Community Suggestions

[Andriejj]

I had a nice AtD game today ^^

That chasing part, after demons appeared, was nice. But I have a suggestion- the demon base, with portal, looks kinda lame, try to improve it pls And the demon cinematic could be improved...

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

Mmm, there is a demonic cinematic !? lol....

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

I had a nice AtD game today ^^

That chasing part, after demons appeared, was nice. But I have a suggestion- the demon base, with portal, looks kinda lame, try to improve it pls And the demon cinematic could be improved...

Perhaps I could improve the base... but how so? What is lame about it? should it not spawn there? I could improve the Doom cinematic by showing demons coming through the portal maybe... would that be better?

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

.... How are the spells going ??

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

.... How are the spells going ??

Working on them and revamping older ones. It's going well!

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

I would like to know if you are going to do that Nature bound spell i suggested ... You know you can count on me if you need.

Anyway it's good to know.

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

I would like to know if you are going to do that Nature bound spell i suggested ... You know you can count on me if you need.

Anyway it's good to know.

I might be, but like I said if I do it's only going to include one transformation for all units, not one specific for each different unit.

Also, I just became aware of two small small things I forgot to fix when updating to Version 2.0b. The hotkey of Vanish... it says the hotkey is I, but it is V. Also, when I erased the icon for my attack command button, I forgot to change the icon used for "Commands" in the Info(F9) menu. Even though these are not desirable, they are only superficial bugs and thus forth will not be fixed until the next full update is made. I foresee the release of the next update after a new spell is created for the Nature Mage and the Frozen Archer, and perhaps the Hunter.

 

[Andriejj]

It just looks bad imo. The tileset and those towers using ward models... And terrain there is so flat.

About demon arrival- when it goes about Armageddon(and that demon arrival is in that theme) things like meteors(or infernals ^^) falling from the sky, screen trembling and tinting look good. It would also look nice if those burning spiders appeared in waves, with some nice SFX, not all at the same time.

And the camera could move during the cinematic, now it just shows DK near Pit Lords.

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

It just looks bad imo. The tileset and those towers using ward models... And terrain there is so flat.

About demon arrival- when it goes about Armageddon(and that demon arrival is in that theme) things like meteors(or infernals ^^) falling from the sky, screen trembling and tinting look good. It would also look nice if those burning spiders appeared in waves, with some nice SFX, not all at the same time.

And the camera could move during the cinematic, now it just shows DK near Pit Lords.

Yeah I see what you mean. I will see what I can do. It was never intended to be a strong cinematic, but just a notification that the game type is changing and that the Death Knight had opened the portal.

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

Another suggestion:
1 - Why not use Chaos orc models ??? Since they are allied with the legion, it would make sense.

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

No. The story is not that Chaos Orcs are invading a town. The story is as follows;

"A rogue Death Knight has made dealings with demons of the Burning Legion to open a portal from the Twisting Nether into Lordaeron. This would allow the demons to infiltrate the lands of Azeroth. Thus, a call has been sent out to the Death Hunters across Lordaeron: Eradicate this rogue leader before he opens the portal within an isolated village- for if they fail, it will surely spell doom for the pure lands of Azeroth!"

 

[Saiyuki]

i think it would be useful to pause all units while/before the doom cinematic...
got killed while it was shown, not rlly that funny xD

then, could u add some more help for the hunters after doom? maybe add a requirement for it, like opening the door to north to get help by allied units (controlled by computer), its sometimes hard to avoid the spawned demon troops... just minor help to get away for some more seconds... ^^

moreover, i know it's some minor bug, but you can see the bonus gold (+10 Gold) text message in the fog of the demon knight as hunter... just happened NOT to walk in him because of it. *g*

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

i think it would be useful to pause all units while/before the doom cinematic...
got killed while it was shown, not rlly that funny xD

then, could u add some more help for the hunters after doom? maybe add a requirement for it, like opening the door to north to get help by allied units (controlled by computer), its sometimes hard to avoid the spawned demon troops... just minor help to get away for some more seconds... ^^

moreover, i know it's some minor bug, but you can see the bonus gold (+10 Gold) text message in the fog of the demon knight as hunter... just happened NOT to walk in him because of it. *g*

Units are paused and rendered invulnerable right at the start of the cinematic, I'm not sure how your Hero would have died in Doom. It may have happened at the precise moment before all units are paused.

