Diablo IV suggestions & comments

[Kerael]

Are you sure it's not just the camera angle on the light that comes through somewhere from above? The light is blocked by the membrane and after it is ruptured, it gets through, below it as well. In the end, you can see the fascicle coming from high above.
Does not look like demon fire, neither like angel light, but more like sun light.
Regardless, it helps the quote word: "blessed", while the membrane is for "mother".

I meant the flash from above the membrane, coming through the 'window' on the top. Technically, there shouldn't be any flashes unless the window is widened rapidly, if we are talking about sunlight.

Without context, it seems very strange to put bright silver lights around the demonic summoning. Viscerally, I'd expect more of a red scale. But instead, you can clearly see on some frames that the red scale shifts into blueish silver as she descends.
That detail grows more and more suggestive, the more I think about it now.

Also, this is a powerful shot.

Obviously, the membrane casts shadow, but note that Lilith ain't summoned from down below (of the frame).

I wonder if that means a sort of shift toward good or evil in the story or if it represents the balance between those two, what Rathma and the necromancers aims for.

Hmm, interesting. My guess is that it means 'duality' in general. You know, how she can break loose into hysteria, but she is also The Creator. And so on.
Wouldn't think that she cares much about Balance (or whatever ideas her offspring might believe), however. Given that her sole purpose is to end The Eternal Conflict.
Where as the idea of Balance is that of accepting and maintaining the Conflict in order for 'life' to exist.

Because that's where Lilith will be and is icon to Diablo since it's where you usually face Diablo and demons? In the third game we didn't face Diablo in Hell but in Heaven by the way but in the first two games, in Hell.

That was a bunch of rhetorical questions/puns on my part. :) I genuinely have no clue why is there such a strong focus on the eyes. Maybe to make it look more personal?

This art might support your point about her being in Hell,

but I don't know. She is kinda at home already. We'll see how the plot turns.

I don't think anyone was coming. The veins filled with the priest's blood as those veins shown there are on the wall behind the black man.
About blood and stuff, there's a certain similarity to Adria in RoS.

I meant Lilith's arrival. :) She definitely came.

I think it's their general approach now. They've also added Necromancers later, infusing them with a sort of 'meat magic' (which, I believe, evolved from just the Corpse Explosion of the ol' days).
Can't stress it enough, how great this approach is for the franchise. Literally visceral experience.

Sun's out,
Guts out.

More like an uterus with ovaries, lol.

Yep. This too. xD

EDIT: Opened DIII now, turns out I had a nice little Hardcore Necromancer, built for Health Regen with Health Cost abilities, Cooldown Reduction and a sprinkle of Bone Armor (Inarius Set). Had, before I've met a Greater Rift Boss who zealot-charged me like "Hey! Fxck you!".

Figured I can't regenerate that well while being killed in 1 (one) hit, 100% to 0%. Other bosses telegraphed their damage somewhat, at least. By the way, DIV Duriel's impaling attack + iron maiden belly does release you back alive (don't remember the link to the video), so there is hope for better quality of game flow.

But oh well, not like I was going to play DIII anytime soon again, given that I've logged into it once in two years to check what is up. More importantly, my DII Necromancer will never die (as stupidly).

And so the cycle of Life and Death for this little one is now complete. My deeds of valor will be remembered.

Just for the record, each drop of blood was spilled willingly.
Hail daughter of Hatred!

 

[deepstrasz]

I meant the flash from above the membrane, coming through the 'window' on the top. Technically, there shouldn't be any flashes unless the window is widened rapidly, if we are talking about sunlight.

Yeah, that's why I mentioned the camera but maybe it should have faced the opposite side for the light to shine so.

Without context, it seems very strange to put bright silver lights around the demonic summoning. Viscerally, I'd expect more of a red scale. But instead, you can clearly see on some frames that the red scale shifts into blueish silver as she descends.

Veins turn blue when light goes over them because the blood has CO2 unlike arteries

Obviously, the membrane casts shadow, but note that Lilith ain't summoned from down below (of the frame).

Hmm, Rathma is below and Lilith is above (the alchemical, kabbalistic and Taiji as above, so below and the other way around). The opposition of the sides: dark and light.

but she is also The Creator.

Well, partly.

Wouldn't think that she cares much about Balance (or whatever ideas her offspring might believe), however. Given that her sole purpose is to end The Eternal Conflict.
Where as the idea of Balance is that of accepting and maintaining the Conflict in order for 'life' to exist.

Yes and Rathma risks much releasing Lilith because the necromancer has one plan and the demoness another, the problem being ultimately, Rathma losing in both cases, either by Lilith ending the conflict or by Lilith dying giving the angels or non-demons more weight on the scales.
But nephalem/humans are both demon and angel. The balance should be kept like that. Maybe Rathma will use Lilith to slaughter what's left of the angels and then banish both angels and demons out of Sanctuary forever, only humans remaining as the balance shift between good and evil to watch over.

This art might support your point about her being in Hell,

Crazy, even there the demon looks like the Blessed Virgin. So, you might actually be 100% right about the light and where it's coming from in the intro, although in the end of the video, the higher density is upward and not on Lilith. There's no light coming from the demoness afterward, not that way in any case.

I think it's their general approach now. They've also added Necromancers later, infusing them with a sort of 'meat magic' (which, I believe, evolved from just the Corpse Explosion of the ol' days).

Yeah, they put Telekinesis on necromancers in that video. Sorcerers and Sorceresses had that before. Don't know about Diablo III, don't remember.

Hail daughter of Hatred!

What do you think will come out of that?
They should definitely change Lilith's "name". Hatred is not what the demoness is supposed to be after.

EDIT: some more few things on alchemy and occultism

Spoiler

As seen above, there are many symbols resembling: Alchemical symbol - Wikipedia
Especially:

Spoiler

Theosophy?

Spoiler

Ariosohpy?

Spoiler

The middle could be the masonic eye (the Great Architect of the Universe) and/or the G.

Spoiler

 

[The_Silent]

I don't think the circle is necessarily a reference to something outside the diablo universe. Triangles, circles and weird symbols is just the go-to when artists try to draw occult stuff.

 

[deepstrasz]

I don't think the circle is necessarily a reference to something outside the diablo universe. Triangles, circles and weird symbols is just the go-to when artists try to draw occult stuff.

:\ inspiration wise it's what we're referring to. It's a game. There's no hidden meaning or knowledge in it.

 

[The_Silent]

Cool cool, people sometimes go bananza over trying to find references and Easter eggs in games.

 

[Kerael]

Yeah, that's why I mentioned the camera but maybe it should have faced the opposite side for the light to shine so.

Crazy, even there the demon looks like the Blessed Virgin. So, you might actually be 100% right about the light and where it's coming from in the intro, although in the end of the video, the higher density is upward and not on Lilith. There's no light coming from the demoness afterward, not that way in any case.

I mean, it would be too grotesque if a demon was glowing with such a light. Lilith is unholy by nature, yet she has united with light once. I think that's as far as it goes.

Veins turn blue when light goes over them because the blood has CO2 unlike arteries

Hmm, Rathma is below and Lilith is above (the alchemical, kabbalistic and Taiji as above, so below and the other way around). The opposition of the sides: dark and light.

I like how the red-blue, light-dark 2D gradient of the later scenes allows more space for interpretation, enriching the composition. Cool finds, by the way.

