Gaias 1.2 ... and yes, I'm not joking.

[Zwiebelchen]

I think increasing the gap to three levels would be good in many senses, but I feel as if it forces every class to hybrid split their stats. Not every class is required to get multiple stats and the ones that wish to do so have every options to do it with respeccing. It is their own fault if they choose to stay a mono stat as a hybrid class they will just be less effective since their spells require different points in different things to do more damage or healing. Basically it is up the player right now to decide how good his character is. Any noob can mono stat but the good players know better to split it up on their own. I think it will naturally balance out as more spells are added that require different stats in different points to be effective. The good players will naturally find hybrid builds to compensate for it on their own.

Its not the hybrids that I'm concerned about but the actual 'pure' classes.
A Monostat-Int-Cons Sorcerer will always outperform a hybrid class in pure damage, even if the hybrid class is meant as a pure damage dealer. What I can do about that is intervening by adding some kind of workaround via skills.
I did that with the current spell layout, as for example as crusaders gain some attackpower with int. I hope this will be enough to really make a difference. Players usually become data-junkies at some point of gaming ... and they will do the maths some time and will find out that a certain specc should be superior than a mono-build. At least that is the goal I'm aiming at with this. And I hope it works.

I agree that Wisdom is almost completely useless and needs some kind of reworking. I have no idea how to go about doing that though. The one thing I think it should not do though is give mana regen while in combat. In older versions of the game back in beta it was even more useless when players regenned mana on their own with high int. you would never run out of any mana ever.

I will definitely remove the Manareg with the next map version (left out the "infight"-prefix as you have rest anyway). This is like 100% decided, because I feel that its a good idea and gives me the opportunity to add new spells that will make mana-management easier and adds some new flavour to the gameplay. Also, all items that granted manareg will have this stat gone or replaced by something else.
It's a matter of balancing, though. I don't want mage classes to be completely useless once all mana is gone. I need to balance wisdom that way that it grants enough mana for the mage to be able to nuke through an entire boss encounter, at least with the help of mana potions. Maybe a little less, so that for example a certain spell that steals some mana from the enemy is useful.
I will change it and then see how it turns out.
This change will be in 1.1f, so people have a lot of time to give feedback until the 1.2 version comes out. I will also add less +mana bonus to upcoming new items (and will possibly remove some overdone bonuses on existing items), as I felt it turned out a little bit extreme having like +300 mana from items and not a single point in wisdom.



EDIT: Still working on the new spell trigger. It gets longer and longer every day, but goddamn, there are so many spells ... it will still take a while for the entire trigger to be finished.
Good thing is; I am also checking the existing spells for bugs while doing that. I was able to fix some minor bugs with the existing spells, such as a leak with judgement and some inconsistency with the tooltips.
Still, there is a huge amount of work to do. :/
But I think it's totally worth it. The rewriting will remove several annoying bugs (such as the infamous bash bug) and will also improve map performance.

 

[texugo1337]

zwiebelchen, since you are checking the existing spells you could change the hotkeys to something better, why there are spells that are used in O, I and U? You should change them to QWERTY and ASDFG. And a suggestion is to reduce cleric heal from 6x spellpower to 4x or 5x because clerics can heal 500+ at lvl 30 if they get d3 gear and thats kind OP since my lvl 33 crusader have 585HP with full constituion build.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

zwiebelchen, since you are checking the existing spells you could change the hotkeys to something better, why there are spells that are used in O, I and U? You should change them to QWERTY and ASDFG. And a suggestion is to reduce cleric heal from 6x spellpower to 4x or 5x because clerics can heal 500+ at lvl 30 if they get d3 gear and thats kind OP since my lvl 33 crusader have 585HP with full constituion build.

Yeah I thought about reducing the heals already. And I wrote that on my to do list.

 

[harlemo]

Ah not to forget, are you going to add Demon Heart to dropables? And Mind Breaker is not showing CD on Mind Twist, would be nice to fix it. And hotkey for Fire Shield !