The Floating Text bug is one I noticed in one of the last times that I was playing. I have found how to fix this and it will indeed be fixed in the next version. Check out the newly created Bug Report Thread for all the known bugs in Against the Darkness.

 

[Andriejj]

Dark Nite, you really can die during the cinematic. Same happened to my friend, Nudl9.

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

Dark Nite, you really can die during the cinematic. Same happened to my friend, Nudl9.

Okay, I will look over the triggers. It shouldn't happen, but there is obviously a hole somewhere.

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

It's easy to solve.
Before the cinematic begins just put all units invulnerable, or you can hide them, so they don't appear =)

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

It's easy to solve.
Before the cinematic begins just put all units invulnerable, or you can hide them, so they don't appear =)

I do already, that is the weird part. This is the trigger actions I have:

• Unit Group - Pick every unit in (Units in (Playable map area)) and do (Actions)
  • Loop - Actions
    • If (All Conditions are True) then do (Then Actions) else do (Else Actions)
      • If - Conditions
        • (Owner of (Picked unit)) Not equal to Neutral Passive
        • (Picked unit) Not equal to Scout Post 0202 <gen>
        • (Picked unit) Not equal to Scout Post 0025 <gen>
        • (Picked unit) Not equal to Obelisk of the Damned 0065 <gen>
      • Then - Actions
        • Unit - Make (Picked unit) Invulnerable
        • Unit - Pause (Picked unit)
      • Else - Actions

It should pause every unit spare the conditioned units them AND make them invulnerable. This is why I was saying it could not happen. Does anyone spot a hole?

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

• Unit Group - Pick every unit in (Units in (Playable map area)) and do (Actions)
  • Loop - Actions
    • Unit - Hide (Picked unit)
    • Wait - Wait 1 seconds
    • Camera - //Start the movie triggers here.
    • Wait - //wait until the movie ends
    • Unit - Unhide (Picked Unit)

Well, you don't need any of those conditions ...
If the objective is to play the movie, then just simply do. Players will pay attention to it, not to the creeps (the won't probably show).

This trigger will work.

 

[Saiyuki]

@Flame:
wouldn't it start the cinematic for each picked unit once? ^^
moreover i dont think wait conditions works in a "pick every.." state/action.

@Dark:
well, why dont u just use "pause on all units"? (sry if the translation went wrong, im using german vers of wc3)
it normally put them all invulnerable.

or just use a
pick every player in all players* + pick every unit by picked player + make picked unit invulnerable **

*maybe adding a matching condition for only player (non computer) based controll
**hell... how do i get this nice gui like u guys? xD

___edit:
i still think you should add better tooltips for the abilities. how should a alchemist (sry, forgot how the hero is named xD) know how good it is to learn alchemy when the tooltip lacks this information? well, nearly every hero ability tooltipp lacks this... so either u played all heroes at max lvl to discover it, ask it the pro gamers in AtD or just play without knowing it...

___edit, 2nd:
if u type "-no hints" then u still get minimap pings when the hints would show up, moreover maybe adding a little message like "Hints won't show up again..." or something like that after disabling them. ^^

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

@Flame:
wouldn't it start the cinematic for each picked unit once? ^^
moreover i dont think wait conditions works in a "pick every.." state/action.

@Dark:
well, why dont u just use "pause on all units"? (sry if the translation went wrong, im using german vers of wc3)
it normally put them all invulnerable.

or just use a
pick every player in all players* + pick every unit by picked player + make picked unit invulnerable **

*maybe adding a matching condition for only player (non computer) based controll
**hell... how do i get this nice gui like u guys? xD

___edit:
i still think you should add better tooltips for the abilities. how should a alchemist (sry, forgot how the hero is named xD) know how good it is to learn alchemy when the tooltip lacks this information? well, nearly every hero ability tooltipp lacks this... so either u played all heroes at max lvl to discover it, ask it the pro gamers in AtD or just play without knowing it...

