Earth Ward (GUI)

[Moderator]

22:46, 2nd Jun 2009
hvo-busterkomo:
Leak-free, MUI, and well documented. The effect could have been better, since it's basically a well-directed earth-quake. I'm not sure why you reverted back to GUI after writing a decent spell in vJASS, but whatever.

 

[xxdingo93xx]

Hmm, does more look like a spam of revival stones ...

 

[D4RK_G4ND4LF]

imho that spell is a very good idea
(well, I didn't get the reason why he is porting out of it but it's still cool
you could add an expiration timer instead of removing the stones
but it would cause some overlapping with the other stones and might not look as good
so you might remove the stones which are blocking the new ones, too

oO I just saw it are doodads
you might replace them with units as well :>

 

[Rmx]

Well Septimus u have taken an overdose, u are doing same trigers with diffrent effects.

Still it's nice, but i didn't understand what the spell does.

Edit : Not MUI ?!

 

[Deuterium]

[-]

1. Not much of a nice idea; as xxdingo93xx says: spam of revival stones.


2. Use:

• Events
  • Unit - A unit Starts the effect of an ability

Instead of:

• Events
  • Unit - A unit Begins casting an ability

The first triggers the trigger the moment the mana is spent and cooldown starts running, but the second a bit before that happens.


3. Don't use these two together as events together:

• Events
  • Unit - A unit Stops casting an ability
  • Unit - A unit Finishes casting an ability

It's useless to use both. I can't really recall, but I think this is the better one:

• Events
  • Unit - A unit Finishes casting an ability

4. The slow effect affects the casting unit too...


5. If the spell affects structures, add structures to your map.


6. A little effort on your map gives your spell a better impression.



[+]

7. Leakless.


8. MUI.



[?]

9. Is the unit supposed to blink out of the enclosed circle?


10. Are the units supposed not to go in and out of the enclosed circle? Because the casting unit can't... maybe you'd like to use a smaller model.

 

[Septimus]

but it would cause some overlapping with the other stones and might not look as good

Did you read the warning?

oO I just saw it are doodads
you might replace them with units as well :>

Replace them with unit are rather bad idea, pathing blocker are the best to block ground and air unit from escape from the encirclement.

Well Septimus u have taken an overdose, u are doing same trigers with diffrent effects.

I currently trying to test destructible/doodad as part of the spell. It was created at the same time with Fire Ward, just that I forgot to upload it.

2. Not MUI.

From what I had tested, it seems to be working fine. Need somebody to explain it though.

4. Don't these two together as events:

Ooops, the documentation contain both. But at the actual copy and paste does not have it. I would remove it from the documentation.

5. The slow effect affects the casting unit too...

The description already indicate it would effect every unit.

6. If the spell affects structures, add structures to your map.

Would add it in the next update.

9. Is the unit supposed to blink out of the enclosed circle?

Yes, it was suppose to be a escape ability that create a wall that trap every unit and damage every structure within the wall.

 

[Deuterium]

From what I had tested, it seems to be working fine. Need somebody to explain it though.

My usual mistake on judging MUI... since the spell is instant yes it is MUI!

The description already indicate it would effect every unit.

Yes it does... but that's annoying!

but it would cause some overlapping with the other stones and might not look as good

Did you read the warning?

Why don't you fix that instead of adding a warning?

 

[Septimus]

Yes it does... but that's annoying!

It was a escape ability. XD

Why don't you fix that instead of adding a warning?

I do not think there is a right solution for it since pathing blocker cannot be set as owner of pathing blocker equal to. If the main stone expired, it would remove all pathing blocker within it. I doubt it could be done at GUI, but I could be wrong.

 

[Kingz]

Just an idea, making the stones as units you can change the look of the spell, example:
They could all face the center of the cast point and maybe even make them a bit transparent so it looks like those are spectral stones
Imagine them banished^^

Just suggestions though

 

[Septimus]

But they cannot lock unit inside the circle.

 

[Kingz]

Why?
Just make them ground units and increase their colision size in the object editor

 

[Septimus]

You forgot air unit.

The earth ward I design suppose to trap everything and anything. It is a escape spell, but it escape the spell caster only. XD

 

[Kingz]

An additional dummy unit which is the same as the first one but doesn't have an model(or has a nice one) and blocks air units.
Also the way you remove destructibles is really unefficent while if you would use units you could simply give them expiration timers

 

[Septimus]

Also the way you remove destructibles is really unefficent while if you would use units you could simply give them expiration timers

Since the loop run over 100 times, it would completely remove all pathing blocker even though you spam the spell and this make it completely safe. Then again, another problem arouse. That is why I add a warning. XD

 

[Kingz]

Well that is what i meant, the destructible removal right now removes even other destructibles when one spell expires

 

[Septimus]

yeah, if they are too close to it.

