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Warcraft IV: Red Horizons

Submitted by radeonmaster
This bundle is marked as substandard. It may contain bugs, not perform optimally or otherwise be in violation of the submission rules.
Disclaimer: Yes, the map size is enormous. However, this map is really more of a "mod" and is designed to be played through a modified MPQ file. Since that can't be uploaded, I've uploaded a "source" map.

This map attempts to answer the question: What if Blizzard develops Warcraft 4 to be a more traditional RTS?

The result is fast-paced gameplay with heroes taking a less important role and brute force being emphasized over magic. A fully functional navy has been implemented and the custom effects and models have maintained Blizzard-like quality. Also, units feel more deadly and less cartoonish/feminine, as many models have been replaced with more badass counterparts.

Two new gameplay systems have been added: one for the Undead and Orcs and one for the Humans and Night Elves. These new units and abilities are accessed through the worker units' advanced build button, or in the case of the Night Elves, by training a Blood Elf engineer

The Undead and Orcs have an offensive approach. They can build a “Demon Alter” functionally similar to a “superweapon” factory from CnC. Upon storing enough mana, the altar can deploy a variety of powerful spells at any point on the map. Units and heroes can be sacrificed to increase the mana. In contrast, the Humans and Night Elves have a defensive approach. They can build walls and grow a defensive barrier of trees and deploy other special units.

The terrain in this version is not polished. If you'd like to terrain it, send me a PM and I'll send you an unprotected version.

Version 1.1:

- Added oil patches to the seas, which function as a time-based income system
- Added the Ancient Collosal to the Night Elves; a wisp can merge its spirit with a Mountain Giant to create the massive unit capable of hurling boulders long distances
- With their Well of Wonder, the Night Elves can grow trees to create a defensive barrier anywhere within a large radius (They can no longer build walls)
- Orcs can build War Stations, mobile units that can repair machines and train Grunts, Raiders, and Axemen
- Humans can upgrade their walls to allow Archers to garrison and fire from them
- Mercenary naval units: Pirate ships that plunder from enemy units each attack, Gnomish repair vessels, a kamikaze Orc rowboat
- If a Hero kills the Dragon King, he reaches max experience
- Killing the Dragon King drops the lucrative "Dragon Gold" item, it's worth 10,000 gold

Version 1:

- Added high-resolution terrain textures for the Lordaeron tileset
- Decreased wait time for Prince

Version .9:

- Orcs and Humans have a "super unit." If the Orcs build 25 ogres, they acquire the Ogre Master, a powerful hero with unique spells.
- If the Humans build enough defensive structures, they acquire the Royal Family. First come the King who can create Vassal states, knight Royal Captains, and marry a Queen. When the Queen appears, the prince will also soon appear. The prince is himself a hero, but can choose to murder his father (you just have him attack your King) to become even more powerful.
- Vassals generate an income stream
- The "Knight" ability when applied to Royal Captains summons a horse, allowing the unit to become a Royal Crusader
- The Humans now have the "Enforce Prayer" ability at the Church. Activating it will allow a chance that an Angel appear in 5 minutes to provide extra defense to your forces
- The Dragon King now has a knock-back ability
- To make directing large armies even easier, every unit has a "Command Comrades" ability. Clicking anywhere on the map will order all units of its type to attack-move the target location

Version .8:
- Orcs, Humans, and Undead workers have an "advanced build" button; Night Elves can train Blood Elf engineers; you no longer have to purchase builder units as mercenaries
- Human footmen are promoted to Royal Captains once they accumulate 5 kills
- Night Elves can build a Blood Elf Observatory, which can reveal the entire map for 10 seconds
- To ease micromanagement of large armies, heroes have a "command coordinates" ability that allows them to order all of your military units to attack-move any point on the map.
- Races are now balanced

Other major features:
- Food limit is now 200
- Units' attack strength has been doubled

