My first little steps...

[Lightshard]

Hey there, after the search of a new Update for the (atleast for me) 2 Best RPG Maps for WC3, Legacys: Tides of the Serpent and Tkok, i found this little Gem here! Sadly the other two are dead.

So i gave it a try.

I wanted to share some of my early Game exp to give some Feedback to the Dev/Devs.
Atleast i hope the Feedback from a absolute beginner on this Map, is welcome


Thief lvl 1:

Died, to the first lvl 1 and 2 Wolf Pack, instantly -repick. Didnt touched again so far.


Magician lvl 1:

"Week Attack Stats and week Defense"
Yeah, my Auto Attacks doing more DPS then my Fireball with the 3 years Cast time... I didnt felt like i played a Mage here. Why should i cast when simple Right Click does more DMG!?

-repick

Mystik lvl 4:

Wow, the first "Real" Char here! The first levels felt amazing. Low Mana Cost, Skills doing decent Dmg, except the Buff Spell, is Bugged?!
It says: "Spellpower x 0,5 per Attack for 3 Atacks". I have at level 4, 4 Int. Thats 4 Spellpower. So i should hit for 2 Extra Damage on every Attack.
Just did 1.
But i thought, wolves and Bandits have maybe 50% Light Resistance, so what ever.

Char is on "hold" for now.

Cleric lvl 7:

Healing and Damage Spell to start with. Nice!
Felt a bit like the Mage early on, why should i use the Dmg Cast, when my autos just do a bit less dmg / equal Dmg. So i save my mana for Heals and dont have to Rest after every Fight.

I tryd out the Mercs with him. Tank Merc.. Well, he holds Aggro, is Kinda nice. But vs the Crap Boss, he was useless.
Healing Merc was my next try to beat the Boss. Sadly the AI for the Shaman is dumb as f... He is constantly overhealing. I guess its % Coded, when he starts to cast the Heal, so it might be more usefull on a High HP Char.

Next try was the Sorc.
Just Garbage. Worst Merc from all. Oom after nearly every Pack of Monster. At best, Medicore Dmg.

At this Point i was allready anoyed about the Merc System, but i thought, cmon lets try the last Guy.

HOLY MOLY!
This Guy is damn Beast! He deals dmg like a Truck, has decent HP and gets Armor at level 7+ or so?! AAAAAnnnd he buffs my Auto Attacks to deal some extra Poisen dmg.

The Crab Boss was just a "Drive by" with this Guy. The 3 Others need a buff or this Guy a big hit with the Nerf Bat!
This Troll is now my brother in arms, no question about that!

Cleric is on "hold" for now.


Caster realy dont feel good at the start. The Lack of Power the Cast have is just bad. Maybe its the Mana Cost too. Hard to describe, but i think Caster in early levels, just feels damn unrewarding. Maybe they get better later on, but thats bad then too, when you are forced to play these poor classes with there bad early Game to have a decent Late Game Hero.

Ranger lvl 7:

Troll + Wolfi = Super Ez Mode. Who needs healing, when you just Faceroll over every Monster/Monster Grp.
After playing the weak Caster Chars, i felt like i unlocked the God Mode.
Only downside was: When you have more then 1 Companion. (So Wolf + Merc) you "cant" simply rightclick a enemy anymore to start the battle, because your Companions are bugging around then and just run around without doing anything for several seconds. Looks like they try to reposition themself, for what ever reason.
So you have to Engage every Fight with the X Command, than is everything Fine and smooth.

on "hold" for now.


Squire lvl 12:
After the Blast with the Hunter i wanted to give the last Class a try! I realy felt like a Tank! A bit less then "medicore" Damage, but extreme Beefy.
Once again, i rushed to the Town, grab the Troll and Facerolled the Content. Died the First Time to the Bad Wolf, took the Healer Merc and died Again. Crafted all Items from the Blacksmith Guy, bought a HP Potion and The Wolf was done!
Damn, these Crafting Items are so much more Powerfull as the Stuff i found so far!

