[Aeon of Strife] [Planned Project] Protection of the Cheese

[Doomlord]

Greetings members of Hive, all those who may or may not know me.

Originally, I intend to stay off the path of mapmaking during my modding ventures around here. However an idea suddenly stroke me a few days prior and I presumed that it could work out somehow. The basic of this project is a parody of the AoS genre in general. To put it in a sentence "AoS with a (unhealthy) dose of humor and comedy". Imagine a child born of AoS and slapstick cartoons. Well I hope you get the idea in general. Of course I plan to keep the balance and preserve the core principles of an AoS map to avoid turning this into a total laughstock. Kinda influenced heavily by Team Fortress 2 I guess.

I am making this thread to inquire for your feedback and opinions concerning this idea. Oh and don't mind the name, I made it up in 5 seconds for completion's sake. It will change when this idea gets enough T-up to be carried out.

I am also sorry for the thread being in shambles, I just think that an idea doesn't need that much formatting and spicing. And yeah if you feel like I am not ready for mapmaking (did I mention I don't know how to terrain?), feel free to speak up. I am willing to listen to all criticism.

Just one last thing, as this is a (planned) project, I am looking for a (decent if possible) team so if you feel like it, contact me and we will work out the details.

Thank you for reading and have a nice day!

Update

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/.../protection-cheese-recruitment-thread-236955/

Recruitment thread is up everybody

 

[Binsu]

I like the idea of the AOS having some dose of humor and at the same time, not having too much humor.

Firstly, you will need a intro story on why this AOS or war occurred. In every way, there is a reason. I cant think of yet because I cant yet imagine an AOS having some Humors.

Second, if we know the story, the terrain will come next. Maybe I can help you a little in here but we should first cover the story that is.

Third, the other prinicples in AOS will come but first, the story and terrain should come first.

 

[Almia]

Hmmm.
I think I'll assemble my rats.

 

[MasterTrainer]

Going to post a full feedback later

 

[Doomlord]

I like the idea of the AOS having some dose of humor and at the same time, not having too much humor.

Firstly, you will need a intro story on why this AOS or war occurred. In every way, there is a reason. I cant think of yet because I cant yet imagine an AOS having some Humors.

Second, if we know the story, the terrain will come next. Maybe I can help you a little in here but we should first cover the story that is.

Third, the other prinicples in AOS will come but first, the story and terrain should come first.

Yes yes I will add a story later. As I said this is only an idea thread so the quality isn't that decent.

Hmmm.
I think I'll assemble my rats.

Eh? I am sorry I can't understand what you mean to say.

 

[Almia]

Protection of the Cheese
I am your enemeh!

 

[Da Fist]

Eherm. I think that the best story is that a child imagined about an AoS, which resulted to this map.

Random events that may occur on the child, e.g. P.E. class, buffed creeps for x seconds, Math class, everybody is slowed for x seconds, or Wild Dreams, the heroes cannot auto attack, rather, he/she can only utilize his/her skills. This would be a optional mode, of course.

On the other point you want to implement is humor. Humor is a hefty card to put on a AoS. I dunno how you would pull this out, but I know one thing, humor is always unexpected, witty, and well, funny. The one problem in humor in AoS is it becomes nasty after a few playthroughs, so as I said earlier, I dunno how you would pull this out ( yes, quite redundant, I know ).

Good luck.

 

[Doomlord]

Protection of the Cheese
I am your enemeh!

Oooookay...

Eherm. I think that the best story is that a child imagined about an AoS, which resulted to this map.

Random events that may occur on the child, e.g. P.E. class, buffed creeps for x seconds, Math class, everybody is slowed for x seconds, or Wild Dreams, the heroes cannot auto attack, rather, he/she can only utilize his/her skills. This would be a optional mode, of course.

On the other point you want to implement is humor. Humor is a hefty card to put on a AoS. I dunno how you would pull this out, but I know one thing, humor is always unexpected, witty, and well, funny. The one problem in humor in AoS is it becomes nasty after a few playthroughs, so as I said earlier, I dunno how you would pull this out ( yes, quite redundant, I know ).

Good luck.

Thank you for the idea. I will take it into consideration. I already have a story in mind but I can still reuse some elements. And yes I will try my best.

 

[Daffa]

not a bad idea, I got nothing to say for now.

