Christianity, The Holy Trinity

[MySpaceBarBroke]

Christ isn't god, he's a part of God sure, but you've got to understand that christ isn't everwhere, he's the son of god, so he has his limits also, but through god all things are possible, so through out his time on earth he'd go back from just healing people to healing them in the name of the father...he did both many times (first in his name while the second in his fathers name.

I don't think Christ is omni-present, god is though, although when sin is present in our hearts his presence leaves us, and since christ had all the sin that was EVER done put on him for thoes 3 days, God was seperated from him

I'm too lazy to requote my bible passages, so can you go to post #43?

 

[FuryOfASquirrel]

ill quote too then

And at the ninth hour Jesus cried out in a loud voice. "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?"-which means,"My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

and what's forsaken mean?

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

ill quote too then

and what's forsaken mean?

But he WAS one with his father on at least one occasion, and he IS omnipresent. Therefore, it contradicts with hell.

 

[FuryOfASquirrel]

Alright alright, Elenai, u got anything?

 

[Elenai]

Actually Furyofasquirrel God, The Holy Spirit, and Christ are one and are the same just in three different manifestations and persons.

And Hell is not a sin its self. Thus just because God's presence is there does not mean that Hell isnt Hell anymore. God simply makes it so that the denizens of Hell cannot feel his presence.

And thus it is not contradictory.

 

[FuryOfASquirrel]

ah, fine then, XD

g2g = church

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

Actually Furyofasquirrel God, The Holy Spirit, and Christ are one and are the same just in three different manifestations and persons.

And Hell is not a sin its self. Thus just because God's presence is there does not mean that Hell isnt Hell anymore. God simply makes it so that the denizens of Hell cannot feel his presence.

And thus it is not contradictory.

Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Pretty quote chain

 

[Elenai]

Why do you insist on quoting the same passage that has been answered three times.

"Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;"

IT MEANS THIS= They go to hell and God severs their feeling of his presence and glory and power.

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

Why do you insist on quoting the same passage that has been answered three times.

"Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;"

IT MEANS THIS= They go to hell and God severs their feeling of his presence and glory and power.

not their FEELING. he simply ISN'T present. you have not answered the quote as it should be answered.

 

[Elenai]

I have answered it you are just trying to prove that God does'nt exist because you keep trying to read the passage in away that says God does'nt.

GOD simply enough for the 5th time in this thread severs his connection and presence to the Denizens of HELL.

THAT is how the quote should be answered because that IS THE ANSWER.

its like I am telling you that the square root of 81 is 9 and you are trying to say that 81 doesnt exist because 9+9 isnt 81.

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

I have answered it you are just trying to prove that God does'nt exist because you keep trying to read the passage in away that says God does'nt.

I am not proving god "does'nt" exist. I am proving the bible contradicts itself.

GOD simply enough for the 5th time in this thread severs his connection and presence to the Denizens of HELL.

Yes, he severs his presence, not hides it. It's not seen by the denizens of hell because it isn't there. It's not their point of view.

THAT is how the quote should be answered because that IS THE ANSWER.

Upper statement.

its like I am telling you that the square root of 81 is 9 and you are trying to say that 81 doesnt exist because 9+9 isnt 81.

No, it's like telling you the square root of 81 is 9, but you saying i interpreted it wrong, because i'm supposed to find the square of 8, not 9.

 

[Elenai]

The bible does not contradict its self.

Gods presence is in Hell. The denizens are cut off from it. Like the leaves of a tree in a yard. The leaves are cut off but the tree and its life giving roots but is still in the yard.

That quote was anwered.

hmmhmm. the square of 8. really.

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

The bible does not contradict its self.

Gods presence is in Hell. The denizens are cut off from it. Like the leaves of a tree in a yard. The leaves are cut off but the tree and its life giving roots but is still in the yard.

That quote was anwered.

hmmhmm. the square of 8. really.

Everlasting destruction from the presence of the lord means being tormented without the lord there.
God = Jesus = Everywhere = In Hell, but
Hell = No God In It.

 

[Elenai]

Without the lords presence being felt.

God is everywhere but his presence is not felt in hell.

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

Without the lords presence being felt.

God is everywhere but his presence is not felt in hell.

