Warcraft III - Fall of Outland

[AIagremm]

A few days ago I had an idea - a full mod, where Humans, Orcs, Undead and Night elves are replaced with Draenei, Orcs, Arakkoa and Ogres.
The storyline is based in time prior to the opening of the Dark Portal. The campaign is made according to lore.
There are 6 campaigns: Sons of Gruul(Tutorial campaign, Ogre Clans), Forgotten Ways(Orcish Clans), Legacy of Terokk(Arakkoa), Light of the Naaru(Draenei), Rise of the Horde(Orcish Horde) and Shards of the Light(Draenei remnants - Broken). Note that the names and order of the campaigns will be changed.
There are following playable races in the mod: Draenei, Orcs, Arakkoa, Ogres.
There are also campaign-only races: Broken, Lost Ones, Sporelings(neutral), Orcs(Corrupted), Demons(Also note that in melee game Bloodpact is an upgrade that changes the color and stats of your units. It also destroys some units and heroes, and replaces them with other units. Both - corrupted and uncorrupted orcs are good to play, it is more a matter of taste)

Of course it is really hard to make the project because of severral circumstances. We need to make many new doodads, units and especially buildings. But the hardest thing, is the creation of main menu models for all the campaigns and the game itself. Ans also loading screens.

P.S.
Im sure that I cant do such project, and it needs much time and talanted people. However I like that idea, so I can be the storyline and concept maker.


So what do you think people?

 

[Fussiler1]

Hm. Yeah, an Outlandish style would be good.. but please, call it Draenor, it isn't yet Outland. The Shards of Hope Campaign seems me rather useless though.

 

[AIagremm]

I named it Fall of Outland? F*ck. xD
Sorry, it was an accident. Dont know what took over me.

EDIT:
Double f*ck. I cant change the name

The Shards of Light is needed, because the storyline is big, and I cant use draenei twice. So to explain some things and help storyline we do need it. Also they will be mostly helping normal draenei and themselves.

Also: We are thinking about making etherals be in the mod as the traders and merchants. However without their fancy technology.

 

[Vosty]

this would be a HUGE project!
Of course that means i Can't help, but it would be really nice to see. It's a whole new Warcraft basically!
Might as well wait for SC2 for something so big. (Of couse im probably not gonna buy SC2) Since it's got a better trigger editor.
Really cool, just like your highborne campaign idea.
Who are you working on this with? You seem to use a lot of "we's"

 

[Linaze]

I think that you have planned way too much. It can take a year or more to even finish and balance 4 races, and on top of that six campaigns! I suggest you think smaller, really.

 

[AIagremm]

You do have a point. But of course you need to understand, that I didnt even make a storyline from the known lore, yet. So there's a pretty big chanse that it will have only four campaigns. It actually has 5 campaigns, since the ogre campaign is actually 2-3 map long tutorial(It was the best I could think of. Ogres arent usually the brightest characters).
Yes, I think that Shards of the Light are not needed(Fussiler1, Linaze thanks for helping me understand)

P.S.
vosty, actually I made a mistake like always. I usually forget that I dont yet do a project and that there are no people helping me with it. Yet.

 

[Vosty]

So wait, are you making a whole bunch of stuff for wc3, or making a new game all together?

 

[AIagremm]

It is called a mod. You know, it changes the game - races, units, campaigns, main and campaign screens. You know, like The Tales of Raviganion.

 

[Vosty]

Oh, ok. Yeah, I've heard of em and stuff, like NewSoc, (mainly just a vjass mod, so you can use accurate keyboard and mouse unctions.)
I have no idea how stuff like that works, so getting it done is entirely up to you!

 

[Jokunen]

Nice idea, I would like to do something like this, but I'm afraid I'm a bit useless, I'm new at mapmaking so I'm not a good triggerer/terrainer but I'm always happy to help people

 

[AIagremm]

Well, I am not so good in triggering and stuff. Im good with ideas, concepts and a bit terraining.
However making a mod needs some serious work.

So, do you people think this should be a project or only an idea?

 

[Vercas]

Arakkoa?
This race sounds interesting.

I am also curious which technologies are you going to use on Draenei and Arakkoa.
I think the ogres and orcs are supposed to be one and the same force.

 

[Trillium]

wc3c has a pack of draenei buildings and units

I think the ogres and orcs are supposed to be one and the same force.

according to WC1 manual orcs and ogres hated each other prior to First War. Only when Gul'dan made an order of Ogre-Magi (who naturally became leaders of ogre clans), the ogres joined the horde

 

[AIagremm]

Trillium's right. They were enemies. Plus I needed the 4th race...