The Game should notice the Player about that! After i found out how strong the Crafts are, i felt dumb to not saw them sooner. The farming for the Mats was okayish, i thought its maybe more Painfull, maybe i was lucky, but i just needed around 1h for all 3 Craftings for my Squire. (Gold was the biggest Problem, no real income, only from selling random drops / the outdated Gear)

Back To the Troll Bro, and crossing the Bridge... Killed few Boars and then... didnt i forgot something? Ah yeah the Dungeon! So i went back and tryd to solo it!
First Group = Dead Squire!
Wow, a Bandit outside has 6-8 Dmg and these guys have 18-22 or so!
Back to town, swapping in the Healer Merc and gave it one more try.

I just needed to make sure, that my healer dont draw Aggro with his Awesome 2-4 Dmg hits and the Groups was no Problem at all. Just Rest after every Fight, so he has Full mana to Heal!

The first Dungeon Boss:

...

After we traded some Blows, i instantly remembered that i forgot something important! So i left this battle with a Draw and pretended to have something to do in real life.

I will come back soon!


tl;dr:

-Playing a Caster feels unrewarding! Auto Hits dealing more/equal DPS then Casts! Except Priest, but thats only the case, because i can Heal and my Merc deals the DMG then.
-Farming for Gold for Crafting/Skills is no Fun, because there is no Real way to Gold early on.
-Troll Merc is freaking OP or the 3 others are just bad, except the Healer in some Situations.
-The Game needs to give me more Information / Help!!! Example: How exactly works ArP in this Game? How my Wolf gets +dmg/HP/AR ? Scales it with level? My Gear? What exactly does the Skills from my Mercs...
-Early Game dont feel smooth enough, either you have to Grind XP/Gear to just beat normal Monster or you Faceroll everything. There is no middle.


Well, today i will try this Game out with my Brother, lets see what we can both do on this Map as a Team!

Last Words:

Great Game! Keep Up the Good work, but for gods sake, make it more beginner friendly! The Game feels so punishing when you dont know a shit! After you explored this and that with your 3rd/4th Char, its easier to get into, but still, so many unanswered Question about the Game Mechanics that i have to know, when i whant, as a Player!


I hope such a little Feedback from a absolute Gaia Beginner, will help. I read allready in the Forum that the Next Update contains Stuff for the early Game, but i wanted to share my first Impression.


Peace


Light

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

Feedback from newbies playing a 4player-balanced map as solo always amuses me.

Thief lvl 1:

Died, to the first lvl 1 and 2 Wolf Pack, instantly -repick. Didnt touched again so far.

Great, you've already established yourself as a low skill player that easily gives up. I'm just going to ignore this bit for your benefit.

Magician lvl 1:

"Week Attack Stats and week Defense"
Yeah, my Auto Attacks doing more DPS then my Fireball with the 3 years Cast time... I didnt felt like i played a Mage here. Why should i cast when simple Right Click does more DMG!?

Casters have a very low attack speed. 1 Attack may be somewhat effective early on but obviously the actual DPS will be very low. Fortunately you can do BOTH. That's right. You can attack then cast a spell and so on for optimal DPS, crazy right? Who'da thunkit.
Ofcourse, there's also little things like fireball having AoE and ignoring armor. After lvl10 your spell damage will take off then you won't be attacking much.

Mystik lvl 4:

Wow, the first "Real" Char here! The first levels felt amazing. Low Mana Cost, Skills doing decent Dmg, except the Buff Spell, is Bugged?!
It says: "Spellpower x 0,5 per Attack for 3 Atacks". I have at level 4, 4 Int. Thats 4 Spellpower. So i should hit for 2 Extra Damage on every Attack.
Just did 1.
But i thought, wolves and Bandits have maybe 50% Light Resistance, so what ever.

It seems you're not familiar with the Tank/DPS/support system that most RPGs have. The reason you think this is the first "Real" class is because they were designed to tank these mobs. Damage calculations have a slight roll to them so all your attacks and spells won't always deal the same damage (but very close), at 4SP your jolts can deal 1-2 lightning damage.

Cleric lvl 7:

Healing and Damage Spell to start with. Nice!
Felt a bit like the Mage early on, why should i use the Dmg Cast, when my autos just do a bit less dmg / equal Dmg. So i save my mana for Heals and dont have to Rest after every Fight.

See mage. That being said you're supposed to be healing your team, you can't critique a healer when you're playing solo that is just daft.

Going to ignore your mercenary stories also, can't expect you to know which situations to use each merc as a new player. You probably don't even know that you can only have 1 type of merc in game so you can't hire a bunch of lancers.