Yes and Rathma risks much releasing Lilith because the necromancer has one plan and the demoness another, the problem being ultimately, Rathma losing in both cases, either by Lilith ending the conflict or by Lilith dying giving the angels or non-demons more weight on the scales.
But nephalem/humans are both demon and angel. The balance should be kept like that. Maybe Rathma will use Lilith to slaughter what's left of the angels and then banish both angels and demons out of Sanctuary forever, only humans remaining as the balance shift between good and evil to watch over.

It's still unclear why does he summon her in the first place, given their prior relations.

If Lilith is summoned to confront all the Evils which broke loose from the soulstone, that would be one reason.
Also, releasing Inarius is going to be on the table as well. You know, if "The Gates of Heaven are now closed", there's one angel still left in Hell.

And Tyrael should be like 100 already. What place do you think he will occupy in the game? In the RoS finale, he said:

1) He returns to the Council (to Heaven?)
2) as the Aspect of Wisdom, (R.I.P Malthael, the Angel of Death)
3) but as a mortal too. (stays in Sanctuary?)​

Yeah, they put Telekinesis on necromancers in that video. Sorcerers and Sorceresses had that before. Don't know about Diablo III, don't remember.

DII Sorc Telekinesis/Teleport was a part of Lightning Skills, and it looked just like that. In DIII everyone got a stylized teleport ability, inflating the concept (not to mention 'cheat death' passive abilities). At the very least DIV Dash is just a moderate hop to the side.

I think in the video, it's just a jedi force, which can by justified at your will. For example, as a necromancer, he was commanding flesh and bone.
At (5:15) you can see the dead man waving as if Rathma is inside, on another layer.

Rathma has shown to possess somewhat of telekinetic abilities. Furthermore, it is unclear whether Rathma is capable of shapeshifting or teleporting into an undead body under his control. [?]

xD

What do you think will come out of that?

• Necromancer class. Bone Prison.
• Ranger class (some variation of [Amazon - Assassin - Demon Hunter]; mainly ranged, but with melee/hybrid builds). Single target damage.
• Mount Bags with a quarter/half of hero inventory slots.
• Stackable ears (by name).

They should definitely change Lilith's "name". Hatred is not what the demoness is supposed to be after.

Yeah, but can't choose parents. And she can be hateful. It's the same as with Jaina, daughter of Sea lol.

some more few things on alchemy and occultism

I don't think the circle is necessarily a reference to something outside the diablo universe.

It's alchemy in the broad vague sense. Many alchemical statements may be applied to Diablo worldbuilding. Horadric Cube is an alchemical tool.

Especially:

Spoiler

I never spotted the Squared Circle, for the square is rather slim. Now, I find it interesting that the actors (Barb, Rathma, Lilith) have stepped on the inner circle (inner self). It's also worth noting that Lilith has simply incarnated from the Greater Self (outer circle). She should be as immortal as the others, but her vessel is mortal and holds some loot.

We can break down the triangle now:

1. Barbarian is a full-Body experience.
2. Scoundrel Thought about gold a lot.
3. Scholar represents Spirit as someone taking action/transforming something. He was asked. His belief also fits in here, but not primarily.​

The circle also represents the Philosopher's Stone, as in quote "All the knowledge you seek".

Cool cool, people sometimes go bananza over trying to find references and Easter eggs in games.

Yeah, sometimes that is what they do. Us here are just trying to understand what is shown and available. Symbols help.

EDIT: Forgot to mention the DIV system design news.

System Design in Diablo IV - Part I

System Design in Diablo IV - Part II (new)

What do you guys think?

EDIT 2: Just discovered world and lore panel and I'm impressed. It explains a lot.

Lilith goes first, Diablo goes after. Ok, I see how it is.

Inarius and Tyrael are reported to be MIA. Whereabouts are to be found soon™er or later.

 

[deepstrasz]

You know, if "The Gates of Heaven are now closed", there's one angel still left in Hell.

Bust them open Besides they have to have been repaired. The angels suffered a lot.

And Tyrael should be like 100 already. What place do you think he will occupy in the game? In the RoS finale, he said:
1) He returns to the Council (to Heaven?)
2) as the Aspect of Wisdom, (R.I.P Malthael, the Angel of Death)
3) but as a mortal too. (stays in Sanctuary?)

How does Tyrael even travel to the High Heavens and back, lol?
Maybe they will use Tyrael to open the gates to Heaven or something.

For example, as a necromancer, he was commanding flesh and bone.

Yeah, but of dead creatures, not live ones. I guess Rathma goes over 9000.

Yeah, but can't choose parents. And she can be hateful. It's the same as with Jaina, daughter of Sea lol.

That doesn't obligatorily make offspring the same as parents. They can be quite different. Please leave Jaina's lame senile retconned story out of this :\

The circle also represents the Philosopher's Stone, as in quote "All the knowledge you seek".

The priest has come full circle... with death by accepting it, sacrificing one life or another's.

EDIT: Forgot to mention the DIV system design news.

Seems OK. We'll have to wait more to see how it develops.

EDIT 2: Just discovered world and lore panel and I'm impressed. It explains a lot.

Ah, they'll make multiple expansions. Harrison Pink said they're gonna ship Diablo IV with only those four or so regions and the rest of the map is a lot.
Haha, no more live questions so they won't get "free Hong Kong!" shouts anymore. Way to go for censorship Blizz. Now, we don't even know if those questions are addressed by actual fans.

Not the only mother, Lilith? Would that make the character less important?

OK, I get it. It's basically a WoW Diablo where you explore the world and kill every evil character in the universe.

Duriel looks too hollow inside and the walls of the belly too thin.

 

[Kerael]

Bust them open Besides they have to have been repaired. The angels suffered a lot.

Maybe they will use Tyrael to open the gates to Heaven or something.

I think it rocks to shut the light for an aeon or two. Yet Tyrael is a core character in Diablo and cannot go.
Maybe his newly assumed mortality will play its role in the end. Of Act III or something.
It seems to be the case with modern writing these days. :)

How does Tyrael even travel to the High Heavens and back, lol?

Waygates!

Yeah, but of dead creatures, not live ones. I guess Rathma goes over 9000.

I think being alive doesn't really impress him.

That doesn't obligatorily make offspring the same as parents. They can be quite different. Please leave Jaina's lame senile retconned story out of this :\

Yeah I meant that she also may be not hateful at times, but rather creative, in fact. Can Mephisto though? xD
I agree. However it sounded sooO melodic in the trailer. But in russian it sounds super weird. Threw me off for a sec even.

About Jaina, I don't really care much. I just exemplified a title.

The priest has come full circle... with death by accepting it, sacrificing one life or another's.

He gave a life of one for The Life of many. Even all, maybe? Depends on how far are they willing to go with the events which entail calling mother. It usually means serious trouble.

For real, are the evils going to attack when they've regained power? Yes. But narratively speaking, how is it going to happen? All 7 will not hit at once, 100%. But three...
Do you think it is going to be spread out in Acts for each of the evil?
Imagine 7 Acts (5 + 2 add-ons or so) of campaign/story culminating with the iconic bosses and Belial.

Seems OK. We'll have to wait more to see how it develops.

It's great that they've assessed the first impression feedback from the crowd. It's been a month now and there's some quality communication going.
The team has heard what the valued aspects and details of the game are, and made adjustments + a serious decision to axe ancient items. Major strides have been made.

Ah, they'll make multiple expansions. Harrison Pink said they're gonna ship Diablo IV with only those four or so regions and the rest of the map is a lot.

