Round Table of Arkain

[LISBOAH]

Yeah, keeping her seems storywise, but damn her combat skills are so underwhelming. I mean Cora has blizzard, Cora has a damn lightning with 450 damage and 5 sec. And what does Scarlet possess? Silence and sleep. You know, i'd get over silence, but we get a staff of silence the very mission we get to play Scarlet, which is...well, renders her first ability kinda useless. I mean it has superior duration, but I sacrificed Cora for her. Sleep, well sleep is sleep. Her ultimate is strong though, but that's pretty much her only advantage.

Cora is a high ranking member of the Imperial Army, so she must have received better training than Scarlet. She was trained to fight at the frontlines, while Scarlet was a noble.

 

[Championfighter25]

Cora is a high ranking member of the Imperial Army, so she must have received better training than Scarlet.

Spoiler

And there goes the entire line:
''she is a powerful magician- maybe even more powerful than you''
Guess Thanok was wrong. Very wrong.

 

[Boriss]

Cora is a high ranking member of the Imperial Army, so she must have received better training than Scarlet. She was trained to fight at the frontlines, while Scarlet was a noble.

Nobles are often way better at infiltration, espionage and backdoor deals. Put a guard asleep while sifting through rival noble´s room? Priceless.
Cora is a high damage cannon but she loses mana fast. Scarlet is more of picking key targets, putting them asleep...

 

[LickMyEyeBall]

Cora is a high ranking member of the Imperial Army, so she must have received better training than Scarlet. She was trained to fight at the frontlines, while Scarlet was a noble.

Well, that's reasonable and all, but couldnt the trade be a little bit less onesided? Besides, even Thanok implies Scarlet is a superior mage.

 

[Championfighter25]

Well, that's reasonable and all, but couldnt the trade be a little bit less onesided? Besides, even Thanok implies Scarlet is a superior mage.

I think her biggest problem is her title "chaos bringer". Only her ult comes close to that. Maybe Shar can give her a different Q and W to fit her title better? A chaos mage with silence and sleep just doesn't sound right.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Oh, I will take a closer look at her abilities.

Remember that you still gotta fight her in Chapter Five, though...

 

[LISBOAH]

Oh, I will take a closer look at her abilities.

Remember that you still gotta fight her in Chapter Five, though...

Just for you all to know, I wasn't the one who brought the Scarlet topic into this conversation
I was talking about Aridon.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Still, a powerful Scarlett affects all of you. >:-]
Right, his lightning ability, wasn't it?

Spoiler

The idea behind this was that one of the dead gods whose powers created the Avatar
of Death was the God of Lightning.

 

[LickMyEyeBall]

Just for you all to know, I wasn't the one who brought the Scarlet topic into this conversation
I was talking about Aridon.

You can blame me

 

[Championfighter25]

Still, a powerful Scarlett affects all of you. >:-]
Right, his lightning ability, wasn't it?

Spoiler

The idea behind this was that one of the dead gods whose powers created the Avatar
of Death was the God of Lightning.

Spoiler

Thor must be really unhappy right now
Anyway since we are talking about elements will we get to see more "elemental lords" like Progaderas? If there are any more that is.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Spoiler

There is none such as Progaderas the Smoking. There cannot be another such as him.

Back to Scarlett, I am not entirely happy with her skills myself - well, apart from her ultimate. I pretty much just threw stuff together back then and never changed it.
She will get the Mark of Chaos ability that Aedy is already using.
I think I also already have a better alternative to Sleep.

 

[Boriss]

Spoiler

There is none such as Progaderas the Smoking. There cannot be another such as him.

Back to Scarlett, I am not entirely happy with her skills myself - well, apart from her ultimate. I pretty much just threw stuff together back then and never changed it.
She will get the Mark of Chaos ability that Aedy is already using.
I think I also already have a better alternative to Sleep.

Now that would be cool. So, still thinking this weekend will spawn the hate?

 

[Shar Dundred]

Progress report

I have sent @Imperator the map for terrain adjustments, in the meantime, I will be working
on the triggers and AI.

 

[Boriss]

Progress report

I have sent @Imperator the map for terrain adjustments, in the meantime, I will be working
on the triggers and AI.

Is Kasrkin still hardtesting them?

