New Content Discussion [SPOILER]

[LISBOAH]

Just played the Chapter Twelve.

Spoiler

Boy it was hard. Luckily Amari and company came with the Gnolls and Harpies. And then those Bonelords decide to attack us.

I spared Logan and his men. I have no reasons to hate Logan. He may be the most logical and likeable human till now in this campaign. Lol, Sasrogarn likes talking but apparently he couldn't even beat Logan in a one-on-one fight, what a loser!

What are the requirements for the Secret Mission Shar?

 

[Championfighter25]

Just played the Chapter Twelve.

Spoiler

What are the requirements for the Secret Mission Shar?

Making enough "wrong choices" makes Vanessa defect to Volarian's side in the Duke interlude. While I'm not completely sure, this should be the condition that decides if the secret chapter gets unlocked.

 

[LISBOAH]

Spoiler

Making enough "wrong choices" makes Vanessa defect to Volarian's side in the Duke interlude. While I'm not completely sure, this should be the condition that decides if the secret chapter gets unlocked.

Spoiler

Wow, so Rangul can be enough of a douche to make Vanessa defect to an army of Arkain-alternate nazis?

I will try that after I finnish this campaign.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Spoiler

I'll just say that the secret chapter here is very very special.

 

[Daffa]

Time for hack mode

Anyway, thanks for the release, time to send myself to the nether.

 

[Kuras2003]

to unlock secret chapter we need to replay FOB and SOB and pick every bad choice?

 

[LickMyEyeBall]

I wonder does anyone actually have the chapter available?

Not me Gotta wait until Shar releases some full blown rookie guide on "how to press X to win"

 

[Kuras2003]

i think we need to make every possible bad choices regarding vanessa in both orc books to unlock it

gona try it later

 

[Daffa]

Have fun guessing I suppose. Apparently, I was in the right direction all along, just need to know that I need to retrace to find it

And Shar, thank you for the chapter. It was satisfying, at least.

 

[Championfighter25]

I found the secret chapter and played it. The units we got to use were pretty cool. It was a bit sad playing through it, but certain people will really enjoy it. The ending wasn't all that surprising. Though I feel like the path not having a proper epilogue hurts it a lot.

Spoiler: HOW TO UNLOCK THE CHAPTER

Chose most of the bad choices concerning Vanessa and the humans ( Attack the Kasrkin, kill Salomar, attack the Ironfist, fail at convincing Sasrogarn, attack the humans to gain more resources instead of the undead, kill Greymoore, etc...) Go to ''The Duke'' interlude. If you've already watched it, skip to the end. After it asks you whose path you will follow, chose Redfist's path. Enjoy (or don't).

 

[LickMyEyeBall]

I found the secret chapter and played it. The units we got to use were pretty cool. It was a bit sad playing through it, but certain people will really enjoy it. The ending wasn't all that surprising. Though I feel like the path not having a proper epilogue hurts it a lot.

Spoiler: HOW TO UNLOCK THE CHAPTER

Chose most of the bad choices concerning Vanessa and the humans ( Attack the Kasrkin, kill Salomar, attack the Ironfist, fail at convincing Sasrogarn, attack the humans to gain more resources instead of the undead, kill Greymoore, etc...) Go to ''The Duke'' interlude. If you've already watched it, skip to the end. After it asks you whose path you will follow, chose Redfist's path. Enjoy (or don't).

Spoiler: spolier

Oh, I see so much irony in this. Those choices make Duke Redfist's crusade a worthy task. As if they justify his actions. Gotta do a lot of replaying I guess.

EDIT:

Spoiler: regarding the secret chapter

What happens if I follow the steps to get the secret chapter yet skip it and proceed as usual? I mean how can the plot/dialogues change given those conditions?

 

[Kuras2003]

i just finished secret chapter nad i have only 1 question for now....

will there be more maps with Duke Redfist as pratagonist?

 

[Shar Dundred]

@LickMyEyeBall: You will proceed normally but one main character will be gone.
Just as if you had chosen not to follow that path.

@KuraTheKura20033002: No, the Secret Chapter counts as an alternate ending.

 

[Daffa]

Duke will be meet again I'm sure, AS ENEMY.

Anyway, just wanna say the backlash was a bummer. That last moment.

 

[OblivionDeadra]

Well that secret chapter is something

didn't expect that happen

 

[Daffa]

If I consider the condition of the alternate ending second part as valid, would that mean he will beat her?

 

[Verb8im]

@LickMyEyeBall: You will proceed normally but one main character will be gone.
Just as if you had chosen not to follow that path.