I'd say enough for DV to exist as well.

Haha, no more live questions so they won't get "free Hong Kong!" shouts anymore. Way to go for censorship Blizz. Now, we don't even know if those questions are addressed by actual fans.

True. But some of them were on point, actually.

Not the only mother, Lilith? Would that make the character less important?

No, it just means that most of the people aren't Lilith's direct descendants, that's all.
I think it's more of a Kerrigan - Broodmothers kind of relationship. :)

OK, I get it. It's basically a WoW Diablo where you explore the world and kill every evil character in the universe.

Yeah I think you've got it right there. With mounts and pet fights (for dropped gold).
They've said they won't add everyone just for content, but not until they can justify it. And who's left out of cool characters? The Butcher, Leoric, Colenzo (dead), Gharbad, Siegebreaker and maybe Countess.

By the way, Azmodan will miss Cydaea and the Hearts of Sin were squashed by noble heroes. Will he change even, what do you think?

Duriel looks too hollow inside and the walls of the belly too thin.

Yup. And they went in the 'bugs' direction too much, I think. In DII he had a proper face and looked sporty.

Saw Andariel?

The snake is so dumb. xD It's like: "Poison damage, remember?"
She is kinda in Anguish now herself. And she hates fire. Wonder what the fight is going to be like, regarding Stagger (or her own fire-damage-meter). Is she gonna unchain or instead be punished once it fills?
The heads remind me of Bone Spirit (heat-seeking necro spell). Also, seems that the spider-arms have been severed for good.
What if she is a shackled wandering demon without an exact location to be found in. But she finds you eventually and these heads start flying at you. Smoke and stench surround her screen-wide.
And I'd prefer one nipplechain over all of those.

Edit: Baal.
I feel like he has to tear a part of Sanctuary away or it's not real Destruction.
Last time he shattered the Worldstone, but all the graphic implications of this act were left to imagination. Now the technology can allow virtually anything.

Imagine a large city, bigger than Westmarch Keep (RoS Main Town), and then a 60° slice is taken away from the center, crumbled into a canyon, killing all the merchants and folk in the area. Less shopping/npc_talking options would make players feel desolated and sundered somewhat.

Edit 2: Look at this Diablo 4 story theory: Lilith is a red herring lol.

 

[deepstrasz]

Yet Tyrael is a core character in Diablo and cannot go.

Since Diablo II. Look at Cain though...

Maybe his newly assumed mortality will play its role in the end. Of Act III or something.

The angel that sacrificed its immortality for a whim and then sacrificed mortality for mankind.

Waygates!

:\ what, they got firewall, I mean holylightwall?

Yeah I meant that she also may be not hateful at times, but rather creative, in fact. Can Mephisto though? xD

I'm not sure we'll see much of Lilith since the first "act" (game piece; the rest being expansions) looks mighty short and will probably end with Lilith as the main villain/boss.

For real, are the evils going to attack when they've regained power? Yes. But narratively speaking, how is it going to happen? All 7 will not hit at once, 100%. But three...

They should have trouble cooperating since Diablo allegedly fooled them all in DIII and took over.

Do you think it is going to be spread out in Acts for each of the evil?

For each main one (prime evils), pretty much yes.

Imagine 7 Acts (5 + 2 add-ons or so) of campaign/story culminating with the iconic bosses and Belial.

Meh and with that I imagine more than 2 expansions which kind of means buying the game at least 3 times.

I'd say enough for DV to exist as well.

Well, they could Diablo forever but it'll get boring one day.

They've said they won't add everyone just for content, but not until they can justify it.

They can very much simply justify it with something like the Anniversary Event.

By the way, Azmodan will miss Cydaea and the Hearts of Sin were squashed by noble heroes. Will he change even, what do you think?

They're going to be back the same way. I mean, Duriel is and Leoric was (damn, I hated this one the most; Butcher had a blind eye for it though).

Saw Andariel?

@MasterBlaster was pointing that out way back but it doesn't look like Andariel though unless it's a sort of reimagined version but then why is Duriel not also differently recreated?
Might it be Blood Raven, the Countess? I've no idea. Probably something new.

The snake is so dumb. xD It's like: "Poison damage, remember?"

Ah... then you might have a point. It kind of winks that it's Andariel, not just hints.

And she hates fire.

But there was fire all over in DII and the player got burned by it.

The heads remind me of Bone Spirit (heat-seeking necro spell). Also, seems that the spider-arms have been severed for good.

That looks weird like something else... also too metallic, steampunk/sci-fi.

And I'd prefer one nipplechain over all of those.

What nipples even? So, they put the chains to make a better representation of anguish. But it looks like the demon is chained. So, does it move or do we have to set it free first?

Last time he shattered the Worldstone, but all the graphic implications of this act were left to imagination. Now the technology can allow virtually anything.

From what I gathered it was more corrupting it than anything and the destruction was the war going on in Arreat.

Imagine a large city, bigger than Westmarch Keep (RoS Main Town), and then a 60° slice is taken away from the center, crumbled into a canyon, killing all the merchants and folk in the area. Less shopping/npc_talking options would make players feel desolated and sundered somewhat.

Archimonde is that you?

Edit 2: Look at this Diablo 4 story theory: Lilith is a red herring lol.

"He builds up a massive army of angels."
From what? Most angels are dead and as the fan wrote, it takes time for the Crystal Arch to reborn any. What, does the Arch create new ones each day too?

I'm curious if they are drawing inspiration from the Book of Revelation.

 

[deepstrasz]

Diablo IV Quarterly Update—February 2020

 

[Venombite]

Is Diablo IV going to be a free to play mobile game, that's compatible with console?

Why am I asking this?
Activision-Blizzard pretty much said that they basically care only about mobile market now. And after Diablo Immortal backslash, knowing Blizzard from today, I wouldn't be surprised if they decided to scrap Diablo Immortal, but just upscale the graphics and make it compatible with console and release it as Diablo IV.

That would be very bad. Diablo is the last standing of the big three franchises. Starcraft is, sadly, pretty much done for, with RTS no longer being a thing and all planed Starcraft FPSs being scrapped and re-released as parts of Overwatch. With Refunded fiasco, BfA failure, if Shadowlands fails, Warcraft will be pretty much done for as well, and yet the Alpha is late, there's been radio silence for almost six months, with just small things now. If Refunded thought us anything it's that silence and late Alpha/Beta is not a good thing, yeah it doesn't look good. Warcraft might as well be pretty much done for. Now if Diablo IV ends up being of mobile quality, and causes outrage with fans again, I'm pretty sure Diablo is done for as well.

So with pretty much the last standing of the "original" big three, Diablo, failing, I think Blizzard Entertainment is pretty much done for. I know it's not the big three anymore, with Overwatch joining the fray, but still, that's not enough for a company so big. Yeah, if Diablo IV fails, I think Blizzard is pretty much done for.

 

[Uncle]

Is Diablo IV going to be a free to play mobile game, that's compatible with console?

Why am I asking this?
Activision-Blizzard pretty much said that they basically care only about mobile market now. And after Diablo Immortal backslash, knowing Blizzard from today, I wouldn't be surprised if they decided to scrap Diablo Immortal, but just upscale the graphics and make it compatible with console and release it as Diablo IV.