However, pathing is the best solution. If i add locust ability and increase collision of a unit to make it as a wall. it isn't that good.

It could probably cause lag if been mass casted compare to pathing

 

[Kingz]

Why o.0?
I tested my missile system by spamming it, creating 8 units per cast to about 64 units per second so i fail to see why would it lag...

 

[Guishiu]

First a question. If it's an Earth Ward, why would it effect Flying units?

[-]
The cooldown says 40seconds, and the spell says it lasts 20 seconds. I was able to cast it twice and they both run. So one of these is wrong.

A test hero that runs from all the creeps that are supposed to be trapped in the circle is pretty annoying. Add a 1 damage attack or something.

When I cast it twice in a row, one of the center stones was left behind, as well as one of the tombs on the side. I would post the Screen but, someone has to explain to me how. Aint got a clue here.

It would also be cool to add trees to the map. I want to see if it works when the Hero is surrounded by trees.

And maybe 2 heroes of the same guy. Easy way to test MUI.

Overpowered, Unbalanced

I give this spell a (1/5).

Also, add some Multilevel usage besides reducing the mana cost and cooldowns.
Make it add more damage and maybe even reduce speed even more with every level.
As it is, it destroyed those towers way too fast. A hero could level an entire DOTA base in the first 5 minutes of the game with this. ROFL

 

[Septimus]

First a question. If it's an Earth Ward, why would it effect Flying units?

Because I want it to follow the generic of escape. If it doesn't lock the air unit at encirclement as well, the air unit could chase the escape hero.

Since you and several user have request for the encirclement not to block air unit, I would generally update that.

The cooldown says 40seconds, and the spell says it lasts 20 seconds. I was able to cast it twice and they both run. So one of these is wrong.

The ward lasts for 20 seconds, but the spells cooldown is 40 seconds. Are you illiterate enough not to be able to make a difference between "lasts for" and "cooldown"?

A test hero that runs from all the creeps that are supposed to be trapped in the circle is pretty annoying. Add a 1 damage attack or something.

It was suppose to be a escape spells that trap unit and allow casting unit to escape from the pursuit.

Overpowered, Unbalanced

Overpowered at what? The spells just lock enemy unit and decrease their speed by 75%, it damage building by 50 hp every seconds.

It was using the earthquake ability of warcraft 3 and I never change the damage. So, are you accusing blizzard of making inbalance ability?

Also, add some Multilevel usage besides reducing the mana cost and cooldowns.
Make it add more damage and maybe even reduce speed even more with every level.

By making it like this, it was even more inbalance. And it was indeed multi level, did't you see it have 3 levels? Do you know what is multilevel at first?

As it is, it destroyed those towers way too fast. A hero could level an entire DOTA base in the first 5 minutes of the game with this. ROFL

Play Orc at melee game and use Far Seer, that is where the earthquake ability is.

Also, why does the ability reduce cooldown per level? To avoid inbalance of using it this way. Sure, I can increase the cooldown even higher. But, I currently set it to the standard 60 seconds as the highest. Exceed 60 seconds doesn't make it a 2nd ability usage anymore.

Do not forget, DotA ultimate ability have 3 levels. It could also be set as a ultimate ability as well. The cooldown amount could be adjust by the user itself, the current standard I set was at max 60 seconds.

Honestly enough, you are giving it a rating 1/5 (Unacceptable) all at the wrong term. I do not even see a single comment of yours that comment about trigger.

I suggest you to delete your post before someone else sees it, because the rofl is at you and not me.

 

[Kingz]

Well if nothing i liked it, it is a fresh idea not the best coding but id does the job, and i think the gfx is nice and fits the spell nicely.
The only thing i didn't like is the removal of other destructibles created by other spell instance upon one of them is finished.
4/5 by my opinion until you find a way to fix that "bug"...

 

[Septimus]

The only thing i didn't like is the removal of other destructibles created by other spell instance upon one of them is finished.

I cannot do anything about it. Blizzard does not have any trigger or action that could recognize and remove the pathing blocker in a circle. It could be consider as unfixable bug.

 

[Kingz]

I can show you how to if you want

 

[Septimus]

I bet it use unit. XD

 

[Kingz]

Nope.

 

[Septimus]

Thanks kingz, the indexing system have make the spells even better.

 

[Guishiu]

Because I want it to follow the generic of escape. If it doesn't lock the air unit at encirclement as well, the air unit could chase the escape hero.

The ward lasts for 20 seconds, but the spells cooldown is 40 seconds. Are you illiterate enough not to be able to make a difference between "lasts for" and "cooldown"?

