www.wc3sear.ch's Stance on WoW Ports

[Horn]

Howdy folks.

First I'll just state that as long as Blizzard frown upon using Wow models/textures in Warcraft 3 - I'm against it too.

However, I'd like to know the official stance of this website - I'm more than happy to post WoW ports here if it is allowed.

 

[olofmoleman]

if yo are agianst using WoW models/skins in Warcraft3, then why did you upload several WoW models?

 

[Horn]

if yo are agianst using WoW models/skins in Warcraft3, then why did you upload several WoW models?

Because I bark like a frog.

 

[VGsatomi]

I say go ahead and upload'em, Whitehorn. Blizz already wont recognize us just because of a stupid banner.

if yo are agianst using WoW models/skins in Warcraft3, then why did you upload several WoW models?

Because WH has little to no respect for this site. Probably just a "I'll upload them here so my own site doesnt come into question" dealy.
-VGsatomi

 

[Horn]

I say go ahead and upload'em, Whitehorn. Blizz already wont recognize us just because of a stupid banner.

if yo are agianst using WoW models/skins in Warcraft3, then why did you upload several WoW models?

Because WH has little to no respect for this site. Probably just a "I'll upload them here so my own site doesnt come into question" dealy.
-VGsatomi

The site's fine - it's some the users I have no respect for!

Anyhow, I'll keep doing the sensible port requests.

People will port them either way - I just want to see them done efficiently.

For anyone interested:

I will port any model that doesn't already have a representation in Warcraft 3, on the conditions that it is less than 1mb total (including skins) and less than 2000 polygons if it is animated.

If Blizzard or the administration here requests these removed, I shall delete all my ports.

If anyone uses the model, I suggest you clearly add a disclaimer stating that you must own a copy of World of Warcraft to play maps/mods using these models.

Blizzard should obviously be credited for the graphics, and feel free to thank me for doing the port - some models take 5 minutes, some take up to an hour depending on how many meshes/anims/textures need optimising.

I'd love to credit the Author of mdlvis, but I can't make out his name in the Russian info. You should probably credit Oinkerwinkle and Yobgul too if you're going to bother crediting the authors of the tools I used.

 

[VGsatomi]

Well, if you want, I can set it up so that it says they were submitted by Blizz, so people think to credit them before crediting you.
-VGsatomi

 

[Horn]

Well, if you want, I can set it up so that it says they were submitted by Blizz, so people think to credit them before crediting you.
-VGsatomi

Well, I've placed in a note for each model now. I'd rather you leave my name on it (Submitter) so people can chose whether they prefer my ports as opposed to a certain few inefficient ports.

 

[cayjole]

If these are going to keep coming out, and I am sure they are - I think a new model category is in order here at wc3sear. It should be called "Stolen"...eh *cough, cough* I mean "WoW models." I can't say I am for the use of the models, but at the same time I can't say I am against them. I think it's the novelty of getting to use them in the RTS world that makes them just so darn exiting. Anyways, it's been said a hundred times and I'll say it again - skins from WoW just don't coexist well with WW3 skins - and that is why I feel there should be a new model category. Just a suggestion.

 

[DeadDogNoGoWoof]

im personally against it for ethical reasons, but i can live with them being in the archive...for now....

and i have discussed a new category for WoW models previously with VGsatomi, and it is now added.

 

[Afronight_76]

strange how this is now a conrtaversial issue when there are anciant models on this site ripped from NWN and other misc games.

 

[Kimbo]

but if u post wow models, all these people who have made the effort to make their own will lose diginity and wc3sear will nolonger b so creative.

 

[VGsatomi]

Somehow I doubt the posting of wow models will discourage anyone. Like every other model, they'll have their time on the front page, then be buried.
-VGsatomi

 

[Horn]

I thought this through before I posted anything - the cockroach was only going to be a joke to show how stupidly easy it is to do.

I considered that anyone can do it - and they'll probably do it badly (which they did).

So, I felt it best that I port what I can so those who want the models get decent ports - mostly efficient and usable models.

Added to this the fact that I make my own models, so I don't really lose any such 'dignity' or appear as some skill-less guy wanted some misguided praise for models that I hardly created.

 

[Kimbo]

but some of us put effort into our work..and then people who have wow will no longer giv respect to the home model makers and just go port some models or dl some illegal* ported ones..

 

[Mecheon]

Xaran Alamas asked Metzen about using WoW skins in WC3, and Metzen basically said "Go right ahead"

So yeah. Take that as you will

Oh, and I need to figure out how to get that program to work for me without crashing

 

[Kimbo]

holy shit!? the mighty metzen said that?!! howd they get in contact with him!??! i want hes addy!

 

[Horn]

but some of us put effort into our work..and then people who have wow will no longer giv respect to the home model makers and just go port some models or dl some illegal* ported ones..

