Map Development: The Scourging of Azeroth

[Silverfish423]

Update!!:
Techtree for Silver Hand added! Check it out!

 

[Hawkwing]

Looks good, but, to be honest, I'm not crazy about the name "Light-filled Chapel." It's sort of like saying "Military-personnel filled Army", but much less of an extreme.

At least that's how I feel. What's the unit with the Arthas icon?

 

[Silverfish423]

Haha, I see what you mean. And eh, a chapel could be filled with demonic influences
And that is a Paladin

 

[Hawkwing]

Haha, I see what you mean. And eh, a chapel could be filled with demonic influences

I just think it's sort of stating the obvious, you know? Anyways, if you don't agree, it doesn't need to be changed.

And that is a Paladin

Ah, too bad. I was hoping to be able to mass Arthas's.

 

[Sky Green]

Well hows it goin with the masterys

 

[Silverfish423]

It's going pretty well. I visit em every once in awhile, but right now the main focus of the progression is the units. I need the units completed so testing can run smoothly

 

[apsycobear]

im curious, for the terrain did you use mainly the "cliff" tool (raise 1/2 lower 1/2 shallow/deep) or did you use the raise, lower, smooth tool.

I looked closely at the pics of the continents and it looks as tho it may be the "cliff" tool, frankly i find that the other tool works much better for elevation as far as mountains and shorelines go. If you did use the cliff tool i could change it to the other version when i terrain it if you want, it looks much nicer.

 

[Miss_Foxy]

I think it's the cliff tool.

 

[Silverfish423]

Well, I used the cliff tool when it was appropriate, the same goes for the raise/lower tool. I used raise/lower tool for rivers, lakes, and shorelines. When land was by the ocean, but I did not want there to be a shoreline, I used the cliff tool.
I hope that answers your question

{EDIT 1 — 2-Mar-2011, 1:25 AM}
Man, the units are coming along very nicely. I can't wait for the Beta to be ready for complete testing
We are at the 80% mark!!

{EDIT 2 — 4-Mar-2011, 2:11 AM}
It is going to be very sweet

As a note to everyone: Deathwing/Twilight Dragonflight race was heavily revamped. Testers were not having fun playing it, so I changed some of the spells, added different units, and some events, and not it is much better. Much more involved, unique, etc.

 

[Miss_Foxy]

Hmm... So were they improved?

 

[Silverfish423]

I believe so. I will have my testers check it out again this weekend, but I told them what I changed and they seemed to like it. This is what I changed:


Twilight Dragons: changed them to a more powerful version of an undead Destroyer (from melee maps). It possesses Devour Magic (removes enemy buffs, restores mana/health), Consume Magic (removes all mana from friendly unit and gives it to Twilight Dragon) and Orb of Annihilation (+20 dmg/aoe dmg)

Wyrmkin (spellcaster): added 2 spells. First is Curse of Shadowflame. It is just like the parasite spell, except that a Shadowflame Minion undead is spawned. the 2nd spell was Bond of Dragon's Blood. It is just like the orcs' spirit link, but a tiny bit weaker.
Events: If Deathwing travels a spot in Blackrock Mountain, Nefarian & Chromatic Dragons join his forces. If Deathwing travels to a spot in Dustwallow Marsh, Onyxia & Onyxian Dragons join his forces.

Misc: random techtrees, tooltips, etc, were fixed

 

[apsycobear]

What's deathwing players start location?

 

[WillofKhrone]

You know, it's probably to late, but if you reaallly wanted to be unique, you could add in Ysera, the Emerald Dream area, and the Emerald Nightmare.

 

[Silverfish423]

@apsycobear: his starting position is in Grim Batol (Twilight Highlands)

@WillofKhrone: nope, it is still possible! I may add her later on

 

[apsycobear]

careful with the blackrock event in that case, having a new hero and units available so close to your starting position could be op, i understand hes probably gna have to fight dwarves but lets say he sneaks deathwing through to blackrock, thatd be an insta win against dwarves.

also are all heros revivable, most, or none?