It never said anything about him not being felt, it said his presence wasn't there.

 

[Elenai]

But his presence is there.

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

But his presence is there.

And from that stems contradiction, no?

 

[wugiboy]

Hello Fury, I am Elenai one of the known Christians here at the HIVE. I am very pleased with this thread. God bless you.

I am also here if anyone has questions about Christianity.

...sorry thats all I could think of as a first post in this thread.

ello mates! I'm a catholic..

 

[Eleandor]

The bible does not contradict its self.

Gods presence is in Hell. The denizens are cut off from it. Like the leaves of a tree in a yard. The leaves are cut off but the tree and its life giving roots but is still in the yard.

That quote was anwered.

hmmhmm. the square of 8. really.

the bible does not CONTRADICT itself???

The First Day
3 1.3 2Macc 7.28; 2Co 4.6.
God said, “I command light to shine!” And light started shining. 4 God looked at the light and saw that it was good. He separated light from darkness 5 and named the light “Day” and the darkness “Night.” Evening came and then morning—that was the first day.
d 1.5 the first day: A day was measured from evening to evening.
The Second Day
6 1.6-8 2P 3.5.
God said, “I command a dome to separate the water above it from the water below it.” 7 And that's what happened. God made the dome 8 and named it “Sky.” Evening came and then morning—that was the second day.
The Third Day
9 God said, “I command the water under the sky to come together in one place, so there will be dry ground.” And that's what happened. 10 God named the dry ground “Land,” and he named the water “Ocean.” God looked at what he had done and saw that it was good.
11 God said, “I command the earth to produce all kinds of plants, including fruit trees and grain.” And that's what happened. 12 The earth produced all kinds of vegetation. God looked at what he had done, and it was good. 13 Evening came and then morning—that was the third day.
The Fourth Day
14 God said, “I command lights to appear in the sky and to separate day from night and to show the time for seasons, special days, and years. 15 I command them to shine on the earth.” And that's what happened. 16 God made two powerful lights, the brighter one to rule the day and the other
e 1.16 the brighter ... the other: The sun and the moon. But they are not called by their names, because in Old Testament times some people worshiped the sun and the moon as though they were gods.
to rule the night. He also made the stars. 17 Then God put these lights in the sky to shine on the earth, 18 to rule day and night, and to separate light from darkness. God looked at what he had done, and it was good. 19 Evening came and then morning—that was the fourth day.
The Fifth Day
20 God said, “I command the ocean to be full of living creatures, and I command birds to fly above the earth.” 21 So God made the giant sea monsters and all the living creatures that swim in the ocean. He also made every kind of bird. God looked at what he had done, and it was good. 22 Then he gave the living creatures his blessing—he told the ocean creatures to live everywhere in the ocean and the birds to live everywhere on earth. 23 Evening came and then morning—that was the fifth day.

On the 6th day, God created the human

When the Lord God made the heavens and the earth, 5 no grass or plants were growing anywhere. God had not yet sent any rain, and there was no one to work the land. 6 But streams
f 2.6 streams: Or “mist.”
came up from the ground and watered the earth.
7 2.7 Ws 15.8
The Lord God took a handful of soil and made a man.
g 2.7 man: In Hebrew “man” comes from the same word as “soil.”
God breathed life into the man, and the man started breathing. 8 The Lord made a garden in a place called Eden, which was in the east, and he put the man there.
9 2.9 Rev 2.7; 22.2
The Lord God placed all kinds of beautiful trees and fruit trees in the garden. Two other trees were in the middle of the garden.

so... was Nature made before or after the creation of humans??
Something else: birds were evolved after mammals. Or are you one of those extremist Americans who reject the Evolution Theory? Good luck proving it, and start with reading your 2 first chapters again.
These are only the FIRST 2 chapters of the bible, and already there's a contradiction. Read the bible again will you.

Now, although we *know* God is on earth, we cannot see or hear him, we can only believe in him, as even the bible is no prove of his excistance.
Ok, so hell is a place where god excists (God = everywhere), but we cannot see or hear him. Thus, Earth = Hell.

Jezus didn't *feel* God's precense when he was about to die. Did that make him a fallen angel that would go to hell? why was he resurrected then?

