In Unanimous Vote, Russia Passes Bill Making It Illegal To Tell Kids Gay People Exist

[AIagremm]

I included Northern Europe in 'Western Europe'. I'm not talking about geography, but rather geopolitics and society. I meant the liberal half of Europe compared to the more conservative half.

 

[Edhel-dur]

So you're saying your selfish and irresponsible?

 

[trolman]

Unless the baby poses a serious threat to the mothers life, abortion should not be an option.

Yes im a random internet person of the internet but its not like parents "own" the life of their kids as they will go to jail if they murder their child but they wont if its unborn and thats the real problem i have, the embyro may not be a human yet but in nine months it will. Why should they be denied the joy of life me and you were granted.

 

[Razosh]

No I clearly misunderstood what you were trying to say Edhel-dur.

However you can't change the fact that out of the 349 people sitting on the swedish riksdag which leads Sweden only 22 opposed same sex marriage and only 20 voted to keep abortion illegal.

And if the child really lives before it's born is a hard question to answer for example the child does not start to show any signs of personality until it has reached a few months of age and the Jewish belief actually also say that the human is not a person until it passes out of the mother.

 

[AIagremm]

Scandinavia is a very liberal society in the first place. Although I have my personal doubts on how long that can last.

 

[Razosh]

Considering that Scandinavia is getting less and less religious by the day I would say it will keep on for quite a while.

 

[trolman]

Balkanistan is on 7th in number of abortions per citizen in the world and the only reason we're only 7 is because the population cant have more abortions because we had too many abortions, keep in mind balkanistan has a population of 7 milion. Thank you state atheism *kisses the Lenin statue*

 

[AIagremm]

What made you think I was talking about religion? Frankly, considering how few truly religious people there are even in religious states, it's not a strong influence in the first place.

Don't fool yourself with the illusion of stability. You have not created a new order of ages. History goes in circles and everything ends sooner or later. How long do you think you can keep up?

Well, to be fair, Orthodox church was the best during communist times, simply because it was not corrupt. Only people who were deeply became part of it, under the threat of being punished by the state. That was when it was holy. After that... just a business.

 

[Razosh]

Yes and why is abortion a bad thing since the child might not be wanted it might end up aborted and then it can be used for stem cell research to help people with illnesses survive.

 

[Edhel-dur]

However you can't change the fact that out of the 349 people sitting on the swedish riksdag which leads Sweden only 22 opposed same sex marriage and only 20 voted to keep abortion illegal.

Since when is Sweden the only society on Earth? Just because swedish agrees to something means it's the right thing to do?

Thinking that you can deny a babies opportunity to live just because "gee, I'm not sure, I wanna finish college first and play video games" is just out right immature and stupid.

 

[AIagremm]

Oh boy. Oh heck. You just HAD to mention using embryos for stem cell research.

*Takes out an umbrella*
The weather is a cloudy with a small chance of sh&tstorm.

 

[trolman]

Except when you learn that stem cell research can be done on adluts with no harm at all and realise that keeping those babies is better for society and science.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adult_stem_cell_research

 

[Razosh]

And bringing a child into the world of which you can't feed or put a roof over it's head is not irresponsible and immature?

I think it's actually really mature and brave to stand up and say that it's not the right moment to have a child and actually take responsibility for your child's well faring. And if it's wrong to not give a child the chance to live than I need to be spreading my sperm constantly so that no sperm goes unused because do you know how many sperms die per second. And considering how many other animals humans kill just for the fun of it I have hard to imagine it's any different to kill a human since we're animals just as any other mammal.

And why should I not mention stem cell research had planned to do something else withe aborted child? Maybe use it as a book marker?

 

[Edhel-dur]

And bringing a child into the world of which you can't feed or put a roof over it's head is not irresponsible and immature?

I think it's actually really mature and brave to stand up and say that it's not the right moment to have a child and actually take responsibility for your child's well faring. And if it's wrong to not give a child the chance to live than I need to be spreading my sperm constantly so that no sperm goes unused because do you know how many sperms die per second. And considering how many other animals humans kill just for the fun of it I have hard to imagine it's any different to kill a human since we're animals just as any other mammal.

And why should I not mention stem cell research had planned to do something else withe aborted child? Maybe use it as a book marker?

If you can't feed and put a roof over it's head, that means you are homeless. I thought we were talking about people who are part of society, not homeless people.

If you want to make an abortion, okay fine, make it. But don't argue about it in a casual manner as if we're choosing between chicken or beef for dinner. Because it's not.

And no, it takes no amount of bravery to abort a child.

Animal cruelty and hunting for sport is going way offtopic. Stop doing that. Focus on the discussion at hand.

 

[Razosh]

We're not only talking about homeless people we're talking of teenagers and it gets more and more common with teenage parents today who does not have a paying work.