Ranger lvl 7:

Troll + Wolfi = Super Ez Mode. Who needs healing, when you just Faceroll over every Monster/Monster Grp.
After playing the weak Caster Chars, i felt like i unlocked the God Mode.
Only downside was: When you have more then 1 Companion. (So Wolf + Merc) you "cant" simply rightclick a enemy anymore to start the battle, because your Companions are bugging around then and just run around without doing anything for several seconds. Looks like they try to reposition themself, for what ever reason.
So you have to Engage every Fight with the X Command, than is everything Fine and smooth.

Archer + companion is usually easier to solo, this is also done in most RPGs. You can even learn a healing spell to be completely self-sufficient. However, this is just for trash mob grinding, it's a different story for boss fights.
For your rightclick issues, you need to change your pet stance to defensive. Press Z for Game Options then U for auto-engage.

Squire lvl 12:

Do you really need a notice in an RPG to tell you that you should craft items? I mean, it certainly couldn't hurt but the recipes aren't hidden or anything. There's already been so much spoonfeeding added to the game, may aswell add a note for crafts in the Hints F9.
I'm glad you're finally comfortable with beating the tutorial-zone mobs.
You should have more than enough gold to cover recipe costs from the early quest rewards. There were already some gold things added for newbies: No gold loss before lvl10, higher drop rate for low items, gold per kill increased. I don't see why anyone would have a problem with gold early game.

As for the dungeon... seriously? Ofcourse a dungeon is going to be alot harder than world map trash. You really sound like someone who's never played an actual RPG before. Dungeons in this map are balanced for 4 players (possible with less for skilled players but still risky), with appropriate level and gear. Perhaps there will be solo and heroic dungeon modes later on but for the foreseeable future, new content is the priority.

Trash mobs can be solo cleared by any class at an appropriate level, with classes that have some tanking power obviously being safer, but it's going to be slow because it's not a solo game. The bosses need a team, and it's supposed to be that way. Also, it sounds like you never did any quests or simply missed most of them.

Man, your entire review screams NOOB. I've seen literally hundreds of people start this map from scratch and did not have anywhere near as much trouble with lvl1-10 content. I sincerely hope you dig down deep and finish this map. I can guarantee you'll be a different sort of RPG player coming away from this.

The only thing anyone can take away from this is that more notes could be added to the F9 Hints.

 

[Risk.frishers]

Can't we try to be a bit nicer to somebody who actually likes the map, just had a funny diddling and gave what the thought was constructive critique? I mean, we even have a thread that escalated about the 'tutorial' part of the game, shouldn't the community be glad Zwiebel get some actual NOOB feedback on it?

The guy sure is a noob on Gaias, especially for the time being, but one that cares enough to visit the forums.. Try to be a little bit less condescending man.

Love it or leave it, no need to scare the newcomers away now is there?

Actually thought it was a good read and had a few relatable situations.

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

That's nice risk. The problem is not that he's new to the map. It's that he plays it with a defeatist attitude and criticizes things being difficult when most of the issues he has is because of his own inadequacy. What exactly is the constructive critique here? All I see are complaints about things being too difficult for him.

That being said, I answered all his (implied) questions, explained the things that didn't make sense to him and urged him to continue playing.

My personality may be harsh but I always go out of my way to help new players, even when I clearly don't like them. What have you offered here? How about reply to the opening post and help him out? If not then point out exactly what you agree with and why.

I'm not going to baby everyone and consider all their "precious feelies". Get real.

 

[BoxOfFaith]

Well.. Its not like he tried saying Thief and Magician need major buffs, I thought all he was saying was that these two classes are extremely difficult to start off with, and that is completely true. A defeatist attitude would have been ONLY playing those two classes and then coming onto the forums to complain about how hard the game is. Though Im always amused that new people seem to pick the squishy DPS classes first.

But ultimately, yeah, the map isn't designed to be played solo. Its actually quite amazing that the content is designed in such a way that you CAN solo play it without it being ridiculously hard to progress, yet still plays as not being too easy with a group either. Nothing needs to be changed, new players just need to realize this isn't one of those maps where you can pick a DPS character and win because you kill stuff before it hits you. Its designed to promote exploration rather than having super clear directions, and this is a good thing.

