Demigod

[I)eadnerzhul]

Demigod is not balanced, they have not had the time to even tweak the balance. Examplewise, Lv20 is utterly out of balance. Demigod might be fun if you got time, and like taking it slow with some trips at the toilet in-between without it making any difference.

How is it unbalanced if you reach the max level? You get extra XP for killing enemy Demigods, which happens to be the fastest way to get XP.

I'm glad there actually is a DotA clone as well, Heroes of Newerth, and a gameplay clone, content original, League of Legends. 'cause, as I've said countless times already, I prefer competitive games, Demigod is not competitive, and Demigod is slow-paced and long-drawn.

DotA is slow-paced and long-drawn, and from what I can see, Demigod isn't quite like that. I can complete a match in about 10-15 minutes, the longest ones taking about 20 or so. And that's against the computer... I wonder how quick it would be with real players?

 

[Gilles]

- Lack of variation- few Demigods, few maps, small maps, increadibly bad AI - probably a bit more variation in MP though.

Sorry to go way back, but... what? You're saying that DotA is better due to this reason? Last time I checked DotA didn't have more than one map, which isn't very big, and no (offical) AI. Huh?

 

[Deleted member 157129]

How is it unbalanced if you reach the max level? You get extra XP for killing enemy Demigods, which happens to be the fastest way to get XP.

DotA is slow-paced and long-drawn, and from what I can see, Demigod isn't quite like that. I can complete a match in about 10-15 minutes, the longest ones taking about 20 or so. And that's against the computer... I wonder how quick it would be with real players?

It seems that level 20 has some extra benefits that throws them all out of balance, if all the heroes are level 20, you can't kill eachother, it's virtually impossible.

I've never seen or played a match of Demigod any shorter than an hour. Except those matches in the tournament; first team to get 5 kills, which is done in a minute or two in a 5v5 battle. By the way, real players tend to play better than the computers resulting in longer matches, not shorter.

I don't really get how DotA is slow-paced compared to Demigod though, have you seen how slow everything progresses? Even attack animations seem to be at half speed.



DotA has way more heroes, way larger and detailed map (put all the Demigod maps together and you don't reach half the detail in the DotA map). And in fact, even unofficial, the DotA AI is much more sofisticated. But I agree that the AI is not something to compare on.

 

[Dr Super Good]

Well, the dota AI uses WC3's AI for casting spells mostly. Thus its unfair to compair as the AI DotA uses is far more easy to make as it relies on the mechanics from WC3. Also demigod is more complex, so the AI not only has to be low level coded but also interface with more.

Also if you lot have not ralized, the game was incomplete when it was released... If you saw supreme commanders 2 you would understand. The demo showed that supreme commanders 2 was fully playable and its still 6 months odd from release. As THQ used the same developers for both (they said that they got experience from demigod), they obviously eithor rushed demigod so they could work on supreme commanders 2, or they did not pay it their full efforts, thus it was released with too little polish behind it. Also, they are trying all kinds of stuff like nural networks for learning AI for supreme commanders 2, yet none of that was tried with demigod, which means obviously it was not a serious game for them. It seems that THQ made most of the game (especially the graphics) and stardock is basically trying to maintain what was made and finish it with their limated resource team. They promised new content every month I remember reading somewhere yet they are yet to add a single new hero lol.

 

[Deathcom3s]

DotA is slow-paced and long-drawn, and from what I can see, Demigod isn't quite like that. I can complete a match in about 10-15 minutes, the longest ones taking about 20 or so. And that's against the computer... I wonder how quick it would be with real players?

Games generally take up to 30 minutes max, so they're definitely shorter than many rounds of DotA.

 

[Deleted member 157129]

Games generally take up to 30 minutes max, so they're definitely shorter than many rounds of DotA.

If one side is stronger than the other, yes. If you put a good team versus an average in a DotA match, the game is over in less than 30 minutes as well.

If you finish in 30 minutes I guess you're around level 15 and without any artefacts or high-tier items. Just for the record, what are the 'general' team scores, in warrank and hero-kills- and are buildings usually destroyed on both sides, or is one side barely touched while the other is crushed? Besides, are you guys talking about full, conquest mode, or one of the mini-games?

 

[I)eadnerzhul]

If one side is stronger than the other, yes. If you put a good team versus an average in a DotA match, the game is over in less than 30 minutes as well.

Yeah, but most B.net games these days explicitly require you to be a "pro", so it doesn't matter.

If you finish in 30 minutes I guess you're around level 15 and without any artefacts or high-tier items.

Demigod isn't about getting the best item build- it isn't even about having a good hero build. It's about having abilities and knowing HOW TO USE THEM. That's what sets it apart from DotA. It's more of an Action-game with RPG elements than an... well, a regular AoS.

