- Joined
- Apr 24, 2012
- Messages
- 5,113
4 Spell Mods and still a 3 page of pending resource.
Come on.
Come on.
4 Spell Mods and still a 3 page of pending resource.
Come on.
all of the spells not pending because of lack of moderation. Iceman has been rather active since he joined too, that should be said.
4 Spell Mods and still a 3 page of pending resource.
Come on.
Do you spend time going over and reviewing all of the resources? If so, then great.4 Spell Mods and still a 3 page of pending resource.
Come on.
Do you spend time going over and reviewing all of the resources? If so, then great.
If not, how about trying to help them rather than this. It's a lot of work they do, and I hate when people complain about it. Especially the way you just did. It's a lot of fucking work to be a resource mod, and they really don't get much credit.
The mods know the users that are prevalent in their fields, seeing a review by someone who knows their shit can help. Obviously you have to check it yourself, but having users reviewing is helpful.Help what? Giving review? That's not helping dude. Spell mods are used to re-review them all. They don't believe to users.
This is what bothers me. Yes, mods get bored and their activity slows and eventually they die out. Lazy though? No. It's a lot of fucking work and it is draining. Very very draining. In fact people are only commended when they work really really hard and spend insane amounts of time doing stuff on this site, and they burn out. There are very very few that have had high activity over large periods of time. In fact DSG is one of the few that I can think of. Others burn out, get banned, or get demoted. The banning/demoting, to me, is a result of burning out. Purple, Ash, Rui, Py, and many more.I'm siding to Almia here. Mods should know what they are doing, don't be lazy.
They aren't professionals. That's the issue. This is something they do in their SPARE TIME. And a lot of them (probably all) are students or hold full-time jobs. This site should not be a priority in people's lives. Even mods.They don't get much credits indeed. But if they hate it, they should quit. Users' complaints are the result of their laziness.If users are complaining, don't response to it harshly, but try to improve instead. Professional workers should know about this already.
This is something they do in their SPARE TIME.
Magtheridon96 said:Let me put this into perspective.
If we're talking about code ONLY, it takes me only up to 5 minutes to completely review some typically sized GUI spell. In GUI code, you just have to look for the presence of magic numbers and values, lack of configurables, re-initialized hashtables, memory leaks (locations, groups, special effects, forces), leaked dummy units, inefficient iteration, inefficient Unique-ID generation and management (allocation/deallocation of instances), and certain less-preferable actions that cause memory leaks like (Pick every unit of type) and (Smart Camera Pan). There's not so much you have to look for. It's just a few passes over the code.
For JASS, it would take a bit more than that because there are many more common mistakes and errors to look for like local agents or handles that aren't nulled, BJs, magic numbers, structs with reducible boilerplate, redundant function call repetition, unused variables, the use of actions instead of conditions, inefficient unit group iteration, badly named variables and functions (be it, they don't follow convention or they are just terribly inexpressive of the author's intent), Get/SetUnitPosition and Get/SetUnitState where Get/SetUnitX/Y and Get/SetWidgetLife would suffice, the use of locations for anything other than TerrainZ value queries, the use of GetSpellTargetLoc when GetSpellTargetX/Y would be better, the use of terrain deformations in general, memory leaks such as undestroyed special effects or unreleased timers, the use of bad libraries, the use of scopes when a library is obviously superior, the lack of an API when an API seems important for the users of a resource, the use of the wrong initialization methods for the given circumstances, &c...
This may look like a lot, but really, if you can make 1-2 passes through code in search of problems like these, you can finish at a rate of 150 lines of code per minute which would yield about 3 minutes for 1 pass for some typical JASS spell. With bigger code, obviously, you're going to have to focus a lot more on what you're reading. Consider Tank-Commander for example. He once a wrote a vanilla JASS spell that had lines so long, it took me 3 days to review it because I kept getting distracted. It's hard sometimes, especially with super long udg_ variable names.
Now let's discard the idea of an ideal reviewing environment.
Sometimes, it takes me a combined 10 minutes to completely review the code of 2 resources and have a review written out for each. Other times, it will take me 10 hours because I'd start a review in the morning, leave half-way through and get distracted by stuff like Hive Chat, 9gag, Facebook or Whatsapp, then I'd come back later and realize I started something I didn't finish.