 

[Championfighter25]

Progress report

I have sent @Imperator the map for terrain adjustments, in the meantime, I will be working
on the triggers and AI.

I'm loving... i mean hating this already! And since i've made a wrong choice this will be even more fun... ah i mean painful!

 

[LickMyEyeBall]

Err, seems we won't see it until next week

 

[LISBOAH]

I'm loving... i mean hating this already! And since i've made a wrong choice this will be even more fun... ah i mean painful!

There is no right or wrong choice! The definitions of right and wrong are not absolute. What you may perceive as right might be seen as wrong by others and it might change over time and while your perspective changes as you grow!
Embrace amorality!

 

[Championfighter25]

There is no right or wrong choice! The definitions of right and wrong are not absolute. What you may perceive as right might be seen as wrong by others!
Embrace amorality!

Spoiler

You know the choice to defeat or to spare the dark elves in chapter 6 may have a disadvange later. I decided to kill them since an undead betrayal can happen at any moment and they cannot be allowed to have extra forces. But at the same i sort of helped van Durce, but for me destroying them was the right choice. Hope it doesn't punch me in the face later though. Also since you didn't kill them enjoy a easier chapter 9.

 

[LISBOAH]

Spoiler

You know the choice to defeat or to spare the dark elves in chapter 6 may have a disadvange later. I decided to kill them since an undead betrayal can happen at any moment and they cannot be allowed to have extra forces. But at the same i sort of helped van Durce, but for me destroying them was the right choice. Hope it doesn't punch me in the face later though.

Spoiler

That is exactly what I said. Back then, destroying the dark elves would seem the right choice, but later you find out that it was a wrong move!
What we may think to be right now might prove to be wrong in the long run!

 

[Shar Dundred]

Spoiler

By sparing the Dark Elves in Six, you made van Durce unhappy.

 

[Championfighter25]

Spoiler

By sparing the Dark Elves in Six, you made van Durce unhappy.

Spoiler

First we kill Imperator, then we crush a rebellion that was meant to kill Gardon and now we made him unhappy?
OH BABY A TRIPLE!
Just another reason to enjoy... ah i mean hate this chapter! We are such terrible people!
Edit: Seems like Shar loved this comment so much he gave me 4 re.. i mean hated it so much he gave me 0 rep.

 

[Kasrkin]

Is Kasrkin still hardtesting them?

Sometimes, mostly just to see if hard mode specific mechanics are working. I completed Green Wave on hard with no ally as well.

I have a semblance of the difficulty I'm going to face so I have to prepare.

 

[LISBOAH]

Spoiler

First we kill Imperator, then we crush a rebellion that was meant to kill Gardon and now we made him unhappy?
OH BABY A TRIPLE!
Just another reason to enjoy... ah i mean hate this chapter! We are such terrible people!
Edit: Seems like Shar loved this comment so much he gave me 4 re.. i mean hated it so much he gave me 0 rep.

Spoiler

Golden Guard: Sir, Gardon has arrived to the outpost.
van Durce: It doesn't matter.
Later...
Golden Guard: Sir, Gardon has defeated the demons getting closer to his base.
van Durce: Okay, send a letter to Retka telling him to get ready.
Later
Golden Guard: Sir, Gardon is winning against Retka!
van Durce: Send a squadron of my guard and kill him!
Later...
Golden Guard: Sir, Gardon has defeated our army and killed Retka! He is now aware of our goals!
van Durce: Damn it all!
Later...
Golden Guard: Sir, Gardon has defeated the elven queen. Now the elves fight for him. Also, part of our forces have joined him!
van Durce: (screams in rage)
Later:
van Durce: Today has been a good day with no bad news at all.
Golden Guard: Sir-
van Durce throws a spear at the messenger and kills him.
van Durce: Yep, no bad news at all.

 

[Morris]

Hope we get to play the new chapter this weekend
Feeling so.much hate.

 

[Championfighter25]

Spoiler

Golden Guard: Sir, Gardon has arrived to the outpost.
van Durce: It doesn't matter.
Later...
Golden Guard: Sir, Gardon has defeated the demons getting closer to his base.
van Durce: Okay, send a letter to Retka telling him to get ready.
Later
Golden Guard: Sir, Gardon is winning against Retka!
van Durce: Send a squadron of my guard and kill him!
Later...
Golden Guard: Sir, Gardon has defeated our army and killed Retka! He is now aware of our goals!
van Durce: Damn it all!
Later...
Golden Guard: Sir, Gardon has defeated the elven queen. Now the elves fight for him. Also, part of our forces have joined him!
van Durce: (screams in rage)
Later:
van Durce: Today has been a good day with no bad news at all.
Golden Guard: Sir-
van Durce throws a spear at the messenger and kills him.
van Durce: Yep, no bad news at all.