Use the tags that say

• and put your GUI text in between it. To do this, you right-click the trigger and do Copy as Text. Then close it with a /TRIGGER in between brackets.
• Alchemy - "Study the ancient art of Alchemy, learning how to create two potions for each level learned. Mana cost varies per potion being created."
• It tells you that you will learn how to create 2 new potions per level, and that the mana cost of each potion will vary. Then when you select the level of the ability, it tells you which potions you will be able to create:
• example: Level 1: "Gives the Scientist the ability to create Potions of Haste and Potions of Speed."
• [quote="Saiyuki, post: 367426"]___edit, 2nd:
• if u type "-no hints" then u still get minimap pings when the hints would show up, moreover maybe adding a little message like "Hints won't show up again..." or something like that after disabling them. ^^[/QUOTE]
• okay, thanks for the heads up. I will add it to the bug list and fix it in the next version. I will also perhaps notify the person typing -no hints that they have turned off hints. But I hate text cluttering the screen for players when it is unnecessary, so I will evaluate the necessity of doing so.

 

[Saiyuki]

aah, k, overlooked it (or so it seems), but i still think it would be useful to know it before learning the skill, especially for beginners. ^^

 

[Andriejj]

I forgot about one thing- Nether Walker(edit of spirit walker) has no death anim and does not decay- he stays in his stand position after death.

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

Well you can relax saiuky.
First, my trigger will NOT start the cinematic for each picked unit. A cinematic is a complex of triggers that do not affect simple unit. Their variabçe types and calls are way to different for that to happen. It's 100% safe.

Also, waits only don't work with picked units when they are meant to affect them. I only affect my units to hide them, that's all. Because the movie does not affect the units, the units will be stored in memory (in the form of picked unit) and when i call "Unhide", the computer uses the stored units and unhides them.

However, i don't like GUI. I suggest the use of JASS. Your script leaks Nite, the use of JASS can prevent that.

test my script. It will work. If not, i already have other solution.

post the progress on the work or PM me for more detail.

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

Flame, that is not the entire unit. I use a bj_wantDestroyGroup = true before that pick all units. That was only a tiny part of the trigger, I didn't post the entire thing. Also, the new trigger is completely different (I am almost finished creating the new Doom cinematic at the suggestion of Andriejj. It looks awesome, and I will try to take a video or something and put it up here soon).

Andriejj, the Nether Walker death problem has been added to the Bug Report Thread. I have a fix in mind but I just need to test to see if it works.

 

[Saiyuki]

maybe letting the corpse explode on death? ^^

how about adding some low/lame mini quests like go fishing (capture fish with esnare item) with each fish there would be some kind of counter (via floating text, so u don't need another item slot), for each fish u get 25 G, 15 EXP and +10 max HP, about 5 fishes max at a time on the map, ~12 seconds for respawn. quest would be endless repeatable but maybe adding a walk to take with about max 15 seconds. ^^

oh yes, i think it would be great to implement a stack option for items... u are rlly lucky if u find 2 light potions, but each needs a slot... :\

*for each int a from 1 to 6 do, for each int b for 1 to 6 do, if ( a != b && item carried by trigg unit in slot a is equal to item carried by trigg unit in slot b) then (set counts of item carried by trigg unit in slot a to counts of item carried by trigg unit in slot a + counts of item carried by trigg unit in slot b, remove item carried by trigg unit in slot b

yay, easy to implement i think, but be quite useful. ;-)

*again sry if there are some mistakes in this code *g*

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

Saiyuki, this is a cool idea. I don't want to add recipe systems, but a stacking system would be superb. I never knew you could stack items in a single slot, and I'm still not sure if you can for sure*, but I will look into it. As a backup if you can't stack items how you suggested, I will make an item "Backpack" that will allow you to carry more items in the backpack. That is something I know how to do.

What I mean is, I know I can stack charged items like potions, pumpkins, etc. But can I stack armors and attack boosters? I'm not really sure if that is possible.