 

[Formula1]

Do you want an in depth aos hidden under a horrendously comedic exterior?

 

[Doomlord]

Do you want an in depth aos hidden under a horrendously comedic exterior?

Yes, that is what I have in mind. Horrendous or not is open to question though. Would you be kind enough to open my eyes to some facts that I am not aware of? This is my first project so I honestly don't expect myself to be on the right track.

 

[Binsu]

Ok, I am just starting to realize that pulling up a AOS with a mix of humours is kind of unfit and hard. Maybe if you are up to making the game silly like Humans vs Rabbits or somehow like that... you can pull off a humorous AOS and everything will follow.

 

[Doomlord]

Ok, I am just starting to realize that pulling up a AOS with a mix of humours is kind of unfit and hard. Maybe if you are up to making the game silly like Humans vs Rabbits or somehow like that... you can pull off a humorous AOS and everything will follow.

What makes you think so? Do you know Team Fortress 2? Do you think FPS can become comedic?

As I said this is only an idea. Why are you the one getting cold feet instead of me?

 

[Binsu]

Its just my idea actually its hard to pull off but Im not stopping you....lol. I didnt expect you to get mad on me as far s I can see from you... Well I apologize if there is misunderstandings here.

 

[Doomlord]

I am not mad =)) I just want to inquire about what makes you think it is bad to carry out my idea.

 

[Binsu]

Well, I just gave my idea, if you are ready to make it silly, yes you can do one. =))

 

[Doomlord]

A poll has been created. Vote if you feel like it.

 

[I_am_Death]

Sorry for the "No" answer
i just can say this: "make good and fast, plz "

 

[Binsu]

Voted Yes. We just need some valid and abundant of great ideas to pull this one. =)

 

[Doomlord]

Sorry for the "No" answer
i just can say this: "make good and fast, plz "

I don't plan to do a fastfood map. Play DotA if you want a "good and fast" game. This is not the kind of map you are looking for I am afraid.

 

[GreeN!X]

Hey this is a nice idea. Adding humor to a map is a pretty hard thing to do. I voted YES because this is a pretty unique idea and the title made laugh a little.

Since you're a pretty good coder, I think you can pull of an AOS map. The thing that you should focus on is how you're gonna implement the humor part of the map. Usually jokes are only fun at first but will make you sick after a few times reading it again. So I suggest adding a lot of them and putting most of them in secret places like item descriptions, some kind of silly side quest, mini game, etc. Oh and maybe some funny sound effects or SFXs to add some slapstic into it. x3

 

[Binsu]

To add, item descriptions with funny humours in it.

 

[Doomlord]

Hey this is a nice idea. Adding humor to a map is a pretty hard thing to do. I voted YES because this is a pretty unique idea and the title made laugh a little.

Since you're a pretty good coder, I think you can pull of an AOS map. The thing that you should focus on is how you're gonna implement the humor part of the map. Usually jokes are only fun at first but will make you sick after a few times reading it again. So I suggest adding a lot of them and putting most of them in secret places like item descriptions, some kind of silly side quest, mini game, etc. Oh and maybe some funny sound effects or SFXs to add some slapstic into it. x3

Oh thank you. I am quite sure you will laugh your socks off =)) Humor will be everywhere. Death messages, sound sfx, item descriptions, etc. and, of course, random surprises and trolling. I will avoid repetition ofc.

 

[MiniMage]

It's an interesting idea. But I can't really participate in the project due to be preoccupied with my own project, but yeah, it's an interesting idea. ;P

 

[Doomlord]

It's an interesting idea. But I can't really participate in the project due to be preoccupied with my own project, but yeah, it's an interesting idea. ;P

Thank you for replying and voting. It is not a problem )

 

[Daffa]

Carry it out or I'll have these poor mice pack to bite you, they're hungry for cheese

 

[I_am_Death]

ah, i mean is "good, and fast if you can"

 

[Faith]

Okay, I personally think this can be done.
I have faith in your skills and I know you can find good people to help you. c:

However, I'd like to point out that it will be extremely hard.

-You'll have to keep on track throughout the map, which WILL be difficult at times.
-Humor is great, but it still has to make sense. You can't just have a bunch of random jokes everywhere and expect people to laugh.
-Keep placement of these jokes, and content, in mind throughout creation.
-Enlist a team. Team members can help keep you on track and can provide a variety of opinions. A map like this will need that diversity to continue.

