and that you shall leave and that your are a complet noob...

So it's veeerrry difficult to learn it...

But when you managed to learn it then you will have great fun because there is a huge variety of heros, ability, items... Can be combined in nearly unlimited ways..
 
Level 24
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Basically, all the DotA-players are saying the non-DotA players suck, and the non-DotA players say the DotA map sucks.
This theory fails!

Personally I don't see why DotA is such a major map, except for the fact that it's being updated frequently, there's nothing special about it, and I think another map like EotA could have made it just as far, with some luck.
Because your an idiot, play it more and you will eventually see!
 
Level 13
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Personally I don't see why DotA is such a major map, except for the fact that it's being updated frequently, there's nothing special about it, and I think another map like EotA could have made it just as far, with some luck.

It's community, it's league (Clan TDA @ useast), and it's popularity which brings in more players all play a part in the game.
 
Level 5
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yeah, i personally am not a big fan of DotA anymore, mainly because i think Icefrog is screwing over the game a bit. I miss the ol' 6.50 days. That was when the game was fun. Although it doesn't help that i discovered Dawn of the Dead (another fun game).
 
Level 6
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This theory fails!
Because your an idiot, ..
What?

And yes, community has a lot to say to make a game popular, but if you change what AoS was made first, and say DotA was made this year, and some other AoS was made instead of DotA, and was updated just like DotA, it would most likely be very popular aswell.
 
Level 6
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Personally I don't see why DotA is such a major map, except for the fact that it's being updated frequently, there's nothing special about it, and I think another map like EotA could have made it just as far, with some luck.

I used to play DotA very regularly and here are a few reasons I liked DotA:
1. Hero variety - It was really fun with all the different heroes and stuff, each game was never really the same due to the difference heroes.

I say this is one of the major(if not, the main) reason why DotA is very popular, the hero variety.

2. Like you said, it's updated often - DotA is probably one of the longest and most updated custom map on Warcraft 3, if it's not "the' longest/most updated.

It was there since virtually the beginning of Warcraft 3(Eul's version), became the "Allstars" version(Guinsoo/Icefrog version) and is still being updated as of today.

A lot of new content(heroes/items/etc) is added very often which leads to the map staying "fresh" and drawing in more and more players.

Some have argued that DotA takes skill, sure, I can agree that you need to play it a few times before you're good, but it does in no way require more skill then a different type of map, take the WoW Arena for example, it also requires a lot of knowledge, timing, tricks and mindgames to be good.

If anything, I think it's not that DotA "require skills", which makes it popular, it's that "it's easy to pick up and play" which makes it popular.

Comparing DotA to melee Starcraft or melee Warcraft 3, DotA is a lot easier to play(no need for micromanaging, macromanaging, or crazy actions per minutes[like Korean starcraft players have], etc).

Sure there is "denying"(killing friendly units before they die so the enemy won't get gold) but besides that, DotA is easy to play (in "public/casual play" that is, organized team competitive play is a different story, I'll talk about it later).

You only need some "knowledge" to play good in public game: Knowing which items to get on which heroes and which abilities to get first and which to get last. These two things can be learned quickly. While the item recipe may seem complicated at first, it becomes fairly simple once you play a few games.

Of course, another important thing to know is to not get hit pointlessly(i.e. running into a group of enemy creeps at level 1 then dying) and sticking together(AND not trying to fight all 5 enemy heroes solo, unless you're fed).

Anyway, here's why I say that organized team competitive play is much different than casual "public" play:

In public play - You only need to know which items to get and which abilities to get first to play good in public play. And, of course, you need to know how to play Warcraft 3 also. (I actually encountered a few players who introduced a friend STRAIGHT to DotA, skipping "any RTS"[they never played an RTS before until WC3/DotA]).

What matters more in public play is not "how much you can deny" or "how fast you can click", what matters more in public matches is "which team has the most leavers/feeders/trash talkers/stackers".

In most cases, what defines which team wins is simply which team has horrible or uncooperative players OR which team has a "stack" of players(i.e. a bunch of friends who all know how to play DotA, all join the same team vs random people).


In organized competitive play - This is where the "skill" is needed in DotA because there is less "luck" involved like in public games, where luck plays a huge role in whether you win or lose(luck, i.e., which team has the good players, which team has the bad players, which team has leavers, etc).

The main skill in DotA is team work skill(I say "team work" broadly, to mean a lot of things that have to do with "team" skills and not "solo" skills). Denying and clicking are secondary(because they're very easy compared to the former). I could further explain but I think it's more easier to understand if I say clan(team) vs clan(team) matches require skill(to win) while simply playing in public matches does not require much skill(to win, as in most cases, teams win or lose because they have bad players).


I think the BIG problem of dota is that it is really hard to learn...