I dont like wc3c pack. These buildings dont have many animations, plus they are based on Tempest Keep concepts. And thats not what we meed. We need real draenei buildings for our project.

Yeah, arakkoa are an intersting race(especially because nobody has made a map with them).

We will need arakkoa, draenei, ogre and First War orcish building models. They will need to be requested. Along with more mag'har unit skins and draenei and arakkoa unit models.

We will also need new doodads(Terrokar trees, Nagrand trees and stuff like that)

Also, the technologies will be queit interesting. Draenei crystal updates and arakkoa stuff. However there will some problems. For example draenei flying units. They hve the magic-powered flight, which means they will have something like flying ships. And by the way, there will be no sea combat options(no ships or shipyards)

 

[VeljkoM]

If you want I can make AI so you wouldn't need to replace existing races. This way heroes will use their abilities.

 

[AIagremm]

Wait. Explain a little bit more. Im confused.
How can AI remove the need for replacing exisiting races?

 

[VeljkoM]

Well if you want to make custom race and want computer to use it you can do 2 things:

1) Replace existing race.
-Good side- this is easy
-Bad side- But this is very problematic since then race doesn't have originality and heroes won't use custom spells. Units will. Also replacing undead and night elf can be buggy like night elf workers are programed to attack and won't return to work and things like that.

2) Make custom units that won't replace any race and give them custom AI.
-good side- You won't have any limit in originality, heroes will use all abilities and you would still have original 4 races.
-bad side-this is harder and AI will probably be easier to win but that depends on many things.

 

[AIagremm]

Oh, I get it. Just as I thought.
Of course we will AI. If the project will start, and it will have lots of new models, including new main screens and race interfaces(except orcs. Or not?).

And if we will just replace exisiting races, it will be a total fail.
We need custom races! With custom units and spells(and upgrades)

 

[VeljkoM]

Upgrades and spells can also be replaced. But that is just it.

Also where can you get new main screens and race interfaces?

 

[AIagremm]

Make 'em!
You know that the Frozen Throne screen, and the screen of the campign when you choose the mission you want to play. Those are models. And we will need them!

Also, interfaces are image files. For example there are pandaren and demon interfaces on wc3c, and there is naga interface on Hive.

 

[VeljkoM]

I know that those are models but how to use them. I only saw one campaign with custom screen.

As for interface ask Interceptor. But I don't think that they are that necessary.

 

[AIagremm]

Well yes, add some feathers to the night elven interface and its an arakkoa interface.
Edit of orcish interface, making it more brutal will be ogre interface. And more... shamanistic one will be the orcish. But on the other hand... no, beter not to change ogre interface.

And draenei... yep, we do need an interface for them.

 

[Vercas]

A naruu-style one?
Some edits to the human interface, like new textures could do the trick.
Some magic runes, glyphs, stuff.

 

[Vosty]

This Project is INSANE!
Since you can't do triggers or any of that stuff, and only make ideas, people will kinda feel ripped off, and think you are a bit lazy.
IF you can get a team, I would love to see this done (but I can't help)
Best O' Luck!

 

[noob134]

2 questions:

1: If you get a mod can you switch it off somehow?

2: Will your draenei take the look of warcraft 3 style or World of Warcraft style?
(they look like 2 totally different races)

 

[Vosty]

2 questions:

1: If you get a mod can you switch it off somehow?

2: Will your draenei take the look of warcraft 3 style or World of Warcraft style?
(they look like 2 totally different races)

Totally agree with you on the second one. WTF did Blizz do that anyway? Was it because the old Dreaenei looks ulgy as crap, and were badly made?
=D

 

[Vercas]

Wc3 Draenei seem to be unbroken...

WoW Draenei are nice

Oh and... Alagremm, you can't trigger or, at least, paint?

 

[AIagremm]

Wow, thats a lot to answer.
1.No, the draenei interface will not be really naaruish. It will be more like runes and crystals.
2.Vosty, I know im bad ^^ However I can easily .do Draenor terrain for the missions(cinematics will requier better quality, and thus better terrain)
3.noob134, its easier just to copy warcraft(make two folders with warcraft), and install the mod in one of them.
4.The draenei will be from WoW(uncorrupted ones), however the WC3 draenei(lost ones)will be in the campaign , as a campaign-only race.

I still need to find people, who can actually make the mod itself.

 

[Vercas]

Is it going to be a mod, a map or a campaign?
I think a campaign could do fine...

