Global Morals

[Elenai]

Adults do have more tools, but they also have less idiocy in them and realize their mistakes which is why most adults turn out good, and the ones that don't end up a psycho killers.

Adults are just as cruel as their kids, after their own fashion.

It's not what I believe, it's what I know. Not only that, but I have yet to see one user here, let alone an intellectual agree with you.

And yet, millions out in the world would agree.

No. You think you know everything, despite not a single person agreeing with you here,

A few have agreed, and millions in the world do.

and I presume in real life as well. Find me 3 people on the streets that agree with you and don't fit the description of an emo/non-conformist/goth.

Let me find you a thousand refugees that know that the world is cruel.

Thinking you are above everyone else, that's pride.

I do believe you have pulled that statement out of your butt.

 

[CMarket]

Find me those millions you speak of and then I will agree. I, on the other hand, don't know a single person that will tell me that the world is a black hole of evil. Especially not anyone who has some issues to go through.

But obviously this is going nowhere as you just simply won't accept any point of view but your own. And that is called pride, do some research. Pride is not only loving ones self but it is also thinking yourself above everyone else.

 

[Elenai]

Talk to these people:

http://www.unhcr.org/pages/49c3646c4d6.html
http://www.bread.org/learn/hunger-basics/hunger-facts-international.html
http://www.who.int/healthinfo/global_burden_disease/en/index.html
http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/SOD.CHAP3.HTM
http://www.abaana.org/resources/statistics.php
http://www.un.org/cyberschoolbus/briefing/soldiers/soldiers.pdf
http://www.boes.org/coop/censor1.html
http://www.worldofchildren.org/Newsletter/PlightofChildren.htm
http://www.shoaheducation.com/camps/statistics.html
http://www.scrapbookpages.com/poland/Majdanek/DeathStatistics.html
http://books.google.com/books?id=ZN...qmXBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=10
http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/COM.ART.HTM
http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/SOD.CHAP10.HTM
http://infofluency.wordpress.com/2009/04/02/statistics-number-of-deaths-in-darfur/
http://humanitarianrelief.change.org/blog/view/darfur_-_updated_statistics_on_humanitarian_access
http://www.frac.org/html/hunger_in_the_us/hunger_index.html
http://www.census.gov/compendia/sta...nt_courts_prisons/crimes_and_crime_rates.html
http://www.rainn.org/statistics
http://www.childhelp.org/resources/learning-center/statistics
http://www.aardvarc.org/dv/statistics.shtml
http://www.childwelfare.gov/systemwide/statistics/can.cfm
http://www.safeyouth.org/scripts/faq/bullying.asp
http://www.bullyingstatistics.blogspot.com
http://www.olweus.org/public/bullying.page
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/ovc/ncvrw/2005/pg5l.html

But obviously this is going nowhere as you just simply won't accept any point of view but your own.

You won't accept mine, why should I accept yours, when I can clearly look at the world and say:

"Holy crap, this place sucks!"

And that is called pride,

Which you apparently have in abundance.

do some research.

I have, just did, and did it again, and linked alot of reputable sources.

You should do the same.

Pride is not only loving ones self

When did I say I did? I do believe you are talking about of you butt again.

but it is also thinking yourself above everyone else.

When did I say I was? I do believe you are not only talking out of your butt, but you are also spreading what ever comes out of it all over the carpet.

___

Now I want you to look me in the eye (figuratively) and you TELL ME with a straight face, how the world can possibly be good, when all of this ACTUALLY HAPPENS and is DOCUMENTED, while most of the world turns a blind eye? And while by sheer irony, everything I've linked only shows about a quarter of what is actually going on, and is probably triple what it actually is, especially in places where there is poor documentation, and access is limited and strictly monitored by tyrannical governments, and shameful households.

You tell me how the world is possibly good, when all of this happens.

And heck, I haven't even linked every possible thing, and even if I did, like I said, it would only show a quarter, or half at best, of the real numbers.

 

[MySpaceBarBroke]

You won't accept mine, why should I accept yours

...Because that sort of puts you in a gridlock?

when I can clearly look at the world and say:

"Holy crap, this place sucks!"

Clearly, that's what you were born into. You ventured out of your mother's womb, and you said "Holy crap, this place sucks! Get my placenta, I'm going to the fucking moon!"

Quite frankly, you don't have a point of reference. There's no other place to live, and if you want to give the afterlife a try, be my guess.

Which you apparently have in abundance.

What the hell is wrong with you? Are you on your fucking period or something? Lighten up. Drink some cranberry juice.

I have, just did, and did it again, and linked alot of reputable sources.

You should do the same.

