Warcraft III - Fall of Draenor

[AIagremm]

What do you think you can do, Joss?

 

[Joss]

Well, I lost all my skinning programs and the skin i made, but I can reinstall and redo the skin, and can create more, if it is in your mind that I do so. I also LOVE to write storyboards and quests, and, of course, I came up with 3 heroes in the past, which were recieved with quite a warm welcome from the entire FoD staff, and perhaps 1 or 2 others. I also was in charge, before my indefinite leave of absence, of recruiting more members to the FoD team, which garnered us 1 voice actor (unsure if he's still around). I'm mildly decent at terraining and acceptable as a triggerer. And, lastly, but not least of course, as a composer, I can write music, which could be used in the game.

 

[AIagremm]

Oh right, sry ^^'
Its been some time. Lately many are returning to us.

Could you remind those heroes? Ok, if you will reinstall kinning programms, do you think you can do a bunch of hard recolors?

Your musical skills will be most useful to us.

 

[Joss]

Of course. I'll search for the prewrites of the heroes.

I'll also get to work writing some sample music.

And, I'll set to reinstalling the skinning programs, and, if I could have a list of skins I could do, I'd set to work on them as soon as possible. However, recolors are the best I can do.

 

[lightning brigade]

it's not done yet, I finished two casters, and the two ground melee, I still have to make one caster, the mechanical unit, the two air units and the one hero I'm using for the campaign(I'll add more later) This is a full race, I'm making it to be like say, a blizzard race, so the campaign is more fun. I'll send you the WIP also, I need to come up with a balanced ability I just made that one on the spot. Well I have to go now, I'll send u the data when I get back(and tell u how to import it. I'll think about that harvesting ability, it's tough because you have to make it based to their culture. Be back soon, bye for now!

 

[knight26]

Im totally helping this project as much as I can, im not a modeler or a skinner, so i guess i can only help by keeping the project on my signature.. :S
anyhow, great idea, i can barely wait for a alpha/beta test or w/e keep working!.

 

[AIagremm]

Thanks! ^^

 

[Deolrin]

Some ideas:

Gold is replaced with either Metal, Crystals, or Stone. Or, perhaps, all of them - like, "Ore" or "Shards" or something. Either will be mined from small deposits scattered across the map. Mining will be much more similar to the way Lumber is harvested - the worker wont enter the chunks\deposits but rather harvest from it. Upkeep will not be used.

Orc: Peons will harvest ore just like regular peons harvest lumber in WC3, same for lumber. Peons can mount a boar from the pig farm, reducing the amount of food provided by that Pig Farm but increasing the peon's attack and movement speed, armor, health and damage.

Ogre: The Ogres will have two kinds of workers - the Masons and the Lumberjacks. The Masons can build structures, mine from deposits and repair, while Lumberjacks would be able to only cut lumber. If the War Forge is built, you will be able to convert Lumberjacks to Axemen, by attaching a second blade to their axe and making the handle longer(so it becomes rather a Battle Axe) and forging some light plate armor for them. Axemen no longer are able to harvest lumber, but are able to deal much more considerable damage and would have much more armor than the Lumberjacks.

Arrakoa: Apostles will be able to summon Slaves(Slaves will be captive Arrakoa, enemies of Terokk, non-believers, rebels). The Apostle must channel if the Slave is to remain under the Apostle's control, held with magical chains and a weak mind control spell. The Slaves can gather resources, but are very vulnerable and weak. In addition, if a slave moves too far from it's Apostle, or if the Apostle stops channeling, the slave turns against the Player, attacking it. Apostles can be ordered to "Unsummon", which will stop channeling but will also unsummon the slave, returning it to... umm... the magical slave-pens which exist somewhere. Apostles can summon buildings very similar to how Undead summon buildings in Warcraft 3, but the Apostle channels while summoning. If the apostle stops channeling or is killed, the building is destroyed(and the resources are returned). Apostles can sacrifice themselves, transforming into Shadowy(or Time-lost) Devotees(or just Apostles), which have a moderately powerful ranged magical attack, but are as vulnerable as they were when they were mere Apostles.

