Let's make a map! (Forum Game idea)

[Silva]

Although I like the idea of melee maps, but there's not much people can add to it other than terrains, neutral creeps and quests.

I suggest an RPG map. the protagonist will have a small intro with no basic story, that's where the members come in to fill that hole. Creating a story and an adventure for our hero. Sorta like the "3 word game" in the forum but a playable one. Also, each member has to add small progress so as to prolong the fun.

 

[Empirean]

Make it a choose your own adventure type of rpg where you decision can affect the outcome of the story. I.e. You found a glowing rock and u picked it up and something happens.

 

[Silva]

Make it a choose your own adventure type of rpg where you decision can affect the outcome of the story. I.e. You found a glowing rock and u picked it up and something happens.

I like that. So the story has a beginning but the ending is set by players.

 

[xXAgeofComedyXx]

I like that. So the story has a beginning but the ending is set by players.

That's a really good idea. Question is how will it work? It would be pretty hard to trigger right.

 

[pick-a-chew]

RPGs are big projects and going from the fact that big projects fail on these "make a map" things then i'd vote strongly against it.

You want a map that can be played with relatively little development, yet which can be expanded if there's enough editor interest in it (essentially anything with waves or levels like TDs, defenses or min-games).

However, the RPG-adventure concept could work like mini-game/RPG fusion, where the decisions you make determine which scenario you face next. Example: You start in a room with 3 doors, and going through one "teleports" you to another room with a different situation (e.g. kill 1 abomination to open a door, or escape through a different door to the left)

Definitely shouldn't be open world though

That way, it would be easy for people to drop in, add a scenario/situation, link it to a previous scenario, and be done with it.

 

[Silva]

That's a really good idea. Question is how will it work? It would be pretty hard to trigger right.

Basic knowledge is enough. Like creating quests and stuff.

RPGs are big projects and going from the fact that big projects fail on these "make a map" things then i'd vote strongly against it.

If there are enough members, it can be fun to do, more than 3 at least. Plus, last map was a TD, it'd be repetitive.

That way, it would be easy for people to drop in, add a scenario/situation, link it to a previous scenario, and be done with it.

Like the idea.

 

[pick-a-chew]

Plus, last map was a TD, it'd be repetitive.

Out of curiosity, was the TD successful?

RPGs will still be too freeform imo, they'll only work if the team working on it follow the theme and expectations of the project (and you can sort of expect less-skilled people working on this thing to add ridiculous things which will break any sense of immersion and role-play )

 

[Empirean]

i suggest you layout the storyline first and the setting of the story then let people add the characters. you should be able to establish something there

 

[Silva]

@pick-a-chew

You can try it out yourself, won't take you long. It has great models but I got stuck at 1st gate opens.

@Empirean

It's just a suggestion, perhaps RPGs aren't the sort of maps for threads like this.

 

[Spellbound]

I think a TD would be fun, but I'm in a mood to make towers so I might be a bit biased. As for an RPG, that will require a lot of planning to get it to work right.

 

[Empirean]

if you want an easy map to deploy go for td or survival. its fun to do and most people will have fun with it. also you might want to add a competitive aspect into your map so make other team spawn the monster other team must fight. it will be like a hero defense, boss, hero arena mashup.

 

[pick-a-chew]

Essentially any map type that has a simple backbone of triggers would be perfect.

 

[Empirean]

edit a blizzard's melee map then supply a trigger that spawns enemies. tada

 

[Spellbound]

I think they mean some useful systems like an indexer, a dds, etc. A spawning system would be viable if it's a TD, otherwise optional.

 

[pick-a-chew]

We (or i? ) meant more a long the lines of something like a spawning system. For example, you can make a handful of triggers that handles the loading, execution and finishing of all waves/levels. All you would need to do is to create a profile trigger for each wave, and leave it to the system to execute it. Which is something anyone can do.

Example:

Derpette takes the map and makes level 1. For level 1, she creates a few units, creates the profile trigger and inserts her wave variables (the units, amount and location they spawn). That's it. She tests the map, and the system in place spawns the level as she wants.

Derpington next takes the map, and makes level 2 and level 3 with whatever units he desires, makes a profile trigger for level 2 and 3, and tests. The system will run level 1, then Derpington's level 2 and 3. And it's easy to give the system flexibility to change things around.