Wait, who? And how?

 

[Shar Dundred]

If I consider the condition of the alternate ending second part as valid, would that mean he will beat her?

In the alternate ending he does, yes.

Wait, who? And how?

In order to unlock the Secret Chapter, a certain character must be mad at Rangul and Co. That character will not join Rangul's successor both if you play the Secret Chapter and if you do not.

 

[Verb8im]

In order to unlock the Secret Chapter, a certain character must be mad at Rangul and Co. That character will not join Rangul's successor both if you play the Secret Chapter and if you do not.

Oh, Vanessa?

 

[LickMyEyeBall]

Just finished the secret chapter.

Spoiler: Some thoughts

1) The ending was predictable. Not in bad way tho I liked the transition to Aedale's part, but I think it could be interesting if Vanessa would witness how the Duke executed her sister.
2) I got the dialogue part with Gran Gorehowl (is that his name? Im sorry if I misspelled it), Sas, Pechan and Grofzag. So I assume there are more? For example there is no way for the player to get to Grella before the pyromancer guy destroys her base. I mean one can try to destroy the trees with mortars but there's a lot of cutting to do and my allies are quickly finishing off the first two orc bases.
3) The enemy heroes start appearing only after their bases are attacked. They are not present initially. Could tune the difficulty a bit with that.
4) Speaking of which. The chapter was overall easy (unlike the rest of the SOB). Please, great Shar dont punish me (or poor Kasrkin) for those words. Redfist army too OP.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Spoiler

4) Speaking of which. The chapter was overall easy (unlike the rest of the SOB). Please, great Shar dont punish me (or poor Kasrkin) for those words. Redfist army too OP.

Spoiler

I can upload an older version with only like 2 enemy barracks more and you may reconsider that statement.

 

[Ahman]

I actually saw Rangul's death coming the moment he started speaking about how he will be remembered after his death. It reminded me how characters in Naruto Shippuuden suddenly get flashbacks before they die, but in this case it was a long ass conversation with Ephrog or whatever his name was. Interesting how Redfist's character completely changed from a good caring commander into a tyrant because of what Rangul did before he became Warchief. The campaign maker is basically saying that Redfist became the way he is because we, the players, slaughtered a whole village in chapter 1 of the first Orc book.
I also remembered the chapter where Aedele hunts down her father in the second human book and how her sister came in to convince Adeale that Redfist is an amazing daddy. I'm starting to regret killing him in that mission now, but it is quite hard to say for sure, unless there is still a way to pull Redfist back to the good side.
Interesting turnout of the events! totally loving it so far!

 

[LickMyEyeBall]

No negative/positive points for Blen?

EDIT: Gee, im such a dummy, forgot to switch choices T_T Apologies, the question was wrong.

 

[Championfighter25]

After replaying chapter 12 I can definitely confirm that it's a lot harder. The tactics I used to beat it before still worked, but its playtime was doubled.
Most of the 4th interlude wasn't surprising. The non-aggression pact though, that was unexpected. It will probably be broken soon, but it will serve its purpose.
And considering who Logan serves after you spared him, he will probably die by the time of the epilogue. It will be a bit surprising for him to outlive it.

 

[LISBOAH]

Just saw the Interlude

Spoiler

The only grammar error I found was during Commander Valan(?) quote when he says 'nonethless' rather than 'nonetheless'.

Glad to see Sasrogarn dying. People like him are too worthless to be left alive. Plus, he could attempt to undermine Amari's authority. It would have been funnier if he had demanded a trial by combat to decide who should rule and then ask for Grofzag to represent him, but Grofzag simply ignores his request. Sas gets more and more hysterical and starts asking everyone, even the Grunts, to fight for him but no one has interest in fighting for him and Amari kills him.

Isn't 'Brian' kind of breaking the pact he made with Aridon by advising Amari and making both her and Gardon form a pact?

I think this pact will work well. Logan has a high opinion of Amari and Gardon knows that the Domion under Amari will not go around plundering and burning like the orcs did under Rangul.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Isn't 'Brian' kind of breaking the pact he made with Aridon by advising Amari and making both her and Gardon form a pact?

He is using a loophole, actually. Since this is focused on Gardon, in this particular case, he
is not breaking the pact - not any more than Aridon by sending the three Bonelords.
It is not like Brian is telling Gardon to "support" Amari or is using his own powers to fight.
If this would have been an alliance offer rather than what it is, Aridon would not have allowed
this to happen.

