The Shifting Market

[Celaquil]

Hey, if you've been wondering where my terraining side has been lately,
then I'll have you know that it's been consistently working on a very delicate
terrain. For the last month I've been working on this one on and off, and it's
certainly the most overwhelming terrain I've ever undertaken.
With a doodad count of roughly somewhere just above 6000.

This terrain is a dedication to my all-time favourite author, Scott Lynch,
and his book series "The Gentlemen Bastards Sequence". This particular
piece is based off of a location in the first book, called "The Shifting Market"
- Hence, the name.

"The Shifting Market was a lake of relatively placid water at the very heart
of Camorr, perhaps half a mile in circumference, protected from the rushing
flow of the Angevine and the surrounding canals by a series of stone
breakwaters. The only real current in the market was human-made, as
hundreds upon hundreds of floating merchants slowly and warily followed
one another counter-clockwise in their boats, jostling for prized positions
against the flat-topped breakwaters, crowded with buyers and sightseers
on foot." - The Lies of Locke Lamora, Scott Lynch

Obviously I couldn't make it as grand as it is described, and obviously I
chose my setting to be early morning, or late evening, whatever your
choice, so that I could get away with it not being too "crowded."

I hope you like it.

 

[Heinvers]

The scene is impressive
I was wondering when you'd release it so that we can observe and leave our jaw on the floor in awe.
However I can see some minor flaws, dunno if intentional or not.

The DNC settings (a.k.a ambient light) doesn't fit quite well with the canvas. By the looks of it I'm guessing that you used the Dungeon settings...
I think that the Dalaran Ruins would've been better suited for this one overall.

The light seems a bit off or is it just me? o.0
Behind the sun/searchlight there's a rather strange spot of light (no idea what that is but it does look weird and disturbing).

The background seems a bit cutoff near the vicinity of the light source;
also the clouds on the top left part behave a bit unnaturally (what I mean is that it looks like it's lower than it should be, part of it is in front of the roof).

Regarding the ship mast parts and the vanilla statues, a lower tint would help integrate those better and shake off that feeling of unfitting for this scene.

I like the water, bit too still but gives out an eerie feeling overall.
'love the vegetation as well.
The constructions are very well done as it concerns me, all that work man

 

[~Void~]

Really cool and ambitious idea. Because there's so much to the piece, there's going to be a lot of critique. But I think you can make this into something really great.

My recommendations:

• Turn the ship that's leaving the market about 35 degrees port side and move it into the channel, so that you still see the rear of the ship, but the angle fits better with the perspective of your shot
• Take out either all or some of the trees in the foreground, because they obscure the view and also clutter the color palette. I like the green color of the undergrowth there, but the trees don't mix well. I wouldn't suggest adding a different tree model but that's just me. Maybe keep the ones on the left and right of the frame
• Add some people! Markets are crowded! Make it tell a story. Since it's dawn, maybe some hung over sailors from the night before, prostitutes walking home, night watchmen changing shifts, early-bird salesmen setting up their stalls, a thief creeping out of sight, a young couple watching the sunrise, a stray dog or two eating the scraps from the night before, and a few young kids sneaking out to play before their parents wake up.

 

[Celaquil]

I don't remember saying "critique welcome" >.>

That said, I do like it when people give me ideas

I'll address some:

About the lighting, changing from this preset to that makes such subtle changes that
I hardly think it necessary at all, but I might fool around with it just to see.

The light isn't off, there's a lot of fog, and some clouds, mix that with light and you
get a strange glow behind the sun, just... Don't look at it.

The cloud part is intentional, I want them to touch the tops of the constructions, to give
off a feeling that these buildings are gigantic.

I'm not going to turn the ship, do you honestly know how many tiny doodads make
that ship? It's not one model, it's a giant lump of doodads.

Not going to touch the trees, they obscure exactly what I want them to obscure, ie;
bad textures, poor doodad transitions and generally artsy stuff.

Oh, and, I have a serious beef with unit models, I use them sparingly and rarely, so
no, there's not going to be more models. (Besides, I'm pretty sure my editor can't
handle a single more animated model).

-

There are some things I'll likely touch up, some ideas fladder suggested earlier, and
some ideas you guys gave me. Thanks, even if I didn't ask for it And thanks for
the kind words

 

[Gilles]

The execution with doodads is awesome. In fact I'd go so far as to say one of the best ever. Unfortunately the quality of models and textures really let this (amazing) terrain down. It's mostly the background, your foreground is superb.

Perhaps shifting this to a morning terrain and abusing strong lighting would help to fix this.

 

[~Void~]

Just my opinion! I didn't mean to trespass on your work

 

[Celaquil]

It's mostly the background, your foreground is superb.

How so? The models in the foreground and background are the same.
Or, at least, from the same doodad pack. (Talavaj)

Excepting the Ogre and naboo doodads, though.

I didn't mean to trespass on your work

Well. Excuse me for being a prissy little tit!

 

[MasterTrainer]

I think this would really help out my terraining, and I really need to know:
Does the whole terrain look good from that angle only? (For example if the camera is moved, other doodads won't seem, out of place)

 

[Gilles]

How so? The models in the foreground and background are the same.
Or, at least, from the same doodad pack. (Talavaj)

Excepting the Ogre and naboo doodads, though.

This is normal in wc3. Textures will often look too busy or jagged in the background. I don't really know how to explain it well.

 

[Celaquil]

Does the whole terrain look good from that angle only?

Well.

 

[MasterTrainer]

Well.

Amazing. You. Are. Amazing. This is probably the biggest help I've got in terraining since, ever. No kidding.
Thank you!

 

[johannesr]

Hmm, a bit too much going on for my taste. Don't mind me tho, i don't really care for architecture much anyway.

One suggestion i have tho is to put some fog/glow behind the bridge to make it so it doesn't blend into the background.