Minor features:
- Humans can upgrade Knights to Paladins. Paladins have a 25% chance of surviving the death of their horse to continue the battle as a foot soldier.
- Orcs can increase the armor of Ogres further with a special upgrade that equips them with shields
- Siege weapons have a badass explosion impact
- Abominations have been replaced by Hell Riders who can set building on fire with their raze ability
- Human archers have a flaming arrow ability that sets units on fire
- Siege towers can be garrisoned, and when garrisoned by archers can attack
- Kodo Beast Tower can be garrisoned by Troll Beserkers
- Undead can build the Lindormr Dragon, which can take off and land, functioning as both a land and air unit
- Dwarven Cannon team can lay mines
- When heroes die, they drop "spoils," an item recoverable by both enemy or friendly heroes which gives the owner 250 gold
- an independent population limit for ships, just like in Age of Empires 3, which avoids problematic trade-offs between land and sea units
- Many more unique units and abilities!


NOTE: This map is designed to be played LAN with a friend, since the AI will not take advantage of many of the features.

UPDATE: Fixed some of the tool tip errors and balanced creeps.

Thank you to the many talented artists who have submitted their work to this website's resource section. Your work is very high quality and I am indebted to many of you.

forelmashi (for the map template), HFR, Balnnazar, Beepo, Callahan, Blade.dk, Blizzard Entertainment, Cookie, Darky27, Dmitry Rommel, Elven Spellmake, General Frank, Ghan_04, olofmolem, Miseracor, General Frank,Hueter, Happy Tauren, FrIkY, Amigurumi, jatter2, Kitabatak, Tenebrae, Illidan(Evil)X, Hubcool, ahtiandr, IceFrog, maskedpoptart, Metzen, Moyack, Paladon, Pitzer Mike, PurplePoot, quaisio, richie_lich, Red XIII, Rising_Dusk, Strategy Master, The_Mechanic, Tiki, Tim., Vexorian, w3catlegio, Whitehornm, Tranquil, Olofmoleman, Mechanical Man, wingednosering, Kallimachos


Keywords:
Warcraft 4, Warcraft 2, traditional rts, starcraft, red alert, diablo
Contents

Warcraft IV: Red Horizons (Map)

Reviews
Moderator
18:54, 11th Aug 2010 ap0calypse: Rejected
  1. supertoinkz

    supertoinkz

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  2. WhiteTrashBoy

    WhiteTrashBoy

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    any screenies now?
     
  3. Moon Lord Hawkeye

    Moon Lord Hawkeye

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    No please god no.

    I've played this map, and i see some glaring problems here.

    For one, i played as orcs, and i can honestly say that you nerfed the damage, not raised it, for the grunts. I'd also like to point out, the the berserker upgrade is potentially useless if you want your army to look cooler, as you just use a normal creep troll model for both.

    your heros, i wanna kill them. You changed the name, but not the spells. Come on, thrall with a Troll... whatever's spells, and a warlord with a far seers spells? No, set it straight.

    I'd also like to inform you, that waaaaay too many of your tooltips are screwed, specifically the naval units.

    Once more, a huge problem. Your dummy unit for Meteor is built wrong. A frog, that can be attacked, that just appears? Give the damned thing Locust.


    [+] Fairly Good Idea
    [-] Units are bad, and too many models are used for normal units
    [-] bad terrain
    [-] BAD HEROES
    [-] Bad dummy unit
    [-] What the hell is up with Doom affecting ONLY HEROES?

    All in all, this map is a waste of space on my system, and until you can fix these glaring disrespects to your beloved "Traditional RTS's"...

    No, just no.
     
  4. radeonmaster

    radeonmaster

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    Moon Lord Hawkeye:

    Your criticism about the heroes is valid - I agree that the spells don't fit the types of heroes. Also, you're right about the tool tip errors.

    However. . .

    By Blizzard's design, which I left unchanged, Doom can only affect heroes.

    I swapped the models for many units to return the game to a Warcraft 2-feel. As a matter of taste, I preferred troll axe throwers and ogres to spear throwers and tauren.

    I'm not sure what you mean about the units being "bad." Unbalanced? If you find any other areas for improvement, i'd be happy to know.
     
  5. Erader

    Erader

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    WTF!? Doom can only effect non-hero units and after their death they turn into a Doom guard!!
     