It's only in these ideal conditions where a moderator doesn't get distracted that he can finish reviewing 20-30 spells in a day effortlessly. Some factors include the length of the spell. If a spell is pretty long, the moderator is going to leave the page in search of smaller spells to review just to finish the easy part of his job. There was once a system so large, no one reviewed it for over a year. It just stayed there in the Pending Spells section and rotted. I tried reviewing it 3 times, I really did, but it was just too enormous. I'd say it easily surpassed 5000 lines of code.
SO YEAH.
when you don't have any motivation.
You also have to take the downloading-movingmapintocorrectfolder-openingmap-loadingmap-checkingmap-checking triggers, checking ingame, writing a review that takes a bit more time.While this is true, a review doesn't take THAT much time. I remember Magtheridon96 claiming somewhere that he could review a spell of either jass or gui in 5 mins when he was a spell/jass mod.
edit: Original post: http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/site-discussion-97/lack-mods-252417/index2.html#post2530827
How about if we could just get along and help one another? if someone knows that a spell resource is approve-worthy, tell the spell moderator enough proof for it to be accepted by means of proper review/criticism and reasoning why it must be approved. Sending it to the moderator's profile is faster, and easier.
When I see such wall of text I have to update it. I shouidn't lose motivation because I made it anyway, it would be a shame to leave it half in the air.But now I feel that users are generally lazy to update their resources after seeing wall of texts in the review.
Unless there are rewards.I'm afraid that's not going to work.
I'm afraid that's not going to work.
No, you don't understand the case. I saw some spells were acceptable enough but were approved 2 months later. Like this (this one hasn't been moderated though). Sometimes moderators forgot that they just need to spot major flaws to put a resource into needs fix status, else they are approve-able, it can ease their jobs a lot. Someone's resource at BPower's level (example) is very easy to review, because you will rarely meet major flaws within them, that means acceptable. You are totally free to mention minor improvements but remember, that's not enough to put something into needs fix in any case, rule is rule, making your own standard shows inconsistency.Unless there are rewards.![]()
It works for the map section so what is the reason why it will not work for the spell section? It basically just having someone who have enough knowledge in the field reviewing stuff and reporting to the mod that this and that are approvable/rejectable.
Please cite an example of what you think is 'minor improvements'. I'm assuming you're referring to mod's suggested variable naming but I might be mistaken.You are totally free to mention minor improvements but remember, that's not enough to put something into needs fix in any case, rule is rule, making your own standard shows inconsistency.
Purge re-reviewing the resource doesn't imply his distrust on you, he's just doing what he's supposed to do(which is to review the spell's script). Also, I think he has to do it, since he's going to be responsible for approving the said resource. If any user files a complaint(s) about the approval, he will be the one answering to it.I did so with PurgeandFire. But ended up with he re-reviews all of those spells, my reviews are not trusted. ;-;
No, I'm agree (now) that variable naming is important since it's mentioned in the spell rules. I meant anything other than every point mentioned in the spell rule is considered as minor improvements, they are not required to be done/fixed. Sometimes mods forgot about this.Please cite an example of what you think is 'minor improvements'. I'm assuming you're referring to mod's suggested variable naming but I might be mistaken.
So that means my review doesn't help mods at all. Yeah, I know he appreciate me, but I didn't help him to save his times in reviewing, I didn't make the moderating process become any faster. That's my point here. We are helpless as user.Purge re-reviewing the resource doesn't imply his distrust on you, he's just doing what he's supposed to do(which is to review the spell's script). Also, I think he has to do it, since he's going to be responsible for approving the said resource. If any user files a complaint(s) about the approval, he will be the one answering to it.
As orcnet mentioned, your reviews are appreciated and considered, so don't worry.
I don't think it doesn't help. As I've said, it's their responsibility to review the submitted spell's code so they review it and post their reviews. People can't hold you responsible if Purge decides to approve a resource with only your review as basis. Also, I don't think Purge ignored your points, I think he considered it when he was composing his own written review, and that in itself helps speed the reviewing process up.So that means my review doesn't help mods at all.
Help what? Giving review? That's not helping dude. Spell mods are used to re-review them all. They don't believe to users.
(whereas my reviews are alwayz better :>)
EDIT:
I'm siding to Almia here. Mods should know what they are doing, don't be lazy. They don't get much credits indeed. But if they hate it, they should quit. Users' complaints are the result of their laziness.If users are complaining, don't response to it harshly, but try to improve instead. Professional workers should know about this already.