There may be other things that come up and you'll have to deal with them, just don't give up and work and you'll be fine.

 

[DZerpic]

As most, I think is a good idea yet hard to pull off.

The fun and dumb interaction between players and different game modes is what, I think, makes TF2 so special, but AOS is a hard genre to pull of due to it's heavy competitiveness.

Think of the core mechanics of the genre itself and try to twist them around. The Heroes are essential to it. They not only make the game what it is; they are also the game's 'face', what the players relate to the most.

The basic story is also important. Maybe play around the fact that the most important AOS are set in medieval fantasy and make a parody version of it, or create something entirely different. The world it's set into has to be intentionally funny, it has to be built around that concept, parody and fun.

The most repetitive kind of joke is the one that's verbally told, like a character saying something stupid. Those are the last ones you should focus on, imo. Think of Plants vs. Zombies. None of them speak but after hours of playing you still laugh at the Michael Jackson zombie or the Cone-head zombie. Also, their 'funny aspect' goes hand in hand with their gameplay mechanics. For example, the Bucket-head zombie is tougher because he has a Bucket in his head! The walnut gets sadder the more it's hurt. The repeater has a badass look because he shoots two peas instead of one. Etc.

After characters and world come the descriptions for the items and the heroes. Here you can put actual written jokes because it's only going to be read once or twice.

 

[Formula1]

Aos's as it is tends to be farming with fear in early game
Then leading to team based gangks
Then leading to a race/stealing of powerful items to either get back into the game or to finish it off

Towers provide a minimum game time and give people confidence and safety in their own areas

Im going to talk alot in threes since its kind of a magic number to me in ways

Hero choices are interesting in that at different levels of play you want different things
1) new players look for something that is safe. Range provides safety, health and defense peovides safety also opponents being afraid to kill the unit provides safety. Likewise they look for power and stability. Where at some point they will dominate the board

2) then we have role players. Role players play their specific tole such as...
-carry-weak early game, dominant late game
-bully-strong early game, vulnerable lategame
-support-they arent strong alone (about .75 the strength of a normal hero), but amplify allies to 1.75. This makes thrir combined force 2.5 instead of just 2

3) team work. This requires recognition of hang bang opportunities, different players compensating for eachother and a sort of idea of team chemistry where the team is stronger thsn the single. However splash spells make situations more wary in that players cant just bunch and think they'll be ok. This is probably the most difficult to balance in that mass nuke focus firinf has very little mana investment and requires little communication. However, if theres ever a point an esports crowd is screaming, its times like these


Ok so thats psychology skillgaps, now im going to go into action skill gaps
1) micromanagement. What makes good wc3 and sc1 players is micromanagement. The more you can manage, it generally means the better of a playrr you are. As a result, high summon heroes should be the most powerful, though forcing each unit ro have an ability of some sort will make sure the power is in truelly micro instead of just a moving

2) decisions. Farm or gang? Fear or be feared. The more decisions a player has to make, it generally means the player makes good decisions. However, sometimes its good to test you opponents decision making skills. Things like bluffs or putting them in lesser of two evils type scenarios will make the game exciting and each interaction not just "another day in an aos" but make s person think theyre freakin genius

3) risk reward. Sometimes you just gotta take a risk to get ahead. This may cone from investing into a very cyclopean item or running at you opponents planning a suicide mission hoping they dont realize it or dont have the mana to kill you. Desperate times calls for desperate measures. However, anytime is a good time for a dollar bet. Small edges may eventually win you games

Now for spellcasting aspects
1) reaction time. Reaction time is the sort of thing that either comes from defending against a windwalked player or in a more generic sense having a .5 second leeway to cast an ability that can only be casted at a random point in a three second span of time. Resident evil 4 had some. In any case. The important part is some people are just terrible at them and sometimes they are necessary to balance out powerful spells

2) rhythim. Some people got it, white people dont. The important part is giving people opportunity to enjoy it

3) spam. This hard to do in wc3 in that there is a lag. But its a skill, a simple one, but at least makes people feel like they did something.


Theres unit specific balamcing and stat aspects, but this is prolly enough for now.

Done on iphone while biking at the gym

Also making sure a player can always do something besides watch their hero attack or run from point a to point b allows for another element of fun where you can always win a little bit more by pennies.

