Revolutions in the RTS Genre

[Metal_Sonic]

Opinions? Warcraft is a good game modding-wise, but if you take a look at the actual game, it doesn't really introduce anything ground-breaking.

 

[ben_xuereb]

well i see as its probly one of the most customable games ever but with the "nothing ground breaking thing" its not neccaseraly true.
(or however ^ is spelt)

some maps kinda have thier OWN systen heres an example
counter strike: its a 3rd person shooter kind of map
poker TD: you seen anyone make such an advanced TD like that?
some ant colony game: kinda like the dungeon keeper game
Art contest: defintly nothing to do with fighting here appart from who has the best picture
dark deeds: this must have one of the most complicated systems ever with its scoring code and all that stuff also with the part were you can ally with evil is great

and im sure there is some more but thats all i can think of at the moment

 

[ragingspeedhorn]

I dont think you read what he said proberly or else you are just stupid. He said modding wise its good but the actual game aint that ground-breaking.

 

[Metal_Sonic]

Apart from heroes. I don't even know if any otpher games have heroes though

 

[bamboodude]

i think the melee games are pretty balanced and fun to play with. i mean, it requires uber micro and skills. starcraft too~

i think its just an upgraded version of warcraft1, wich was quite a ''revolution'' in its genre.
im sure there is other rts, but i think war3 is my favorite.

i dont think war3 was especially made for custom games. i think some custom games doesnt need any strategy or logic, just building a tower and stare at the carnage while eating your meal with an orange juice

 

[Metal_Sonic]

We know that warcraft couldn't live without custom games though. And, yes, Warcraft 1 was pretty inotative, but Warcraft 3 is pretty simple in itself, easy to get into, but eventually boring.

 

[Daminon]

Wasn't the combination between RPG-stuff (items, skills) and RTS a new thing in Warcraft III?

He he, in Supreme Commander there will be a brand new thing: tripple click. Funny isn't it?
But there will also be some new nice "AI-things" like you can give some units priority when they are attacking like make your bomb planes bomb only buildings or maybe even specific building types like production buildings. And when are out and fight you can activate a thing that serves your base while you have to control the battle. I really what to have that game.

 

[VGsatomi]

Well, in my opinion, 99% of this games worth is the map editor. Its worth buying the game for that program alone. I mean seriously, its essentially a "build your own game" engine. There is almost nothing you cant make within the limits of Wc3 game engine with that thing. Playing enouph user made maps has shown that very clearly. Ranging from Final Fantasy-style RPGs complete with random battles, movies/cinimatics, 1st and 3rd person shooting games, puzzle games, mini games, racing games comlete with arrow key control, MMORPGs comlete with save/load features, lengthly campaigns, board games, traditonal shooters, endless variations of traditional RTS, all sorts of crazy stuff, some of which even exceeds the quality of the official Blizz stuff...plus how easy it is to import custom materials, including music models, is something almost unheard of before that adds a whole new degree to customization....all in a user-friendly package. The WC3 map editor really is one of the greatest programs out there in my view.

As for as the actualy game, yeah, its nothing much to brag about. they took away from strategy and made the game minaly a micro-management oriented game. I really dislike the hero system, as I prefer the more army-oriented combat seen in WC2 and SC. As far as RTS goes I vastly prefer the C&C games, or at least Starcraft, over WC3.
-VGsatomi

 

[Vexorian]

That thing you call war3 melee gameplay is just a mod of the game engine featuring some samples on models / slks / textures / AI and that kind of things.

This software is a game engine whose intetion is to get edited.

 

[bamboodude]

but who plays maps made by other? most people i see on bt.net is used to play their dota and footie wars.

every rts needs good micromanagement and good unit choice. anyway i used to play custom games, but i guess most of them are for people that likes games like diablo 2 or WoW. i play it beceause its a good brain teasers and i set myself objectives and i do long observations on the techniques of others.

i liked starcraft better, i think there shouldve have 2 alternate melee modes, one without heroes and one with, i dont know.