Another thing I wrote about Damage Meter, in "-help" thread. Maybe it would be nice to have upcoming message after every killed boss ? Let say like that:
Damage Meter for boss_name:
1. player_name X Damage, Y %, Z Dps.
2. player_name X Damage, Y %, Z Dps.
3. player_name X Damage, Y %, Z Dps.
Total: X Damage; Time count: yy:yy:yy
Or just show that with special command and even add damage taken for tanks (if theres going to be bosses for 2 tanks -.-). Like always just an idea, which depends on how much work You need to make it, if it's even possible.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Ah not to forget, are you going to add Demon Heart to dropables? And Mind Breaker is not showing CD on Mind Twist, would be nice to fix it.

Another thing I wrote about Damage Meter, in "-help" thread. Maybe it would be nice to have upcoming message after every killed boss ? Let say like that:
Damage Meter for boss_name:
1. player_name X Damage, Y %, Z Dps.
2. player_name X Damage, Y %, Z Dps.
3. player_name X Damage, Y %, Z Dps.
Total: X Damage; Time count: yy:yy:yy
Or just show that with special command and even add damage taken for tanks (if theres going to be bosses for 2 tanks -.-). Like always just an idea, which depends on how much work You need to make it, if it's even possible.

Its not hard nor impossible ... but why the heck would anyone need that? Oo

 

[fifek556]

@2up
sounds nice

@up
guess its for curious addicted players

btw, mr onion u could change the barbed arrow/multishot images cause they are exactly the same

 

[GIMLI_2]

i think 1.2 will be the last version, are there any new quests?
and is it possible to do the gaias retaliation part-I with a squire lvl 23?

(dont complain about my english, i know... it sucks)

 

[GIMLI_2]

ach ja und noch ne frage zwiebelchen, was is eigentlich mit der kanalisation, da is nix drin?

 

[king_stupid]

Hey zwiebelchen, love the map and by all means take your time.

I was just curious if that village in the loading screen would ever be implemented.

 

[Palooo3]

Cant wait for 1,1f or 1.2

 

[S0ulseeker]

Hey zwiebelchen, love the map and by all means take your time.

I was just curious if that village in the loading screen would ever be implemented.

It's to my understanding that the loading screen image was actually a sample work of terraining from one of the members (I believe Teh.fellow) and is not actually a part of the game.

 

[muzzel]

Yes, the terrain was part of teh.Fellows map "The Fellowship" which was canceled some months before he joined the Gaias project.

 

[mynickisnick]

nice nice ive been playing this game for a long time and i still enjoy it when i saw this topic about 1.2 i went crazy only one Questing
u guys got any release date yet?

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Dont know ... I still not done fixing all the bugs of 1.1e.
This may still take a while, I guess. Other than that, dudes, it's summer and I need to enjoy my freetime a little.

 

[S0ulseeker]

You're still on summer vacation Zwieb? I started up classes this week in the US. When does summer break end for you guys? I can't imagine it's much longer. Either way enjoy the remainder of your break and take as long as you need to finish the map!

 

[Zwiebelchen]

You're still on summer vacation Zwieb? I started up classes this week in the US. When does summer break end for you guys? I can't imagine it's much longer. Either way enjoy the remainder of your break and take as long as you need to finish the map!

Well ... there's not really an end in "summer vacation" for me, because I don't have lectures in the upcoming semester anymore. I meant more like the *felt* summer ... you know ... sun, heat, bikini girls and stuff ... XD

 

[mynickisnick]

haha u know what u mean i went to spain and lots of bikini girls in there so i can only say enjoy ur holiday and work on the map when u can and wll see when it comes out

 

[EloTheMan]

I really enjoyed playing this map, (as far as I could get) but there are a few things that could need a change.

First i just want to say that the attachment/item combination is great but the armor for Thief and Assassin looks ugly with its proportions, could you remake all the leather armor so that they would fit better?
You could just give them a cloak on their back or a small(er) chest armor, I think some modelers wouldn't mind to create some female attachments since its pretty unique.