And i'll help you with a few abilities but im a bit busy with a bunch of other things to be a driving force

 

[WolfFarkas]

Done on iphone while biking at the gym

Really??????????????????????????? XD

i admire your wall of text (in the good meaning) you separated well in parts and used numbers to make it nice to read

about the map,
if the game play and the scripting is perfect, who cares the tematic it can be anything

voting for yeah do it

 

[Doomlord]

Okay, I personally think this can be done.
I have faith in your skills and I know you can find good people to help you. c:

However, I'd like to point out that it will be extremely hard.

-You'll have to keep on track throughout the map, which WILL be difficult at times.
-Humor is great, but it still has to make sense. You can't just have a bunch of random jokes everywhere and expect people to laugh.
-Keep placement of these jokes, and content, in mind throughout creation.
-Enlist a team. Team members can help keep you on track and can provide a variety of opinions. A map like this will need that diversity to continue.

There may be other things that come up and you'll have to deal with them, just don't give up and work and you'll be fine.

Thank you for sharing your feedback and opinions. Much appreciated. I will keep them in mind and of course a team will be assembled.

As most, I think is a good idea yet hard to pull off.

The fun and dumb interaction between players and different game modes is what, I think, makes TF2 so special, but AOS is a hard genre to pull of due to it's heavy competitiveness.

Think of the core mechanics of the genre itself and try to twist them around. The Heroes are essential to it. They not only make the game what it is; they are also the game's 'face', what the players relate to the most.

The basic story is also important. Maybe play around the fact that the most important AOS are set in medieval fantasy and make a parody version of it, or create something entirely different. The world it's set into has to be intentionally funny, it has to be built around that concept, parody and fun.

The most repetitive kind of joke is the one that's verbally told, like a character saying something stupid. Those are the last ones you should focus on, imo. Think of Plants vs. Zombies. None of them speak but after hours of playing you still laugh at the Michael Jackson zombie or the Cone-head zombie. Also, their 'funny aspect' goes hand in hand with their gameplay mechanics. For example, the Bucket-head zombie is tougher because he has a Bucket in his head! The walnut gets sadder the more it's hurt. The repeater has a badass look because he shoots two peas instead of one. Etc.

After characters and world come the descriptions for the items and the heroes. Here you can put actual written jokes because it's only going to be read once or twice.

Thanks very much for your feedback. This is indeed a valuable piece for me. Thanks again

<Insightful and awesome text>

This is the most thoughtful and in-depth thing I have ever read. Thank you very much for your awesomeness.

Really??????????????????????????? XD

i admire your wall of text (in the good meaning) you separated well in parts and used numbers to make it nice to read

about the map,
if the game play and the scripting is perfect, who cares the tematic it can be anything

voting for yeah do it

Thank you for providing feedback.

 

[Binsu]

Agreed with a user here saying that humours should not be overused because some humours are not that funny, annoying to get with and such... so just to give some tips, be sure when using humourous words statements in your map, be careful on choosing such statements because one wrong statement and that might change the player's mood. Instead of laughing, they might be angry or such. So the main point of here is not to take humours that seriosuly because there are some things that makes humours bad.

Actually, we dont need to make the AOS too much funny or humourous because remember even in the most serious AOS there are some funny aspects, take the unit's soundset for example. Each of them has this funny sounds they make.

Also, the way you make your AIs sometimes when they act weird or funny, that is already funny to some.

Now, you'll just have to think and possible think out of the box to gather some more ideas to make your AOS funny and I can see many gave you already.

 

[Doomlord]

Agreed with a user here saying that humours should not be overused because some humours are not that funny, annoying to get with and such... so just to give some tips, be sure when using humourous words statements in your map, be careful on choosing such statements because one wrong statement and that might change the player's mood. Instead of laughing, they might be angry or such. So the main point of here is not to take humours that seriosuly because there are some things that makes humours bad.

Actually, we dont need to make the AOS too much funny or humourous because remember even in the most serious AOS there are some funny aspects, take the unit's soundset for example. Each of them has this funny sounds they make.

Also, the way you make your AIs sometimes when they act weird or funny, that is already funny to some.

Now, you'll just have to think and possible think out of the box to gather some more ideas to make your AOS funny and I can see many gave you already.

Alright thank you very much I got it. I will be recruiting idea men to create a suitable balance.

