Good&Evil

[Moderator]

10:04, 1st Mar 2016
Ardenian: Good&Evil offers a majorly cinematic RPG.
The player, or should I say viewer, gets into an exciting story and the presented personalities show unique character traits.
The player can see there is lifeblood in this project, Mathayis.

However, the file-size is not acceptable in relation to the presented content. The terrain, when filming from bird view, is majorly empty, besides a few trees. Close-up terrains are average. You could make much more with it
The gameplay does not offer much difference than a usual hack'n'slash and is not challenging or original.
It is unpleasent and confusing passive abilities have active icons.

As you tagged this map as RPG, players would expect more gameplay, more difference. Your focus lies clearly on the cinematic sequences and the dialogs and story. That's totally alright.
But I suggest you may think about making it a full cinematic map ?
I enjoyed the dialogs and couldn't wait what happens next.
The gameplay phases rather interrupt the story.

 

[WhiteFang]

The screenshots are broken you forgot the

 

[yogiman]

hi! nice Project, ive "played" about 30min so far but this game is more a cinematic than a game.. about 99% of this are cinematics.. maybe u make them skippable? or move it to cinematic category? or am i wrong?

 

[Arad MNK]

253mb is A LOT. But you must give credits

 

[WhiteFang]

253mb is A LOT. But you must give credits

Lol,didn't notice the size till you mention.Probably because size doesn't really matter to me

 

[Mathayis]

The screenshots are broken you forgot the

Oh hey hehe I know..I apologize for that, I haven't really figured out how to make the screen shots show up.

253mb is A LOT. But you must give credits

Oh I know haha...Sorry about it being such a large size!

Oh right! For sure I'll start my long quest of searching for the people that I need to give credits too ^__^

hi! nice Project, ive "played" about 30min so far but this game is more a cinematic than a game.. about 99% of this are cinematics.. maybe u make them skippable? or move it to cinematic category? or am i wrong?

Oh hey thank you so much!! Haha I know ^__^"...Yeah I think I should change it to the cinimatic category...
If it helps any, the first 6 or so hours in the game are a bit slow and boring...but eventually it will start to open up a little more..well, there still will be a lot of cinimatics ahead but the wont be as boring XD
Ah anyways, i hope you have fun!

 

[Arad MNK]

The Hidden tags have gone mad!

The Changelog is in the Terrain Screenshots, and real Terrain Screenshots aren't in a Hidden Tag!
And Remove unnecessary things like "xxxxxxxxxxx".

Fix them please

EDIT:
REVIEW SOON.

 

[WhiteFang]

-reserved

 

[Mathayis]

Hello there!, Er, I'm still kinda new to this site XD and I'm not sure how to properly comment, last time I tried I got a warning because I didn't..errr.. merge the comments I made or something? *not sure how to do that* Um so anyways, sorry if I'm commenting wrong again. *is a noob*

I was just wondering, It's been a few months I think, and I was just curious how to go abouts getting my map reviewed? Thanks ^___^ I'm starting a new project now, Good and Evil 2, Just lookin for some advice perhaps..

 

[N0t 4 No_Ob]

I tried out the game. Mostly cinematics. Once the cinematic mode is off, i was so glad. But to my horror, another cinematic. I only moved 3 steps or so...
Afterwards I get to control another character. Same thing, moved 3 steps and another cinematic. Then finally there was fighting.

 

[WhiteFang]

Hi!
Sorry that I forgot about the review,I will try and get to it tomorrow

 

[Mathayis]

Hey! no worries at all

Oh wow! Thank you so much!
Ugg.. i apologize, It's mostly cinimatics..soo It might be a bit boring.

 

[San_Melon]

"User who made this Presents" u should change this aswell
The map sounds interesting, Mb I´ll try this later

 

[Valenvai]

During a cinematic Zeramesh calls Volt "Greece Monkey". Racist jokes in maps are never funny. Please change that.

 

[Mathayis]

Waaa?? OMG Sorry!! that was actually a misspelled word! -___- I meant Grease !!

 

[Valenvai]

I played for about an hour and so far is pleasant.
If I'm not mistaken the map is heavily influenced by Final Fantasy styled games. The cinematics are many as you mentioned, focusing on the characters bonding which is again influenced by Final Fantasy styled games. Still, in my opinion you could take out some "minor" cinematics that don't give any direct naration to the story.
Also if you could avoid faces like 0____0 and ^____^ and " ... " and rather put character emotions in parenthesis. Replace with some emotes like " (let's out a deep breath) " etc.
I will give a better review when i finish it.

 

[Zordrak]

I will test it, i am already downloading.

 

[Mathayis]

Oh, hey thank you very much for the advice and the positive feedback !
Yeah hehe I was planning on cutting out a bunch of the useless cinimatics once I build up the energy to fix the map up again XD

Uggg the first 6 or so hours of the game are honestly the worst part -___- This was like a 6 year project..and back then I really sucked with story telling..and also i put a lot of the cinimatics waaay to close together XD
Thank you so much again for the feedback!! I apologize If the map gets boring

 

[Valenvai]

It's a really nice map. Would be a shame to not improve it.

 

[Zordrak]

I tested it and i honestly think that there are too many and too long dialogues and cinematics. The gameplay was too short between the cinematics and i couldn't really create and develop my heroes. I also had no item storage system. After a short time of playing the game is suddenly interrupted and one of these long and boring cinematics start. The starting cinematic also was a lot too long. You should also add a quest window with all necessary informations included. The terrain should also be improved: Some constructions and buildings are very nice and can even be entered but there are only a few of them in the whole big map. My map is also still quite empty but only because the levels aren't finished. In your map is very little decoration in some places. But some regions and villages are pretty beautiful and well done. I especially liked the landscrapes and forrests. The nature looks nice and realistic. But there are many places which are just too empty. You could also add more traps and surprises (but no cinematics!) and some more different enemy units. Altogether the gameplay could be more dynamic with only a few short interesting cinematics. I would give you now 4/5 points. I wish you good luck, Greetings, Zordrak

 

[Valenvai]

I encountered a bug:

spoiler

I freed James from prison AFTER I fought the Pit Keeper. I think the cinematics are in wrong order.

 

[Mathayis]

Oh really? 0___0 That's so wired! how did you do that? Lol!
I've tested this game several times and never had that happen to me..hmmm..

I'm looking through the triggers and everything seems to be okay 0__0

There is only one way to trigger that fight with the pit guard..and in order to get to him you walk right on the location that triggers that part where you I free James..

Arr sorry about that, i'm so confused as to why that happened ..

 

[SeedinAethyr]

Hi Mathayis. I just finished your map, Good&Evil. You obviously put a lot of time into your map, and seeing that you have had little serious feedback, I felt like I should give the map a play-through and let you know what I thought.
I'm putting it in a spoiler because it will, funnily enough, contain spoilers. This review will be for you.
I'll put in a summary at the bottom of the post for everyone else detailing my thoughts (without spoilers).

Spoiler-tastic Full Review

Let's first talk about your terrain.

It was very good. You have an absolutely huge map, but that didn't deter you from putting a ton of effort into your terrains. You use imports liberally in order to make your terrain more appealing, and you use lots of doodads to make it more lively. You have good tile variation and changes in height. You used blizzard cliffs, but they're not ultra-prevalent about the map, which is good, and when they're used, they're used well. I especially liked your usage of walls and structures. Your structures and interiors were excellently made, considering how difficult it is to do that. The ship interior was one of my favorite parts. You also used weather effects well. However, my favorite part about your terrain was how it changed. I loved that. The Caves of Darkness changing was really cool, the changing terrain in flashbacks was awesome, the Water Temple illusion being broken was awesome, and the post-apocaylpse world was really, really awesome. It was really cool to see just how much the world changed because of the Destroyers. Doodads changed, tiles changed, the water color changed, the sky changed--it was really an excellent job! It really shows your dedication towards making an immersive and believable world. I do however have a couple qualms about your terrain. Firstly, you had some scaling issues. When you scale things up to be too large, sometimes they start to look stretched, which was a problem with some of the especially large rocks and floor tiles. Secondly, in Fort Falcon, there were some buildings that were units, not doodads. This was inconsistent with the rest of the map. Thirdly, some of the shops had tiled bases, which didn't make sense, given that they were people. Fourthly, there were some instances where I could walk through doodads because their collision models weren't perfect. Lastly, there was the "end of the world" feeling at the edges of the map because there was nothing covering the edges of the map. This is acceptable though, because I realize you have no room to fix this issue.
Also, I really liked your battle on the tornado area. It felt completely unnecessary, but it was really really awesome!
Finally, I LOVED your world map. It was so cool how you implemented that into the game, and it was extremely well done. The terraining of the world map was extremely well done, with excellent scaling, the right amount of doodads and tile variation, and clear locations. The addition of things like the Prison Ship and the Airship was really cool too. It was awesome to be able to board the Prison Ship to transfer between locations (I thought that it was such a cool thing to use it when I first got it, even though it was just a normal Warcraft III transport), and the Airship system was epic. You made a very good airship tutorial, and it explained the mechanics of the airship very well. It's rare to see something like that in a map. Your location transition mechanics were also very nicely done, with clear places to transition, camera shifts, music changes, and either one hero or the entire party being moved depending on whether a cinematic was activated. Excellent job.