 

[Edhel-dur]

We're not only talking about homeless people we're talking of teenagers and it gets more and more common with teenage parents today who does not have a paying work.

Teenagers don't have roofs over their heads? Well they can start working. They are young, it's an advantage. Don't they have parents and grandparents? Who said those teenagers need to raise that child alone?

 

[Razosh]

So adults should have to live with their children no matter the situation? Abortions is allowed for a reason and that is that sometimes having a child makes the life of the parents worse and the parents in turn makes the life of the child worse. Abortions is allowed because in some situations it does help and if it helps I see no reason why it should not be allowed. Besides I see no reason why it's cruel to send a child to the eternal void we all have to go there sooner or later and letting a child who never knew life do without life is not cruel.

 

[trolman]

Mmmm so many wrongs in a post, lets start!

And bringing a child into the world of which you can't feed or put a roof over it's head is not irresponsible and immature?

Except when you've got the money for an abortion, you have enough roof and food for yourself. Also i bet you were born in a very supplied and materialistic family if you think the joy of life is food and roof.

I think it's actually really mature and brave to stand up and say that it's not the right moment to have a child and actually take responsibility for your child's well faring.

Its responsable to pay a bunch of money to some doctor who will litteraly poke your child out of excistance? Its mature and brave to kill your child and that makes your responsive of the kids well faring? By not letting it feel life?

And if it's wrong to not give a child the chance to live than I need to be spreading my sperm constantly so that no sperm goes unused because do you know how many sperms die per second.

You never paid much attention in biology class huh? Do you happen to know that a baby forms when the fathers sperm meets the mother's egg? Yes those are just cells but if you dont have sex they will just die inside your organs and get replaced by new ones. So basicly no, masterbation doesent count as abortion becasue you couldnt have created life.

And considering how many other animals humans kill just for the fun of it I have hard to imagine it's any different to kill a human since we're animals just as any other mammal.

Oh... when you think about it you really are right for one thing. We are animals and i've always wanted to have a shootout with the police in real life. With this revalation im off to comit murder!

And why should I not mention stem cell research had planned to do something else withe aborted child? Maybe use it as a book marker?

Here's a hint, dont abort it.

Srsly this is what "debating" with you feels like.

 

[Edhel-dur]

If you're an adult, and a mature one, why wouldn't you love your child? Hence why wouldn't you help your child overcome a struggle in his life? Hence why wouldn't you love your grandchild?

What kind of adult are you if you don't feel all of those?

It's not about if it's cruel or not. It's about what the society is promoting. You are promoting immature behavior. Let's not protect ourselves, we have the law which allows us to undo any mistake we did. That's how the folk understands any law. Promote use of condoms and bc pills, don't have abortions legal so the folk will think a second time before having sex without protection.

 

[trolman]

Oh wow sorry for the double post but if i edit my previous one, im sure our thread genius will not notice it.

So adults should have to live with their children no matter the situation? Abortions is allowed for a reason and that is that sometimes having a child makes the life of the parents worse and the parents in turn makes the life of the child worse. Abortions is allowed because in some situations it does help and if it helps I see no reason why it should not be allowed. Besides I see no reason why it's cruel to send a child to the eternal void we all have to go there sooner or later and letting a child who never knew life do without life is not cruel.

Oh lol even more stupidity having children is so worse BAH! Lets all stop having children and force abortion all of the time, that way mankind will improve.

But why dont you go to the ethernal void now, like srsly go to the kitchen, get the knife and GG on your vains. Why not, we're all gonna die anyway, do it while I rape your sister, because we're all humans and we're all gonna die. Im so intelligent

 

[Razosh]

First of all an abortion in Sweden costs next to nothing thanks to our high tax rate.

Second of all trolman we are not discussing when the sperm starts living which technically is in the sperm sack not in the mothers belly. We're discussing when the baby has a personality and a consciousness.

And over to Edhel-dur. You don't need to hate your child yo make him or her miserable.

And lastly if you're not ready why do you feel that you have the right to force someone too be a parent?

 

[Edhel-dur]

I'm not forcing anyone to be a parent. But don't talk about abortion as if it's something casual like declining some ice-cream because it's not chocolate.

Tell me, how do you make a child be miserable?

 

[Razosh]

I'm not saying that I think it's good with people going around and planning mass abortion before they're pregnant I say that it's a good thing too have abortions legal if it makes the scenario better.

How do you make a child miserable? Well there are a lot of ways to make a child miserable for instance a lot of children are looked on as an unnecessary asset and a lot of times of times whether the parents are aware of it or not they are also being treated that way. Children grow up not ever daring to say anything against their parents since they fear them.

 

[trolman]

Then you wouldnt have trouble feeding and housing your child because Sweeden is so great.