Draenei: The Draenei have two worker types - the Gatherer, which can gather resources and has a weak attack, and the Architect, which can build structures and has an even weaker attack. When an Architect builds a building, it will stay inside it and will slowly repair it when it is damaged(in the cost of resources; the Repair ability is auto-cast, so you can cancel it). You can order the Architect to get out of the building, however this will stop it from being able to auto-repair and it will make the building only half-functional, making training units, researching updates, attacking units(e.g., the tower) and any other activity the building does slower and less effective. Architects can pick up some armor and a war hammer during a battle from the nearest Town Hall(Refuge would be a nice name), while Gatherers can pick up a bow and some arrows. Works like Militia.

 

[lightning brigade]

Actually, I think your on to something. Maybe a few of the less advanced races don't use money. They build with raw materials. We could turn gold mines into ore mines. Then, once it's returned(presumably to a forge) it becomes metal. Lumber can stay the same. That way, they wood and metal, that's a good combo to build a civilization. Think about that.

 

[AIagremm]

I like your Shards idea debode. However I dont think that orcs should have something like that.

Your arakkoa idea is awesome(though I believe you took it from some game like Red Alert or something like that), however to difficult. I thought about Initiates being similar to acolytes, but dying(self-sacrifise) when building a construction with a tree. Also, Apostles are too holy and Christianic for being used in arakkoa race, however since the word means "Student" in ancient greek it may work.

Ogres... in my opinion Slave and his convertion into Axeman are better fitting, yet I believe others have to decide which idea is better.

Your draenei idea though is strange, actually has a lot of potential. If we change it a little bit... also, about the "militia". What if instead of calling them to the town hall, user will use an ability of the town hall which makes a special roar-bloodlust-call to arms effect, making the workers infused with Light and magic making them...

 

[Deolrin]

It could be metal instead. And my Arrakoa idea, I didn't know there was something similar in Red Alert, and yet it shouldn't be too difficult. You could do it so when a worker right-clicks a tree or a deposit, he will automatically come closer to the respective resource and summon the slave. Apostles is a synonym for "Believer" according to www.thesaurus.com. I don't know what is this idea about slaves for ogres, but I'd like to hear it out. My idea for Draenei, how is it strange? I thought we were trying to think about unique ideas, that will make your mod unique?

 

[AIagremm]

Oh sry, I met I like your shards idea, and thne I said that orcs shouldnt have "swine militia", but i kinda messed it up.

Now your arakkoa idea is really interesting! We could make Apostle a warrior unit, who can summon spirits(or slaves) to work on some place like a tree or a deposit, while he is away fighting or building.

Your idea is strange because of the thing that you must leave the Architects inside buildings to make them work and be repaired, but it sounds really interesting as well. If we could refine the idea and make it better, this could be quite good!

 

[lightning brigade]

IMO, we should have a unit that break rocks to get ore as well(assuming we use ore, crystals don't make sense, because people on draenor didn't use crystals, titans used crystals.) So, for example, workers have an ability to gather ore, it's like a harvest ability. It can have an animation and everything! It would add some skill to harvesting gold, or you can put it on autocast. This would probably be used in addition to the gold mine. Hope you like this idea.

 

[Joss]

Today, I'm gonna do some serious thinking, and come up with some ideas. For now; however, I'll be giving 1:

Draenei Building: The Sanctuary
The Sanctuary is the base magical production building for the Draenei. It can train (insert units here), and has multiple upgrades, such as (insert upgrades here). It also has the ability to construct an add-on (similar to Starcraft), called the Library, which has advanced upgrades not just for the magical aspects of the Draenei, but also for the other units under their control. Ideas for units it can train would be the Crystal Mage and/or the Apprentice, who can aspire to be upgraded (individually, not by a "1 Upgrade affects all units" thing) to become a Crystal Mage (or something else, if Crystal Mage is implemented), a Pyromancer, or an Earth-Bound. Pyromancer, obviuosly, deals with fire, and the Earth-Bound is a very slow-moving mage unit with ground-based abilities, and deals high damage to buildings.

More ideas to come.

And, cuz i just cant resist (hope no one posts while I'm typin this up) 1001st POST!!!

 

[Deolrin]

Oh sry, I met I like your shards idea, and thne I said that orcs shouldnt have "swine militia", but i kinda messed it up

Why shouldn't they have 'boar militia'? There's a model for it, and it sounds like a nice idea to me.

Now your arakkoa idea is really interesting! We could make Apostle a warrior unit, who can summon spirits(or slaves) to work on some place like a tree or a deposit, while he is away fighting or building.

