Terrain Classes

[Talavaj]

Uh, and what exactly is there to teach ? Terraining is not a knowledge.
People could be taught the tools at max, such as the purpose of pg up/pg down pitch angles and such plus some tricks that make things efficiently but that is already covered in the guides.
That is all there is to it, "teaching" people to make things not float and group things in clusters instead of spamming everything everywhere is not teaching, those things are more a matter of common sense.
If the person can't tell his creation is ugly the effort is instantly a lost cause.

It is like trying to teach people how to build with lego bricks.

 

[InfernalTater]

Pretty sure we only need Ralle's permission for it to be official.

There's nothing in the rules saying we're not allowed to teach people how to do things.

Anyway, yeah, I'l record a little video footage of some terrain I've made. My best work is gone, though, hard drive got fried. Only stuff I have now is the recent, incomplete stuff, but you can still at least be able to see that I know what I'm doing.

 

[Binsu]

Looking forward, bro!

 

[sonofjay]

Cool idea guys wish you goodluck but here are some basic fundamentals that you might need.. a wild imagination, innovative and a bunch of patience.

But I still think that learning on your own is a cool thing cause you can develop your own style that way. Well its just my thoughts.

 

[InfernalTater]

Alright, here you go! It's not my best work; lost that from my hard drive getting fried a while back. Here's some of what I've been working on lately. It's all incomplete, but you can still sort of get an idea of what I do.

 

[Binsu]

The video is set private. Try making it public, bro. =)

 

[InfernalTater]

The video is set private. Try making it public, bro. =)

Oops, sorry about that. It's public now.

 

[Binsu]

Terrain looks good tho there are some flaws such as:

• Terrain is empty
• Some tiles have weird way of blending with the tile or in another words, tiles doesnt blend that great with other tiles.
• Water from waterfall should not flow directly into the ground. Put a water where it can land.
• Looks flat maybe it can still raised and lowered

Sorry for this but I am just explaining the flaw hope you are not offended or anything. But not to worry because its just a WiP! Cheers

 

[DESTROYER123]

Some parts of it look really good though!

 

[mckill2009]

@Talavaj

Creativity, I have in terraining but application is what I'm missing, how can I get it out of my brain and do it in WC3 Editor?,
it's like you're imagining a very lovely woman and you want to draw her, but your hands cannot, therefore you must learn how to draw...

How to do this?, make a basic terrain then teach them how to improve and make it super awesome...the be a judge...

 

[MasterTrainer]

^ There's a basic technique; well this is what I do: start with a completely small terrain (64x64), use the raise tool randomly around the map really, really fast, then once I have a completely deformed surface, I start to smooth it up, put in the tilesets, then some doodads. If I like what I see, I expand the map even further.

 

[InfernalTater]

Terrain looks good tho there are some flaws such as:

• Terrain is empty
• Some tiles have weird way of blending with the tile or in another words, tiles doesnt blend that great with other tiles.
• Water from waterfall should not flow directly into the ground. Put a water where it can land.
• Looks flat maybe it can still raised and lowered

Sorry for this but I am just explaining the flaw hope you are not offended or anything. But not to worry because its just a WiP! Cheers

The terrain was nowhere near complete; this wasn't meant to show off my abilities. It was just so you could get a basic idea of some of what I do.

And about the waterfall:

1: The water didn't go straight into the ground. All of the waterfalls I'd shown you traveled into another body of water.

2: Water actually CAN go directly into the ground. There are lots of caves with waterfalls going through them because despite what you say, it's actually possible for a waterfall to go straight into the ground.

 

[Binsu]

The terrain was nowhere near complete; this wasn't meant to show off my abilities. It was just so you could get a basic idea of some of what I do.

And about the waterfall:

1: The water didn't go straight into the ground. ALl of the waterfalls I'd shown you traveled into another body of water.

2: Water actually CAN go directly into the ground. There are lots of caves with waterfalls going through them because despite what you say, it's actually possible for a waterfall to go straight into the ground.

Didnt know that and that is a good point.

 

[InfernalTater]

^ There's a basic technique; well this is what I do: start with a completely small terrain (64x64), use the raise tool randomly around the map really, really fast, then once I have a completely deformed surface, I start to smooth it up, put in the tilesets, then some doodads. If I like what I see, I expand the map even further.

That's similar to what I do, but I always start with the maximum size, and then just shrink it down later. If you start small, and hit a boundary, it will look very awkward and difficult to repair after you try to expand it to a larger size.

 

[Rui]

Could have some for StarCraft II as well.