No.No. Sperm is just sperm, a baby is sperm+egg=embyro + time = baby . You cant make a embyro without sperm or an egg but when you have an embyro theres no way you cant have time for it to turn into a baby.

Do you even know what Misery is?

Considering that someone didnt use protection or better yet, abstain then if you've gone that far, congratulations youre going to be a parent, you cant just wash your hands away from a child's life.

 

[Edhel-dur]

How do you make a child miserable? Well there are a lot of ways to make a child miserable for instance a lot of children are looked on as an unnecessary asset and a lot of times of times whether the parents are aware of it or not they are also being treated that way. Children grow up not ever daring to say anything against their parents since they fear them.

That's not miserable at all.

 

[Razosh]

Exactly +time makes it into a baby so with other words this is not a person because it has not had the time.

Why is it wrong to kill a human and not a cow or a pig or a shark? Humans are already vicious killers I see no reason what difference one more life would make.

So being told by your parents that you should never have been born you would describe as what exactly? Happiness. Even though it does not necessarily lead to you being miserable it sure as hell can.

 

[trolman]

Exactly +time makes it into a baby so with other words this is not a person because it has not had the time.

But it will be a person and the only way you can take that away is if you murder it, not like a sperm that will die anyways without becoming a human.

Why is it wrong to kill a human and not a cow or a pig or a shark? Humans are already vicious killers I see no reason what difference one more life would make.

Go read the bible.

So being told by your parents that you should never have been born you would describe as what exactly? Happiness. Even though it does not necessarily lead to you being miserable it sure as hell can.

Ugh.Do i really need to reply to this?

 

[Nuclear]

This thread needs to be nuked from orbit, too much stupid. Surprising to see how many casual bigots there are on the Hive though.

 

[trolman]

This thread needs to be nuked from orbit, too much stupid. Surprising to see how many casual bigots there are on the Hive though.

Are you upset?

 

[Razosh]

1. And animals are not persons? They have personalities which makes them into persons.

2. I'm an atheist I do not believe in any God.

 

[trolman]

1. No

2. Its very obvious.

 

[Razosh]

1. Apparently you've never spent a lot of time with other animals than humans for if you had you'd known that's not true.

2. Thank you.

 

[Nuclear]

Are you upset?

Not particularly, just baffled.

1. Apparently you've never spent a lot of time with other animals than humans for if you had you'd known that's not true.

Just because animals have certain patterns of behavior, it doesn't give them "personality", learn the definitions.

 

[trolman]

1. http://tobey100.hubpages.com/hub/10-Reasons-Why-pets-are-Not-People

2.Thats not a compliment.

 

[Edhel-dur]

So being told by your parents that you should never have been born you would describe as what exactly? Happiness. Even though it does not necessarily lead to you being miserable it sure as hell can.

That alone can't make a child be miserable. For example, if the parents gave their child all the materialistic things they need, eventually that child will find someone else to love them.

 

[Zakamutt]

/thread

 

[Edhel-dur]

If that's what you truly believe then you weren't paying attention to the thread.

 

[Razosh]

But humans also have those patterns so that means that neither are we persons.

And then again other animals are very much like humans in their personalities not suprising though since we're both mammals which means we're related or atleast acourding to sciense.

1. Oh and trolman about that 10 reasons. And also other animals are not humans I'm saying they're persons, however.

Reason One: Elephants are believed to have a skill for conversation believed to be as advanced if not more advanced than ours it's been proven that they can comunicate in sound frequences so low that the human brain can not process it and they have been proven to have a wide list of words.

Reason Two: Animals such as cats stay in your house because you provide them with food, a place to rest, a life without stress and in return they give you nothing. Dogs on the other hand are pack animals and can not survive without a pack so they stay with you to survive. Cats on the other hand are known to desert humans if they're being misstreated. There's a lot of humans who has lived as slaves and that is actually living under worse contidions than a pet. Maybe it's just me but where do I sign to get free food and house room in exchange for looking cute?

Reason Three: Why would they care about money when they hunt their own food and live as kings in our houses for free?

Reason Four: Everywhere you look different persons have different views on what's common curtasy and all animals as well as humans are not born knowing that it's wrong to clean yourself on the carpet but just as humans they understand that it's wrong if you teach them the right way.

Reason Five: Other animals also have learnt not to eat anything they find there was a house sparrow and she wanted to eat the food on the plates so badly and she was constantly being pushed out so in order to survive she had to eat the burnt out remains of cigarets and the house sparrow has been my favorite bird for 10 years and during all the time I've lived I've never before seen any house sparrow eat cigaretttes nor has anyone I've ever spoken too.

Reason Six: Evolution grants animal the best body parts for what they're requiered to do and for example a cat that can get tails that are longer than the rest of their body need it to keep balance when for example they're climbing trees and they do not need thumbs.