Wait, what? The Apostle is the worker unit, he can summon buildings, repair, and summon slaves to harvest. And the point is that he is channeling while the slave gathers, so he can't 'go away and fight or something'.

Your idea is strange because of the thing that you must leave the Architects inside buildings to make them work and be repaired, but it sounds really interesting as well. If we could refine the idea and make it better, this could be quite good!

Refine the idea? How about... The Architect is empowering the building, like, maintaining it like naval engineers maintain submarines.

IMO, we should have a unit that break rocks to get ore as well(assuming we use ore, crystals don't make sense, because people on draenor didn't use crystals, titans used crystals.) So, for example, workers have an ability to gather ore, it's like a harvest ability. It can have an animation and everything! It would add some skill to harvesting gold, or you can put it on autocast. This would probably be used in addition to the gold mine. Hope you like this idea.

There is no UI for a third resource.

 

[Linaze]

I so wonder how this thread got over 1000 replies. There are no awesome screenshots, no awesome art, and it's just... a mess.

 

[AIagremm]

Yes we have more then 1000 posts and more then 20 000 views.

Also, did you check the techtrees that are in our social group?

EDIT:
Sry didnt see the two last posts.
debode, we still have a lot to think about it.

Linaze somehow you are right. Its just... we never post screens, though he we should.

 

[lightning brigade]

No you don't understand, why use crystals? There were no crystals on draenor, thats a misconception. Crystals were on azeroth because of the titans(there are crystals on draenor but that's the naaru architecture) It makes more sense for units like ogres and orcs to use metal to build things, Drainie use crystals because their architect is based off naaru architect, and the arrakoa would use lumber more(although I'm not sure alagremm wants that.

Here's my opinion, different resources for different races. We'll have 3 different types to make 4 combinations.

Ogres:Metal and Lumber
Orcs:Metal and Lumber
Arrakoa:Lumber and (Crystals?, Chemicals?, Metal?)
Draenei:Crystals and Lumber

This is a nice setup but Alagremm gets the final word.

 

[AIagremm]

I think Ore or Shards fits better then:
Metal and Stone for ogres and orcs
Crystals and metal for arakkoa
Metall and draenite/draenethyst crystals for draenei.

 

[Deolrin]

Metal it is, then.

 

[Linaze]

Different resources for different races? Not possible.

 

[lightning brigade]

Different resources for different races? Not possible.

something tells me your not a very good mapmaker... No offense, it's just that at this point, you must know about editing UI. You edit each UI in every map, so you see, we can edit the UI for every race.

 

[supertoinkz]

yes linaze is right
but if our programmer is "advanced", we can

 

[Linaze]

something tells me your not a very good mapmaker... No offense, it's just that at this point, you must know about editing UI. You edit each UI in every map, so you see, we can edit the UI for every race.

Something tells me you are an even worse mapmaker... Either way, I'm not gonna argue with you.

 

[knight26]

Something tells me you are an even worse mapmaker... Either way, I'm not gonna argue with you.

I agree with Linaze on this one, the only way to make different resources for different races in ONE map, is to create a whole triggers system(i saw a smth similar in a map about civilizations or smth.. cant remember), but that is gonna take a lot of time, so I doubt that this will work.. :/
Why dont u just make 2 different resources?

 

[lightning brigade]

Well I was talking about the campaign, what were you talking about....oh....derp... I think their was a miscommunication...

 

[zolga]

ok so do you have a custom ui creator

edit: i checked you do
well to bad

 

[Evillizard]

heh, the ore idea brings back memories of that Starwars RTS game. Good times.

 

[Bernkastel]

As talking of metal.. It'll be gathered from an ore? Or a mine?

 

[AIagremm]

Enough! The resource will be one - ore. But the question is what ore does a race use?
So the ore used by draenei is probably used for metal and crystals, but ogres will hav differnt stuff.

I mean that the resources will be Ore and Lumber. However Im still thinking if its and the whole deposits stuff is a good idea.

 

[Deolrin]

Alagremm, it doesn't makes sense. The "Gold" resource should be replaced with a "Metal"\"Iron" resource, and that's it. And instead of mining from gold mines, I've had an idea where there's an additional building - a storehouse, which is where you drop resources instead of using Town Halls. The first Storehouse you build is free. Deposits of iron ore could be find across the map, scattered. Kind of got the idea from Age of Mythology.

 

[AIagremm]

Storehouse could be the lumberjack/blacksmith for races. This would solve the ogre axeman thingy.
Hm, interesting. FoD will be a complete revolution of Warcraft playing.