Secondly, in the trade district there are hardly any shops that sells items and adding some recipe shops in there would really enhance the rpg feeling, when you have to search for ingredients. The class specific items (bow, gem, shield, relic etc) are kinda rare and some recipe or quests that would give you these would be appreciated.

And at last,
The Armor Penetration system is, as far as I have seen, 1 Armor Penetration counters 1 Armor. Could you remake it? Otherwise its the same as Attack Power.

I am really looking forward for the update

NOTE: All of these are just suggestions I got from playing Gaia's Retalliation.

 

[GIMLI_2]

the armor penetration is nice. it isnt the same as attack power, cause attack power u need for some skills, also if u have 10 armor penetration, but the enemy got only 8 armor, its reduced to 0, not to -2.

but more item shops would be rlly nice

 

[EloTheMan]

the armor penetration is nice. it isnt the same as attack power, cause attack power u need for some skills, also if u have 10 armor penetration, but the enemy got only 8 armor, its reduced to 0, not to -2.

but more item shops would be rlly nice

Well it still has lower value than Attack Power since it doesn't scale with abilities the same way.

While we are at it, the Ogres got 31-32 Attack and I got 18 Armor, they deal 22 damage to me while it should have been 13 without their Armor penetration, meaning they got 9 Armor Penetration

When I first started going on the Ogres I had a m8 with me so that I wouldn't die because I had 12 Armor back then, they dealt 28-29 damage on each attack while I couldn't even go thru their 27 Armor with my low Armor Penetration.

If the Armor Penetration was % instead it would be easier to face high Armor creatures while it would make it slightly harder to face low level creatures.

However, if the map is to adapted to this Armor and Armor Penetration mechanic a change wouldn't be necessary.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

I see no problem in the fact that armor penetration is less useful than attack rating. It's meant like that. The items are also made so that it makes sense.

Armor penetration was added so that classes with low damage and high attack speed or simply low damage still have a chance to deal more than just one damage point without being totally overpowered when the enemy has low armor. Also, this was made so that STR heroes have a little bit of extra use from their stat to balance out the fact that AGI heroes get attack speed, crit AND damage in one stat.

In 1.1f, all staves will get a lot of armor penetration, so that caster classes' white attacks will ignore armor now. As those white attacks should be magical anyway, I think this makes sense.

Also, pets will get a lot more armor penetration than they have now, to improve their damage to high armored units.

I am also thinking about changing the calculation formula for armor penetration.
Right now its:

Damage = AP - (Armor - ArP)
with ArP <= Armor

to:

Damage = AP - (Armor - ArP)
with ArP <= Armor

if Damage < ArP then
Damage = ArP

 

[EloTheMan]

Well all I want to say is that Armor Penetration is somewhat unbalanced, when i started off as a Squire I took Strength and HP as skills since Agility didn't improve my damage so much.

But when I played as a Thief my damage increased a lot more with the Agility and Strength combination than what it would have if I were a Squire.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Well all I want to say is that Armor Penetration is somewhat unbalanced, when i started off as a Squire I took Strength and HP as skills since Agility didn't improve my damage so much.

But when I played as a Thief my damage increased a lot more with the Agility and Strength combination than what it would have if I were a Squire.

Then again, thieves are meant to deal more damage than squires. I dont see a problem here.

 

[EloTheMan]

Damage = AP - (Armor - ArP)
with ArP <= Armor

if Damage < ArP then
Damage = ArP

Ok I did not fully understand the last part of it but my guess is that ArP will increase your damage output further, well this discussion can keep on forever so lets just leave it be and see how this one works.

But back to the Attachments, I haven't fully played Thief and ranger over lvl 20 but their armors still look weird on them at the lower levels, the armor proportions to their bodies makes them look weird. This type of attachment would fit with their models better Imperial Assassin Shroud

I know that attachments can be a real pain sometimes to configure, and probably Gaia's best feature is the item/attachment, updating it more wouldn't hurt.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Ok I did not fully understand the last part of it but my guess is that ArP will increase your damage output further, well this discussion can keep on forever so lets just leave it be and see how this one works.