Stick with playing the map. The classes become much more well defined the further you get into the game. Finding other players to team up with on Bnet will help as well. Sometimes it can be difficult to find players, but most of them are usually willing to help out new players should you want the help.

 

[Risk.frishers]

That's nice risk. The problem is not that he's new to the map. It's that he plays it with a defeatist attitude and criticizes things being difficult when most of the issues he has is because of his own inadequacy. What exactly is the constructive critique here? All I see are complaints about things being too difficult for him.

That being said, I answered all his (implied) questions, explained the things that didn't make sense to him and urged him to continue playing.

My personality may be harsh but I always go out of my way to help new players, even when I clearly don't like them. What have you offered here? How about reply to the opening post and help him out? If not then point out exactly what you agree with and why.

I'm not going to baby everyone and consider all their "precious feelies". Get real.

Excuse me? This kind of elitist attitude has killed many communities. Take your poor attitude and shove it. It's not about "precious feelies". It's about not being a complete *ss. Your personality isn't 'harsh', its straight out rude. I really hope somebody pulls that stick out of you so you can function socially.

"I wanted to share some of my early Game exp to give some Feedback to the Dev/Devs.
Atleast i hope the Feedback from a absolute beginner on this Map, is welcome "

I think this is something that's been on the wishlist as of late. His inadequacy as you called it is something very valuable, seeing as he's above the general perceptive ability of the general populace of BNet, so instead of being a pompous a-hole maybe you could stop beating grown men with a ruler to try 'n teach them.

Just because somebody blocked out your sun doesn't mean you need to bring everybody else you seem to deem inferior to you down acting like you're doing them a favor.

Why don't you take your low self-esteem and do something good with it, lonely people with problems usually become very nice.

Something or someone must have really hurt you. Sorry for you, hope it gets better.

GGWP, I'm going to step back to lurking, not going to dignify whatever gloomy response you come back with.

That said, you've got your smarts, and you provide a ton for the community. But there are plenty of people that do that without that kind of attitude. Really hope you come to your senses.

 

[Jumbo]

Let's get back on topic guys, shall we?

@Lightshard: the startup part of the game (Lvl 1 and game basics) could use some improvement. The ideal way to introduce the map would, in my opinion, be a lore related quest that kicks the game setting off and at the same time teaching the basics to the player. The startup inn would be a good spot to start. A guy in there serving as your temporary mentor.

This guy briefly welcomes you to the Riverdale forest and explaining that this is one of the safer parts of the country. 'You are a <insert class> so I suppose you will use your skills to <keep the attention of your enemies defending your allies/support your allies with healing/finish your enemies off fast while others take the blows.'

'Riversdale has a few problems with the plague, but as of yet, no human being has been infected in the area.

A traveller looking sick interrupts: Arghh stay back I ... I don't..

The mentor npc says: quickly ready yourself for a fight. He is no longer human but a mindless victim of the plague. (A hint pops up for that player: 'select your hero and enter your spellbook (hotkey Q) to use abilities.

After 8 seconds the diseased zombie traveller gets up and attacks. The fight takes around 30-40 sec with only one player and considerably less with more players. During this fight a new hint is provided 'Notice how the aggro meter changes in the upper right corner of the screen during the fight. 100% or more will make the selected enemy attack you. Dealing damage and/or using spells like healing will generate aggro on enemies in combat.'

After the fight, the mentor gives the player some parting words and the player can leave by exit circle and get to the point just outside (where the current version starts).


A few notes:
The inn wisp area is used for this tutorial. The wisps turn invisible for the player who has chosen a hero.
- the tutorial inn can be skipped by running to the exit circle at any time. This promots a 'Do you wish to skip the tutorial' yes/no dialogue. Once outside the game progresses exactly as it does in the current version.
I really hope someone will help Zwieb and add such a startup to the game.

On the mercenaries. Yes the tank could use better aggro handling. And yes, the sorcerers needs to be better, cause it is useless now. Otherwise the game has no problems at all.

 

[Lightshard]

Hey, thanks for all the Responses so far!

@SaikoDeMoN

Under the Line, you are not wrong with the things you try to "teach" me. But cmon, you think somebody listen to an asshole?

My English is very poor, that should be clear after reading my OP. I tried to explain all Problems i came across as good as i could. Well, it sounds Noobish, im fine with that.