That would be very bad. Diablo is the last standing of the big three franchises. Starcraft is, sadly, pretty much done for, with RTS no longer being a thing and all planed Starcraft FPSs being scrapped and re-released as parts of Overwatch. With Refunded fiasco, BfA failure, if Shadowlands fails, Warcraft will be pretty much done for as well, and yet the Alpha is late, there's been radio silence for almost six months, with just small things now. If Refunded thought us anything it's that silence and late Alpha/Beta is not a good thing, yeah it doesn't look good. Warcraft might as well be pretty much done for. Now if Diablo IV ends up being of mobile quality, and causes outrage with fans again, I'm pretty sure Diablo is done for as well.

So with pretty much the last standing of the "original" big three, Diablo, failing, I think Blizzard Entertainment is pretty much done for. I know it's not the big three anymore, with Overwatch joining the fray, but still, that's not enough for a company so big. Yeah, if Diablo IV fails, I think Blizzard is pretty much done for.

It's already confirmed as a PC title (they had playable demos at blizzcon). Platforms: PlayStation 4, Xbox One, Microsoft Windows

Blizzard isn't going anywhere anytime soon. They create AAA games and own franchises that have massive amounts of fans and a history of great success. Sure, the die-hard fans have been disappointed with just about every game they've made since 2004, but that's not really something they care about. There's too many casual players/fans that love everything Blizzard makes for them to give a shit about catering to the minority.

Diablo IV will NOT fail, just as Diablo 3 did not fail, in terms of profit. It will however fail to impress the die-hard fans, but that's pretty much been the pattern here for years now. They're trying to sell this one as "more like Diablo 2", which is nice I suppose because at least they're acknowledging what we want. Unfortunately, from the looks of the content updates that they've been releasing, they haven't learned much from Diablo 3's mistakes.

It looks like they're sticking with their "modernization" method of removing depth from the game wherever possible. This means less item affixes, less features (no trading or a worthless trading system), a terrible stat system that destroys customization, an inventory grid that removes the decision making of what items to keep/toss, etc... They simply don't understand that these "modern" updates end up hurting the game more, or maybe I'm just being naive, it's probably more likely that it's just way more work to create a game like Path of Exile than it is to create a game like Diablo 3.

 

[Venombite]

I've read on reddit and Battle.net that D4 is basically going to be a World of Diablo, an MMORPG. Rather than D2/D3 acts it might have an open world, wow like questing and group Dungeons. And besides three announced classes represent their WoW counterparts in many ways. I'm not sure I'm a fan of all of this. Seems like they're trying to release a WoW 2, and I don't know if it can even work at this day and age. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

 

[deepstrasz]

I've read on reddit and Battle.net that D4 is basically going to be a World of Diablo, an MMORPG. Rather than D2/D3 acts it might have an open world, wow like questing and group Dungeons. And besides three announced classes represent their WoW counterparts in many ways. I'm not sure I'm a fan of all of this. Seems like they're trying to release a WoW 2, and I don't know if it can even work at this day and age. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

I guess it's gonna be a mix of Diablo and WoW, not sure how much WoW percentage-wise. They said you can play alone too, finishing the story line but you'd have problems trying raids(?) alone.

 

[Venombite]

I guess it's gonna be a mix of Diablo and WoW, not sure how much WoW percentage-wise. They said you can play alone too, finishing the story line but you'd have problems trying raids(?) alone.

Well that's WoW 100%. You can complete questing and story in single player basically(even group quests are solo able 99% of times if you're smart+right level), but can't do dungeons alone, unless you're ridiculously, next expansion high level. I'm definitely beginning to see the same pattern here.

 

[deepstrasz]

Well that's WoW 100%. You can complete questing and story in single player basically(even group quests are solo able 99% of times if you're smart+right level), but can't do dungeons alone, unless you're ridiculously, next expansion high level. I'm definitely beginning to see the same pattern here.

Really!? I found WoW to be pretty much impossible in singleplayer and raids there are story related too whilst here (in Diablo IV), I understand that they're not.

 

[Venombite]

Really!? I found WoW to be pretty much impossible in singleplayer and raids there are story related too whilst here (in Diablo IV), I understand that they're not.

Well, not really. Dungeons and Raids are story irrelevant 99+% of time. Only the final bosses matter and it's mostly an (cinematic) ending with this big bad evil is gone, victory! Most if not all story plots, character progression and other story elements happen during single player questing and leveling. The only raid I would consider a lore necessity in the entire game is Icecrown Citadel.

And I can definitely see the same thing with Diablo, if it was an MMORPG, I imagine that big evils like Diablo, Mephisto, Baal, Azmodan, King Leoric, Malthael etc...would all be dungeon/raid final bosses, and I imagine their story significance would be identical like final bosses in WoW dungeons/raids.

 

[MasterBlaster]

You should stop reading reddit bait threads Here's a far better source:
Here's how Diablo 4's shared world works | PC Gamer

might have an open world

Yes, but it's been explicitly stated that they are going to limit the amount of people you're going to run into, i.e. you're going to see more people in town, not so much out in the open. This is done to preserve the "lone adventurer" feeling. Moreover, story areas are private to you or your party the first time you do them.

wow like questing

What do you even mean by that?

group Dungeons

They've said that you'll be able to solo dungeons and since they're private to you or your party, there's zero risk that anyone will interfere with that.

three announced classes represent their WoW counterparts in many ways

In what ways? Like come on, just because WoW has mages and D4 has mages, doesn't mean it's the same thing.

Seems like they're trying to release a WoW 2

It's not going to be WoW 2, it's going to be basically D3, but darker, with a ton of references to D1/D2 lore and with some MMO-elements that aren't significant enough to make it no longer be an aRPG game. At least that's the impression I got.

raids

I didn't see anything about "raids" anywhere.

Dungeons and Raids are story irrelevant 99+% of time.

It seems you haven't played WoW in a long, long time - in the modern game, dungeons are raids are a vital part of the story, often acting as conclusions of plotlines, but not always. You want an example? Tomb of Sargeras raid, where upon defeating Kil'jaeden Illidan opens up a portal to Argus, thus setting up another chapter of the story.

 

[Venombite]

@MasterBlaster thank for the link and some interesting opinions.

Yes, but it's been explicitly stated that they are going to limit the amount of people you're going to run into, i.e. you're going to see more people in town, not so much out in the open. This is done to preserve the "lone adventurer" feeling. Moreover, story areas are private to you or your party the first time you do them.

That's nice to hear. But I'm kinda sceptical how that's going to work in an open world, we'll have to wait and see.

What do you even mean by that?

I meant, let's say. You're a Draenei, you start off in Azuremyst Isles, do some starting quests, and than abandon it mid story and start leveling in Darkshore, but in the middle, just before meeting Malfurion you descide to abandon Darkshore and go to let's say Redridge Mountains(on the other side of the world) and wanna do the last part of the zone with John J. Keeshan story.
To my knowledge you weren't able to do this in any of previouse Diablo games, you had to fully complete the Acts, or maybe I missed something cause I always like to do full stories.

I didn't see anything about "raids" anywhere.

Well that's kinda a philosophical question. What is a raid? A raid is a large Dungeon with more bosses, more powerful bosses, usually lore characters, designed for a large number of players. So every raid is a dungeon technically.

It seems you haven't played WoW in a long, long time - in the modern game, dungeons are raids are a vital part of the story, often acting as conclusions of plotlines, but not always. You want an example? Tomb of Sargeras raid, where upon defeating Kil'jaeden Illidan opens up a portal to Argus, thus setting up another chapter of the story.