  6. WhiteTrashBoy

    WhiteTrashBoy

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    omg this map is AWESOME!
     
  7. Loyal2NES

    Loyal2NES

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    This was going to be a civil critique, but now it's just a shit-list.

    Having tried a previous version, and being quite unimpressed by it, I thought to give it another go when I saw the map layout was redone from the ground up. I'd hoped you'd learned something of decent game design in the many months since I last tried it, but apparantly not.

    First, the general things:
    • Some things are really out of place. You say you're trying to give it a more "WC2 feel", and you've replaced certain units to that effect, but why is the TC still here, for instance? And then there are the creep camps. This is a Lordaeron Summer tileset, why on earth do you have Unbroken, Tuskarrs, Dragonspawn, and Thunder Lizards here?
    • As with the last version, units are priced far too high for the nerfing you've given them. Gathering rates and overall resource availability are the same, so there's absolutely no reason why units that have lost 3/4 of their health should still cost the same amount. Units in an RTS should follow one of the following themes:

      1) Weak, expendable, but cheap. Typically best used in large numbers. Games that follow this pattern (Age of Empires, Starcraft) usually emphasize map and resource control.

      2) Strong and precious, and expensive. Used for ambushes and the like. Games that follow this pattern (such as WC3) emphasize unit micromanagement, keeping as many troops alive as possible while whittling down the enemy.

      What you get, when you make units expensive but weak, is an unfortunate and unplayable mess where the first player to gain an edge in momentum wins, because the losing player will be unable to replace his units before they too are eradicated.
    • Ships aren't very well done here. There are no strategic resources on the seas besides a single gold mine (which some races can reach with or without ships), and any important land-based assets are too far inland to be affected by the naval units. All that remains is the accessway -- controlling the seas means you can bypass the three (!) creep camps guarding the land route.
    • Lose the custom models. I don't know what you're trying to make it 'feel' like with them, but 'hardcore' or 'badass' ain't it. The gameplay, along with the legion of other issues outlined above, makes the whole thing feel remarkably amateur and the models are not going to help that.
    • With units having so few hitpoints, adding to their armor really doesn't do much to make them live longer. If you changed the armor upgrades to add to the units hitpoints instead it might help.

    And for some specific things:
    • Orcs
      • Goblin sappers are overpowered, possibly even worse than when they could lay infinite land mines. A single one getting into the thick of an enemy formation can kill entire armies. Or at least turn a creep camp into an instant rout.
      • The healing salve was merely useful to the Orcs in vanilla WC3. Now, with grunts having 150 HP and the salve STILL healing 400 HP, it's insane.
      • Zeppelins in the shop, first tier, no prerequisites. What were you thinking?
    • Humans
      • I can understand changing the model for the magic building, but why change the shop model?
      • Much like with the Healing Salve, keeping the healing factor of the Regen Scroll was a bad idea.
      • There's absolutely no reason to build footmen, at all, ever. Especially now that T1 range has no prerequisites and has 1.5x as many hitpoints as footmen.
      • Human towers appear to be almost entirely the same as their vanilla counterparts. They were powerful then, they're moreso now.
    • Undead
      • For some inadequately-explored reason, the Tomb of Relics counts as a town hall and can't be built near a gold mine
      • Why did you make the Lichdemented warrior melee? He's still a caster!
      • 15 hitpoint skeletons, with 4-5 damage. Yeah, I can do a lot with those. Like watch them die.
      • Dark Ritual, and to a lesser extent Death Pact, are largely useless now because of how many hitpoints undead units don't have.
      • Crypt Fiends/Archers were already dangerous because of how much damage they could do at once with enough of them. Now, their damage remains the same, and so because of the lowered hitpoints you can achieve the same effect with about half as many archers firing. Also, they have 30 more hitpoints than grunts and are infinitely more useful. What's up with that?
      • If you don't want Undead buildings to require blight for placement, that's fine. But the Undead still don't regenerate unless they're standing on blight, so. Yeah.
      • All these problems and I haven't even gotten past first tier, what the hell. I think I'm done with this race.
    • Night Elf
      • Is there a particular reason why you've removed the mobility of night elf buildings?
      • Hippogryph riders are kinda overpowered. Just about the only thing they can't comfortably take is airborne anti-air (gargoyles and such), and towers. And I'm not so sure about the former.
      • Consider reducing the coefficient on the moon well's healing, or reducing its maximum mana and/or recharge rate. They hardly have to expend any juice at all to heal an entire control group to full.
    • Other
      • There's no reason for the shipbuilders to be located at mercenary camps. Having them built at a sufficiently-tiered town hall (or another derivative structure that you, the player, have built) is good enough, and also allows you to have one unique shipbuilder per race. Again, no reason to do otherwise.
      • The thought that not one, but TWO red creep camps are close enough to be guarding the same gold mine is an oversight that should never have been missed.
      • Creep camps are still too strong. The weakest creep has nearly as many hitpoints as a grunt, while doing more damage. Higher level creep camps can decimate your troops in an instant with their AOE spells or splash damage.
      • Melee units in general are mostly useless because they will typically die before they can get more than two hits in, if that.
      • If you have an air unit spotting for you, the trebuchet can fire straight across the river into the secondary goldmine on the other side.