Spoiler

That was perfect, but how did you forget his iconic catchphrase?
Imgflip
Im so mad!

 

[Shar Dundred]

Hope we get to play the new chapter this weekend

Me too.

I want to see the hate in your posts when the time has come!

 

[Championfighter25]

I want to see the hate in your posts when the time has come!

Don't worry our nerf ideas will be like a bottomless rift, they will never end!

 

[Shar Dundred]

You will make suggestions on how to nerf the player even more?
Excellent, @Kasrkin will love that kind of stuff - and let's not even mention Kasrkin Mode!

 

[LickMyEyeBall]

A little bit off topic, but do I have to reset difficulty on "hard" after every chapter?

 

[Championfighter25]

A little bit off topic, but do I have to reset difficulty on "hard" after every chapter?

It's not off-topic at all and yes you have. That's a bug with all custom campaigns sadly.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Sadly, yes.
This is a WarCraft 3 issue that affects all campaigns that use the existing difficulty system
instead of implementing one with triggers.

It is something that will be adressed at some point in the future - it is somewhere on my list.

 

[Daffa]

For now, go to blizz official camp.
And change their diff to Hard.

 

[Morris]

I don't what will fill.me.with hate more
Playing the new chapter or replaying chapter six or replaying from the first humn book on.brutal difficulty

 

[Championfighter25]

I have this ingenious idea, don't hate me please! So Shar you said the difficulty resets every chapter, yes? Well just make the standart and only difficulty hard and no one will complain ever again, guaranteed!

 

[LickMyEyeBall]

Sadly, yes.
This is a WarCraft 3 issue that affects all campaigns that use the existing difficulty system
instead of implementing one with triggers.

It is something that will be adressed at some point in the future - it is somewhere on my list.

He-he, I see. The difficulty panel will be available at the start of every chapter before the starting cinematic, right?
Edit: Championfighter's method also seems convenient.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Well just make the standart and only difficulty hard and no one will complain ever again, guaranteed!

Considered doing that, but I didn't want to.
I cannot have people throw their keyboards out of the window all the time.

He-he, I see. The difficulty panel will be available at the start of every chapter before the starting cinematic, right?

Once I have implemeted it, yes.


For those of you who seek a challenge, I got a few ideas.

Spoiler

1) Chapter One of the First Human Book with Barracks units only - lite version would be no chaplains until Harmos arrives
2) Chapter Two of the First Orc Book with only Grunts and Raiders - after completing the Side Quest you may or may not add casters
3) Chapter Five of the First Human Book with no allies (not calling for any help)
5) Chapter Nine of the First Human Book with no allies (killing Salana) and without Bear Riders - lite version would be just without Bear Riders
6) Chapter Five of the First Orc Book with no allies (killing Rath and Zairmak, not having anyone else join you)
7) Chapter Seven of the First Orc Book with no allies (killing Rath) and leaving the Blood Shield alone
8) Chapter Eight of the First Undead Book with no allies (kill Ross) and without using Possession
9) Chapter Nine of the First Undead Book with no spawns (kill your allies, but leave Aridon alive for obvious reasons)
10) Chapter One of the Second Human Book with killing your units as soon as you leave the camp of the Golden Guard (sounds easy? Do it.)
11) Chapter Two of the Second Human Book without using Hydromancers
12) Chapter Three of the Second Human Book without using Hydromancers and with only killing Retka's Army, leaving all other rebels alone (incl. not doing the Side Quest)
13) Chapter Four of the Second Human Book without using Shadows or Elites
14) Chapter Five of the Second Human Book without using Destructors (if you get any, destroy them at once)

Enjoy!

 

[LISBOAH]

For those of you who seek a challenge, I got a few ideas.