I'd be more interested in modeling lessons^^

 

[MasterTrainer]

We're posting terrains anyway so... I thought I'd let you guys know what I'm capable of:

Hidden

The ruins of a once great city has been now overgrown with shrubs and forestry

 

[mckill2009]

Ok, ok calm down guys, TLI-Inferno's terrain was not bad, he said it's no whre near complete, now about starting point,
I always start with deep water then just raise it...the problem would be 'decorations' like rocks, shrubs, grass, flowers, etc...
where's is the best place to put those?, that's the kind of stuffs I wanna learn...

MasterTrainer's pic is good but the land is flat...

In any case we should wait until further notice about this idea...

 

[MasterTrainer]

^ Thanks for the comment; I know it's a little flat; I just rushed it so I can save time. It'll be super-edited later.

 

[Binsu]

From my Terrain WiPs in Terrain Board:

Click!

Still working on it and not taking pictures near boundaries.

 

[mckill2009]

^ Thanks for the comment; I know it's a little flat; I just rushed it so I can save time. It'll be super-edited later.

Means you created just now?, that's fast!

 

[MasterTrainer]

It's my technique I just told you earlier.

^ There's a basic technique; well this is what I do: start with a completely small terrain (64x64), use the raise tool randomly around the map really, really fast, then once I have a completely deformed surface, I start to smooth it up, put in the tilesets, then some doodads. If I like what I see, I expand the map even further.

But in this case, instead of the raise tool I started immediately with the doodads.

 

[Lordkoon]

Can I assist with something in those lessons? Altho all basic and most advanced techniques are already implemented as tutorials... I can offer my asistance when it comes to playable terrains.

Here are some samples from the last few months and years.

Estate

1

2

3

Illum

1

Underworld

1

2

3

4

5

My long-term StarWars project(map1)

1

 

[DESTROYER123]

I believe that we need to create applications.
First of all we will need people to moderate the applications.
If someone wants to apply as a teacher he must create a decent terrain and show it here.
And if someone wants to apply as a student he must create the best terrain he is cappable to make in order to give us his current state of his terraining knowledge.

 

[Ralle]

Holy shit guys. Why don't we just say that this thread is now a terrain class in itself?

Why does this need to be official for you guys to start teaching each others how to terrain? The terrain forum is not very active, so why not just start there and make a Terrain Class thread. Name how things will be run and post content. You don't need me to approve a thing. If this gets big, we can make arrangements in regards to forums and what not.

 

[DESTROYER123]

So this means we go to the Terrain forum and get da party started?

 

[Gilles]

I don't really understand what this whole teaching thing is about. How does someone teach you terrain over the internet? Seems like tutorials and videos would be the best, which we have.

If you want to get better at terrain, start terraining and post your photos on the terrain forum. I'm active again (for a time), and can help you guys out.

I'll give you three major rules.
1. Study the best terrains. What do they do differently than you.
2. Find the right angle. With terrain art, it's all about the angle. If this is a playable terrain, angle still helps if you're taking pictures, but is less important.
3. This is most important. SPEND TIME. If you look at fladdermasken's terrains, how long do you think they take? A few hours? A few days? A week? I'd hazard a guess that it varies, but generally I would say around 5 hours minimum. Often more.

 

[Ralle]

I think what makes this fun is the group thing. "Let's all watch this YouTube video together" or let's all read this tutorial and post what we did and think. A class is merely a group of people doing the same at the same time or in the same place.

 

[fladdermasken]

Fladdered that you want me for it, but Gilles pretty much nailed it. A major factor I see people fail at constantly is way too little effort put into it. Never terrain average joe, terrain extraordinary joseph. The difference between try and triumph is just that tiny little umph!

You could start weekly challenges again too, that's not a bad idea. I could do the themes and maybe judge a bit half heartedly.

EDIT: If I remember it I could try and record myself doing some simple scene to show how lighting pretty much makes all the difference.
Maybe for the first challenge.

 

[InfernalTater]

Learning to terrain just comes down to motivation. I did it on my own, but some people need guidance, and the encouragement of active interaction with a teacher as well as other students will often help them to keep trying until they've got it down.

Anyway, I suppose since I'm the teacher, I'll organize a "lesson plan" or something, later.

Anyone else who wants to help teach, just send me a message. I'll give it time, one week, for other teachers to volunteer

One week from now I'll make a new thread which I will link to from here, and that thread will be open for another week while the teachers set up their plans and students sign up for taking the classes. After that week, from that thread, it will link to a new thread in the terraining section where the actual classes will begin. That thread will also link to a communication thread where students can ask questions. Why the different threads? Well, I want to keep things separated so that students can find all of the information in one place without having to sift through communications.