    In conclusion, this map is nothing resembling balanced or fun, and I strongly suggest, I implore you, to go back, do a lot of playtesting, maybe break out Excel and get some spreadsheets going so you can compare numbers on each race. Whatever you were trying to do with this map, you've got a long way to go.
     
  8. radeonmaster

    radeonmaster

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    Dear Loyal2NES,

    Thank you for your passionate review of my map. Disregarding your immature tone (your post reeks of a strange mix of anger and despair, like a fat toddler who discovers he can no longer keep up with his friends on the playground), you definitely found some weak points and some clear mistakes.

    You implore me? Yes, honorable warrior of the internet forum! I accept your noble mission! I will balance my custom Warcraft 3 map!
     
  9. Moon Lord Hawkeye

    Moon Lord Hawkeye

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    Hrm, i must admit, that at the time i wrote my review for this map, i was tired, irritated at having space taken up by a game that really feels unfinished, and i did not go as in depth as Loyal2NES... I digress, that my post, wasn't so much a review, as.... bad.

    However, in light of that, L2N actually has a more mature, better post then what i had, and i cannot help but wonder what part of his, nearly all encompasing review, could have an immature tone.

    What he posted is a proper review, and no offence if there's some sort of sarcasm i'm not picking up over the internet, there's only one truely immature post here, and to me, it seems like the one above me...

    I am done, and as i said before, sorry if i'm not picking something up.


    On that bright note, i like the concept, it's just that the execution is a little... missing, and execution is everything. I await eagerly for a balanced out version, and a version where the creep camps are proper, and your heroes have either custom skills, or skills more suited to their models and names.


    Balancing is a huge issue, and i can understand the trolls in the orc race, i just suggest that you give them a new model file for the berserker upgrade, instead on just a unit with the same model, and an added ability... makes it seem like a ripoff.

    Sea units... well, they're pretty much useless. There's a goblin labratory that can be used to ferry your units to the gold mine, and if you were to instead add an attack, perhaps based off of Pheonix Fire, that would allow the zeppelin's to attack, it would be much more useful than the ships. I will admit, however, that they are usefull chokepointers in the land pass between bases.

    Heroes... well, i suggest getting rid off some of the custom models, or at least finding something that suits them better, perhaps the warlord could have..... i got nothing :p

    I will admit, that i only played as orcs, and i have no idea what issues other races may have, but right at this moment, i do not wish to find out.

    -Hawkeye
     
  10. The_Phalanx

    The_Phalanx

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    Moon, for someone called Hawkeye, you're not that perceptive. Loyal has a good deal of flaming in his post, however, I agree with his points.
     
  11. radeonmaster

    radeonmaster

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    Yes, yes, I probably should have posted it in the map development forums first to weed out many of the problems discussed in this thread.

