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Huge Project Which I may be in over my head on!

Discussion in 'World Editor Help Zone' started by aussj5link, Dec 9, 2014.

  1. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    Oh man, I'm definitely going to need that in the future. Right now I have a lot of work ahead of me in the terrain but in the future I do plan to have a system for quests, item storage, abilities, talents, and professions to name a few. At the moment I've been reading about the cliff making but Iseem to be having trouble making the cliffs at a straight incline which I need for the walls and walk-ability.
     
  2. Wietlol

    Wietlol

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    Maybe ask for some experienced terrainer to guide you to a certain point.
    There are a lot of excellent terrainers around here that can learn you a lot of how to do something and how to keep it simple.

    For the systems... There are also indeed a lot of amazing vJASS/JASS programmers in here that can make everything you need.
    In fact. The system is the same for every RPG (with small modifications in how professions, talents, etc. are used.)
     
  3. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    Seems I have ran into another problem. The scout towers I was using for the bunkers on the harbor are lowering perfectly on the editor, but when I went to test a couple of pathing blockers I put in to prevent people from running right up mountains, I noticed that in-game the towers are sticking up out of the ground incorrectly. Anyone know why the editor is showing the towers in the correct spots but in-game they are refusing to get in their spot?

    Edit: I'm wondering if using too many pathing blockers can be a problem in the future. I'm going to be using quite a lot due to using the terrain raising and lowering method to create everything. Am I looking at a laggy or unstable map further down the line if I continue to base a lot of the map around blockers?
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2014
  4. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    Ok I figured out the issue with the scout towers. Apparently if they all too close to an edge, despite the fact they have no pathing map, the game gets confused and moves them away from the edge in a seeming random fashion. As for the height not being correct, it seems it doesn't set the height correctly if the movement type is set to Fly, instead, Hover is what it needs to be set to to be at the correct height in game.

    I just finished creating the wooden stairs I needed using a bunch of table doodads and I am now working on the straight incline I need for the cliffs. I was told I needed a certain txt file in a folder named "UI" in the WC3 folder in order to make the incline I need, but even with that, it seems to be giving me trouble. I will continue to update my progress and thank you all for your help.
     
  5. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    Progress is being made! It's slow right now, but as I learn more I accelerate in the terraining and what not. The mountains right now are really just a base image right now that I will be altering to look better in the future, but for now, my aim is to create the stairway leading up to Stormwind from the harbor and then adding tons of details with various doodads. When it's done I think it will look pretty good, unfortunately I'm not able to do everything I wanted, but I still think this is gonna look pretty great. Thank you all for your helps and any more tips you can give me are always appreciated! :goblin_good_job:
     

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  6. Sabertooth

    Sabertooth

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    Why imitate WoW, auss?
    I dig your drive and your big idea mentality, but I think you should apply it to a world of your own. Recreating World of Warcraft has been done a thousand times, and, honestly, I don't want to play "just another WoW-close attempt", I'd rather play a mediocre game in your world. This will also allow you to add neat features/remove features that are too hard / time consuming to implement.
     
  7. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    I actually have tried what few maps I could find based on WoW and they always seem to fall short, by a lot. I'm hoping that by doing this I can recapture at least some of the feel and appeal that have come to enjoy in WoW, but with the benefit of no monthly costs and not having to deal with people. I've always loved the game, the quests, exploration, instances and so on, but I never liked the fact that end game content required dealing with many strangers whose objectives are very rarely in parallel with my own. For example, there are sometimes bosses, events, paths and quests that you can skip, and if it can be skipped then it seemed like everyone but me wanted to skip them and get everything done as fast as possible, as if they considered the game a chore instead of something to do for fun. Then of course there's the people that if you don't play exactly to their specifications, will boot you out of groups making the game much less enjoyable.

    If I can do this I think it would be amazing, even if I am the only one playing. I would like to make the game so that you can play with up to 5 players and the games difficulty would adjust according to how many are playing at a time. Unfortunately I don't think this is a possibility with the custom campaign which I need to make the world scale better.

    These past few days since I started this project have been an amazing learning experience and I can't wait to have everything I want done and to be able to run around in it knowing that I put a lot of time and effort into it. I don't know programming, I've tied to learn in the past but I get confused very easily very fast. Because of this, when I want to make something I end up needing loads of help and an editor like WE to make any progress at all.
     
  8. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    Progress! Check out the sexy walls!
     

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  9. Zwiebelchen

    Zwiebelchen

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    I agree with sabertooth: Why recreate something that exists and is well known? Thats totally lame. Create something new and unique, instead of just repeating everything that has been done so far.
     
  10. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    I think I explained that pretty well, can't make it any more clear. :/
     
  11. Zwiebelchen

    Zwiebelchen

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    Well... if you insist, go ahead, but don't expect anyone to get hyped if it's just another WoW map.