 

[Saiyuki]

well im not that nooby with triggering, well im new to jass but thats a matter of time, but i dont have it atm.... (thats a reason why i stopped progressing in my mod, but thats another topic...^^)

well, i just wanted to stack potions, i got this system in my own map (but i just wrote how i thought it was like, u surely know how to let it work ^^) so there shouldn't be big probs with it. perhaps when different potions got diefferent counts left.. well try and error... ^^

btw i dont rlly like a backpack, but thats just my opinion. =)

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

With an item system armors and boosters will NOT stack. item system only allow you to store items for later use. They use variables and some even use cache to store the item value. When you need the item, the value in memory is restored and you have the item back. That is why item system don't make items stack.

Also, about your cinematic, BJ's are EVIL ... (by PP lol).
yes Bj's are evil, and mainly a lot slower.
I suggest you use natives instead of Bj's.

If you want, i can give a look on your cinematics script in order to improve it.

Also, the fishing idea is way very unbalanced ... the DK would had a tremendous advantage - remember that he has more attack, armor and hp than 1 hunter.

Also, for your movie, i suggest that you make the camera shake. In order to simulate havoc =).
Infernals falling from sky also rule.
You should also see w3 camp, as it also has lot's of legion cinematics.

Finally i think you should make an introduction movie. A movie that is a prelude of your mission.

 

[Saiyuki]

well as i said u would need to use the fishing item to fish them out *g*
or can the death knight walk over water? ^^

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

That way, it will be unbalanced as well, because the hunters would become to much strong in order to kill very easily the DK.

It's just unbalanced ... there is no turning back.

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

I don't really see the problem being that it is imbalanced, but just that it does not fit the scenario. I mean, come on! You are on a mission to save all of Azeroth from demonic beings and a crazed Death Knight, but you're going to take time out of your day to fish?

then, could u add some more help for the hunters after doom? maybe add a requirement for it, like opening the door to north to get help by allied units (controlled by computer), its sometimes hard to avoid the spawned demon troops... just minor help to get away for some more seconds...

Just as an update to this, Saiyuki, I am very seriously considering doing something like this. Not quite sure how I'll go about it yet, but I really like the idea. Like you said, they wouldn't be strong enough to kill the Death Knight, but just strong enough to create a little diversion or lend a helping hand. Perhaps they would spawn from the town gate and another area which I could create, and head directly to attack random Burning Fiends or the Death Knight's base.

 

[Saiyuki]

for the quest, well then somethink like "get magic stones", after the quest is enabled there will be a chance of "level of creep * 8%" that they will drop a rune. if u collect up to 5 of them, all hunters will get 250 G, 175 Exp as well as 75 MaxHP. death knight would get 125 G, 100 Exp and a potion. would be the same scheme as the fishing (with floating text).

for the helping: yeah, there could also spawn some units from the village buildings too, maybe adding the kids quest and/or the mercenary quest as requirement for (better) troops. =)

moreover cause i still think its hard to move the first seconds after the demon troops being spawned, as a small help, each hunter could get buffed for 30 seconds, increasing HP Reg by 200%, Mana Reg by 300% and Movement Speed by 15% for the time, so they will get a litte help to break through the troops.

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

moreover cause i still think its hard to move the first seconds after the demon troops being spawned, as a small help, each hunter could get buffed for 30 seconds, increasing HP Reg by 200%, Mana Reg by 300% and Movement Speed by 15% for the time, so they will get a litte help to break through the troops.

This could be possible but I don't know if I see it within the next release (not that it would be hard to do). If I did use it, however, I could tweak it to increase Life and Mana regen by 5% (which is A LOT, 200% would mean they couldn't be damaged at all, even one bit) and make it last only 20 seconds. The buff could be called "Immense Fright". I know for a fact if I did it I wouldn't want it to make them virtually invulnerable. Like I said, I don't know if I like the idea yet though.

 

[UchihaSasuke.gr]

I disagree.They are 9 and when demons rise they shall fight like a team.

 

[Saiyuki]

yeah, i wrote it wrong i know, i meant it like 100% is normal reg, 200% is twice as much, 300% tripple then.