 

[Deolrin]

But Blacksmiths\Lumber-mills(Lumberjack is a man who cuts trees :/) are very costly, and also provide upgrades...

 

[AIagremm]

Then it should be the storehouse and ogre axeman.

Actually I think that your ideas of total recretion are just great! We arent making some mod now... we are creating almost another game!
We should change the buildings, units and gameplay considerably. We already have rams instead of catapults. But we need more radical changes!

 

[lightning brigade]

Hmmmm...Would there be a way to add more strategy... I had an idea for a game called macrowars. The point is the game makes all the units smaller and slower so the map seems much bigger... If you do that to each map it makes the map space seem bigger and much more widely spaced. This allows for more tactics. Better tactics should be the goal of our mod's radical changes.

 

[AIagremm]

Well we wont make units smaller, but tactics will be important part of the gameplay, since there wont be much flying units or catapults.

 

[kingbdogz]

Hi guys I would just like to say good luck with your project. I'm curious though; how much in percentage have you progressed? (in terms of modding the mpq's data, not actual gameplay). I've found a way to move in-game UI and main menu UI. Quite cool stuff.

 

[AIagremm]

Hm, personally I think we have about 6% of models and other stuff done. However w havent sarted modding the mpq yet.

Also I know there easy ways to change UI and main menu UI, but you might have found some other way.

 

[kingbdogz]

Hm, personally I think we have about 6% of models and other stuff done. However w havent sarted modding the mpq yet.

Also I know there easy ways to change UI and main menu UI, but you might have found some other way.

I don't mean just changing the skin of the UI, I mean literally changing the way it works. For example, I have made a modification that makes the in-game UI a side-bar similar to Command & Conquer's:

It's very buggy though, so I still have to work on it.

 

[AIagremm]

Wow this is very impressive. And all of the buttons work?

 

[kingbdogz]

Wow this is very impressive. And all of the buttons work?

Kind of.. The minimap buttons don't work at all. Only the left side of the middle section works (where it shows what units are selected). and the portraits are displayed in there original area even though I've relocated them. Like I said it is very buggy, and the only thing that works perfectly is the buttons for commands and building units/using spells (like move, patrol, build, train "unit", etc).

EDIT: I made a photoshop image of what I hope to make it look like at one stage. This will not be the UI for Warcraft IV: The Edge of Eternity though, it is only a session to see how far I can push the engine.

 

[AIagremm]

Wow this is impressive. I know that Warcraft engine can be easily modified, but this! This is just close to being impossible.

 

[kingbdogz]

Wow this is impressive. I know that Warcraft engine can be easily modified, but this! This is just close to being impossible.

It might be, but I don't know. It seems kind of impossible to fix the button issues atm.

 

[AIagremm]

Well it seems logical.

 

[lightning brigade]

WOW! that's all I have to say king... I think by replacing the UI objects in the mpq we can achieve something similar. We should start brainstorming how we could make it possible.

Adviceon't push yourself ahead of your limits yet. Try getting a demo alpha then we know we've achieved a milemark. It raises morale and gives us the ability to pick up on it any time it's been left off. The demo should be the races quite frankly replacing warcraft's and a new UI then we can make it as complicated as we want.

You might want to read through this old post to find why most great projects fail. You might have to dig a little but you'll find it if you read through it.

 

[Cthulus]

No need to sound so negative, lightning xD
Progress is looking good to me, actually. I'm still waiting for a scanner or at least a webcam..

 

[dab]

Kind of.. The minimap buttons don't work at all. Only the left side of the middle section works (where it shows what units are selected). and the portraits are displayed in there original area even though I've relocated them. Like I said it is very buggy, and the only thing that works perfectly is the buttons for commands and building units/using spells (like move, patrol, build, train "unit", etc).

EDIT: I made a photoshop image of what I hope to make it look like at one stage. This will not be the UI for Warcraft IV: The Edge of Eternity though, it is only a session to see how far I can push the engine.

Should be do-able.. I will have to study it through, tho, as I'm not sure how to do so(inside of the mpq)

 

[Bernkastel]

If you are going to do that, i'm going to have a break for a while then.

 

[MogulKahn]

I dont like that man.Dont change it.Very ugly for eyes.

 

[Erader]

I agree with MogulKahn,just because you can do something doesn't mean you should do it!