Btw wats the lore this map is set in, since deathwing is in azeroth and arthas is alive im assuming its alternate lore(slightly).

 

[Silverfish423]

It isnt OP at all. When Deathwing goes into Blackrock, he only gets 1 hero and 2 units immediately. the units can be triained, but u still need the proper techtree requirements for them, which would take awhile.
and getting a hero like that isnt OP considering Deathwing starts with 1 hero

And the lore is based immediately after The Frozen Throne campaign

 

[apsycobear]

w8 if it's after frozen throne then why is deathwing in Azeroth? At this time ge should be in deepholme "recovering" from the events of the 2nd war.

Also yes the units must be trained but here's what I mean, ok idk if uve played this game but in azeroth wars if the troll player takes over Gundrak he obtains ice trolls wich are very strong, it's difficult to get them so it's not OP. Basicly what I'm saying is, since it's so easy to gain access to these units don't make them that much stronger then his other units(make them unique ya but not that much stronger)

 

[Silverfish423]

Because the lore following the frozen throne, in my game, is open ended. so it is possible that deathwing would come out.

and yes, i understand what you are saying, but what im saying is that even if you gain access to these units, it is not easy to train them. for example, the Onyxian Dragons and Chromatic Dragonspawn that you can get require the tier 3 halls for them to be trained. That takes a lot of gold and lumber, of which will take quite awhile. So trust me, it isnt OP

but of course, testing will also give testament to this statement, and testing has shown that it isnt OP

 

[apsycobear]

I see, also around how big are the armies? Around ladder match size or like 50-100 units?

 

[Silverfish423]

Well, there is 100 available food.
All workers cost 1 food. All ground fighters cost 1 food. All air units cost 2 food. So depending on how many workers you have harvesting lumber and building, how many ground fighters you have, and how many air units you have, you could have an army anywhere between 35-100. it just depends how you use your food.

 

[Sky Green]

Well, there is 100 available food.
All workers cost 1 food. All ground fighters cost 1 food. All air units cost 2 food. So depending on how many workers you have harvesting lumber and building, how many ground fighters you have, and how many air units you have, you could have an army anywhere between 35-100. it just depends how you use your food.

are you thinking about making workers not costing any food i mean they still cost gold but it would be easier for players to focus on their army

 

[Silverfish423]

I have thought about it before, but I decided that it would be better if the workers cost food. That way, you have to make a choice between a slightly larger army, and less lumber resource intake; or slightly smaller army, and more lumber resource intake

EDIT: AI progress bar added to original post! Current AI progres percentage..: 0%

 

[apsycobear]

exactly how will the income and military systems work together, as in if you get enof income for like 1 unit or 10 units cuz if the food limit is 100 and a player is relativly strong i can see 2 armies of 100 food fighting and the smaller player winning, ez fix to this would be techs for upgraded dmg and armor wich im wondering if ur implementing and if so how many(most games are 8 dmg and 8 armor techs)

 

[Silverfish423]

Well, the income system basically works based upon how many of different kind of income buildings you have. There are 3 types; marketplaces, special sites, and capitals.

Marketplaces: 5g/60g. You can build a maximum of 12 for every capital you own. So for example, if you have 1 capital, you can build 12, but if you own 3 capitals, you can build 24.

Special Sites: 10g/60g. These are scattered around the map. There is not one in every region and there will never be more than 1 in one region. Player control can be transferred by an enemy player capturing it.

Capitals: 15g/60sec. There is one of these for each starting zone of a player. They also allow more marketplaces to be created. The player control can be transferred by an enemy capturing it.

Units cost anywhere between 10g and 45g. Ground melee units range from 10g-30g, Ground ranged units range from 12g-23g, Ground siege units range from 20-25g, Spellcasters range from 14-18g, and Air units range from 27-45g

And yes, I do have upgrades in SoA. There are 3 dmg and 3 armor techs

 

[apsycobear]

I like your new take on income, however you shud rethink capturable capitals, if let's say scourge captures stormwind he would either raze it or rebuild it as a necropolis. You get my point right?