@uchiha: well, about 9 hunters against a high lvl death knight and against about +50 demon troops from all over the map? u sure? not rlly a fight u can always pick on...

btw. after the cinematic, the demons can see u even if u activate windwalk...

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

yeah, i wrote it wrong i know, i meant it like 100% is normal reg, 200% is twice as much, 300% tripple then.

@uchiha: well, about 9 hunters against a high lvl death knight and against about +50 demon troops from all over the map? u sure? not rlly a fight u can always pick on...

btw. after the cinematic, the demons can see u even if u activate windwalk...

Uchiha is right. As little as 2 Hunters can take them all on actually as long as the avoid the Death Knight as long as they have bought sufficient items. Play more often and you shall see! The idea of adding reinforcements will probably not happen, I was kind of letting you make me forget that the Hunters grow very strong well. That is what the point of Doom is. It assumes that the Hunters have become strong enough to kill the Death Knight (which they should be by that time) and serves as a final chance for the Death Knight. It also fits the story behind the map and is a fun, tough challenge for the Death Hunters to play through.

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

Mmm..... I have no comments to say ..Well, uchila is right ... still it you should add better items if you want to make the hunters survive.

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

Mmm..... I have no comments to say ..Well, uchila is right ... still it you should add better items if you want to make the hunters survive.

What are you talking about? Please play some more on battle.net and then bring me more feedback instead of just naming things that you think would make the map better. There are plenty of items that help a Death Hunter to become a beastly Hero. Say, 2 Enchanted Shields and 1 Staff of Natures Might combined with some dropped items from creeps, like a Wolve's Paw.

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

........ ........ .......... .............. ............... ............. ............ ........... I do play your map .... ... just to make sure you know ....... and i am just trying to help, otherwise i wouldn't be posting here.......

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

I understand this, but what you said really holds no water. And if you are going to say something like that, back it up with something! Tell me why you don't think that the items are sufficient and what you think could be done to improve them. Not just that they aren't good enough. Have you checked out the Complete Against the Darkness Item List?

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

I know nearly all your items, i don't know all of them because i don't had the time to test them yet.
Your map has 3 main shops, i already tested 2 of them.

You want facts ?? Well, i think that most of your items are very easy to make. They may be balanced but they are basic. I suggest the creation of complex items, and the use of item black boxes.

Your map is heading to a version where many of it's spells are now nearly professional like (professional spells are too advanced for people like you and me, and only PurplePoot, Wyrmlord or other JASS masters can really create and understand them), and so i think that you should the same with your icons.

I can give you some icon suggestion if you want .... But my points is, that you hunters are good, but they would be better with new special make items.

Also, you seem to be angry to me today !! what's the problem !

 

[1)ark_NiTe]

I know nearly all your items, i don't know all of them because i don't had the time to test them yet.
Your map has 3 main shops, i already tested 2 of them.

You want facts ?? Well, i think that most of your items are very easy to make. They may be balanced but they are basic. I suggest the creation of complex items, and the use of item black boxes.

Your map is heading to a version where many of it's spells are now nearly professional like (professional spells are too advanced for people like you and me, and only PurplePoot, Wyrmlord or other JASS masters can really create and understand them), and so i think that you should the same with your icons.

I can give you some icon suggestion if you want .... But my points is, that you hunters are good, but they would be better with new special make items.

Also, you seem to be angry to me today !! what's the problem !

I'm sorry. I didn't mean to sound angry, I was just frustrated that you were saying something without anything to let me know why you were saying it. Yes the spells are coming along wonderfully, and perhaps better items are next. But the thing is, at this point I am chiefly concerned with making original spells. Until that process is done (which you are helping me with!) then we can talk about fixing items.

Some items will stay basic though, such as armor and attack boosters. I am all for adding complexity to creep dropped items though.

 

[UchihaSasuke.gr]

Items are fairly balanced.The Armor(don't remember name)that gives 425 HP and 10 or 15 armor is maybe one of the best items to start with.Especially if you are a fast creeping hero like Hunter.Then you can easily get it and survive.

 

[Flame_Phoenix]

I know the items are balanced ... the question here is not that. The question is that their complexety need to be improved in order to benefict the map.