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[Campaign] Alternative to gold mines

Discussion in 'Idea Factory' started by Grey.Knight, May 18, 2018.

  1. Grey.Knight

    Grey.Knight

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    I know this topic has been brought up before i was thinking what are other methods of providing the player with a steady income without the gold mine, people have told me to set up a salary system where based upon performance the player gets x amount of gold every y minutes as long as z enemies are destroyed, however I was looking for a more creative solution, what do you hivers think? List as many solutions as possible
     
  2. ArchDuke

    ArchDuke

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    For steady income here are some ideas:

    Gold bonus ability - An ability that works once every 120 seconds and grants the player 1000 gold

    Alchemy building - Like a gold mine, but generates funs at a much slower rate

    Lumber economy - if there are no gold mines on the map you can cut down lumber and trade this in for gold, the trade can go however way you want for instance 10 lumber for 10 gold, or 10 lumber for 50 gold, this is your choice

    Water Mil - Build these structures in shallow water and they in turn generate gold

    I might edit this post and add other things.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2018
  3. Grey.Knight

    Grey.Knight

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    Nice, however what about developing some sort of magic-exploittiion where you can have units or a structure casting a spell within a a specified region and in turn creating gold
     
  4. nedio95

    nedio95

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    There is a book where mages can turn anything into gold (mages being mages) so they were prohibited by a royal decree to use anything but copper coins for trading around :) So, you could have items like iron ore or copper ore or gold ore or just some item. Mage grabs it and then uses an ability to turn it into gold. This is more suitable for RPG though...
    You could automate the process like making it a building that has certain capacity & limits.

    Don't forget the pillage ability :) People often forget about this as one of the two native ability based resource incomes. (Alchemist transmute, is there anything else?)

    to be honest, you don't really want to have the player engulfed in resource gathering mechanics for a melee map... Would you mind sharing what type of map we are tinkering about? Obviously, some ideas would be viable only for RPG maps others would be viable only for strategy, and some would not be applicable for either.

    Regards
    -Ned
     
  5. Banelingline

    Banelingline

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    Take the Factory dummied out ability, make it generate "units" with costs based on your desired rate of resource production, then use either Pillage or Transmute set to some form of automateable trigger to make it so that you have a regenerating supply of resources.
     
  6. cleavinghammer

    cleavinghammer

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    Trade: Allied caravans regularly spawn at the edge of the map and head towards a building (town hall, market, control point...), giving gold and lumber once they get there (amount increases with distance traveled). Killing enemy caravans causes coins and lumber to drop, though not as much as they give to their trade partner. Same thing with trade ships and shipyards. Upgrades increase movespeed, HP and amount carried.

    Crafting: Workshops that automatically manufacture low-level items (potions, scrolls) and have an option to automatically sell them. In effect, you set them to either create items or give gold every X minutes.

    Slavery: Every 5 enemy workers killed/every worker with low HP targeted with an Enslave ability spawns a neutral slave at your base. Every few minutes the slaves leave for the edge of the map, giving gold once they reach it (increases with distance traveled and per slave), but will escape if not accompanied by at least one of your units (rebellion occurs when the sum of guard HP is lower than the sum of slave HP). Enemies that attack the caravan can rescue some of the workers, the others escape.

    Ransom: Using the Enslave ability on a non-worker unit with low HP turns it neutral. The owner can use the Pay Ransom ability on the unit to get it back, giving the captor a low multiple of its gold cost (1.1 to 2x).

    Control points: A standard control points system with different amounts of income, with each point able to generate income-boosting buildings (lumber mill, mines, market, guard post, etc.).

    Bandit King: Pays a large amount of money up front in order to get money every time a creep kills a unit.

    Taxes: Generates income based on the number of food structures/current max food/current food used/number of workers.

    Corruption: Lowers an enemy's income and increases your own.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2018
  7. Oliver

    Oliver

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    Investment: You buy shares, more shares = more money per period of time (money tick)

    Complex Investment: you buy shares in a team. The amount of money you get per tick depends on how many shares you have in a team and how well (or how many buildings/units) that team has.

    Sponsor a hero: Similar to shares but amount per tick depends on the heroes level with bonuses for feats performed by the hero - eg killing an enemy hero

    Tree tending - Buildable building. Every tick (say 60 seconds) you count the number of trees near the buildings and award gold based on that number.

