Dota 2 announced it will support mod! Will that be worth the Hive participate of it?

[Napoqe]

Cyborgmatt that make part of Valve's, announcement developing suport for DotA 2! Is it worth it? Making (not compulsory, course) the community develop mods for DotA 2? Models, Icons, etc... who knows

An excerpt talking about the maps of Warcraft.

It also means we will also get to look forward to some huge new additions such as custom game support and the wide scale of possibilities that will hopefully be doable in that system, those of you who did play Warcraft 3 and experienced their custom maps will have an idea of what I’m talking about.

Source: http://www.cyborgmatt.com/2013/09/dota-2-6th-september/

 

[Adiktuz]

so they will open up possibilities of creating and adding new maps to the DotA 2 engine???

 

[Napoqe]

so they will open up possibilities of creating and adding new maps to the DotA 2 engine???

In Playdota even to talked about a similar to the object editor.

 

[Statharas]

No?

 

[Kino]

There was an old joke on wc3c that said that dota would become its own game and have a dota editor.

welp.

 

[Rui]

Too bad for the DotA haters. Theoretically, this is a good idea, but I think DotA has its own site and forums. If so, we will most unlikely be able to compete. Between a longtime DotA dedicated forum and another one who's just started, people will obviously use the first.

 

[Ralle]

Nah.. But if you love DOTA 2 modding and are a serious trustworthy being, I wouldn't mind letting you expand the site and control that section, but I would have to vet you for months before making that decision.

 

[Vladadamm]

Agree with Rui, we won't be able to compete with Playdota if there's a dota editor.

 

[BlinkBoy]

I wouldn't really mind since I don't think modding dota would actually let you go out of dota's meta gameplay. At the end it will just be a bunch of aos like mods which will be as limited dota 2's conventions for units.

 

[Vladadamm]

I wouldn't really mind since I don't think modding dota would actually let you go out of dota's meta gameplay. At the end it will just be a bunch of aos like mods which will be as limited dota 2's conventions for units.

Yeah, I guess it will be kinda like D2Ware's custom modes and afterall, isn't the modding already there as those custom modes exists (but well, no editor so far).

 

[_lycan]

Nah.. But if you love DOTA 2 modding and are a serious trustworthy being, I wouldn't mind letting you expand the site and control that section, but I would have to vet you for months before making that decision.

Umm not really Ralle, even Icefrog used models from the hive, there's also many modders who use hive in playdota (tho most of them now are retired because they're playing dota 2) but if we actually get custom maps it would be also huge for the hive (obviously this would require a huge UI revamp for the dota 2 section not leave it like the sc2 section).


However there's many bad things in the source editor aswell i won't explain it (even though i was going to) but just say that to allow custom maps without programming language and actually have 100% working stuff they would have to make source 2 already in mind for rts games and then transfer dota 2 to source 2 (which would make sense considering they're already working in source 2 (by the leaked photo of the valve office computer of currently worked titles) and considering by the normal lifetime of rts games that they plan dota 2 to be alive for at least 10 years.

 

[Direfury]

Fuck. That.

I don't want anything to do with DotA. Remember how they used one of HappyTaurens models, and pretty much took credit for it? That kind of dirty stunt is enough to drive me far away from that game.

Pretty sure thats who they stole from, atleast.

 

[Rheiko]

i would prefer Warcraft than Dota 2, or Dota
it's not because i hate it or something..
i just don't like it

 

[Rui]

(...) as limited dota 2's conventions for units.

What matter do you speak of?

 

[_lycan]

What matter do you speak of?

Try multitasaking in dota 2 (preferable meepo) and you'll see what i'm talking about...

Whenever you do control groups they get all messed up even if you have 1 unit in ctrl 1 other in ctrl 2 etc you can't keep switching...

the only way to switch without messing stuff up is with tab and most warcraft 3 users never used tab (or caps lock) to switch because they had ctrl + numbers (which is better for an rts)

 

[Daffa]

Honestly, if Dota 2 has their own editors, mostly we can only make AOS mod [as Blinkboy stated], and that's it. Unless, they really making it like the Warcraft 3 Editor, that is, if they are really dedicated to make such editor.

Honestly, I don't like Dota as it destroy's Warcraft 3 Modding Community at My Country, most forums for Warcraft 3 stuff that I found for my country is full of Dota topic, I rarely even find any maps made by my country, I did however find some well quality maps made by my fellow Country members at Hive [pretty much why I like Hive].

This is my personal viewpoint.