I think this would be a good time to transition on to music.
Your soundtrack was great. You put a lot of time into finding appropriate songs to use, and you had a lot of songs. They were well worth the large filesizes, and your map was made so much better with a strong soundtrack. However, you must credit your songs (assuming you didn't compose it yourself). Not only do the composers of the songs deserve some credit, I myself would really like to know the songs that you used. There were some really nice ones in there.

Let's transition to your gameplay next. The monster spawning mechanics were well done, and you did a good job making sure that the player couldn't spawn a spawn too quickly after it was already spawned. The changing monster spawns (like in the Water Temple, the apocaylpse, and outside Ledamion) were also very well done. Your monsters themselves were also extremely varied and quite interesting. A good amount of them had abilities, they were quite balanced, they had interesting and varied stats, and most didn't have anti-fun mechanics like spell immunity or long stuns. (It's okay to have these things in small amounts, though.) The monsters gave acceptable bounties (except for the Chrono Controllers, those gave too little) and experience values, and it never felt like it took way too many monsters to get a single level. (Although I did do some grinding, it was somewhat fun grinding, since levels weren't so infrequent that I'd get one every five minutes.) Your bosses were also quite well made, and they had a very large variety of spells with a large variety of effects. These weren't all just normal Warcraft spells either--there were some triggered spells. The spells also had different sfx, so even if they were duplicate Warcraft abilities, they didn't quite feel like it. Bosses also weren't just balls of stats; you did a good job of giving them semi-unique abilities that were all impactful in their own ways. Your Monster arena bosses were quite notorious with this - I found myself needing to buy Bracers for my weaker heroes because they were taking too much damage from abilities. (That's not bad though.) The bosses also didn't spam abilities, which is a problem that maps from inexperienced mapmakers sometimes have. You also did a great job making your bosses difficult and fun to fight; the only boss that I felt was a real chore was the Cactuar King. His ridiculous evasion and damage led me to simply kiting him with spells and never letting him hit me, so I did that... for about ten minutes. It was terrible. I think you need to adjust his stats a bit to make him more manageable. Also, your Cactuar hunt was a pretty fun thing, and I enjoyed looking for all the Cactuars. I did like how you put in optional very difficult bosses though, and I liked how they gave really cool content. Alpha, Omega, and Tetra and the Monsters were all quite difficult and fun to fight, and gave fun, powerful rewards for the amount of grinding necessary to fight them and the amount of skill required to beat them.

While we're on the topic of rewards, let's talk about items. You did a really good job of making a ton of items for everyone to use, and your endgame items that gave abilities (and took them away when dropped!) were really well done. I'm glad you went with the design decision to give the player the ability instead of keeping it on the item, despite how much work it might have caused you in triggering. Your items are balanced for the most part, and there are strategic decisions to be made when choosing the equipment for a certain hero. One problem I find is that because all heroes benefit from Strength, there comes a certain benefit for everyone to get Warrior Gloves or some of Nole's axes. I feel like the effects of the other stats should be played up a bit more (or maybe the characters should grow less in those stats) if you want characters to invest in Agility or Intelligence. Also, some specific issues with items that I have: Scale Armor says that it increases Magic by 75, not Mana; Elixirs sell for Lumber, which they shouldn't (also, the resource Lumber should probably be changed to kills); and Elven Arrows (while on the ground) say that they increase stats by [data] and do not actually say what they increase stats by. (The data that you are referencing is not transferring over.) I liked your usage of shopkeepers; all the shops felt different to an extent, and they weren't ubiquitously placed around the map but were common enough so that one could sell or buy items without too much hassle. The shopkeepers all coming to Spinny's shop after the apocaylpse and changing their sales was also really cool. Two thematic issues I had with the shopkeepers were some not being hidden after certain events. The Mercenary Potion Vendor at Locke's camp after it was destroyed was one issue, and the sellers in Vector after it gets destroyed are another. (They could come back though after Vector is fixed.)

Also, before I get into my next points, I want to mention some specific issues I had with bosses. Firstly, in the Valcanus fight, his flame strikes are too small and intermittent, and are therefore too easy to dodge. Secondly, while he is on his throne, he moves around to try and attack the heroes, even though he can't. He shouldn't be able to move while he is on the throne. Secondly, in the Gaian fight, for whatever reason, after it ended, I kept getting messages that Gaian used Mirror. When I saw James and Fay through the stone, I also saw that Gaian was near them and not dead. I don't know why it was still alive after I beat it, but this is an issue. (A minor one though, since it was harmless and impossible to get to afterwards.)

Anyways, the next point: heroes.
You did a decent good job with them. They have a lot of interesting abilities (though they aren't special triggered ones for the most part), and none of the abilities feel useless. The Dig ability on Dart is especially cool; the resulting treasure hunt mechanic forces the player to always be mindful of his or her surroundings because there are many cool items to be found. The player has a lot of choice in selecting abilities for each hero. Most of the abilities also go up to level 20, so each hero's abilities can remain relevant throughout most of the game. There are a couple issues with tooltips though; some of the "Level [x]" texts are not colored yellow, like Shell or Water, and none of the abilities have highlighted hotkeys (and some, like Fay's Arrow, even have hotkeys on forbidden keys like A). The second point is very important to fix, the first not so much. Also, there are some grammatical errors in your descriptions, like Dart's Fan of Knives' description having a space before the first letter, which is not capitalized, and Fay's Arrow having "arrow" (in the description) capitalized with an exclamation point afterwards.

You may have noticed me avoiding one aspect of your map. Before I continue, I want you to know something.
Your map, considering everything else, is extremely good. Definitely worthy of at least a 3/5, possibly even 4/5. One half of my next point further strengthens this score.

That part is the mechanics of your cinematics. In a map so heavily laden with cinematics, it is important that your cinematics are high quality. You did not disappoint. You make strong use of filters which thoroughly enhance cinematics. The sound effects you use, both custom and native, enhance your cinematics. You use good music during your cinematics. You use multiple good camera angles and panning cameras. You use turning units. You use animations. You use special effects, like earthquake. I remember especially well the scene of the heroes yelling at Atma and Atma slowly turning around with some grinding sound and an earthquake effect and the scene where Leon is taken by the Dark Lord because of all the cool effects and sounds. This is all excellent. You are clearly a very skilled mapmaker.

However,

there is a big problem.
(I'm sorry for what I'm about to say.)

Your writing isn't good.
And for a map so heavily laden with cinematics, that's absolutely major. About 90% of the early game is cinematics, and it eventually evens out to maybe 50%. If your writing is bad, then players are going to need to tolerate 13.5 hours (half of the projected 27 hours) of bad writing to enjoy the great map. This isn't attract players to your map, ESPECIALLY considering how much of your early game is cinematics. You are going to put off so many players because of the amount of cinematics with poor writing in the early game. I was barely able to keep myself from quitting the map in the beginning because I could barely play the game and was forced to watch cinematic after cinematic after cinematic of poor writing. I just kept telling myself, "it's going to get better, I know it," and luckily for me, it did. However, you can't expect most of your players to be like that, and you need to work on your writing.
So, what about your writing is bad?
Your style, your characterization (sometimes), your maturity, and your spelling.
Your grammar is acceptable for the most part, but you often spell words wrong (such as "remember", or using "are" instead of "our", or using "there" instead of "their"), and this thoroughly detracts from your writing. You also often show an immaturity in your writing, such as when the characters make poor jokes or USE EMOTICONS. You DO NOT use emoticons in maps. Take the emoticons out of your map completely, and replace emotions with different colored text (say, light blue) and say something like "[Fay's eyes light up]" or "[Dart cringes]" . It will increase the quality of your writing fivefold, and I mean that literally. Your characterization is also sometimes off. While at times the characters are all very distinct, sometimes the characters' characters blur, and it becomes very clear that they're all being written by one person. You need to make your characters distinct, and smart. Nole is an example of a very well made character; he does not change much, and he sticks to the personality you gave him. Dart on the other hand, I felt was a train wreck. (I'm sorry.) He was thoroughly immature and acted quite stupidly at times, but at other times he acted extremely intelligently and maturely, and that doesn't make sense. He lacked a core character, and you need to change that.
(If you want me to rate your characters out of ten, I'd give Nole an eight (your strongest), Fay a seven (despite her rampant emoticon usage, thematically she has a very strong character), Kayla a five (inconsistent at times), James a five, Leon a four (more inconsistent than Kayla and James), and Dart a two.)
Finally, your style. While you get your points across, you don't do it very elegantly. You need to expand your vocabulary, and try using different kinds of sentence structure.
All of this serves to dramatically hurt your map because of its focus on cinematics. Because you chose to add in cinematics, you allowed your map to be graded on another criterion and because they are so prevalent, you allowed that criterion to have an extremely large effect on the quality of your map. This hurts you so much even though it shouldn't. Your plot (I haven't said anything about it, but I will now) is extremely well done, your gameplay is great, and your aesthetics are great. The only thing that is hurting you is your writing.
Now, when I was halfway through the map, I had a mind to give it two thumbs, and warn you that you were inches away from one thumb because of the quality of your writing. However, my last day playing the map convinced me otherwise. You did a really really nice job with the end-game gameplay, and the story was wonderfully wrapped up (despite it being a bit overly dramatic). I also loved how you allowed the player to keep playing after he or she finished. Your style also showed clear improvement over when the map started, although it still wasn't perfect. There were also markedly less cinematics than there were at the beginning, and the cinematics were more important. (Try removing or shortening some of the early cinematics.)
If you can improve your writing, I'll be happy to give your map four stars, for it's clear that you deserve it.
But for now, I'll give it three.