Today i played a Online Session with the Gaia Bot and met a nice Guy who helped me out with explaining some basic Tips, like i level faster when i kill Monster on my own Level for example.
We played roughly 3h together and my Mystik is now Level 16!
I got some cool Souls allready (atleast i think they are cool XD )

One realy bad thing he teached me today was, that i need to farm the Crab Boss and the Wolf Boss till end of Days, until my Class Ability Scroll drops.
I asked him if the Ability is "worth" to farm for and if i just dont can buy it or make a Quest for it.
He said no, and its a very Rare drop too...

Farming for Gear or Materials for Crafting is one thing, but farming for a Essential Skill for my Class?
And when i wanna try out a new Class, i have to do it again...
THATS poor Design! Right there!

But Man... i guess im realy addicted now, Game makes tons of Fun, and this in Days of WoW or other pollished 3D MMORPGS, think about that!

How old is Wc3 now? 346 Years or so? Sort of... And still be played and Maps developed on.

Just WOW...


@Jumbo

Well, i dont thing any Game should have such a Tutorial at all! I allways feel bad, when a Game trys to teach me Step by Step whats the meaning of HP / MP or Attack DMG is...

Just simple things: More detailed Tooltips for Mercs, for example. What exactly does there Skills do, whats the CD/Mana Cost, how they Scale ?
How much DMG / HP / ect they get per Player Level?
How the Pet of the Ranger Scales with Player Level / Gear?!

A "little Hint" where i can farm some Materials. Like:

Poor Leater
"Looks like Leather from a very Weak Monster..."

Then the Player knows! Aha, its Leather, so it must be dropped by a Animal...
And it says, from a weak one, so maybe these level 1-2 Wolves give me Some.


Such Stuff i mean. By no means, the Game should Spoiler everything, but a little Hint, here and there. So you dont feel sometimes "lost".

Sure you guys, know every shit. And sure you can walk into the Forum and read things, but lets be real, only 1-5% of the Playerbase from every Game, only checks out Forums. No more.
Most Player dont bother to check Forums, so they need a bit Help ingame!

Just Help, not Spoilers/Playing the Game Hand in Hand with them, u know?


Peace


Light

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

@Jumbo: The aggro meter is definitely something that needs explaining to new players. I don't think that having a zombie in the game so early (and so far away from the spores) would stand up lore-wise but the general idea of an interactive tutorial is good.

Would be nice if there were just some casual NPCs around that gave useful starter information in passing if you talk to them, like what spells the bosses in the areas use or where you can get certain materials. Right now I feel that most players just ignore NPCs altogether if they dont have a yellow sign over their heads. This isn't bad game-play wise but it takes away from the immersive feel of gaias.

With regards to mercs, the sorceress feels weak because of her long wind-up. If you're killing stuff quickly anyway then ofcourse she won't do anything. If you're taking awhile to kill or want some AoE she's OK. The warrior is fine, I used it for levelling thief/mage/cleric and it did pretty well in holding threat. I think the discrepancy has more to do with lancer just being too good, he has too much armor considering how much DPS he adds. I'd rather have lancer nerfed than buff the other mercs. Mercs should help players that can't find a group, they shouldn't completely replace other players.

@Lightshard: If you don't want to listen to solid advice regardless of the source, that's your loss. I have nothing to gain or lose. There will be many people in life whom you don't like but can learn from. The spell scroll system will be changed in upcoming versions, you can read more about it here: Zwieb's ability thread

 

[Lightshard]

With regards to mercs, the sorceress feels weak because of her long wind-up. If you're killing stuff quickly anyway then ofcourse she won't do anything. If you're taking awhile to kill or want some AoE she's OK. The warrior is fine, I used it for levelling thief/mage/cleric and it did pretty well in holding threat. I think the discrepancy has more to do with lancer just being too good, he has too much armor considering how much DPS he adds. I'd rather have lancer nerfed than buff the other mercs. Mercs should help players that can't find a group, they shouldn't completely replace other players.

From my Perspective:

The Troll is Weaker as a Player, no question.
But every other Merc is way Weaker then the Troll. Thats the Big Problem. The Healer only came Handy for me, when i fought Bosses or discovered the Dungeon, where Fights was "longer".

In Short Fights, the Tank deals to less Dmg and Takes to much. His Aggro Handling is sometimes weird, he cast he Demo Shout, when i X him to attack and he not in Range for anything...