 

[OblivionDeadra]

Ummmm question about chapter 12

 

[lloyd2422]

I did not expect that plot twist though, now i know the reason why amari herself was not present during the end of the invasion (chapter 12 of shb), and i guess having murlocks as part of the dominion is not really considered as canon. still, that interlude was Great.

 

[Tuwnew]

Yeah, where is the weedhunter tribe? x)

Also, I just noticed that almost all orcs chieftain from the first book are now dead.
Except Zairmak!

I am not sure if Lokar was already a leader since we don't see him in the first book.

 

[LISBOAH]

Just played the Thirteenth Chapter

Spoiler

Errors:
-The description in the loading screen is too long for all to appear.
-'buried' instead of 'burried'

The Redfist claim that they have been more successful than the mercenaries. Let's see:
-They managed to burn the Orc islands, but only because most of the warriors were away and failed at preventing the few warriors to escape.
-They attacked the Gnolls that were neutral in this whole mess and then got massacred.
If this is their defintion of success, I can't even imagine what they deem as failure

Look Daric. I value honor and commitment. I REALLY do. But deciding to stay commited to this cause was not just stupid, it was advanced stupid. Do you really think that an order given by Lerrig is worth anything at all? You sent yourself and your men to their deaths due to the order of an incompetent man that can't even be trusted with taking care of a hamster during hibernation!

I hope that either Aedale or Ebira kill Orie when this is all over. A sister that didn't do anything while her younger sister was being abused by her father is just as worthless as trash. Seriously, what did she thought Aedale was going to do to her father if given the opportunity of revenge? Blame your 'precious' father for the whole mess, blame the source not the effect!

I hope Zelech and his men get burned alive by Aedale's flames. It would be karma at its finest!

I felt pure catharsis at slaughtering the Bloodstone Dwarves and Redfists. I felt more joy at killing them than killing the Golden Guard, imagine that! They are the epitome of hypocrisy, the flaw I deem as the worst of all!

Wait, so Gardon failed? That was even more shocking than nearly another plot twist!
So it is up to Amari and friends to both defeat the Golden Guard and stop the demonic invasion?
If things will go similar to the Second Human Book, the undead will intervene, by either allying with Amari (unlikely) and later betraying her or attempt to claim and destroy the cannon. Aridon will not let that the cannon is left at the hands of mortals, even at the hands of Brian's servants.

 

[Championfighter25]

I expected part of Daric's mercenaries to desert after we destroyed his main base.
While some of them really want to destroy us, a lot are in it for the money.
Anyway, as expected a certain demoness did indeed help, even if indirectly.
Orie is even more foolish and gullable than Aedale. Ironic.
Gardon failing was unexpected. At least the Dominion now have a better reason at attacking the canon. Unfortunately, we know how this is going to end.

 

[LISBOAH]

I expected part of Daric's mercenaries to desert after we destroyed his main base.
While some of them really want to destroy us, a lot are in it for the money.

Right, like they would get a lot of money. From who? Lerrig is dead and the Redfist would most likely take all the credit.

Orie is even more foolish and gullable than Aedale. Ironic.

Yep.
What does she have to complain? She was clearly a favourite of her father, while the rest of her siblings were mistreated.
Is little Orie upset that her precious daddy got killed, even though he clearly had it coming?

I hope she gets what is coming to her as well. She didn't do anything to aid her sister when she needed her and abandoned her father's men simply for revenge.

Gardon failing was unexpected. At least the Dominion now have a better reason at attacking the canon. Unfortunately, we know how this is going to end.

I only hope that they manage to kill van Durce and Zarin before they inevitably fail.

 

[Hardric62]

Right, like they would get a lot of money. From who? Lerrig is dead and the Redfist would most likely take all the credit.

The part where he said the Emperor 'renewed' his mission is the likely explanation for me. When your ruler gives you a mission, you usually follow on.

I only hope that they manage to kill van Durce and Zarin before they inevitably fail.

The way it's said, i'd say they're still alive (maye not that much of a surprise if the future is supposed to include a Zyainor). I'm curious to see if Gardon's remaining forces will play any role in the last parts of this campaign.

 

[LISBOAH]

The part where he said the Emperor 'renewed' his mission is the likely explanation for me. When your ruler gives you a mission, you usually follow on.

Mercenaries are not like the Golden Guard or the Redfist, that are bound by duty to serve the Emperor. They simply work for those that pay them. But in this case no amount of money will be sufficent to repair the losses that the mercenaries suffered due to Lerrig's incompetent order.