(Also, a few more comments I have that I don't feel like sticking into my review.
1. Fay's Rapid Fire is available every three levels, not every two. She also has terrible vision.
2. The characters could have killed Duran when they were stuck in the cage because they had ranged weapons. Say something about them being trapped behind a magical gate or something, or have their weapons taken away.
3. The Forest Temple didn't actually have any traps, contrary to what Fay said (besides monster spawns). There were only puzzles. I think there should be more traps, like step here and get impaled for 500 damage. (Stuff similar to the Fire Temple, but not obvious.)
4. The maze was really cool, but the camera could easily be righted with the mouse wheel, and accidently scrolling could cause the player to lose sight of the heroes because of the way the screen scrolls with the inverted camera. Lock the camera so that players don't have to deal with either issue.
5. Remember to hide control circles during cinematics.
6. Neville isn't invulnerable (the one where you get a chance to return to the airship right before the final area).
7. Remove the rat sound from anything that has a quest related ability that you gain control of. Also remove the tooltip. Also, if an ability can be cast more than once from a specific quest item, remove the ability after it is used once or don't allow the player to gain control of that thing anymore (for aesthetics' sake).

Good&Evil is a strongly story driven RPG with a lot of cinematics. The map is high-quality, but the writing is poor, especially in the beginning. If the player can manage to sit past the many early cinematics, the map eventually proves to be an extremely fun and rewarding experience, with tons of content to discover and a very interesting story (once the map gets going). I'd only recommend the map to players who have a lot of time on their hands, and who are extremely patient--the first couple hours will make many would be players quit.

 

[deepstrasz]

My game froze when trying to load the map before even starting it.

 

[Mathayis]

My game frozen when trying to load the map before even starting it.

Oh hey, the loading bar tends to freeze for quite a while at a certain point, but eventually it should start loading again

 

[deepstrasz]

Oh hey, the loading bar tends to freeze for quite a while at a certain point, but eventually it should start loading again

Must be the file size then, loading stuff. I'll try it again.

 

[Mathayis]

Must be the file size then, loading stuff. I'll try it again.

Oh yeah hehe, that must be it It always freezes for me too in the loading bar.
Er..To be honest, the game is quite boring in the beginning anyways..I'm actually working on redoing the first 5hrs of the game, sorry if it's a bit bland at the moment.

 

[deepstrasz]

Er..To be honest, the game is quite boring in the beginning anyways..I'm actually working on redoing the first 5hrs of the game, sorry if it's a bit bland at the moment.

OKs, I'll wait for the update then.

 

[deepstrasz]

A somewhat nice JRPG touch with quite a large grain of visual novel.

Spoiler: comments

1. The loading time is huge man (including the time it takes for you to be able to press the Start button). I've no idea of the reason but might you try to separate this map into more levels thus creating a campaign? I think that would help the loading time a lot. Or at least make a soft version too with least custom content. It must've been a pain testing this. Actually, object data is what causes the most the increment of loading time. There are 6 heroes with 4 spells each and some of them have 20 levels plus. If you could base spells on hero attributes or something, that would enable you to only use 1-3 levels for each spell.
2. The terrain sometimes looks fine, other times is just flat with no detail resembling a map (in an overview manner; is that intended? If yes, then at least write some letters on it to give a hint of locations).
3. You should avoid moving for 1-4 seconds before another cinematic scene starts. It's pointless.
4. Units are selected during cinematic mode (Volt).
5. First Aid's icon looks like a passive ability when it is active. You can use this program to turn it into active: Button Manager v1.8.2
6. Abilities should have detailed/proper description (even where you learn them) mentioning the values of damage or healing or whatever they do. Also mentioning the levels (max) each can grow to.
7. Dart's icon isn't fit; try finding one that does. He also does not have hero glow. You could add one to him: How to add Hero Glow without Modeling
8. Hotkeys for abilities? (Throwing Knife for example).
9. Are animals supposed to suddenly appear each time you get into their region?
10. Critical Strike's icon is that of an active ability.
11. Note that when abilities are learned (ability panel) they all have active icons. (that's how it is in the original game)
12. Zaremesh is really naive, even telling of where Kayla is being taken albeit losing the battle. Maybe, he didn't think Leon would have any chance getting there.
13. Not necessary to mention they are casting something you can't dodge anyway.
14. Why was Tom not helping them?
15. In the house, pathing blockers are needed; units get through walls.
16. Maybe Dart should have been an agility hero for diversity?
17. Problem is, creature regions are too close to each other and you might trigger them trying to get one hero out of combat and back again. You can even trigger the same zone, kind of forcing you to not move at all until every enemy is dead and your HP is up.
18. There should be another way to use potions because armours and weapons take most inventory space.
19. Dark Wind's selection circle position is broken.
20. Should increase selling range because the heroes move and try to get as close to the vendors as possible, sometimes getting through doodads to do so.
21. The better Leather armour is placed first and not second as the other items.
22. Well, there's a lot of farming involved until you get your gear.
23. Not sure if intended but you can have two weapons on.
24. Most of the times units are selected during cinematic mode.
25. Could you change the water colour in the sewer to make it look dirtier?
26. Merchants in the prison
27. Too much "..." (waster seconds).
28. James could use a hero glow.
29. Backpacks are needed. Too many potions are lost because of scarce inventory room plus when you also have to carry things like keys...
30. This is just silly. Why didn't he kill Volt?
31. Would be nice to move all heroes when entering/exiting regions since the camera moves to the first one entering/exiting.
32. Ice doesn't mention the duration of the slow.
33. Locke's Memento Stone=deus ex machina.
34. Really need to reduce item cooldown; example: Willow Staff.
35. Would be nice to change the colour of item icons depending on their level. You could use these programs for that:
Button Manager v1.8.2
BLP Lab v0.5.0
36. Maybe you can find an effect or use the water wave doodad (Icecrown tileset, I think) to make the boats look like they're moving.
37. Strange that no one decided to inhabit James' house.
38. Dead soldiers can be attacked
39. Is the Prison Ship supposed to get through bridges? (which means you can get the first ship to the capital).
40. Three healing heroes might be too much.
41. Zeek's portrait doesn't show when he's talking (transmissions) maybe because he isn't selected in the trigger.
42. Try using other barrel models for those which are invulnerable.
43. Forgot to mention that Kayla's animation(s) freeze after she lights the fire in Leon's flashback.
44. There's only one camera position when Fay talks to Dart after she finds him.
45. Piercing Arrows icon=Aim's; also passive icon for active ability.
46. Most times, the units are red coloured during transmission; might be a mistake of not choosing the brown player.
47. Fountain of Health that does not heal
48. Alright, so there's no Agility hero. Oh wait, there are only Strength heroes.
49. Dart told Fay he did not tell anyone else about his sudden awakening in the forest but he did tell Leon.
50. The second ship is also named prison ship.
51. Come on, their tower would be unguarded just like that for how important the crystal is? (I guess they were few and only relied on the beacons being off hiding the island?)
52. Sam can learn abilities which cost more mana than he has.
53. You might be able to destroy doodads and take items on the island which may affect the future.
54. Oh really? Theo did that to the great and powerful Zeramesh!?
55. Units selected during cinematic mode kind of everywhere.
56. Nah, it doesn't make sense for Theo to be able to get through all those guards. I thought maybe he had some Dark Lord power in him or something but nope.
57. Why limit the camera on the airship when it would be better to leave it as with the prison ship?
58. Would be nice to have some text in the quest log of what you're supposed to do in case you decide to play later.
59. Should set mana and hp to max/full before fights like challenges to avoid wasting gold on potions.
60. Dragon Bangle looks like that other ring item.
61. How did Sam know Kayla was in the cavern and that Dart was missing to appear as him to warn her? Why didn't he just use peaceful means to find Kayla at least at first and why didn't he go personally, since he was the only one who knew how she looked like?
62. Why didn't Sirus helped Kayla the first time?
63. The troll boss freezes after summoning the two lesser ones.
64. James can carry a bow along with his staff too...
65. You need both maze keys on one hero and you have to get into the region with them equipped. Can't open the gate if you equip them while in the region.
66. The twisted terrain+camera puzzle/maze can be exploited by moving the camera and clicking the place you want to go to then waiting for the hero to get there. I guess locked camera would make it harder.
67. No bodies/carcasses of any of the twenty? How were the monsters there revived if the first heroes reached the beacons?
68. Should have split the heroes one with healing and one without; Dart and Nole's trial is pretty awful with only temporary potions. Not to mention the creep fast respawn rate. And, those Satyrs reviving each other... and then the stupid keys which occupy inventory slots.
69. You can get through some doodads behind the eastern fire gate. Not only that, there are other places where you can get through as shortcuts. Check pathing. Press P to see it and add blockers where it is needed.
70. After Dart and Nole died, nothing happened, no defeat, no resurrect, nothing.
71. How did they survive the volcano's eruption? Why didn't Locke recognize Dart at all (if indeed that was Locke)?
72. Ice Path Blockers can be selected and some have numbers after their name(s). I suggest using the editor prefix for that in the object editor.
73. Some parts of terrain during dungeons are good others are flat and have one tile with less to no doodads.
74. You can destroy the icy gate near the switches to the north.
75. Camera does not reset after the scene where the fountain is changed.
76. The switch blocked by ice right to the left/west of the entrance to the last room can be reached by getting down into the water off the cliff (I guess there was an ice bridge there). Heroes should circumvent a bit to the south instead.
77. Interestingly Theo was also teleported although he wasn't touched by Alisha/the Magi's power like Sam and Kayla. What happened to Alisha and Galen?
78. How did Galen escape the magi prison?
79. Why send them back when the crystal was still deteriorated instead of sending them to stop Theo and/or Kain? If destiny should not be tempered with then what does it matter anyway at all?
80. Avoid camera clipping; you can see the water through the sand when the temple is shown and looked at by Dart and Kayla.
81. Well, wouldn't the crystal be able to bring back anyone back to the current time? If not alone, at least with Odin's help from the past.
82. As potions got up to a stack of 20, you could have made the ankh get up to at least 5.
83. Fay's Aim becomes quite useless after a while since her normal attack becomes stronger than the highest levels of that spell.
84. Should make the zone portal regions way gates; it's easier and not annoying to move heroes from a place to another.
85. Gold gathering gets quite slow on higher levels.
86. Shouldn't the engine have been fixed? It's still burning.
87. So yeah, you can carry as many weapons as you like.
88. Demon Wall's death animation is bad (absent); the model remains there and blocks vision.
89. How did Amadeus become stronger if he was not in possession of the crystal's powers?
90. The Airship doesn't follow you if you go by foot but you can still see it in Alixaide for instance
91. Sirus remained partially raising to the sky in the caves near the portal. You can attack him.
92. Illusions should be removed after Zeramesh's forest temple copy dies.
93. Nole's Axe Rage has the hotkey A...
94. Would be nice to have cinematic scene skip.
95. Well, reaching the three destroyers and them is a much harder challenge than Zeramesh and Amadeus.