    If anyone is interested, we could turn this into a collaborative project. Just PM me. I'm not interested in getting credit. I just want to convert Warcraft III into a fun, fast-paced, balanced RTS, so I have something to play until I use my old-age pension to buy the real Warcraft IV.
     
  12. Moon Lord Hawkeye

    Moon Lord Hawkeye

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    Har, yes yes call me unperceptive... however, some of the flame... i dunno, most of the time, the forums i'm on, that can be normal.

    I'd be interested in helping with this, as i can definatly see this being a really good map, that and i need something to work on...


    Dang, feel wierd to be called moon..... *shudder*
     
  13. radeonmaster

    radeonmaster

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    Great. I think we have a nice foundation to work from.

    The goal, or the overarching vision you might say, is to use Blizzard's game as a base from which to add our own ideas to make the game faster-paced and a little more grown-up, like a more traditional RTS. While I enjoy Warcraft 3's style of gameplay, I was initially dissapointed with the direction Blizzard took. I think it'd be cool if we could make this map the realization of what could have been if Blizzard continued the direction it took with Warcraft 2.
     
  14. mouseman89

    mouseman89

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    the games a good idea... though i see something wierd... everytime a hell rider dies he uses the abomanations death animation it looked really wierd cause he turned into an abomanation that exploded might wanna change that. :grin:
     
  15. Mike_Morhaime

    Mike_Morhaime

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    Overall, an enjoyable map. Not sure if it is any better than the original game, but it does present some new features and a slightly different gameplay style.

    Pros:
    The Offense vs. Defense feature that the engineers and craftsman present.
    Cool new abilities (the meteor, zeal, trebuchets, walls, fire arrows for archers)
    More units=cooler battles

    Cons:
    Doubt that it is balanced
    Many small polish issues (tooltips,frog from meteor, greened-out icons)
    Overpowered creeps
     
  16. adrianwho

    adrianwho

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    um... can you please look at the pics you got and why it is all greeny and defferent to the map that you give us to download? and how do you build walls????????? i dont get this map on the pics its way much defferent... is it an upcoming one??????
     
  17. radeonmaster

    radeonmaster

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    Those are screenshots from an earlier version. . . I've imported all of the modded content into a different map.

    You build walls with the Blood Elf engineer, purchased from a mercenary camp. I've triggered it so idle engineers will auto finish walls after the foundation has been placed. I'll upload an updated version soon.
     
  18. HD888

    HD888

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    this is the best melee map ever!!!! 5/5 not anymore! wheres the cool lindorm dragon and stuff
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2010
  19. radeonmaster

    radeonmaster

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    I took the dragon out to make the file size smaller. But I'm thinking of putting it back in, since the map size doesn't really matter - it's never going to be played on Bnet anyway.

    A lot of the cool stuff can be accessed with the special builder units (i.e. blood elf engineer or horde craftsman). you buy these at a mercenary camp. if you're playing as undead, make sure you research the horde treaty at your town hall. then you can build the horde laboratory and demon altar.
     
  20. Delpiroth

    Delpiroth

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    I tried the map, and I really liked it. Here are my thoughts:

    +Good Things+

    I absolutely adored the fact, that you can make full scale assaults without having to send groups one by one. I wish that was in the real War3 :thumbs_up:

    I also liked the new units and spells. Gives much more variety. :thumbs_up:

    The damage change was also good, I didn't have to wait all that long for my troops to destroy a small village. :thumbs_up:

    I know I forgot something, but lets leave it at that..

    -Bad Things-

    The hero Warlord (I dont know if I got the name right.. the new orc hero) was pretty much useless himself in battle, because he has like 50% lower hp than the grunt, I would usually keep him standing out of battle, summoning those creatures. :thumbs_down:

    The spoils of war were not all that useful. :thumbs_down:

    The AI builds like three to four rows of towers around their gold mine, and they do not attack as far as i've seen. :thumbs_down:

    Overall

    As I said before, I really liked it, I had alot of fun and it kept me entertained for quite a while. I was just kinda picky with the bad things, but still you could fix some of that. 4.5/5