God is everywhere and everything, which means he must have created hell for a reason. Why? Which father wants to let his own children burn in hell even if they have "terrible" sins? Which father forgives everybody for everything but nevertheless creates something like hell? Sinless babies go to heaven, right? sure, unless they're not baptised... Oh, really? so unguilty little babies don't go to heaven because a ritual wasn't performed? Gosh, God really must love his own children...
No offence, but what kind of rule was that anyway? Oh, and it's not the only strange one out there.

Eating meat on friday is forbidden, and people will go to hell if they eat anyway. Although a few years ago, the pope declared eating meat was no longer a sin... so what does God say to all those people in hell? Oh, sorry for burning you, you can eat meat again?

I'm Christian, I believe in God, but this same God gave us a brain to think with. Use it.

The bible isn't always right
The pope isn't always right
You aren't always right either.

 

[JarrardKO]

^ Amen. Please use your brain Elenai. It's almost as if the information you read in others replies goes into your ear but comes out of the other one and you just don't get it at all and miss the point. It tends to make you look pretty stupid sometimes in this thread.

LOL GET IT? AMEN? CHRISTIAN THREAD?

BADOOM-CH!

 

[Dr00d]

LOL GET IT? AMEN? CHRISTIAN THREAD?

BADOOM-CH!

Ha ha I lol'd.

 

[Elenai]

1st of all: the bible does not contradict its self in genisis either.

and actually the bible says that:
first came light:
second came land and the sky:
third came plants: which thrived on the ever present light before the sun and moon.
fourth came the creatures of the sea and then the birds of the sky:
fifth came the mammals and the creeping things:
sixth came man:
seventh he rested to watch his creation:

Evolution itself has much the same timeline: except they propose that billions of years of genetic mutation has created these creatures.

God did create nature first: but he created a special garden in the east for his creation called man after natures initial creation.

Hell was created as a prison for fallen angels that rebeled against God and tried to take his throne. When man sinned we doomed our selves to Hell.
God does not want to send any of his children to Hell. But he is a just God and when we have done crimes against him and each other Hell is our fate.
Just because a judge doesnt want to see anyone go to prison does not mean he doesnt give out the judgement a criminal deserves and we all deserve Hell not one of us is sinless. God did however in his mercy and love send his only son to die for us and be the sacrifice, it is a free gift and only needs to be accepted and entrence to heaven is guaranteed for eternity. Christ did not feel God's presence because when he hung on the cross he took all the sins of humanity and laid it on himself and so God could not look upon the sin that covered him. God resurected him because the sins on him were taken away because he died as the sacrifice and those sins were paid for. Jesus then conquered death and was resurected.

Babies do not go to Hell and eating meat on Fridays wont send you there either. Babies do not know right from wrong and thus do not enter Hell because they cannot repent for what they dont know is sin.

You do not become saved through ritual and works. That is a heresy. You become saved through accepting Christs sacrifice and that is the only path to Heaven.

I am not always right: I know
The pope isnt always right: he's a human being of course not
The bible is always right: because its the living word of God and is still relevent today and still as powerful even as thousands of years has gone by.

Dont call me stupid JarrardKO I am far from stupid I am actually quite intelligent. (no conciet implied).

 

[Eleandor]

No offence but did you actually read my post?
How can you say that the bible doesn't contradict itself in Genesis if you compare Genesis: The Story of Creation and Genesis: The Garden of Eden. there is NO way that that is no contradiction...
No, don't try to talk yourself out of this one, just admit that this is a contradiction because it IS a contradiction. You must either be blind or dumb if you cannot read what these 2 chapters say. So don't make a fool of yourself if you deny this

Something else about Genesis 1, it implies that God rested on the 7th day as his creation was finished. So... how do you explain the whole evolution theory?? how do you explain mutations that lead to new species if the creation is finished?

I never said babies go to hell, but if they're not baptised, they are NOT allowed in heaven.

Many Catholics today do not know that there is an obligation to abstain from meat on all Fridays of the year. While it is true that the Code of Canon Law allows for the substituting of another penitential practice, authorized by the National Conference of Catholic Bishops (NCCB), such a substitute penitential practice has not been defined. As a consequence, many Catholics have set aside the abiding custom of the Church. Few clergy inform the faithful of the obligation of Friday penance.