Overall a neat experience however quite slowly progressed and monotonous at times.
I don't remember seeing any credits at all ingame: doodads, models, music etc. You could use Resources in Use by Good&Evil | HIVE to add them to your current thread description list.

 

[Mathayis]

A somewhat nice JRPG touch with quite a large grain of visual novel.

Spoiler: comments

1. The loading time is huge man (including the time it takes for you to be able to press the Start button). I've no idea of the reason but might you try to separate this map into more levels thus creating a campaign? I think that would help the loading time a lot. Or at least make a soft version too with least custom content. It must've been a pain testing this. Actually, object data is what causes the most the increment of loading time. There are 6 heroes with 4 spells each and some of them have 20 levels plus. If you could base spells on hero attributes or something, that would enable you to only use 1-3 levels for each spell.
2. The terrain sometimes looks fine, other times is just flat with no detail resembling a map (in an overview manner; is that intended? If yes, then at least write some letters on it to give a hint of locations).
3. You should avoid moving for 1-4 seconds before another cinematic scene starts. It's pointless.
4. Units are selected during cinematic mode (Volt).
5. First Aid's icon looks like a passive ability when it is active. You can use this program to turn it into active: Button Manager v1.8.2
6. Abilities should have detailed/proper description (even where you learn them) mentioning the values of damage or healing or whatever they do. Also mentioning the levels (max) each can grow to.
7. Dart's icon isn't fit; try finding one that does. He also does not have hero glow. You could add one to him: How to add Hero Glow without Modeling
8. Hotkeys for abilities? (Throwing Knife for example).
9. Are animals supposed to suddenly appear each time you get into their region?
10. Critical Strike's icon is that of an active ability.
11. Note that when abilities are learned (ability panel) they all have active icons. (that's how it is in the original game)
12. Zaremesh is really naive, even telling of where Kayla is being taken albeit losing the battle. Maybe, he didn't think Leon would have any chance getting there.
13. Not necessary to mention they are casting something you can't dodge anyway.
14. Why was Tom not helping them?
15. In the house, pathing blockers are needed; units get through walls.
16. Maybe Dart should have been an agility hero for diversity?
17. Problem is, creature regions are too close to each other and you might trigger them trying to get one hero out of combat and back again. You can even trigger the same zone, kind of forcing you to not move at all until every enemy is dead and your HP is up.
18. There should be another way to use potions because armours and weapons take most inventory space.
19. Dark Wind's selection circle position is broken.
20. Should increase selling range because the heroes move and try to get as close to the vendors as possible, sometimes getting through doodads to do so.
21. The better Leather armour is placed first and not second as the other items.
22. Well, there's a lot of farming involved until you get your gear.
23. Not sure if intended but you can have two weapons on.
24. Most of the times units are selected during cinematic mode.
25. Could you change the water colour in the sewer to make it look dirtier?
26. Merchants in the prison
27. Too much "..." (waster seconds).
28. James could use a hero glow.
29. Backpacks are needed. Too many potions are lost because of scarce inventory room plus when you also have to carry things like keys...
30. This is just silly. Why didn't he kill Volt?
31. Would be nice to move all heroes when entering/exiting regions since the camera moves to the first one entering/exiting.
32. Ice doesn't mention the duration of the slow.
33. Locke's Memento Stone=deus ex machina.
34. Really need to reduce item cooldown; example: Willow Staff.
35. Would be nice to change the colour of item icons depending on their level. You could use these programs for that:
Button Manager v1.8.2
BLP Lab v0.5.0
36. Maybe you can find an effect or use the water wave doodad (Icecrown tileset, I think) to make the boats look like they're moving.
37. Strange that no one decided to inhabit James' house.
38. Dead soldiers can be attacked
39. Is the Prison Ship supposed to get through bridges? (which means you can get the first ship to the capital).
40. Three healing heroes might be too much.
41. Zeek's portrait doesn't show when he's talking (transmissions) maybe because he isn't selected in the trigger.
42. Try using other barrel models for those which are invulnerable.
43. Forgot to mention that Kayla's animation(s) freeze after she lights the fire in Leon's flashback.
44. There's only one camera position when Fay talks to Dart after she finds him.
45. Piercing Arrows icon=Aim's; also passive icon for active ability.
46. Most times, the units are red coloured during transmission; might be a mistake of not choosing the brown player.
47. Fountain of Health that does not heal
48. Alright, so there's no Agility hero. Oh wait, there are only Strength heroes.
49. Dart told Fay he did not tell anyone else about his sudden awakening in the forest but he did tell Leon.
50. The second ship is also named prison ship.
51. Come on, their tower would be unguarded just like that for how important the crystal is? (I guess they were few and only relied on the beacons being off hiding the island?)
52. Sam can learn abilities which cost more mana than he has.
53. You might be able to destroy doodads and take items on the island which may affect the future.
54. Oh really? Theo did that to the great and powerful Zeramesh!?
55. Units selected during cinematic mode kind of everywhere.
56. Nah, it doesn't make sense for Theo to be able to get through all those guards. I thought maybe he had some Dark Lord power in him or something but nope.
57. Why limit the camera on the airship when it would be better to leave it as with the prison ship?
58. Would be nice to have some text in the quest log of what you're supposed to do in case you decide to play later.
59. Should set mana and hp to max/full before fights like challenges to avoid wasting gold on potions.
60. Dragon Bangle looks like that other ring item.
61. How did Sam know Kayla was in the cavern and that Dart was missing to appear as him to warn her? Why didn't he just use peaceful means to find Kayla at least at first and why didn't he go personally, since he was the only one who knew how she looked like?
62. Why didn't Sirus helped Kayla the first time?
63. The troll boss freezes after summoning the two lesser ones.
64. James can carry a bow along with his staff too...
65. You need both maze keys on one hero and you have to get into the region with them equipped. Can't open the gate if you equip them while in the region.
66. The twisted terrain+camera puzzle/maze can be exploited by moving the camera and clicking the place you want to go to then waiting for the hero to get there. I guess locked camera would make it harder.
67. No bodies/carcasses of any of the twenty? How were the monsters there revived if the first heroes reached the beacons?
68. Should have split the heroes one with healing and one without; Dart and Nole's trial is pretty awful with only temporary potions. Not to mention the creep fast respawn rate. And, those Satyrs reviving each other... and then the stupid keys which occupy inventory slots.
69. You can get through some doodads behind the eastern fire gate. Not only that, there are other places where you can get through as shortcuts. Check pathing. Press P to see it and add blockers where it is needed.
70. After Dart and Nole died, nothing happened, no defeat, no resurrect, nothing.
71. How did they survive the volcano's eruption? Why didn't Locke recognize Dart at all (if indeed that was Locke)?
72. Ice Path Blockers can be selected and some have numbers after their name(s). I suggest using the editor prefix for that in the object editor.
73. Some parts of terrain during dungeons are good others are flat and have one tile with less to no doodads.
74. You can destroy the icy gate near the switches to the north.
75. Camera does not reset after the scene where the fountain is changed.
76. The switch blocked by ice right to the left/west of the entrance to the last room can be reached by getting down into the water off the cliff (I guess there was an ice bridge there). Heroes should circumvent a bit to the south instead.
77. Interestingly Theo was also teleported although he wasn't touched by Alisha/the Magi's power like Sam and Kayla. What happened to Alisha and Galen?
78. How did Galen escape the magi prison?
79. Why send them back when the crystal was still deteriorated instead of sending them to stop Theo and/or Kain? If destiny should not be tempered with then what does it matter anyway at all?
80. Avoid camera clipping; you can see the water through the sand when the temple is shown and looked at by Dart and Kayla.
81. Well, wouldn't the crystal be able to bring back anyone back to the current time? If not alone, at least with Odin's help from the past.
82. As potions got up to a stack of 20, you could have made the ankh get up to at least 5.
83. Fay's Aim becomes quite useless after a while since her normal attack becomes stronger than the highest levels of that spell.
84. Should make the zone portal regions way gates; it's easier and not annoying to move heroes from a place to another.
85. Gold gathering gets quite slow on higher levels.
86. Shouldn't the engine have been fixed? It's still burning.
87. So yeah, you can carry as many weapons as you like.
88. Demon Wall's death animation is bad (absent); the model remains there and blocks vision.
89. How did Amadeus become stronger if he was not in possession of the crystal's powers?
90. The Airship doesn't follow you if you go by foot but you can still see it in Alixaide for instance
91. Sirus remained partially raising to the sky in the caves near the portal. You can attack him.
92. Illusions should be removed after Zeramesh's forest temple copy dies.
93. Nole's Axe Rage has the hotkey A...
94. Would be nice to have cinematic scene skip.
95. Well, reaching the three destroyers and them is a much harder challenge than Zeramesh and Amadeus.