Just for the record, what are the 'general' team scores, in warrank and hero-kills- and are buildings usually destroyed on both sides, or is one side barely touched while the other is crushed?

I couldn't tell you. I never attempted to play multiplayer with my *ahem* "not so legal" copy of the game.

Besides, are you guys talking about full, conquest mode, or one of the mini-games?

What you need to realize is that those other modes are fully fledged modes- they aren't "mini-games". Not in the slightest.

 

[Deleted member 157129]

Yeah, but most B.net games these days explicitly require you to be a "pro", so it doesn't matter.
Demigod isn't about getting the best item build- it isn't even about having a good hero build. It's about having abilities and knowing HOW TO USE THEM. That's what sets it apart from DotA. It's more of an Action-game with RPG elements than an... well, a regular AoS.
I couldn't tell you. I never attempted to play multiplayer with my *ahem* "not so legal" copy of the game. What you need to realize is that those other modes are fully fledged modes- they aren't "mini-games". Not in the slightest.

There are many levels of "Pro" .. one of them is noobs.

If you think you can just cast spells at random in DotA you are gravely mistaken. How to use your abilities at the exact right moment at the correct target in sync with your team is essential in DotA, if you can't do that you lose. Buying the correct items makes sure you are not at a disadvantage, and building spells in an order that suits your team and enemy is necessary to maintain control in the early state of the game. You see, this is where DotA adds a lot of depth, whereas Demigod has none.

I could say the opposit, that DotA is more of an action game than Demigod is, simply because there's no action in Demigod. It's an epic RTS battle, and that's all there is.

Question about the 'general' endgame status was more directed at Deathcom3s.

If they are not mini-games, then how come they are small parts of the conquest mode? They take little time, and they are bits of a larger game, they are mini-games.

 

[I)eadnerzhul]

There are many levels of "Pro" .. one of them is noobs.

You of all people should know.

If you think you can just cast spells at random in DotA you are gravely mistaken.

I think not.

How to use your abilities at the exact right moment at the correct target in sync with your team is essential in DotA, if you can't do that you lose.

See, unlike DotA, Demigod has no "support" roles. Each Demigod is more than fully capable of defending themselves and supporting themselves, whereas DotA has the more traditional healers, tanks, etc.

Buying the correct items makes sure you are not at a disadvantage, and building spells in an order that suits your team and enemy is necessary to maintain control in the early state of the game. You see, this is where DotA adds a lot of depth, whereas Demigod has none.

How so? Demigod also requires you to pick the right skills at the right time, but then again, every skill is important and suited to a particular playstyle, whereas DotA has specific "hero builds" that are followed every game. The items you buy in Demigod are to help out your own hero, not your allies. As I've said, each Demigod is a capable tank/damage dealer/dps/etc.

I could say the opposit, that DotA is more of an action game than Demigod is, simply because there's no action in Demigod.

But you can't, because that's not the case.

It's an epic RTS battle, and that's all there is.

Not at all. If anything, the units that are spawned in the game are little more than cannon fodder. Although, some units can be useful for destroying towers (the demolishers that generals have access to). The only time units really make an impact is in the beginning of each match, where Demigods are the weakest.

Question about the 'general' endgame status was more directed at Deathcom3s.

Makes sense.

If they are not mini-games, then how come they are small parts of the conquest mode? They take little time, and they are bits of a larger game, they are mini-games.

The time each takes is dependent entirely on the customizable settings (how many points necessary to win the flag-capturing mode, how many kills for the "deathmatch" mode, etc.). If you set the kill limit for deathmatch to say 5, you'd have a significantly shorter game than if you'd set it to say 15 or 20.

 

[Super-Sheep]

Dota is slow. Demigod is faster. Lolwat? I think that I have missed something.

I awlays thought that in Demigod you just stand still on a lane and maybe move a bit and look cool, then at some very random moment you just nuke your enemy with one very cool looking spell, oo enemy takes a lot damage, now another spell, ooo imba effects and he is dead. ssssss

And give me a one example of a hero that is only healing based at Dota. Oh now I remember. There are none.

 

[Deathcom3s]

If one side is stronger than the other, yes. If you put a good team versus an average in a DotA match, the game is over in less than 30 minutes as well.

If you finish in 30 minutes I guess you're around level 15 and without any artefacts or high-tier items. Just for the record, what are the 'general' team scores, in warrank and hero-kills- and are buildings usually destroyed on both sides, or is one side barely touched while the other is crushed? Besides, are you guys talking about full, conquest mode, or one of the mini-games?

I don't have exact numbers, but yes, the games me and TU played were about 30 minutes long and we ended at around lvl 15 - 20, with items and artifacts. I'm talking full conquest mode.