Overpowered at what? The spells just lock enemy unit and decrease their speed by 75%, it damage building by 50 hp every seconds.

By making it like this, it was even more inbalance. And it was indeed multi level, did't you see it have 3 levels? Do you know what is multilevel at first?

Im not saying you have to remove Air blocking completely. You could make it a new aspect as the Ultimate Level of the ability. Like say at Level 3 it can now trap Air units. Im not even sure this spell works on Air units since there aren't any on the test map to test it out on.

And maybe you are the illiterate one.... I said the ward lasts for 20 seconds, and the cooldown is 40 seconds before I should be able to cast it again. So then the spell should end TWICE before I can cast it again. But it doesn't. I can actually cast it again before the spell stops.

And it is Overpowered. EarthQuake is a channel spell for a reason. For a Hero with this ability to be able to run into an enemy base, stand next a "Key Structure" of the enemy and then teleport out. Then run halfway across the map, while the unstopable EarthQuake turns the enemy's building into rubble.
Either the hero should stand outside the circle at the target Location and channel the Earthquake, or that Stone in the middle could be made destroyable and then the Quake stops. Just a couple of suggestions.

And your multilevel, you have done the same "mana and cooldown reduction" on the last 3 spells that you have made.

Suggestions- Increase the radius with each level. Make air units effected at a higher level.

 

[Septimus]

And maybe you are the illiterate one.... I said the ward lasts for 20 seconds, and the cooldown is 40 seconds before I should be able to cast it again. So then the spell should end TWICE before I can cast it again. But it doesn't. I can actually cast it again before the spell stops.

You obviously illiterate and trying to downrate my spells without valid reason because you do not even bother to check the coding and read the documentation at all.

Do not give the excuse of "Oh, Idk about it" because it was obvious that you just test the map and immediately decided to said it was "Omg, it sucks. 1/5" without even checking the trigger and documentation at all.

And it is Overpowered. EarthQuake is a channel spell for a reason. For a Hero with this ability to be able to run into an enemy base, stand next a "Key Structure" of the enemy and then teleport out. Then run halfway across the map, while the unstopable EarthQuake turns the enemy's building into rubble.

First of all, it isn't over powered considering the amount of mana consumption and cooldown can be adjust.

Second, if you think the spells is too strong against structure. You can just change the amount of damage from 50 to 20 or something even lower at object editor, how hard it was for you to do that?

And your multilevel, you have done the same "mana and cooldown reduction" on the last 3 spells that you have made.

Honestly enough, you just check my earth ward and fail spells and not the other 2.

Do you know why FAIL spells and Earth Ward ability reduce mana and cooldown per level instead of increase the ability damage, duration or radius. To avoid overpowered ability, infact the ability was reasonably balance at all.

Suggestions- Increase the radius with each level. Make air units effected at a higher level.

You are suggesting something that are now really consider as inbalance, making the encircle radius even higher would make more structure in within the area been damage especially if the spells was use at altered melee map.

Honestly enough, please stop giving such a review to tarnish my image. The only person image you currently tarnish at are your own image considering that you do not even know what are you talking about.

I am currently trying to teach you and saves yourself. If you want to continue to drown yourself, then go ahead. The death are at your own.

 

[Guishiu]

Im just trying to give you suggestions for the spell. But if you want to keep up this attitude that everything I say is stupid and everything you say back is genius then go ahead. I was only giving my opinion and trying to help. Have a nice day, your friendly neighborhood Guishiu.

 

[Septimus]

Im just trying to give you suggestions for the spell

When you suggest something, think twice of what you suggest. There is a contributive suggestion, but there is also a destructive suggestion.

Your suggestion are destructive suggestion that would make the spells even more inbalance and useless. If you think I am joking, go ahead and edit the spells according to your suggestion and you would know exactly what I mean.

But if you want to keep up this attitude that everything I say is stupid and everything you say back is genius

I did not say you are stupid or neither claim my opinion was awesome. Do not forget, when give opinion about a spells, always remember what are you talking about.

In this case of yours, you obviously did not know what are you talking about. One of the fine example to prove this statement would be this quote of yours.

you have done the same "mana and cooldown reduction" on the last 3 spells that you have made.

 

[Guishiu]

And im telling you that while this spell is decently coded, which would earn it a higher rating, It is still 90% of the time useless. If someone were to put this in their map, the first time someone casts an Unstoppable EarthQuake it would hopefully be removed. Like i said before, Earthquake is a Channel spell for a reason. Making it a spell that sits there and demolishes all buildings underneath it without any way of stopping it is making it Overpowered.