Overall a neat experience however quite slowly progressed and monotonous at times.
I don't remember seeing any credits at all ingame: doodads, models, music etc. You could use Resources in Use by Good&Evil | HIVE to add them to your current thread description list.

Hey there! Thank you so much for your feedback and taking the time to list the many things in need of fixing. I learned a lot while working on that project, and all the feedback I received..thank you again! I've moved on to another project for the time being, with the knowledge I have now, and things I learned from all this I'm hoping it will be a better experience...

One day i might go back to this project, it's just there are soooo many things in need of fixing, plus the slow loading time makes it all a little overwhelming

 

[StoPCampinGn00b]

Moderator review raised to 4/5 based off of deepstrasz's 2017 review

"A somewhat nice JRPG touch with quite a large grain of visual novel. [...] Overall a neat experience however quite slowly progressed and monotonous at times."

 

[tulee]

Thanks to Deepstrasz for telling me about this map.

Not much to say, I have still not finished it, but it is one of the most immersive RPG maps on hive workshop. I really really really enjoy playing it, and reminds me of Chrono Cross (or any other Japanese RPG). Especially those "..." lines ha-ha.

There is so much extra dialogue that gives this map flavour, and its the presence of these additional things that are not related to the mainstory that show how much effort was put into this map. So much time must have been put into this, with so many/long cinematics. I actually made the mistake of not going to the bathroom when I had the chance before the cutscene with the waterfall/flashback, and I regret that decision ever since, since I was sure the cinematic was going to end in a minute or so, but it ended up lasting 11 minutes :/

I really appreciate you making this and posting it here for us to play.


My only concern is that the players who this type of map is geared towards will never see it because it is in the RPG section of hive. Ever since they removed the ability to easily filter maps by maximum player (so in the past if I wanted to find single player RPG maps, I would put maximum 1 player into he filter), I have never really looked at the RPG section. This map really needs to be in the campaign section, and even though it is not strictly a campaign, unless it is made easier to search to search for single player RPG maps, maybe you could consider adding the campaign tag? Most people who player single player maps will only look at the campaign section nowadays. There are also some other RPG single player maps that are in there, so I don't see what the problem would be. It is just that this map is not accessible to the audience who would love to play it, and I cannot believe I never knew about this map until now. Maybe there could be a trend of putting single player RPG maps (maximum 1 player) into the campaign section. Even though there might be a small spam of maps, the fact is that most players I know who just look for single player content will go for the campaign section, and not check the RPG section. There are too many multiplayer RPG maps that have no story, and most players who enjoy single player maps are playing because of story (and gameplay).

Would love to see you add the campaign tag, and start a revolution to allow single player RPG maps into the campaign section. Especially nowadays since many people do not play multiplayer, we need a section that is strictly for single player maps, without needing to use advanced filters to find them. I don't see why the campaign section needs to only be campaign file maps.


Edit1: Link for my request to have campaigns include single player maps:
Allow Single Player RPG Maps into Campaign Section

 

[tulee]

Sorry for the double post!
This map keeps getting better and better!
Could I ask 3 quick questions Mathayis, if you have time?

1)How long did it take approximately to make this map/
2)Do you know the names of the songs, particularly the one that often played on the word map during the first part of the game, the one that is really relaxing. I do not know where to find it/
3)What is the command to get back into the zepplin. I have been on the north/West continent for so long and not used it, that I forgot the command and now I cannot leave that region ha-ha-ha/

I just saw you images you posted for another map, and am super exited about it!

 

[Mathayis]

Sorry for the double post!
This map keeps getting better and better!
Could I ask 3 quick questions Mathayis, if you have time?

1)How long did it take approximately to make this map/
2)Do you know the names of the songs, particularly the one that often played on the word map during the first part of the game, the one that is really relaxing. I do not know where to find it/
3)What is the command to get back into the zepplin. I have been on the north/West continent for so long and not used it, that I forgot the command and now I cannot leave that region ha-ha-ha/

I just saw you images you posted for another map, and am super exited about it!

Oh hey there!! I'm so sorry for the late reply First of all, i just want to thank you so much for your kind comments! I just noticed that other one you made
I'm so happy to hear that you're enjoying it
Now I'm more eager then ever to finish the second one!

Hmm, I think it took over 6 years actually, but during that time I took a long break, my first computer broke, but luckily I had saved it on a cd then years later my second computer broke, and luckily I had saved it on a usb stick lol So that map kinda moved around from computer to computer

Ooh I love that song too! It's called "Lost tales" By SimBi. You can find it on youtube

As for the command, it's "Enter" But you gotta finish off those temples before you can enter the airship from that area of the map, but if you go through that snowy village "Gelthor" and exit from the other side you'll be able to enter the airship from that part of the map

Thank you so much again! I really appreciate it!...I think I'm about finished my 2nd Map, just gotta lot of little tedious things to finish off XD

 

[fantocan]

Too much cine.

 

[deepstrasz]

Too much cine.

That's not a reason to give it 1/5 rating. If you don't like apples and a movie has many, you don't give it a bad mark unless you've got some things running about loose in your head.
This is one of the few maps on the site with proper character development.

Your one liner is not even feedback, doesn't tell the author what to improve but just that you don't like many cinematic scenes which is as subjective it can get.

 

[tulee]

Too much cine.

You will miss out on one of the most immersive Rpg maps on hive if you don't accept the cinematic length.

Oh hey there!! I'm so sorry for the late reply First of all, i just want to thank you so much for your kind comments! I just noticed that other one you made
I'm so happy to hear that you're enjoying it
Now I'm more eager then ever to finish the second one!

Hmm, I think it took over 6 years actually, but during that time I took a long break, my first computer broke, but luckily I had saved it on a cd then years later my second computer broke, and luckily I had saved it on a usb stick lol So that map kinda moved around from computer to computer

Ooh I love that song too! It's called "Lost tales" By SimBi. You can find it on youtube

As for the command, it's "Enter" But you gotta finish off those temples before you can enter the airship from that area of the map, but if you go through that snowy village "Gelthor" and exit from the other side you'll be able to enter the airship from that part of the map

Thank you so much again! I really appreciate it!...I think I'm about finished my 2nd Map, just gotta lot of little tedious things to finish off XD

Ha. Thanks! I had stopped playing this because I couldn't get back on the airship, now I think I will continue! That is so awesome that your 2nd map is nearly done. And yes, I have just been listening to "Lost Tales" by SimBi on repeat for the past 10 minutes~~.

 

[fantocan]

That's not a reason to give it 1/5 rating. If you don't like apples and a movie has many, you don't give it a bad mark unless you've got some things running about loose in your head.
This is one of the few maps on the site with proper character development.

Your one liner is not even feedback, doesn't tell the author what to improve but just that you don't like many cinematic scenes which is as subjective it can get.

Of Course it tells what to improve, let me translate the obvious: make less cine or at very least make it skippable, If I play a game I want to PLAY the game, not watch a boring 3 hours movie.

If I'm allergic to apples and just thinking about them make my throat swallow, then movie about apples would make me murder the writer and burn alive the cast's entire familly!

 

[deepstrasz]

Of Course it tells what to improve, let me translate the obvious: make less cine or at very least make it skippable, If I play a game I want to PLAY the game, not watch a boring 3 hours movie.

"I want" is not objective. That's what's obvious.
Cinematic scenes to be skipped is an idea but should not be mandatory unless they are at the start and end of a map. Aside, you can save before and after anyway as the game/map permits it.

When you're in the cinema, you can't skip the parts you don't like.

So, just think it this way. It's not always about you. Some things are for you to leave to others without you throwing rotten tomatoes before leaving.

 

[fantocan]

I don't ev

"I want" is not objective. That's what's obvious.
Cinematic scenes to be skipped is an idea but should not be mandatory unless they are at the start and end of a map. Aside, you can save before and after anyway as the game/map permits it.

When you're in the cinema, you can't skip the parts you don't like.

So, just think it this way. It's not always about you. Some things are for you to leave to others without you throwing rotten tomatoes before leaving.

I don't even know why I'm replying but lets go: YOU are saying that it is not for ME to decide if I like the game, that I am playing, and because YOU don't mind the cinematics I should be ok with it?

You are saying that I should not rate it the way I feel about a map just because it hurts YOUR feelings? Because you don't care about the cinematics and love the map does not mean I should like it, or how else do you want me to spell it?

 

[deepstrasz]

I don't even know why I'm replying but lets go: YOU are saying that it is not for ME to decide if I like the game, that I am playing, and because YOU don't mind the cinematics I should be ok with it?