    Tax collector - Similar to the tree tending but instead of trees it requires neutral passive villager units.

    Animal farming - You must capture animals, grow them to maturity, breed them and then sell their produce.

    Caravan system - use code to establish trade routes between 2 town centres. Special units are assigned to these routes. Further the distance = more money per trip. Done by assigning an integer to each caravan unit that integer indexes to 2 arrays, one for the "start" of the trade route and one for the "end" of the trade route. Each time the caravan comes close to its destination you are given some money, the caravans destination is changed and the caravan is ordered to the other destination. (I realise this is very similar to the post above but I based this off of rise of nations)
     
  8. cleavinghammer

    cleavinghammer

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    Investment should have a chance to fail the more money gets put in/the bigger the returns.

    Maybe have these systems be passive (as in, 3 upgrade levels of sheep farming, 3 levels of logging, etc.) that increase income but don't require actually watching over the sheep (or only require it at the first level, and the upgrades begin once you hire someone to do it for you).
     
  9. Oliver

    Oliver

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    For the investment you could make it have diminishing returns. Like if you have 2 or so goldmines try to have the max investment income tend toward that. To stop crazy snowballing. Unrealistic but better for gameplay.
     
  10. Oliver

    Oliver

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    Maybe just have randomly generated quests/tasks and reward gold for them. Stuff like kill this creep, destroy this building, take this unit there, aquire this item, get to level 5, amass 1000 wood
     
  11. cleavinghammer

    cleavinghammer

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    Export weapons: Receive money from another player, giving them an upgrade you have researched or the ability to produce a unique unit.

    Mercenaries: Targets an area containing allied units. Transfers ownership of units to the casting player, former owner receives 1.1x the unit's cost from the casting player's resources.
     
  12. Lord Aiden

    Lord Aiden

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    Arcane energy Harvesting - Have a special structure that if captured provides an income of around 300 gold per minute

    Alchemy factory - a factory that produces a certain amount of gold per minute if captured
     
  13. nedio95

    nedio95

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    Sacrificial Pit (Building) - Sacrifice a unit to activate. The building operates for time scaling with current HP of sacrificed unit. Generates resources based on operation time and sacrificed unit hp.

    Sacrifice Pit (Neutral Building) - Same as above. Enemy players can sacrifice a unit to interrupt your sacrifice, so you have to fight for control over it.

    Arcane Ritual (Building / Ability) - Imagine it like Undead Goldmine a bit. A number of mages can perform a ritual in this... thing... draining their mana and conjuring resources. When they run out of mana the building starts draining their HP with increasing rate.
    It could be like a ritual circle with some slots. Also, mage units could have an ability to place one themselves.

    Conjure (Ability - Passive/Auto-cast) - Mage conjures a random item that could be sold. Usually just cheap junk comes out that is sold immediately.

    @Grey Knight we still don't know what map you are having in mind?
    Obviously, a Mage would find it very hard surviving among spaceship slugging around with lasers and a hacker would find it troublesome cracking the firewall of a Tree of Ages.

    regards
    -Ned
     
  14. Oliver

    Oliver

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    Mana crystal trader. Neutral buildings with a consumable item which have a slow replenishment rate. When purchased by a hero it converts the heroes mana into gold. The replenishment rate creates scarcity forcing players to fight over the control of neutral buildings which sell them.
     
  15. disruptive_

    disruptive_

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    Some nice and creative ideas. I laughed a bit with the shares or stocks thing. You can make an entire game out of that.
    In my opinion (just a trivial and surely incoherent monologue), and presuming the thread starter is talking about a melee or altered melee campaing, the economy aspect of the game should'nt be too flashy and rather be mechanical or atleast with options to make it somewhat automatic. Most of the ideas given here can be automated with a building that repeats the respective economical action, with some space to provide adaptation options. Aren't gold mines just a building that, providing minor interactiveness, give you the money?.