Spoiler

1) Chapter One of the First Human Book with Barracks units only - lite version would be no chaplains until Harmos arrives
2) Chapter Two of the First Orc Book with only Grunts and Raiders - after completing the Side Quest you may or may not add casters
3) Chapter Five of the First Human Book with no allies (not calling for any help)
5) Chapter Nine of the First Human Book with no allies (killing Salana) and without Bear Riders - lite version would be just without Bear Riders
6) Chapter Five of the First Orc Book with no allies (killing Rath and Zairmak, not having anyone else join you)
7) Chapter Seven of the First Orc Book with no allies (killing Rath) and leaving the Blood Shield alone
8) Chapter Eight of the First Undead Book with no allies (kill Ross) and without using Possession
9) Chapter Nine of the First Undead Book with no spawns (kill your allies, but leave Aridon alive for obvious reasons)
10) Chapter One of the Second Human Book with killing your units as soon as you leave the camp of the Golden Guard (sounds easy? Do it.)
11) Chapter Two of the Second Human Book without using Hydromancers
12) Chapter Three of the Second Human Book without using Hydromancers and with only killing Retka's Army, leaving all other rebels alone (incl. not doing the Side Quest)
13) Chapter Four of the Second Human Book without using Shadows or Elites
14) Chapter Five of the Second Human Book without using Destructors (if you get any, destroy them at once)

Enjoy!

This is no challenge.
Challenge would imply that we would have a chance to succeed!

 

[Morris]

This is a challenge that I will accept.
BUT I will do it after you release the new chapter

 

[Championfighter25]

This is no challenge.
Challenge would imply that we would have a chance to succeed!

Spoiler

This reminds me of an old post, why not write it again:
Here is the perfect idea for Kasrkin mode on chapter 4 second human book born from Kasrkin's dreams!
How about from behind Thanok's base Demon gates and portals spawn,overwhelm the base,the demons completely ignore Toran's capital and the undead and just attack you,while the blue undead also attacks you,while the traitors attack you,while at the same time Aridon comes with his entire army to destroy just you, and yes he completely ignores the demons.While we are at it make Progaderas return to burn away your dreams of completing this chapter.Then when you think you are done with this chapter and you are amazed you survived van Durce and Retka and the human emperor Theodor the second come with they're armies to make you angry german kid version 2.0!
DO IT SHAR!
Now that is a true challenge!
Warning side affects may include:
Severe brain damage, rage, hate, anger, suffering, you doing this all the time because the chapter caused you to get depressed:
http://www.gifbin.com/bin/052011/1306866467_jumping_out_the_window.gif
Please consult your local Kasrkin before playing!

 

[Boriss]

Considered doing that, but I didn't want to.
I cannot have people throw their keyboards out of the window all the time.


Once I have implemeted it, yes.


For those of you who seek a challenge, I got a few ideas.

Spoiler

1) Chapter One of the First Human Book with Barracks units only - lite version would be no chaplains until Harmos arrives
2) Chapter Two of the First Orc Book with only Grunts and Raiders - after completing the Side Quest you may or may not add casters
3) Chapter Five of the First Human Book with no allies (not calling for any help)
5) Chapter Nine of the First Human Book with no allies (killing Salana) and without Bear Riders - lite version would be just without Bear Riders
6) Chapter Five of the First Orc Book with no allies (killing Rath and Zairmak, not having anyone else join you)
7) Chapter Seven of the First Orc Book with no allies (killing Rath) and leaving the Blood Shield alone
8) Chapter Eight of the First Undead Book with no allies (kill Ross) and without using Possession
9) Chapter Nine of the First Undead Book with no spawns (kill your allies, but leave Aridon alive for obvious reasons)
10) Chapter One of the Second Human Book with killing your units as soon as you leave the camp of the Golden Guard (sounds easy? Do it.)
11) Chapter Two of the Second Human Book without using Hydromancers
12) Chapter Three of the Second Human Book without using Hydromancers and with only killing Retka's Army, leaving all other rebels alone (incl. not doing the Side Quest)
13) Chapter Four of the Second Human Book without using Shadows or Elites
14) Chapter Five of the Second Human Book without using Destructors (if you get any, destroy them at once)

Enjoy!

I think that my idea about using tents to spawn forces with kasrkin mode using only limited forces for the first 3 chapters will make it harder in the way that you need to preserve your forces and thus fight clever and not rush in.