Fladdered that you want me for it, but Gilles pretty much nailed it. A major factor I see people fail at constantly is way too little effort put into it. Never terrain average joe, terrain extraordinary joseph. The difference between try and triumph is just that tiny little umph!

You could start weekly challenges again too, that's not a bad idea. I could do the themes and maybe judge a bit half heartedly.

EDIT: If I remember it I could try and record myself doing some simple scene to show how lighting pretty much makes all the difference.
Maybe for the first challenge.

Alrighty, I hope you'll teach your stuff! But lighting shouldn't be in the beginning; lighting belongs closer to the end.

Once you decide for sure that you'll be there to teach, I'll have you down as confirmed.

Confirmed Teachers:

TLI-Inferno
Lordkoon
Footman16

Possible Teachers:

fladdermasken

 

[mckill2009]

I did it on my own, but some people need guidance

That's the whole purpose of this thread, to teach what are the dos and donts to terrain making...

@Gilles
The problem is challenge and motivation, there is no challenge if we just do it on our own, e.g. can you imagine if this site has only 5 active members?...
Yes there are a terraining contest but we are not allowed to ask questions on how to make it more awesome in that thread,
in short we are alone in making that, also the deadline is quite long, while in threads like this, we can reply our suggestions almost everyday...

Lordkoon and fladdermasken maybe a teacher also...

 

[MasterTrainer]

Shit I leave the thread for 5 hours and this is what happens. By reading pages 5-6, I picked up that this thread is now officially the terrain class. If so, who are the faculty members?

Okay, it took me a while because I had to do some triggering but I was finally able to finish the ruins:

Hidden

I added more trees, flowers, shrubs, and added some destroyed houses

 

[InfernalTater]

Shit I leave the thread for 5 hours and this is what happens. By reading pages 5-6, I picked up that this thread is now officially the terrain class. If so, who are the faculty members?

Okay, it took me a while because I had to do some triggering but I was finally able to finish the ruins:

Hidden

I added more trees, flowers, shrubs, and added some destroyed houses

Still needs height variation.

 

[Binsu]

It needs more of a size to the trees because it is mostly same with the doodads and shurbs there. Make the trees bigger.

Also it is flat, try using the raise/lower tool to make different levels in the ground.

 

[MasterTrainer]

Done. Though any more resizing of the trees and all camera views break.

Hidden

 

[Binsu]

Looks better but I guess your right, the trees did really blocked the view of one of the church. Try reducing the trees in that area, good luck!

 

[MasterTrainer]

That's the purpose of an overgrown forest in the ruins of a village.

 

[Binsu]

Good point. But nice terrain =)

 

[Almia]

Terraining, me wants to learn.

 

[Binsu]

Me want to be a great terrainer.

 

[MasterTrainer]

Me want to teach what I know

 

[mckill2009]

Ok now guys, here's my terrain made a long time ago, any suggestions and improvements?...

 

[Binsu]

Looks really good tho it is quite flat and also it needs decor at the water.

 

[MasterTrainer]

Ok now guys, here's my terrain made a long time ago, any suggestions and improvements?...

-Raise the area on the top of the falls
-See the part of the cliff that is showing between the falling water? Remove that and replace it with rocks
-Remove the rocks that are in the lake and replace them with some river rushes, lily pads, and seaweeds.
-You may want to add some fog
-Add more life (i.e. birds, deer, frogs, fish)

That's it for now.

Oh and this is what I meant by my second suggestion:

Hidden

I made this for my project:

 

[Binsu]

Yeah agreed, looks lifeless without birds and animal as such.

 

[mckill2009]

see? that's what teachers are here for, giving tips...but what kind of decor and maybe the waterfall is flat you mean?...

 

[Kaizer]

Me apply for student

@MasterTrainer you should really be a teacher here

 

[MasterTrainer]

@mckill2009 See my previous post: after raising the waterfall's peak, add some rocks, shrubs, river rushes, lily pads, flowers, etc.

 

[Binsu]

see? that's what teachers are here for, giving tips...but what kind of decor and maybe the waterfall is flat you mean?...

It needs more doodads on seas such as maybe corals.... Also make those ponds a little bigger also.

And as what MT said, add birds, deers and animals as such to add life to the terrain.

Make the tiles smooth to make it blend well on. Just try re ordering tiles in Modifying Tileset and it will do the trick.

 

[mckill2009]

OMG! this is much more hard than learn how to code! lolz...

 

[Binsu]

Meheheheh...... you betcha! >