 

[Silverfish423]

yeah, i understand what you are saying, but that is very difficult to do. also, i dont know if it is possible, what with trying to trigger it all. it would be very difficult, complicated, and really isnt necessary
it would be a cool addition. maybe once i get near the final phases i will find a really good triggerer to see if they could do that.

 

[apsycobear]

Actualy the trigger isn't all that complicated, just slightly long. When player X takes building X down to X health, replace it with building Y.

Also have trigger for when this trigger activates for the player to gain control of his newly spawns building.

One more trigger for the player to lose control of his "killed" base.

Triggering it is pretty easy, just requires a large amount of triggers, my specialty isn't triggering tho so there's probably someone that can make it simpler.

 

[Silverfish423]

No, i already have that system included. The problem is replacing it, because then I would have to create a a mass of new income triggers to go along with that. It is just waay too much, haha.
As I said, maybe I will implement that at a later date

EDIT: Pics of several Masteries were attached to the original post! They show the units/heroes obtained. For more information, check out my Photo Album on my profile

{EDIT}
Hey everybody! Outland is being revamped so that it more closely resembles the Outland presented in WoW.
As a preview, here is Blade's Edge Mountain! (it is still under construction)
To view it, either go to the original post and find the picture (It'd be the last) under attachments, or click this link: http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/...ging-azeroth-blades-edge-mountain-preview.jpg

 

[Miss_Foxy]

That sounds nice, hope to see other regions too!

 

[Silverfish423]

Okay guys, here are 4 regions of Outland! Netherstorm, Blade's Edge Mountains, Hellfire Peninsula, and Nagrand! They are mostly complete except Nagrand. Give me criticism and suggestions!

Netherstorm

Blade's Edge Mountains

Hellfire Peninsula

Nagrand

By the way, these are being posted because a few people felt that Outland needed to be remade. So, that is just what I am doing!

 

[Hawkwing]

More grass in Nagrand please! Also, are there not supposed to be islands in Netherstorm?

 

[Silverfish423]

Here is Nagrand updated! I will post old + new versions so you can see the differences:

Old Nagrand

Nagrand New

And yes, you are right; Netherstorm does have 'islands'. The boundary texture is meant to represent that.

 

[Hawkwing]

And yes, you are right; Netherstorm does have 'islands'. The boundary texture is meant to represent that.

Perhaps you could use the raise/lower tool in combination with the boundaries to do this.

 

[apsycobear]

Ya netherstorm needs a touch up, don't worry too much bout terrain, I'll fix anything that needs fixing.

 

[Silverfish423]

Hmm....yeah, I see what both of you mean. It has really got to look like those are floating or something, as islands, to create a truly magical effect. thats what i want all of the map to have. awesome terrain that draws attention, haha xD
and okay apsycobear, I will be sure to keep that in mind and just keep working on testing and the units.
Man, it's getting close!
Oh, by the way, the progress dropped from 80% to 60% because I included the category of AI. AI will be used for open slots or for the optional races that are not chosen. This way, a full house is not absoultely necessary and empty spots from the optional races not chosen will not create a rigged shift of power in the game

 

[apsycobear]

ur gna need some sort of genius to make the AI system to control unused slots/races(atleast if u want him to be able to compete wit pros). btw im not exactly sure but doesnt having an AI for unused races(all slots are full but the races pink/green didnt choose) require 1 slot to be a computer?

 

[WillofKhrone]

There isn't really anylore supporting this idea, however it'd seemed like it'd be a pretty sweet event.