Maybe your right about the Sorc, but in Long fights you dont die to little DPS, you die when you take to much dmg or dont get healed. (Atleast for the early Game Stuff, but thats what im talking all about, cant Judge later Stuff)

 

[Manipulation]

@LightShard

Theif is prob one of the most enjoyable classes. At least it was for me. I felt that i was truelly a thief that had to play in a certain way to be successful.

No! The game must not tell u that crafting items are better or whatever of that kind of information. What else do u want? the game tell u how to use skills? seriously people. Things are there for u to experiment with, to explore it. Dont wait your daddy to hold your hand in everything. I cant help myself and get very annoyed by such comments because gaias is good because for what it is.
When i start a game i dont want to read 1293219392 pages of text. Thats AWFUL, boring, bad design. I just want to open the map explore, find out whats in every corner, whats in town, shops etc etc.
And OF COURSE crafting items have to be better ? ITS LOGIC. Because u actually make an effort to gather materials etc so that in the end u can feel that it was worthy!

I agree that some more info on attributes and mechanics might be needed.

The game has absolutely nothing hard at the begining. Think that people like u might consider it newbie unfriendly but most ppl that played this map didnt felt that way. This means that the map is fine. The map shouldnt be downgraded so that 5 year olds can play it. So that they can one shot everything and never lose HP. There are tonz of random maps out there that are like that and they all die.

EDIT:
Also yes. The mercenaries dont feel balanced because their role is not the same. The Troll feels good cause it does is auto attack (like a good bot) while the Tank and the Healer are situational. So yeah you can assume that the troll functions better as A BOT

 

[Jumbo]

It is always harder to see things from the perspective of others. I dont know where you get the statistical evidence to claim that most people get the game. In my experience up to at least 50% of the new players leave within the first few lvls. This has a wide range of reasons, and one of them is poor grasp of the map. Throughout the years, I have seen so many new players not understanding features accessible to them: backpack (very common), how to use abilities (because of the spellbook some dont realise they have spells at all. They may think that the spellbook is just an aura or whatever).

Now, one can take the ignorant view that such people are just stupid, but realising that many people aren't dedicated gamers is important. To understand my point more easily think of this: You ask a guy who has never played an RTS game before to play melee WC3. He will perhaps grasp the basics of base building and getting an army, but perhaps he won't since he basically doesn't grasp the basic logic and goal behind the game.
This is exactly the same with some random players trying out Gaias for the first time.

I totally agree with you Demon on the zombie. Maybe it should simply be a bandit - introducing the bandit threat of the Riversdale region. Or perhaps a few simple talk npcs will do the trick for explaining the basics, as you suggested.

 

[S0ulseeker]

Welcome to Gaias!

I'm sure Zwiebel (the creator of the map) values your input on a new players perspective. Not something we get to hear often on the forums which is refreshing! If you're playing on Battle.net feel free to stop by clan ORPG @USWest. We have a lot of members who play pretty frequently on the bots and are all more than willing to help. There are also several good Garena groups you can join to help find some games.


Feel free to message me on bnet/forums/garena if you ever have any questions or are looking for games.

 

[BoxOfFaith]

I like the idea of having random NPC's throughout the map that tell you little tips and hints if you take the time to talk to them. Mentioning things about how some enemies will cast certain spells and abilities on players who don't have lead aggro, or how abilities can be cancelled using interrupts and such.

Not a big fan of a forced tutorial or anything of that nature though. Some things should be learned through out just playing the game. Little tid bits of information if you talk to certain NPC's = Good. Being told specifically how to play the game and being forced through a tutorial = bad.

 

[Devlain]

I think the experience of Lightshard just reinforce the evidence that I was pointing in the OP of my thread Early Game Playability Issues.
In my last observations this didn't changed so much. Until now, only 5 out of 14 people that played the game and were RPG or Action-RPG adepts, wants to give it a second chance. This couldn't be completely random.
I love this game, but I really hope the new talent system and improvements on the next version make it easier to learn for new players.

 

[Lightshard]

Welcome to Gaias!

I'm sure Zwiebel (the creator of the map) values your input on a new players perspective. Not something we get to hear often on the forums which is refreshing! If you're playing on Battle.net feel free to stop by clan ORPG @USWest. We have a lot of members who play pretty frequently on the bots and are all more than willing to help. There are also several good Garena groups you can join to help find some games.