I have actually played through whole Legion and BfA up untill patch 8.1, and I disagree, here are examples:
Stormheim-All the character introduction, what is Odyn all about, what is Helya all about, Sylvanas deal with Helya that ultimately led to a big Sylvanas Greymane show off, Vrykul of Stormheim, their back story, God King Skovald and his back story, everything was told during "single player" leveling. While in Halls of Valor, the story summery is Skovald is dead and Odyn finds you worthy of Aegys of Aggramar. And again Trial of Valor raid the story summery, Helya is dead everyone is free, cheers! I don't see how fighting most bosses like Hymdal or Helya's dog is relevant to the story in any way. Most of those bosses only have story cameos or even nothing at all.
Val'sharah-Cenarius corruption, Malfurion trying to save him, Xavius reveald, Ysera's corruption, Tyrande vs Xavius and Ysera's death. Everything was during "single player" leveling. Raid story summary Xavius is dead, everyone is free from the Nightmare, cheers! Again don't see how fighting Elereth in corrupted Mulgore is relevant story wise in pretty much any way.
Zandalar- Blood Troll chaos, Zul betreyal, freeing Mytrhrax and gigatic cenarie with the Loa battling him, everything is "single player". Uldir G'huun is dead there is no more corruption!
Suramar- every character, rebellion and set up is in single player mode. Nighthold summary Elisande and Gul'dan are dead Illidan is free! And story wise if you skip the whole raid and just watch the cinematic on youtube, you won't be missing much of the story. Same goes for Tomb of Sargeras, and even Antorus. There are moments sure, like Kil'Jaeden vs Velen show off, but nothing major really.

In what ways? Like come on, just because WoW has mages and D4 has mages, doesn't mean it's the same thing.

No, there are absolutely no simmilarities. Diablo Sorceress doesn't use frost for damage+debuff and fire for direct damage+dot. The Druid totally doesn't turn into a guardian bear or a rogue like wolf. The Barrbarian totally doesn't resemble a fury Warrior at all. Crusader/Paladin and Necromacer(bound to come to D4 sooner or later) totally don't resemble WoW's Paladins and Death Knights

It's not going to be WoW 2, it's going to be basically D3, but darker, with a ton of references to D1/D2 lore and with some MMO-elements that aren't significant enough to make it no longer be an aRPG game. At least that's the impression I got.

Why I started this topic. Diablo 3's biggest problem was't that it was a gameplay downgrade of D2, nor was it the game itself, it was a Blizzard standard game. Nor was it commertially unsuccessful, it was quite the opposite. It's problem was that it didn't last. People just played it for a time and shelved it. It simply didn't last. They even had to scrap a whole 2nd expansion and release just the Necromancer class, cause it didn't last.
I think what they're trying to do with D4 is move away from D3 as much as possible and make a game that will last. However I'm kinda sceptical with them introducing a lot of MMORPG elements.

 

[deepstrasz]

No, there are absolutely no simmilarities. Diablo Sorceress doesn't use frost for damage+debuff and fire for direct damage+dot. The Druid totally doesn't turn into a guardian bear or a rogue like wolf. The Barrbarian totally doesn't resemble a fury Warrior at all. Crusader/Paladin and Necromacer(bound to come to D4 sooner or later) totally don't resemble WoW's Paladins and Death Knights

We'll have to see how similar the original Diablo (II) classes will be to WoW classes. For now, the comparison is shallow speculation.

 

[MasterBlaster]

That's nice to hear. But I'm kinda sceptical how that's going to work in an open world, we'll have to wait and see.

I imagine that they will use something similar to WoW's sharding or layering, i.e. a system that creates instances of an area based on how many people are globally doing it. If so, then I think it's ultimately going to be something that will be one of the things that they will want to extensively test during the beta and given how the Diablo community is mostly aRPG-based, I believe that if only Blizzard listens to feedback, the final tuning of that system won't turn out so bad.

I meant, let's say. You're a Draenei, you start off in Azuremyst Isles, do some starting quests, and than abandon it mid story and start leveling in Darkshore, but in the middle, just before meeting Malfurion you descide to abandon Darkshore and go to let's say Redridge Mountains(on the other side of the world) and wanna do the last part of the zone with John J. Keeshan story.

I'm not 100% sure of this, but I think they've said there's going to be a full narrative experience that will take you through the story, so if anything - perhaps the side quests and world events have a bit more open design, but if you like just playing through the story you should still be able to do that.

To my knowledge you weren't able to do this in any of previouse Diablo games, you had to fully complete the Acts, or maybe I missed something cause I always like to do full stories.

Honestly, Acts are an archaic concept, imo. I mean, there is something interesting in having clearly defined "chapters" of the story, but at the end of the day what really matters is how the overall story feels If it's good then I don't think anyone will miss acts all that much.

Well that's kinda a philosophical question. What is a raid? A raid is a large Dungeon with more bosses, more powerful bosses, usually lore characters, designed for a large number of players. So every raid is a dungeon technically.

That's a fair point

I have actually played through whole Legion and BfA up untill patch 8.1, and I disagree

Okay, so let's just agree that there are some that are more relevant to the story and some that are mostly for some extra lore and capping off the plotline.

Anyway - moving on to Diablo... Were Diablo "dungeons" even that interesting? I mean, look at Diablo 2. Pretty much all setup for Mephisto happens before you enter the Durance of Hate, right? The same can be said about many other areas. Things were a bit better in D3 as the story was more spread out. That said, I don't think I would mind if most of the setup happened in the open world, but once you entered a "dungeon", it was you vs the monsters with a big bad guy at the end. In some sense, it does actually add to the atmospehere - like, entering the Diablo area in D2 and opening the seals in silence to summon the big D was far more climactic then Diablo shouting at you every couple of minutes in D3. At least for me.

No, there are absolutely no simmilarities. Diablo Sorceress doesn't use frost for damage+debuff and fire for direct damage+dot. The Druid totally doesn't turn into a guardian bear or a rogue like wolf. The Barrbarian totally doesn't resemble a fury Warrior at all. Crusader/Paladin and Necromacer(bound to come to D4 sooner or later) totally don't resemble WoW's Paladins and Death Knights

WoW's combat system and class design depends heavily on the idea of "rotations", from what I've seen seems to not go in that direction. And as for classes, come on - if you're going to build a mage that has fire abilities then it's pretty obvious that you're going to have some fireball skill or some frost skill that slows enemies, etc. That's not ripping off WoW, that's just going with popular tropes - but even if we assume that they're copying WoW then WoW has obviously copied D2, right? I mean, Diablo 2 Sorceress also used fire skills and the Druid had some shapeshifting abilities...

Why I started this topic. Diablo 3's biggest problem was't that it was a gameplay downgrade of D2, nor was it the game itself, it was a Blizzard standard game. Nor was it commertially unsuccessful, it was quite the opposite. It's problem was that it didn't last.

Diablo 3 had one big problem - fairly shallow customization and itemization systems. This obviously improved over time, but seeing as how the main reason why people play aRPGs is to tinker with their characters either by modifying skills/attributes/whatever or changing items, I hope Diablo 4 does a better job in this regard.

I think what they're trying to do with D4 is move away from D3 as much as possible and make a game that will last. However I'm kinda sceptical with them introducing a lot of MMORPG elements.