So you want to censor the good wow models so that the crappy geomerges continue to get praise?

It's an inevitable phase - we all knew an importer would become available one day. I think the best people can do is wait it out and continue what you do.

If someone feels that better models is culling their motivation then that's quite pathetic. It should increase motivation to get better at what you do.

So, the qualty has gone up a notch, people need to accept that.

The textures and models are better than ever for people to edit, and the stagnant warcraft resource pile has had a nice make-over.

 

[Kimbo]

Grmm...fine...but noone better extract that worgen, im makin my own werewolf ^^

 

[Horn]

Xaran Alamas asked Metzen about using WoW skins in WC3, and Metzen basically said "Go right ahead"

No. No, he didn't.

 

[Mecheon]

Apparantly he did

But it was just a few skins, like the Dragonspawn, which is already in WC3 anyway

 

[Horn]

He did not say that.

He said more along the lines of 'I cannot legally answer that, but the world would not explode if you did'.

that pretty much sums up that it is not allowed, but Blizzard would hardly hunt you down if you did it.

 

[Blade.dk2]

I am AGAINST everything illegal here, WoW models, NWN models, WoW icons, WoW gold selling banner, Guild Wars icons etc. I think we should remove them.

 

[DeadDogNoGoWoof]

*cheer!*

 

[Horn]

I am AGAINST everything illegal here, WoW models, NWN models, WoW icons, WoW gold selling banner, Guild Wars icons etc. I think we should remove them.

I think you should shut your ignorant mouth from spouting trash.

http://www.battle.net/mod/resources.shtml#icons

 

[Afronight_76]

wait, didnt blizzard themselves upload a beta WoW model here?
http://www.wc3sear.ch/index.php?p=Models&ID=816&sid=e3814a4f57ee72b16a46d43c81da4c0f

but my best guess would be that someone just named themselve blizzard out fo spite.

 

[VGsatomi]

Its no more legal posting WoW models then it is posting altered WC3 models. Well, thats unless you all want this place to be a scratch modeing-only site if you REALLY fear legalities that much.... :roll:

(I know some of you woldnt complain about that )
-VGsatomi

 

[Kimbo]

well, does darky know about all this? cuz hes the one that could get punished.

 

[Horn]

Can someone clearly state why its not legal - quoting the official documents.

I had a quick look through the EULA and conduct and wow agreemenet and saw nothing.

 

[VGsatomi]

Can someone clearly state why its not legal - quoting the official documents.

I had a quick look through the EULA and conduct and wow agreemenet and saw nothing.

If you ever find anything, lemme know. :roll:
-VGsatomi

 

[Daelin]

It's no news that people have been posting WoW (even modified or merged) icons on this site. I even remember seeing one of Rommel's statues which from what I heard is merged from WoW stuff. Other HoS models are obtained that way.

And I also have a question, what about WoW icons? There are a lot, it wouldn't be a problem to delete them (remove the whole WoW icon cattegory and add a new rule which forbids people from posting WoW icons). But I want to do know what should I do. I can't just remove them before I hear some opinions and an administrator's decision.

~Daelin

 

[Xaran Alamas]

Firstly, Blizz themselves have put WoW icons up for download so they specifically are not a problem.
As for WoW models the difference between using WoW models and modified WC3 models is modified WC3 models are still being used for their original purpose even if they have been modified. Anyway I'm trying to get a clear position from Blizzard on WoW models in WC3 and once I get one I will spread the word.

 

[Blade.dk2]

Firstly, Blizz themselves have put WoW icons up for download so they specifically are not a problem.
As for WoW models the difference between using WoW models and modified WC3 models is modified WC3 models are still being used for their original purpose even if they have been modified. Anyway I'm trying to get a clear position from Blizzard on WoW models in WC3 and once I get one I will spread the word.

I couldn't agree more. I am awaiting Blizzard's answer.

Whitehorn: I know the WoW icons are up for download now but wc3sear.ch has some icons Blizzard hasn't uploaded, and moreover they were here before they were at the mod support site, so at that time it was illegal.

 

[DeadDogNoGoWoof]

Can someone clearly state why its not legal - quoting the official documents.

I had a quick look through the EULA and conduct and wow agreemenet and saw nothing.

From the Terms of Use,

All title, ownership rights and intellectual property rights in and to World of Warcraft (including without limitation any user accounts, titles, computer code, themes, objects, characters, character names, stories, dialogue, catch phrases, locations, concepts, artwork, animations, sounds, musical compositions, audio-visual effects, methods of operation, moral rights, any related documentation, "applets" incorporated into World of Warcraft, transcripts of the chat rooms, character profile information, recordings of games played on World of Warcraft, and the World of Warcraft client and server software) are owned by Blizzard Entertainment or its licensors.

pretty hazy; i may get in contact with someone.