The Hand of the Queen
or
The Lich King's Replacement
Multiple things are possible at the death of Arthas. If he dies to the hand of Sylvanas or a unit controled by the Forsaken, the Forsaken may type -Queen of the Damned. If she does so, Sylvanas herself will take over as the Lich Queen, bringing the undead hordes together again under her banner. If this is done, Sylvanas is unable to ally.
If Plague is reaserched and "The Hand of the Queen" is to take place, Tichoundorus (or however it is spelt) will instead funnel a path for demons to enter Azeroth if you type -Path of Seven Hells. This allies the Burning Crusade and summons "Saergas, the Destroyer of Worlds" as a shared unit between the two. If he dies, he is unrevivable.
If Arthas is slain by Muradin Bronzebeard, the Frostborn Dwarves will work together with the Taunka to end the undead scourge in Northrend. The Taunka gain control over the Ice Troll area, where as the Frostborn Dwarves gain control of Icecrown Citadel.
If Arthas is slain by Baine or his father, the Frostborn Dwarves will aid them and the Taunka to end the undead scourge in northrend. You will gain control of Icecrown Citadel, whereas the Frostborn Dwarves will gain the Ice Troll Area.
If the Argent Crusade defeats the Lich King, Tiron Fording will become the new lichking, sealing the undead under his will if he types -New Lich King. He gains a new techtree and is able to train Death Knights of Icecrown.
If Thrall kills the Arthas, he will gather the tribes of orcs, giving you a large settlement on the coast of Northrend as Helscram Barricade. It will be pelted with undead every few minutes, but every wave you survive, it gains a new tech. There is a maximum of fifteen waves.
If Anub'Arak kills Arthas, then the Nerubians will resurface, taking back Northrend for their own if there is no one to resist them other than the Scourge.
If Anub'Arak kills Arthas after falling to the old gods whispers, then unspeakable horrors (nameless ones and servants of the old gods) will begin surfacing all over Northrend.

 

[Miss_Foxy]

Nagrand looks, grand.

 

[Silverfish423]

@apsycobear: Yeah, that is true. A genius may be needed, haha xD but yes, a computer spot is needed. But that is why if you are going to start the game without full house, just fill the open spots with computers and that way the unused spots would be some sort of a challenge
@WillofKhrone: Those are pretty interesting! They definitely get my lore mind working xD but the only thing I don't like is that nearly every race gets a reward for killing Lich King. That basically puts a huge bounty solely on his head and it could be imbalanced if everyone tries to kill him. But I will definitely try to implement some of your ideas
@Miss_Foxy: Thanks a lot! ^_^

 

[apsycobear]

First idea makes some sense, blizzard hasnt really shown sylvanas true nature yet(power hungry, sympathetic to the dead, ect.) so its debatable if shed do it but ya the ideas nice.

For second idea, tichondrius died to illidan in felwood, i think ur thinking of sylvanas "assistant" dreadlord whos name is Varimathras in which case i like the idea except for the shared unit control. this would really screw things over if one of the players is being a dick or if one player was gna do something wit the hero but other player does somthing else.

I dont like the third idea all too much, just doesnt feel right giving such a minor faction(ice dwarves) such a strong pressence in northrend.

Same for fourth idea.

Fifth idea wouldnt be accurate to lore since its made clear in lore that tirion is arthas' opposite basicly, he stands for light and justice and therfore would never do such a thing. Even when arthas died he was more concernd about keeping the scourge in check then ruling over them.

Sixth idea doesnt feel right cuz it gives it a sort of a "tower defense" feel, wich just wouldnt work in this game since someone could just kill the base anyways.

Seventh idea dont make sense cuz the nerubian and scourge players are allied and if the game were to have an -unally command with this event in place u cud just surround arthas(descretly) as his ally then just -unally and bam hes dead.

Last idea doesnt make sense to me cuz Arthas' death wouldnt really cause faceless ones to randomly pop up outa nowhere.

In my opinion i only liked the first two ideas, if they could be implimented in a balanced method they could work.