Another thing: I'm sorry to tell you, but the bible wasn't thrown on some profet's head. The bible was written by various people, and jezus wasn't even one of them. The writers might have been INSPIRED by "God", but the writers are still human beings, and you just said yourself that human beings make errors. Logic tells me that the bible contains errors too.

 

[Elenai]

There is no contradiction as I explained earlier.

Creation is complete development is still going on. And even when a Dog becomes a new spiecies of Dog it is still a Dog. Mutation is adaptation not evolution.

You do not have to be baptised to go to Heaven. The thief hanging on the cross beside Jesus who accepted him while hanging and admitted his sins, Christ said you will be in paradise with me. The thief wasnt babtised, and he still went to heaven.

God gave the prophets the word and the prophets had it written down or they themselves wrote it. and what ever errors in the bible there is is like a typo in a history book. You can still clearly make out what happened. And Christ was indeed a prophet, But he is also the living savior of all the universe.

 

[Eleandor]

There is no contradiction as I explained earlier.

sigh...

let me rephrase the 2 first chapters in the bible in short:

The story of creation:
God created plantlife
blablabla
After doing so, God created the human
blablabla

The Garden of Eden:
God created the first human
blablabla
After doing so, God created plantlife
blablabla

First god created plantlife, then humans. but not even TWO pages later in the bible, the bible says that God first created human and then plantlife...
no offence, but if you still don't see any contradiction, you're just hopeless

Creation is complete development is still going on. And even when a Dog becomes a new spiecies of Dog it is still a Dog. Mutation is adaptation not evolution.

Oh, so now the world wasn't created in 6 days and finished?? The bible isn't so right after all is it

You do not have to be baptised to go to Heaven. The thief hanging on the cross beside Jesus who accepted him while hanging and admitted his sins, Christ said you will be in paradise with me. The thief wasnt babtised, and he still went to heaven.

I'm talking about SINLESS BABIES that haven't even spend 5 minutes of their life on Earth.

God gave the prophets the word and the prophets had it written down or they themselves wrote it. and what ever errors in the bible there is is like a typo in a history book. You can still clearly make out what happened. And Christ was indeed a prophet, But he is also the living savior of all the universe.

heh, so if you can still clearly make out what happened, why are there HUNDREDS of interpretations? why is there large evidence that a few hundreds of years after Christ's dead, certain people decided what should be in the bible and what shouldn't? because it's the word of God? (oh no... don't say "yes", please..)

 

[Elenai]

OH I SEE what your seeing now. God created plant life blahblahblah. But when he created man he put them in a safe haven the garden of Eden so he wasnt recreateing plant life he just made a home in a location. Not contradictory.

God created the world. And so the world changes why is the bible wrong for that.

Babies go to heaven when they die.

Why because people in general interperate things even instruction manuals for blenders are interpretated.

The bible is the word of God, The council simply compiled it. Its like the worlds knowledge being compiled in an encyclopedia.

 

[Eleandor]

Read closely what it says in "The Garden of Eden":
When the Lord God made the heavens (heavenS? oh, I thought there was only 1 heaven) and the earth, 5 NO GRASS OR PLANTS WERE GROWING ANYWHERE

7 2.7 Ws 15.8
The Lord God took a handful of soil and made a man.

9 2.9 Rev 2.7; 22.2
The Lord God placed all kinds of beautiful trees and fruit trees in the garden. Two other trees were in the middle of the garden.

READ goddamnit


If you say babies go to heaven, they will? Sorry, but get informed about what christianity really stands for the next post you make. unbaptised babies will NOt go to heaven, end of the story. If you don't believe in that, fine for you but then you're not following the Christian rules.

Profets are people too. If you say people interpretate things, don't you think 1 out of 100s of bible writers would have interpretated God's words instead of just writing it down? What do you think are the gospels (dunno the english word, so I just put it in a translater...)? INTERPRETATIONS of people on the life of Christ. Why, do you think, is Johannes the ONLY one in the 4 gospels who says Jezus christ was born in a barn? why is he the only one who mentiones the 3 magi?