How flexible a system is depends on how much effort you put into it, but for basics, it's easy to create a system that allows you to determine what unit types you want spawned, how many, at what location, and how quickly they spawn.

I think most Tower Defenses deploy a similar system to this, but really such a system can be extended to any game that is separated into areas/levels.

 

[Silva]

We (or i? ) meant more a long the lines of something like a spawning system. For example, you can make a handful of triggers that handles the loading, execution and finishing of all waves/levels. All you would need to do is to create a profile trigger for each wave, and leave it to the system to execute it. Which is something anyone can do.

Example:

Derpette takes the map and makes level 1. For level 1, she creates a few units, creates the profile trigger and inserts her wave variables (the units, amount and location they spawn). That's it. She tests the map, and the system in place spawns the level as she wants.

Derpington next takes the map, and makes level 2 and level 3 with whatever units he desires, makes a profile trigger for level 2 and 3, and tests. The system will run level 1, then Derpington's level 2 and 3. And it's easy to give the system flexibility to change things around.

How flexible a system is depends on how much effort you put into it, but for basics, it's easy to create a system that allows you to determine what unit types you want spawned, how many, at what location, and how quickly they spawn.

I think most Tower Defenses deploy a similar system to this, but really such a system can be extended to any game that is separated into areas/levels.

You can't do much with this kind of map, just adding waves/levels. Meanwhile the idea of rpg/mini-game fusion sounds more promising. and it can attract new members as well as veteran hivers.

 

[QuillQuickcard]

I think a sandbox map is best. Everybody can develop their own areas with their own characters and bits. They don't need to necessarily overlap, and in the end, we have a shockingly varied creation that highlights well the vision of every person who touched it.

If we want to attract editors, why bother for consistency? Ridiculous fun is also an option.

 

[pick-a-chew]

You can't do much with this kind of map, just adding waves/levels. Meanwhile the idea of rpg/mini-game fusion sounds more promising. and it can attract new members as well as veteran hivers.

But you can, with enough cunning and triggering . Mini-games would be the equivalent of a level, in fact games like Uther Party and Pyramid Escape likely use such a system to transition from mini-game to mini-game, with additional triggers specific to each mini-game.

The only way a system can't be used like this is if the map is "open world" (no way to partition levels, such as in risk, altered melees, rpgs etc.)

I think a sandbox map is best. Everybody can develop their own areas with their own characters and bits. They don't need to necessarily overlap, and in the end, we have a shockingly varied creation that highlights well the vision of every person who touched it.

If we want to attract editors, why bother for consistency? Ridiculous fun is also an option.

It is, and that probably comes down to preference. Some people like a map that makes sense and has some consistency to it, whilst some people prefer just chaos and randomness - and with it being an open project, the latter is probably the case.

Sandboxes have no beginning or end though, there's not really a design a goal, they'd be more like "make a loada crap and shove it in" - or maybe that's just my view on that game type

Personally i'd like to make something that the Hive community would be proud of, but this might not be the place for that

 

[QuillQuickcard]

Fair points, all.
Well, I vote for sandbox, but I'll be a happy contributor to anything that comes up.

Quill Quickcard, officially onboard.

 

[Silva]

Until now, the rpg/mini-games is the best candidate. It has consistency and can be as fun as the members make it. It doesn't have to be a big project or something the hive has to be proud of. After all, it's about having fun.

And we don't have to worry about people adding crap that doesn't relate to the theme as long as we're spending time working on it.

Example : Jack (main character) find himself unconscious on the shore of a beach. He doesn't remember what happened to him, but he's about to find out.

Next one : implement ideas

 

[Empirean]

alright whats the title of the map?

 

[pick-a-chew]

How can we think of a title when we don't even know what's going to happen? All we know is that Jack is unconscious on a beach at the moment .

The Adventure of Jack

There are *some* things that should DEFINITELY be decided before any huge work is done though, such as if it is multiplayer, the tileset, how fast-paced the game is, how the game starts (we know this much ) and how it should end etc. otherwise whatever is made by people will probably have to be refined several times to make it all fit together.

The more i think about it, an RPG/mini-game adventure-style map could be interesting to make. I think it's best if someone puts together a prototype of something first; any volunteers? Else i could do it tomorrow

@Quill; i think anything with RPG will actually be quite sandboxish anyway

 

[Empirean]

i suggest that you make a poll on what project most members want to tackle. from there we can see which kind of map we can get most help.