 

[Horn]

SUPREME COMMANDER > ALL

 

[Daminon]

As for as the actualy game, yeah, its nothing much to brag about. they took away from strategy and made the game minaly a micro-management oriented game. I really dislike the hero system, as I prefer the more army-oriented combat seen in WC2 and SC. As far as RTS goes I vastly prefer the C&C games, or at least Starcraft, over WC3.
-VGsatomi

I agree a bit here. Have one single infantry unit that is thougher than all other units even if they are much bigger feels wrong. I don't like heroes in such games. I want it to be more realistic. A knight can take more damage than a archer becouse he has better protection. But if the archer is a hero then he is much tougher than the knight, for no logical reason. I dislike such. The best thing in wc3 is as every one else said the editor. It is truly unique.

 

[Raiju]

thats one of the things that makes SC wonderful, but well, wc3 (mostly coz of editor) is reigning supreme because lets reckon it, SCEditor sux

 

[Daminon]

SCEditor sux

I was very good for its' time. I used to make a few "installation" maps with it. Compared to the Red Alert editor where you could only make melee maps, the Starcraft editior was fantastic. I liked it very much. Hmm, maybe VG gets angry now. :lol:

 

[Raiju]

cant always live in the past huh?

if it was so, i would still be playing Heretic 3 (my first game ever taking off the windows ones)

 

[Xeridanus]

I've tried quite a few of the modern RTS' and I can't think of one that doesn't have a hero type figure. First theres Spell Force, which is basically an RPG fantasy game. Your hero can build a base and army in each level\island as it doesn't go with you when you move to another island, to try and wipe out the opposing force. So it is partly RTS. Then there is WarHammer 40k and Battle for Middle Earth, which are both good for squad based tactics. However they also have hero units. (although in Wh40k they arn't as superior to the other units).

For a realistic medieval simulation game there is http://www.taleworlds.com/ quite a good game. It'll be even better when its finished.

 

[VGsatomi]

The orignal Red Alert, yeah, you could only make "melee" maps, but Red Alert 2 you could make "ums" maps just fine. Althought it wanst nearly as user friendly as SC. I made 26 maps for Red Alert 2, half of which were ums, including racing maps, tag maps, art of defense (helms deep style) maps, click defense maps, even a successful AoS map complete with heroes and upgrades for spawns and so forth.
-VGsatomi

 

[Daminon]

i would still be playing Heretic 3 (my first game ever taking off the windows ones)

I still do at rare times with Doomsday.

 

[Raiju]

i would still be playing Heretic 3 (my first game ever taking off the windows ones)

I still do at rare times with Doomsday.

old games rlz...

some time ago i still used to play heretic, doom, hexen and such. but recently i gave up all of these to play Quake 2 (quake 1 was a crap)

 

[Xeridanus]

Total Annihilation. now thats a good ol' game. Who agrees with me?

 

[Daminon]

Total Annihilation. now thats a good ol' game. Who agrees with me?

There are different thoughts about that game. There are both bad and good sides.
Bad sides:
- Can feel very boring at some times, nothing happens.
- Many structures take incredibly long time to build.
- All units are very slow.
- Stupid AI. Units sometimes get stuck and doens't shoot back at attackers. The last thing was ever worse in Red Alert.
- Too large maps. Combined with the slow units it takes years to make an assult. yes you can use air craft but they take very long time to build compared to land units.
- Over all slow. The whole game feels so slow.
- Completely lack of interesting story. I never read the text shown before a mission starts.
- Feels a little bit dorky with those two transformers looking commanders.
- Too few resources, often. It takes much time to get any resources to build anything, unless you play on the metal planet.

Good sides:
- Many many units. I like this very much.
- Units for both land, air and water combat.
- Most units are used for a specific purpose.
- Unusually amount of defensive structures with dfferetn specialites. An they are powerful. I like that very much too.
- 3D models. All untis are in full 3d.
- Unique radar system. Units can only be seen on mini map if they are within a radars' range. Some people may like it other don't. It opens new ways of how to lead an assult.

There are sure other attributes but this is way I can figure our now. Some people like this game others hate it. I liked much.

 

[Raiju]

Wheel of Time and Twisen Odyssey (its so funny)

and who remenber the old good Settlers?

 

[Mechanical Man]

Well, Dune 2! As first RTS (i think) it wasn't even so bad.

 

[DarkShadow]

Favourite old games? Outcast, Final Fantasy 3, TA, etc...

Getting back on topic
Imo the only REAL revolutions were Homeworld and Spellforce. Still my favourite games.