 

[Elenai]

The heavens are:
The stratus heavens : the sky
The stellar heavens: space
Heaven: its well .....Heaven

I did read. HE MADE A BLOODY GARDEN he didnt recreate plant life.

Babies do go to heaven you don't have to be baptised only saved. I know this for a fact. I am not biblically ignorant Baptism is a symbol to the world that HEY I accepted CHRIST. To believe that without baptism you will not enter heaven is a heresy and a false teaching. Until proven otherwise I will stick to my original statment.

When God directly says to a person do something they do it there is no room for interpretation. The Goseples are the Biography of Christ. And just because John is the only one who mention magi doesnt mean the bible is wrong, Its only a detail in the big picture that Jesus was born in a stable, and such.

 

[Eleandor]

it says he created the garden AFTER he created the man. Above that, he created and placed the plants in the garden after creating the garden.

re-read both chapters again and extremely closely this time please. Don't try to interpretate it but just read it objectively.

oh, and unbaptised babies don't go to heaven, they go to the Limbo. The edge of hell. Sorry to disappoint you, but you're not an informed Christian, it seems.

 

[Elenai]

That still does not mean that the bible is contradictory.

Limbo is a creation of man and there is no mention in the bible of limbo nor is there any biblical evidence to support limbo. Limbo is a false teaching. I am indeed informed.

 

[Eleandor]

That still does not mean that the bible is contradictory.

what
the
fuck

sorry for that, but... WHAT THE FUCK??

the bible *is* a creation of man too. Ofcourse I can't prove it right now because I'm not a historician. As far as I know, all evidence leads to that.
Oh, and the bible YOU read is definatelly not the original one. The original one was written thousends of years ago, and has been adapted through the ages, not to mention the differences in Bible translations. So how can different versions all contain the same truth? oh, and the differences are not spelling flaws, it are total different concepts. and even if only 1 word changes its meaning, it could change the whole meaning of the book.

I give up now, if you can't face that's a huge contradiction, you're not ready for it I guess...

 

[Elenai]

What ever the bible is God breathed.

You cannot change an entire book by changing one word. THATS LUDOCRUS.

The bible was not ever adapted, It was translated. ONLY translated. Recently churches under the thumb of anti christian values have tried to make their own politically correct copies and that IS a sin that will not stand.

 

[JoshT]

Three major questions are:
Is Christianity a Religion?
- a system of measurement
- provides a false comfort and belief
- creates a confusion
- a belief that focuses mostly on humankind's work and history

Is Christianity based on morality, manners and ethics implanted in the human mind but only discovered after reading a book about it?

Or did humankind made "Religion" to set morality, manners and ethics to make a world a better place, because of the reason that humans have a short life span, therefore we strive to better ourselves, facing changes almost everyday?

Oh yeah and one more thing, maybe Jesus was real, only the historical evidence was burnt and/or lost. The Roman Empire did get a lot of sacking from the Visigoths, and it did get terrorized by the Huns.

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

What ever the bible is God breathed.

You cannot change an entire book by changing one word. THATS LUDOCRUS.

The bible was not ever adapted, It was translated. ONLY translated. Recently churches under the thumb of anti christian values have tried to make their own politically correct copies and that IS a sin that will not stand.

So there is only one correct denomination of christianity, and you only read the old testament?

 

[Elenai]

There is only one correct christianity and that is the one that follows the bible and the biblical teachings.

All the others are nothing more than non christian cults.

 

[JoshT]

I agree with SpaceBar
He has a very good valid point, since there's lots of adaptations like the Roman Catholic Edition, King James edition, and others as such.
The words between the editions can make confusion and misunderstanding
And there's a lot of Christian denominations out there, like:
- Roman Catholicism
- Eastern Orthodoxy
- Protestantism
You can name the rest.

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

"The Lord is slow to anger, and great in power, and will not at all acquit the wicked: the Lord hath his way in the whirlwind and in the storm, and the clouds are the dust of his feet" (Nahum 1:3).

Clouds are God's footprints in Heaven and are made up of the dust from his feet.