 

[pick-a-chew]

I agree, but i have no idea how to do polls. I also suggest we wait at least a day, because there are probably some folk who have yet to give any input in the matter.

 

[Spellbound]

Hmm, do you think we could use a missile system? There should be some GUI versions out there that we can make use of. The reason for that would be to make combat a bit more dynamic. If we have a system that does collision detection, we can have a multitude of different dodge and block mechanics (I mean walls) that Jack can use to make combat more interesting. Y'know, as opposed to just stand there and let his attac/abilities go off cooldown.

That may be going a bit too complicated, but hey, a good plan gets you further than no plan at all.

Also knockback system.

 

[Silva]

The Adventure of Jack

There are *some* things that should DEFINITELY be decided before any huge work is done though, such as if it is multiplayer, the tileset, how fast-paced the game is, how the game starts (we know this much ) and how it should end etc.

Title : The adventures of Jack
Story : Jack wakes up to find himself on the shores of a beach with no memory of what brought him there, however, the next events will trigger his memory.
Theme : Island/forest/villages/castles
Map size : Big preferably
Map type : RPG

The ending shouldn't be stated, because we want to give others the chance to set the story. However, it should be assigned to someone so when we get bored or finished with it, he'll come and wrap it up.

I don't think that multiplayer will be easy to make, specially if we're focusing on scenarios and events.

Tileset : something that matches the theme, like sunken ruins or cityscape

@pick-a-chew Now we only need the prototype. :3

@Spellbound sounds nice but difficult. I can do knockback spells but block and dodge mechanics are new to me.

 

[Spellbound]

There are systems already for that. If we use a missile system that has collision detection, we can just use a knockback system for the dodging. I can handle that. We'll keep it GUI so that newbies can get a better sense of how to use it, not to mention vJASS doesn't seem to popular here

As far as the story is concerned, leave notes when you add in a cinematic or some sort of conversation so some else or I can proofread it. There are some great projects here on the Hive, but the writing is almost always bad in some way, especially dialogue.

 

[Silva]

@Spellbound We have to have the map first to know what systems to put in it.

And like the first map, this map must include a quest named "Progress" for example where anyone who contributes can add a comment to it mentioning what edits he did.

 

[Spellbound]

Well I'm mostly tossing ideas around from a technical standpoint (not to mention this will ultimately be up to a vote, correct?), since most projects start and then die off because it was too ambitious, so knowing what a map can do can help with the scope of things.

As for the map itself, something like Rexxar's campaign could be a good way to go about it, like someone mentioned previously. Gives people the opportunity to add their own stuff to the map without interfering with what others made.

 

[pick-a-chew]

So i toyed around with what i had in mind earlier, (made it in about 1 hour, don't laugh ) and have attached it. Basically, each event/scenario will connect to others and *eventually* jack will find his way home.

 

[Silva]

So i toyed around with what i had in mind earlier, (made it in about 1 hour, don't laugh ) and have attached it. Basically, each event/scenario will connect to others and *eventually* jack will find his way home.

Nice work (not laughing ) but I'm not sure about the tileset, it's a little gloomy, and doesn't really inspire a lot of scenarios.

And like @Spellbound said, I don't want to get to work before I'm sure this is what we're working on. A poll seems only necessary.

 

[pick-a-chew]

I was going for a "lost" kind of feel, though i think any tileset with natural and manmade cliffs will do.

Agree on poll, though things are looking unanimous at the moment!

 

[Silva]

I'm down for this. :3 Let's see what the others say.

 

[Spellbound]

I like the underground tileset - shipwrecks are always on the beach. This changes from that cliché imo. That being said, I'm not opposed to beaches

 

[pick-a-chew]

I like the underground tileset - shipwrecks are always on the beach. This changes from that cliché imo. That being said, I'm not opposed to beaches

I didn't have time to make a good beach, opted for a cove . In all seriousness though, even though the two "rooms" i have are quite small, there's nothing really stopping you from doing a big stretch of beach for another zone. (though you can't make beaches without a sand so who knows)

I did think that Sunken Ruins would be the best tileset, but it's quite used in RPGs which is why i steered away from it. However i'm happy using anything really. Key of RPGs is in the decoration/doodads.

 

[QuillQuickcard]

I guess we need to decide some very basic things. I hereby declare this an unofficial poll for very basic infor.