 

[Kasrkin]

3) Chapter Five of the First Human Book with no allies (not calling for any help)
5) Chapter Nine of the First Human Book with no allies (killing Salana) and without Bear Riders - lite version would be just without Bear Riders

After beating defense of home within an actually reasonable time frame on hard that is next on my list.
I would honestly say Gryphon Riders are the more useful of the two on this mission, since most of the orc heavy hitters have well heavy armor. The magic damage was a real help once I could actually make the damn things. While I ended up using one or two bear riders most of the time... well when they weren't dead to hold the chokepoint leading to the Goldaxe and Deathbreeze.

It was actually very damn scary playing that, even though I needed new buildings I couldn't do it because I'd probably lose one of the lines of defense. That extra gold had to go to towers, miners, and units from whatever production buildings I started out with. I nearly lost it when I went to upgrade more towers and realized my workshop got blown up.

Once I got going I still had to deal with all of the static defenses since Salana is gone. This also caused some extra stuff to aggro of course making it even more of a headache.

8) Chapter Eight of the First Undead Book with no allies (kill Ross) and without using Possession

I know you're talking 'bout me here.

 

[Shar Dundred]

I would honestly say Gryphon Riders are the more useful of the two on this mission, since most of the orc heavy hitters have well heavy armor. The magic damage was a real help once I could actually make the damn things. While I ended up using one or two bear riders most of the time... well when they weren't dead to hold the chokepoint leading to the Goldaxe and Deathbreeze.

True, but remember the first version of Chapter Nine? Without any Bear Riders?
Also, give them more credit, they are the only real meatshields you can get in this mission.
But sure, feel free to play without both Bear Riders and without Gryphon Riders, if you want.

Once I got going I still had to deal with all of the static defenses since Salana is gone. This also caused some extra stuff to aggro of course making it even more of a headache.

Kasrkin Mode for Chapter Five: NO TOWERS AVAILABLE.

I know you're talking 'bout me here.

Maybe?

 

[Kasrkin]

True, but remember the first version of Chapter Nine? Without any Bear Riders?
Also, give them more credit, they are the only real meatshields you can get in this mission.
But sure, feel free to play without both Bear Riders and without Gryphon Riders, if you want.

To be fair, siege engines might work better they may not attack that many types of units but they can just be repaired while holding a chokepoint.

Kasrkin Mode for Chapter Five: NO TOWERS AVAILABLE.

Give a higher upkeep and I can maybe make this work.

 

[Boriss]

To be fair, siege engines might work better they may not attack that many types of units but they can just be repaired while holding a chokepoint.


Give a higher upkeep and I can maybe make this work.

Comp will kill those repair workers fast. You will need quick kill commando for that.

 

[DD Mikasa]

Tbh Scarlet ultimate makes up for her three other "lacking" spells.
Whats weird with her is that her first three spells make her look like a controll type mage and then,low and behold her ultimate melts everything.I'd still go for Cora,she is way more usefull,not to mention her ultimate obliterates clustered up enemy forces,ideal for the chapter.

If the story demandes we go for Scarlet,then i guess i will,but Cora is far more opressive for the enemy that Scarlet.The other reason why i would chose Scarlet over Cora would be probably cuz she a redhead :<

 

[Shar Dundred]

The next update will replace Scarlett's Silence with Mark of Chaos and her Sleep with Dark Spirits.

If the story demandes we go for Scarlet,then i guess i will

The story demands you do that?

Progress report:
@Imperator is doing the terrain, I am done with most of the triggers and have done quite some AI work.
Release is VERY CLOSE, but I can't guarantee a release date.

 

[LickMyEyeBall]

The next update will replace Scarlett's Silence with Mark of Chaos and her Sleep with Dark Spirits.


The story demands you do that?

Progress report:
@Imperator is doing the terrain, I am done with most of the triggers and have done quite some AI work.
Release is VERY CLOSE, but I can't guarantee a release date.

Eh, no chance to play it tomorrow I guess. What are "dark spirits" anyway? Cant recall despite the fact the name sounds too familiar.

 

[Shar Dundred]

AoE stun

 

[DD Mikasa]

@Shar Dundred

If we siding with her is canon as a choice (or did you remove the canon choices part i cant remember i always mess that up)

 

[Kasrkin]

Well, there is a cannon but no canon.