And considering who the true Emperor is...

The way it's said, i'd say they're still alive (maye not that much of a surprise if the future is supposed to include a Zyainor). I'm curious to see if Gardon's remaining forces will play any role in the last parts of this campaign.

I know they are still alive. I only hope that they get killed by the Dominion and Zarin gets killed by the daughter of the orc that killed his brother. I don't care if this means that the Dwarves will be left leaderless or even go into civil war. It is their fault for going into war simply because the brother of the king was killed.

 

[Hardric62]

Mercenaries are not like the Golden Guard or the Redfist, that are bound by duty to serve the Emperor. They simply work for those that pay them. But in this case no amount of money will be sufficent to repair the losses that the mercenaries suffered due to Lerrig's incompetent order.

And considering who the true Emperor is...

Well, I guess 'agents' of the Emperor renewed their contract, while pointing out that the Empire was pulling out of the Kingdoms and giving them up to the Demons, and only loyal efficient servants could pretend to a place in one of the ships leaving the place behind... Could be a big motivation.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Mercenaries are not like the Golden Guard or the Redfist, that are bound by duty to serve the Emperor.

Trust me, if the Emperor had told Redfist to abandon his personal crusade and order him to like attack the Demons or Gardon, Redfist would have gone renegade and his army would follow.

 

[LISBOAH]

Trust me, if the Emperor had told Redfist to abandon his personal crusade and order him to like attack the Demons or Gardon, Redfist would have gone renegade and his army would follow.

Wow, for real?

Then that is settled!
The Redfists are henceforth the faction I despise the most in all of Arkain! If they were a race, I would commit full genocide on them without regret; their screams would serve as lullabies; the few survivors would be buried alive, for their corpses are not even worthy of being eaten by the vultures. And to Volarian, I would incapacitate him and force him to watch his men die!
Once I was done, anyone that would say 'Redfist' would get a a shiver down on their very soul because they would immediatly think of the absolute massacre I inflicted upon them!

 

[OblivionDeadra]

Hmmmm

I know this question is dumb but it got me thinking

During the secret campaign in SOB the demonlord/Buff Doom guard mention he can't mind control the redfist men..
soooo can aridon somehow manipulate the redfist of stopping their crusade?

Just a thought though.

Edit: Just fixing my grammar sorry

 

[LISBOAH]

Hmmmm

I know this question is dumb but it got me thinking

During the secret campaign in SOB the demonlord/Buff Doom guard mention he can't mind control the redfist men..
soooo can aridon somehow manipulate the redfist of stopping their crusade?

I don't think Aridon can directly mind control others, only undead.

Rahandir knows about the spell Gardon uses to secure the loyalty of the Ironfist, so most likely he can use it as well.

The best in Aridon's ranks in terms of manipulation is Largoth since he can enter people's minds, create nightmares, etc.

 

[Shar Dundred]

Wow, for real?

Then that is settled!
The Redfists are henceforth the faction I despise the most in all of Arkain! If they were a race, I would commit full genocide on them without regret; their screams would serve as lullabies; the few survivors would be buried alive, for their corpses are not even worthy of being eaten by the vultures. And to Volarian, I would incapacitate him and force him to watch his men die!
Once I was done, anyone that would say 'Redfist' would get a a shiver down on their very soul because they would immediatly think of the absolute massacre I inflicted upon them!

While it makes me a bit proud that I have apparently managed to create a faction that you
out of all people hate even more than the Orcs, I have to admit that my choice of words was
maybe not entirely correct.
What I meant was that Redfist would ignore such orders and you COULD consider that going
renegade or it would justify any actions from the Imperial forces against him if it came to that
point.
I did not mean to say that they would actively work against their former brothers and sisters
in arms or attack any other human factions, I only meant to say that NO ONE would have prevented
Redfist from doing what he is doing.
Regarding Aridon, his manipulations might have SOME effect, but he is not using "direct" mind control
(neither is Rahandir, btw), he is using his powers but he could not have someone serve him like that.
His manipulations work in a way that people mostly don't even notice that they are being manipulated.
Someone like Redifst, who is COMPLETELY determined to destroy the Orcs could not just be manipulated
out of that.

The best in Aridon's ranks in terms of manipulation is Largoth since he can enter people's minds, create nightmares, etc.

He isn't really in Aridon's ranks anymore though.