I don't think they should "move away" from D3, quite the opposite - they should expand on D3. No matter what you think about D3, the fact is that even to this day it's still one of the best, if not the best, aRPG in terms of raw gameplay. It's fast, fluid and visceral. It feels satisfying. This is something they should strive to recreate in D4.

 

[deepstrasz]

Diablo 3 had one big problem - fairly shallow customization and itemization systems. This obviously improved over time, but seeing as how the main reason why people play aRPGs is to tinker with their characters either by modifying skills/attributes/whatever or changing items, I hope Diablo 4 does a better job in this regard.

Good that it had a fashion shop. It's what I wanted I always wanted from such a game anyway.

 

[Uncle]

Diablo 4's success really comes down to the systems that they implement into the game. The reason more people are streaming Diablo 2 than Diablo 3 on Twitch right now is because of the systems that hold these games together. Diablo 2 managed to get the RPG elements just right, while D3 failed in just about every department besides feeling good. That's not a very great accomplishment for a game released 10 years later, as feeling better than it's predecessor is almost a given.

D3 feels like a 1 step forward, 2 steps back scenario. Blizzard managed to make the game feel a lot better than previous titles and other ARPGs in general, but they also went backwards on everything else.

If you've ever tried to create your own ARPG, which I've done to a certain extent, this all becomes too clear. After doing so I can say with confidence that Blizzard went with the path of least resistance at just about every design "crossroad" they came to for D3. This is why D3's major systems (Itemization, Character Customization, PvP, Trading, etc...) were all downgraded/removed. You could say that this design philosophy was to reach a more casual, wider audience, but I'm pretty sure it was just because it was a lot easier than putting in actual hard work to come up with deep and rewarding systems. The wider audience was just the icing on the mediocrity cake.

What I think Diablo 4 needs to be successful:
-Bring back the beloved systems of D2. This means the return of many Affixes (Prefix/Suffix Item Stats) that were missing from D3 as well as adding new ones.

-Bring back the Skill Tree and other character customization elements that made leveling exciting and opened up room for more Item Affixes.

-Bring back the amazing Itemization of Diablo 2. This means that every single quality of Item has value, beyond "scrap material" (more of that lazy game design).

Normal Items were used in cube recipes/socketing for Runewords as well as having Ethereal/Superior versions that could be very rare and useful. Magic Items were very important during leveling and had powerful cube recipes. Rare Items had the potential to be amazing, which is in my opinion is one of the defining features of the Diablo series. The idea that I could have the WORLD'S greatest Axe is very exciting. Diablo 2 did this well but it could have been improved. I think the power ceiling for Rares was too low, or maybe Runewords just overshadowed them. Uniques/Set Items were powerful but felt pretty damn balanced. They also felt UNIQUE, since the game didn't throw 50 of them at you all at once (Another failure of D3). Runewords were unbalanced, but the concept was great, they simply needed to be handled with more care.

-Open up Trading to be bigger and better than it ever was. Showcasing your fat loot to 7 other players was a lot of fun back in the Diablo 2 days (Diablo 3 thoroughly butchered this experience). D3 reduced the max player count from 8 to 4 as well as ruining the Trading system with the Real Money Auction House and then down the line practically scrapping Trading altogether with the Binds to Character bullshit. Imagine having a Bazaar setup where 20+ players could open up Shops to buy/sell/showcase their loot. "That one's not for sale" comes to mind.

-Bring back the dark aesthetic of the original games.

I could go on and on... Long story short: Take the RPG elements of D2 and combine them with the Action elements of D3 and you'll have a great game. Fingers crossed that Diablo 4 achieves this.

 

[deepstrasz]

I could go on and on... Long story short: Take the RPG elements of D2 and combine them with the Action elements of D3 and you'll have a great game. Fingers crossed that Diablo 4 achieves this.

All nice and sassy but I don't expect a Diablo II remake. That would be awful. And it seems they're even doing it lore-wise by bringing back dead characters.

 

[Uncle]

All nice and sassy but I don't expect a Diablo II remake. That would be awful. And it seems they're even doing it lore-wise by bringing back dead characters.

I don't expect a D2 remake either, and from the footage shown so far there's some clear differences being made (D4 being made more like an MMO with instances and what not). But I do expect it, or rather hope that they look at Diablo 2 and not Diablo 3 when designing this one. D2 is better (imo) on all counts, besides the fluid combat that D3 had.

 

[Venombite]

Honestly, Acts are an archaic concept, imo. I mean, there is something interesting in having clearly defined "chapters" of the story, but at the end of the day what really matters is how the overall story feels If it's good then I don't think anyone will miss acts all that much.

I think exactly the opposite thing. I think it's essential to make a difference from Warcraft. I mean despite having Undead monsters, genocide references and all kinds of monstrosities, essentially WoW is a jolly fairy tail world with dungeons, dragons, princesses and what nots, where players can happily party together(and piss off each other at times). Diablo is supposed to be quite the opposite, it's supposed to be a dark, mystery adventure with elements of horror and scare. And I think acts are essential for that kind of storytelling, besides they're a signature feature of Diablo franchise by now.

Anyway - moving on to Diablo... Were Diablo "dungeons" even that interesting? I mean, look at Diablo 2. Pretty much all setup for Mephisto happens before you enter the Durance of Hate, right? The same can be said about many other areas. Things were a bit better in D3 as the story was more spread out. That said, I don't think I would mind if most of the setup happened in the open world, but once you entered a "dungeon", it was you vs the monsters with a big bad guy at the end. In some sense, it does actually add to the atmospehere - like, entering the Diablo area in D2 and opening the seals in silence to summon the big D was far more climactic then Diablo shouting at you every couple of minutes in D3. At least for me.

That's a fair point

No matter what you think about D3, the fact is that even to this day it's still one of the best, if not the best, aRPG in terms of raw gameplay. It's fast, fluid and visceral. It feels satisfying. This is something they should strive to recreate in D4.

I agree here 100%

I don't expect a D2 remake either, and from the footage shown so far there's some clear differences being made (D4 being made more like an MMO with instances and what not). But I do expect it, or rather hope that they look at Diablo 2 and not Diablo 3 when designing this one. D2 is better (imo) on all counts, besides the fluid combat that D3 had.

I don't really want D4 to be a WoW 2, nor a D3 v2, but I don't really want a modern remake of D2 either. According to rumors (which end up being true more often than not), there's D2R coming for that. What I'm hoping for is that we'll get "the best of both worlds" or even a completely new system, who knows the new system might end up being better than both D2 and D3. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

 

[deepstrasz]

I think exactly the opposite thing. I think it's essential to make a difference from Warcraft. I mean despite having Undead monsters, genocide references and all kinds of monstrosities, essentially WoW is a jolly fairy tail world with dungeons, dragons, princesses and what nots, where players can happily party together(and piss off each other at times). Diablo is supposed to be quite the opposite, it's supposed to be a dark, mystery adventure with elements of horror and scare. And I think acts are essential for that kind of storytelling, besides they're a signature feature of Diablo franchise by now.

Warcraft was never jolly since the first RTS. Don't get fooled by the cartoony graphics and Easter egg soundset references.