Feel free to message me on bnet/forums/garena if you ever have any questions or are looking for games.

Thanks for the offer!
Sadly my friend, im playing on EU (Northrend) so i guess we wont see us Ingame

Is there a actual List for the Garena thingy you mention? The Topics here in Forum about Garena / Playerlist are several years old and the Post in there too.
So they might be outdated.

Its a bit Painfull to sit everytime for ~60 mins in the Bot Lobby and hoping 2 Others show up. I played most of the Time alone, but i would like to Team up more!

 

[SHBlade]

I'll be able to play at weekend.
Northrend(EU): SHBlade

 

[SaikoDeMoN]

Thanks for the offer!
Sadly my friend, im playing on EU (Northrend) so i guess we wont see us Ingame

Is there a actual List for the Garena thingy you mention? The Topics here in Forum about Garena / Playerlist are several years old and the Post in there too.
So they might be outdated.

The bot crosshosts on all b.net realms and a room in garena so you don't need to be in USWest to play with him. For example, I play from USWest but we still played together today in the bot. However, it really is worth it to make an account in USWest just to join clan ORPG - this is where the majority of b.net gaias players will be.

I'm not sure where the active groups are, the only one I haven't left yet is Brotherhood of Gaia (ID 20274429). My clan is now active in gaias again, if you're willing to go the distance in this map then you're welcome to join (Clan ID: 351764). I believe Shadowchewer tried to start a clan recently, you could check there too (Clan ID: 1738181).

 

[Jumbo]

@Box: no one said anything about a forced tutorial.. Argh sometimes people dont read thoroughly on these forums :-D

 

[Manipulation]

I think the experience of Lightshard just reinforce the evidence that I was pointing in the OP of my thread Early Game Playability Issues.
In my last observations this didn't changed so much. Until now, only 5 out of 14 people that played the game and were RPG or Action-RPG adepts, wants to give it a second chance. This couldn't be completely random.
I love this game, but I really hope the new talent system and improvements on the next version make it easier to learn for new players.

What exactly is hard for the new players? You talk as if all the new players are retarded or mental. How can u even generalize like that? Did u ever though that people actually like how the map is and thats they reason they stick to it?
Personally i always loved the start, even the first time i played gaias like 5 years ago i never thought for a min that the game is hard. That thought never crossed my mind, but instead i loved how unique, beautiful, well crafted it was. It didnt bother me that as a thief i was dying easy cause it made sense to me. I loved how should go Stealth and how i should be on the back of my opponent in order to use skills. I loved how classes were unique. Each one of them with his advantages and disadvantages. I loved that not every class was able to kill the same monsters or even the same boss. THAT meant a good game for me. A game with TRUE classes.

This subject of the difficulty is as pointless as the subject of balance in games.
Go out there and find the most balanced RPG, then go to their forum and see how there are still ppl that complain about balance.
Same for difficulty. There are always people that will either complain for something being too difficult or even easy. But this has nothing to do with the game itsself. This is mostly how every single person has been raised. The map isnt here to satisfy the 32981319 types of neurosis and whims out there.

If artists were here to satisfy the WANT of others then there wouldnt be artists. Being creative and fullfilling the others wishes are two opposite things. They are not compatible.

 

[Jumbo]

I wish that these forums could be more mature. Why do we have to end up in extreme terms? People who don't know how to play Gaias are hardly retarded or mental. Really I'm kinda tired of this uneducated, narrowminded level of debates here. I'm out of this thread.

 

[Devlain]

What exactly is hard for the new players? You talk as if all the new players are retarded or mental. How can u even generalize like that? Did u ever though that people actually like how the map is and thats they reason they stick to it?
Personally i always loved the start, even the first time i played gaias like 5 years ago i never thought for a min that the game is hard. That thought never crossed my mind, but instead i loved how unique, beautiful, well crafted it was. It didnt bother me that as a thief i was dying easy cause it made sense to me. I loved how should go Stealth and how i should be on the back of my opponent in order to use skills. I loved how classes were unique. Each one of them with his advantages and disadvantages. I loved that not every class was able to kill the same monsters or even the same boss. THAT meant a good game for me. A game with TRUE classes.