Of course not. I'm saying, you should refrain from rating based on what you like and don't. That's not objective.
You're not hurting my feelings. It's not even my map. It's that the way you rate doesn't show good character. You are free to do as you like (but so are others). Let's not spam anymore.

 

[fantocan]

Of course not. I'm saying, you should refrain from rating based on what you like and don't. That's not objective.
You're not hurting my feelings. It's not even my map. It's that the way you rate doesn't show good character. You are free to do as you like (but so are others). Let's not spam anymore.

I agree we should not spam anymore, I am being objective here, as in a map that is supposed to be a game the cinematics should be skippable.

 

[Abhuyl]

The map is good and the story is ok so far.

And I know there is a disclaimer that there are a TON of cinematics and whatnot. I'm fine with that. I wouldn't even skip them (on a first play as they would be unbearable for a second run of this.)

My main beef with the map:
* WHY STRENGTH??? Why does EVERYONE have their base stats as STR?
And items give... +2 dmg, +24 INT. making Kayla, James etc deal almost zero damage aside from kayla's skills. Use their own base stats. It makes sense for their classes and playstyles. STR all around just makes it so all your heroes fight for the same loot, which is annoying.

My main complaints with the story and cinematics are:
1. Geez, why so many emo faces and wasted cinematic lines? Dart and Fay are pure mega-emo-kids who can't speak without a long face on each transmission. And sometimes in their dialogues there are like... 3, maybe 4 second transmission that only have an emo thing like "n__n" or something like that. I'm 31, I don't even know what those things mean and I don't care to either! Use your words! EFFECTIVELY, please.


2. Not only that, I understand this is trying to tell a story, but telling a story doesn't mean EVERYTHING must be written.
The player can fill the gaps in his own mind. That's exactly what makes great books/movies great. Room for interpretation.

For example, when Kayla goes to Eko to retrieve her memories: There is an entire scene where all that's going on is "I'm scared bla bla bla", and Leon asks "are you sure about this?" etc. and it goes for whatever long.
This whole conversation could be cut down, with no downsides AT ALL to
K: "I'm really scared about this, but I must do it. I made up my mind."
L: "Are you sure?"
K:"Yes. I must see it through."

And then... *poof*, no Eko explanation. NOBODY CARES! We are all after Zion and trying to figure out whatever happened in this world. I can't give two f*cks about the electrical current running through the doodads by the side of the machine.


3. Finally: Re-read dialogues. Double-check everything. There are WAY.... i mean WAY too many lines with no useful information. If asked, I could expand with a thousand lines here, but let's keep the post relatively small.
If the line is not essential to the plot, it shouldn't be there. Also, the "..." transmissions before every... single... line... is... annoying... This recourse should be used to express a pause. An idea cut short in the middle of a sentence. Not... after... every... word... in... the... world...


Aside from that, it's a great map. Good terrain IMO, decent plot. I'd rate it 5/5 if dialogues were cut to meaningful lines and skills were mapped to QWER instead of random letters.

 

[cleavinghammer]

General:

Spoiler

* Cutscenes:
** Soldiers and Footman-derived models keep using their drinking animation during cutscenes, it's very distracting.
** Units keep the buffs cast on them during cutscenes (most prominently Nole's Protect), and this is highly distracting if not cluttering during cutscenes.
** Many cutscenes have the camera obscured by wall doodads during part or most of the scene, ruining any dramatic effect.
** During cutscenes, selection circles tend to blink on and off.
** When characters sleep/fall over, their death cries are always heard. There's also always a spatter of blood on the ground.
** During cutscenes, sometimes part of the lower blue bar displays swirling Autocast lights.
** Heroes dead during cutscenes should be revived instead of just talking invisibly.
** During cutscenes, it often happens that character portraits are red instead of the character's color (most notably Fay). Except the dreadlord boss, who is red with a black portrait.

* Creeps:
** Creeps should respawn only after the currently present ones are dead. If you can't beat one group, two groups won't be easier to beat. I ended up with seven Mountain Golems I had to whittle down by shooting them from the other side of the river.
** Creeps should drop more potions if there isn't a global healing mechanism like inns.
** Some creeps in the temples don't use their abilities against 2 heroes (Immolation in the Fire Temple, Crushing Wave in the Water Temple...) but do use them against all 6. Is that intentional?
** Arena bosses and some enemies (Nightmare, for one) are very badly designed, mostly they just autoattack too fast and too hard, sometimes two-hit killing characters. And this is with everybody hopped up on stat-boosting items and Critical Strikes on everyone, not with 1 weapon-1 armor-2 accessories setups.
** Cactuar model prevents them from being selected for spells half the time.

* Abilities:
** Digging should be a normal ability, not Hero. There are also multiple places that look like Digging should get something, but yields nothing.
** Critical Strike needs a flat icon.
** Aim needs a raised icon.
** Fay should not have 2 autocasts.
** Many melee creep spells (bite, claw, etc.) are cast at range.
** "Creep uses ability" should be used as floating text on the creeps instead of messages to avoid drowning out important messages (like the Cactuars' riddles).
** Axe Rage's tooltip is misleading, the listed effect sounds more like Forked Lightning than Stampede.

* Items:
** Potions should stack when picked up, either by automatically merging or by combining them into full stacks of 5/10/20. Same for Phoenix Downs (although they'd work better as powerups, maybe as wood and used up instead of as items).
** Different weapons should have different icons.
** Items should be hidden when they're there but shouldn't be there yet (e.g. Island).
** Keys should be powerups with a scoreboard, otherwise it forces you to give up an item for a bossfight.
** Ultimate weapons don't cast the spells they're supposed to, even when equipped on the person they're meant to be unique to.

Music: There are several moments when the music cuts abruptly instead of fading out. There are also cutscenes the would be improved by playing music instead of long silences while characters talk.

* Other:
** What's wood used for? I thought it'd be for particularly awesome items, but there's nothing to spend it on.
** Gold and Lumber windows still say "gathered from mines/trees".
** There should be an explanation of how Life Points work, I only found out by accident. They should activate whenever a hero is in the area instead of needing to be next to it.
** The Quest Log should be used to update the current goal, and give game info (digging, talking, airship, etc.).
** Why does no one heal over time?
** Where doodads are used as floors (e.g. the prison, James' house, the palace), units have a tendency to sink in them. These doodads also go up and down when a terrain-altering spell (shockwave, quake...) gets cast on near them.
** Destroyed areas (Vector, Dollet) should not still have merchants inside.
** There should be more creep battles in between interludes during the plot-heavy segments so it isn't just "bring character A to point B".
** Dart and James don't have hero glow.
** Eko's class name is ".".
** James should be ranged.

Part 1:

Spoiler

Vector:
* Tom should have a weaponless model if he's just going to sit there and not help.

Prison:
* ... Really? Leon and Dart have fought roomfuls of soldiers, but now a single guard is enough for him to tell them to run?
* Barrels (especially the ones in the locked cells) can be attacked with Dart's knife.

Locke's camp:
* On the mountain path to Locke's camp, there are several areas that look like digging would get something, but are empty.
* ... If the plot demands that the tank kill the other characters and force you to flee, the boss fight should not end with you killing the tank.

River Battle:
* During the overworld segment, the boats are under the water's surface.
* During the river battle, maybe have rocks and floating doodads move by to give the illusion of movement. The boats should be smaller too.

During Leon's flashback:
* If the item was left on the forest path, it's still there in the flashback.
* Kayla waking up and making a fire are obscured by doodads.

Wait, wife? What happened to James being a monk? "Scholar" might be a better term for what he does.

Alixaide:
* James is invisible unless you stand right next to him. Even standing on the other side of the platform.
* Female vendor has a male voice.

Why the soldier creeps all of a sudden? They weren't even identified aas the people who'd killed the soldiers just before.

Ledamion:
* Zeek doesn't have a portrait when talking.
* Can't get close enough to the blue Pandaren to talk to him.
* Talking to Nick before the other two should change the dialogue. "Hey I heard where Eko is but it's still better if you stay hidden until I get him"
* Leon died without a Phoenix Down, the Mission Failed dialog didn't show up.

Desert:
* During the Fay-Dart cutscene, the fire keeps going out.
* During the fainting cutscene and others, Fay's portrait is red.
* No healing spells, and Fountain of Health in the oasis doesn't actually heal. Any particular reason why?

Coral Shire:
* The NPCs around the lizard don't say anything.
* During the ship cutscenes, the camera is stuck in a wall doodad.
* The second ship is called "prison ship".

Memento stone cutscene:
* Camera stuck in wall during first part of cutscene.
* Why does her hair change color when changing clothes?

Island:
* Just after the shipwreck, the camera is stuck in a doodad, only showing Sam and Kayla.
* No music?
* Sam doesn't have enough mana to cast anything.
* The Magi should have their skills pre-set, especially Zeramesh.
* Items remain in position after the first visit.

Airship:
* Kayla has no portrait during her conversation.

Temples:
* The Fire Temple room with a salamander and 2 worms has a gap in its southern edge.
* The merchant only stays in the water temple after all 3 are beaten.

Part 2:

Spoiler

Vector revisited:
* No cutscene?

Locke's camp revisited:
* The tents in Locke's camp should not be still standing.

Ledamion revisited:
* There's still a civilian hanging around in the back near the inn at the Imperial City in the cutscene.

Dolet Prison revisited:
* Since the prison is deserted, the creeps should be replaced by different enemies (sewer monsters, bandits, etc.)