 

[Deleted member 157129]

You of all people should know.

I think not.

See, unlike DotA, Demigod has no "support" roles. Each Demigod is more than fully capable of defending themselves and supporting themselves, whereas DotA has the more traditional healers, tanks, etc.

Ehm, I'm starting to think you haven't even played DotA.

How so? Demigod also requires you to pick the right skills at the right time, but then again, every skill is important and suited to a particular playstyle, whereas DotA has specific "hero builds" that are followed every game. The items you buy in Demigod are to help out your own hero, not your allies. As I've said, each Demigod is a capable tank/damage dealer/dps/etc.

'Specific hero builds' - what the **** are you talking about? There are no specific hero builds. Your build depends on your enemies and allies, and not some preset 'ideal' .. well, that's the best part about DotA, it's a teamgame, not 10 players playing on their own, all getting supported by one of the two AIs - that's how you try to describe it, right? - to be honest, I don't play Demigod like that either. I buy items to support my team, and win the game, instead of ensuring that my own 'score' looks 'good' or anything like that.
Besides, heroes in DotA are mostly capable of taking care of themselves as well.

But you can't, because that's not the case.

Yes it is. Describe a situation with action involved in a Demigod game.

Not at all. If anything, the units that are spawned in the game are little more than cannon fodder. Although, some units can be useful for destroying towers (the demolishers that generals have access to). The only time units really make an impact is in the beginning of each match, where Demigods are the weakest.

The units are more important in the end, when upgrades have been bought, and you need to bring down buildings. In the beginning they are only for gold and experience points. That's how I view Demigod, and most people I play with.

The time each takes is dependent entirely on the customizable settings (how many points necessary to win the flag-capturing mode, how many kills for the "deathmatch" mode, etc.). If you set the kill limit for deathmatch to say 5, you'd have a significantly shorter game than if you'd set it to say 15 or 20.

Aye, but can you nodge it up to at least 50? So that you get a 30min game or more? It's so silly to play 10minute matches that take 5min to set up.

 

[LordForcystus]

Yes it is. Describe a situation with action involved in a Demigod game.

Perhaps this is stating the obvious, but if Demigod didn't have action, it simply wouldn't exist. I'm clearly being very literal, but you say something like that, and you leave yourself open to literal.

just adding this warning at top, 'cause Hive is over-populated by DotA haters: I'm a DotA player.

All in all, a fairly nice game, once they fix the MP problems and start extenting the content. I wouldn't go as far as to call it a new generation of DotA though, because DotA proved a lot more depth and depend more on skill- perfect examples being Mirana's Arrow, Windrunner's Arrow, Pudge's Hook, Clockwerk's Hook, and many more.

This is just to show when this thread switched from being about Demigod to being about DotA.

Also I'd like to add that just because few people like DotA, and are willing to defend it still, it does not mean that Hive is over-populated by DotA haters.

Also I'd like to agree with Gilles from the first page, for those of you who don't know what I'm agreeing with, here's the quote.

Nothing beats EotA in the AoS genre. Nothing comes even close.

 

[Deleted member 157129]

Stardock made this thread 'about DotA' (if you can call comparing two games a thread about the game you compare the topic-game to) when they claimed that Demigod would be a revolutionary remake of the popular WC3 Mod DotA. Not exact words, but the essence of it.

Aight, I gave you a free hit, but everyone realize what I intended to imply. Example-wise, if you put on an action movie you've seen too many times, and play it off at half speed, you won't get the feeling it's an action movie (especially if you also cut any scenes with explosions and intense gunfights). That's what I see in Demigod. It's DotA, ripped off it's action-filled parts, at half speed. It's simply not fun, not intense, it's plain boring. (To me.. 'cause I've played 'too many' DotA matches.)

Yes, it is. I have not seen any other WC3 Fan site with as many anti-DotA forumers as the Hive. If you put up a poll about it, I'm sure the results would be pretty much:

Hate DotA (for either gameplay, community, it's popularity, and/or other) - 70%
Accepts DotA (as a well made game with some flaws) - 20%
Love DotA (for gameplay, community, and/or other) - 10%

Never even heard of EotA (new stuff?), must be an America or China exclusive map.

 

[Super-Sheep]

EotA is hosted on nordic by bot HostEm all the time... And it sucks. I run the map with constant 20 fps and I picked a hero using Mountain Giant and every time I casted one of the spells my fps dropped to 1.

 

[I)eadnerzhul]

EotA is hosted on nordic by bot HostEm all the time... And it sucks. I run the map with constant 20 fps and I picked a hero using Mountain Giant and every time I casted one of the spells my fps dropped to 1.

You must have one HORRIBLE computer.