Yes, let's research the badness of earth. That sounds scientific enough.

When did I say I did? I do believe you are talking about of you butt again.

When did I say I was? I do believe you are not only talking out of your butt, but you are also spreading what ever comes out of it all over the carpet.

...

Now I want you to look me in the eye (figuratively) and you TELL ME with a straight face, how the world can possibly be good, when all of this ACTUALLY HAPPENS and is DOCUMENTED, while most of the world turns a blind eye? And while by sheer irony, everything I've linked only shows about a quarter of what is actually going on, and is probably triple what it actually is, especially in places where there is poor documentation, and access is limited and strictly monitored by tyrannical governments, and shameful households.

You tell me how the world is possibly good, when all of this happens.

And heck, I haven't even linked every possible thing, and even if I did, like I said, it would only show a quarter, or half at best, of the real numbers.

Saying our world is good or bad isn't really something that can be proven or disproven. Dying's bad, but that's only assuming life is so good, and I'm sure there are plenty more people living every day than dying. The only point of reference for something going wrong are the many things in our world that work correctly each day.

Of course tyrannies and poverty are bad. How do we know? Because we have rights, and we have money, and we know we can't live without either. So by seeing how much good in the world is around us, we can notice the bad.

Earth, being the only planet we can survive on, seems to fare pretty well against Mars, the Moon, and a Space Station. As for the universe in its entirety, well, it's completely impermeable to arbitrary concepts like this because we have no point of reference. But given the choice between enjoying our wonderful world and whining about this piece of shit of a planet, I'd easily choose the former over the latter, and I believe many, many people would agree.




I'd like to close by commenting that I'm no Sigmund Freud, but you seem to be rather pissy.

 

[Captain Griffen]

To have an objective idea of morality, you need an objective way to decide morality. To have an objective way of deciding morality, you need an objective way to decide what is objective. This is going to itself be a moral judgement. Therefore your decision process will be circular.

It's simply impossible to know that any morality is objectively correct. Hence, any discussion aimed at trying to find one will be flawed. The best we might hope for, objectively, is to rule some out as inconsistent.

 

[CMarket]

This is going nowhere, fast. It's not worth my time so I'll just say the obvious and be done with it.

You can argue all you want, sit behind your computer as a manic depressant you make yourself out to be and cry for all I care. Yes, the people in this world are sinners, but there is also good, a lot of it. Not more then evil but still. I won't bother finding you documents but if you really have nothing better to do(which seems to be the case) google it. I simply won't waste time on it because you simply aren't worth anymore of my time.

If you want an alternative to this world give the afterlife a shot. I don't really see whats stopping you. You believe in God? You're one of the best candidates for heaven, right? Well then, this place sucks, find a way to go there if your so sad here. I really have no more patience for this thread.

 

[Captain Griffen]

Yes, the people in this world are sinners, but there is also good, a lot of it. Not more then evil but still.

For many definitions of good, I'd dispute that. If good requires one not to be selfish, then it's quite possible that no good has ever been done. Everyone is purely selfish, just with differing conceptions of self, and different weightings of the different components.

 

[I)eadnerzhul]

Everyone is purely selfish, just with differing conceptions of self, and different weightings of the different components.

Nonsense. Complete and utter nonsense.

First of all, "purely selfish" for you can have a whole different meaning for me. Second, at least 99% of the world's total populace is not purely selfish. You want proof? Go and look around for married couples with children- the only way to marry and have a child is through sharing.

 

[Elenai]

99% of the world's total populace is not purely selfish.

I think I've proved otherwise: see my links. If we were not at the very least: MOSTLY selfish, then the things in my links would have been dealt with years ago.

Go and look around for married couples with children- the only way to marry and have a child is through sharing.

99% of the world isn't married...at all. And that number is dropping FAST.

 

[Captain Griffen]

First of all, "purely selfish" for you can have a whole different meaning for me. Second, at least 99% of the world's total populace is not purely selfish. You want proof? Go and look around for married couples with children- the only way to marry and have a child is through sharing.

"Selfishness denotes the precedence given in thought or deed to the self" - sounds plausible. Of course, we're then going to have a discussion over what the self is. Much of the belief that people aren't selfish is by arbitarily restricting what counts as the self, and then introducing a then false dichotomy between being "selfish" and acting only out of concern for others.

Anyway, that's pretty damned good evidence that altruism is dead, or never alive. The measure of altruism is now how they treat their own children (that's selfish, when push comes to shove), but whether they act generously towards other people's children for non-selfish reasons (reasons not to do with benefiting themselves, taken in a broad sense rather than being arbitarily confined to hedonistic or financial gains for self).