Fay's camp revisited:
* Where'd the owl go?

Fort Falcon/Coral Shire revisited:
* The crystal shard Neville picks up should at least be the same color as the one on the statue.

Fort Falcon revisited:
* Kayla has no portrait during conversations.
* GAAAAHHH! CURSED MODEL! THE ABERRATION WANTS MY SOUL!
* The Falcon Swordsman doesn't say anything.
* Dug up the blades of grass, but couldn't find whatever it was Leon had hidden.

Gerthol:
* Selectable champions have "b" after their names (Slayer b, Toren b, etc.). They should also have the same stats as their arena counterparts.
* Nissaru and Lancet either have their hero names or Battle Arena as class names.

Sanctuary:
* Oh come on, he was half dead in seconds before he plotarmored his way out.
* Crystal makes rat sounds and has rat tooltip.

Fire Temple:
* Dragon Turtles are already heard enough to beat with the full team. But with just two heroes, and both of them melee so they hurt themselves more than the turtles do, and with no healing spells?
* No teleport to the beginning?

Water Temple:
* No teleport and no merchant?
* The ice blocks are named "Ice path blocker 3" and have a mine support beam portrait.
* Fountain makes rat sounds and has rat tooltip.
* Sirus has no talking portrait during the cutscene.
* Myrmidon statue and fountain aren't aligned with each other.
* To the left of the Sunken Depths gate, there's a cliff that looks normal but is actually walkable. This seems to be the case for ever place that used to have an ice block bridge, such as the hall leading to the miniboss room.
* During the pre- and post-boss cutscenes, the Forest Temple boss appears right next to James and Fay. Just... sitting there.
* "Toss stone into fountain" ability is still available on the fountain after the dungeon is beaten.
* Room with 2 dirt elevators and a tiled one: When raised, the leftmost elevator is missing its right wall.

Reunion:
* Once on the airship, the camera's in the wall again.

Destroyer: Flares are selectable/the model gets in the way of clicking.

Lots and plots of plot later:
* Airship should have fire effects during the exterior shots.
* Gogun and Kain don't name themselves, so they shouldn't have names. Kain has the Death Knight class.
* Doodad called "cave path blocker" is named, and portrait is a mine support beam.

... Jayzus H. Fuck dude, Ferror is messed up.

Eko makes rat sounds when selected.

Part 3:

Spoiler

Post-timeskip:

Dollet:
* Why is Minnie still in the sewer if she's also in the merchant house up north?
* Caved-in walls are named "." and have a mine beam portrait.

Oak Forest:
* Zeek's tent should be removed.

Vector:
* Overworld buildings should use destroyed models.
* There's an invisible wall that prevents bypassing the village on the overworld (NW of the big crater), it should be removed or made visible (replaced with rocks, fissures, etc.)

Mountain path:
* The house north of the massacre has no pathing.

North exit of the desert area on the overworld should have rocks barring the arch to show it's blocked off.

Left Airship engine is still on fire and remains so for the rest of the game.

Gerholt:
* No cutscene to explain where the two new guys came from?

Island:
Portal to leave the Island reads "Fuse" as its ability.

Pre-Galen encounter: Camera stuck in doodad wall for some of the cutscene.

Post-Sirus: Effects are kind of lacking. Why the linear deformation away from the city?

Ledamion:
* ... The revival point has spawning creeps?
* Invulnerable barrels are everywhere.
* The entrance to Eko's house is still visible in a wall.
* Palace gates are called "Led dark Gate".
* The airship tower has a gap in its NE corner.
* Double bug boss:
** A small white wall is still sticking out of a wall.
** This room should not use a doodad floor, the ground-altering spells (shockwave, quake) do horrible things to it.

Palace:
* Walls should not be the same tint as floor doodads.
* Great Behemoth room has an arms rack in the NW corner.
* Evil versions: Either they should all be Animate Dead-looking, or all use evil skins, but three pale, three dark-tinted ones is ugly.
* Amadeus cutscene starts with the camera in a wall doodad.
* Ark is... I dunno, could use more SFX.
* Reunion: Neville is visible through the door before he comes through.
* The 4 NPCs in the Airship don't have class names.

Ark:
* The floating rocks would look better if some were reskinned as forest and ice terrain.
* Amadeus' species was never mentioned before, only that he wasn't a Magi.

Final Boss:
* After the bossfight on the tornadoes, an Ark wall is visible during the ending cutscene.
* Camera goes through a doodad during the orbital shot in Coral Shire.

Post-story:
* Overworld music on foot should be a little cheerier. The big bad is dead, after all.
* No cutscene for the places you visit?
* No dialogue with the NPCs in Coral Shire?
* Who was that guy whose house James ended up invading?

An excellent emulation of classic JRPGs, but as has been said, the cinematics being unskippable is very detrimental to replayability. Dart and Fay emoting all the time is annoying, but it's bearable. Excellent map design (the overworld changing was a great touch), and very captivating plot. Grammar and spelling are subpar, but the story is enjoyable nonetheless.

Definitely needs a way to fully heal characters (other than killing and reviving them).

Is there a list of all the music used? I identified Zelda, Chrono Trigger and FFIX and X, but don't know the others.

I liked Dart's switch shooting, shame that didn't see more use. Great work on the forest maze, overworld and the evolving locations.

Will there be a way to get a New Game + eventually?

Overall, I'd say 4.6/5.

 

[Mathayis]

General:

Spoiler

* Cutscenes:
** Soldiers and Footman-derived models keep using their drinking animation during cutscenes, it's very distracting.
** Units keep the buffs cast on them during cutscenes (most prominently Nole's Protect), and this is highly distracting if not cluttering during cutscenes.
** Many cutscenes have the camera obscured by wall doodads during part or most of the scene, ruining any dramatic effect.
** During cutscenes, selection circles tend to blink on and off.
** When characters sleep/fall over, their death cries are always heard. There's also always a spatter of blood on the ground.
** During cutscenes, sometimes part of the lower blue bar displays swirling Autocast lights.
** Heroes dead during cutscenes should be revived instead of just talking invisibly.
** During cutscenes, it often happens that character portraits are red instead of the character's color (most notably Fay). Except the dreadlord boss, who is red with a black portrait.

* Creeps:
** Creeps should respawn only after the currently present ones are dead. If you can't beat one group, two groups won't be easier to beat. I ended up with seven Mountain Golems I had to whittle down by shooting them from the other side of the river.
** Creeps should drop more potions if there isn't a global healing mechanism like inns.
** Some creeps in the temples don't use their abilities against 2 heroes (Immolation in the Fire Temple, Crushing Wave in the Water Temple...) but do use them against all 6. Is that intentional?
** Arena bosses and some enemies (Nightmare, for one) are very badly designed, mostly they just autoattack too fast and too hard, sometimes two-hit killing characters. And this is with everybody hopped up on stat-boosting items and Critical Strikes on everyone, not with 1 weapon-1 armor-2 accessories setups.
** Cactuar model prevents them from being selected for spells half the time.

* Abilities:
** Digging should be a normal ability, not Hero. There are also multiple places that look like Digging should get something, but yields nothing.
** Critical Strike needs a flat icon.
** Aim needs a raised icon.
** Fay should not have 2 autocasts.
** Many melee creep spells (bite, claw, etc.) are cast at range.
** "Creep uses ability" should be used as floating text on the creeps instead of messages to avoid drowning out important messages (like the Cactuars' riddles).
** Axe Rage's tooltip is misleading, the listed effect sounds more like Forked Lightning than Stampede.

* Items:
** Potions should stack when picked up, either by automatically merging or by combining them into full stacks of 5/10/20. Same for Phoenix Downs (although they'd work better as powerups, maybe as wood and used up instead of as items).
** Different weapons should have different icons.
** Items should be hidden when they're there but shouldn't be there yet (e.g. Island).
** Keys should be powerups with a scoreboard, otherwise it forces you to give up an item for a bossfight.
** Ultimate weapons don't cast the spells they're supposed to, even when equipped on the person they're meant to be unique to.

Music: There are several moments when the music cuts abruptly instead of fading out. There are also cutscenes the would be improved by playing music instead of long silences while characters talk.

* Other:
** What's wood used for? I thought it'd be for particularly awesome items, but there's nothing to spend it on.
** Gold and Lumber windows still say "gathered from mines/trees".
** There should be an explanation of how Life Points work, I only found out by accident. They should activate whenever a hero is in the area instead of needing to be next to it.
** The Quest Log should be used to update the current goal, and give game info (digging, talking, airship, etc.).
** Why does no one heal over time?
** Where doodads are used as floors (e.g. the prison, James' house, the palace), units have a tendency to sink in them. These doodads also go up and down when a terrain-altering spell (shockwave, quake...) gets cast on near them.
** Destroyed areas (Vector, Dollet) should not still have merchants inside.
** There should be more creep battles in between interludes during the plot-heavy segments so it isn't just "bring character A to point B".
** Dart and James don't have hero glow.
** Eko's class name is ".".
** James should be ranged.

Part 1:

Spoiler

Vector:
* Tom should have a weaponless model if he's just going to sit there and not help.

Prison:
* ... Really? Leon and Dart have fought roomfuls of soldiers, but now a single guard is enough for him to tell them to run?
* Barrels (especially the ones in the locked cells) can be attacked with Dart's knife.

Locke's camp:
* On the mountain path to Locke's camp, there are several areas that look like digging would get something, but are empty.
* ... If the plot demands that the tank kill the other characters and force you to flee, the boss fight should not end with you killing the tank.