 

[AIagremm]

The idea is that people can play as uncorrupted orcs, draenei, arakkoa and ogres.
And because of that, we will also make the needed timeline - before the first war.

 

[Vercas]

Please make them more... interesting than the ordinary Warcraft III races.
More upgrades, caster arts, units, heroes and maybe some interesting unit experience system. ^_^

 

[Vosty]

Like every unit being a hero?
That would create the boundary between minute-men and seasone fighters for sure!
It would be cool, that say you couldn't train knights (im using a wc3 example) but if you upgraded a pesant to a footman, and mounted a footmen (with enough experience) to a horse, you build your units! To su[pply this creation, give the ability to add a mage to a horse aswell, or maybe and archer, or any other foot unit.
Another idea i always wanted was an item forge, where you put in 2 items, and they either make an uber weapon, or fail and are destroyed.

 

[AIagremm]

Oh, item forge? There is one in Norj'hal campaign. It was awesome.

Of course we will try our best in making them not only according to lore, but also better then normal. I guess we will make some special features, that would make the game even more interesting

vosty your idea is good, but it isnt exactly what we need.
There was also unit-uniting system(making a huntress out of a werewolf footman and a sentry for example). Your idea can be good for a mod

 

[Vosty]

the only problem wiht my idea, is that it completely repalces techtrees. It basically creates several bases, and add-ons that go on each base. It would work maybe, but I doubt it could be balanced well, or used effectively against other types.

 

[AIagremm]

The problem is that if you will make all units heroe-like(getting experience and stuff), you will need to trigger f*cking lots of stuff.

The strangest thing is, that I seem to remember some map which had experience for many normal units...

However we need to return to our main discussion - the mod.

 

[Vercas]

A hero mustn't be so "hero"-ish. You can disable his displaying of hero minimap icon, you can make him not show in the left side of the screen and more.

 

[Vosty]

Tons of small features = point of ALL mods.....
=D

 

[AIagremm]

I ment that he is like a normal unit... except that he gets experience.

 

[Vercas]

Yeah whatever
Half-Heroes are better

 

[Vosty]

Like the heroes of wc2.
Wc3's heroes are too big in the role of gameplay, and they all have very unique gameplay. BUT that makes them unbalanced when against each other, but not when thrown in with rest of race.
That is why maps with all wc3's premaed heroes by themselves are EPOCH PHAIL.

The more We talk about this, the more I want in, but I know all I c an do is ideas right now.

 

[Vercas]

I can trigger and manage objects very accurately.

 

[AIagremm]

Good. But maybe we need to return to the main discussion?

So, do you think I should start this project or not?

 

[Vercas]

Sure!
Of course yes!

 

[AIagremm]

Im still not sure if there are people on hive who can make mods.

 

[Vosty]

Than go on wc3campaigns!
or some other chinese/german/whattheheckizstan site!
I'm sure there is SOMEONE left. Ask the guys who are making Warsoc if they know anyone, or would help.

 

[izaiphovias]

Alagremm, you said that you don't even has a lore for this campaing, you also sais that you are good with ideas, i'm an Idea Factory, if you need any help with the lore (specialy about Dreneis, cus i love them), i'll be glad to help. ;D

 

[Vercas]

Dreneis? LOL!
Do you mean Draenei?

As a side note... Lore is the easyest part of a project.

 

[AIagremm]

Actually, the campaign will be lore-accurate.
I already found the "key" moments that will be in-game.
It will tell the whole story that happened prior to the First war(the campaign ends with the opening of the Dark Portal)

 

[izaiphovias]

Dreneis? LOL!
Do you mean Draenei?

As a side note... Lore is the easyest part of a project.

I said Drenei? oops , yeah, i was meaning Draenei. Anyway, the only thing i can do to help is with ideas, about the lore or the races...

It will tell the whole story that happened prior to the First war(the campaign ends with the opening of the Dark Portal)

But were it will start... i mean, it will be cool if you tell something about Sargeras and all of that stuff of the Legion as a prologue.

 

[AIagremm]

Prior means "before". The campign will be set before the First War. In the period of time when orcs became green and almost destroyed the draenei. The campaign ends when Gul'dan opens the Dark Portal.

There will also be the arakkoa. The orcs are unic - they will be the main race of two campaigns - in one you play as the uncorrupted orcish clans, and in other as the orcish Horde.

I needed the fourth race so the ogres will be the last race. However since I didnt know how ogres would be imporatant, so I made them the main race of the tutorial campaign.