 

[Rheiko]

Honestly, I don't like Dota as it destroy's Warcraft 3 Modding Community at My Country, most forums for Warcraft 3 stuff that I found for my country is full of Dota topic, I rarely even find any maps made by my country, I did however find some well quality maps made by my fellow Country members at Hive [pretty much why I like Hive].

This is my personal viewpoint.

yep, agree
you can rarely find warcraft 3 modding community at our country
they are all just care about playing DotA
they don't even want to open WE

and about DotA 2, i'll let community decide

 

[Tleno]

Dota 2 = Valve product = All mods available on Steam Workshop

So no need for Hive to get involved, really.

 

[chobibo]

Fuck. That.

I don't want anything to do with DotA. Remember how they used one of HappyTaurens models, and pretty much took credit for it? That kind of dirty stunt is enough to drive me far away from that game.

Pretty sure thats who they stole from, atleast.

I have the same opinion.

 

[Rheiko]

Dota 2 = Valve product = All mods available on Steam Workshop

So no need for Hive to get involved, really.

if that's the case, leave it to steam workshop then

still, i'll let community decide

 

[Rui]

I don't remember that incident (the stealing of HT's model). Which one was it?

 

[chobibo]

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/warcraft-discussion-99/community-dota-104570/

 

[Rheiko]

have they give a credits for HappyTauren's model now?

it's been sometime since i play DotA and the last time i played it, i didn't check the credit list

 

[-Kobas-]

People already mod DOTA 2 and earn real money doing so.
You can see, models that change hero appearance, couriers, wards or now even
HUD's (ingame interface) like items.

Steam workshop is place much like hive, the best items are approved, added into
shop and you can earn % money from monthly sales.

DOTA 2 (if not already, it will) become the biggest online gaming community.
Check international championship, this year winners took $1,437,190 USD.

There are many people that already become famous almost like game itself, names like
Dendi, Mushi, Iceiceice, xiao8, Sylar, PUPPY, Ferrari430, Loda, S4, Akke, DD, DDC and
many many others. Teams like Na'Vi, [A]lliance, LGD.China, IG...

Teams all over world play this AOS styled game, day night, around 5.000.000 players
online each single day. And now when game left beta stage and become free to play,
even in China government indirectly allowed people to play it (check Perfect World).

So please don't tell me that DOTA 2 sucks.

 

[Rui]

Well, all of that just means the game is popular. Which isn't strange, given how its predecessor had a similar, unjustified popularity.

 

[BlackEnvyX]

Dota 2 = Valve product = All mods available on Steam Workshop

So no need for Hive to get involved, really.

I agree. Why would the Hive want to get involved with Dota 2's modding when Steam already has a handle on it. Along with this, if you notice the Starcraft, Diablo and other sections, they aren't exactly brimming with activity.

 

[Rheiko]

People already mod DOTA 2 and earn real money doing so.
You can see, models that change hero appearance, couriers, wards or now even
HUD's (ingame interface) like items.

Steam workshop is place much like hive, the best items are approved, added into
shop and you can earn % money from monthly sales.

DOTA 2 (if not already, it will) become the biggest online gaming community.
Check international championship, this year winners took $1,437,190 USD.

There are many people that already become famous almost like game itself, names like
Dendi, Mushi, Iceiceice, xiao8, Sylar, PUPPY, Ferrari430, Loda, S4, Akke, DD, DDC and
many many others. Teams like Na'Vi, [A]lliance, LGD.China, IG...

Teams all over world play this AOS styled game, day night, around 5.000.000 players
online each single day. And now when game left beta stage and become free to play,
even in China government indirectly allowed people to play it (check Perfect World).

So please don't tell me that DOTA 2 sucks.

if steam workshop is already do the job, there is no need for hive to get involved
plus, if what are you saying is true.. you can earn % money from monthly sales
you can't compare hive with that, since you can't earn money from here.. tell me if i'm wrong?

 

[StoPCampinGn00b]

Don't hate DotA! But, in my country, people don't play it. They play RTS games I hear Europe is doing the same.

I do think that if someone really wanted, ask someone to create the forum for it. But really, could we compete with playdota? Are we competing with top SC2 sites right now?

 

[Ralle]

Now. Please don't make this a Dota flame way just yet. If we were to have a Dota section it would not degrade the other sections in any way, so there is no downside. This is not to say that I have any plans on making such a section.

 

[Daffa]

Alright, lets just cut the minor flames and get straight to point.