 

[LISBOAH]

While it makes me a bit proud that I have apparently managed to create a faction that you
out of all people hate even more than the Orcs, I have to admit that my choice of words was
maybe not entirely correct.
What I meant was that Redfist would ignore such orders and you COULD consider that going
renegade or it would justify any actions from the Imperial forces against him if it came to that
point.
I did not mean to say that they would actively work against their former brothers and sisters
in arms or attack any other human factions, I only meant to say that NO ONE would have prevented
Redfist from doing what he is doing.

In times of war, desertion is considered as pretty much betrayal.

Considering that the Redfist burned alive people that had no problem in coexisting with other races, their loyalty to their own race is not exactly very high. To them everyone that doesn't agree with their extreme racist ideals are traitors, but considering that they murdered civilians, the very people they were supposed to protect, they are the biggest traitors.

So orcs killing Redfist's family is wrong, but him killing civilians of his own race is fine? I would say that Redfist needs to get laid, but considering that he has plenty of children, that is not the problem. So he should pick a better option, kill himself.

He isn't really in Aridon's ranks anymore though.

So in all timelines he ends up leaving the Undead cause?

 

[Tuwnew]

Gardon failing was unexpected. At least the Dominion now have a better reason at attacking the canon. Unfortunately, we know how this is going to end.

I only hope that they manage to kill van Durce and Zarin before they inevitably fail.

Well to me, it was not surprising. And no, we don't know how it will end.

Pretty sure, the main race will always win in his book. Like, Human book => Humanity wins.
In Orc Book, well pretty sure Domination will wins.

 

[Shar Dundred]

In times of war, desertion is considered as pretty much betrayal.

True, true.

Considering that the Redfist burned alive people that had no problem in coexisting with other races, their loyalty to their own race is not exactly very high. To them everyone that doesn't agree with their extreme racist ideals are traitors, but considering that they murdered civilians, the very people they were supposed to protect, they are the biggest traitors.

While the Redfist is rather.... "passionate" (fanatical, zealous, name your poison really) about
their war against the Orcs in the name of humanity, they consider themselves more the avengers
of the dead than as protectors of the living. They re controlled by their own hatred.
As Grella said "I can sense that your heart is filled with pain and regret, Human, leading your
mind to rage and hatred." and "It is a shame that your heart has been corrupted by your own emotions".
I am not excusing their behaviour, they are fanatical butchers of ANYONE who either is an Orc
or alligned to the Orcs in any way (or in the case of some unhappy villagers, those who are
trading with the Orcs' allies, they really like to burn everything down), but they became what
they are now not just because they felt like it.

So in all timelines he ends up leaving the Undead cause?

Yep.

Pretty sure, the main race will always win in his book. Like, Human book => Humanity wins.

I am not going to argue with that logic, but people like @Championfighter25 may disagree on the
"Humanity wins" part for the Second Human Book.

I would say that Redfist needs to get laid, but considering that he has plenty of children, that is not the problem.

He even used to have two sons who are dead by now! So THAT is NOT an issue.

 

[Tuwnew]

Well, perhaps not "Humanity", but our main characters.

 

[LISBOAH]

Well to me, it was not surprising. And no, we don't know how it will end.

Pretty sure, the main race will always win in his book. Like, Human book => Humanity wins.
In Orc Book, well pretty sure Domination will wins.

The Humans won in their book, but their victory was not 100% due to the Undeads' intervention. So I am guessing that the Dominion's victory will also not be absolute.

 

[Championfighter25]

The Humans won in their book, but their victory was not 100% due to the Undeads' intervention. So I am guessing that the Dominion's victory will also not be absolute.

If they can use the canon to get all the land the humans lost from the demons, that will be an enormous victory regardless. And they probably will, at least temporarily.

 

[Kuras2003]

Redfist fraction is kinda like Scarlet Crusade doesn't it?

 

[LISBOAH]

Redfist fraction is kinda like Scarlet Crusade doesn't it?

Not really. The Scarlet Crusade's actions were a mixture of warped good intentions, demonic corruption and religious fervor (except one or two douches). The Redfist are guided simply by hatred and thirst for revenge.

 

[lekxman22]

I love Redfist faction but not their intention

 

[Shar Dundred]

They are using Scarlet Crusade models and also are rather fanatical so the factions were bound to be compared, but as @LISBOAH stated, that's pretty much where the similarities end. And the color red + fanatism is nothing new, really.
Redfist got no demonic influence involved and is not religious. They are united by their leader Duke Volarian Redfist and by their hatred against all Orcs.
I would say that this and many other things will become easier to see once I finally get to work on the Faction Sheets.