    Just like most RTS, in which you just click the respective "economical subject", usually a worker or dedicated unit or a building, then proceed to click again or do something with a lot less juice than for example invading a base, and thenenjoy the dollars.
    Should be noted that there still should be a margin for meanginful choices (read: players can mess things up) in this economical aspect of the game, otherwise there is no real point to make a resource system and design scarcity. Time could also be tweaked to become scarce, ie. turn system.Talking about scarcity -where?-, in an usual W3 melee game, this aspect almost never kicks in. One can only guess what will happen if gold mines have half the gold, or if massing mortar teams to deforestate were a viable strategy.

    My guess is that "we" -the players- are all too aware of the importance of amassing resources, but in the very end the fun is obtained by spending them.
    In the end i'm saying this strictly because i enjoy more the beatdown, let's say the militar aspect, than the economy aspect. But hey, maybe someone likes to amass resources, as an end in itself, isn't greed good after all. Was it AOE II that had a mode consisting precisely in winning by gathering X resources?, i'm also aware that some games allow for a better equilibrum (in all aspects, incluiding the juicing) between the militar and economical aspect, making them both equally meaningful to win.


    TLDR; design diffent buildings, some more general, some more specific, that do some of the given ideas, as a repeating and hopefully automated effect. Add some SFX (ie. transmutation on death effect), text tags, etc, so players are aware that they are getting rich.

    Some buildings ideas (new):
    - Bank, this one just provides gold as periodic income, and has mana. It has an active ability (that's why the mana) called "Speculate" (or "Modify Interest Rates" w/e is more themed), that increases all gold gains by other buildings by X% for X minutes.
    - Shipyard/Port, this one periodically creates ships -what else-, up to a maximum. Created ships just wander around the building, but every X seconds, the building grants the player X gold based on the number of ships. Ships can be of course be killed, but can also be captured. Upgrades can increase the maximum ships controlled, gold per ship granted, and gold income time rate. Sometimes, instead of a ship an "awesome ship" is spawned instead, this ship gives more stuff... etc.
    - Work Post (this is inspired by the concept, "salary system", already mentioned by Grey Knight), this building has mana. It starts with 3 or 4 different abilities. Each ability has the structure: "Whenever the player does X, it gains Y gold". Each antecedent is different. The thing is that whenever the player switches between abilities, as each cost full mana points, he actually needs to wait to do the switch. Use mana regeneration to control the wait time. Make each ability be based on Channel, to allow different order ids, with 360000 follow through and 0 cooldown and suddenly it appears as if you are toggling between abilities. Triggering this might be tricky, since you might want to make this building be able to be builded many times.
     
  16. TheLordOfChaos201

    TheLordOfChaos201

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    Populous the beginning had an interesting concept for magical resources, instead of harvesting gold your mana increased according to the number of people in your community.

    This would be like collecting tax. The more people you have the more money you generate. When war strikes that number decrease as people die, adding strategy into the game as there will be now greater risk economically and socially, to war. You could further influence this currency by adding moral, when your troops are winning your cash flow increases, but when they lose it now costs more to hire new troops as they are now unwilling to join the doomed effort of war.

    Or like populous

    The more of the enemy you kill, the more your currency goes up, the more men you lose the more your currency goes down
     
  17. Oliver

    Oliver

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    I really liked populous. The way you had to train braves into other types of units, the way the land was all deformable, the way you could deplete the resources, the way the braves would sort of "auto" behave (like upgrading houses automatically, putting wood in piles etc) Solid game. Wonder how much work it'd take to remake in Wc3
     
  18. TheLordOfChaos201

    TheLordOfChaos201

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    I don't think populous can be recreated

    It was a game Devined by Gods and gilded by angles
     
  19. Rem

    Rem

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    How about "magic wells" whoever captures these structures receives some sort of income from transmuting arcane energy into gold.

    Also an economy that lets say you get paid 2000 gold for every 3 minutes of gameplay

    An economy where you get rewarded gold for destroying the enemy (enemy buildings)

    Lastly an economy where where gold is rewarded for controlling certain structures (etc.)

    Heroes could be given the ability that they will generate 500 gold if a certain number of enemies are killed

    Lastly just an economy where gold mines are just small sources of income and the rest comes from capturing bases, destroying enemies, etc.
     
  20. Lord Aiden

    Lord Aiden

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    If you want a long game, just have gold mines with 200,000+ gold

    Otherwise youre in for a quick game