When you join a dota game online and you are a newby then EVERYBODY will tell you how bad you are and that you shall leave and that your are a complet noob...

So it's veeerrry difficult to learn it...
DotA isn't hard to learn unless you never played a "real time strategy" game ever before(i.e., you skipped Warcraft 3's tutorial on how to play, and you never played an RTS ever before). I've actually met a few players who invited a friend to play DotA, except that person never played an actual RTS before, so they didn't exactly learned things fast.

The item recipes may seem complicated but it's very simple to understand(it should only take a few minutes to understand how to combine items if you read the descriptions of things).

When you join a dota game online and you are a newby then EVERYBODY will tell you how bad you are and that you shall leave and that your are a complet noob...
Four tips:
1. If you die often, "tower hug" or simply stay far away but still in exp gain range. Switch lanes with an ally if you're having trouble against a hero.

2. There are a lot of jerks in games who may say you're not "playing correctly", regardless if the person is some veteran at DotA or not. For example, sometimes a person that died from their "own fault" may blame you or someone else because you were the one near them.

Example - So you're laning with an ally. The ally decides to do something without telling you, running into the large enemy army to try to kill the enemy hero.

You notice this, so you do everything you can (use your abilities, attack, etc). The ally dies, they then blame you.

This will happen often. Just remember that there are jerks in the game and it's a very unfriendly environment so you have to learn to deal with it(mute them, ignore them, don't argue with them, just ignore them or something).

3. Read - Abilities and items have very helpful descriptions of what they do.

Don't assume what the ability does by simply looking at the icon. Yes, I've ran into players who did not read what the abilities did, which is why I'm pointing this out.

Also, same thing for items. Some new players might get a recipe thinking it's the whole item but failing to actually read that it's simply a recipe and not the whole item.

4. Stick together - Going out into enemy territory alone is usually a bad idea unless you "know"(AKA, you're fed) you can take all 5 enemy heroes at the same time(as well a horde of creeps).
 
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Map Makers have already surpassed it in every way, except that Dota is more established and been there for a very long time and with constant updates, I don't think it will die soon. Thank god for Starcraft 2, I'll get a bit of custom variety some months before another map takes the monopoly over BNET, which I'm really hoping that it doesn't happen like in Wc3.
 
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DotA is and will remain popular because It's got a hardcore fanbase and is more BALANCED than other AoS's. Many will argue against this, but its usually because you've only played it less than 10 times (I've played it over 400 times for sure). It's constantly getting more balance changes and it gets some pretty good content. It may not be the best coded map, but alot of people care more about fairness than OOH AAH amazing stuff. I, for one, think it will outlast starcraft just because it has SOOO much more content and is constantly getting updated.

It's becoming more and more of an E-Sport because it is BALANCED (see the keyword). Tournaments with $5,000 USA prizes is huge for online gaming. DotA gets stuff like that more and more frequently. Not only is it fairly easy to assemble of team of players who can get good (since its mostly about teamwork rather than individual skill) by practicing with each other. The game keeps getting shorter as well which is a huge help. Alot of these, ZOMG SUPER AWESOME MAPS take 2 hours to beat. That or you just abuse one thing to death and the enemy concedes.

I would love it if another game could put up a fight to DotA because quite honestly, I'm getting sick of annoying hardcore people who tell me what to get for items when I'm clearly better than them. More variety is always a good thing, but first a game needs to get balanced and not have any "pet" heroes, items, units, spells, ect in it. I know as a map maker its fun to make one guy more powerful than the rest and stomp at your own game, but it really turns it off to everyone else.
 
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Amen. I play DotA but just for fun... I hate it when they treat it as a religion, telling you what you should and shouldn't do.
 
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Dota sucks, im happy its going down.
The games ok, but theres too much complex multitasking involved.
The people that play it all swear too much, and dont care for noobs.
People dont enjoy dota, its too serious.
People should have fun playing games and stuff, not fighting over the smallest of crap.

People are too attached to this "amazing" game [oooh look cool SFX, awsom spell] that they dont check out better maps, like Tkok and such.

The only game in wc3 my bro has played, is Footmen Frenzy [b4 it lost control with all the fake versions n stuff]
and now dota, when i ask him to play another game, i gota pester him and maybe then i get a good game.

People should play dota, AND other games 2
 
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okay, first of all, people are not attached to DotA becouse of the "omg grafix" or the "imbaspell"

they are attached becouse its easy to play(no complex systems or rules), easy to learn and ITS ALL OVER THE FUCKIN PLACE. Seriously, they can get into a game at any time(if not on B.net, on dota leagues). Same reason Green TD is one of the most popular TDs. its simple, easy to learn(anti-air towers vs air levels and so on) and its popular(which it became becouse it was so easy). Oh, and 75% of the people playing are either retarded, assholes or stubborn aswell.
 
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