Is this map going to be in Azeroth, or a totally original setting?
Are we going for serious or silly?
Should we plan our direction/story in advance, or just see where things lead?

I vote for Azeroth, Silly, and See Where Things Lead.

 

[Spellbound]

So something like Joe's Quest? I think we should not have it in Azeroth so you have the freedom to invent everything.

 

[xXAgeofComedyXx]

Hm. I also think there should be multiple villains but one major overarching, mysterious villain. Maybe we could add boss fights to the rpg?
I vote for Not Azeroth, Silly, where things lead but with minor planning

 

[Zwiebelchen]

That's a really good idea. Question is how will it work? It would be pretty hard to trigger right.

Not if you make it a text adventure.

You just need a system that provides the decision tree and people that use that system to fill it with text.


Such a system can be wrote in 10 lines. Ask in the trigger section if you need a JASSer write it for you, then you guys can all use it to create a massive 80's style text adventure.

 

[Silva]

Is this map going to be in Azeroth, or a totally original setting?
Are we going for serious or silly?
Should we plan our direction/story in advance, or just see where things lead

Well not knowing what the others are gonna do is kind of the fun of this, but I agree that we should set some basics.

I vote Not azeroth, silly or serious (depends on the person, really) and see where things lead.

 

[pick-a-chew]

I'd stick to a particular theme unless we don't want coherency in our RPG . Azeroth is nice because everyone knows about it. Anything custom can be fun too, but will be prone to people making weird things (e.g. 1 person might make a human encampment with footmen and riflemen, whilst someone else imports spaceships or some silly anime things).

I guess i value immersion in RPGs, but perhaps that's just me.

Serious AND Silly can work. I think a bit of (sensible) comedy will work wonders. Again, if Jack got ambushed by a group of Protoss Ships, i wouldn't be very impressed unless it was well scripted.

See where things lead. We could have multiple endings.

@Zwielbelchen; that's what (i think) we're aiming for. But i don't think we're depending on text that hugely. Similar to those adventure books where you're presented with options 1 or 2, which both lead to a different passage, but instead of text, we'll be moving Jack around the map to different areas.

I.e. decision tree that uses regions instead of text

 

[Silva]

Anything custom can be fun too, but will be prone to people making weird things (e.g. 1 person might make a human encampment with footmen and riflemen, whilst someone else imports spaceships or some silly anime things).

Well, a little consistency is required. Like the characters don't have to be from Azeroth (i.e illidan/maiev/janna/etc) but the models can. But not heavily modified models like anime stuff or spaceships or stuff.

By the way, don't work on the map now because I'm making something at the moment.

 

[pick-a-chew]

Well, a little consistency is required. Like the characters don't have to be from Azeroth (i.e illidan/maiev/janna/etc) but the models can. But not heavily modified models like anime stuff or spaceships or stuff.

By the way, don't work on the map now because I'm making something at the moment.

Ooo *excited!*

I would actually think using characters like illidan or whatever would be bad, it's always fun to e.g. make a new Demon Hunter who you meet who you have to fight or help or whatever. Gives you a chance to be creative and develop something new and interesting.

 

[Silva]

Another challenge for our adventurer.
It's kind of sloppy but this is just to get things going.

 

[Spellbound]

Lol, I had too google that riddle. Anyway, looks promising. I'll mostly concern myself with making spells if I ever do get involved.

 

[pick-a-chew]

Nicely done Silva!

 

[Windrunner29]

Could I do the terraining ? I really love the concept of this thread Too bad that I didn't noticed it before

 

[pick-a-chew]

Hey Wind, i'm working on it at the mo (i thought i posted but apparently not :S). If i post it back, you can then work on it. If you're already done stuff, i can copy it over to my version.

You can terrain where you are allowed . If you want to make a nice bit of terrain someone can use for a Scenario feel free. Also the first area (with Jack) is bare, so feel free to decorate that.

 

[Windrunner29]

Thanks! I'll do it when you have finished your part

 

[pick-a-chew]

I added the 3rd Scenario. At the moment it links from the medium door in area 1.

Come on people, don't be shy . It will take you 1-2 hours to add something to this!

Oh, and there you go Windrunner. If you have an idea for an area, but don't know how to trigger (or are to lazy ), and just want to do the terrain, let me know what you have in mind and i'll probably be able to make the triggers.