    You are basicly falling into the same traps that many new mappers fall for:
    1) starting a map that has a scope way too big for what a single person can accomplish
    2) being very unoriginal
    3) starting out with an RPG map, instead of something that is easier to create at first

    Making a quality RPG map requires years of dedication and a lot of coding experience, if you want it to be good. There's a reason why people usually create tower defenses, Arenas or AoS maps for their first projects: they are perfect for learning, as the triggers involved in such maps are simple, the terrain needs to be functional (creating functional terrain is a skill that many new mappers miss ... they often end up with terrain that looks good, but suffers from terrible playability) and you learn a lot about balancing aswell, as you will instantly notice if something is overpowered just by playing the map against other players.


    Consider this an advice from someone who has been mapping since vanilla WC3 and who has seen hundreds of projects fail because people simply refused to set realistic goals for themselves.
     
  12. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    I don't mind if this takes a very long time. Hell, just this Harbor has taken me a week to get things better looking. As I figure out more stuff about terraining my progress will accelerate. As for the map working, collision-wise, I have been testing it quite frequently to make sure a unit is able to walk only where he is supposed to.

    I can see that you tend to avoid anything that doesn't scream originality and I can understand that. My reasons for this project are not based on creating originality but instead allowing playability of something that is hurting in certain departments but shining in others. I have played WoW for many years and I have come to a realization that the actual gameplay is what I enjoy so much. The multiplayer aspect seems more like baggage to me, like something I must get around to get back to the enjoyment of the game. I do believe that WoW is just that good of a game that even recreating it in a different medium like WC3 is worth it, especially if improvements can be made at the same time.

    This is not my first attempt at a map. A few years ago I tried to create a mix between "Melee" and "Hero War" where players would choose whether to play as melee (everything is basically the same) or Hero which would involve a hero capable of taking on everything a melee player can throw at them in a balanced fashion. It was going great, I figured out how to make revival systems, random item drops across the map, and many other things. Unfortunately, I don't remember a lot of that stuff and the map was lost when that computer's HDD decided to take a crap. Now that I seem to have nothing but time on my hands and not much way to do what I would like, I figured I'd make a way to do what I like lol.
     
  13. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    So I believe I have finished the Harbor! All that's left is tons of little doodads to make it look a little more like the game. I was screwing around with the sky thing, it looks cool but I hope it doesn't look square like that in-game lol
     

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  14. Zwiebelchen

    Zwiebelchen

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    Wait, you think that the multiplayer aspect of a "massively multiplayer online rpg" is the worst feature of the game?
     
  15. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    Yes, I think WoW would be much better is multiplayer was an option rather than a requirement. Blizzard has here an amazing game with a great story in an epic world. All of that is lost when you are forced to play with people who would rather spam chats with bullshit, fighting over petty things that have nothing to do with the game. People who would rather skip as much content as possible instead of enjoying the game for what it is. People who get their rocks off on doing nothing more than insulting anyone who doesn't play the game exactly the same way they do but continue to call the game an RPG. So much of the feel and enjoyment of the game is lost when you're doing an escort quest, having a blast protecting your charge, when someone from the opposite faction who is many levels higher than you, comes out of nowhere, kills everyone including the one you're trying to protect and then spams stupid insult emotes as you wait for the escort to respawn again, only to have to drop the quest and repick it up because it says you failed.

    Yes, many games are great in multiplayer, WoW, IMO, is not one of them.
     
  16. Zwiebelchen

    Zwiebelchen

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    You are clearly playing with the wrong people then. WoW is great for it's group content, not despite of it. Check out all the "singleplayer online rpgs" like ESO and see for yourself why they failed so hard.
     
  17. aussj5link

    aussj5link

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    If you're talking about the Elder Scrolls series then I have to say, you are very wrong when it comes to saying how bad they failed. The Elder Scrolls series is amazing. Elder Scrolls Online, from what I can tell, is not a singleplayer online game. It appears to be a cookie cutter mmorpg, unfortunately. This is not what I mean when I talk about a singleplayer/small group multiplayer WoW.
     
  18. Quilnez

    Quilnez

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    Try to make something smaller first (AoS map for example). See if you can finish it. Otherwise you have small chance to finish this, pretty close to impossible actually. Creating an average RPG game requires a lot of efforts. And to successfully develop a WoW-level RPG, it requires more than just total effort, it requires a team, an above-good team, and years. Just look at Gaias Retaliation, it's a small RPG (compared to WoW) yet it took more than 3 years to be finished already.

    That may sounds rude and discouraging, but it's better to piss you up to save you from wasting times. But eventually, it's up to you, if you just want to get experiences, then go on. If not, I suggest you to hold back or at least, as I have said before, try to experiment with something smaller.

    Good luck.
     
  19. Heinvers

    Heinvers

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    Always try baby steps first before leaping into a huge 'shit'.
     
  20. Zwiebelchen

    Zwiebelchen

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    I was only talking about Elder Scrolls Online. Which is more like a singleplayer game with a sub-par multiplayer due to the horrible phasing mechanics.