This subject of the difficulty is as pointless as the subject of balance in games.
Go out there and find the most balanced RPG, then go to their forum and see how there are still ppl that complain about balance.
Same for difficulty. There are always people that will either complain for something being too difficult or even easy. But this has nothing to do with the game itsself. This is mostly how every single person has been raised. The map isnt here to satisfy the 32981319 types of neurosis and whims out there.

If artists were here to satisfy the WANT of others then there wouldnt be artists. Being creative and fullfilling the others wishes are two opposite things. They are not compatible.

With all due respect, this is data, maybe it is a low amount but it is strictly data, only 5 out of 14 player that I wanted to try the map wants to give it a second chance, and the demographic is of people that has played or currently plays some action-rpg or rpg like Diablo II, Diablo III, World of Warcraft and another Warcraft maps.

You surely like the beginning of the game, and I'm surely like this game a lot, that's subjective to our personal preferences, but facts are facts and they seem to be consistent with the experience with newbies among others users in this forums.

I've made my statement on my OP in another thread and I was satisfied with community and Zwieb answer so I wouldn't continue my exposition here.

 

[S0ulseeker]

Thanks for the offer!
Sadly my friend, im playing on EU (Northrend) so i guess we wont see us Ingame

The bot crosshosts on all b.net realms and a room in garena so you don't need to be in USWest to play with him. For example, I play from USWest but we still played together today in the bot. However, it really is worth it to make an account in USWest just to join clan ORPG - this is where the majority of b.net gaias players will be.

To kind of just add off of what SaikoDeMoN (Kamina) said since the bots cross host between all servers and garena and since the majority of the games played are via the bots it ultimately doesn't matter where you play from since your latency/ping will remain the same. There are many players within Clan ORPG themselves that are not from the USWest server, it's just where the bulk of bnet players play at which will make it easier to find a pre-made game for the bot , and as long as your username on the USWest server is the same as your EU server name you should be able to load all your chars and vaults with no problem.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

I didn't read everything because I am kind of busy at the moment (well, actually, this is the first time my work schedule allows me a day off, so I will probably code some Gaias tomorrow...); but anyway:

@Lightshard: I like reading feedback from enthusiastic new players every now and then. Despite what some people here might say, I actually do value all these inputs, no matter what the supposed "skill level" of these players is.
In fact, many of these issues you presented are actually well known. For example, the lack of an "interactive" tutorial in the game. I do get why this is important, I just didn't see it as a high priority issue yet, since many people will just play this map on the hostbots anyway and there is always a player or two that can explain certain elements of the game.

But I will add a tutorial on threat, backpack and the mathematics behind the game later on. It's just that there are other things on the schedule first, like the release of new endgame content, mounts and a new ability system.

Also, yes, I am aware of the skill grinding issue. Don't worry, this is already gone in my developer builds, as I completely revamped the ability system for the upcoming version of the game.

Also, I am aware of the perceived usefullness of the mercenaries. Keep in mind that these mercs are designed after the holy trinity principle and that the healing AI for the shaman merc was designed for lategame content, in which it is important that the merc starts healing even on slight losses of health. I tried to hit a compromise in the design here, by giving the shaman merc a pretty large mana pool in early levels to compensate for it's over-aggressive healing without artificially reducing the treshold in which he starts healing for endgame purposes.

The Sorceress merc will receive a buff in future designs. I am aware that it is currently the least useful mercenary.

You can fix the passive pets by putting them in "aggressive" mode btw. This will make your pets attack as soon as you (or the enemy) deals any damage.


Anyway, if you are interested in what will come in future updates (or just to see if the direction this game will be going fits your gusta), just check out some of the most recent threads by me. I always try to give some previews for future content to keep you guys informed on what I am currently working on.
Here's some stuff to get you started:
New ability system
Mounts
Procedural dungeons

 

[Lightshard]

Thanks for the Response Zwiebelchen. (Are you German btw? )

I realy looking forward to the next Update! Any ETA btw?
Sure now, i having more XP about the Game and know alot more Stuff how things work ect ect.

I just wanted to give a complete Fresh Impression in my OP. Without visiting any Topics before. So i had realy no Clue about the Game and just worked with the Stuff, the Game "told" me.

Peace

Light

 

[tylo19]

It's nice to have new people starting this and interested enough to join the forums too. Just try to ignore some elitist 4ssholes. Also you can use enthost to host/connect with others.