"And the Lord said unto [Moses], Who hath made man's mouth? or who maketh the dumb, or deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? have not I the Lord ?" (Exodus 4:11). "And, behold, thou shalt be dumb, and not able to speak, until the day that these things shall be performed because thou believest not my words, which shall be fulfilled in their season" (Luke 1:20).

deficiencies are deliberately inflicted on some people by God.

"Hear attentively the noise of his voice, and the sound that goeth out of his mouth. He directeth it under the whole heaven, and his lightning unto the ends of the earth" (Job 37:2-3).

Thunder is the sound of his bellowing voice. Lightning is a deadly force He deliberately hurls at various places

"I do set my bow in the cloud; and it shall be a token of a covenant between me and the earth. And it shall come to pass, when I bring a cloud over the earth, that the bow shall be seen in the cloud: And I will remember my covenant, which is between you and me and every living creature of all flesh; and the waters shall no more become a flood to destroy all flesh" (Genesis 9:13-15).

God has rainbows occur periodically to remind Him that He has promised not to brutally kill all the men, women, children and unborn children of the Earth again

"Behold, the whirlwind of the Lord goeth forth with fury, a continuing whirlwind: it shall fall with pain upon the head of the wicked" (Jeremiah 30:23). "Yea, they shall not be planted; yea, they shall not be sown: yea, their stock shall not take root in the earth: and he shall also blow upon them, and they shall wither, and the whirlwind shall take them away as stubble" (Isaiah 40:24).

God uses tornadoes to kill sinners when He wants a quick result, as opposed to the somewhat slower means of plagues and pestilence

"But God came to Abimelech in a dream by night, and said to him, Behold, thou art but a dead man, for the woman which thou hast taken; for she is a man's wife. . . . For the Lord had fast closed up all the wombs of the house of Abimelech, because of Sarah Abraham's wife" (Genesis 20:3, 18)." "And he had two wives; the name of the one was Hannah, and the name of the other Peninnah: and Penninah had children, but Hannah had no children. . . .But unto Hannah he gave a worthy portion; for he loved Hannah: but the Lord had shut up her womb" (1 Samuel 1:2, 5).

Inability to have children is a punishment for being adulterers, whether they admit the sin or not

"Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the Lord of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger" (Isaiah 13:13). "Then the earth shook and trembled; the foundations also of the hills moved and were shaken, because he was wroth" (Psalms 18:7).

God inflicts earthquakes on sinners when he is really angry

"He turneth the rivers into a wilderness, and the watersprings into dry ground; A fruitful land into barrenness, for the wickedness of them that dwell therein" (Psalms 107:33-34). "Though he be fruitful among his brethren, an east wind shall come, the wind of the Lord shall come up from the wilderness, and his spring shall become dry, and his foundation shall be dried up: he shall spoil the treasure of all pleasant vessels" (Hosea 13:15).

Rivers and springs sometimes dry up because quite simply, this is product of the sin of those nearby

"The Lord shall smite thee with a consumption, and with a fever, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword, and with blasting, and with mildew; and they shall pursue thee until thou perish. And thy heaven that is over thy head shall be brass, and the earth that is under thee shall be iron. The Lord shall make the rain of thy land powder and dust: from heaven shall it come down upon thee, until thou be destroyed" (Deuteronomy 28:22-24).

Drought is is one of God's many punishments for sin

"The Lord will smite thee with the botch of Egypt, and with the emerods, and with the scab, and with the itch, whereof thou canst not be healed" (Deuteronomy 28:27). "But the hand of the Lord was heavy upon them of Ashdod, and he destroyed them, and smote them with emerods, even Ashdod and the coasts thereof" (1 Samuel 5:6).

Hemorrhoids are yet another of God's countless methods of punishing sinners

 

[FuryOfASquirrel]

Why'd u list out punishments?

I do set my bow in the cloud; and it shall be a token of a covenant between me and the earth. And it shall come to pass, when I bring a cloud over the earth, that the bow shall be seen in the cloud: And I will remember my covenant, which is between you and me and every living creature of all flesh; and the waters shall no more become a flood to destroy all flesh" (Genesis 9:13-15).

God has rainbows occur periodically to remind Him that He has promised not to brutally kill all the men, women, children and unborn children of the Earth again

I thought it was to remind us that he won't make a flood not brutually kill us
Of course, it could mean both no flood and not to brutally kill

Okay, topic on bible being contradictory and other sub-groups of christianity...