In my view for DotA 2 Section, I guess we can have this list as a check :
1. How many people at Hive does actually play DotA 2 and plan to Mod it?
2. How many people that agreed with the creation of this section?
3. Will this DotA 2 Mod get released? If not, it's not worth the time.

So, the main question is 3, if yes, then we will come back to 1 and 2, if DotA 2 players at Hive shows a significant amount and many of them request for section's creation, I guess that will make the section's creation worth and useful.

That's what I can conclude.

I do think that if someone really wanted, ask someone to create the forum for it. But really, could we compete with playdota? Are we competing with top SC2 sites right now?

It's based on our tactic in Developing the Section.
About SC II, yes, we are competing with SCIIMapster.
About DotA Community, it's possible to compete against them, but the chance are slim, unless we really get many supporter.

I agree. Why would the Hive want to get involved with Dota 2's modding when Steam already has a handle on it. Along with this, if you notice the Starcraft, Diablo and other sections, they aren't exactly brimming with activity.

Pretty much agree.

People already mod DOTA 2 and earn real money doing so.
You can see, models that change hero appearance, couriers, wards or now even
HUD's (ingame interface) like items.

Steam workshop is place much like hive, the best items are approved, added into
shop and you can earn % money from monthly sales.

So I guess there's no need for Hive to get involved then? As Steam has ruled it.

DOTA 2 (if not already, it will) become the biggest online gaming community.

I believe it's already [or not?] the biggest gaming community.

So please don't tell me that DOTA 2 sucks.

I think the criticism for DotA is more directly to DotA, not DotA 2.

Well, all of that just means the game is popular. Which isn't strange, given how its predecessor had a similar, unjustified popularity.

Agree, since the predecessor has high popularity, so will their successor

 

[Sunreaver]

Hate Dota 2 ugly models and icons not nice at all example:anti mage and nightcrawler ugly like hell.

 

[I3lackDeath]

Please don't make this a Dota flame way just yet.

Very amusing plea. The administration could always do their job and intervene to keep things clean (instead of the common closing of polluted threads).

As for the matter at hand:
DotA 2 has a, let's say, rather delicate way of implementing tailormade content.
A third-party site can not compete with the original Steam workshop because of the system that's been used there.
Energy should be better used for focusing on aspects that offer greater advantages.

Sidenote:
This obviously is a thread concerning DotA (2). Why do people who dislike it actively post in it, going as far as completely ignoring the subject of discussion? One should think that it's too troublesome to look into a subject that one dislikes, compared to simply ignoring it altogether. This usually does not result in either productive content or personal relief. Luxury of choice and possibilities, I suppose.

 

[chobibo]

The Hive does not need to compete with the official forums and the official modding community, if a significant number of Hive members want a forum section dedicated to DotA 2 modding, then that's good. Some of us joined here to get or submit quality stuff and tutorials right? So it just logical to think that the hive will produce good mods for the said game.

I didn't hate DotA, I just agreed with Vermillion Edict's comment on uncredited resources.

 

[Statharas]

Just think of it, the same thing will happen to the Unity3D forum, which I deem a failed attempt.

 

[Rui]

(...)
Agree, since the predecessor has high popularity, so will their successor

I failed to realize if this was sarcasm, but the fact is that DotA 2's mechanics and values are an exact replica of the Warcraft III counterpart. As in, it isn't a DotA 2 like Diablo III. For some reason, people started disliking the standard wc3 mechanics and bots, even though they lowered delay and even added the !ff (forfeit) option, which DotA 2 REALLY needs. What's worse about it? Someone already answered:

Hate Dota 2 ugly models and icons not nice at all example:anti mage and nightcrawler ugly like hell.

Yeah. LoL graphics may be more cartoony, but I prefer them a lot more to DotA's blurry stuff. The voice acting is bad, the quotations are screamingly lacking in originality (e.g. Bloodseeker: "Open your veins", seriously? Firelord lines forever) and there's no variations in music. Then the bug that sometimes happens that doesn't let you control anything, the horrid voice chat moaning and babbling that I still don't know how to mute without squelching the player altogether, the caption-less tab buttons that you click randomly looking for something (much unlike LoL's intuitive interface)... On the media department, DotA 2 took from the original and made it all worse.

What I meant with unjustified popularity was that there were much better AoS which were superseded for some reason. "Land* of Legends" was decent, but vile1's "Age of Myths" had -swap command for rebalance, knockbacks and hero spells and mechanics that DotA hadn't dreamed of until then, with its Sven and Leoric still casting Storm Bolts, Troll Warlord with Endurance Aura and so on.