 

[Septimus]

And im telling you that while this spell is decently coded, which would earn it a higher rating, It is still 90% of the time useless. If someone were to put this in their map, the first time someone casts an Unstoppable EarthQuake it would hopefully be removed. Like i said before, Earthquake is a Channel spell for a reason. Making it a spell that sits there and demolishes all buildings underneath it without any way of stopping it is making it Overpowered.

Like I said, the damage could be personally adjust by the user itself if they think it was overpowered.

How many times do I need to repeat my statement only you would get what I said?

Do not forget, spells can be ADJUST. We have DOCUMENTATION to help user adjust the spells according to their own way.

First of all, it isn't over powered considering the amount of mana consumption and cooldown can be adjust.

Second, if you think the spells is too strong against structure. You can just change the amount of damage from 50 to 20 or something even lower at object editor, how hard it was for you to do that?

It is still 90% of the time useless.

Also, it was up to the user itself to decide on how to use it. Spells are never useless as long as they are coded properly, it was up to the user imagination and creativity on how to use it.

The only spells that are useless are the spells that are coded horribly.

 

[Kingz]

Rating: 5/5.

EDIT:
I dare the one who rated this with 1/5 to speak now...

 

[Guishiu]

Whatchu want? Aint been on in a while. well.... speak up boy, I don't have all day.

 

[Kingz]

Flaming isn't the answer Guishiu, i never said anything against you nor did i flamed you.
I tried to make you come to your senses and see the point where you are wrong
You can't just rate something with 1/5 for all wrong reasons.
An example:
How would you feel that you spent 20 days on a map and you upload it.
People like it, one of the users rate it with a 4.
Then a member which i don't know doesn't like the type of the map comes and rates it with a 1 because he didn't like it.
Now people see that your map has 2.5 rating and think it's average even though it may be great.

That is a pure example of rating 1 for the wrong reasons, the same thing goes here, you rated this with 1/5 for wrong reasons.

Now i ask you to stop replying here to keep this "thread" clean of offtopic stuff.
If you have anything else to tell me do it via visitor messages.

 

[Dr Super Good]

Firstly, this is meant to be a civilized place so please remember manners.
Secondly down voting just because it does not fit into your kind of map is unconstructive unless you have a clear reason (Eg if the spell OHKOed any unit all the time would be a good reason).
Thirdly, flamming does not refer to the act of homosexuality, it refers to the act of repetitivly insulting, being rude and overall nasty to another member with generally no reason to back up your arguments.

Although you were not really flamming that much, your posts were still rude, unconstructive and overall inappropiate.

When ever you give a ratting, you should give clear justification why you give it or do not give it a certain ratting. Just because you think the ballence is poor does not make it diserve a 1/5, equally well just because it looks cool or is well ballenced does not make it diserve a 5/5.

Also do remember that these are spells and so are meant to be ratted by trigger quality as well as ingame functionality.

 

[Fire and Ice]

Whatchu want? Aint been on in a while. well.... speak up boy, I don't have all day.

Seriously some people...

There are no major flaws, except that the position of the pathing blockers could be made neater as in a circle formation. A smaller model could be used for the pathing blocker in this case as more needs to be placed to prevent any gaps though that can be easily changed. Or simply increase collision size.
Another sugestion would be to make the stone in the center destructible to end the spell. Getting immobilized for 20 seconds with no way to break free is agonizing. Once again this is purely optional so I rate 4/5
And errr, DSG, it's spelt 'flaming' with one 'm'.

 

[JansiGX]

nice 3/5 spell.

Though there is a bug: sometimes one of the stones don't disappear.
uploaded picture where it happened twice

 

[Septimus]

Did you mass spam the ability?

 

[JansiGX]

this is MUI, right.
At first I placed 2 more rexxars to check if it's MUI and it seemed fine. Then this error a cured.
After that I tested your ability with one hero as it was planed and sometimes a cured the same thing.
here is another picture. Problem is one of the stones in the right. not shore with was it.

 

[Septimus]

Strange, during the testing period. I test everything and it seems to be fine, is it only occur to 2 stone only?

Did you make any edit to the spells or spam the ability?

 

[JansiGX]

problem is with one stone but when every other disappear I'm not shore which one had the problem so I pointed 2.
Ability was cast multiple times with 10 second cooldown. no changes to triggers made

 

[Septimus]

I think I set it pretty low, instead of 200. Try set it higher.

 

[Kingz]

Oops my fault forgot to reset the dynamic index in my system.
Just saw it, w8 till i upload the fixed version.
EDIT:
Attached the same map with system fixed, sorry, forgot to add 2 actions.
Anyway shouldn't happen anymore the problem was that even upon reseting the 2 indexes the dynamic one had value so it couldn't loop properly(hard to explain).