Bible...was originally made of people that were writting stuff, god was working through them.
Thousands of years od adaptations and translations all happened, i think that whatever editing god had his word go through should still go through people of god, unless something like cults manipulating christians are tainting the world ot preach false-doctrine . But maybe somewhere along the line false-doctrine was laid-into some scripture editions and adaptations, but if that's the case than god gave us brains to look at it and REASON it, when we read it we should realy think about it (which is hard to believe that the bible has false-stuff in it since thousands of people read it, someone should notice)

Sub-Groups probably sprouted cause one church got made at another and made another name for itself, it's just humans getting mad at eachother and seperating -.-. There was probably only one Christian group at once, but than as it grew different opinions and harsh thoughts came up, seperation was probably expected.

 

[Teh_Ephy]

Hmm, I'm certainly in here rather late. The bible contradicts itself left and right, what's important is the overall story and the morals. People that obsessively defend details are... obsessive. As Elenai is so fond of saying, humans are imperfect.

The bible may (or may not) be what God breathed, but it was compiled by humans, who are imperfect. As such, the bible we read is imperfect, even if the bible as it was intended by God to be was totally perfect. So, whether or not the bible (as it was intended by God) is or is not what God breathed, it was compiled by humans, who are certainly imperfect.

Also, it was compiled by humans, it may be very far from the bible God intended the majority of humans to read (or uh... the one that he breathed). This could also explain the several many iterations of the bible, as it may have been compiled by several different and separate people or groups of people, each independently of each other, at the same time.

Have I settled the matter, or is my argument unsatisfactory?

 

[FuryOfASquirrel]

satisfies me

 

[zt2211]

Context is everything in the Bible. Don't go saying a single verse without telling the story behind it first. The Bible was split into verses AFTER it was written SOLELY to organize it.

Also, many, many people, even many born-again Christians, talk about the love and mercy and grace that God gives. I'm glad that He IS a God of mercy, love, and grace. However, many people do not realize that this is only HALF of who God really is!

God is Love, but He is also just. When God created man, He let him have a choice of whether to love Him or to forsake him. If the creation did not have a choice, then what glory would come to God for it? He would have just created a bunch of programmed robots!

God also gave angels freedom of will. That is why His former chief angel, Lucifer, could choose whether to love God or to lust after his own desires. Lucifer, through extreme pride, wanted to be more powerful than God, his creator. Lucifer was so cunning, he even convinced 1/3 of God's angels (who had never known sin before) to join him in open rebellion. Lucifer didn't understand God's love for him, and he thought he could do a better job of running things than God.

Well, it appears that God created the natural world AFTER the spiritual world. It stands to reason that the concept of time was born when the first traces of matter were made, since Einstein's theory of General Relativity states that time and matter are COMPLETELY inseparable. (This also makes sense later in the Bible, when in Revelations God says He will do away with the material world and time itself will, therefore, cease to exist [the End of Time concept])

When God creates human beings, He loves His creation enough to let man choose whether to love Him back. Lucifer, a.k.a. Satan, who was banished from heaven and hates God, saw a chance to hurt his enemy. So, Satan appeared to Eve and deceived her. Then she convinced Adam to sin along with her. Thus Adam and Eve defied their own Creator! Considering that God is the God of Love, it's hard to imagine how much it must've hurt for Him to watch His creation call Him a liar and disobey His command by eating the forbidden fruit.

Since God is a God of justice, and of mercy, and God already knew that man would fail Him, God started laying out a plan that would bring Him great glory in the end. He showed Adam and Eve that sacrifice is the only way to redemption. The fig leaves that Adam and Eve sewed together just didn't cut it; works alone wouldn't save them from what they deserved! Only God's mercy could do that. Did you know that God killed the first living creature as a sacrifice for man's sin? This is a type and a forerunner for the complete plan of Salvation through Jesus Christ.

Think about it. If you commit a crime, it doesn't matter how many hours you've volunteered to help out in the community, or how much time you've spent helping out disabled kids. You owe a debt to society that must be paid. Lets say that you're tried and found guilty. You can either pay a $200 fine, or go to jail for two months. Let's also say you're broke, and you have no way to pay for the fine. What can you do? Unless someone were merciful enough to pay your debt for you, you're going to prison for a while. It's the same way with works vs. salvation.

