Hi
@Granite_Golem @mafe @Mr.Henci
Your map drew my attention due to
@mafe's Top5 suggestions for new community maps in the W3C discord server
based on this thread. Of all maps mentioned, I think this is the map with the most potential of being introduced to tournament mappools because it is insanely well designed and very fresh. The idea of axial instead of point symmetry is the one thing that I think is totally underexplored in mapmaking, because it opens alot new design space while still fullfilling all the formal requirements for competitive balance (i.e. even distibution and equal access to resources). Therefore, I am quite delighted to see a map like Senjins Hideout which comes with all those features and fresh ideas. The map is playable and refreshing as it is right now (5 stars from me). Nonetheless, I would like to comment on a few things which I fear might make this map unpopular/unbalanced in competitive play but could easily be improved (sorted by decreasing importance). We have to keep in mind that custom maps are viewed critically by a major part of the competitive scene and therefore need to be absolutely perfect to stand a chance of replacing a map that the playerbase is familiar with.
1. Ramps
Ramps and cliffs are an attractive tool for mapmakers due to their powerful characteristics regarding paths and adding flavor the the environment. Though, they are a dangerous addition for any map due to their strategical implications on competitive play. Because the player on the upper side of the ramp has vision advantage and the player on the lower side has +25% miss chance on range attacks, ramps serve as a fortress for the player on the upper side which is basically impossible to break if you are not up by 15-20 supply or have a massive air army, which is both highly unlikely in high level 1v1. This has two consequences:
- ramps must be clearly identifiable for the players so that the strategical (dis)advantages can be calculated and don't come as a surprise
- ramps should be used very sparsely and carefully.
If we take a look at other competitive maps, most of them have exactly zero ramps included (AZ, EI, TM, TS, NI), leaving us with two ramps on CH and four ramps on LR:
- LR utilizes two ramps to separate Labs from the main bases and two ramps for the red spot expansions. All of those ramps are clearly identifiable, only accessible from one side and not essential for the flow of the game because the player on the lower side can just take other objectives instead like attacking the main base of the player camping upside a ramp.
- CH is more critical with the red spot expansion in the middle of the map being located upside a ramp on a strategically very important location. These ramps are harder to play around and also not perfectly identifiable ingame because their edges are covered by trees.
Now lets take a look at Senjins Hideout. You have introduced as many as 7(!) ramps (red lines in the picture below). More than all other competitive maps combined. Also, the ramps are not limited to certain areas of the map that the attacking player can avoid in order to go for another objective like in CH/LR. Especially around the main bases, this introduces a big imbalance in competitive play because good players can use the ramps as fortresses, resulting in a too huge disadvantage for the attacking player and thereby making the game very stale. Keep in mind that the attacking player already has some natural disadvantages in Wc3: no towers/burrows/moonewells/..., no shop where you can buy potions and a longer distance for reinforcements to join the fight. Introducing another significant disadvantage for the attacking player like having to fight from the lower side of a ramp is probably just too much.
My recommendation would be to lower the cliff level around the main bases by one and therby removing six of the ramps. If you think that ramps are essential to the flavor of this map, I would propose the areas marked in blue (picture below) as alternative ramp locations.
Furthermore, the ramps on Senjins Hideout are hard to detect (picture below), making it inconvenient for players to identify areas of impeded vision (and +25% miss chance). This is a big no-no for competitive play and would probably make this map an instant-veto for many ladder players.
2. Map size
With 104x104, Senjins Hideout is on the large side of competitive 1v1 maps. This is not necessarely a bad thing, but tournament organizers tend to only include a few large maps and those slots are occupied by some of the most popular and best designed maps (NI, TM) while some of the smaller maps are on the weaker side and crave to get replaced (TS, CH, AZ).
Concerning Senjins Hideout, I think the map size is fine as it is but it would not lose any of its flavor by being reduced to ~90x90. This could be achieved by:
- moving everything including the starting positions slightly towards the top right corner (which also helps making the top right corner less "boring")
- reducing the dead space next to the natural expansions
- removing one of the four lvl 4-5 green creep spots around the main bases (having more than 3-4 green creepcamps per player doesn't really fulfill any tactical purpose other than decorating empty space)
- moving the island expansion out of the corner and maybe even connecting it to the land mass
- reducing the map size towards the left and bottom edges.
3. Island expansion
Island expansions are probably as controversial as ramps in competitive maps. For us mapmakers who are generally not the strongest 1v1 players, it seems like a fun mechanic. In reality, it is boring at best and frustrating at worst because the player with the strongest anti-air (bats/gyros) can abuse this up to the extreme case of forcing a draw which is not intended to happen in Wc3 because it results in an endless game.
I see the point of an island expansion on this specific map because it cuts off the bottom left corner and therby reduces the playable area which is generally a good thing. But, as stated above, I think there are other possibilities of reducing the map size that should be considered before introducing an island expansion. Overall I think, an accessible red spot goldmine both in the bottom left and top right corner would be beneficial for the mid/lategame game flow on this map.
4. General comments:
- I really like the general theme of the map, combining Lordaeron Summer terrain with some Barrens rock spires/craters/geysirs. Perhaps, this theme could be explored even further by using dirt instead of grass cliffs and adding some fissures, cactuses, occasional Barrens trees etc.?
- IMO, it is generally a good idea to connect some of the dirt terrain spots so that they emerge as a pathway which is visible on the minimap and makes orientation much more intuitive for players because it gives an additional measure where on the map you are, i.e. 'left of certain road' instead of 'somewhere in the green' (see picture below).
- Introducing topography by the 'raise' brush is generally great but I would recommend to stay more flat around gold mines (especially main bases). Build orders easily get screwed by too much topography which is quite anti-fun (see picture below).
- Overall, this is map is the most refreshing custom map I have seen in ages and I really hope to see it being introduced in ladder and tournament mappools in the future.
Approved
I must say, ever since Thawing Snow I studied every aspect of boats in w3, every single "bug" that might come with them. That being said, here are my thoughts on the shipyard itself.