But back to the Attachments, I haven't fully played Thief and ranger over lvl 20 but their armors still look weird on them at the lower levels, the armor proportions to their bodies makes them look weird. This type of attachment would fit with their models better Imperial Assassin Shroud

I know that attachments can be a real pain sometimes to configure, and probably Gaia's best feature is the item/attachment, updating it more wouldn't hurt.

Would look ugly because of the long hair of the thief model.
And I will definitely not double the amount of armors I imported just because it doesn't look *sexy*.
I think the rogue looks pretty good even in armors. Dont see a reason why this should be changed.


I today found and fixed a serious bug with the item system sometimes causing trouble with item ownership and stuff. Hopefully now everything will work flawlessly.

 

[Kl3sk]

Would look ugly because of the long hair of the thief model.
And I will definitely not double the amount of armors I imported just because it doesn't look *sexy*.
I think the rogue looks pretty good even in armors. Dont see a reason why this should be changed.


I today found and fixed a serious bug with the item system sometimes causing trouble with item ownership and stuff. Hopefully now everything will work flawlessly.

Ya, that bug was a real pain. Anyway, the dude complaining seems to have an armor (penetration) fetish. @ Mr. Armor pants : It's.all.in.your.head. ...ok ? Everything you've mentioned looks and works fine. No need to be biased or take anything personal.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

I now finished the remastering of the spell triggers and have fixed all of the major bugs of 1.1e.
That was almost 3000 lines of coding ... phew...

Next on the list are the minor bugs - which should go much faster, I think. Looks like this project is finally doing some progress.

 

[S0ulseeker]

Awesome news Zwiebel! Keep up the great work!

 

[tw3ye]

Damn great news when i hear that Gaias is gona continue. awsome map
keap up the good work Mr'Onion' (and crew)

 

[Zwiebelchen]

All the minor bugs and terrain issues are fixed now.
Next on list: Some changes on the current gameplay and some rebalancing.

 

[Palooo3]

Great to hear, cant wait to get into Gaias again,
you and your team made best ORPG ever,
the gameplay feeling is better than anything else.

 

[EloTheMan]

Did you fix the 3rd person camera issue when walking south of Riversdale btw?
You know the part of the road which is next to the map border.

It gets moved away from the hero when walking to close to the edge.

 

[ncommand-]

i was away from wc3 for a while, wait a second, your starting gaias back up again? i would fall in love with you, lol

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Finished a huge amount of work tonight, such as the changes to the current manareg system, rebalancing a lot of items, changes to armor penetration and crit damage formulas, improving the wisdom stat and also fixing some more bugs, etc..

The only thing that is now still left are a rebalancing of the mana cost of all spells in the game (to match the manareg change) and the changes class balancing and class spells.

I think you can expect 1.1f version somewhere around next weekend.

 

[keko4321]

started playing today and i love it
welldone m8
first i thought i should wait for the new version release but i can't lol
i'll play it again when you release 1.1f

 

[texugo1337]

If your rebalancing the class change quests consider nerfing the mage quest boss, he sometimes kill the mage with one hit when his magic missile does a critical and since magic missile don't have casting time, there isn't much time to run to the element in the ground. Its really frustrating to make the boss yelloy life almost red and then getting one hit k.o =\

 

[Zwiebelchen]

If your rebalancing the class change quests consider nerfing the mage quest boss, he sometimes kill the mage with one hit when his magic missile does a critical and since magic missile don't have casting time, there isn't much time to run to the element in the ground. Its really frustrating to make the boss yelloy life almost red and then getting one hit k.o =\

Hmm, I never experienced any trouble with the mage quest. But I understand what you mean; sometimes the luck component is a little bit too strong. However, you can always manage to make it there in time, even when you're on the other end. I tried it. If I take out this component then the encounter would probably be too easy.