 

[Silverfish423]

I have similar feelings to apsycobear. But as said before, the ideas are nice and keep em coming! By the end of the creation of this game, there will be lots of cool events and such that can change the direction of the game, of which many will have been provided by WillofKhrone! haha

 

[WillofKhrone]

I dont like the third idea all too much, just doesnt feel right giving such a minor faction(ice dwarves) such a strong pressence in northrend.
Same for fourth idea.

Fifth idea wouldnt be accurate to lore since its made clear in lore that tirion is arthas' opposite basicly, he stands for light and justice and therfore would never do such a thing. Even when arthas died he was more concernd about keeping the scourge in check then ruling over them.

Sixth idea doesnt feel right cuz it gives it a sort of a "tower defense" feel, wich just wouldnt work in this game since someone could just kill the base anyways.

Seventh idea dont make sense cuz the nerubian and scourge players are allied and if the game were to have an -unally command with this event in place u cud just surround arthas(descretly) as his ally then just -unally and bam hes dead.

Last idea doesnt make sense to me cuz Arthas' death wouldnt really cause faceless ones to randomly pop up outa nowhere.

In my opinion i only liked the first two ideas, if they could be implimented in a balanced method they could work.

Sixth idea and Seventh idea were pretty bad, I guess.

The last idea was focused on like, when Arthas is destroyed by the nerubians after they fall to the old gods, the old gods would be able to begin to surface in Northrend.

Tirion was the wrong name, lol. I meant Bolvar.

For the third and the fourth idea, it adds an incentive to actually go to Northrend for them. Instead of getting a weak base, you can slowly gain control of Northrend by defeating Arthas, where as most players wouldn't go for the Frost Dwarves / Taunka.

The reason these are all based off of Arthas's death, is at the end of Warcraft 3, nearly everyone had the same realization. If they didn't end Arthas, he would be able to level the world.

Yea, I guess these weren't my best ideas.

For the control of Saergas, would it work better, if perhaps, it worked like this...

"Avatar of Saergas is changed to Saergas, the Master of the Legion, and the undead gain Saergas, the Destroyer of Worlds? Saergas, the Master of the Legion would be mainly a lesser version of Saergas, the Destroyer of Worlds."

I feel that the forsaken should get the Destroyer of Worlds, since THEY did kill Arthas, not the legion, in that idea.

 

[apsycobear]

if i understand that correctly u mean buff avatar of sargeras for legion and give real sargeras to forsaken. altho it does make sense to give the person that got the kill the hero its not rlly correct since sargeras is only logical to go wit legion player, as for the avatar being buffed i understand the reasoning as to y do it but after sargeras is summond theres no real need to have his avatar there anymore.

 

[WillofKhrone]

Yea... that's why I had originaly had it under shared control for the idea I had.

Perhaps give the real Saergas to the legion, and give the Forsaken the "The Unholy Shadow of Saergas".

 

[apsycobear]

Or maybe give forsaken player the other dreadlords that are alive, deathroc, balnazaar, and mal'ganis.

 

[WillofKhrone]

I suppose that could work.

(Forsaken turns to the Council of Four!)

 

[Miss_Foxy]

You mean the four horsemen?

 

[WillofKhrone]

I mean what I say and say what I mean.

 

[apsycobear]

he means council of four(name he made up wich has a nice sound to it actualy), as in Balnazaar, Varimathras, Mal'Ganish, and Mephistroth(the currently "alive" dreadlords, Mephistroth being leader of the nathrezim i think)

Edit: Mehpistroth leads the nathrezim, deathroc was killed by sylvanas(my bad)

 

[Silverfish423]

Hmmm, interesting ideas everyone. Since one of the Masteries for Undead is the "Plague of Unbridled Wrath", we could this off-shoot idea into it as well! (since they both encompass the same thing)

All of these ideas everyone is coming up with are fantastic! WillofKhrone is like a Lore Event machine...he just pumps em out time and time again! haha xD

Keep em coming guys! These events will surely increase the quality of SoA!