Just think of it, the same thing will happen to the Unity3D forum, which I deem a failed attempt.

Pretty much every forum or category launched in the last 2 years has been a failure. The reason probably lies in the fact that accommodation of something is more than just creating a forum for it.

 

[Daffa]

Energy should be better used for focusing on aspects that offer greater advantages.

This is a nice idea and I really have to say that wasting our energy on things without big advantages is really wasting everything.

Just think of it, the same thing will happen to the Unity3D forum, which I deem a failed attempt.

Pretty much every forum or category launched in the last 2 years has been a failure. (....)

Not all Forum made in this last 2 years has deemed to be a failure. The Lab seems to be useful and working well.

(...)The reason probably lies in the fact that accommodation of something is more than just creating a forum for it.

Yes, and many members doesn't partake in these forums, making it an utter failure.

 

[Napoqe]

I just only am laughed of posts.

Increasingly the Dota 2 is more powerful. But let's talk about the two companies involved.

Activision Blizzard: After Activision buy it, the company had more interest in profit of course. An example is the causes of auctions of real money in exchange for items. That one Blizzard was against it (I am sure). Then I knowing (now little) that they removed the auctions of Diablo 3. By motive of not need farm, for have gears. According to Blizzard. And another is that they do not hear a very the players (I think more Blizzcon, meets).

Valve: By my knowledge about Valve is one of the companies that more heard the community. The Steam is one example (with a forum on it, mods, etc).

I remember that Team Fortress was a Quake mod of ID, that the Valve contract the creators for working for them. In that epoch was the best mod of the game. Being today one of the best FPS games.

In faith, nowadays I enjoy much more of Valve that Blizzard. And look who I loved it (by Lost Vikings, Rock Roll Racing, Diablo 2, Warcraft Custom Games and the World of Warcraft).

Edit: Team Fortress was not an official mod of Quake.

 

[_lycan]

Well, all of that just means the game is popular. Which isn't strange, given how its predecessor had a similar, unjustified popularity.

The game became popular because it was fun, no need to crazy micro and it had mechanics that allowed a pro scene.

----------

Nvm noticed you're a LoL player no reason to argue with brainwashed people.

 

[Rui]

I'd like to answer in a way that doesn't seem like you dismissed my entire argument and almost insulted me over the supposition I'm a LoL player. Even if I was, it would still be irrelevant.

The game became popular because it was fun, no need to crazy micro and it had mechanics that allowed a pro scene.

I don't know about everyone else, but, for me, clicking 1 or 2 buttons, attacking and profiting isn't my definition of fun. And that was 99% of the ooooold DotA. Fortunately, now it has heroes like Xin, Icarus, or Kaolin (whose concept is coincidentally similar to Age of Myths' Gigas), who actually require SOME skill to play (specially the latter).

And I don't know what you mean by «micro», but DotA 2 actually is the most (or the only) demanding on denies and creep kills. Old DotA might have had no such mechanics, but nowadays standards are pretty demanding.

 

[Adiktuz]

it depends on when you played and where you play... like for me who tried playing in a "base" comp shop, tried playing at garena and tried playing on other shops (as in our team go to other places to fight in the shops there)

And so far, the base shop and shop to shop plays are really fun and skill requiring... but for garena play, I rarely had the chance to need skills to play... most of the people I played against in garena where people who quit when you killed them a few times...

 

[Napoqe]

I'd like to answer in a way that doesn't seem like you dismissed my entire argument and almost insulted me over the supposition I'm a LoL player. Even if I was, it would still be irrelevant.


I don't know about everyone else, but, for me, clicking 1 or 2 buttons, attacking and profiting isn't my definition of fun. And that was 99% of the ooooold DotA. Fortunately, now it has heroes like Xin, Icarus, or Kaolin (whose concept is coincidentally similar to Age of Myths' Gigas), who actually require SOME skill to play (specially the latter).

And I don't know what you mean by «micro», but DotA 2 actually is the most (or the only) demanding on denies and creep kills. Old DotA might have had no such mechanics, but nowadays standards are pretty demanding.

If you're wrong.

The DotA do not need the top kill for team win the game and another if you do not like to kill other players, you are wrong in playing style. What is grace to be stay killing creep? Out LoL out that almost all attacks of heroes is the spells (not normal attack).

And needless to remember the visual pollution, right? Heroes repeated (clones), etc...