River Battle:
* During the overworld segment, the boats are under the water's surface.
* During the river battle, maybe have rocks and floating doodads move by to give the illusion of movement. The boats should be smaller too.

During Leon's flashback:
* If the item was left on the forest path, it's still there in the flashback.
* Kayla waking up and making a fire are obscured by doodads.

Wait, wife? What happened to James being a monk? "Scholar" might be a better term for what he does.

Alixaide:
* James is invisible unless you stand right next to him. Even standing on the other side of the platform.
* Female vendor has a male voice.

Why the soldier creeps all of a sudden? They weren't even identified aas the people who'd killed the soldiers just before.

Ledamion:
* Zeek doesn't have a portrait when talking.
* Can't get close enough to the blue Pandaren to talk to him.
* Talking to Nick before the other two should change the dialogue. "Hey I heard where Eko is but it's still better if you stay hidden until I get him"
* Leon died without a Phoenix Down, the Mission Failed dialog didn't show up.

Desert:
* During the Fay-Dart cutscene, the fire keeps going out.
* During the fainting cutscene and others, Fay's portrait is red.
* No healing spells, and Fountain of Health in the oasis doesn't actually heal. Any particular reason why?

Coral Shire:
* The NPCs around the lizard don't say anything.
* During the ship cutscenes, the camera is stuck in a wall doodad.
* The second ship is called "prison ship".

Memento stone cutscene:
* Camera stuck in wall during first part of cutscene.
* Why does her hair change color when changing clothes?

Island:
* Just after the shipwreck, the camera is stuck in a doodad, only showing Sam and Kayla.
* No music?
* Sam doesn't have enough mana to cast anything.
* The Magi should have their skills pre-set, especially Zeramesh.
* Items remain in position after the first visit.

Airship:
* Kayla has no portrait during her conversation.

Temples:
* The Fire Temple room with a salamander and 2 worms has a gap in its southern edge.
* The merchant only stays in the water temple after all 3 are beaten.

Part 2:

Spoiler

Vector revisited:
* No cutscene?

Locke's camp revisited:
* The tents in Locke's camp should not be still standing.

Ledamion revisited:
* There's still a civilian hanging around in the back near the inn at the Imperial City in the cutscene.

Dolet Prison revisited:
* Since the prison is deserted, the creeps should be replaced by different enemies (sewer monsters, bandits, etc.)

Fay's camp revisited:
* Where'd the owl go?

Fort Falcon/Coral Shire revisited:
* The crystal shard Neville picks up should at least be the same color as the one on the statue.

Fort Falcon revisited:
* Kayla has no portrait during conversations.
* GAAAAHHH! CURSED MODEL! THE ABERRATION WANTS MY SOUL!
* The Falcon Swordsman doesn't say anything.
* Dug up the blades of grass, but couldn't find whatever it was Leon had hidden.

Gerthol:
* Selectable champions have "b" after their names (Slayer b, Toren b, etc.). They should also have the same stats as their arena counterparts.
* Nissaru and Lancet either have their hero names or Battle Arena as class names.

Sanctuary:
* Oh come on, he was half dead in seconds before he plotarmored his way out.
* Crystal makes rat sounds and has rat tooltip.

Fire Temple:
* Dragon Turtles are already heard enough to beat with the full team. But with just two heroes, and both of them melee so they hurt themselves more than the turtles do, and with no healing spells?
* No teleport to the beginning?

Water Temple:
* No teleport and no merchant?
* The ice blocks are named "Ice path blocker 3" and have a mine support beam portrait.
* Fountain makes rat sounds and has rat tooltip.
* Sirus has no talking portrait during the cutscene.
* Myrmidon statue and fountain aren't aligned with each other.
* To the left of the Sunken Depths gate, there's a cliff that looks normal but is actually walkable. This seems to be the case for ever place that used to have an ice block bridge, such as the hall leading to the miniboss room.
* During the pre- and post-boss cutscenes, the Forest Temple boss appears right next to James and Fay. Just... sitting there.
* "Toss stone into fountain" ability is still available on the fountain after the dungeon is beaten.
* Room with 2 dirt elevators and a tiled one: When raised, the leftmost elevator is missing its right wall.

Reunion:
* Once on the airship, the camera's in the wall again.

Destroyer: Flares are selectable/the model gets in the way of clicking.

Lots and plots of plot later:
* Airship should have fire effects during the exterior shots.
* Gogun and Kain don't name themselves, so they shouldn't have names. Kain has the Death Knight class.
* Doodad called "cave path blocker" is named, and portrait is a mine support beam.

... Jayzus H. Fuck dude, Ferror is messed up.

Eko makes rat sounds when selected.

Part 3:

Spoiler

Post-timeskip:

Dollet:
* Why is Minnie still in the sewer if she's also in the merchant house up north?
* Caved-in walls are named "." and have a mine beam portrait.

Oak Forest:
* Zeek's tent should be removed.

Vector:
* Overworld buildings should use destroyed models.
* There's an invisible wall that prevents bypassing the village on the overworld (NW of the big crater), it should be removed or made visible (replaced with rocks, fissures, etc.)

Mountain path:
* The house north of the massacre has no pathing.

North exit of the desert area on the overworld should have rocks barring the arch to show it's blocked off.

Left Airship engine is still on fire and remains so for the rest of the game.

Gerholt:
* No cutscene to explain where the two new guys came from?

Island:
Portal to leave the Island reads "Fuse" as its ability.

Pre-Galen encounter: Camera stuck in doodad wall for some of the cutscene.

Post-Sirus: Effects are kind of lacking. Why the linear deformation away from the city?

Ledamion:
* ... The revival point has spawning creeps?
* Invulnerable barrels are everywhere.
* The entrance to Eko's house is still visible in a wall.
* Palace gates are called "Led dark Gate".
* The airship tower has a gap in its NE corner.
* Double bug boss:
** A small white wall is still sticking out of a wall.
** This room should not use a doodad floor, the ground-altering spells (shockwave, quake) do horrible things to it.

Palace:
* Walls should not be the same tint as floor doodads.
* Great Behemoth room has an arms rack in the NW corner.
* Evil versions: Either they should all be Animate Dead-looking, or all use evil skins, but three pale, three dark-tinted ones is ugly.
* Amadeus cutscene starts with the camera in a wall doodad.
* Ark is... I dunno, could use more SFX.
* Reunion: Neville is visible through the door before he comes through.
* The 4 NPCs in the Airship don't have class names.

Ark:
* The floating rocks would look better if some were reskinned as forest and ice terrain.
* Amadeus' species was never mentioned before, only that he wasn't a Magi.

Final Boss:
* After the bossfight on the tornadoes, an Ark wall is visible during the ending cutscene.
* Camera goes through a doodad during the orbital shot in Coral Shire.

Post-story:
* Overworld music on foot should be a little cheerier. The big bad is dead, after all.
* No cutscene for the places you visit?
* No dialogue with the NPCs in Coral Shire?
* Who was that guy whose house James ended up invading?

An excellent emulation of classic JRPGs, but as has been said, the cinematics being unskippable is very detrimental to replayability. Dart and Fay emoting all the time is annoying, but it's bearable. Excellent map design (the overworld changing was a great touch), and very captivating plot. Grammar and spelling are subpar, but the story is enjoyable nonetheless.

Definitely needs a way to fully heal characters (other than killing and reviving them).

Is there a list of all the music used? I identified Zelda, Chrono Trigger and FFIX and X, but don't know the others.

I liked Dart's switch shooting, shame that didn't see more use. Great work on the forest maze, overworld and the evolving locations.

Will there be a way to get a New Game + eventually?

Overall, I'd say 4.6/5.

Oh wow! Thank you so so much for all the feedback! I have to admit, I made this map back in the days when I was still learning about the editor...This was sort of a test project for me, playing it again years later i can see a lot of those things you pointed out....and oh what a mess it was
I've actually been working on the sequel over the past 5 years. It Takes place in a whole other world, with new stories....

Good and evil 1 was sort of a learning process, there is much to be fixed with it, and a lot of time to spend on it....I would love to find the time one day to totally perfect it, but as of now I'm really trying to finish up Good and Evil 2, I've been running into a lot of bugs after updating to the 1.31.1..sooo..Yeah busy busy busy!!

Thanks again for the feed back! While it being such a mess, I'm glad to hear people actually enjoyed it! I learnd a lot from it and hope Good&Evil II will be a much better experience..I'll be posting it in the next few days Oh and as for the music, sorry i forgot to post the list... But if you look in the map editor of the imported music, you can find the names of them on youtube

 

[cleavinghammer]

What's the point of elemental damage? As far as I can tell it doesn't give orb abilities. Or was there going to be an FF elemental system?

Whose house does James end up in? Is it the original Zion?

What's wood used for?

For future reference: All heroes using STR wasn't too bad a decision, given how necessary it is to have lots of life, but spells could be better if they used the other stats to calculate damage as well.

 

[诺森德的呜喵王]

Dear author, I am a Chinese Warcraft player. Can I translate your map into Chinese? I want Chinese Warcraft players to experience such great works.

 

[Mathayis]

Dear author, I am a Chinese Warcraft player. Can I translate your map into Chinese? I want Chinese Warcraft players to experience such great works.

Oh wow, really? That would be such an honor! Thank you! I'm so happy that you enjoyed it! Feel free to translate it if you like!

 

[Shido]

Good job everyone.