Reson Seven: Do I even need to discuss this one? Ok fine... gas is caused by air that's being locked up with your pop and that's why it smells bad. And when we're discussing teretorial animals such as cats and dogs who use smell to mark their territory then stinking farts is kind of a good feature.

Reason Eight: It will take ALOT for a horse to run into a burning barn and dogs chase cars because they have built in to excercise since being a hunter is a tough life so you need to be fit and chasing cars will make for excellent training. And a cat will run up in a tree again because he or she did not need your help in the first place and climbed there by chooise. And it's not like humans are extreamlly brilliant so I think it's funny that you judge other animals.

Reason Nine: I've already been through this you give me ten reasons and two of them are pretty much the same thing.

Reason Ten: Really pets can't tell time? Let's take cats who are really awesome at this. There are alot of cats who have gatherings every day and the same time of the day every time and they do not use a watch so that's pretty darn impressive in my opinion.

2. I like myself the way I am and you said it's obvious I'm the way I am so that's a compliment in my ears.

 

[trolman]

1. Lol seriosly? I paste some random site of google i didnt even bother to read and you try to have a proper debate about such an unrelated topic? Humans are the top of the food chain, and as Darwin said : Nom,nom,nom this has nothing to do with abortion.
2. Enjoy yourself.

 

[AIagremm]

People like you make me hate Scandinavia. Stop it.

Nuclear, just because someone doesn't share your opinion, that doesn't make him a bigot. You hypocrite.

 

[Razosh]

Well trolman actually the topic was same sex relations and not abortions but I'm happy to debate either way. And yes we're at the top of the food chain but does that mean that we are better than them? No. Does it mean that we can do whatever we like to animals after all Hitler did as he liked.

Alagremm I'm simply stating my opinion that all animals are equal and if anti racism makes you hate Scandinavia then go ahead.

 

[fladdermasken]

[REACTION=http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7183/6808865064_b7a6688b5b_b.jpg]This community has declined so much in debating skills it's not even funny.[/REACTION]

 

[AIagremm]

...racism?

 

[Razosh]

Saying that cats and other animals are worth less than humans is as bad as saying ethnic group A is worth less than ethnic group B.

 

[trolman]

cats=humans

 

[fladdermasken]

I miss Hakeem, Ash and Poot.

 

[AIagremm]

Because f%$# logic.

Yah, Hakeem was great.

 

[Edhel-dur]

@lowe1994ba Humans aren't animals.

Reason One: Animals do communicate between themselves. That doesn't make them a person. Just like because you can talk it doesn't make you intelligent.

Reason Two: Maybe it's just me but where do I sign to get free food and house room in exchange for looking cute? - Also known as a trophy wife.

Reason Three: Why do cats don't worry about money? WHAT!?

Reason Four: I dare you to teach pig to be clean.

Reason Five: I'm pretty sure that just one damaged sparrow. Either that or she was locked without any food, and the only food was on a plate.

Reason Six: It's the other way around, animals gain body traits depending on what their species needs to adapt too in terms of conditions.

Reson Seven: Who claimed animals didn't mark their territory with piss and poop?

Reason Eight: I don't even... what?

Reason Nine: Again... what?

Reason Ten: They know it's time to gather! But they can't actually tell time. They rely on the light they see to read 'time'.

I don't really understand why you brought animals into this discussion. Just like I don't get why you brought abortion into this discussion since it's originally about gay marriage.

Furthermore I don't understand the overall point you're trying to make.

Edit: @fladdermasken - I know, right?

 

[SA Dashie]

Humans, just like other animals are brought to us by evolution. Evolution helped bring what cats need and the fact that there are cats. Same as any other animal.

From what I am seeing here is debating about how animals can closely relate to humans. Although what has seemed to happen now is that something living needs to have in-depth persona enough for it to be considered murder. But yet not worrying so much about an animals death in any usual case as a human death.

Reason why abortion isn't illegal in alot of countries would be cause you wouldn't be killing them off because of there personality(as murder would usually be only attempted to someone that they clearly have against in anyway).

A reason why someone would be going so much against abortion is that your pretty much killing apart of yourself(assuming that the woman is the one considering).


Wait wasn't this topic about some country going against homosexuality?

 

[Razosh]

Yes that's what I'm saying cats have the same value as any human and I'm being mashed at for a lot of things here first it's because I think that homosexuals should have the same rights as any heterosexual person should. You argue that it's wrong because they can't have children but what does love have to do with making children? Why do you oppose this are you afraid you'd like same sex intercourse if you gave it a chance.

Second I get mashed at for thinking that in many situations abortion is a good solution.

And now I'm being mashed at for saying that all living beings are equals.

I can't wait to see what you'll mash me for next.

And Edhel-dur I brought animals into the discussion because they're still looked upon by many as if they're not as good as humans and that's the exact same thing people think about homosexuals so I thought it good since they're in a small way related topics.