 

[Horn]

Yeah, so they own the stuff they made - so what?

 

[DeadDogNoGoWoof]

intellectual property rights

its completely THEIRS. they can take action against those who steal their work.

 

[VGsatomi]

If that the case then we need to take down all the edited wc3 models, too. Is that what you all really want?
-VGsatomi

 

[DeadDogNoGoWoof]

they encourage WC3 modding, as long as it is for WC3. that is why they established the editor to come along with WC3 in the first place, and also why there is an entire section of their bnet site devoted to it. but with WoW, it is different.

 

[VGsatomi]

We are not modding WoW. Are are still only modding wc3.

 

[DeadDogNoGoWoof]

sorry, i phrased that wrong.

i mean that we are taking their models from wc3 for the purpose of modding wc3. blizzard likes that and encourages it.

since we aren't modding WoW, blizzard definately wouldnt encourage it. we are just stealing their models, which is apparently illegal.

 

[Daelin]

That is silly. It's quite the same thing. Take their models to use them into their own game. WOW, big difference!

Anyway, if you come to the decision to remove WoW icons, please remove the World of Warcraft cattegory from icons Veggie. Thank you!

~Daelin

 

[N00byStance]

So I have to download them all before they get deleted? :roll:

 

[Horn]

intellectual property rights

Its completely THEIRS. they can take action against those who steal their work.

Why do people quote things and then garble some nonsene message unrelated to its definition?

STEAL? We are using THEIR models to use in maps and mods that, if you read the World Editor agreement, becomes THEIR property.

As for IP, we are using Warcraft concepts, putting them into a Warcraft environment - that does not damage their IP at all.

 

[Blade.dk2]

Something funny:

because i dont want face the consequences when kiddies upload copyrighted music.
People will upload things like Nickelback, Robbie Williams e.t.c which is illegal -> so no thanks

This is Darky's view on copyrighted music, which is illegal, I think his view on copyrighted WoW models would be the same, and in fact the rules say that discussing illegal stuff isn't allowed.

Did the wc3sear.ch staff ask Darky about this at all?

 

[Horn]

Something funny:

because i dont want face the consequences when kiddies upload copyrighted music.
People will upload things like Nickelback, Robbie Williams e.t.c which is illegal -> so no thanks

This is Darky's view on copyrighted music, which is illegal, I think his view on copyrighted WoW models would be the same, and in fact the rules say that discussing illegal stuff isn't allowed.

Did the wc3sear.ch staff ask Darky about this at all?

He cares so much that he didn't post.

Warcraft 3 is copyrighted, which includes all its contents.

3. Responsibilities of End User.
A. Subject to the Grant of License herein above, you may not, in whole or in part, copy, photocopy, reproduce, sublicense, translate, reverse engineer, derive source code, modify, disassemble, decompile, create a source code equivalent, create derivative works based on the Program, or remove any proprietary notices or labels on the Program, or allow others to do so, without the prior consent, in writing, of the Licensor.

So, why does this site host warcraft 3 models and textures when that is illegal?

 

[VGsatomi]

So, why does this site host warcraft 3 models and textures when that is illegal?

Thats what I've been trying to say. I guess people really want us to delete every blizz originated item here...
-VGsatomi

 

[ragingspeedhorn]

I couldent care less if this site has any eligal WoW models, icons or not.

Also I really dont see why using WoW models would hurt blizzard in any way or their income on WoW? People playing WoW aint gonna quit WoW just because the models are used in some Warcraft 3 map. :roll:

 

[Horn]

I couldent care less if this site has any eligal WoW models, icons or not.

Also I really dont see why using WoW models would hurt blizzard in any way or their income on WoW? People playing WoW aint gonna quit WoW just because the models are used in some Warcraft 3 map. :roll:

That really does not matter - what you *think* is not what we're bothered about.

 

[Cookie]

IMO:

Good porting (optimising, removing unneeded anims, making texture fit more to the engine, etc..)= fine

bad porting (just downright converting x to y
) = meh

As long as there is no official word yet from Blizzard regarding this issue specifically, it should be tolerated (for now).

Though one thing should be asked, is it practical for most of the maps in progres out here?...

 

[Horn]

I did port a lot of useful and smaller models - such as the beasts, pets, etc. They are ideal for maps.

The rest, obviously, are only useful (if at all) for mods/campaigns.

I have begun editing the dragon

 

[VGsatomi]

Well, given the fact they received quite a number of downloads during their time up, people obviously found them useful. Whether they put them in a map or not is another thing. Among the maps in our archive, there is suprisingly few that actually use the imports posted here or anywhere else...I guess traditional is still the way to go.
-VGsatomi