 

[Formula1]

Really??????????????????????????? XD

i admire your wall of text (in the good meaning) you separated well in parts and used numbers to make it nice to read

about the map,
if the game play and the scripting is perfect, who cares the tematic it can be anything

voting for yeah do it

Thanks i really apreciate it
Thats kinda how i feel about. If its a great game, people will see the over the top humor more as an additive than a distraction
As someone with a lot of mechanic ideas but few stories. Slapping on a half assed story thats a lot of fun is sort of an ego thing, simply because i am so focused on gameplay and if games are fun story is unecessary imo

Ssb did something interesting though where story was a much bigger picture and metaphorical and yet nonexdistant

 

[WolfFarkas]

Ssb did something interesting though where story was a much bigger picture and metaphorical and yet nonexdistant

offtopic

yea aaa ?? ¿¿¡

footnote to the page?

what the hell means nonexdistant?? no results in my translator XD

in topic
something halorius for an AOS can be the reverse world where all is reverse
for exmaple the footman wins on the knigth, the big units are more weak and cheap than the small ones
so the people will say WTF i just double in size and i lost to that
imagine 3 knigth loosing against a footman XD

 

[Doomlord]

I plan to go with slapstick and black comedy actually =)) Thanks for your idea anyway.

 

[UngThanhNhan]

I agree with you about that!

 

[Doomlord]

Hello everybody. Newsfeed here. I have recruited Da Fist and DZerpic as idea men for the project and we are working on the plot. The poll result is very nice also. Perhaps I will have a chance to launch this off the ground very soon

 

[I_am_Death]

Can i join in your team as an idea man :-?

 

[Doomlord]

Can i join in your team as an idea man :-?

The question lies in whether you can brainstorm unique, humorous and wacky ideas

You also need to be able to cooperate with the two other guys. Try and talk with them first. I will not tolerate bickering and in-fighting in the team.

 

[MasterTrainer]

Holy sh*t how this thread has advanced in the fast few days!

Anyways, good luck with your project bro! I know in the first page I said I'd give some feedback later, well here it is! (Though it's not completely related to what you originally wrote on your main post )

Since you already know from a sorta-vague viewpoint of my tight schedule, and since I want to help you out so badly, if you want I can be your icon maker
or signatures too, unless you have chosen the professional support of advanced art workshops here then I'll just stick to icon making for this project

Again, good luck with your plans and future activities bro!

 

[Doomlord]

Holy sh*t how this thread has advanced in the fast few days!

Anyways, good luck with your project bro! I know in the first page I said I'd give some feedback later, well here it is! (Though it's not completely related to what you originally wrote on your main post )

Since you already know from a sorta-vague viewpoint of my tight schedule, and since I want to help you out so badly, if you want I can be your icon maker
or signatures too, unless you have chosen the professional support of advanced art workshops here then I'll just stick to icon making for this project

Again, good luck with your plans and future activities bro!

Aww, I plan to recruit you as a terrainer actually I will work out the details with you once the project is up.

Okay so now we get 13 up vote versus 1 down vote, that is a 93% approval. This project will be initiated very soon everybody. Perhaps after I finish my exams in mid-July. Stay tuned!

P.S: The team positions are still opened. We are still accepting applications

 

[MasterTrainer]

Terrainer huh? Well I suppose I can work full-time on weekends, but I can sure only work on a 128x64 terrain at most.

 

[Legendary]

Nice Pretty cool

 

[Doomlord]

Terrainer huh? Well I suppose I can work full-time on weekends, but I can sure only work on a 128x64 terrain at most.

What is the usual size of a AoS?

@Legendary: thanks

 

[Occult Glider]

Profiled... For now.

 

[I_am_Death]

What is the usual size of a AoS?

@Legendary: thanks

I think (just think) 6MB or 8MB

 

[Faith]

8mb is the max size for a map.
I don't think that's what he meant tho.

I tried finding out the dimensions for DotA but I couldn't find it anywhere lolz.
If you can think of some way I'd try basing it off something like that(;

 

[Doomlord]

I think (just think) 6MB or 8MB

If you would care to look closer, I was referring to the map size. Thank you for your tip.

Okay everyone, we have a new JASS coder, Spartipilo, in the team. Two of my friends, Pourquoi and Colorful Being, are also going to join and work on the idea section. We are going to launch the Map Development thread very soon. Stay tuned~~