---

Blizzard is hiring:
Level Designer - Diablo IV - Design
courtesy of @FeelsGoodMan

 

[Uncle]

I don't really want D4 to be a WoW 2, nor a D3 v2, but I don't really want a modern remake of D2 either. According to rumors (which end up being true more often than not), there's D2R coming for that. What I'm hoping for is that we'll get "the best of both worlds" or even a completely new system, who knows the new system might end up being better than both D2 and D3. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

Yeah, I hear ya. I basically want the same thing, the best of Diablo 2 (itemization/character customization) combined with whatever new things they can come up with. As of right now, the big "new" factor for D4 that we know about is the MMO-style dungeon/raid design, which I guess isn't really anything new, but it's also not something you've seen too often in an RNG-filled procedurally generated world. If they pull it off correctly this game could be played for a long, loooong time. I mean most good MMO's already have longevity and that's without the Diablo-randomize-everything factor, so imagine what it would be like with it.

 

[deepstrasz]

the MMO-style dungeon/raid design, which I guess isn't really anything new, but it's also not something you've seen too often in an RNG-filled procedurally generated world.

Will it be that RNG like the old Diablo games had it? With new graphics and all it's pretty hard to get things to fit when randomly generating their places and whatnot. With pixels it works easily by overlapping and who knows what else but with advanced 3D graphics there are so many things to consider like lights, shadows, all these have to be properly calculated to blend well.

 

[Venombite]

All nice and sassy but I don't expect a Diablo II remake. That would be awful. And it seems they're even doing it lore-wise by bringing back dead characters.

As for the lore, honestly I wouldn't mind seeing some iconic villains come back like King Leoric or The Butcher or even Baal or Mephisto. And sadly I'm pretty certain who the final boss of the game is gonna be. I say sadly because, well look that whole story with good Angels vs evil Demons worked wonderfully in D2 and even D3, but it's not 2001 anymore and that whole concept feels too cliché at this day and age. I mean I loved in D3 that we got to go to Heaven instead of Hell, but the story wasn't that innovative.

Here's hoping that the final boss this time is gonna be Imperius rather than Diablo. I mean they scratched the whole concept of not so good Angels in D3 with Imperius and the other Angels not exactly being 100% good guys, and later tried bringing a full scale Angel villain with Malthael. But it was imo done quite clumsily. I think D4 is actually their chance to do it right this time, rather than go back to D2 standard. I'm hoping we're gonna get the opposite of D3 and go to Hell to stop the Angels, or even go to Heaven, but this time to fight the Angels.

 

[deepstrasz]

As for the lore, honestly I wouldn't mind seeing some iconic villains come back like King Leoric or The Butcher

If I see those two again, it'll surely be the last game I buy from Blizzard.

Here's hoping that the final boss this time is gonna be Imperius rather than Diablo.

We went through that with Malthael. Imperius is weak. Diablo too as per Diablo III considering Diablo there was like 7 demons at once. That means the nephalem is strongest. Maybe he'll be the last boss instead? I doubt it.
Why not fight the universal Trag' Oul instead so we can finally put an end to everything?

 

[Venombite]

We went through that with Malthael.

Well no, he was more a death/necromancer vibe. I don't think we ever had a hc angelic villain, I mean an Angel that's all about Light and Song stuff.

 

[deepstrasz]

I mean an Angel that's all about Light and Song stuff.

That would be against the angelic ideal, for such to be a villain. Compared to demons, angels did not directly interfere with humanity, except for Tyrael who acted more as a guide.

 

[MasterBlaster]

King Leoric or The Butcher

Again? I mean, we just had both of them in D3, let them rest.

 

[deepstrasz]

Again? I mean, we just had both of them in D3, let them rest.

Yeah, and I also hate the phrase: "there's no Diablo game without Diablo" or something like that.

 

[Venombite]

Anyone here willing to speculate on a release date?
I'm thinking it'll be early-mid 2022. Diablo Immortal will be dropping later this year, and if D2R rumors are true, than D2R will be announced at the coming Blizzcon, and probably released in early to mid 2021. I know, Refunded fear starts, but I don't think D2R will fail, two reasons. One it's a 2D game, and thus easier to remaster, and two they can't afford it to fail, or it would be a marketing disaster, the last thing they need in preparation for D4. So that leaves early to mid 2022 for D4.

Also the two remaining classes?
I'm pretty certain that the fourth class will be an archer type class, the successor of Rogue(D1), Amazon(D2) and Demon Hunter(D3), but none of those. Rogue is just primitive in this day and age, Amazon won't work cause they wanna add character customization and Amazons can't be male, and I'm not sure they'll want to return a trap setting Archer that was the Demon Hunter, though Demon Hunter seems most likely of the three. Most probably it'll be a new archer type class.
As for the second, well there are really three other options: first being Paladin/Crusaider/Templar, second Necromancer and third ninja type class, a successor to Assassin(D2) and Monk(D3). Again don't think they'll go with light ninja Monk, nor a pure Assassin, but rather a new class of the same ninja type. Any one of the three could be in base game, while the other two in an expansion(or expansions).

 

[MasterBlaster]

D2R will be announced at the coming Blizzcon, and probably released in early to mid 2021

I've heard that Resurrected is to be released this year:
Report: ‘Diablo 2: Resurrected’ Remaster Coming This Year, Built By Former ‘Destiny 2’ Support Studio

This quote from the article above though:

However, we all remember the disaster that was the Warcraft 3: Reforged launch, which was one of the most broken, unwelcome releases in recent memory.

Anyway, release date... I think it's definetely not this or the next year, so 2022 seems fair, though I wouldn't be surprised if the game releases as far as 2023.

 

[Venombite]

I've heard that Resurrected is to be released this year:

Pretty certain that won't be happening. If the D2R rumors are true indeed, they won't be releasing it just out of nowhere, it's not how they do things. Instead there'll be an official announcement, a Beta and so on... And iirc, both Starcraft Remastered and Warcraft 3 Refunded were announced at Blizzcon, so they'll "have to" wait till Blizzcon for the announcement. And given that Blizzcon is in November, they simply won't have time to get it out till the end of the year, so that means early 2021 at the earliest. Most likely, like with SR and Wc3R, it won't be the big reveal of Blizzcon, but a side reveal to get everyone surprised and hyped.
Here's hoping that the big reveal of this year Blizzcon will be Starcraft 3. Yeah, I know it's not likely, but one can dream, hope dies last. I know RTS is pretty much a dead genre, but it doesn't have to be strictly RTS. It can be an RTS-FPS/TPS-racing game hybrid, especially cause they kinda scratched the surface with Nova Covert Ops. Then again they've released Overwatch in between now and then, so yeah, it's unlikely, but one can dream, hope dies last.

 

[MasterBlaster]

And iirc, both Starcraft Remastered and Warcraft 3 Refunded were announced at Blizzcon, so they'll "have to" wait till Blizzcon for the announcement.

No, they won't. Until WoW:Legion, every single WoW expansion was announced at Blizzcon and they they've announced one at Gamescom. Heck, Diablo 3 was revealed at the Worldwide Invitational in Paris. There's no rule that they can only announce stuff at Blizzcon.

With that in mind, there's also this:

Geoff Keighley will act as both curator and host for pre- and post-shows in a lineup that includes companies such as Bethesda, Blizzard Entertainment, CD Projekt Red, Electronic Arts, Microsoft, Riot, Sony, and Square Enix.

Source: Summer Game Fest, a new digital celebration, promises months of gaming news and events

To make things even more interesting, the 20th anniversary of Diablo 2's release date is this June and Blizzard is said to participate in the Summer Game Fest Event around that time, which makes it possible or even likely that what Blizzard will bring to this event is precisely the Diablo 2 Resurrected announcement.