EDIT:
I added something new on my to-do list:
I will remove the concept of rage in the upcoming 1.1f version. It turned out that the rage system the way it is implemented fails to do what it was intended for.
Instead, I will remove rage and rage-production and all rage spells will have a balanced value to work with.

 

[Palooo3]

Be carefull about it, since Bishops Burst of Light is sometimes only a way how to survive Myrtagas dungeon, when it is casted it kills almost everything and heals everyone to maximum hitpoints, when you remove it, dungeon 3 might be very hard

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Be carefull about it, since Bishops Burst of Light is sometimes only a way how to survive Myrtagas dungeon, when it is casted it kills almost everything and heals everyone to maximum hitpoints, when you remove it, dungeon 3 might be very hard

There are other balancing changes that might make up for that. Also, BoL will not be removed. Only its damaging component will.

 

[dudeim]

Also isn't the mmeaning of a dungeon that it is very hard? If all is a cakewalk it wouldn't be fun would it?

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Great news! I managed to find the bug with the annoying resetting of Boss-minions when the attacked unit of the minions died. Also, this fix removed the very rare bug of linked creep camps when a unit spawns right into a fight of a different creep camp.

 

[SneedZ]

good job, I just wanna play the new 1.2 waaah

 

[Zwiebelchen]

good job, I just wanna play the new 1.2 waaah

It will still gonna take a long time since 1.2. But 1.1f will be released in like one week. But I guess once I released 1.1f, my motivation will skyrocket and I can present you some new terrain screens in no time

 

[cooI_Ilama]

Really impressive progress made already in this short amount of time from these announcements. Great work Zwiebel!

 

[Kniff]

ANother bug: If you want to reset your stats a window pops up asking you whether you want to reset. But since you can only click"yes" there is no sense behind. Eg. if you want just to look up this ressetting otion in your first time u ever made but you dont want to reset you must pay for it. im to lazy for grammar sorry<

 

[Zwiebelchen]

ANother bug: If you want to reset your stats a window pops up asking you whether you want to reset. But since you can only click"yes" there is no sense behind. Eg. if you want just to look up this ressetting otion in your first time u ever made but you dont want to reset you must pay for it. im to lazy for grammar sorry<

Thanks for reporting that. I'm gonna fix that. Im pretty sure it worked when I tested it, but that was in single player. hmm... gonna check that out


EDIT: Any idea how to reproduce that bug? I tested it and it worked fine.

 

[_lycan]

Omg 1.1f? NICEEE some stuff fixed though i want to report something that may want you to come back completely to wc3 rpgs if you see dacia orpg 1.28 you can see that He actually got a code for wc3 1.26-1.25-1.25b-1.24(all versions starting in 1.24b) that allows you make the save code go directly to the Wc3 Logs in a text file instead of having to copy it.
that will aloud faster rmks. i think you should search how did he make it. and basically no one should report the bug (if its a bug) so blizzard wont fix it it's a really nice bug for Rpgs

 

[tw3ye]

Omg 1.1f? NICEEE some stuff fixed though i want to report something that may want you to come back completely to wc3 rpgs if you see dacia orpg 1.28 you can see that He actually got a code for wc3 1.26-1.25-1.25b-1.24(all versions starting in 1.24b) that allows you make the save code go directly to the Wc3 Logs in a text file instead of having to copy it.
that will aloud faster rmks. i think you should search how did he make it. and basically no one should report the bug (if its a bug) so blizzard wont fix it it's a really nice bug for Rpgs

Theres problem with this... I can steal youre code anitime...
Thought you should display code in "Dialog button"
i think its not shown on Replay...

 

[_lycan]

anyone can steal your code on replays even with the current save/load code system.
though look it works with your nick, so if someone uses your name on garena (and u play on bnet) he can use your code.

 

[Zwiebelchen]

Finished 1.1f today.
I'm gonna go for a closed beta test tonight at 11PM (GMT+1) on European Bnet Servers.
Volunteers meet at Channel "Clan TuX" at that time please. If the channel is not public (dont know really, simply /w Todeszwiebel for the game name).