Every single person, at some point in their life, becomes aware and responsible for their eternal destiny. These people, you and me, everyone who is no longer shielded by innocence, would be found guilty of the curse of sin if we were given a fair trial. God Himself said that the wages of sin is death (which, in the Bible, usually means separation from God, not necessarily physical death). So, if we were to pay God ourselves for our life of rebellion and sin, we would need to do three things:
#1: We would need to physically die.
#2: We would need to go to Hell.
#3: We would then need to stay in Hell. Forever. Pretty bleak. I'm guessing this is a consequence of the "End of Time" concept. Thanks a lot, Einstein.

Luckily for humanity, God IS NOT pleased by the death of the wicked. That is why the Son, Jesus Christ, died on the cross. He was the ultimate, perfect sacrifice; God Himself, reduced and humbled in human form, the Creator, suffered and physically died for His creation! This is the perfect plan of salvation, it is God showing that He can do the impossible; He reestablished a relationship between sinful man and their Holy God. All we must do, as sinners, is, by faith, believe His promise, and He will pay our debt of sin for us. THAT, my friends, is how God gets ultimate glory. He deserves it, in my opinion.

 

[NetCriminal]

im a christian too!!

 

[Elenai]

zt2211 that is indeed correct. Basically you laid out the very heart of Christianity before the people. Very eloquently I might add.

 

[Teh_Ephy]

I certainly have no objections with it, although it is said with the presumed context that we all hold Christian beliefs... although he does say that context is everything.

 

[Elenai]

It is said that the law of God is written on the hearts of man. So that would explian how we all hold Christian values even if your religion is different or non existant. Though the main point of Christianity is not just the following of the law of God. But the salvation of man through the death, burial, and resurection.

 

[Teh_Ephy]

Heh. We don't all hold Christian values. Particularly the Japanese. I'd give examples, but I'm feeling a little brain-dead right now.

 

[Elenai]

Christian values as in the law of God, like not lying, stealing, murder, greed. Ect It is the concience if you will. The Jimmeny cricket in everyone. People will of course disobey them because they are sinful beings in need of salvation.

 

[Teh_Ephy]

Heh, murder. That's the one. In some cultures, fights to the death is actually the right thing to do.

 

[milcon]

"Repenting and telling others of your sin is 100% guarentee that your forgiven of that sin, if ur keeping a dirty secret god usually tries to eat away at it to make it public."
Sorry i forgot how to quote but that was said a few minutes back. Now, what about someone like the Fuhrer in WW2? He openly did not protest what he had done, so is that considered 'repenting'. So are you trying to tell me that hes livin heaven when he made countless people suffer, even to this day?

Also, just to add a note to something. For our family reunion we went to this christian lodge or something like that in Colorado(courtesy of my uncle/aunt that are very religeous). This place is HUGE, its got its own golf course and everything! So where is their church? Its a fricking shack that couldnt hold 10 people when the whole area is meant for a few hundred! But because it is a religeous area or something they dont have to pay taxes! And this is only one example of many things such as this.

Now, i am not trying to contradict the fact that there is a god, but tell me this. Are you open to the fact that the god may be of a different religeon that yours, or even one that NOONE knows of(i mean that there is no true bible, or kown truth)?

Personally, i dont think i will ever go to one religion, nor will i completely 'hate' or dismiss it entirely. The reason for this is that i do believe there could be a great being that had SOMETHING to do with us. Though i hardly believe of a 'god' as many see him. For all i know there could have been an alien race that nudged life along on earth, but also it could be one such as yours.

Alright so what i am getting at is are you open to ideas like that in any way? Also, do people who do not believe in god go to hell because of that? I personally believe thats a huge load of BS for those that think that because oh how we were raised as a kid to not believe in god(note im not talking about me. My parents are not religeous but let US decide which path we take).

 

[FuryOfASquirrel]

We're called to believe that christianity is the only way to god, but i can still tolerate other religions XD.

So i can open up to other ideas, but i won't believe in them.