And given that Blizzcon is in November, they simply won't have time to get it out till the end of the year, so that means early 2021 at the earliest.

If they announce it at Summer Game Fest, which again seems quite likely, then they still have 6 months between the announcement and release.

If the D2R rumors are true indeed, they won't be releasing it just out of nowhere

The information about D2R releasing this year comes from the very same source that leaked that it's coming at all.

 

[Venombite]

Amazon won't work cause they wanna add character customization and Amazons can't be male, and I'm not sure they'll want to return a trap setting Archer that was the Demon Hunter, though Demon Hunter seems most likely of the three. Most probably it'll be a new archer type class.

On second thought, I'd like to correct myself a bit here.
On Blizzcon playable demo, of the three classes, Barbarian had four character customization options, one was basically Sonya from D3 and HotS, the other was a woman with darker and smaller hair, third was a white male a lot younger than his D3 counterpart and fourth was a black male. However Sorceress and Druid only had two, female Sorceress with long and short hair and black and white male Druid. So a sorceress could be female only and druid male only. I assumed that was cause male Sorcerer and female Druid weren't done yet, but....
After double checking the lore, there is no reason for druids being strictly male, however Sorceress is gender locked. So there are two things they could be doing here. They could be retconing D2 as we speak, or they plan to make some classes gender locked. While I don't like them retconning D2, I also think that gender locking is a step back from D3 rather than a step forward.
However if they're making gender locked classes, given that the three confirmed classes come pretty much straight out of D2, than I think the Amazon is not just possible, but actually extreamly likely to be the 4th class in D4.

 

[deepstrasz]

On second thought, I'd like to correct myself a bit here.

Maybe they'll make the male Sorceress a Wizard. Whatever the case, I'd not be surprised seeing a male Amazon for customization purposes, even if it doesn't make sense lorewise or maybe they'll figure out some lame addition/retcon for it.

 

[Venombite]

Maybe they'll make the male Sorceress a Wizard.

You mean a D3 Wizard?
They "can't" do that. That would mean that female and male would have to have a significantly different appearance, with a Middle-Eastern looking and themed female and East Asian looking and themed male. Also from game play perspective, while D2 and D4 Sorceress is solely focused on using elemental magic, D3 Wizard, while having some elemental spells, is mostly centered and focused on Arcane magic(*cough*WoW Mage*cough*), so again to simply make customization "won't be possible" in that perspective.

 

[deepstrasz]

Yeah, they pretty much killed the classes in D3 and the wizard is one of the worst because they also had to create a new place that wasn't ever mentioned before.

 

[Venombite]

wizard is one of the worst because they also had to create a new place that wasn't ever mentioned before.

I actually disagree here. If anything it's the other way around. To me Xiansai is a missed opportunity for D4 rather than a D3 mistake. Imagine going to the land with East Asian people and architecture, filled with Japanese/Chinese/Korean horror monstrosities.(to my knowledge, among other things, Japanese are known worldwide for having extremely brutal horror stuff) That could've been brutal, fighting all kinds of those monstrosities. Maybe even giving Li-Ming(cannon D3 Wizard) a cameo and some small role, though that might not be possible cause she'd recognize Sonya.
Instead they went with the standard Desert/Snowy Mountains/Jungle types. I mean Scosglen sounds great in theory, but we'll have to see how it works in game. I hope they focus on that Celtic elements and feeling rather than making it a New Tristram #4. Having us fight all kinds of monstrosities from Celtic myths rather than just Zombies, Skeletons and Ghosts. The same I'm hoping for other regions, I hope that Fractured Peaks will be as different from Barbarian Highlands as possible, Hawezar as different from Kurast as possible, Kehjistan as different from uhhh....Kehjistan as possible(I doubt we'll be seeing Caldeum again in D4 so there's room for expanding). I mean the concept art looks somewhat different, than again somewhat sameish. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[The_Silent]

If they stopped being creative and just regurgitate the same concepts over and over again I would never return to diablo. It is the absolutely worst when franchises do this in their squeals.

 

[deepstrasz]

I actually disagree here. If anything it's the other way around. To me Xiansai is a missed opportunity for D4 rather than a D3 mistake. Imagine going to the land with East Asian people and architecture, filled with Japanese/Chinese/Korean horror monstrosities

I don't need to imagine another Pandaria. Also, it's heavily Chinese based, not Japanese.

f they stopped being creative and just regurgitate the same concepts over and over again I would never return to diablo. It is the absolutely worst when franchises do this in their squeals.

I'm not saying that. I'm saying they did it badly, basically overwriting the Zann Esu and Vizjerei with Xiansai instead of making it its own thing, with its own class(es).

 

[MasterBlaster]

Well... An Update on BlizzCon

It's understandable considering the nature of the event and the COVID19 situation, but it's going to be interesting to see how they do their announcement this year - I think the chances of Summer Game Fest being actually relevant just went up significantly.

Also @Archian @Mythic in case the staff wants to post this as news

 

[deepstrasz]

Well...

good economical strategy since they'd probably lose more and also not sure how much deep into the social distancing measure Cali is.

 

[Venombite]

I don't need to imagine another Pandaria. Also, it's heavily Chinese based, not Japanese.

I disagree again. As mentioned in another post, even though Pandaria was based entirely on a joke, probably initially non cannon character, that was meant as little less than a tribute to ecology and animal preservation, it was actually a nice expanding and a nice piece of content, and man are Pandaria aesthetics, game play and even lore kinda awesome.
Anyway back to Diablo. I don't think Xiansai is Chinese. That would be like, just cause Westmarch is based on Paris, so Westmarch is France, or cause Tristram citizens have somewhat German sounding names, Khanduras is German or Dutch. No all three Western Kingdoms are based on medieval western Europe, but not specifically on any country. In the same way Xiansai is based on medieval East Asia. Sure Xiansai should look like some China, but some Japan or Korea would fit nicely too.

@MasterBlaster you seem to follow Diablo news pretty religiously. So, Diablo Immortal is going to be an MMORPG for mobiles only? That might ruin Diablo, since it's mobile it probably won't have that many character customization, and I imagine a lot of people will be giving their characters their cannon names. So seeing a dozen Johannas running around at the same time in the same place is going to look a lot weird.

 

[deepstrasz]

you seem to follow Diablo news pretty religiously. So, Diablo Immortal is going to be an MMORPG for mobiles only? That might ruin Diablo, since it's mobile it probably won't have that many character customization, and I imagine a lot of people will be giving their characters their cannon names. So seeing a dozen Johannas running around at the same time in the same place is going to look a lot weird.

From what I saw in the trailer, it looked a bit more action-adventure packed which I found interesting but yeah, phones...

hat would be like, just cause Westmarch is based on Paris, so Westmarch is France, or cause Tristram citizens have somewhat German sounding names, Khanduras is German or Dutch. No all three Western Kingdoms are based on medieval western Europe, but not specifically on any country. In the same way Xiansai is based on medieval East Asia. Sure Xiansai should look like some China, but some Japan or Korea would fit nicely too.

I wrote heavily based on Chinese culture, not only. That doesn't mean there's no other Asian influence.
I didn't relate any cardinal points to cultures. They might have done it somewhat intentionally or involuntarily. Skovos might be south like Greece, and others, so many things kind of fit with our world map, yeah.
I think Khanduras sounds more Spanish, Latin?

While Pandaria is nice and all, it's as you wrote, a joke